Sgt. Bukhenik's testimony 'has to hurt the prosecution,' analyst says

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Karen Read Murder Trial: Canton Confidential

Episode: Sgt. Bukhenik's Testimony 'Has to Hurt the Prosecution,' Analyst Says
Host/Author: NBC10 Boston
Release Date: May 10, 2025

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Introduction

In this gripping episode of Canton Confidential, NBC10 Boston delves deep into the second trial of Karen Reed for the murder of her boyfriend, Boston Police Officer John O'Keefe. The episode, titled "Sgt. Bukhenik's Testimony 'Has to Hurt the Prosecution,' Analyst Says," provides a comprehensive analysis of the courtroom proceedings, particularly focusing on the contentious testimony of State Police Sergeant Yuri Bukhenik.

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Key Testimonies and Discussions

Sergeant Bukhenik's Testimony

The episode opens with a critical moment in the trial where State Police Sergeant Yuri Bukhenik takes the stand. His testimony revolves around crucial pieces of evidence, including text messages between Karen Reed and ATF agent Brian Higgins.

• Jeff Lewis introduces the significance of Bukhenik's testimony:
  "Tonight on Canton Confidential, a key investigator returns to the stand." (01:49)

• Bukhenik is compelled to read explicit text messages that shed light on the relationship between Reed and Higgins:

  • Bukhenik: "You're hot. Feeling is mutual." (01:57)
  • Bukhenik: "I was basically begging you." (02:03)

These exchanges suggest a flirtatious relationship, which the defense leverages to cast doubt on the prosecution's case.

Examination of Text Messages

The defense attorney, Alan Jackson, methodically deconstructs the evidence presented by Bukhenik, focusing on the authenticity and relevance of the text messages.

• Jackson: "Did you seek to actually document where each item was found? In other words, by cross coordinates or some other such matter?" (03:35)

• Bukhenik admits the lack of precise documentation:
  Bukhenik: "The exact location where each item was recovered from was not documented with a picture or GPS." (04:06)

This admission raises questions about the chain of custody and the integrity of the evidence.

The Dog: Chloe/Cora

A peculiar aspect of the trial is the discussion surrounding the dog named Chloe, later revealed to be rehomed and renamed Cora.

• Jackson: "Did you learn that the Albert family had gotten rid of the dog named Chloe?" (06:21)
• Bukhenik: "We learned that they no longer care for the dog. I don't know if 'get rid of' is accurate." (06:30)

The vague responses and repeated questioning by Jackson highlight potential evasion, further undermining Bukhenik's credibility.

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Defense and Prosecution Strategies

Defense Strategy

Defense attorney Morgietta Derisier articulates the defense's approach to dismantling the prosecution's case:

• Derisier: "One of the most important things that we have to show is consciousness of guilt." (09:12)
• She emphasizes presenting the text messages in full context to demonstrate Karen Reed's lack of interest in the relationship, thereby portraying Brian Higgins as the primary pursuer.

Prosecution Challenges

The prosecution faces hurdles due to the weakened testimony of Bukhenik:

• Derisier: "This has been the most impactful examination out of all of the witnesses." (21:28)
• The repeated evasiveness in Bukhenik's answers has introduced reasonable doubt, complicating the prosecution's case.

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Juror and Expert Insights

Juror Perspective

Juror Ronald Estetislau provides an invaluable perspective on how the testimonies are perceived:

• Estetislau: "It seemed like there was no interest for Karen in terms of this relationship between the two. So, yes." (10:43)
• He expresses skepticism towards both prosecution and defense theories, finding them unconvincing based on the presented evidence.

Courtroom Dynamics

Courtroom insider Sue O'Connell observes the jury's reactions:

• O'Connell: "This text message exchange... was riveting to all of it... they leaned forward, they were taking notes." (17:35)
• The introduction of the text messages significantly engaged the largely younger jury, making it a pivotal moment in the trial.

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Conclusion and Future Outlook

As the episode concludes, the hosts discuss the potential ramifications of Bukhenik's testimony on the prosecution's strategy. Defense attorney Derisier remains optimistic that the flawed examination will erode the prosecution's case, while insider Sue O'Connell anticipates that the jury's perception of Bukhenik will continue to weaken the prosecution's stance.

Looking ahead, the prosecution plans to introduce medical expert testimonies to clarify the cause of Officer O'Keefe's death, aiming to solidify their case despite the challenges posed by recent testimonies.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Yuri Bukhenik: "You're hot. Feeling is mutual." (01:57)
• Alan Jackson: "Did you seek to actually document where each item was found?" (03:35)
• Morgietta Derisier: "This has been the most impactful examination out of all of the witnesses." (21:28)
• Ronald Estetislau: "I don't think either of those theories is believable based on the reading of the text today." (11:23)

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Timestamps Reference

• 01:49 - Introduction to Sgt. Bukhenik's Testimony
• 01:57 - Bukhenik reads text messages
• 02:03 - Bukhenik continues reading messages
• 03:35 - Jackson questions evidence documentation
• 04:06 - Bukhenik admits lack of GPS documentation
• 06:21 - Discussion about the dog, Chloe
• 09:12 - Defense strategy on text messages
• 10:43 - Juror's view on text message relationship
• 17:35 - Juror's reaction to text message testimony
• 21:28 - Defense attorney on Bukhenik's impact

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This episode of Canton Confidential offers a nuanced and detailed exploration of the Karen Read murder trial, highlighting the complexities of courtroom dynamics and the strategic maneuvers of both the defense and prosecution. Through expert analysis and firsthand accounts, listeners gain a comprehensive understanding of the trial's current state and the potential paths it may take in the days to come.

Transcript

[Kelly Ripa]

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[J.C. Monahan]

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[Glenn Jones]

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[Yuri Buchanak]

Every piece of evidence is important.

[Jeff Lewis]

The state police sergeant forced to read text messages between Karen Reed and ATF agent Brian Higgins.

[Yuri Buchanak]

You're hot. Feeling is mutual.

[Jeff Lewis]

Is that the relationship thrown under the microscope?

[Yuri Buchanak]

I was basically begging you.

[Jeff Lewis]

Plus, the atmosphere in the courtroom during key moments.

[Yuri Buchanak]

If you can bring up the Webster's Dictionary, I can read it.

[Jeff Lewis]

A juror from the first trial weighs in. Canton Confidential the Karen Reed murder trial starts right now.

[Melody Mendez]

A pretty intense week in court comes to a close in denim. Good evening. I'm Glenn Jones.

[Glenn Jones]

I'm J.C. monahan. Even in the second trial for Karen Reid, new information is coming to light each day. A total of 13 witnesses took the stand this week. You're looking at the first 12 whom we saw Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. But yesterday and today, all eyes were on this man, State Police Sergeant Yuri Buchanak. He supervised the lead investigator in this case, the now former trooper Michael Proctor. Today, Buchanan was grilled by the defense about evidence that was collected.

[Melody Mendez]

These are pieces of taillight cover collected from Karen Reed's suv. And there's questions about who collected each piece and when. But the most contentious testimony came from these text messages. You're looking at messages sent between Karen Reed and ATF agent Brian Higgins. Messages Buchanak, who wasn't involved in these conversations, was forced to read on the stand. The texts reveal a lot about the relationship between Reid and Higgins.

[Glenn Jones]

All right, let's bring in NBC 10's Melody Mendez live outside Norfolk Superior Court in Dead. A melody. A lot to dissect from what was said in court today.

[J.C. Monahan]

Yes, J.C. and Glenn, I'm glad you guys mentioned it, because though there was only one man on the stand all day, there is a whole lot to cover, a lot to dissect. Here's a look.

[Alan Jackson]

Can you describe for the jurors exactly where each of the. Let's take them one at a time where each of the six pieces of plastic fragments were found.

[Yuri Buchanak]

It was all located in the general vicinity where it was initially excavated, but also where I was told Mr. John O' Keefe was found.

[Alan Jackson]

Did you seek to actually document where each item was found? In other words, by cross coordinates or some other such matter?

[Yuri Buchanak]

The exact location where each item was recovered from was not documented with a picture or gps.

[J.C. Monahan]

Jackson continuing to poke holes at the documentation of the evidence and the chain of custody. Who was in possession, who had access? And again, the involvement of former trooper Michael Proctor. And more text messages came into focus today. This time, texts between Karen Reed and ATF agent Brian Higgins. He's one of the people the defense has argued could have been responsible for o' Keefe's death and was in the Albert home on the night in question. The text and the words of the defense showed a sometimes flirtatious exchange.

[Yuri Buchanak]

You're hot. Are you serious or messing with me? No, I'm serious. Feeling is mutual, in which Reed talks.

[J.C. Monahan]

About the state of her relationship with John o' Keefe, referring to an incident on New Year's Eve.

[Yuri Buchanak]

Are you breaking up or staying together? I don't know. He hooked up with another girl on vacation. I am very close to his niece. It is a very up situation.

[J.C. Monahan]

The texts reference that Higgins and Reed kissed, with Reed eventually driving to Higgins home on January 19, but days later, seeming to cut off the romantic interest. Then, on the night in question, he sent her two more texts while they were in the same room at the Waterfall Bar. She didn't respond. The defense says Higgins was upset at being Ghosted by Reed. Later in court, Sergeant Buchanak was pressed on why they never got Higgins phone.

[Alan Jackson]

Did you become aware of a call that was made by Brian Higgins at 1:35am while at Canton Police Department?

[Yuri Buchanak]

I am not aware of that, no. We never sought to get Brian Higginson's phone.

[Alan Jackson]

Even after you received and read all of those text messages between him and Karen Reed?

[Yuri Buchanak]

Correct.

[J.C. Monahan]

He was shown video of Reed's SUV seemingly hitting John o' Keefe's in the driveway of his home. Jackson asking the sergeant to clarify his testimony from last year.

[Alan Jackson]

Based on what you just saw in this video, do you believe that the SUV struck the Chevy Traverse?

[Yuri Buchanak]

Logically speaking, the two vehicles had to have come into contact for the tire to move.

[J.C. Monahan]

And then the dog that's gotten so much attention.

[Alan Jackson]

Did you learn that the Albert family had gotten rid of the dog named Chloe?

[Yuri Buchanak]

We learned that they no longer care for the dog. I don't know if get rid of is accurate.

[Alan Jackson]

So it's no longer with him, right?

[Yuri Buchanak]

Correct. They no longer own the dog.

[Alan Jackson]

Okay. So they got rid of it.

[J.C. Monahan]

Just another example of that contentious, often really laborious feeling back and forth between Jackson and Buchanan. We saw that all day. Glenn and J.C. back to you.

[Glenn Jones]

All right, Melody, in that exchange that we just heard, we learned more about Chloe, Brian, Albert's dog that was rehomed.

[Melody Mendez]

And we learned as well that Sergeant Buchanak traveled to see Chloe. What else did we learn about this sort of mysterious dog?

[J.C. Monahan]

Okay, well, we now know that, yes, Sergeant Buchanan traveled to see the dog and its new owners. The dog now has been named Cora. We don't know much other than that. We know that it has since had two different owners since the Alberts. We know that based on cross examination, we do know that he wrote a report about the dog, but left out the name of the new owners and left out the location of that family. The way Jackson set this up, we will certainly be hearing more and more about Chloe the dog in the trial as we move forward. Guys, back to you, Melanie Mendez.

[Melody Mendez]

Thank you very much. Another week of testimony in denim. Let's bring in the rest of our team now. We're joined by defense attorney Morgietta Derisier and a juror from the first trial, Ronald Estetislau. It's good to have both of you with us tonight.

[Glenn Jones]

Let's start with a viewer question. Okay. We want to go to Ashley in Boston, who says, what is the purpose of the defense? Having Sergeant Buchanak reading this long and awkward text thread between Karen And Brian Higgins, he doesn't have anything to do with their relationship. And if anything, it perhaps makes the jury forget about his testimony this morning and his reluctance to answer questions regarding Michael Proctor. Before we dive into this, let's give you a little bit of that Brian Higgins. We're going to compare him reading those messages during the first trial versus Sergeant Buchanak doing the same thing today. Defendant responded, do you like me?

[Jeff Lewis]

I said, yes, from jump. Defendant said, when was jumping? I said, first time I saw you.

[Yuri Buchanak]

Do you like me? Yes, from jump. When was jump?

[Melody Mendez]

All right, Morgieta, so that question from the viewer is such a good one because of course, Buchanak didn't send any of those text messages, yet he had to read them all into evidence. Why not call Brian Higgins to do so like we saw the prosecution do in the first trial? After all, the defense is accusing him of being a third party culprit.

[Morgietta Derisier]

So remember that when we're dealing with the elements of a crime, one of the most important things that we have to show is consciousness of guilt. And we don't know right now whether or not Karen Reid is going to take the stand. So we need to hear her voice somehow throughout this trial. And when the text messages came in the first time around, they were cherry picked, if you guys remember. Now we're hearing all the messages in its full context from beginning to end. So this is a way to take away from the steam of the prosecution cherry picking and putting out the full context, which if you look at the text messages at one point, Karen just is not interested. And it's really Brian Higgin who was like, pursuing this relationship even more so. It takes away from this consciousness of guilt that she had some anger towards John, and this was like some sort of, like revenge, you know, murder. And I think that was really effective today.

[Glenn Jones]

I will say, listening to it, when Brian Higgins is reading his own text, it was very flat. But we had, you know, Sergeant Buchanak put a little bit of a bedtime story spin on it with, you know, inflection into the different things. If you had heard the text messages this way, Ronnie, when you were on the first trial, would that have made a difference one way or another?

[Ronald Estetislau]

I believe it would have been. It's. I believe it was much more interesting the way it was presented today in comparison to the previous time. And so, yes, I believe it would have made a difference one way or the other, depending upon how it would resonate upon jurors.

[Glenn Jones]

To Morgietta's point, though, we heard More text messages this time around. Did that change your opinion of what their relationship was like?

[Ronald Estetislau]

It seemed like there was no interest for Karen in terms of this relationship between the two. So, yes.

[Melody Mendez]

You know, we learned from the testimony today that Sergeant Buchanak wants the jury to believe that Karen was in pursuit of Higgins and. And some kind of revenge against John. John o' Keefe, her boyfriend. The defense wants us to believe that because he got ghosted, Brian Higgins had some kind of motive in this crime. Ronald, I guess I'll start with you. Which of those two theories is easier to believe as you consume this evidence? Or is either of those theories believable?

[Ronald Estetislau]

I don't think either of those theories is believable based on the reading of the text today. And so taking that all into consideration, it seems like it could be anything, right? I think it was just two people kind of texting each other.

[Melody Mendez]

And what about your thoughts on those theories?

[Morgietta Derisier]

I kind of agree with Ronald here. I don't think it landed the way that either side really wanted it to. But what it did do was open again, credibility issues for Buchanak on testifying today. And you could see that the jury is slowly starting to not believe the credibility. And that's really hard for the prosecution, especially when this is one of their key witnesses that they're trying to get the jury to like.

[Glenn Jones]

Okay, so to that point, Alan Jackson has said multiple times during this trial, words matter. Right. And he has used witnesses, words from the past against them, or tried to, at least in this. In this trial. But then he's also throwing out quick yes, no questions. And when there's hesitation, and we saw a lot of hesitation when Sergeant Buchanak to give a yes or no answer. I'm wondering if that's just doing that to protect yourself. If you don't like the way that the question has been phrased, I want to play this for a little bit. We'll talk about it on the other side.

[Alan Jackson]

At some point during the course of your investigation, did you learn that the Albert family had gotten rid of the dog named Chloe?

[Yuri Buchanak]

We learned that they no longer care for the dog. I don't know if get rid of is accurate.

[Alan Jackson]

Well, they don't have it anymore.

[Glenn Jones]

Right.

[Yuri Buchanak]

Giving it up for adoption, I guess. I don't know. I'm not a pet owner. Rehomed. I guess they no longer own the dog.

[Alan Jackson]

Okay, so they got rid of it.

[Yuri Buchanak]

Yes. You can get rid of the dog?

[Morgietta Derisier]

Yes.

[Melody Mendez]

Okay.

[Alan Jackson]

At some point during the course of your investigation, did you find out that The Albert family got rid of Chloe.

[Yuri Buchanak]

We learned that they no longer owned Chloe. Yes.

[Glenn Jones]

Okay, so there was a lot of chit chat I saw and heard about, well, why can't you just say yes or no? But I'm just going to flip that for a second and say, well, saying you got rid of a dog is harsh, you know. And he wanted to say, well, I don't want to say they got rid of it. I will say that they rehomed it. And that looks evasive at the same time. So you're protecting yourself. Evasive. How do you handle that as a witness?

[Morgietta Derisier]

As a witness you just have to handle the truth. And I think the reality is, is that if you have bad facts, you let them play out. Because now Alan Jackson gets to ask that question three or four times. And even though the jury can consider the questions as evidence, they're hearing it over and over and over again. And you look like you're a bad witness. And remember, this is the prosecution's witness. So they are supposed to be prepping this witness for the testimony that's coming in on a retrial. Right. This is not new information. This is information we knew was gonna come out. So it could be just bad witness prep, to be honest with you.

[Glenn Jones]

And I mean this is a police officer. They should be prepped before the prep.

[Morgietta Derisier]

Absolutely.

[Melody Mendez]

Ronald, I gotta ask you about the content of answer about Chloe in the first trial. Did you make any conclusions about whether or not Chloe has any relevance to this crime one way or the other?

[Ronald Estetislau]

During the first trial? I did not put any credibility on any of that testimony about having Chloe there. Interesting enough. It is interesting how they're pointing out whether she was rehomed or she was put down or what actually happened to her. And there was no evidence collection.

[Melody Mendez]

So yeah, more of a mystery than anything else.

[Glenn Jones]

Okay. Morgieta, if you were with us yesterday, you know this woman was excited about today, what was going to happen. You thought it would be explosive. Was this what you were expecting?

[Morgietta Derisier]

This is exactly what I was expecting. And I honestly thought that this further examination of Buchanan, he would have gotten the cues from yesterday and just answered the questions. But he didn't. And guess what, he's going to be on the next trial day as well because Alan Jackson's not done because he's just not answering the question. So now he's up there for three days of grilling testimony which has to hurt the prosecution. Just has to. Yeah.

[Melody Mendez]

Okay, thank you to you both, Ronald, for braving the traffic to get here. In Morgietta. Stick around. We'll be talking to you in just a moment. So how is the jury feeling about testimony so far?

[Glenn Jones]

Our courtroom insider, Sue o' Connell has a front row seat for it all and she joins us after.

[Melody Mendez]

And before we go, we want to take a moment to remember John o' Keefe, the victim in this case. The Braintree native was a Boston police officer who became the legal guardian of his niece and nephew after the children lost both of their parents to illness. You're watching Canton Confidential, the Karen Reed murder trial.

[Jeff Lewis]

Hey. This is Jeff Lewis from Radio Andy, live and uncensored. Catch me talking with my friends about my latest obsessions, relationship issues and bodily ailments. With that kind of drama that seems to follow me, you never know what's going to happen.

[Morgietta Derisier]

You can listen to Jeff Lewis live at home or anywhere you are. Download the Sirius XM app for over 425 channels of ad free music, sports, entertainment and more. Subscribe now and get 3 months free offer details apply.

[Jeff Lewis]

CIDP is no walk in the park. It can make your daily routine feel not so routine. The good news, there's a treatment option for chronic inflammatory demyelinating polyneuropathy that may fit into your routine. Discover [e-mail] and talk to your doctor. That's innovationforcidp.com brought to you by Argenyx. Don't miss any of the Karen Reed murder trial. Get the full recap of what happened in court, expert analysis and what we could see next. This is coverage you won't see in anywhere else. Canton confidential weeknights at 7 on NBC 10 Boston.

[Glenn Jones]

Welcome back. We have defense attorney Morgietta Dorisier with us. And joining us, of course, our courtroom insider, Sue o' Connell.

[Melody Mendez]

Hi, Sue. You told us yesterday that the text messages read from Michael Proctor seemed to capture the jury's attention in a way you hadn't quite seen before. Did that continue today?

[Sue O'Connell]

Everything changed for the jury today, Right. I've been saying all along and my colleagues from other stations and other outlets have been saying this is a very stoic jury. Many people are writing notes so their heads are down all the time. This text message exchange that went on for a long, long time. Yeah, more than an hour was riveting to all of it and also to some of the unexpected jurors who you think wouldn't be paying attention. They leaned forward, they were taking notes. They heard kiss, that someone kissed someone and that got their attention. This is a young jury, much younger than the first jury and they are, were just paying attention to every single thing. And for those who think how were they ever going to find a jury who didn't know about this case? You could look at their faces and see that this was brand new information to them. They didn't know where it was going. And then the heartbreaking end of these texts. John is dead, right? And then we go to lunch and I can see them walk out with that feeling of they didn't know it was going to end. They didn't know what was going to happen. This was sort of like a miniseries. Right on Peacock.

[Glenn Jones]

That's how it felt.

[Sue O'Connell]

And then in the end, this terrible ending and you get to go to lunch. So it really, I think, made a change that Buchanan is going to be seen as the pivotal moment of this case for very different reasons than, say, Proctor was in the first case.

[Melody Mendez]

So that that portion that sue is talking about did last for more than an hour. And at one point, they paused to figure out how to display the text on the screen in the courtroom. Sue, you'll remember this. It made for a levity moment from Judge Kanone.

[Glenn Jones]

Sergeant Buchanak, you do not have to describe the emojis.

[Morgietta Derisier]

You don't have to say anything about.

[Glenn Jones]

What the pictures are.

[Yuri Buchanak]

Do you want me to start the beginning or.

[Morgietta Derisier]

Just start with.

[Glenn Jones]

I'm sorry. Okay. I was just listening. I wasn't looking at it at that moment. And you could feel how everyone. No, do not start over. What was it like? Because that was a full laughter that sounded like.

[Sue O'Connell]

Oh, no, that was a roar. So, first of all, remember, the courtroom is very stressed, much more stressful than it was the first trial. There are lots of courts officers in there. They are really, really enforcing the no talking, no chewing gum, no moving around too much. So we are all the viewers and everyone really locked in there and not talking or making faces or really being strict. And then this happens because the idea of thinking how painful this was going to be to hear him read these with the question mark emoji with the eyeball, and it's not his fault. It was just going to be extraordinarily, excruciatingly painful. I think maybe Alan Jackson set it up so he would get permission to put the things, the text messages up on the screen to make it easier for the jury and the jurors, as Kanoni said. But it was a burst of energy and laugh out because none of us wanted to hear him go through that.

[Glenn Jones]

I'm so sorry. But one of the moments was when Judge Canoni went, you're going to make him read all that's right, yes.

[Melody Mendez]

And he said yes.

[Glenn Jones]

And there was a sidebar. You know, it was like, because it.

[Sue O'Connell]

Was like this, it was a good almost inch thick binder.

[Glenn Jones]

Listen to it all.

[Melody Mendez]

Morgietta, we spent a lot of time this week talking about how the Commonwealth manage Michael Proctor, and I understand why that's a big deal. But after watching your buchanak on the stand over the last couple of days, you're kind of worried he might be damaging the Commonwealth's case. Why?

[Morgietta Derisier]

Because I think there's no way that you can get around bad investigation. You just can't. And I honestly think at this point, after today, after Monday, the next trial day, they're probably not going to call Proctor, but the defense will absolutely call him. And they're going to use that to capitalize and to obliterate anything thing that's left about this investigation. And it's really going to create that reasonable doubt that everybody who is a Karen Reid supporter is really going to see. It's not going good in terms of the examination for Buchanan and it had really shown these last few days and is going to continue to show so far.

[Melody Mendez]

Morgietta, has he been the most damaging witness for the prosecution?

[Morgietta Derisier]

This has been the most impactful examination out of all of the witnesses. And I think everybody has honed in on this examination extremely well because not only could you hear the text messages, you could read them. There was emotion behind it. This was the most impactful. Absolutely.

[Melody Mendez]

All right, before we go, let's take one viewer question.

[Glenn Jones]

Judy is wondering, I get the feeling the defense has Michael Proctor on trial, not Karen Reed. In the opinion of your legal team, Morgietta, is this a smart move?

[Morgietta Derisier]

So again, remember, the defense doesn't have to prove anything. Right. It's the prosecution that has to prove the case in cheap. But when the stakes are so high, like first degree murder, you have to bring that level of reasonable doubt to the table. Right. And the lead investigator, the lead investigation is how we even got to this case today. Right. And so you have to really, really poke all the holes that you can to leave that in the minds of the jury. It's Friday. That's the last thing that they're thinking about is how horrible this investigation was and how horrible the officers were to Karen Reid throughout this entire investigation.

[Glenn Jones]

So then looking ahead, because this is round two, so we have some idea of what's ahead. What does the prosecution still have left in their arsenal? If this is damaging, what are we looking for that the prosecution still has?

[Sue O'Connell]

Well, I think that when they get to the doctor that's going to testify, the neurodoctor about how John o' Keeffe's brain and his head and his neck were impacted, that's something I'm told, I don't understand from the last trial, but was not emphasized correctly to the jury that his, his cause of death or what doctors think may have happened since many people said, you know, his, his, his injuries weren't, didn't align with being hit by a vehicle, this doctor's going to be able to say that. So that's a witness they can bring in. Their dog bite witness is also going to be helpful, I think, although it's now because we don't even really know if this is really Chloe or Cora. You know, Jackson already set the table for that. But I think that the doctors are going to be very important.

[Morgietta Derisier]

Absolutely. And I think if you look at the totality of this entire case for the prosecution, they're doing all the impossible, bad, not so good information first. So the last piece of information that they hear is the medical information is the more technical because could you imagine this being the last witness for the prosecution? Exactly right. So do the technical information last? So that's the last piece of information that the jury hears from the prosecution side.

[Melody Mendez]

All right. Yuri Buchanak back on the stand Monday morning at 10am Sue O' Connell, Morgietta Dericier, thank you both very much. And if you have questions about this case, keep sending them our way. The email is on your screen. Canton.confidentialbcuni.com we'll answer as many questions as.

[Glenn Jones]

We can and remember to join us every weeknight at 7 on NBC 10 Boston. We'll have a full recap of the latest developments from court as well as legal analysis. Plus, this week's episodes will be streaming on Peacock starting Sunday. You're watching Canton Confidential, the Karen Reed murder trial.

[Jeff Lewis]

Chief meteorologist Pete Bouchard, weeknights at 5, 6 and 11 on NBC. 10 Boston.

[Kelly Ripa]

Hey there everyone in podcast land. I just wanted to thank you all for listening and telling your friends about our little podcast. Next, let's talk off camera with me, Kelly Ripa. I know there are millions of podcasts out there, so I really appreciate you giving us a listen. There are so many gems from season one from Matthew McConaughey disclosing that he and Woody Harrelson might be brothers. To Salma Hayek telling us about the argument that started her friendship with Prince. Hope you enjoy season one. And stay tuned for a bigger and better season two.