John Bolton indicted on 18 criminal counts

Summary

The Last Word with Lawrence O’Donnell — Episode Summary

Date: October 17, 2025
Episode Title: John Bolton Indicted on 18 Criminal Counts

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Main Theme Overview

This episode examines the tumultuous political climate in the United States, focusing on the scheduled nationwide “No Kings” protest rallies against the Trump administration’s shift toward authoritarian governance. The episode unpacks the right-wing attacks framing the protests as “hate America rallies” and explores broader themes of dissent, democracy, and constitutional rights. Additionally, it covers the breaking news of John Bolton’s indictment and investigates the swelling controversies around Trump’s administration, including the Epstein files and U.S. agricultural policy.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Republican Reaction to “No Kings” Rallies

(01:31–05:03)

• Republicans label upcoming nationwide “No Kings” rallies as “Hate America rallies,” wrongly conflating constitutional protest with hatred of the country.
• Quote:
  • Robert Reich:

    “The Emperor has no Clothes. Rather than it being a Hate America rally, Saturday’s rally is an opportunity for all of us who love America to express our determination that our nation’s ideals not be crushed by the Trump regime.”
    (03:03)

• Host Lawrence O’Donnell and guests reiterate that peaceful protest is foundational to American democracy.

Timestamps:

• [03:03] — Robert Reich’s statement on protest as patriotic
• [04:35] — Hakeem Jeffries on the “patriotic” nature of protests

2. The Meaning and Importance of the “No Kings” Protests

(05:03–13:26)

• The rallies are broad, grassroots, and family-focused events built around defending democracy and the Constitution.
• Alderman Timmy Knudsen (Chicago) describes the protest as peaceful and family-friendly, pointing out ICE’s violent overreach in Chicago:

  “Right now, the worst gang in Chicago is called ICE, and it’s funded by the federal government.” (10:38)

• Emphasis on inclusiveness:
  • “We’re creating a safe space. We expect hundreds of children, and we’re just going to be standing up for democracy for Chicago.” (Knudsen, 11:58)

3. Ordinary Americans Mobilizing

(13:26–18:43)

• Sharon Jackson, a 76-year-old grandmother from Kansas City, shares her motivation for protesting for the first time:

  “I think I’ve had enough of listening to the lies that come out of his mouth . . . I want [my grandchildren] to be in a democratic country and . . . not be an authoritarian like we have right now.” (14:03)

• She notes the generational distress at political division and disinformation:

  “People now are mean to each other. We didn’t used to be that way . . . That’s not the way it should be. No. In a free country, you should be able to speak how you feel, and you shouldn’t have someone call you names or lie to you about things.” (16:47)

4. John Bolton Indicted by Trump’s DOJ

(18:43–23:38)

• John Bolton, former Trump advisor, indicted on 18 counts related to mishandling classified material.
• Charges stem from the Espionage Act, similar to the earlier case against Trump.
• Legal analysis by Lisa Rubin (MSNBC legal correspondent):

  “This can be both retributive and possibly meritorious at the same time.” (21:14)

• Indictment handled by career prosecutors, not a direct Trump appointee, distinguishing it from previous “revenge” indictments.

Timestamps:

• [21:14] — Lisa Rubin explains the nature of Bolton’s charges
• [22:43] — Details on the career prosecutors handling the case

5. The Epstein Files and House Shutdown

(25:32–33:15)

• Speaker Mike Johnson’s refusal to swear in Democratic Rep.-elect Adelita Grijalva delays a petition to force release of Epstein files, which would increase scrutiny over Trump’s Epstein connections.
• Rep. Eric Swalwell (CA) calls out the shutdown as a stalling tactic:

  “We are in an Epstein shutdown. Mike Johnson has shut down the Congress for almost 30 days because he doesn’t want to find out how close Donald Trump is to Jeffrey Epstein.” (30:57)

• Bipartisan frustration grows, with the impasse holding up not just the Epstein files but also vital health care subsidies.

Timestamps:

• [30:57] — Swalwell on the “Epstein shutdown”
• [32:32] — Expectation that over 100 Republicans may vote to release documents when the time comes

6. The Fight Over Health Care Subsidies

(25:32–35:23)

• Democrats refuse to pass defense funding alone without measures for health care and other key social supports.
• Rep. Swalwell underlines the stakes:

  “The best case scenario is your health care costs are going up… for people who get their health care through the ACA exchanges . . . you can’t go from paying $500 a year in insurance to $10,000 a year in insurance, you’ll just choose not to be insured.” (34:25)

• Stakes include cuts to rural hospitals and millions threatened with loss of coverage.

7. Trump’s Argentina Bailout and Impact on U.S. Farmers

(36:41–44:06)

• Trump is criticized for proposing $40B in bailouts to Argentina’s right-wing government while U.S. farmers suffer from lost soybean markets due to trade wars.
• Both progressive and conservative politicians oppose the bailout.
• Rep. Angie Craig (MN) highlights the harm:

  “Minnesota has already lost about $2 billion in soybean sales . . . While these numbers are coming out, Donald Trump is writing a check for $40 billion to Argentina . . . There’s some really pissed off farmers, and they should be very, very angry right now.” (41:02)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Robert Reich on protest:

  “The Emperor has no Clothes.... [The rally] is an opportunity for all of us who love America to express our determination that our nation’s ideals not be crushed by the Trump regime.” (03:03)

• Alderman Timmy Knudsen:

  “The worst gang in Chicago is called ICE, and it’s funded by the federal government.” (10:38)

• Sharon Jackson, KC protester:

  “I want my grandchildren . . . to be in a democratic country and . . . not be an authoritarian like we have right now.” (14:03)

• Rep. Eric Swalwell:

  “We are in an Epstein shutdown. Mike Johnson has shut down the Congress for almost 30 days because he doesn’t want to find out how close Donald Trump is to Jeffrey Epstein.” (30:57)

• Rep. Angie Craig:

  “Minnesota has already lost about $2 billion in soybean sales . . . While these numbers are coming out, Donald Trump is writing a check for $40 billion to Argentina.” (41:02)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• No Kings rally/Republican response: 01:31–05:03
• Alderman Knudsen, Chicago protests: 10:14–13:26
• Sharon Jackson, first-time protester: 13:26–18:43
• Bolton indictment breakdown: 18:43–23:38
• Epstein shutdown and healthcare fight: 25:32–35:23
• Argentina bailout and farmers: 36:41–44:06

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Tone and Language

Lawrence O’Donnell and his guests maintain a blend of earnest concern, pointed critique, and urgency throughout, using accessible, plain-spoken language. The tone is passionate, sometimes sardonic when discussing right-wing rhetoric, but ultimately rooted in defense of democratic ideals and advocacy for ordinary Americans.

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Summary for New Listeners

This episode delivers a deep-dive into American democracy in crisis, punctuated by personal stories of protest and institutional struggles over transparency and fair policy. It contextualizes the Bolton indictment as both potential justice and possible political payback, illustrates the politicized battle over the Epstein files, and exposes the real-world impact of Trump's economic and foreign policy decisions—especially for vulnerable farmers. The central message is clear: at stake is nothing less than the nation’s democratic character and the lived reality of millions of Americans.

Transcript

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[A]

Welcome to all of you. Tonight we are watching something remarkable unfold not in Washington, but across the country. As we reported on the program last night, Republicans are now trying to convince the country that millions of Americans preparing to protest on Saturday, Hate America. And they have taken that message straight to their favorite conservative networks. The no Kings rally, we call it the Hate America rally. Usually have all the Marxists collected, all the antifa people, you know, the BLM remnants. You'll have the, you know, the pro Hamas wing of the Democratic Party. And they're going to be out here demonstrating and screaming and wailing.

[B]

Continue this shutdown for what?

[A]

For a Hate America rally that's taking place on the mall on Saturday. Maria, I don't think it will end before the, you know, Hate America rally on the. On the mall on Saturday where they. All the Marxists and antifa people and all the people who hate Trump and Hate America will be there. I mean, that's. It's dumb. It's up to these. It's not even sophomoric. It's childish. According to Republicans, Democrats are waiting until Saturday's protests to reopen the government. The talking point makes no particular sense because nothing about these rallies relate to anything about the shutdown. But I guess Republicans need something to say about what may end up as the largest series of rallies in American history. Look at this. More than 2,500 no Kings events, separate events, big and small, are scheduled for Saturday. These protests are not just happening in Democratic cities, they are happening everywhere. This is a nationwide movement. The former US Labor Secretary Robert Reich wrote this week, quote, trump's power depends on maintaining the illusion that he's all powerful and that most Americans, apart from those he and his lap dogs label pro Hamas terrorists and antifa, adore him. But that illusion is harder to maintain if a significant part of the population of every town and city is on the streets decrying him. The Emperor has no Clothes. Rather than it being a Hate America rally, Saturday's rally is an opportunity for all of us who love America to express our determination that our nation's ideals not be crushed by the Trump regime. It's a chance for us to publicly rededicate ourselves to democracy, the rule of law, equal protection under the law, and our rights to believe what we want, say what we want, and choose our leaders without fear of recrimination. End quote. Well said. Last night, Senator Bernie Sanders echoed that sentiment. Millions of people are going to come out on a no Kings Day. Maybe more people coming out than any.

[E]

Time in American history.

[A]

Speaker Johnson said this is a Hate America rally because people are coming out expressing their concerns about massive cuts to health care and the movement toward authoritarianism. Not a hate America. It's a love of America. Here's what House Democratic leader Hakeem Jeffrey said about the preemptive Republican meltdown about Saturday's mass demonstrations against Trump.

[F]

The notion that the no Kings rallies is anything other than a patriotic act consistent with the First Amendment right to express yourselves and petition the government for a change in policy continues to reveal that Republicans are clueless as it relates to the Constitution of the United States of America, or they continue to lie for political reasons.

[A]

I'm going to take option B. Republicans are lying for political reasons because Donald Trump's power depends on convincing Americans that dissent, that very specific thing upon which this country is based, is now suddenly a threat to the country itself. And the President of the United states who told 30,573 lies in his first term, according to the Washington Post. Because it's become a thing to actually track, Donald Trump's l is continuing to lie about Chicago, where our next guest, the alderman Timmy Knudson, is holding a no Kings rally in Chicago's Oz park, specifically geared toward families with young children. So you better watch out for those America hating babies on Saturday in Chicago. Saturday's protests are especially important in the Chicago area because Trump has been pushing aggressive immigration enforcement and putting American troops on the streets there. But today, a federal appeals court panel said it would not let Trump send troops anywhere in Illinois for now, leaving in place a lower court ruling blocking his administration from dispatching the National Guard there. He's able to federalize them, but he can't deploy them. Also today, a federal judge in Chicago said that ICE agents must wear body cameras. The New York Times reports that Judge Sarah Ellis, quote, was profoundly concerned that federal agents might have violated a court order that she said she had issued, setting strict limits to on their use of tear gas and requiring them to give protesters warning to disperse. The judge also said she would order federal agents to wear body cameras and for the Director of Immigration and Customs Enforcement's Chicago field office to appear in her courtroom on Monday morning. Last week, Donald Trump posted a video on a social media platform that was supposed to show Chicago as a hellscape. Once again, the video was a lie. The video opens with images of the Chicago mayor, Brandon Johnson and Illinois Governor J.B. pritzker as text flares across the screen. Illinois criminal aliens, cartels and gangs are poisoning our kids. As the clip flashes between cinematic shots of Immigration and Customs Enforcement, ICE and other Homeland Security agents knocking down doors, chasing down deportation targets and carrying out arrests, Trump's voice plays in the background, his words summarized into subtitles at the bottom of the screen. Chicago's a mess, the president says. The multilingual news agency Agence France Press reports quote, many of the video's sensational scenes purport to depict the mess in Chicago, but they're outdated. They were filmed outside of the city. An AFP investigation based on reversed image searches and a review of the Defense Visual Information Distribution Services video archive has revealed that the White House's video lifted numerous additional shots from footage of immigration enforcement operations in California, Arizona, Texas, South Carolina and Nebraska. Some of the videos date to 2024, 2023, when the former President Joe Biden was in office. The Daily Beast reports, quote, much of the footage was actually filmed in April in Florida, the state that's home to Trump's Mar A Lago residents, with a big giveaway being that it features palm trees, which are not known to grow. In Chicago today, a group of retired military generals, leaders, and veterans joined Governor J.B. pritzker to discuss what Pritzker calls, quote, trump's unprecedented overreach, politicization of service members, and abuse of power within the military. Resistance is growing. Doug Krugman, who served for 24 years in the United States Marine Corps, writes in the Washington Post, quote, when the President's orders push or cross legal limits and put commanders in these situations, cohesion within our military is at risk. President Trump's description of Portland as a war zone is as fantastical as his belief that the June protests in a few blocks of Los Angeles would somehow obliterate the massive city of nearly 4 million. In both cases, his words had little connection to reality. Every dubious basis he gives for an order creates more room for doubt, more room for reservations, more threats to our unity. I voluntarily gave up my rank as the President suggested. But the future of our country is more important than any individual's career, wealth, or power. I have no regrets about my decision. I've given up the service I loved for the freedom to do the right thing, the freedom to speak my mind, the freedom to speak in defense of our country. End quote. And that is what Saturday is all about. Millions of Americans, and there will be millionthere were at least 5 million at the last series of no Kings rallies. Millions of Americans standing up for democracy, for the rule of law, and for the Constitution. Not hate, love. For America in action. Leading off our discussion tonight, Chicago City Council Alderman Timmy Knudsen. He represents Chicago's 43rd War. Alderman, thank you for being with us tonight.

[E]

Thank you so much for having me on, Ali.

[A]

I am fascinated by this strange turn of events in which we are categorizing these events as hate. They are as purely American as anything in America. The idea that people who love their country will go out, protest in favor of it, dissent from the government is what makes this country exceptional.

[E]

Yeah. And this will be a peaceful protest. You said it best. Largely, I would say right now, the worst gang in Chicago is called ice, and it's funded by the federal government. We're going to show up in masses this weekend downtown and say that, you know, we don't believe in authoritarianism.

[A]

It's kind of amazing because I just, I watch all these videos, the real ones from Chicago, that people who are out there taping are posting ICE Seems to be pretty proud of it. The administration's putting it out there. The violence seems to be the point.

[E]

Yeah, and that's the terrifying part of it. You know, a few weeks ago in Franklin park, someone was killed by ice. Just days ago, one of my colleagues on Chicago City Council was tear gassed alongside Chicago police officers. To be frank, I've had a colleague who was arrested by ice. And there doesn't seem to be a slowdown here. There's no regard being given to the Constitution or the laws of our country.

[A]

What do you say to people for whom these rallies, the no King rallies, are an abstraction? They're somebody else's rally, because that's no longer the case. This isn't sort of an organizers rally. This is regular people like you talking to regular people like the families with children who will be with you on Saturday, 100%.

[E]

And everyone can be involved. And I think a big piece of this is showing that if this can happen in Chicago, if ICE can use brutal force in our city in the central of the country, it can happen anywhere. And we need to show coast to coast that they could come to your home next. I would say in Lincoln park, we're hosting a kid centric rally just because some parents feel apprehension to bring their kids downtown because of the good reason that there's going to be an extraordinarily large crowd and to downtown events in general. A lot of parents resist large crowds. So we're creating a safe space. We expect hundreds of children and we're just going to be standing up for democracy for Chicago and making sure that they have a space to stand up for some of their classmates who have been missing from school because of fear of going there.

[A]

What a great call to action for people who are watching the show tonight to be able to say, go out there as a protection racket. Go out there to make sure that the families with children are safe in protesting the things that they believe need to be protested. There is some value in the strength of crowds.

[E]

Absolutely. This will be safe. This will be joyful, and I love it. As a call to action, I call, you know, cities around the country to have these kid centric protests. Let's talk to our kids about freedom and democracy and, you know, what our grandparents fought for abroad, that's all at risk right now. And we need to show it to them in themes of unity.

[A]

All right, Alderman, we're going to be watching on Saturday. Thank you for doing this. Thank you for being with us tonight. Chicago City Alderman Timmy Knudsen joining Us now is Sharon Jackson from Kansas City, Missouri. She plans to attend Saturday's no Kings Day protest in Kansas City. Sharon, welcome to the show. You are not a professional protester. You have not, you've not done this a lot in your life.

[G]

No, never.

[A]

So this is the first time this is the reason to talk to you because I think there are a lot of people watching us right this second who probably also haven't attended protests in their life. What's made you change? What's made you decide this is the time?

[G]

I think I've had enough of listening to the lies that come out of his mouth. There are so many things that have happened since he took office that do not follow the Constitution. And after a while it starts to really wear on a 76 year old grandmother that lives in the Midwest who has grandchildren that will be growing up. And I want them to be in a democratic country and be able to live freely and have the person who is in charge of the country follow the Constitution and not be an authoritarian like we have right now.

[A]

I speak to a lot of people in their 60s, in their 70s, in their 80s, retired, in many cases, wondering what should they do? What can they do in this moment? What, what does it mean to you to go to a protest? What made you say that may make a difference?

[G]

I think I've watched so many on TV lately and they aren't what the Republicans say they are. They're calm, they're elderly people, a lot of them. They know what the United States should be. And we also know that what it's turning into. And I think most of us just want our country back and we want it back in a peaceful way. And we want people to know that we just aren't what the Republicans are saying we are.

[A]

Who'd you talk to about this? Was this a sort of a discussion with friends, family?

[G]

Well, actually it was with friends with family and my sister who is in charge of the no Kings rally here in Kansas City.

[A]

And what do you like? What's going through your mind right now? What are you thinking about? What are you thinking about ahead of Saturday morning?

[G]

I hope it doesn't rain.

[A]

I love it. We're all regular people in the end, right? That's what we mostly care about. There's stuff, I hope you don't consume this, but there's stuff going around on certain channels about how this is a hate America rally that people there will be filled with hate. You're old enough to have seen a lot of changes in this country that don't tend to be born of hate. They tend to be born of I would like a better country.

[G]

Right. I've heard so many people on the other side talk about or use hate as a way to express themselves. And I know that I'm not old enough to remember what happened in Germany, but I know what happened in Germany, and I just feel like they're headed in that direction. People now are mean to each other. We didn't used to be that way. We could talk to Republicans as a Democrat, I could talk to a Republican and we could just discuss things. And in some ways with some people, you lose friendships. Some of your family members won't talk to you anymore. That's not the way it should be. No. In a free country, you should be able to speak how you feel, and you shouldn't have someone call you names or lie to you about things. And I believe a lot of the Republican people are lying to Republicans because Republicans listen to certain TV stations and they believe everything that comes out of their mouth. They don't give anybody a chance. They don't listen to the other news stations. They listen to Fox and on Fox News. They lie about things we do. Somebody has to get out there and show them that we're not terrible people. We just want people to follow the Constitution and be free.

[A]

Sharon, you're inspiring to me and I think to a lot of our viewers tonight, thank you for making the decision at the age of 76 to go to your first protest. I hope it all works. I hope there's no rain. Something tells me that at this point, even the rain won't deter you. But thank you for being with us tonight.

[G]

I have a raincoat.

[A]

Very good. Well, we will follow your progress on this very closely. Sharon Jackson is protesting in Saturday's no Kings Day event in Kansas City, Missouri. All right, coming up, show me the man. I'll show you the crime. The former Trump adviser John Bolton quoted Stalin's secret police in his statement after he was indicted today on charges brought by the Trump Justice Department. We'll have the latest on this breaking news next. Today, a federal grand jury in Maryland voted to indict the former United States Ambassador John Bolton on charges brought by Trump's Justice Department. John Bolton became one of Donald Trump's loudest critics after his experience working for Trump in the first administration. The FBI conducted searches of John Bolton's Maryland home and his Washington, D.C. office in August. Prosecutors have been investigating whether John Bolton mishandled classified materials following his departure from the administration. The indictment charges Bolton with eight counts of transmission of national defense information and 10 counts of retention of national defense information. Donald Trump said this to me.

[H]

John Bolton was just indicted by a.

[C]

Grand jury in Maryland.

[H]

Do you have a reaction to that?

[A]

I didn't know that. You told me for the first time. But I think he's, you know, a bad person. I think he's a bad guy. Yeah, he's a bad guy. It's too bad. But the way it goes against. That's the way it goes, right? That's the way it goes. That's the way it goes. Only if you stand up to Donald Trump. First it was the former FBI Director James Comey, who investigated Russian interference into the 2016 election. Then it was the New York Attorney General, Letitia James, who won a $500 million civil fraud judgment against Donald Trump. Prosecutors say John Bolton sent thousands of pages of information from his time in the Trump, the first Trump administration to his wife and daughter. They then proceeded to type up the information for him. John Bolton denies the charges, saying, quote, I look forward to the fight to defend my lawful conduct and to expose Donald Trump's abuse of power, end quote. Joining me now is MSNBC legal correspondent Lisa Rubin. Lis, I need you at times like this to understand what the charges are and what the case is. And then there's this sort of thing which we can talk about in a second, which is that the specifics are almost secondary to the fact that you cross Donald Trump and this kind of thing might come for you. But what are we talking about, first of all, in terms of the charges against John Bolton?

[H]

So, Ellie, the charges against John Bolton both come from the Espionage act, and one of them actually is a charge that was brought against Trump himself in the Mar A Lago documents case. There were 30 plus counts, you'll recall, in that case, having to deal with Trump's unauthorized retention of national defense information, some of which was classified. And in that respect, this bears a strong resemblance to the Trump case, because what John Bolton is being accused of is taking classified information that was in his handwritten notes and sending it to his wife and daughter over non governmental email and messaging systems. He's also been accused of retaining physical, physical and electronic copies of other documents that have classified information in them. Now, going to the second part of what you were saying about sort of the vengefulness of this, the government is very clear that none of the information that they are charging John Bolton in regards to today is information that ended up in his memoir, which was the subject of earlier civil Litigation. But two things can be true. This can be both retributive and possibly meritorious at the same time.

[A]

All right, what's the, what's the process here? Because as we know with the charges against Tish James and James Comey, initially the prosecutor involved did not feel sort of like he wanted to bring this case. Then they replaced that prosecutor. Where, where do we stand on this in terms of the, the, the, the willingness of the prosecution to proceed with.

[H]

This case very differently. So the prosecutor in the District of Maryland is a woman named Kelly Hayes who is a career prosecutor in that office. She was appointed by the Trump administration to fill that role on an acting basis, and she has been extended after her first 120 days expired by the district of the judges there. They have the right under statute to appoint someone and they have extended Kelly Hayes. So that's one big difference. Second big difference is Kelly Hayes isn't the one signing this indictment. It was signed by a career prosecutor in her office, the chief of the National Security Unit in her office, a guy by the name of Tom Sullivan who not only signed search warrant affidavits, but went in to meet with the grand jury himself today, was seen leaving the room. And is the name on the indictment and on the docket sheet. Both of those things distinguish this situation even before you get to the merits from both Comey and Tish James cases in the Eastern District of Virginia.

[A]

Lisa, I'm always clearer after I've talked to you. Thank you, my friend. As always, Lisa Rubin. All right, coming up, Mike Johnson refused yet again today to swear in a Democratic representative elect who will be the 218th signature on the Epstein files discharge petition. But that didn't help Donald Trump, whose Epstein problem got worse today. And I'll tell you why. After a break.

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[A]

Democrats show Donald Trump and Republicans that they're not willing to bend in their fight to extend health care insurance subsidies for millions of Americans against Republicans who want to do nothing about the huge premium spike. Republicans in the Senate tried to turn the tables and put Democrats on defense by voting on a bill that would have funded the Defense Department. Only the Defense Department through next September. Democrats didn't cave.

[F]

It's always been unacceptable to Democrats to do the defense bill without other bills that have so many things that are important to the American people in terms of healthcare, in terms of housing, in terms of safety. We believe that we need a strong defense, but we believe we need strong, strong health care. We need strong safety for the American people. We need strong programs that help them with so many other issues, mental health and education. And we have always negotiated these bipartisan, these agreements, these appropriations agreements in a bipartisan way. Once again, they're just going at it alone.

[A]

Meanwhile, Republican Speaker Mike Johnson is still refusing to swear in Democratic Representative elect Adelita Grijalva protecting Donald Trump from Grijalva becoming the 218th signature on a discharge petition that will force a vote to make the Justice Department release all the Epstein files, which when it inevitably happens, will bring more attention and questions about Trump's relationship with Epstein and his handling of the Epstein scandal. Today, the top ranking Democrat on the House Oversight Committee, Congressman Robert Garcia, is demanding to know when the Trump Justice Department will produce more Jeffrey Epstein related documents to the committee, including information related to the unpacking unprecedented prison transfer of Ghislaine Maxwell that took place one week after her interview with the Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche. In a letter to Attorney General Pam Bondi today, Garcia writes, quote, I want right to express grave concern about the Department of Justice's ongoing refusal to provide Congress with meaningful information about the Jeffrey Epstein investigation and the deeply troubling reports of preferential treatment for his co conspirator Ghislaine Maxwell. Specifically, I am alarmed by one, DOJ's refusal for nearly two months to provide substantive information regarding progress producing files related to Jeffrey Epstein, and two, the now months long failure by the Federal Bureau of Prisons to respond to urgent and deeply troubling questions concerning the preferential treatment that BOP has accorded to convicted sex offender Ghislaine Maxwell. Taken together, these failures heighten suspicion of a cover up of Epstein related information by the DOJ and the Trump administration. We will not tolerate defiance of lawful congressional subpoenas or any effort by the DOJ to collude with Ghislaine Maxwell to further a cover up. End quote. So the Epstein problem is not going away for Donald Trump. Neither are interesting questions about what happened to the $50,000 in cash that Trump's so called border czar Tom Homan allegedly took from undercover FBI agents recorded on video as part of a sting last year, an investigation that MSNBC reports was recently squashed by Trump's Justice Department. When that reporting first emerged, Tom Homan said he did, quote, nothing criminal, nothing illegal, end quote. But he didn't deny taking the money. Last night. Over three weeks since his appearance on Fox. After MSNBC broke that story, Tom Homan said this. I didn't take $50,000 from anybody. I didn't take $50,000 from anybody. Okay, fair enough. Easy way to verify this. Release a video and someone just tell US where the $50,000 in taxpayer money actually is. But that's exactly the kind of transparency you won't get from a President who's focused on protecting his allies and prosecuting his enemies. Joining me now is Democratic Congressman Eric Swalwell of California. He's a member of the House Judiciary Committee and the House Homeland Security Committee. Congressman, great to see you again. Thanks for being with us today.

[B]

Thank you, Alex. Thanks for having me back.

[A]

You had a great tweet today about Tom Homan. Where's the money, Tom? Simple question. It's my money and your money. It's taxpayer money. It's $50,000. Did he give it back? Did he not take it? Is it in the hands of the FBI? Ironically, Pam Bonney was asked about this at the Senate last week and just refused to answer.

[B]

Where's the money?

[A]

Cash.

[B]

Right, because she said cash note about this case. So where's the money, Tom? And where's the tape? Cash If Cash has the tape and Tom did nothing wrong, just show us the tape. But they won't, Ali, because it's clear that their cover up is a consciousness of guilt. That's how I read it.

[A]

And let's transfer that concept of a cover up over to the non swearing in of the new representative from Arizona. This is wild. First of all, there's no valid reason to not swear her in. The House leader has come up with all sorts of reasons that she needs the pomp and circumstance. She needs this, she needs that. A, that's not true. B, other people have been sworn in when the House, when there's been a shutdown. C, the House isn't in a shutdown. Shutdown itself. So none of this is true.

[B]

It's not true, Ali. And we are in an Epstein shutdown. Mike Johnson has shut down the Congress for almost 30 days because he doesn't want to find out how close Donald Trump is to Jeffrey Epstein. The largest, the biggest, the most notorious child sex trafficker America has ever known. And so who is paying the price? And I just want to give you an example. In my district yesterday, I was talking to a federal worker and he was surprised to see me home. And he said, wait, why aren't you guys in Washington? Because in the last three shutdowns in the last 13 years, we've always been in Washington to find our way out. You're in a pressure cooker. That's how deals happen. The press are there to hold us accountable and they're asking questions. So he was quite alarmed to learn that this is entirely about protecting Donald Trump from Jeffrey Epstein. And so he's not getting paid. Our troops pay continues to be at risk. Health insurance premiums have not been put in place. And November 1st, we're all gonna find out what we're paying next year, month to month, and for what? To protect Donald Trump. So prove to me, Ali, this isn't about protecting the president and his connection to a pedophile.

[A]

So on the discharge petition, on the Epstein stuff, and I don't know how much, how regularly you agree with Marjorie Taylor Greene, but she, she agrees this is an Epstein shutdown. This can't go on forever. At some point, Adelita Grijalva is going to get sworn in. The 218 names will be there, and it's going to have to happen. So I don't really understand the strategy here.

[B]

It's the same thing with the subsidies, right? They're ultimately going to put those subsidies in place because the polling shows it would destroy them in the midterm if they left millions of Americans out to pay 300 to 400% more for their health care. So all they're doing is delaying the inevitable with Epstein because that vote's coming. But let me also share with you, Ali, what a Republican told me. He told me that when that vote happens, it's going to be what's what they call a, quote, jailbreak.

[A]

Right.

[B]

He said, you will see over 100 Republican members vote for it.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Because they know that their constituents are demanding it. So it's all coming out. And the American people shouldn't have to suffer for something that is so inevitable.

[A]

You've been in the House long enough to know that. Again, Mike Johnson is saying that there will be no negotiation because of the shutdown, can't negotiate the subsidies because of the shutdown. Again, not true. There is no prohibition on a member of Congress under any circumstances, anywhere, shutdown or no shutdown, to negotiate with other members of Congress. But the same problem is occurring here, although we're starting to see perhaps a crack on the Senate side. John Thune seems to be suggesting that maybe there can be some discussion about these subsidies. So. So Democrats holding fast seems to be having an effect.

[B]

This is what fighting for the American people looks like. And people for a long time over the last year have asked, you know, where's the fight in the Democratic Party? Where's the messaging? And health care has always been to me, the dance with the one that brought you issue. It's the one that we're trusted on the most. It's why we won the house in 2018. They tried to take it away and Nancy Pelosi led that charge to flip over 40 seats. It's what brought Barack Obama into the presidency. It's our issue. We're trusted on it. We're fighting for people when they need it the most, right before they're going to find out what they're going to pay next year. So I hope my colleagues do not crack.

[A]

Yeah. The bottom line is the best case scenario is your health care costs are going up. The best case scenario is your health care costs, even if you have employer provided insurance, are going up because that's what happens. We haven't dealt with that underlying issue, but for people who get their health care through the ACA exchanges, through Obamacare, it's essentially like throwing them off health care. Technically, it's not because they can pay the 100, 200, 300, 400% increase, but people can't. You can't go from paying $500 a year in insurance to $10,000 a year in insurance, you'll just choose not to be insured.

[B]

And if that is not your scenario, Ali, it's going to be your problem. Because the fewer people who are covered, it means that those with insurance end up having to pay more. So it's in all of our interests that people have accessible, affordable insurance, especially after the president's big brutal bill has already shut down rural hospitals and will take millions of people off Medicaid.

[A]

Congressman, good to have you here tonight. Thanks again for being with us. Congressman Eric Swalwell of California. Coming up, not only is Donald Trump now poised to give twice as much American taxpayer money to make Argentina great again, he's also helping enrich Argentinian farmers at the expense of American farmers. That's next.

[D]

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[I]

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[A]

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[F]

It's perplexing to us that Republicans refuse to spend a dime to protect the health care of the American people. But somehow the Trump administration found $40 billion to bail out a right wing wannabe dictator in Argentina in ways that are also gonna continue to hurt our soybean farmers in Iowa and in the Midwest. That's outrageous. This is corruption in real time.

[A]

Not only is Donald Trump using taxpayer money to bail out one of his buddies, the Argentine president and Mar a Lago visitor Javier Melaye, but he's also made sure through his crazy tariff scheme that Argentina is getting money that would have gone to American farmers. The New York Times reports the humble soybean is in the middle of a geopolitical tangle that spans three continents. At issue is China's enormous appetite for soybeans, millions of tons a year, mainly for cooking oil and livestock feed. China has all but stopped buying American soybeans. Earlier this year, the government in Beijing slapped a hefty tariff on American soybeans in retaliation for hefty U.S. tariffs on Chinese goods. Until then, America had been China's second biggest supplier. But now farmers in the United States have not sold a single bushel to China from this fall's harvest. Argentina sold a mountain of soybeans to China this year after American farmers were locked out, end quote. So Donald Trump is giving $40 billion to a country that is stealing American business from American farmers because of Donald Trump's tariff whims. Politico reports President Donald Trump promised a bailout for farmers reeling from the effects of his tariffs and the high cost for fertilizer and other equipment. But the money hasn't come, and time is running out before farmers have to make crucial decisions about next year's planting season. And for many American farmers, they don't want a bailout. Listen to this soybean farmer. I mean, I want trade, not aid. I need a market. I need a place to sell this stuff. I can work hard enough and make A product. If you'll give me someplace to sell it, I'll take care of myself. I want trade, not aid. I need a market. I need a place to sell this stuff. I can work hard enough and make a product. If you give me some place to sell it, I'll take care of myself. That's what he said. Joining us now is the Democratic Representative Angie Craig of Minnesota. She's a ranking member of the House Agriculture Committee. She's running for the United States Senate in 2026. Representative Craig, good to have you here. Thank you for being with us.

[J]

Good to be here.

[A]

So, a windy road to get to that story, but in the end, I think we sold $13 billion worth of soybeans to China last year. And since the Trump administration has come in, we've sold zero billions of dollars, zero dollars of soybeans to China.

[J]

Actually, it's truly outrageous. Minnesota has already lost about $2 billion in soybean sales. Our family farmers across this country are hurting. Soybean farmers are maybe hurting the worst. But estimates this week are that economic support needed for family farmers as a result of Trump's trade war right now is estimated at $45 billion. And while these numbers are coming out, Donald Trump is writing a check for $40 billion to Argentina. Argentina and Brazil have taken our soybean business. So, look, there's some really pissed off farmers, and they should be very, very angry right now at what is happening with this administration. And we're doing everything we can as the top Democrat on the Ag Committee to fight for these family farmers. As certainly someone now running for the US Senate, I'm going to be fighting across Minnesota to make sure that our farmers somehow are able to recover from what this Trump administration is doing to them.

[A]

Interesting. You brought up Brazil. Brazil didn't have a meaningful export soybean industry to China until the last time. Donald Trump imposed tariffs on China. We created that Brazil is now a massive supplier of soybeans to China. And then we, we had to come up with a bailout, a taxpayer bailout to farmers who had lost that money. So, so we're paying for it. One way or the other, we're paying for it. If Donald Trump feels like he wants to bail out farmers, he could have just avoided this whole tariff nonsense and the bailout to Argentina.

[J]

Well, this has been wholly predictable. I've been saying from day one of this administration that we know how this turns out. And the truth is that the administration also talking about economic assistance to family farmers. And if they don't change the trade policies. We're going to be right back here one year from now. So, I mean, it is, it's outrageous what's happening. Family farmers should be pissed off. And at the end of the day, I want to remind your viewers too, Ali, that 27% of farmers and ranchers in America are, are on the aca. They actually use the Affordable Care Act. And so what's happening in America related to Washington and the fact that my colleagues are out of town, I'm coming to you from Washington because Democrats are here working this week. They need to come back to town so that we can help farm country.

[A]

Interesting point. Not only are they on the AC because they're all small businesses, really, they don't have any other way to get insured, but they're in rural America, which is getting cut health care cuts. I mean, this is impossible if you're a farmer in Minnesota, you can't just decide to go to another place because you can get health care. So across the board, we're hitting them. Important note that that farmer who we just ran some sound of said, I need a market. Once you wreck these markets, they're almost impossible to get back. So thank you for drawing attention to this matter and thank you for being with us tonight.

[J]

Well, you're welcome. And I'd invite your viewers to go to angicraig.com if they want to learn more about the Senate race.

[A]

Representative Angie Craig of Minnesota. We'll be right back. In Titus World, you're hardwired to the feed, a commercial brain implant that allows constant access to the Internet, including a relentless stream of advertisements from birth. When a hacker temporarily disables the feed, Titus is confronted with the realities of apathy, technological reliance and his inability to think critically. That's the premise of this weekend's Velshi Band Book Club feature feed by MT Anderson. Written in 2002, two years before the creation of Facebook feed might be our most alarmingly prescient dystopian feature to date. So I hope you don't miss this meeting and I hope you'll join us Saturday morning at 10am Eastern on Velshi. That is tonight's last word.

[I]

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