Awaiting Closure

Summary

The King Road Killings: An Idaho Murder Mystery – Episode Summary: "Awaiting Closure"

Introduction

In the gripping episode titled "Awaiting Closure" from The King Road Killings: An Idaho Murder Mystery, ABC News Correspondent Kayna Whitworth delves deep into the aftermath of the tragic murders of four University of Idaho students. Released on July 22, 2025, this episode provides a comprehensive analysis of Bryan Kohberger's plea deal, its implications for the victims' families, the local community of Moscow, Idaho, and the broader quest for closure in the wake of such a heinous crime.

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Bryan Kohberger's Plea Deal and Sentencing

Kayna Whitworth opens the episode by discussing the imminent sentencing of Bryan Kohberger, the criminology PhD student charged with the murders of Kaylee Gonzalez, Madison Mogan, Zanna Kernodle, and Ethan Chapin.

"Tomorrow, Bryan Kohberger will be sentenced... he'll serve four consecutive life sentences, one for each murder." ([00:40])

Kohberger has pleaded guilty, agreeing to a sentence that precludes the possibility of the death penalty and any subsequent appeals. Whitworth emphasizes that while the sentencing is largely a formality, it marks the conclusion of Idaho's criminal case against Kohberger and paves the way for lifting the long-standing gag order on the case.

"Lifting the gag order... police and prosecutors are allowed to talk more freely about this case if they want to." ([03:30])

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Legal Insights with Experts

To unpack the legal nuances of the plea deal, Whitworth engages with ABC News legal contributor, Brian Buckmire, a practicing defense attorney, and Matt Murphy, a former California homicide prosecutor.

Whitworth outlines the prosecution's narrative, detailing the sequence of events as presented during the plea agreement. This includes Kohberger's alleged entry into the victims' home, the order of the murders, and the evidence linking him to the crime scene.

"He bought the murder weapon on Amazon using a gift card... he attempted to delete or alter his purchase history." ([10:00])

Murphy defends the robustness of the prosecution's case, highlighting the DNA evidence and Kohberger's attempts to obscure his digital footprint as signs of consciousness of guilt.

"When he bought that K Bar knife, that's new information... that was trying to cover their tracks." ([11:36])

Buckmire discusses the strategic considerations behind the plea deal, suggesting that Kohberger and his defense likely saw securing a life sentence as the best possible outcome given the overwhelming evidence against him.

"This isn't a victim impact statement where he could say anything that would make the judge think... I'll shave off five years." ([24:07])

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Impact on Victims' Families

The episode poignantly captures the profound grief and longing for closure experienced by the families of the victims. Jim Chapin, Ethan Chapin's father, shares his enduring pain.

"I miss him every single day and I always will." ([29:14])

Whitworth interviews Emily Allott and her boyfriend Hunter Johnson, who were present when the murders were discovered. They describe the traumatic experience and the compounded suffering due to online harassment aimed at them and the surviving roommates, Dylan Mortenson and Bethany Funk.

"I think it's very important for people to... recognize that what they say on their phone and what they say on social media is very hurtful to so many people." ([33:51])

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Community Reaction and Division

Julie Scott, an ABC News contributor based in Moscow, provides insight into the community's divided response to Kohberger's plea deal. While some, particularly older residents, feel relief over the guaranteed sentencing without the uncertainties of a trial, others, especially younger community members and certain family members of the victims, feel that justice remains unfulfilled.

"The most vocal has been Steve Gonzalves and his emotion and his anger... I think they were adamant about it." ([41:34])

An unnamed city council member elaborates on the split sentiments:

"The older crowd in Moscow are happy that this plea deal happened because it's a guaranteed outcome... some people wanted the death penalty verdict." ([36:17])

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Expectations for Future Information

With the lifting of the gag order, there is anticipation for more detailed information to emerge about the investigation. Community members express a hunger for understanding Kohberger's motives and the connections, if any, between him and the victims.

"What was his habits? What was he doing in Moscow? What were his patterns? His cell phone data? What did that reveal?" ([42:18])

Questions linger about the whereabouts of the murder weapon, the thoroughness of the crime scene cleanup, and the depth of Kohberger's planning.

"How did he manage to keep the evidence so contained in what was a gruesome stabbing murder scene?" ([43:12])

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Sentencing Hearing Preview

Whitworth anticipates a highly emotional sentencing hearing where victims' families will have the opportunity to deliver impact statements. She speculates on the possibility of Kohberger addressing the court, though legal experts suggest that any such statements from him are unlikely to provide meaningful solace to the bereaved families.

"Do I think he will talk? Keeping out that meaningful part? At this point, I would say 50/50." ([24:07])

Matt Murphy echoes this sentiment, emphasizing that while victim impact statements serve as a cathartic outlet for families, they scarcely influence the judge's decision in such cases.

"These are very dramatic and it can be an incredibly cathartic thing for, for family members." ([25:53])

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Conclusion

"Awaiting Closure" masterfully navigates the complex tapestry of legal proceedings, personal grief, and community dynamics following the tragic murders on King Road. Through expert interviews, personal testimonies, and insightful analysis, the episode sheds light on the multifaceted quest for justice and healing in the aftermath of unspeakable loss. As the community of Moscow grapples with its new reality, the episode underscores the enduring impact of such crimes on individuals and the collective psyche of a tight-knit town.

Transcript

[Brad Milke]

Hey, I'm Brad Milke. If you're hooked on this show, you know how quickly a single story can turn into something bigger, deeper, more complex than anyone first thought. Well, for a smart, clear breakdown of the day's top stories, including true crime cases like this one, check out Start Here, the daily podcast from ABC News. Each weekday morning, my team and I will walk you through what's happening in the world and why it matters. In just 20 minutes. From Earth shaking moves in global politics to fascinating developments in court cases, we will unpack it all. So follow Start Here Again, that's Start Here Wherever you listen to podcasts.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Tomorrow, Bryan Kohberger will be sentenced. The former PhD student has officially pled guilty to the heinous murders of Kaylee Gonzalez, Madison Mogan, Zanna Kernodle, and Ethan Chapin, the four University of Idaho students killed in an off campus home in 2022. Now, the thing is, we already know what Kohberger's sentence is likely to be. As part of his plea deal, his defense and the prosecution agreed that he'll serve four consecutive life sentences, one for each murder. He will not face the death penalty and he has no ability to appeal. The final decision is still up to the judge, but the sentencing part of tomorrow's proceeding is likely a bit of a formality. Still, this hearing is significant for other reasons. It's the one and only opportunity for the victims, families, friends, and Bryan Kohberger himself to speak in court. I'm ABC News correspondent Kayna Whitworth, and this is the King Road Killings awaiting closure. By this point of the summer, I thought I'd be preparing to cover Bryan Coburger's trial. So did ADA County Judge Stephen Hippler. In fact, he'd ordered that no other trials take place in the Boise courthouse this week so they could get ready to process some 10,000 possible jurors. Instead, the court is now using that time to give the victim's friends and family the chance to speak about their loss. To officially sentence Kohberger, sentencing marks the end of Idaho's criminal case against Kohberger. But it will also pave the way for another really important piece of this story. Lifting the gag order. Last week, Judge Hipler decided to lift the non dissemination order that kept a lot of information about this case under wraps and banned police and prosecutors, as well as the defense from disclosing more details about the investigation. For now, all sealed documents are going to remain sealed at least until after sentencing. But for the first time in nearly two and a half years, police and prosecutors are allowed to talk more freely about this case if they want to. And some of them are, but they're being very cautious. Moscow Police Chief Anthony Dollinger says they'll release more information and they want to be transparent, but their priority is to the victims families.

[Brian Buckmire]

The Moscow Police Department, we've been focused on the victims and bringing justice for the victims. That was our focus and we. That was our mission.

[Brad Milke]

Correct.

[Brian Buckmire]

And the mission was accomplished.

[Kayna Whitworth]

We're also already starting to learn some new details about the investigation and Kohberger himself. We spoke with former Pullman Washington Police Chief Gary Jenkins. He assisted Moscow PD with their investigation. Chief Jenkins said that before the murders, Kohberger interviewed for an intern position with his department, but he wasn't selected. He didn't come across as very personable. So when Cobra's name was brought up in connection with the murders, the chief says he was shocked.

[Brian Buckmire]

The hair in the back of my neck stood out because I knew I was going to hear something really significant. And they said his name and I just, I guess I got chills because I knew that I had talked with him before and this person had allegedly.

[Brad Milke]

Committed these just heinous crimes.

[Kayna Whitworth]

In the coming weeks and months, we expect an avalanche of investigative documents to come out on this case. I'll continue to follow this story as it unfolds and keep you posted. But for now, Bryan Kohberger still needs to be formally said sentenced. His hearing starts tomorrow, Wednesday, and could continue into Thursday if necessary. This time, instead of wearing a tie and slacks, the convicted murderer Brian Coburger will arrive at the courtroom wearing handcuffs and a prison jumpsuit. Kaylee, Maddie, Zanna and Ethan's family and friends will have the chance to give victim impact statements. They'll be able to tell the court and Kohberger directly, if they want to, how these murders have impacted their lives. It could be their only opportunity to address Kohberger face to face. This hearing might also be the last chance for Kohberger to speak to the judge to address the families in this forum. Then the judge will likely tell Kohberger that he'll spend the rest of his natural life in prison. He could be sent to the Idaho Maximum Security Institution. The prison has a capacity of roughly 550 inmates, most of whom have a history of dangerous behavior or disciplinary violations while incarcerated. To help us better understand Kohberger's plea and what to expect from this upcoming sentencing hearing, I'm here with ABC News legal contributor and practicing defense attorney Brian Buckmire. Brian, thanks for being with Me.

[Brian Buckmire]

My pleasure, Kayna. Thank you for having me.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Of course. And ABC legal analyst and former California homicide prosecutor Matt Murphy. Matt, thanks for being here.

[Matt Murphy]

Happy to be here.

[Kayna Whitworth]

So I want to talk to you guys first about some of the new information that we learned during this change of plea hearing. It was stunning. And it's important to note here that while Bryan Coburger did change his plea to guilty, he admitted to murdering Maddie, Kaylee, Zanna, and Ethan. The prosecution laid out their own narrat, what they think happened that night. And it was sprinkled with new details. And Brian Coburger himself has not admitted to these new details, these specifics of what the prosecution laid out. But I do want to go over some of it with you guys. I'll tick through them quickly here, gentlemen, and we'll talk about what Bill Thompson, the lead prosecutor, said. We learned for the first time, according to him, where they believe Brian Coburger parked his car. They think he parked his car sort of on this hill above and behind the King Road Home. They think he entered the home through a sliding glass door that's on the second floor. And then they believe he killed Madison Mogan first and then Kaylee Gonzalez. And then reading directly from the prosecutor's narrative here, he says as the defendant was either coming down the stairs or leaving, he encountered Zanna and ended up killing her also with a large knife. Ethan Chapin, Zanna's boyfriend, was asleep in her bedroom and the defendant killed him as well with a large, fixed blade knife. In terms of the narrative, Brian, there's been this swirling question of who really was the target. And I use the word target because that is the word law enforcement used at the onset of this case. This was targeted and we still don't know who that was. And Brian, the lead prosecutor, made a point here that he went in and killed Maddie first.

[Brian Buckmire]

Yeah. And so I don't think you need a legal degree or a journalism degree to try to figure out if the government or the prosecutor is saying who the initial victim was. Maybe there was a reason for that. Maybe there's a connection to that. We may never know that answer. Now, at sentencing, Bryan Kohberger will have the opportunity to give any amount of words that he might want to give. I think it would be smart of him to address the family. And if he's taking ownership of these actions, he should say something to that effect.

[Kayna Whitworth]

So if you were defending Bryan Kohberger, you would advise him to stand up during sentencing and in some form or fashion address the victims, families Directly, yes.

[Brian Buckmire]

And the reason why I hesitate on that is because I think as an attorney, I would advise my client to do what he thinks is best in a case like this, where what he says has no bearing on the ultimate sentence that he gets. He's going to get four consecutive life sentences. I believe the burglary are on top of that. It's not that his words are gonna sway the judge in one way, shape or form. He's not really fighting for anything. And so I would just say to him, like, human to human. There are a lot of people out there who want answers. And you might be able to help someone, maybe this helps them. If this is something you want to do, then I would recommend that you do it human to human.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Human to human. That stands out. Look, when Bill Thompson addressed the court during this change of plea, it was essentially his moment to sort of lay out the evidence that they would have presented at trial had they had a trial. And we all know that the linchpin, of course, was the DNA found on the button sn of the knife sheath underneath Matty Mogan. We know that the murder weapon has never been found. But, Matt, there are some people who feel like as Bill Thompson was laying out his evidence here, it wasn't all that convincing. That largely this case was based on circumstantial evidence. However, Bill Thompson did tick through a few things, and I want to go through some of those with you. He talked about how the prosecution has evidence that would suggest there was at least attempts by the defendant to delete or alter his purchase history on Amazon. And they allege that he bought the murder weapon on Amazon using a gift card. They also allege that he searched Amazon for a replacement knife and sheath after leaving the one behind at the crime scene. And then in terms of that DNA match, Matt, we have long known that authorities did a trash pull on Bryan Kohberger's parents Pennsylvania home and that the DNA match was made from his dad. And Bill Thompson decided to include the nugget here, that it was found on a Q tip coming from the father that that's how they made the match. Why give those details, Matt, as far.

[Matt Murphy]

As the details go and people thinking it's still not overwhelming, number one, he pled guilty. So questions about his guilt are done. Okay, he's admitted it. But having prosecuted a bunch of these, the cell phone records are very damning. When you that alone, when you. When you have somebody moving towards a crime scene and they turn their phone off, it's. It's almost like Footprints on a beach. And on this one, you have DNA on top of that. There is new evidence that came forward at this, and that is that Bryan Coburger attempted to delete or alter his purchase history, which course goes back to Amazon. And when he bought that K Bar knife, that's. That's new information. And that is what we would call consciousness of guilt. That's a legal term for somebody essentially, that is trying to cover their tracks. And I think that that's. That in itself can be very powerful evidence. So from my perspective, for the viewers that think this wasn't convincing, this was an overwhelming case. From my view, I think the defense did an excellent job with what they had to work with as far as the pretrial motions and things. They have to do that, especially in a capital case. I can't offer any criticism towards what they did. They had a job to do. But at the end of the day, almost all of that was shot down. This evidence was coming in. It was overwhelming. And I think that's one of the main reasons why they. They sought a plea.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Well, and the defense essentially threw everything at the wall. Right. Trying to get this delayed, trying to get the death penalty off the table, trying to file motion after motion after motion.

[Matt Murphy]

Right. The change of venue, all of that.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Yeah, yeah. And it did come up as well, Bryan, that there really wasn't anything found in his car in Brian Kohberger's white Hyundai Elantra. And we heard Bill Thompson address that as well. He said that nothing of evidentiary value was found in his apartment in Pullman. And then when they searched his car, his car was seized. And he described it as pretty much disassembled internally. It had been cleaned. There was a bucket of cleaner right beside it. Sort of taking the time, Brian, to explain why they think they didn't find anything in the car in the aftermath of what was an incredibly grisly murder scene. So, Brian, what would be the defense take on that?

[Brian Buckmire]

So for the defense, I would say it's neither here nor there, because your client's already pled guilty. If anything, what you may be doing is trying to fashion some way of highlighting his humanity, which is a very difficult task when it comes down to defending someone who has pled guilty to a very horrendous crime. Because while the defense has been successful at probably the one thing that they were truly seeking to do, and that is removing the death penalty, the next thing to think about is what is his life gonna be like when he is in prison for the rest of his life. One thing that stood out to me was, I think the prosecutor made a very poignant point in the plea agreement that there was no allegations or no impetus in terms of sexual proclivity towards the victims. I think there was like a paragraph or two that said that, and that stuck out to me. Because if my client is pleading guilty to a horrendous homicide, I want to make sure that his record and his. We call them, like his sentencing papers are as clean as possible, because I don't want him to get the treatment that someone would get for sexual assault or rape. They get treated very differently by other inmates as well as guards. And while murder is, of course, very horrible and is treated a very horrible way, and I don't think Bryan Kohberger is gonna have a very nice time in any prison, it gets even worse if there was a sexual aspect to this, that he was attempting to or thinking of doing something sexually horrendous to these victims and then killed them. And so I think that's the only thing that really stood out to me, seeing what language and seeing what was coming up from the prosecutor to see what his life would be like while incarcerated.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Yeah. The exact quote there from Bill Thompson was, I will state for the record, there's no evidence there was any sexual component or sexual assault of any of the victims. I want to make that clear. So there's no speculation.

[Brian Buckmire]

Yeah. And I would say that was heavily negotiated and dealt with in the background. I can't confirm that. I have no information for that. But just being like a defense attorney, and I would love to hear Matthew's opinion as well. Like, you go to bat, like, if my client's going to plead guilty to this, we're going to make sure it is very clear that the things like this that can be speculated about are on the record. And it's no evidence of that. Because if he's going to go to prison, we're going to make sure that this is not a component of why he's in there.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Yeah. So there have been questions about what his interest was in these girls in the first place. There was never an allegation of sexual assault, never a report of that. So, Matt, what do you think?

[Matt Murphy]

I totally agree with Brian on that. I think that that's. That's a huge deal, especially when you're looking at four consecutive life sentences plus the burglary. However, the person I disagree with on that is Thompson, and the wording on it is very interesting. He says there's no evidence of sexual component or Assault, no evidence of sexual assault is certainly clear. However, to say there's no sexual component is an incredibly broad thing for that prosecutor to say, because to say that it wasn't motivated. Component is a super vague word. What is he talking about? Does that include motive? Is there no component of that on the searches, on the, on the computers? Is there no paper in his background to say there's no component at the crime scene? Fine, but he didn't, he didn't clarify what that meant. And so that, I think, is going to invite more speculation than it is going to put to rest.

[Kayna Whitworth]

That's really, really interesting. So I want to move on to just the plea itself and kind of just quick answers here. I actually think, Brian, that I reached out to you early on in this, as this was unfold, There was some people who felt like the timing of this, a month before trial, what happened? Why didn't you do a plea deal earlier? But the sentiment that I got from others was that honestly, this is pretty standard timing and that a month out, a plea deal isn't necessarily that unusual. And also noting here that from our sources and from the documents we've read through, it was the defense that reached out to the prosecution looking for a deal. Brian.

[Brian Buckmire]

So prosecutors like convictions, and the highest and best conviction is always the best result. And so early on in the trial, close to indictment, as the case goes along, as you move towards hearings, as you're doing motions, as you're doing more and more work, you're going to press upon the defense attorney and the defendant that this is the offer, this is the only offer you're going to get. But as you get to the 11th hour, and this has happened for every one of my cases that I go into trial, for some reason, a good deal somehow makes its way to the defendant. A deal that was never on the table, a deal that you were told you're never gonna see the light of day, of you're never gonna see the death penalty taken off the table. And so defense attorneys know this, and we kind of at the 11th hour to say, hey, what's up? You sure you wanna do this trial? You sure you want to put this community and this family through all of the trauma? Maybe we can avoid this if you just give me this I'm asking for. And that's when you get those good deals. That's why the defense attorney reaches out. It's not because you don't believe in your case. You don't. You don't believe in your client because you've Lost emotion or whatever. We just know just before the trial, that's where you can get the real good stuff. That's what you can get. Your best offer possible. And if it's good enough for your client, then you take it and you avoid the trial. If not, then you know you did your job and you found the best possible outcome for your client and the prosecutor's not offering anything better, then you move directly to trial.

[Kayna Whitworth]

I'm curious as to your thoughts here on how bare bones this plea deal really was. Or do we not really know the details of it? Because again, some of the families are saying, look, maybe we could have supported a plea deal had we had some questions answered, had we had a videotaped confession, had we known why he did this, where the murder weapon was. So I just, I'm just curious on your take.

[Brian Buckmire]

So I get. And I understand and I appreciate that the victim's family members are asking for more information. They want to know where the murder weapon is. They want to know why those aren't typical things that you get from a defendant when they plead guilty. There also is this idea of quid pro quo, right? Something for something. And so the prosecutor would have to think, in order to get a confession, I would have to give this person something like, they're not just gonna volunteer this information. And so the first question becomes, well, why can't the offer be taking off the death penalty? Why can't that be the thing that they trade for giving the motive? I don't know. Is that a possibility? Yes. Does it often happen? No. Oftentimes. The avoidance of a trial is the reason why you avoid the harshest penalty in this case, the death penalty. And for the prosecutors, they can only give the information of what they have. They don't have where the knife is. They don't have what the motive is. And so what you're asking then is, prosecutor, can you give Bryan Kohberger a better deal so that we can get this information? And then the answer or the follow up question becomes, what are you willing to give this defendant in order to get that information? Again, I do not want to be insensitive. I would imagine that the greatest thing that you want to ensure is that a person who commits this crime never gets out again. And you don't want to give them the possibility of that for information that doesn't necessarily help in the way that you need to or want to be helped. So that's why I think that doesn't typically happen.

[Kayna Whitworth]

I'm curious about a couple of things. Here, though, as we move forward, Bryan Coburger will be sentenced. That will be the end of the state's criminal case. But we know the Gonzalez family has been disappointed with the investigation. And the prosecution, they are still looking for answers. Matt, do you see any civil suits coming down the pike here? There have been conversations surrounding a potential wrongful death suit. What do you anticipate, Matt?

[Matt Murphy]

Yeah, there are options. They might, they might be able to sue. They may do that just to try to get documents and discovery in order to answer some of the questions that have not been answered, you know, and I, I don't know if any of those would actually satisfy their search for what actually happened, because I doubt there's some document out there that tells us what Bryan Kohberger was actually thinking. But they may do that just in the pursuit. I mean, they seemed pretty angry about this plea. There's no such thing as closure for victims. Families in a case like this changes their life forever. But I, I, I hope that at some point they're able to get some semblance of peace. And having been involved in some civil litigation, as a lawyer, there's no peace when you're in a frigging lawsuit like that, I can tell you that.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Yeah, I mean, you're so right. There's nothing that they can do that will ever bring their kids back and make their lives whole again. Brian, I asked you before the change of plea if you thought that Bryan Coburger might speak in that moment. And I think you said something along the lines of he could, but he doesn't have to. You thought perhaps you might advise him on a human level to speak at sentencing. What are the chances that you think that happens and that it happens in a meaningful way?

[Brian Buckmire]

If you're going to attach end in a meaningful way, then with that added sentence, I would say there's a zero.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Percent chance because of the meaningful part.

[Brian Buckmire]

In a meaningful way. I don't think that there's anything that can be meaningfully said that will give these families any kind of solace. I don't think he's gonna get up there and explain, this is why I did it. This is how I felt. This is why I thought. I don't think you're gonna get that. I think the answers in which the family want, need and deserve are not gonna come from the criminal justice system. The criminal justice system is very good at incarcerating bad people. It's very good at stopping potential threats of people who do some of the worst things in our society. It's not very good at making victims whole. Do I think he will talk, keeping out that meaningful part? At this point, I would say 50, 50. He has no real motivation to talk. This isn't a victim impact statement where he could say anything that would make the judge think, you know what, I'll shave off five years. You know what? I'll make it that he gets to go to parole sooner than what the government or the prosecutor wants. There's none of that there. He can say something amazing, that maybe he's better than me, and he can find words that can make people feel whole, even though you're the person who brutally murdered their loved ones. Maybe he has that ability. I don't know. I've never seen anyone do that yet. But even if he did, that wouldn't do anything for his case. And so that's why I say it's 50, 50. I think he could come up there and just say, your Honor, I did this. I apologize to the family. I'm ready to be sentenced.

[Kayna Whitworth]

So, Matt, in your experience, the word impact here, do these victim impact statements have just that, right? Do they have an actual impact on the convicted?

[Matt Murphy]

So victim impact statements are. They're an incredibly powerful moment for a lot of different reasons. It's the family's opportunity to voice their feelings and what this crime has done to them with the defendant captivated, essentially. He has to sit there and listen. So these are very dramatic and it is, it can be an incredibly cathartic thing for, for family members. But Brian's right, it isn't going to have any real impact on what the judge does in this case. Oftentimes it doesn't. It's just good for the family. The big question then of course becomes, and it's called a statement in allocution. That's when the defendant addresses the court and almost every state when they do it, the defendant goes last. I hate that, to be honest with you, because it gives the defendant the last word. And Brian Coburger, there's nothing he's going to be able to say to make these people feel better. One of the things about people that commit murders like this is they tend to have a shocking lack of empathy for other people. So I don't think, you know, if Coburger apologizes to the family, I don't anticipate that it's going to do them much good. But this is going to be a high drama day or two in court as this families, these poor families go through the impact that this had upon them. And my heart just breaks for them. Through this whole process, it's just, it's an awful thing. And I don't think there's. Like Brian said, we haven't figured out how to make the victims whole. And in a case like this, we never will.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Gentlemen, thank you as always for your insight and your analysis.

[Matt Murphy]

Happy to be here as always. Thank you.

[Brian Buckmire]

My pleasure. Kana, thanks for having us.

[Kayna Whitworth]

After the break, I'll share conversations I've had with the victim's family members and friends. And then we'll bring on ABC News contributor Julie Scott to talk about what we might hear in the victim impact statements tomorrow and how the community of Moscow has reacted to Brian Kohberger's guilty plea.

[Julie Scott]

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[Brian Buckmire]

I miss him every single day and I always will.

[Kayna Whitworth]

That's Jim Chapin, Ethan Chapin's father. I interviewed his whole family just about a week before it was announced that Bryan Kohberger was accepting this plea deal.

[Brian Buckmire]

It drives me crazy because I've always wanted to protect my family and there was really nothing there that I could have done. Yeah, I watch out for everybody in my family and make sure, you know, everybody's good. And instantly he was taken and I couldn't do a thing about it.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Like the Chapins, many loved ones have been forced to find a new normal. One that no longer includes Ethan, Zanna, Kaylee or Maddie. And at tomorrow's sentencing hearing, their family members and friends will have a chance to give victim impact statements. Some of the victims families are split on how the case has developed. The Chapin and Mogan families are content with the plea deal. They've said Coburger's guilty plea has given them closure and that they're ready to move on. But the Goncalves and Kernodle families are furious. For them, negotiating a plea deal with Kohberger isn't justice. They wanted a full confession. On the Gonzalez family's official Facebook page, they posted, quote, bryan Kohberger facing a life in prison means he would still get to speak, form relationships, and engage with the world. Meanwhile, our loved ones have been silenced forever. The emotional toll these murders have had on the victim's families and friends has also been exacerbated by the national media attention and online harassment some have received over the past couple of years.

[Emily Allott]

I think looking back on that day specifically, I would just say that that's just the day that changed it all.

[Kayna Whitworth]

That's Emily Allott. She and her boyfriend, Hunter Johnson, were with the surviving roommates when they called 911 the morning after the murders. Hunter is actually heard on the call. We spoke to Emily and Hunter before Coburger accepted the plea deal. We all thought the trial would move ahead in August, so they were hesitant in this moment to discuss details about that morning. They were worried that whatever they said could impact the trial, so they were careful to not violate the gag order. But we did talk about their friendship with Zanna and Ethan. They were all best friends. Emily and Hunter say they still struggle with the shock and trauma of discovering their friends had been killed. My heart started beating really fast when they told me this.

[Emily Allott]

I think it's just a pivotal moment in your life where, you know, you see the world in pure innocence, and that all gets ripped away from you in one phone call and one, you know, walk over. It's all very blurry. It doesn't, you know, you don't remember everything, but it's a day of impact.

[Brian Buckmire]

Yeah.

[Emily Allott]

I would say just for me personally, I would say you don't ever know when you're really gonna grow up.

[Brian Buckmire]

Like, When's, like. When's, like, I'm gonna be an adult.

[Emily Allott]

You know, I think that was the.

[Brian Buckmire]

Day where my childhood was left behind.

[Emily Allott]

And adulthood had to enter in.

[Kayna Whitworth]

For Emily and Hunter, the grieving process has been complicated. True crime sleuths made it difficult to mourn their friends in peace. Especially for Hunter, the Internet falsely accused him of being involved in the murders. He was bombarded online with harassment.

[Brian Buckmire]

Lots of threats, people saying I should confess to murdering them or knowing things.

[Kayna Whitworth]

That.

[Emily Allott]

I obviously had no clue about. I think it's very important for.

[Kayna Whitworth]

People.

[Emily Allott]

To take a set like a seat back and recognize that what they say on their phone and what they say on social media is very hurtful to so many people. And it can be very impactful to some people's lives. And it was very impactful for our lives for a long time. And we didn't even get the worst of it. And so it is. It breaks my heart to know that people, people say terrible things about Dylan and Bethany and everybody that was involved. I think that it is wrong to have a voice in those areas.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Dylan Mortenson and Bethany Funk lived with the victims on King Road. They were home the night of the murders. Internet sleuths criticized them for not calling 911 sooner, allowing Kohberger to get away. They were viciously targeted online. Emily and Hunter say that Dylan and Bethany are also victims in all of this. In fact, it seems like nearly everyone in Moscow felt the sting of unwanted attention. At some point during that six week investigation, the community of Moscow was suddenly thrust into the national spotlight. Media outlets and true crime enthusiasts descended upon the small college town. So it's perhaps not a surprise that many residents were relieved to hear about Kohberger's plea. Without a trial, they'll be spared a second wave of media attention. And that's why I wanted to check in with our ABC news contributor, Julie Scott. She's based in Moscow. She used to teach journalism at the University of Idaho. So I wanted to speak with her about what she's hearing from residents now that Kohberger has pled guilty to the murders. I'm curious, Julie. I keep thinking about this sentiment. When Bryan Kohberger was arrested, there was this sentiment throughout Moscow of I'm glad it wasn't one of us. Glad it was an outsider, someone they didn't know. Now that he has admitted to this, how is the community reacting?

[Unnamed City Council Member]

Well, it's a tight knit community. They're stunned, much like I was stunned, but it's split. So the community members that I talk to, one in particular is on the city council. It's been a long time journalist in Moscow in Leytai county and now sits on the city council. And she said she was numb that it took her about an hour to really process what had happened. She said there was such an emptiness, an empty feeling, and it all came rushing back to her. So that moment of the crime hit her again hard.

[Kayna Whitworth]

In talking with people in Moscow, though, Julie, is there a divide in how people feel in terms of wishing there had Been a trial and hoping for a conviction out of a trial versus this plea deal.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

So the folks that I talk to, and they seem to be the older crowd in Moscow, are happy that this plea deal happened because it's a guaranteed outcome. And maybe it's because they've had the experience of watching other trials, watching other folks that have gone through the system, that it's, you know, a guaranteed outcome. Is a guaranteed outcome. We do not know what would have happened in a trial. Some people say that, you know, there could have been a loophole. The DNA evidence could have been the sticking point. It could have been a mistrial. And so there was all that fear, because this now is the outcome. We know he's going to be put away for life.

[Kayna Whitworth]

But there's the other side of people that wanted to go for the death penalty.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

Right.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Which again, in the state of Idaho now with this new law, means firing squad. There are people that wanted that day, they were people that were confident that there would be justice served, confident in a conviction, but they also wanted the trial to play out, because I think there's a sense from some folks and some families that the true depravity of this crime is still unknown.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

The students that I spoke to that are very close to this case are angry. They all are in agreement, wanted the trial to happen. They wanted the guilty verdict, the death penalty verdict. They wanted to know the motive, and they wanted to know all the evidence. And they felt like that was the only solution. That's the only thing that, you know, whether it would be satisfying or not, they wanted to make sure that he got the death penalty. And it was one of the students who I know very well, he was a former student of mine, said, you know, it's an eye for an eye.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Yeah, yeah. And it doesn't matter. I think to a lot of people that feel that way, if that process is drawn out for decades, it's the fact that justice prevailed.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

And they felt that the only way that justice would prevail would be that firing squad, death penalty sentence. And they were adamant about it.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Wow.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

The only thing. And this was a group of them that I spoke to. The only thing that they were worried about is the two roommates.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Yeah.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

Having to testify and protecting their friends. They are now spared from that event.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Exactly. We knew that the two surviving roommates had been subpoenaed to testify. That would have been a big day in court, and it would have been really hard on those girls. And we will hear from the victim's families during sentencing because on July 23rd, perhaps it goes into the 24th, Bryan Kohberger will be sentenced to four consecutive life terms in prison. And at that point, these victims families will have the opportunity to make victim impact statements in the courtroom. What do you imagine of that day? I know it's going to be tremendously powerful. And I have a feeling that some of them might speak directly to Bryan Kohberger.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

Well, you know, the most vocal has been Steve Gonzalves and his emotion and his anger. I understand. I don't know how I'd feel if I were in his shoes. I have a son the same age. I would be angry for the rest of my life. Steve is going to have a chance to face him.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Mm. I think Steve and Kristi, I think their eldest daughter, Olivia, I think there's going to be a lot of Gonzalez family members that take to that mic.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

They've been at every single hearing. They have been the most consistent attending because they felt like it was so important to them to be there, to follow everything, to make sure things were done correctly.

[Kayna Whitworth]

It was a responsibility for them.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

It's their responsibility.

[Kayna Whitworth]

Julie, just last week, the judge in this case lifted the gag order, but left the documents related to the case under seal. So as of this recording, we don't know when or if that seal will be lifted. But we are expecting that at some point we'll get a lot more information about the investigation of Brian Coburger and the evidence the state of Idaho had against him. So, Julie, what are some of the things that you have an eye out for?

[Unnamed City Council Member]

I think first and foremost is we know that there was, you know, no real connection with the victims. But what does that mean? Was there any connection between Bryan Kohberger and Kaylee, Maddie, Zanna and Ethan? You know, there was some talk about Bryan Kohberger frequenting a restaurant that Maddie worked at, the Mad Greek. What do they have on that? Is there anything there?

[Kayna Whitworth]

Yeah.

[Unnamed City Council Member]

What was his habits? What was he doing in Moscow? What were his patterns? His cell phone data? What did that reveal? And I think those are the answers that people want to know. What was the connection? And what if we don't have a motive? What if there is no motive?

[Kayna Whitworth]

I also have a lot of questions of my own. I don't know that law enforcement can answer the question of where the murder weapon is, but where do they think it is? And I want to know what they think Bryan Kohberger was wearing that night and what was he carrying as he was leaving the house? It's been described as a Vacuum as something that a firefighter would have as a container. What was it? And how did he manage to keep the evidence so contained in what was a gruesome stabbing murder scene? How did he do that?

[Unnamed City Council Member]

Listen, I've talked to people that are in forensics. I've talked to people in law enforcement that have done horrific crimes, and they said it's almost impossible not to leave hairs, fibers, sweat, saliva. Yeah, saliva around the crime scene. A crime scene like that. And the kill kit. Did he have a kill kit? Did he have Where? What? You know, where did it go? We know that he went, you know, south out of Moscow towards the Snake River. He was very close to the Snake River. Did he throw the weapon in the Snake River?

[Kayna Whitworth]

And, Julie, had he not left this knife sheath behind, would law enforcement have ever found him?

[Unnamed City Council Member]

I don't think so. Because of the surveillance video. All we had was a car, a white car. Basically, the license plate was in question. There were times that they couldn't see the license plate. There were times on the surveillance that the front license plate was missing. But that's all you would have, would be surveillance footage. I also want to know when he was arrested in Pennsylvania, in his home, he was continually cleaning, so he had gloves on. He was obsessed with his cleaning his vehicle. So he continued to clean. What were those patterns? Like, what did they find in the trash? What did they find in his room?

[Kayna Whitworth]

Is the community of Moscow feeling like once he's sentenced, he has no ability to appeal? So for them, is it over?

[Unnamed City Council Member]

I think this community will always remember Maddie, Kaylee, Zanna, and Ethan. And they will do their darndest to make sure that their memories are always a part of the University of Idaho. You have the healing garden. They never want to forget those victims. They want to put behind them the media attention that came upon the city of Moscow, which was tremendous. YouTubers, Internet sleuth, people pointing fingers and making accusations and connecting the dots and really making Moscow kind of a circus for this horrific crime. So this community wants to get back to being the community of Moscow. The one question that comes up, whether you're in the camp of I agree with this plea deal or I do not agree with this plea deal. They want to know why. I think the community, I think students, friends, family want that why so desperately, and they want it from him. Tell us why you did this. Why were they your victims?

[Kayna Whitworth]

I'll be at the sentencing hearing tomorrow, July 20th, 23rd. I'll be covering what happens and report back. So keep an eye on this feed. For our next episode. The King Road Killings is a production of ABC Audio. I'm Kaina Whitworth and thanks for listening.

[Brad Milke]

Hey, I'm Brad Milke. If you're hooked on this show, you know how quickly a single story can turn into something bigger, deeper, more complex than anyone first thought. Well, for a smart, clear breakdown of the day's top stories, including true crime cases like this one, check out Start Here, the daily podcast from ABC News. Each weekday morning, my team and I will walk you through what's happening in the world and why it matters in just 20 minutes. From Earth shaking moves in global politics to fascinating developments in court cases, we will unpack it all. So follow Start Here again, that's Start Here wherever you listen to podcasts.

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[Kayna Whitworth]

Every home, the top stories, biggest headlines, entertainment buzz and viral moments. You give us less than 10 minutes and will give you what you need to know. Your new daily must have habit. Start your day with what you need to know now streaming on Disney plus.