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- [00:00]
Joy Reid
And we're live from the living room as Doug eyes up the match day spread. He's reaching for the buffalo wing. Perfect.
- [00:08]
Jason
Hang on.
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Dina Dahl
What's this?
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Joy Reid
Oh, he's gone for a can of Pepsi too. Incredible. What a finish. Sensational combination. Look at the delight on his face. There's no doubt about it. It just tastes better. Match days deserve Pepsi. Food deserves Pepsi. Grab a pack of Pepsi. Zero sugar for today's match. It's poetry in motion.
- [00:35]
Dina Dahl
Okay.
- [00:44]
Joy Reid
All right, everybody. Happy Friday. Welcome to the Joy Reach show. You can see I've got my fit on. This is my world cup fit. You can't see because the microphone. Why am I echoing in my own ear? Okay, one way. Hey, everybody. Welcome to the show. Big up to everybody that's sitting in the chats. All of the early birdies that get in the chats. Where are the lemon heads? Like normally they put a little lemon in there. We do have the lemon reads that come the lemon readers who come in very early. But all the hellos, hello, Peace Oasis. Hello, Cali bear. Hello, everyone who has popped in early. Who's right at the top? Black diamond and Ruth bear. I think that is Tanya. 8495 says, hi, Joy. We got some lemon heads throwing their lemons up in the YouTube chat. Hello to everybody in the substack chat as well. We want to greet everyone who is in the LinkedIn chat. Hello, LinkedIn. We want to also greet everyone who is on Twitch. We love our twitchies. You guys are growing in number and we love your little small and mightiness. Hello to our Facebook friends as well. So want to cover everyone wherever you're listening. If you're listening on an audio podcast platform. We love you guys as well. Thank you all for tuning in and we thank you all for your support. Those of you who are premium subscribers. If you're an up subscriber, whether you that means you're a reader, meaning you are a subscriber both on substack and YouTube or on multiple platforms or just if you just like us and you call yourself a reader. Or if you're a premium member, this is if you really are premium member, a subscriber. What is it? A member. We're doing a members only chat. Our members only chat has been it's going to be tonight. We changed the time much as they did the White House correspondence dinner, but ours was for a legitimate reason. So please come to the after party if you're a member on substack or on YouTube. It's a lot of Fun. And if you're not a member yet, you can hit like and subscribe. I think if you do it now, you can still get in the members only chat. I have a question of the day for the members only chat. I'm going to just throw it out there now. I was listening to Clay Kane's show early this morning when I was out running errands, and he had this just bananas conversation about Jasmine Crockett and whether or not it is on Jasmine Crockett to aggressively campaign for James Talarico or is it on James Talarico to recruit her and to basically bring her into the field and into the fold. Like, is it. Which of them is who is it incumbent on to do the work of trying to flip that seat? Is it on him or is it on her? And it was just a crazy conversation. Clay had a dinner tonight so he couldn't come on, but he's going to come on next week and we're going to, we're going to talk about it. Because this conversation, if you all didn't hear the Clay Kane show this morning, I'm telling you, it was wild. So we're going to talk about that. I also want to let you all know, in addition to being a member and being in our members only afterparty tonight, and I'm going to make my security for that purpose. So if you don't remember how to make security, I'm going to remind you how to do that before the end of the show. Please also sign up for Run me my slush money. Hundreds of people have already signed up for running my slush money. If you go on running my slushmoney.com, you can sign up to be on the mailing list as information comes up. There is still an active lawsuit about that slush fund. The slush fund is not dead yet. And so until we can kill it, if it's still alive, we want the money. The money needs to go to reparations for those who are descendants of slaves. It needs to go to people who need it. You could run that slush money to people who can't pay their bills, can't pay their rent, can't afford health care. There's so much you could do with 1.776 billion, which of course 1776, like the founding of the country. They tried to name it something clever, but they're stealing our money. We're not gonna let them do it. There are letters you can download on rummymyflushmoney.com where you can Send a letter directly to your members of Congress and to your United States senator saying do not let them do this. And they're worded in a way to say we want oversight now. Also want to remind you guys it's our birthday all month. We are a Gemini show born the day before my sister's birthday. June 9th is our official birthday, but it's our birthday all month. So if you would like to purchase any merch, you can use the code birthday to get 15% off all month long, including the books by our guests tonight. Some of our guests, I have books. So if you want to do that, you should don't get the book full price, just get it with the discount. Use the birthday code. So we want to get that. That is the church announcements for the evening. We've done our church announcements and now if anybody needs a prayer and has a prayer request, please submit them in the chat and we will be sure that we get your prayer request in before the show is over. Also, let's get started on our topic because today it's an it's a rather infuriating topic. The Supreme Court is at it again. Old Clarence, old Uncle Clarence and them. Happy Friday to everyone who said Happy Friday. Happy Friday to you too. It's happy ish. It is Gemini season. Geminis are incorrigible in this season, especially if you're a Gemini and a Knicks fan. Incorrigible. You can't deal with them at all if you're a Black Music Month fan. Also, it's Black Music Month. It's Pride Month if you are a LGBTQ Gemini who loves music and a Knicks fan. No one should even talk to you because you're incorrigible. Like you. No one can even deal with you right now because you're just living your best life this month. Everyone should just leave you alone until July. But yeah, the Supreme Court is at it again up to its old ways. The latest ruling is a pretty cruel one. It allows the Trump regime to yank temporary protected status from more than 350,000 people who came to this country legally through temporary protected status, who came from Haiti and from Syria. They specifically want to borrow those two groups from tps, even taking away tps some of them have had for more than a decade. Here's how the Associated Press reported it. It's a pretty horrific story, but let me read you the Associated Press's reporting. A 35 year old nurse in Kentucky prepared her will. The single mother named a legal guardian for her four children and transferred her properties into their names. She felt like she needed to prepare for death in case she gets deported back to Haiti, a country she fled at nine years old. After the Supreme Court decided Thursday to allow the Trump administration to end legal protections for migrants fleeing violence and natural disasters in Haiti and Syria, fear ricocheted through those communities. Across the United States, hundreds of thousands of people now face the prospect of deportation. I have been living with this internal fear. It's like preparing for a funeral just in case I die when going to another country, said the nurse, who asked not to be identified for fear of being targeted for deportation because this is a vindictive regime. She's among about 350,000 Haitians granted temporary protected status, many of whom have legally, legally lived and worked in the U.S. for decades and have children who are U.S. citizens. Thursday's decision, which is expected to take effect July 27, also applied to around 6,000 it could open the door to the administration unwinding protections for 1.3 million people from 17 countries. Wow. This while they are unwinding these protections from millions and millions of people. While just today I Learned from some D.C. residents that Donald Trump on his birthday did a fireworks display for himself, that D.C. residents kept D.C. residents up all night because he decided to do it at the time when he was born, like around one o' clock in the morning, woke everyone up with fireworks. They're buzzing DC Right now with military planes practicing for their big military show for supposedly the 250th anniversary of the country. But it's really for him. Donald Trump has torn up the White House, messed up the reflecting pool, filled it with algae, destroyed the east wing, destroyed the grounds of the White House with a UFC ring, and he's wrecking the country. No, no, Spence spare, no expense spared. He can spend as much as he wants. He's stealing. They have this, this hush slush money scam. They are refusing to investigate the Epstein files. Taking away people's Medicaid, taking away people's food stamps, taking away people's access to health care, taking away women's bodily autonomy, erasing black history from the military, erasing black history from museums. They're doing all that and now it's still not enough. Now they want to run 1.3 million people, including 350,000 Haitian immigrants who are here legally out of the country just because they're racist, Just for no other reason other than Donald Trump's personal racism enacted as law and the six Leonard Leo store bought members of the Supreme Court said he can do it here's how Democrats, congressional Democrats reacted. In this clip, you are going to hear from Congresswoman Lois Frankel of Florida, who makes a very important point about the high number of care workers for the elderly in the most elderly state in the union, Florida, who are Haitian American. You're going to hear from AOC of New York, of course, Maxwell Frost, also of Florida, who makes a very similar case about healthcare workers and Washington State Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal. In this clip, take a listen in the United States Supreme Court, who issued a devastating blow to humanity, to democracy.
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Joe Okimoto
I'm talking about their decision to allow the Trump administration to deport our Haitian
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Joy Reid
friends and neighbors who had been granted a temporary protective status as they fled the violence and tyranny of Haiti. We have over 100,000 Haitians on protective
- [10:21]
Joe Okimoto
status and they are in our nursing homes. They are in our hospitality venues.
- [10:26]
Joy Reid
These are people who are taking care
- [10:28]
Joe Okimoto
of our mothers and our grandmothers and grandfathers.
- [10:32]
Joy Reid
They are caring, they are loving. And now they are being sent back to Haiti where there is violence and there is poverty and there is starvation. This is wrong. Now we are going to endanger and possibly put people on a track to
- [10:48]
Melissa Murray
deportation that, that are gainfully participating in
- [10:53]
Joy Reid
their communities, in our economy in a
- [10:55]
Dina Dahl
time when frankly, even just economically and
- [10:58]
Melissa Murray
socially, we need these folks now more than ever.
- [11:02]
Joy Reid
Those here on TPS are part of our nation. These are our neighbors. These are our friends. These are our kids friends. These are the people who sit next to your kids in the classroom. These are our caregivers. One fifth of caregivers in this country for seniors are Haitians. I am a proud first generation immigrant who came to this country at 16 years old. I now am one of just a few dozen naturalized citizens to serve in Congress. And the most important part is that when we take back the House, I will be the chair of the immigration subcommittee. And we intend to pass permanent protections and a path to citizenship for GPS holders. We intend to pass permanent protections for our immigrant families with humane and comprehensive immigration reform. And that is why you vote. You don't just vote for the elevator to make Democrats feel good. You vote because you want the right person to be in charge of the committees that write and pass the laws that impact your immigrant neighbors. Here is how New York Mayor Zorhan Mamdani reacted to the news. He had a very heartfelt direct message to terrified immigrants in New York City came back from a rally with 1199 as I stood alongside a number of
- [12:25]
Nana Gyamfi
Haitian New Yorkers who are concerned about
- [12:27]
Joy Reid
what this means for their status in our city. And frankly, this city, the one that we love, is one that has been built by so many from so many different parts of the world.
- [12:38]
Nana Gyamfi
And that includes our Haitian brothers and
- [12:40]
Joy Reid
sisters, our Syrian brothers and sisters. And we stand here ready to be in solidarity with all of those who are concerned by today's decision. And beyond just language of solidarity, actions of solidarity. Now, what that means when it comes to our city is if you are worried about what this means for your status, if you're worried about what this means for your family, I would encourage you to call our mayor's Office of Immigrant affairs hotline and you can do so at 1-800-354-036-5354, 0365. And we should put that probably in the description for people who are in New York. That is government actually working to change lives for the better. By the way, the Mamdani administration has also won a big ruling freezing the rent for like hundreds of thousands of New Yorkers who have rent stabilized housing. Like that's a big win. One of his biggest promises was to freeze the rents. And he did that. He's done that. And so he is saying, no, we're going to protect Haitian migrants in New York. But if you're in Florida, you might be out of luck. And this is where the largest number of Haitian refugees and legal immigrants live. And they live in the wrong place to be in this moment because they're the most at risk right now because they have Republican government, because Republicans run their state. And the guy who's promising to come in, Byron Donalds, who's running his parents are immigrants from Jamaica. But he I haven't seen I was looking for a comment from him on this. I've seen nothing. His parents are Caribbean immigrants. I've heard nothing. And if he's governor, he'll do just what the current governor is doing, which is to basically rub Haitian immigrants noses and faces in it. I want you all to listen to the very different reaction to from Republicans, including the governor of Florida and Tom Holman, the ghoul who is the deportations are for the Trump regime.
- [14:37]
Nana Gyamfi
Take listen the TPS decision that the US Supreme Court just six three about they can allow.
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Joy Reid
So the president has the constitutional authority
- [14:47]
Nana Gyamfi
to make it temporary and not permanent.
- [14:49]
Joy Reid
It's the right call.
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Paul Butler
You know, I've been doing this since 1984.
- [14:53]
Joy Reid
TPS is not never been temporary. That's why the whole statute exists temporarily. Give people protection while the country's in turmoil or after they Suffer a hurricane. But the problem is no administration has had the guts to actually follow that statute. President Trump has the guts to follow the law. So temporary means temporary. When the condition that country gets better, they need to go home. Expect the administration to deport anyone who loses to status as a result of this ruling. Well, of course, if you no longer have status in this country, then you're supposed to be deported. And in particular in the case of the Haitians, the Biden administration flew over vast numbers. Hard to know the exact number, but they're probably more than illegal immigrants from Haiti. That's not counting the border crossings into the United States. So these are people who've only been here for a few months, who are receiving welfare, whose all their ties, all their social contracts, connections, all their family is back in their home country of Haiti. And of course, that's where they should go. This has been going on for over a dozen years. Go home. Get out. We know our country's better than yours. That's because we filled it with our work ethic and our culture and our values. You being here only dilutes it for us, those who built it and live it. And half of you people, more than half, you won't assimilate. We don't want you. We don't care if you're offended. Get out. Go home in TPS stands for temporary. Yet many of these designations go back decades. We have designations from 1998 for Hurricane Mitch that we're still trying to get rid of. But to answer your question, President Trump has been trying to end these programs since 2017. So these people have been on notice for nine years that this day is coming. So what we would say now is it's closing time, which means you don't have to go home, but you can't stay here. The good news is it's not too late to get a $2,600 check and a free flight home. So of course you heard from Stephen Miller, whose grandparents were refugees, refugees from Eastern Europe, who under his own belief system would have been barred from here. They were Jewish refugees. His own family repudiates him. And then of course, Megyn Kelly, who's just a bitch. She's just an ice cold, mean ass bitch, excuse my language, saints. She's just a nasty. A nasty, horrible human being. And she's cool with doing that openly and being a said bitch because that's what Megha likes. That is me saying that. I did not put that on the toy Rigo team. She's just an awful person. So There you have it. I concur.
- [17:26]
Jason
I concur.
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Joy Reid
She's just a horrible person. I mean, and having worked in the same building as her, I'm just going to tell you, she doesn't treat. She treats people exactly the way she sounds. Everyone who worked in that building, they felt about her the way Jason and I feel about her right now. Okay, that's from experience. Okay, I'm gonna leave that there. But yes, you heard the different ways that Republicans sound when they talk about immigration. I will note that all of these people's backgrounds are immigrant. Many of them came through Ellis island without having to sign a piece of paper and they just got way through because they were white immigrants. In some cases they have. She has backgrounds that are Irish and Italian. Those are people who at one point were unwanted immigrants. Same thing with Stephen Miller. Of course. Tom Homan claims to be a Catholic, a practicing Catholic. That church is very pro immigrant. He is not. But anyway, we'll leave it there. So just so you get the difference, I just want you to hear the vibe difference. Okay. The decision was unsurprising and you should not have been surprised that it went this way. This is how I expected it to go given the open right wing politics of the right wing members of the court. Now, four of the six just recently ruled, by the way, in favor of like fertilizer manufacturer Monsanto. A 722 ruling in which only Justices Katanji, Brown, Jackson and weirdly Neil Gorsuch dissented that federal law preempts state failure to warn laws, therefore shielding pesticide manufacturers from state level lawsuits alleging that their products cause cancer and kill people. You know, that is who the majority kind of are. But the oral arguments should have signal how this was going to go. I want you to listen to Sonia, Justice Sonia Sotomayor, trying in vain to get Trump's Solicitor General. The same guy who argued successfully that Trump could order anyone he wants to be murdered by Seal Team 6 and get away with it. That guy. Listen to her attempt to argue with him that maybe an openly racist president might have had bad motives in trying to end tps. Take a listen. Now we have a president saying at one point that Haiti is a quote, filthy, dirty and disgusting s hole country. I'm quoting him. And where he complained that the United States takes people from such countries instead of people from Norway, Sweden or Denmark. Where he declared illegal. Where he declared illegal immigrants, which he associated with TPS as poisoning the blood of America. I don't see how that one statement is not a prime example of the Arlington example at work and showing that a discriminatory purpose may have played a part in this decision. All the statements that they cite as to the secretary and as to the president, obviously there's an issue there about which one you're going to weigh more heavily. None of them, not a single one of them mentions race or relates to race anyway. It certainly does. When you're saying we're taking the, we're taking people from these countries TPS program which are all non white, but instead we should be taking people from Norway, Sweden or Denmark, it seems to me that that's as close to the Arlington example as you can get. All those statements and context refer to problems like crime, poverty, welfare dependence, drug importation. The Harlington example is yes, I don't want poor people, but not all people from Norway, Sweden or Denmark are necessarily rich, but they are all virtually white. So I mean, what evidence could there be that Donald Trump and his regime might have had race based motives for this policy? What evidence could there be to back up Justice Sotomayor's claims, I wonder. In Springfield, they're eating the dogs. The people that came in, they're eating the cats, they're eating, they're eating the pets of the people that live there. And this is what's happening in our country and it's a shame. Joining me now, he's back, Ellie Mostall, senior justice correspondent at the Nation, the man who helps us unpack all things Constitution and SCOTUS related, Nana Jamfi. She is an organizer, activist and executive director of the Black alliance for Just Immigration Baji, which is the largest black led racial justice and immigrant rights organization in the US And I pretty proud name Gyamp it is. And also our good friend Melissa Murray, the Frederick I and Grace Stokes professor of Law at at New York University School of Law, co host of the top ranked Strict Scrutiny Supreme Court podcast and author of her second New York Times bestselling book, the U.S. a comprehensive and Annotated Guide for the Modern Reader. It is my companion. It literally sits on my desk. I have to take a picture of it on my desk because now I have a globe on my desk. I have many accoutrements and I have this because now when I want to look up something, I just use this Constitution. Hello friends. I'm going to go to you first on this Melissa, because I need you to point me. You can see my book is already dog eared and stuff. I use it very regularly. Point me to where I need to go to understand where is the constitutional protection that should have applied to those who are on tps, if it exists?
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Melissa Murray
So the first place you want to go, Joy, is to Article 1, where Congress enjoys authority over immigration and can pass statutes, including the statute for asylum, that provides these protections for asylum holders. So that's the first place. And there are two questions in this case. One was the statutory question of whether the executive can unilaterally rescind TPS status or whether it must only do so after first consulting with relevant agencies, including here, the State Department. We should note that before the court issued this decision, about a week before, there was reporting in the New York Times that said, although the administration had a veered to the Court in oral arguments that it had undertaken this consultative process with the State Department, in fact, they had asked the State Department, but had rescinded TPS before actually receiving an answer from the State Department about whether or not eliminating the status for residents of Haiti and Syria was appropriate at this time, given conditions in those countries. So there's that statutory question that is governed by Article 1, the statute and the questions and the requirements that are laid out in the statutory procedures. And then there's the second question. Even if they are permitted and have followed the appropriate procedures for eliminating and rescinding TPS status, is there additional barriers to doing this because the administration has acted with impermissible animas, I. E. Racial animas. And that's a constitutional question that comes from the 14th amendment. So. So in this decision, Justice Alito, who basically had a whole day for himself on Thursday at the Court, almost all of the decisions that were issued were written by him, and they were all predictably awful. But he wrote that the administration, any decisions that they made to rescind TPS were not reviewable by the Court. And the way they came to that conclusion was they assumed that the determination to rescind TPS was not simply about the decision to do so, but all of the steps going into that decision. So there's no point in that entire process, including the parts that were not taken, that were statutorily authorized and required, none of that is reviewable by a court, which basically means this administration and any forthcoming administration has free rein to do whatever they like with regard to asylum, regardless of what Congress and the statute has said. And then they turn to the constitutional question, even if this is permissible as a matter of statutory law, is this prohibited by the Constitution because the administration did things that they weren't supposed to do, like be racist? And Justice Alito says this doesn't really seem like racism to me. Those statements that the President made, not really racism. It just seems like they're describing actual conditions on the ground in Haiti. This is just the rough and tumble of politics. This is what politicians do. This is not racism. Maybe it's xenophobia, but it's not really racism and it's therefore not unconstitutional. So on every dimension, this is a horrible, awful decision. And predictably so, given the justice who authored it.
- [26:03]
Joy Reid
Yeah. I mean, anything written by a leader, you can expect it to be horrible and to be cruel. And he's really not the person that I would look to to judge whether something is racist. I don't think any of them actually would be very good at it. But, Ellie, if that as Melissa's excellent explanation, then wouldn't that mean that a future Democratic administration can say, our version of TPS is anyone who comes from Haiti gets to stay regardless. Anyone who comes from the Dominican Republic, they stay. Anyone who's a white South African, they can't. They can literally do whatever they want. Because according to this administration, unless you actually use the N word, nothing is racist. So voila.
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Nana Gyamfi
Are you sure that if they actually use the N word, this Supreme Court would say that that was unconstitutional racism?
- [26:45]
Joy Reid
Well, maybe at the end versus the ER they might. You know what? You're right. They probably wouldn't.
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Nana Gyamfi
Right. We're living in a world where we're asking racist people to tell us whether or not other racist people are unconstitutionally racist. It's like asking a dog that licks its own butt whether or not butt licking is hygienic. Like that is the level that we're at with the Supreme Court. So could a new Democratic President overturn this TPS ruling and re. Extend or. Or reauthorize TPS status? Yes, of course. Haiti has had TPS status since the 2010 earthqu and while every. Every person wearing Elon Musk Underoos. Right. Every Republican person over the past two days will be like, temporary means temporary. So it's temporary. And I'm like, look, if Googling the dictionary was enough to explain the law, then all these law schools need to shut down. Right. If all you need is a Webster's to figure out what the law means. Right. That's obviously not how it works. It's obviously more complicated than that. And what the statute requires is a determin that the issue that caused temporary protective status to be granted has been resolved. Right. That's what the statute requires. And the government is supposed to make an inquiry into that. Have they made an inquiry into the conditions in Haiti? Right now, I just putting cards on the table. I happen to be of Haitian descent. My father was Haitian. So if you want to say that I'm biased here, perhaps, but it also shows that I can read a goddamn newspaper. And the situations in Haiti right now are awful. There is no functional government. The country is run by a series of rival gangs. It is so unsafe in Haiti that the Haitian World cup soccer team could not play its home games in country because FIFA wouldn't sanction matches in that country. And so all of this racism that you played earlier from Stephen Miller, from Megyn Kelly, they're actually making the point of why this status needs to be extended. They're actually backhandedly making the point of why these people desperately need that status to be extended. And when the administration doesn't, that's when you say, well, was there perhaps racial animus motivating that policy? And that's when you get into all the horrible, disgusting statements from Trump and Nome and maga, and that's why you have a constitutional issue here. But here's the other thing. Let's never forget that racism is the core motivating factor of their entire movement. There is no modern Republican Party these days without racism. It's the rug that ties the room together. It's how you get billionaires like Elon Musk and a toothless yokel in a trucker hat or on the same team. Their core is racism. And that is why we are here today.
- [29:51]
Joy Reid
I mean, it's hard to get away from that because they try to make the point that the people who come here are too poor, they're going to wind up on public assistance. But if people are poor, that would actually add to your point, Ellie, be a reason why people are trying to leave where they are. Poverty and want have been a reason for people to come here since the Irish famine. Man made potato famine sent a lot of Irish immigrants here. Right? So that's not literally, as you said, expository on their side, but to bring you in here, Nana, the other piece of it is the lie that they're putting about Haitian workers. PBS did a really great piece after the whole they're eating the dogs, they're eating the cats bs. And they went and actually talked to employers of Haitian workers. And I believe these are workers in Ohio. Jason, if you could throw up a six, please.
- [30:41]
Nana Gyamfi
It started slowly.
- [30:42]
Joy Reid
We had an application pool that was
- [30:45]
Nana Gyamfi
a little bit different. People coming to work here, people looking for jobs.
- [30:48]
Joy Reid
What he's welding. Here, again, are welded axle components. Jamie McGregor is the CEO of McGregor Metal, which makes welded parts for the auto and farm industries. Right now, about 10% of his workforce is Haitian. Over 30 employees. I wish I had 30 more. Our Haitian associates come to work every day. They don't have a drug problem.
- [31:09]
Nana Gyamfi
They'll stay at their machine. They'll achieve their numbers. They are here to work. And so in general, that's a stark
- [31:16]
Joy Reid
difference from what we're used to in our community and in Florida. Nana, literally, the healthcare, senior healthcare industry is very dependent on Haitian nurses. So this is going to hurt real people. And also to, you know, to say nothing. Other people have to go home to a very unstable country. What is Baji's position on all of this?
- [31:42]
Satsuki Ina
So, firstly, one thing that we try to do at Baji, it's really important to us is to always put forth first the human part of this, right? And so beyond being workers, beyond being people that have boosted economies, that have brought towns and cities like Springfield from the dust into real life towns with a lot more happening because people were leaving that were originally from Springfield because of the conditions in Springfield, we have to talk about the fact that Haitians bring their culture, they bring their spirit, they bring their energy, they bring all of these things into communities. And they're part of a fabric. And they're part of the fabric that has been here for a long time. Not just with my brother here, but W.E.B Du Bois family was from Haiti. Crispus Atticus was from Haiti. Like Haiti, been in the United States for a long time. This is not a new thing to have Haitians here. Now, the Haitians that have come here because of TPS are coming here based upon the conditions that were either created by climate disaster, which we know is not coming from Haiti itself, but from countries like the US or because of the political interventions that in some cases have been actual takeovers of the island by the United States and other countries of the West. And so that has to be remembered. So when people are coming here, they're coming here with the intention to work. They're coming here with the intention to be a part of this society. They're coming here with the intention of achieving everything they can for themselves and their families. And when, you know, I saw, looking at all those clips that we're talking before about, you know, who these people are and how they need to be thrown away, I want to remind folks, or let folks know if they didn't, that after the decision, Stephen Miller had a press conference at the White House. And part of what he said is that Haitians who have to go back to Haiti need to know that it's not going to be any worse than going than living in Chicago or St. Louis. Talk about something that's more than a dog whistle. The idea, right, that these folks have is that if you are black, that there is no such thing as a condition that is too terrible for you to have to endure and to define our very existence and as inherently terrible, violent, you know, starvation, all of those things. And so it's not such a big deal when you have to be in those type of conditions without talking about how, number one, those conditions are made up in the degree that they talk about them. But secondly, that to the degree that they are real, that it is these white supremacist Epstein class broligarchy, fascists that have created those conditions.
- [34:31]
Joy Reid
You know, I think that the there's a lot of upset, I guess, on the Supreme Court. You hear about it that they're angry that people view them as racist or as partisan and the way that they're spoken about even here and now, and yet the behavior of some of them. I do want to go to, because you did clerk Melissa for Justice Sotomayor, and she read her dissent aloud. I want to know, first of all, is that unusual for the dissent to be read aloud rather than just submitted? And there are reports that while she was reading it, Justice Alito was visibly eye rolling, sighing, staring at the ceiling, having a visible reaction. Very similar. Is that unusual behavior and how should we read that, if at all?
- [35:24]
Melissa Murray
So it's not necessarily unusual for someone to read a dissent from the bench. Many of the dissenters will read their dissents from the bench if it is an issue about which they are particularly exercised. So, for example, Justice Sotomayor has read aloud her dissent, for example, in Shrif vs Utah, which was a case about police violence. So there's precedent for this. What there isn't precedent for is your colleagues literally being on one while you are talking at work. So that seems less to be the norm at the Supreme Court. They tend to be more decorous. There's been some reporting that makes clear that this the idea that Justice Alita, who not only rolled his eyes and looked at the ceiling and seemed visibly agitated while she read her dissent, also provided a short rebuttal after she concluded her statement. And that to me seemed very unusual. But I'm told that this happened once before in 1961, when Justices Frankfurter and Earl Warren got into some kind of beef over a criminal law issue. And it also happened in the 2000s when Justice Scalia made a response to Justice Breyer after Justice Breyer finished reading a dissent. But those are the only recorded times that I have seen where someone has done this. So this isn't normal. It may actually, though, be on brand for Justice Alito, because who can forget that State of the Union during President Obama's presidency, when the president made a comment about Citizens United, which had been decided by the court that year, and he talked about the impact that Citizens United would have on campaign finance and our political landscape. And Justice Alito visibly shook his head, which the justices never do at the State of the Union. They usually sort of stand there like statues. He shook his head and mouth the words not true. So it's peevish, certainly, but perhaps on brand for him. The point that you make, though, about these justices being really worried about what people say about them, I think that's worth digging into a little. You know, this is one of the things I talk about in the book. The Supreme Court is, unlike Article 1, the Congress, which has the power of the purse. It's unlike Article 2, the executive, which has the power of the sword. All it has for its legitimacy is the sense that we think that what it is doing is actually law, as opposed to merely prosecuting their own personal preferences. So they care a lot about what we think, and it really gets them when we think that they are being unprincipled. And to be very clear, they're giving a lot of evidence for being unprincipled in these decisions, certainly the decisions that were issued yesterday. You know, Justice Alito apparently could not see the racism in the president's statements about Haiti. But he could find the racism in the Second Amendment case Wolford vs Lopez, where the State of Court, Hawaii, had a gun control law. And under the tests that the Supreme Court has articulated, you have to show that there is an historical twin for that kind of law if the law is supposed to survive Second Amendment scrutiny. And Hawaii pointed to an 1860 law from Louisiana that prevented gun owners from coming onto private property with their guns. And the Supreme Court and Justice Alito, in his decision for the conservative super majority, said, we're not going to consider a law from 1860s Louisiana because that law was likely animated by the racist impulse of disarming newly freed African Americans. And so, you know, all of a sudden, Justice Alito is woke, and he cares about black people, and he cares about them being able to be armed. And for that reason, we can't consider a law that seems fairly well on point on all fours with the gun control law that Hawaii has enacted. And so it's those kinds of inconsistencies. Seeing the racism here in the Second Amendment context, but refusing to see the racism that literally is uttered in plain view of all of us. And I think that's the kind of thing that gets people mad. And so if you are mad, I think stay mad and make your anger heard like they hear it. And they know this. This is how Justice Kavanaugh heard people calling those detention stops, Kavanaugh stops. And he wrote a whole opinion reiterating that the Fourth Amendment actually does not provide for generalized suspicion. It has to be individualized. So this does actually work. It matters that we listen. It matters that we're following them. We need to stay following them. We just need to stay on them about these decisions.
- [39:47]
Nana Gyamfi
But I slightly disagree with Professor Murray because I don't think that they care what we think us here. I think they care about white people,
- [39:57]
Melissa Murray
not these melanated people.
- [39:59]
Nana Gyamfi
I think they care what white folks think. I think that there is that moderate white voter that John Roberts really doesn't want to think, want them to think that John Roberts is racist.
- [40:11]
Melissa Murray
But I agree with you 100%. But you're right. But I do think public opinion matters to them because they don't have legitimacy without the public believing that what they are doing is law as opposed to rank ideology.
- [40:24]
Nana Gyamfi
But then I think. I think you're right, but I think that that also then becomes part of the media problem.
- [40:29]
Jason
Right.
- [40:29]
Nana Gyamfi
Because the only way they hear what the public says is through the lens of when they're watching Bari Weiss's CBS News, when they're reading the Wall Street Journal, when they're engaging in whites only spaces. I mean, John Roberts famously has lunch with the same three guys he had lunch with in law school. Their circles are so tight. And if you're not penetrating those circles, they're not hearing you at all. And I think that's one of the real problems that we have with the court, is that they are not just. They're not just overpowered, they're incredibly insulated.
- [41:07]
Jason
Right.
- [41:08]
Melissa Murray
I'm going to push back on you on this. I think right now is kind of the golden age of court watching. We have never seen more eyes on the court than we have in this moment. The fact that there are podcasts like mine where three women just like go off on the court and everything they do every single week, that's unprecedented. That didn't happen before. And we're not the only podcast that follows the court. The fact that the New York Times put a Pulitzer Prize investigative journalist on the Supreme Court beat to go literally get in their stuff that is meaningful. More and more people have eyes on the court. And yes, they are incredibly insular. I understand what you're saying. But there have never been more eyes on the court. And I think that for them means that more people are attuned to what they're doing and are more skeptical that what they are doing is law. Because it looks and feels weird and out of step and out of touch and not lawful and not partisan.
- [42:00]
Joy Reid
And partisan. And it does appear that they're making policy, not law. We are out of time. We've gone a little bit over time. I want to give Nana one final word. What is your final word? What should we be doing about this? What do we do next?
- [42:11]
Satsuki Ina
So next, there's a lot of things to do next, but the first thing is we need to make sure that Haitian TPS holders and their families know not to panic. Do not quit your job. Do not take that $2,600 check. We are not defeated. People are going to be able to adjust status. And more importantly, we've got to be organized and really move. Because I will say that I think public opinion, when people say public opinion, they really mean white folks. That what we've seen with Kalay and with all of these cases that are specifically around black people is that black people's opinions clearly do not matter. What is going to matter is our capacity to put some people power on the ground and to actually move some things. And so, you know, keep in touch with Baji, keep in touch with other organizations that are doing this work. And we've got to unite as a black diaspora. Birthright citizenship, I think, is going to come up on Monday. They could do it on July 4th if they could. And we've got to be ready.
- [43:07]
Joy Reid
We should be ready, and we should be prepared for it to be bad. I'm going to read one more thing from Melissa's book. This is from the Constitution Annotated. And Congress is the one authorated to make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers and all the powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States or in any department or officer thereof. That means you vote for the people who make the laws that the Supreme Court is only supposed to interpret. They're not supposed to be out here making policy, which is what it feels like. They're doing. If you want to change what they have done, you need a Congress that's going to pass a law that will let refugees other than white South Africans into the United States. That is on you. And so if you want to do what Ellie has said and expand the Supreme Court, you need the United States Senate that is going to be run by people who actually believe you should expand the court. There are things you can do about this, but it's going to require you voting. At the end of the show. We're going to get into the whole people not voting thing, which really bothers me. Thank you, Ellie Mystal, Nana Gyamphy and Melissa Murray. If you want to get a copy of Melissa's book, just use the code birthday. Get 15% off Ellie's books. All of them are also in the shop. These books really go fast. Once I say this, it's like the books all go very, very fast. So get them while you can while they are available. Thank you, friends. We appreciate you all Have a great weekend.
- [44:23]
Satsuki Ina
Thank you.
- [44:23]
Nana Gyamfi
Have a nice one.
- [44:24]
Joy Reid
Thank you very much. All right. The Joy Reach show, let me let you know, is brought to you by our friends at Common Power. Last year, when the Republican Party started early redistricting, they made it clear that earning Americans votes was the least of their priorities. And after gutting the Voting Rights act, they have doubled down on their attempts to rig the midterm elections. This is nothing new. Our country has been here before. Common Power is fueled by the historical movements that brought us the Voting Rights Act, a call to action that mobilized volunteers from around the country to the south. This taught us the importance of fighting for our neighbors both locally and across state lines, including what we were just talking about now with DBS today. If you are in a predominantly blue state, we are asking you to join the national fight. Common Power has built an organizing force to train and deploy volunteers to door knock for democrats in over 20 battleground states and over 50 races this year alone. Historically, traveling to help your neighbor has been an essential part of progress in this country. And this election requires our leaders to use every tool at their disposal, including trained, dedicated volunteers from around the country who are ready to win in key battleground states. For those of you who refuse to sit this moment out, sign up to volunteer@commoncommonpower.org Joy, that's commonpower.org Joy, please do it if you can. All right, let's get to some legal news. John Bolton, Donald Trump's national Security Advisor during his first term and a guy most famous before that, for saying that if you lopped off the top 10 floors of the 39 story United Nations Secretariat building in New York, it wouldn't make a bit of difference. Which, you know, what kind of in looking back might have maybe been true. And who has been pressing for regime change and a war with Iran literally since his mustache was a baby. He has pleaded guilty to mishandling classified documents. Here's how the AP reported him. Former Trump administration national security adviser John Bolton pleaded guilty on Friday to illegally retaining classified information, sealing a deal with federal prosecutors that could allow him to avoid a prison term. Bolton, who became an outspoken critic of Donald Trump. President Donald Trump, serving in the administration's after serving in the administration's first administration, is scheduled to be sentenced on October 28th by US District Judge Theodore Chuang in Greenbelt, Maryland. The 77 year old, who's from Bethesda, pleaded guilty to a single count of illegally retaining national defense information, which carries a max sentence of 10 years. His plea agreement with the Justice Department may enable him to avoid time behind bars, but the judge ultimately will decide his punishment. After a prosecutor read aloud a summary of his offenses, Bolton agreed that it was accurate and said, I'm sorry for it. That's what he told the judge. Defense attorney Abby Lowell said Bolton did what real leaders do by pleading guilty. He took responsibility for a mistake he made, thereby saving the government resources to pursue a case that could expose additional sensitive information. Which that's what Lowell said. His lawyer, Abbey Lowell, which kind of sounds like a dig at Trump, you know, because Trump, you know, did do the thing about putting classified material he took in his bathroom in his ballroom. Maybe John Bolton should have put his stuff in the ballroom or the bathroom like a real American, because, you know, it's weird. He actually took the information because he was writing a book about his time in government and he shared some of the classified information with family members, like sent them in emails to family members. Like, that's what he did. He didn't take boxes of that crap home and put in his ballroom or his bathroom. But, you know, details tomorrow. Let me do one more headline here before we get to our guests on the international side. The United nations has formally decreed that Israel deliberately kills children. Take a listen. Yeah, so I can only speak legally. There is no doubt whatsoever. There can be no doubt in anyone who reads today's report that every international legal norm has been violated by the actions of the Israeli authorities towards Palestinian children and they need to be held accountable. When we had the oral hearings and doctors participating. They told us that many of the amputations they had to carry out on babies and very young children were without anesthesia, without painkillers. You can imagine the agony those children went through. They also told us they have not seen the destruction of pediatric and neonatal facilities on this scale. Out of the six hospitals, five were completely destroyed by the Israeli Defense Forces. One more back to the domestic news. Tomorrow will be the funeral for one year old Cohen Wiley. That's the one year old boy who was shot by a Mississippi police officer as he sat in his mother's lap in a parking lot at a Walmart in Mississippi where a shoplifting call led to a police dispatch at a level that you would think would be required for like an armed robbery. For these legal stories and more, I'm joined by two of our favorite legal eagles, our good friend Dina Dahl, legal correspondent for Midas Touch, and our friend Paul Butler, Georgetown law professor, author and legal thinker extraordinaire. Thank you both. And we went a little bit late on that a block, so thank you for your patience. Just want to go through these stories one by one. And Dean, I want to start with you on John Bolton. I think a lot of people heard that guilty plea and are like, how could he be guilty of something Trump did? And he's facing five years in prison and a two million dollar fine and Trump, it was like,
- [49:50]
Dina Dahl
you know, if Trump wasn't elected president, he probably would be behind bars because the evidence that Jack Smith had against him in that classified documents case was, I mean, we still haven't frankly even seen it all. Because John, you know, Judge Cannon hasn't really said, but he, as you pointed out in the pictures of the bathroom, I mean, he did far worse. He did far worse. And we know enough. We know enough. But the American people gave him a get out of free jail card. You know, you can't really spin it any other way. If he had been able to continue to trial, I do think he would have gotten some sort of punishment.
- [50:25]
Joy Reid
Same thing to you, Paul. I mean, federal prosecutors like Jack Smith to me seems like the most by the book guy you could possibly come up with. Like he doesn't seem like he would do an egregious malicious prosecution. In your view, when you look back on the, the Jack, the Jack Smith case, did he have as much evidence as they clearly had on Bolton?
- [50:45]
Paul Butler
I think he did. But as Dina said, we'll never know because Judge Cannon has refused to release the prosecutor report and she of course, dismissed the case even this Extremely conservative Supreme Court probably would have overturned that decision. And that case may have gone to trial, but for President Trump being reelected. But Joy, I got to tell you, I'm mad at the Justice Department about its ridiculous prosecution of Congressman Monica McIver. Mad at it about what it tried to do and is still trying to do with Letitia James. I'm mad at it about James Comey. I'm not so mad about this prosecution. Bolton pled guilty. This investigation was started during the first Trump administration, but it picked up steam during the Biden administration. The prosecutor brought the case is one of the more respected appointees of Donald Trump. The U.S. attorney in Maryland and career professionals also signed off on the case. Two federal judges who authorized search warrants who believed that there was probable cause. And when Bolton was writing his book, Trump tried to stop him from publishing the book. The judge in that case said, I'm not going to stop the book publication. But Mr. Bolton, just so you know, you are looking at jail time if you're ever prosecuted for this case.
- [52:13]
Joy Reid
Yeah, I mean, to me that was a pretty open stuff. I mean, he admitted he did it, he seemed to done it. Or let's go to some of these other cases. I'm going to set the UN Case aside for now because this is sort of an international law case that is just. It's sad, it's horrific, but it's like sort of confirmatory. But I want to go to this case about this little one year old. I'm going to go in reverse order and start with you, Paul. Police officers open fire on a car with a woman with a baby in her lap. There's a claim there's a shoplifting of some diapers which cost like maybe 20 bucks. The mom says she has a receipt for the diapers, but her baby's dead. The family is asking for for a new autopsy. What could that do? What would that solve? And this is obviously going to be a civil case.
- [52:59]
Paul Butler
The autopsy will reveal exactly how the baby died. It might reveal some information about where the officer who murdered this child was when he or she shot. It's a civil case, Joy. These officers should be charged with homicide. Fast, quick and in a hurry. This case, the crime that they were investigating was shoplifting diapers. The mother and no one else in the car was implicated in this theft. But what the police did that was most egregious was to shoot at a moving car when they knew that there were at least two innocent people in the car, including this one year old child. Every professional police officer knows you do not shoot at a moving car. Why don't you? Because this is precisely the kind of tragedy that might happen.
- [54:00]
Joy Reid
Right, Dina? It does remind me of the Renee Nicole Good situation. There are lots of other people in the street and the same claim is made. The claim is being made that the car was driving at the officer. They need to prove that. Right. I mean, they're just making a claim that the car was being driven at them. They did the same with Renee Nicole Good. But it seems to me it's never a safe or a good idea in a crowded parking lot to shoot at a moving vehicle. You could kill anyone.
- [54:26]
Dina Dahl
Absolutely. And really, shooting at a moving vehicle doesn't stop the vehicle from moving toward you either. But this is why they're looking in part for the autopsy. Because the autopsy will help show the direction that the bullets were fired, how many bullets were fired in order to refute. Because the. The baby's mother says they weren't even going toward the police. So though that information that they can get independently from the autopsy is helpful. But also, you know, I know the, the families and people connected, attorneys connected to the case also say the fact that they haven't released the body cam footage already is in itself revealing because that is usually what happens if the body cam footage is helpful to the police's theory of the case. Right. That's the first thing they show. It's like if they don't want an alternative story to get out. So the fact that that hasn't been shown yet leads credence to the mother's story and then. But the autopsy, that is in part why they want to know it is that will help prove the direction of those bullets.
- [55:28]
Joy Reid
Yeah, absolutely. So speaking of surveillance footage, the Carmelo Anthony case is now going to appeal. His attorneys are filing an appeal right now. I'm going to go in reverse order again, Dina. There is now the surveillance video has been released by Texas authorities. We're going to play. We're playing a sped up version. It shows the sequence of events when these two teenagers arrived at a track meet. This is a brightened up version of it that was released by a local news organization in Dallas. So it looks a lot brighter. The actual video looks very gray because it was raining. You can really tell in the other video that it's raining. It shows the arrival. The people are very small in here, but I can tell you there's a little circle showing the arrival both of Carmelo Anthony and also of the young man who was killed and his brother. And you see Carmelo Anthony go into the tent where he's going to get out of the rain, take a seat in the back row of the tent and then you can see the young man who has, was killed later confront him, go up to him twice while he's sitting under the tarp. And I'm wondering, you know, it appears that they were the ones confronting Carmelo Anthony. I don't know if this video was used during the course of the trial, but when you look at this case, do you feel that Carmelo Anthony's attorneys did a thorough job in presenting a self defense defense?
- [56:53]
Dina Dahl
Well, that is exactly what is going to be the issue in his appeal. Because even that this footage where you see them can, you know, the, the man who died and the young man
- [57:05]
Joy Reid
that died and his brother, Austin Metcalf, sorry.
- [57:09]
Dina Dahl
And his brother can confront Carmelo tied together with the body cam footage that was also recently released where he says, you know, he put his hands on me. And we know this size difference, all of that definitely should have been part of the defense's argument and been presented to the jury about self defense. I think a big issue on appeal also though, of course is going to be the fact that the prosecutor struck the three black jurors. And interestingly, the Supreme Court that has disappointed us so many times recently just had a 5, 4 decision in favor of somebody who was on death row where his, the jurors, the black jurors were struck. And Kavanaugh wrote that opinion saying, you know, his defense attorney didn't have enough chance to contest that, surprisingly. But you know, evidently this is Kavanaugh, since he was in Yale Law School, actually cares about this issue, which may be a glimmer of hope that, you know, if this does ever work its way to the Supreme Court. But at the end of the day, right, it's a self defense theory is all about whether or not you can convince a jury, jury. So it really matters who those jurors are and putting themselves in the perspective of the defendant. And that's why we care so much about the jury of our peers.
- [58:28]
Joy Reid
Indeed. And to that point that you made, Dina, I want to play for you, Paul. This is the actual arrest video. And I think the significant thing for you who are listening to listen for is the immediate defense that Carmelo Anthony makes to the arresting officer, which to me this is a moment when he's not in a court, he's not been advised by counsel what to say. He probably shouldn't have said anything. But what he says to me does not Speak to some sort of intent to kill this other young man. Take a listen.
- [59:00]
Joe Okimoto
Hold on.
- [59:04]
Nana Gyamfi
If somebody is treatment under a memorial
- [59:07]
Joy Reid
tent, don't reach for anything. All right, man, Stop right there for me.
- [59:13]
Paul Butler
Dispatch, 443, I got the suspects and they're currently treating the victim.
- [59:18]
Joy Reid
Again, he's on the north end of the stadium. All right, any weapons on you like that? I got the alleged suspect in handcuffs right now.
- [59:29]
Paul Butler
Detained.
- [59:32]
Joy Reid
Have a seat here real quick, man. Watch your head.
- [59:36]
Nana Gyamfi
Let me check your.
- [59:37]
Joy Reid
Your hood here, buddy. Okay, well, tell you. I'll tell you what, Lean this way so you're not resting on your hands.
- [59:41]
Paul Butler
Okay?
- [59:42]
Joy Reid
All right, I see a little bit of blood on your hands there.
- [59:44]
Satsuki Ina
Okay.
- [59:44]
Nana Gyamfi
All right, so your first name is?
- [59:47]
Satsuki Ina
Carmelo. Let's see. Hold on one second.
- [59:54]
Joy Reid
I don't know yet, man.
- [59:54]
Paul Butler
Carmelo.
- [59:55]
Nana Gyamfi
C A R, A K A R
- [59:57]
Joy Reid
K A R M E L O M E L O. Carmelo Low.
- [60:01]
Paul Butler
What's your last name?
- [60:02]
Joy Reid
A N th
- [60:08]
Satsuki Ina
grade.
- [60:08]
Joy Reid
You go to Emerson.
- [60:10]
Paul Butler
Where you go? Centennial. Okay.
- [60:12]
Joy Reid
I'm in 12th grade.
- [60:13]
Paul Butler
12th grade.
- [60:13]
Satsuki Ina
12th Grade.
- [60:14]
Paul Butler
Okay.
- [60:14]
Joy Reid
No, Centennial. All right, sit tight for me real quick, bud.
- [60:16]
Satsuki Ina
All right.
- [60:17]
Joy Reid
So he says I was. The first thing he says is I was protecting myself. Does that help?
- [60:25]
Paul Butler
It should have. That was his defense at trial, which the jury. Jury rejected. What they also rejected was the alternative of sentencing him or convicting him of manslaughter, which would have carried a significantly lower sentence than the murder charge that he was convicted of in the 35 years that he got. To Dina's point. The jurors are asked to put themselves in the position of the defendant to see if he reasonably believed that he was. That his life was in danger. And these white jurors had a really difficult time putting themselves in the position of this young black man. When I look at that video, I see a scared teenager who does not believe that he did anything wrong and is not trying to hide anything from the police and says that, yes, I assailed the victim here and I did it because he put his hands on me. That was self defense. And just really quickly, to underscore such an important point you made when you introduced this video, Joy, if you get arrested by the police, shut the heck up. Even if you are innocent, do not tell them anything because what they will do is exactly what they did to the Carmelo. Whatever you say, they will use it against you.
- [61:55]
Joy Reid
Yes, indeed. He immediately starts talking and. Right. Having done this for so long, my first thought was, you should not be talking, young man. Appreciate both it really did take me back to the Trayvon Martin case. And that trial rested on whether the jurors related more to Trayvon Martin or to his assailant, which one they could relate to. And because, again, there was not one black juror, there was one black Latina juror. That's what we found in the end. But she was overridden, we later found out, by the other jurors who all related to the killer and not to him. And so they decided that he was the victim. And that is the way things go. That's why you need a jury of your peers. Dina Dahl and Paul Butler appreciate you guys. Hopefully you guys can come back and talk more legal stuff, more legal news on the show. Thank you both.
- [62:40]
Dina Dahl
Thanks for having me.
- [62:41]
Joy Reid
Have a great weekend. And there you have it. This is the reason why jury selection is so important and it's yet another reason why you've got to register to vote. Because the only way that you get on a jury pool and even can be considered being on a jury, you have to be registered to vote. That is where they get the jury pool. So yet another reason why you must register to vote. We will continue to follow the appeal in the Carmel Anthony case. We're going to continue to follow the case of this sweet little boy, Cohen Wiley. These are children and there's a lot. Also I wanted to unpack, but we ran out of time. The kind of racist statements by Mr. Metcalf, who's obviously in pain and at the loss of his son, and deepest condolences, of course, to him. But some of the statements that were made later were pretty openly. Even he said he was going to say something racist. It's calling Carmelo Anthony watermelon felon and such that we don't know if that comes in in the appeal, but we will see. Welcome to hour two of the Joy Reid Show. Do be sure to hit that like and subscribe button if you have bought merch. Please be sure to tag us. You can tag us at Readers, you can tag us at Joy and Reid. You can hashtag Readers, tag me at Joy Ann Reid and that Joy Reed show on Instagram if you want to do that. And, and please be sure, don't forget to stick around at the end of the show because we are going to do a members only after party. So get your cocktails ready for that. It's going to be fun. I told you our question of the night is going to be who is it on? We're going to talk about voting because, you know, I'm not my voting girl. Who's it on in the state of Texas? Is it on Jasmine Crockett? Or is it on James Talarico to bring those two sides together so that you can get enough turnout among African American voters for him to have a shot? It's going to be very hard to win in Texas. Texas is Texas. But to do it, you're going to need huge turnout. And I'm going to explain later why turnout is kind of everything. Let's take one more ad break. Well, one other ad break our this show, the Joy Reach show, is brought to you by the audio marketing gurus at Radioactive Media. Now look, if you're a business owner or decision maker in marketing and you're still on the sidelines, podcasts should no longer be optional. Yes, clearly I believe they're essential to how consumers spend their time, their attention and trust. Podcasting is the fastest growing digital media, and I'll bet you didn't know that. Podcast ad spending is pacing to increase by 33% this year and podcasts like mine that utilized video are 97.7%. Podcasting is no longer on the edges of the marketing mix. Research shows that more than half of all Americans now listen to podcasts at least monthly, listening close to an hour a day. 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To get the lowest rates in podcast and radio, Radioactive Media can surpass your current strategies with new and innovative ways that sound better. Go to RadioactiveMedia.com or text RESULTS to 511511 Text RESULTS the 511-511 I will note that Radioactive was one of our main Sponsors for the Joy Reid show live. So we doubly, triply appreciate radioactive media. So please go ahead and support by Texting results to 511-511-today. All right, I think I might have a breaking news coming in. Is. Is my earring coming out? Oh, I had the breaking news is that my earring was coming out. I see Winsome slowly approaching me like a shark in the water. That's coming. You just see her coming closer and closer. And she's just getting closer and closer. And it was that my earring was coming out. I was like, ooh, breaking news. I thought she was going to tell me that, you know, they canceled America 250 or something because it was bothering too many people in D.C. or, you know, something like that. My earring was deciding to take leave of absence. It can't go. It can't go. And I am telling you, you're not going to. You're staying right here in my ear where you belong. And she was, the way she was coming at me, Jason, so slowly, so slow. It was like a slower, slow approach. She's trying to frighten me focus and not throw you off. You've been on a row. But I was. And the funny thing about it, I was, I didn't even pay attention. I was supposed to be looking right at you and I didn't pay attention to it. People, people were hoping for different breaking news. And I'm not gonna say what it is. No, it's not that. Breaking news meanies. Okay, so not that breaking news. Earring said, I'm out hearing said, peace. I've had enough of this. Scaring is caring. It's Friday night. I'm going to drink. I've got my scaredy poured and I'm ready to drink. It made me drink. It made me want to get drunk. My earring said, I've had enough. The court cases are bad. Trump is terrible. Immigration has been cut off. I'm going to self deport off your ear. But you can't do that. I'm keeping you here. You have to stay. I'm telling you, you're not going. You have to stay with me. We've got a lot more coming up in the show. And the issue of immigration, which is a big theme of ours tonight, obviously it is important because it is what America is made of. Both my parents were immigrants to this country. Obviously, I am a first gener American. So I care a lot about this because this is how America is composed. And it's interesting that the people who are in some cases, the most anti immigrant people like Stephen Miller. He wouldn't even be here were it not for immigration. His family were Jewish refugees, I want to say, from not Lithuania, from somewhere in Eastern Europe. He wouldn't even been here yet. He is this blood and soil right wing who we now know. People who hate the Southern Poverty Law center came and complained to him because he was listed in the Southern Poverty Law Center's annals of people who had some sort of either affinity for or connections to white nationalists. How can you be a Jewish fascist white nationalist? That doesn't even make sense. It's so oxymoronic. But there we are. You have people like Donald Trump from the Drumpf family who came here in the 1890s from Germany. The grandfather came over, ended up being banned from going back to Bavaria, which is where they're from. They lied and said they were Swedish, but they're really Bavarian German. Because he was a draft dodger like his grandson. And since he dodged the draft and refused to register, they said, you can't even come back to Bavaria. You're stuck. He was stuck here. And he wound up being in, by some arts, some biographers, a pimp because he failed at trying to find gold. He tried to be a gold prospector, but he was bad at it. And so he ended up being a pimp and pimping women to the other prospectors who were more successful at prospecting. There's a theme in that. And then his grandson, Donald Trump, changes his name to Drumpf and suddenly they hate immigrants. What is happening? What is happening? And you know, we won't even go into Megyn Kelly, who's just an awful human being. She's just the worst. But that mean, nasty, mean act is Nosferatu. Jason, is Nosferatu here to talk to us? Nosferatu, can we, can you come to the stage? Nosferatu. I think I left him when we went on vacation. Nosferat. Yes, I left him a long time ago.
- [70:35]
Jason
Yeah.
- [70:37]
Joy Reid
All right. So who can forget little Liam Canejo Ramos, the five year old boy detained with his dad in Minneapolis during Trump's Operation Metro surge? The same military style putsch in which Renee Nicole Goode and Alex Preddy were gunned down in the streets by masked law enforcement. But it was Liam whose image in his little blue like bunny hat and Spider man backpack that became the first global symbol of the Trump regime's immigration cruelty. In that after detaining little Liam, they tried to use him as bait to get his mother to come outside of their house so they could kidnap her, too. And when they did kidnap Liam and his father, Adrian, his name is Adrian Canejo Arias, who, like Liam, had an active asylum claim at the time, meaning they were in the country legally. They took the father and son to a concentration camp far from their home in Minneapolis. They took them to Texas to a place called Dilley Detention Center, a gulag from which you would real talk, infamously hear screams coming out of that building and where the before and after picture of Liam when Congressman Joaquin Castro came to see about him alongside Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, who was his congresswoman, and eventually to free him and take him home, that double image of this happy little boy in the blue hat and this emaciated looking, little, very ill looking, you know, sort of drawn looking, you know, sleeping out of what seemed to be just mental distress. That same little boy was so different after whatever happened to him at Dilley Detention center, that became emblematic of what this moment means. That is what internment does to you. That's what concentration camps do to you. And in Trump's America, we have internment camps. We have concentration camps all over the country, mainly in red states like Texas and Florida, where they infamously built one in a swamp and called it Alligator Alcatraz like it was a joke and sold merch. The one in New Jersey was built illegally without permits. And when members of Congress tried to inspect it, one of them, the aforementioned Lamonica McIver, was arrested for trying to defend a fellow congresswoman who is elderly, was getting shoved around by ICE officials. Lamonica McIver, the congresswoman is currently facing bogus federal charges while heavily pregnant as yet another show of force by this fascist regime that 80 million foolhardy, reckless Americans let back into the White House. Like the sucker who opens the door to the juke joint in Sinners. One of the most powerful speakers at the recent Rise up and Sing concert and resistance rally that I was privileged to be a part of in New York City on no Kings Day was the very popular children's content host, Ms. Rachel, who had this to say about the children who, like little Liam, Liam Ramos, have been interned at Dilley Family Detention Center. Take a listen to some of what she said. I've had the honor of meeting with 10 absolutely precious children who and their wonderful families who have been locked in Dilley Immigration Detention center in Texas. One minute I Talked to a 9 year old about how we both love pizza and soft and how he won the spelling bee and wanted to get to the state spelling bee, and the next minute he was begging for help to get out of what we know is a family prison, a prison that is neglecting, abusing and traumatizing kids. As the American Academy of Pediatrics says, there is no safe amount of time for a child to be in detention. Tilly, Immigration Detention center must be shut down. We need to end the cruel policies of family detention and family separation. Amen to that, Ms. Rachel. And it is sad to say that we are here in the year of our Lord 2026. But of course we have been here before during World War II, when the minority group being demonized were Japanese Americans who paid for the Empire of Japan attacking Pearl harbor with the full force of the federal government, assaulting their very Americanness, rounding up thousands of US citizens and permanent residents and shipping them off to internment camps. That happened literally under the man I call the reverse Donald Trump, Franklin Delano Roosevelt, someone who used his, the sort of awesome powers of the government unlike anyone had done really since Abraham Lincoln, but used it mostly for good when it came to economics, but in this case for very, very evil. And notably, what was done to Japanese Americans was not done to German Americans like the aforementioned Drump family who later changed their name to Trump, despite Hitler being the German autocrat who was responsible for World War II. It was not done to Italian Americans like the Desantis or the Giuliani's, despite Mussolini, you know, but you know, whiteness, they only decided to target Japanese Americans for that retribution against the Empire of Japan, even though the people they targeted were Americans. They were Americans who were demonizable because certain racist people decided that they should be punished, that they should be suspected, that even their children should be detained. This should sound familiar if you're looking at our present era. So a group of survivors of that prior detention, this time by the upside down Roosevelt, Donald Trump, who wields power with the exact same ferocity, if not more ferocity, but only for evil, only for personal aggrandizement, only for personal vengeance, racism and hate, and for self enrichment. He wields that power strictly for those purposes. He's wielding that power now against immigrants from countries he continues to be, that he considers to be shitholes, countries filled with black and brown people, people that he hates, people from Haiti, people from African nations, people from Syria who he also wants to ship back there despite the dangers. But a group of people who have survived that prior internment have decided to speak up and speak out for the current victims of internment. They call themselves free families. We can play this clip. The National Coalition to end family and child detention. And they will be leading a four day, 45 mile interfaith pilgrimage from the site of the Crystal City concentration Camp where Japanese American families were imprisoned during World War II, to the Dilley Family Detention center where immigrant families are imprisoned today. Three families are comprised of Japanese American World War II camp survivors, including people who survived the Crystal City concentration camp as children. And they will join faith leaders, labor leaders, immigrants rights advocates and the mayor of Crystal City on the pilgrimage along FM65 and SH85, culminating with an interfaith healing ceremony and vigil in the town of Dilley tomorrow. That's tomorrow, Saturday, June 27th at 10:00am Central Time. Here are some of the organizers speaking.
- [78:33]
Joe Okimoto
So I come here with hope and understanding that pilgrimage is a journey of
- [78:44]
Jason
healing
- [78:47]
Joe Okimoto
and also to fully acknowledge the brutality and the trauma that people who were held here had suffered, that we were wrenched from our homes, we were unconstitutionally detained, we were robbed of our belongings. Many of us were forced to renounce our American citizenship. And we were here gathered. My father had been separated from us and we were reunited here. This was a family reunification center to be deported to Japan.
- [79:28]
Joy Reid
The woman you just heard is Satsuki Ina, co founder of the Tsuru for Solidarity and a survivor of Crystal City and Tule Lake concentration camps. And she's joined by Joe Okimoto, Elder chair of the Tsuru for Solidarity's Leadership Council and a survivor of the Poston concentration camp. Thank you both for being here.
- [79:51]
Joe Okimoto
Thank you, Joe.
- [79:52]
Satsuki Ina
You're welcome.
- [79:53]
Joy Reid
Thank you both. I want to start with you, Ms. Ina. I feel like the two of you are uniquely positioned to understand what children like little Liam, who was taken to Dilley Detention center have gone through. Talk about what it is like to be a little kid, a child who is thrown into a concentration camp.
- [80:20]
Joe Okimoto
So, you know, I was born in one of the prison camps at Tule Lake and my brother was born in a different prison camp. We were held for four and a half years before we were sent to Crystal City, Texas, which was a family reunification center. My father had been taken from us. So we had suffered family separation for two years and we're finally reunited with the intention of the government to deport us to Japan, even though we were American citizens. So, you know, we were held in the arms of parents who had no idea what their future was going to hold. My mother wrote in her diary, I wonder if today's the day they're going to line us up and shoot us.
- [81:09]
Joy Reid
And she wrote that in her diary. But how did she explain your reality to you and your siblings as a kid? Like, how did she explain it? How did your parents, your mom explain it to you?
- [81:21]
Joe Okimoto
Yeah, I think. I think she was so overwhelmed with anxiety and fear. She just took care of us. I don't think she was capable or able to explain to us. We were toddlers, but what we inherited or internalized was the message from her body to our body through her anxiety. So I think we knew fear at a very raw level. So much uncertainty and, you know, our own trauma of being separated from our father. There were food issues, there were safety issues. There were so many problems. Many of us, we were sick for a good part of the time when we were children there.
- [82:16]
Joy Reid
I am not surprised by that. Mr. Okimoto, same question to you. Because, you know, being told by your country without words that you don't belong, that you're not one of us, that you don't get to be here. That in and of itself is such a trauma. But then there's also the physical trauma of being a child in a concentration camp. Please talk about your experience.
- [82:38]
Jason
Yes, I'm actually a son of immigrant parents who came to America in 1937 as Christian ministers to spread the gospel among Japanese immigrants on the West Coast. They brought with her them two children, 1 and 3. And I was born the following year in San Diego. And in 1942, when the executive order was signed, my mother was six months pregnant with my younger brother. And so our family was comprised of five of us plus the child in utero. And we were taken to by US soldiers to the Santa Anita racetrack, which was a temporary prison camp, only they called it an assembly center, which in an effort to hide really what the government was doing, and we were assigned to a hostel as a living space. So the trauma, you can imagine what the trauma was for, especially for our mother who was facing a pregnancy and delivery in the midst of a concentration camp. And for me, I think the trauma was so intense I was three years old that my brain could only block it out. And so I have a traumatic amnesia for that period of time from age 3 to 7, actually. So most of what I know comes from my discussions with my older sister and brother,
- [84:51]
Joy Reid
you know, and you hear this. And I actually had this conversation with George Takei, who, the actor who, folks know the beloved character Sulu from Star Trek and his other acting work. And he talks about that trauma as well, that it's. It's, as you said, it's almost a physical ailment. It just sort of sits on you as you think about what happened to you. It's such a vicious thing to do to children. And I wonder if you could both talk about what is causing you to want to in some ways reconfront that trauma by going to Dilley Detention center where what happened to you is happening to other children. And I'll start with you, Ms. Ina. How do you prepare yourself to reconfront that trauma and why?
- [85:34]
Joe Okimoto
Well, I think a really motivating factor is many of us who were children in the prison camps during World War II are now 80 and 90 years old. And, you know, we don't have very much time left. And so when we began to hear the policies and practices of the current administration, we got in touch with our anger, our outrage, the fact that our, our history was being repeated again. And we identified with the children who were suffering threats to deep deportation, separation from families, indefinite detention. All of those things resonated for us. And so I think the part that of us that had been suppressed because we were raised by parents who felt so much pressure to survive even after their release from prison, to accommodate and to look, not cause any problems, to see what was happening today, we had to kind of override that fear and let our anger guide us. And we have taken our moral authority, having been victims of the very same kind of government policies, to speak out, to show up and to mobilize our community and others to end family detention.
- [87:03]
Joy Reid
Amen to that. Mr. Okimoto, who is the audience for this action tomorrow? We played earlier some on the right who are extremely hard hearted toward immigrants. They don't have any, there's no softness in their hearts even toward children. And we're talking about people like Tom Holman, we're talking about people like Stephen Miller, people like Megan Kelly. These people are to me irredeemable when it comes to them having empathy for immigrants. So they're clearly not your audience. Who is your audience tomorrow?
- [87:38]
Jason
Well, I think our message is like a seed that has fallen on hardened ground when it's people like you just mentioned, but a large majority of American people, if they knew what was going on, I think they would rise up and resist. And that's what I'm hoping will happen through our message that this is very un American and it's unlawful in many ways. So we're speaking to, I think, the wider American audience.
- [88:25]
Joy Reid
I mean, it's both un American and very American. Unfortunately, it is a real unfortunate part of our history that has happened more than once. And so I guess my exit question to Both of you and I will start with you. Mr. Okimoto is for those who want a call to action. I feel like we talk so much about the horrors that happen to people in this country and then people get depressed about it and then people get angry about it and then they say well what am I supposed to do? What can I do? Give us an admonition of what can each of us do to be helpful.
- [89:01]
Jason
First of all, talk to others, your neighborhood, call your elected officials, organize the local group that you belong to and also the national audience, the politicians. But I think we're beginning to see some of that in our local communities and I'm hoping that our message will get across more strongly to them.
- [89:35]
Joy Reid
Well, you, you delivered beautifully and I think it will. And I'll give you the last word. Ms. Ina. Give us your, your, your, your elevator pitch for what you would like to see. Our audience and those they're going to send this to, hopefully they'll clip this and send this to their, their, the people who are questioning whether or not they think immigrants should be allowed to stay in the country or whether they support TPS and all of that. What would be your message to folks who they're on the fence about whether or not they still believe immigration is good for the country?
- [90:05]
Joe Okimoto
I think it's important for each person to make a decision to choose, not just wait, not just hope someone else will take care of it, but to take ownership of one of the greatest privileges we have in democracy which is to make a choice, to act, to show up. Mass mobilization is very powerful right now. We need to take every step to get as many people together. So we have to talk to each other. We have to, as Joe said, reach out to our electeds. But to decide to take action rather than passively hoping that things will turn out the right way.
- [90:47]
Joy Reid
If people want to get involved tomorrow, where can they go online?
- [90:51]
Joe Okimoto
They can go to www.sudoforsolidarity.org the other is Coalition to Free Families.
- [91:01]
Joy Reid
Perfect. So t s u r u4solidarity.org t s u r u for f o rsolidarity.org we're going to put that in the description to this show and there it is on screen. So you guys take a picture of that screen so that you can get involved. We wish you well. Good luck with the rally and the march. Take lots of water. Hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. Because it is, it is summertime. We appreciate so much. Satsuki Ina and Mr. Joe Okimoto thank you both. It's an honor to speak with you.
- [91:33]
Joe Okimoto
Thank you. Joe, thank you so much.
- [91:35]
Joy Reid
Thank you.
- [91:36]
Joe Okimoto
Thank you.
- [91:37]
Joy Reid
Always great to talk with good people doing good things and good work. And what happened with Japanese Americans during World War II is, is the one huge stain on one of the biggest stains on FDR's legacy, an absolute stain on the. On an otherwise pretty decent legacy. He's our greatest president for a lot of reasons, for saving the country's economy from the Republican reprobates who preceded him and created a Great Depression. But that was a bad look, fdr. It was a bad look. Thank you. For those of you who are complimenting the interview, saying it was powerful, Absolutely. Those are people who actually have been the kid that was locked up behind bars. Can you imagine now their parents felt how they felt as a little child being locked up in your country, telling you, you're not good enough to live here. You don't belong here. What do you tell a little Haitian American kid who's, who's born here? Are they supposed to suddenly go to Port Au Prince where they've never been, and just figure it out? Like, what are they supposed to do? You know, a lot of the Haitian Americans who are now subject to deportation, they're gonna, They've never, they haven't been to Haiti since they were children. The lady I read to you about, that's in Kentucky, she was nine years old the last time she was in Haiti. Just know anybody there. These are, these are folks being told, just go to a country that is still violent and that is still unstable. And that we're making unstable. That's like deporting people to Cuba when we're destabilizing Cuba and turn the lights out. We made the lights go out. There's no lights. There's no electricity. Then we say go there or Syria. You know, the guy that's running Syria right now 10 minutes ago, was in Al Qaeda, and all of a sudden he's running Syria. Syria is not stable. You're going to send people back to Syria to do what? To go where? Where would they go? What if you take your American kids with you? Do they even speak the language? Can they speak Arabic? Will they be able to get a lot? What are they going to do? Where are they going to work? Where are they going to live? And these people don't care. And they're like, well, it's temporary, temporary protected status. You know what I guarantee the indigenous people, when they saw. Your white ancestors, thought that shit was temporary, too. They thought that y' all were temporarily Here just to see what was going on. They didn't think you were going to permanently stay and move them off their land and kill them all. Y' all were supposed to be temporary here. You ended up staying. You didn't go back. You turned around, never went back. Y' all came over here, and all the indigenous peoples were like, weren't this. Wasn't this supposed to be temporary? Why y' all still here? Those who didn't die, you know, because they didn't know how to feed themselves or take care of themselves. And indigenous people are like, all right, let me help you out. And figure out how not to die of dysentery, because you got to wash your hands. Here's. Here's a thought. You need. You need to bathe every day and wash your hands. And they're like, oh, I didn't understand that that's how I could survive. Thank you so much, indigenous people, for helping me. Now I'm going to kill you all and take your land. Everyone dies. Thank you. I'll be taking that. All mine. Supposed to be temporary. Stephen Miller. They didn't want your people here. You know, Ron DeSantis's grandmother, his grandparents got here just under the wire before the Immigration act of 1925 would have, or the last sort of 1927, I think, the Immigration Act. They got here just under the wire. They wouldn't be able to come because they didn't want Italians because they didn't think they were fully white. They used to work Italians in the fields in Louisiana and in the south because the black people left. When the blacks left. They were like, what are the Italians? And they're not white. Then they flipped and made them white. They had to make Columbus Day because they hung 12 of them. And Italy was like, do we need to go to war with these people? And they were like, no, no, no, no. Don't worry. We'll give them a holiday. Columbus Day. Congratulations. You're welcome. The Irish, they were like. Used to be no Irish, no dogs, no Jews. And all of them, they're like, you know what, Irish? You're white after all. Welcome. Come on in. They don't want them here either. Megyn Kelly. Your last name? Kelly. That's Irish, right? They used to want that. And then all of a sudden, they just add. They flipped white, and they flipped Irish and Italians into being white. But they weren't white at first. They were like, nope. But all of a sudden, those of you. It's interesting how in some cases, the new batch are worse than the original people, some of these new batch people that came in the 20th century and the late 19th century, like the Trumps, the Giuliani's, the DeSantis, these late comers, they're worse than the OG people who fought in the Civil War. They're worse than the old Confederates, they're more racist than them. They out racists the Confederacy lineage, y' all worse than them. And I'll tell you why they're worse than them. There's a guy called Kevin Phillips, look him up. He is one of the architects before Lee Atwater of the strategy to take ethnic Americans, American ethnics, Italians, Irish, those people who are ethnics who weren't from here and don't go back to the original. They're not British or, you know, Dutch. They're not from the original sort of patrician camp. Those people actually are less problematic in some ways, unless they're John Roberts, whose people are the patrician version. But they basically, Kevin Phillips said, you know what we're going to do? Here's how we're going to get these white people to stop voting for Democrat, voting for Democrats and make them Republican. Here's how we're going to flip them into a party they generally hate because, you know, white folks hated the Republican Party because that was the Free the Slaves party. Well, here's how we're going to get these white folks who hate the Republican Party to be Republican. We're just going to say that your real interest is whiteness. Forget about all the, you don't have no money, you're broke, you're poor, we won't give you a job, you can't have a union. Forget all that. Just organize around being white. You hate the blacks, the blacks are on welfare, the blacks are lazy. You just organize around that. Forget it. You don't need any money. You don't actually need a good job or a pension. You don't need any of that. Just be white. And the black, they're like, okay. I mean, they literally killed Fred Hampton because he was like, hey, white people and Hispanics, maybe we should all team up. They were like, oh, you gotta die. Oops. So it's all bullshit, right? It's all bullshit. It's all made up. All of this is made up because race is a social construct. They just made it up and they got folks to go along with it. And there you have it. Oh, in just a moment, I'm gonna get in deeper into this voting thing. But before I do that, I have to tell you all that. Look all this stuff will raise your blood pressure and it does raise mine all the time. So that is why we are very glad the Jerry Reid show is brought to you by. 120 life. I'm dead. It's like you've got to raise your. Your blood pressure goes up just thinking about the news. And June just happens to be the beginning of summer. The beginning of schedule changes, the beginning of travel. You're getting busy doing all the things. Your health routines probably go by the wayside. But high blood pressure takes no time off. It takes no vacations. It doesn't have a 4.1k plan. It doesn't have paid time off. It just sticks around and it's there lurking in the background. And then it hits you when it's too late. It's the number one risk factor for mortality. It's one of the deadliest things. It's the deadliest factor for mortality. That is why June is the perfect time to stop guessing. Stop measuring, start guessing and start measuring before summer gets away. You should check your numbers. You should actually check your numbers. It's really important to have a high blood pressure checker, especially if you're over 4.0 40. So you start a simple routine. Check your blood blood pressure numbers, then do something to try to change it. One of the things you can do is to try. 120 live. It's a once a day functional drink made from ingredients that help support healthy blood pressure. You can drink it in one of two forms. There's the powdered version here which is got only one gram of sugar, which is fantastic because it keeps your sugar down as well. Or you can try the liquid version, which you can chill and drink it ice cold. Coming out of the gym. If you're doing tai chi, which is my new thing, or you're in the gym, you can do that as well. Try it. You check your numbers in two weeks and for a lot of folks in two weeks they see their blood pressure number go down. So just try for 14 days. If your numbers do not go go down, they don't improve. You get a full refund. It tastes great. It's made from a blend of superfood juices. As I said, it's great if you're traveling or just trying to stay consistent. The low sugar one is actually really important if you want to not have to put your bag onto the plane. You want to take it on plane, just take the powder version. So go to 120life.com that's 120life.com use my code joy or R E I d read for 20% off. Try it risk free for two weeks again. If your blood pressure doesn't come down, you get a full refund. Go to 120-L I F E.com. use the code joy or reed to save 20%. Don't wait till next month. Nothing to lose except those higher blood pressure numbers. Go to 1-200-COM. Use the code joy or reid for 20% off the day. These statements have not been approved by the Food or Drug Administration. The product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Okay, so I do have to. I'm very salty about this voting thing. I know y'. All. I know I went into it a lot, but I'm gonna do it one more time before we get to our after party. Just let. Just give me. Give me a moment. Give me a second. Let me. Let me just. Yeah, give me. I apologize, but, yeah, you gotta let me cook on this for a minute.
- [100:16]
Jason
So.
- [100:16]
Joy Reid
I'm so salty about it. And the more that I have to say is not so much about the results, which in Maryland were very deeply disappointing. And we're gonna have to figure out what we're gonna do about that because I've always told you your powers in the primary. When the primary is over, you have to sort of suit up and prepare for the general. But what I don't like that these outside groups like the crypto people in APAC and these APAC affiliated groups are doing. They're setting up a lose lose for those of us who care about certain specific issues. Because vote blue, no matter who only works if it doesn't matter who. It actually does matter who. And all blue ain't good blue. All blue ain't helpful Blue. All blue ain't going to get your rent prices down. All blue ain't going to freeze the rent, like my producers have told me, is not hundreds of thousands of people. It's more than a million people in New York who are going to get their rent frozen because of Zohar Mamdani promising and delivering. More than a million New Yorkers are about to get their rent frozen. So it does matter who. Vote blue, no matter who is not quite right. It does matter who. You need to pick somebody good in the primary so that you get people who will actually change the immigration laws to strengthen TPS so Haitians don't have to. Haitian immigrants don't have to go back to Haiti and die or don't have to go back to Syria and die. Okay. Or they can't be or can't be deported to some third party country. You need the right blue, not just any blue. But in order to do that, enough people have to actually give a damn enough to vote in these primaries. And that is not happening. Bam. There are not enough people who give a damn about these primaries. And so I'm gonna sound like Gary Chambers Jr. Over here. Y' all are letting these primaries go by the wayside, not bothering to vote, and then you're disappointed in the general, and then you're saying, I get presented with the lesser of two evils, but it's your own fault. Because if we don't pick anybody in the primary, you get in the general. In shit out is one of Jason's sayings. He always tells you when it comes to editing in out, you have shitty footage, you're trying to edit it, you're going to get out at the end and what you're doing is you're letting go into the primary, come out of the primary, and then you're stuck in the general with vote and blue, no matter who. And AIPAC loves it because they fund both sides. You got the AIPAC Republican running against the BOAFO AIPAC Democrat. So it's AIPAC wins either way. They don't care who wins in November in this district, five in Maryland. They don't care who wins. They win either way. The bombs get funded no matter which one wins, the Democrat or the Republicans. Doesn't matter. Now, this is one case where people say the parties are the same. In this case, they are. WAFO wins, bombs dropped, the Republican wins, bombs drop, don't matter in this case, it doesn't matter which one of them wins. The only thing that matters is who gets that extra vote to give the speaker to either the Republican or the Democrat. But does that matter? Because if the Democrats get in, what are they going to do with this, with the speakership? What are they going to do with the majority? Are they going to change anything? Or are they going to say, you know, if we had more vote, what are you going to do with it? So it matters who we do want that. We definitely don't want Republicans to maintain the majority, that's for sure, because they're dangerous and they're fascists and they're racist and they're doing fascist, racist shit. So we do want the parties, we want the control of the House to change hands. But it does matter who those blue are, because if it's blue who are corporate sellouts, who are in you know, basically enslaved by crypto and foreign interest lobbies. And they're just going to obey the same shitty lobbies that are destroying our country and our world, and they're just going to vote for the same crap. What did you change? You changed that you're going to have hearings. But yeah, people ask John. Ask if John Fetterman is good Blue. Vote blue no matter who. What if it's John Federman when he comes back up in a primary? Are enough Pennsylvania is going to go not that blue. We said vote blue, but not that blue. John Fetterman, get out. Go be a Republican, go be maga, do whatever. But we're not just going to keep voting blue no matter who, because it does matter who. So let's go to Maryland real quick. The turnout in Maryland. I made the mistake. This is what I should not do. This is why I have to have my security. I have to drink. Y' all be making me drink. I made the mistake of going on the Maryland Division of Elections website, and I checked to see the turnout, and I was appalled. And I pulled up this story here that talked about the percentage of people who bothered to turn out for the vote on this past Tuesday. And the turnout percentage was 10% lower than the 2024 elections. And the 2024 elections were pathetic in terms of turnout. 26% turnout in 2024 for a presidential year primary. 16% for this past rate. 16%. 1 in 6 eligible voters. There are 800,000 humans who live in Maryland's District 5. That's just one of the districts. 800,000 people live in that district in Maryland, District 5. Of that, only 16.8% bothered to get off their ass and vote either absentee. But you could literally just mail it in or go in and vote. 16%. That's bad. Which means that Adrian Boaffo was selected by less than a third. 32% is less than 33%, which is a third. He was selected by less than 32% of the 16% of people who bothered to vote, meaning about 8% of people in District 5 wanted the APEC crypto guy. But y' all all gonna get them because in November, it's gonna be Mr. 8% versus a Republican who had even lower turnout on his side. More than something like eight. More than 800,000 people. Okay, let me read a little bit. They have an unofficial results are in 10% lower than 2024. 16.68% of eligible voters in the entire state of Maryland cast their ballot this year. That would be 614,845 people, which is less than the number of people who live in just District 5. 614,845 people out of 3,686,495 eligible voters in Maryland. In comparison, official records show statewide turnout in 2024 when Kamala Harris and our future was on the line. You know what the turnout was then? 27.63%, or 1.016 million people out of 3.68 million eligible voters. Even when the entire future of our country and fascism was on the line. And, yeah, Maryland is a blue state. So people are probably like, what does it matter? Blue always wins here. Y' all used to have a Republican governor here, Larry Hogan. Y' all have voted Republicans in, and he would have been a whole MAGA if he had become a senator. So the Republicans do win here. And people in Maryland were like, you know, only a quarter of us really give a shit who's the. Who's the Democrat who, whether it's the Democrat or the Republican, is the president in Maryland in an affluent. One of the most affluent states in the Union, this. The people here can't say it's because of. Of poverty. This is a rich state. Oh, yeah, Marin Spaffo is coming because that Boafo kid is going to vote for all the bombs, y'. All. If you don't like the bombs, he voting for them all. Because if he doesn't, APAC's gonna spend unlimited money to get rid of them. He's now on the line to vote for everything APAC and its affiliated organizations tell him to and everything crypto wants. And if he doesn't, he'll be out. It's a two year term until you have to run for reelection, right? It's for every. It's for every. You know, you have to run every two years. You have to keep running. You're just constantly running. Every two years, you're raising money again to run again. It's every four years, right? But it's just you're constantly churning and running. So every two years, you're basically running because you got to start raising money two years out. It's just every two years, you're constantly running. So this kid got two years. If he's. If he won vote against Israel, he's out. They will spend unlimited money to get rid of Adrian Buffo. So good luck, Maryland. You gonna get all the bombs. He's gonna vote for all the bombs and all the crypto shit. He's going to do it, he has to do it. They paid for him to become the nominee. And only 16.8% of Marylanders bothered to go out and decide between those 24 damn egotists who would not drop out and let it be a one on one. Him and Harry Dunn. Harry Dunn would have won. Him and Harry Dunn and Walla Blue gaye. Just the two on one. One of them would have won easily. He only got 32% of the vote. Only less than a third of the people who bothered to vote wanted him. You're right. The math, maths. Every time y', all, all he took was for even if 20 of the 24 had dropped out and it had been a four person race, he wouldn't have won. But because it was a 24 person race, he walked it in. And that's what's going to happen in tech, in Florida, in Florida 20, I promise you, Debbie Wasman Schultz is going to walk right in because there's too many people running against her and she just has to get 30%. She doesn't even have to get a majority. And then they're going to be like, oh my God, why did a white lady win in the black town? It's a black district. Why is the white lady. The white lady? Well, y' all don't vote and too many y' all running. And in case you think that New York was better, it's no, 24 is bad. Yo, guess what the percentage turnout was in New York City? 16%. It was also 16%. So all those people screaming, oh my God, the Democratic socialists won the Democratic. So, baby, let me read this Gothamist piece. Because it's not just the numbers, it's the motivation. It's who is the most motivated. In Maryland, it was sort of the dutiful, older, as you saw in the Boafo victory party, it was the older, you know, probably church going, church hat wearing, you know, senior seasoned citizens. That's who voted. They are dutiful. They always vote. It was the younger people and people who are exercised about things like Gaza who are anti the AI building, AI shit everywhere. Those people didn't say no. It was the dutiful voters. In New York, it was different. It was also 16%. One in six people turned out to vote. But the difference is who those 16% were this year. This is Gothamist. This year's primary election didn't energize the city's young voters as much as last year's, but enough showed up to deliver some stinging defeats. Less than half of the voters who turned out for last year's mayoral primary voted Tuesday. But key constituencies of young voters in liberal neighborhoods powered Democratic Socialist Mayor Mayor Zorhan Mamdani's preferred congressional candidates to victory. That's not by accident, said John Mellenkopf, a political science professor at CUNY Graduate Center. Mamdani and his DSA allies, quote, have the most effective targeting, canvassing, get out the vote effort that the city has seen in a long time, said Mollenkopf. He said lower turnout midterm elections generally do not favor progressive candidates who rely on younger voters. But, quote, the DSA has managed to turn that around and activate a whole group of young, well educated people who care about things like childcare, he said. A total of 531,000 New Yorkers voted in this year's primary, according to data from the New York City Board of Elections. By the way, 531,000 voters in New York City is is only 100,000 less than voted in the entire state of Maryland. This is about scale as well. 531,000 people in New York City voting is less than a is just about a hundred thousand less than how many voted in the whole state of Maryland. That's embarrassing just in of itself. But that group, that turnout rate is 1 in 6, just like in Maryland of registered Democratic voters, but roughly the same total number of voters who voted in the June 2022 primary. About 32% of ballots were cast early this year, so a third of those votes came in early. So people were super motivated to vote early compared to 34% last year. Overall, in the most competitive congressional districts, turnout rates of voters younger than 34 was less than half of what they were in 2025. But, but that's overall. But in the competitive districts like District 7, which spans part of Brooklyn and Queens, younger voters carried Mamdani's preferred candidates. Claire Valdez was carried by voters under 35, even though overall in New York City, voters under 35 underperform. You see what I'm saying? It's that the specific voters for the three Mamdani candidates were younger and much more motivated. They voted early and they were aggressive about turning out and they were committed. So younger, committed voters, even though they were fewer in number than the last time there was a primary, were able to defeat establishment candidates because DSA knows how to organize and that's all you have to do. If you think about the fact that in Maryland Come back to Maryland for a minute, brother. Bring it back here. Agent Boaffle got 22,000 votes. That's not that many votes. You literally could canvass that many votes. Harry Dunn was supported by the Pelosi, Nancy Pelosi. They should have poured money into a DSA style turnout operation for him. Or Walla Blige, who had all those progressive young people. You should have canvassed yourself. 22,000 votes, you can do that. That's not that hard. You just have to go door to door. For every three people whose doors you knock on, you want to get at least one of them to come out and actually vote. So if you want 22,000 votes, you need to knock on 60,000 doors. Or maybe 100,000 doors if you want to get 22,000. It's just math. But people aren't doing the groundwork that it takes to actually win elections. And people aren't motivated. But you know who's motivated? People who care about things like affordability, not being able to afford their rent, who care about things like Gaza, who care about defunding this Israeli bomb, bombing and genocide machine. Who care about not having crypto take over our lives and give us the damn mark of the beast where we can't do business unless we do it through crypto. Who care about not having AI data centers in their community. People who actually care about shit will vote. And so I think the message to the Democratic Party is you're not making people care enough and you're not putting forward candidates who are clean enough when it comes to who's funding them. And you're not having internal conversations to reduce the field of people voting in these races to a manageable number where somebody has a shot against the establishment money. After Citizens United, these interest groups can spend unlimited amounts of money to get their particular person in, knowing that they don't need that many votes. The AIPAC people knew they didn't need Adrian Boapo to be popular. They didn't need him to get 100,000 votes. They needed to get 22,000 votes. And he won with that small number because everyone else, cumulatively, sure, they got 2/3 more, but there was 45 of them. Every way. In every way. Maryland was a fail. And it was a sort of textbook fail for progressivism, for liberalism, for organizing, for everything candidates. It was a fail in every single way you can imagine. And New York City was a success in every single way you can imagine from the standpoint of wanting progressive change. Because while people are whining and moaning and complaining that these three candidates won't march in the Israel parade as if that matters at all to affording life in New York City. What they are committed to is what Mamdani's committed to. And again, Mamdani said he was going to lower the price of groceries, and they are creating citywide grocery stores to do that. Mamdani said he was going to lower the price of rents, and he has now won the freezing of more than a million people's literal rent. The things Mamdani said he was going to do, he is doing. And dsa, you may not like them, you may not like their politics on Palestine, but guess what? They're doing what they said they're going to do. And they're turning out the voters who care about the things they say they want to do. They're keeping their promises, and they know how to organize. The Democratic Party writ large is doing neither of those things. The Democratic Party writ large is telling us vote blue no matter who, as if it does not matter who. And we have to change the way we are orienting ourselves toward this party if we want the party to be successful, and we do want the party to be successful. Those of you who are questioning whether people like myself who put these critiques out don't want the party to be successful, that's bullshit. We want the party to be successful because it's the only game in town versus fascists. We, of course, want the anti fascist party to win. We want the anti fascist party to have the gavels. We want them to be able to do the hearings. We want them to be able to subpoena the Trump regime people and cause them to have to answer for the bullshit they're doing. Let's play really quick. Mike Johnson. Jason, you play D3. We were to lose the midterms. Heaven forbid these Democrats, y'.
- [117:26]
Joe Okimoto
All.
- [117:26]
Joy Reid
Impeachment's not even the big concern. They will turn every committee of Congress into an investigative body and they'll go after the president's family. The Cabinet is done.
- [117:32]
Nana Gyamfi
Donors and friends.
- [117:34]
Joy Reid
Don't threaten me with a good time, Mike Johnson. That's what we want. Don't threaten me with a good time, baby. That's what we want. We want a Congress that will turn the House of Representatives into effectively a courtroom in which every horrible, evil, vicious, illegal thing that trump his family, his goons, his insurrectionist pals, his thugs, all the crap they're doing. Yes, we want it all investigated. We want the House of Representatives to put that all on trial every day, every single day, and pass laws to undo everything. We want a Congress that will tear down all of the monuments Trump is building to himself. Replant the grass in the Jackie O. Garden. Rip down whatever Arctic Trump garbage he puts in. End this nightmare for all of us when it comes to immigration, people being deported to countries they've never been to. We want to end this attack on Haitian immigrants, attack on immigrants from Syria, attack on immigrants from Venezuela, Cuba, everywhere that isn't white. We want to end that. We want to end the attacks on Somali refugees who are just trying to live their lives in Minneapolis and start businesses and have a normal American life. We want to stop all of these attacks on LGBTQ people, this weird, freaky obsession with trans kids, genitals, and whether they're playing soccer. Who freaking cares? We want to stop these attacks on the rights of people who are black and brown, on women's bodies. We just want to stop this nightmare. This is a nightmare. And we want a Congress that has the balls to stop it, but we will not have a Congress that has the balls to stop it. If we put bad blue in there, if we put weak blue in there, if we put tepid blue in there, we want strong blue that is not beholden to special interests who do not care about us any more than Republicans do. If you honestly think that this pro Israel lobby gives a good goddamn about affordability, about your life, about police brutalizing you, about the laws being, you know, set against you if you are black or brown, about the military turning you out and throwing you out if you are black brown or too woke if you're white, if you're gay, if you think that Israel gives a damn about that, they don't care about that. They care about bombing Palestinian kids. They don't care about you. Do you think the crypto people care about you? The people who are funding these bad blue candidates, they don't care about you any more than the Republicans do. You'll get the same outcomes and then you'll say, government doesn't work. They're periwinkle. Somebody said. Who said? They're periwinkle. They win, godcast. They're periwinkle. They're not blue. It's not vote blue, no matter who. We want good blue. Like they say, good black don't crack. All blue ain't good blue. Everybody who's your color is not your kind. That's another saying from the community. We don't want right. We don't want light blue. We want actual deep blue. We don't want the. We don't want swimming pool blue. We don't want Trump swimming pool. We don't want. We don't want reflecting pool blue. We don't want sludge reflecting pool ass blue. It's not boat blue, no matter who it's. Vote good blue or we ain't voting for you. It's good blue or we ain't voting for you. If I was in Pennsylvania, you couldn't pay me to vote for John Fetterman at all. And you, you and I would crawl over broken glass to vote against him in the primary. You could put up this bottle of 120 life against. I would actually vote for it because it actually helps you be healthy. You could put up a roll of toilet paper against John Fetterman. I would vote for it if I was in Pennsylvania, but I'd have to give a shit about voting in the primaries to do that. You want to get rid of John Fetterman, you have to get rid of him in the primary. If you don't like him, that's when you get rid of him. And this boaffo kid, if he votes how I think he's going to vote, watch when he comes up for reelection. And y' all better come out in that primary and replace him, too. You have to hold these people accountable by making them unemployed every time that they displease you. And some of these nice people who lost their reelection primaries in New York, y' all were not doing what the, what the motivated voters wanted. And the voters who were with you, they were not motivated enough to keep you in your damn job. Don't cry about it on the, on the View. The lady on the View who's crying about that, A lady was at the Pro palace died March. Y' all should have come out and voted if you wanted to keep the, the, the anti Palestine people in there. People not voting make me mad. Anyway, I appreciate y'. All. Let's do really quickly our moment of joy before we get to our after party. Quickly, two things. A feel good story real quick. Y' all know about this bag, right? You guys know about the. The lucky bag? Oh, Jordan woods, who is the girlfriend of the center of the Knick Center, Carl Anthony town. She has a bag and apparently it's the key to them winning the ring. And when. When she. The one time she didn't show up with her faux ostrich leather clutch bag. It's 125 bucks. It's from the Jordan woods collection when she didn't show up with it. It's the one game they lost. Okay, you can play the style statement of the season. And you only have five days to check it out at the Guggenheim Museum. That's where you'll find the famous Jordan Woods Knicks bag. Oh, my God, I'm so happy. This bag is come so iconic.
- [122:52]
Satsuki Ina
Yeah.
- [122:53]
Joy Reid
Isha's here day one to check out what apparently took the Knicks all the way. I mean, sure, the boys might have played hard all season, but could they have done that without their courtside charm? The one time they lost, she didn't have the bag. You know, this is a real good luck charm. This is a true good luck charm. And you could forget about green representing luck this summer, citrus bag, Nick's orange. It's all because this bag orange. You glad the Knicks won.
- [123:15]
Melissa Murray
Amanda Alexander, tense Edward wins on 92.3fm
- [123:18]
Joy Reid
at the Guggenheim Museum. I love it. Okay, let me show y' all my. My good look bags. I got two of them. This is my. I carry this everywhere. I have look. I gotta look. We. We gotta at least show our own stuff. These are my two little good. This one is actually one. I kind of stole it. We have the black wheel, the white. But yes, those are my good. They're good luck to me. They're available for 15 off if you use the code birthday. But let's do our moment of joy. That's right.
- [123:41]
Jason
There you go.
- [123:42]
Joy Reid
Code birthday. Our moment of joy. Now, it's very rare that I'm ever gonna let the. Jason and I, we. We come up with a moment winsome. But we rarely really pick a politician to do a moment of joy. But in this case, Seth Moulton. You got it. Here it is things this week that sparked a lot of controversy. If you're a criminal, you're going to buy your way to freedom with Trump. If you are one of the people like him who took advantage of young girls with Jeffrey Epstein, then we're going to sort of make that go away. I mean, fundamentally, Speaker Johnson, we don't have evidence that he took advantage of young girls with Jeffrey Epstein. Right, right, right. Just common sense be damned. I'm not saying common sense be damned. I'm saying facts. Let's look at the facts. Is he in the Epstein files? He's obviously in the Epstein files. So I just wanted to take this opportunity to say, yeah, Trump, I said what I said. Whoever on his staff is obviously a young person that decided to put that together. Chef's kiss. Seth Moulton, you are our moment of joy. I just was reminded we have a couple of new. Three new collections that are up on the shop. They're also 15 off. We have an America at 250, at 250 years old collection America 250 collection. So we've got three very cute shirts. We've got a Frederick Douglass collection of shirts that are July 4th friendly or July 4th ready and July 4th friendly. If you care more about the reality of Independence Day than the bullshittery that the right is shoveling off on you, you can get any of these. They're very, very nice designed. This is sort of a collabo between our friends, our wonderful Winsome and our wonderful Sean. So check them out if you want to get them. And they are 15% off if you use the code birthday. We love a good T shirt so that you can be ready for the cookout. All right, y', all, if you guys are sticking around and you're a member, we're going to do our members only chat in like five minutes. Give us a minute. Life, go get my security and if not, we will see you guys on Monday. Have a great weekend and thank you for watching. We love you. Like, subscribe and we'll see you on the next. Oh, and don't forget to hit the little bell thing and say all so you can get notifications. Okay, bye. See you on Monday. Bye. Getting back to the basics grassroot level Let me dig a little deeper with the shovel plenty can't tell the force from the trees that I'm hard to detect Like a black hole in the dark it's justice anywhere it's a threat to justice Heavy wind let me make this clear I got a bone to pick and I'll never fear the threat of poverty they don't want to talk about it they rap the party so I'm a real talk about it for sure.