The Late Show Pod Show with Stephen Colbert

Episode: Intro Rewind: Ocean Vuong (Extended)
Date: December 31, 2025

Episode Overview

In this extended episode, Stephen Colbert is joined by acclaimed author and poet Ocean Vuong to discuss Vuong’s new novel, The Emperor of Gladness. The conversation explores profound topics like hope, suicide, the American dream, and the role of literature in giving voice to experiences not otherwise spoken. The episode also features a playful segment where Becca quizzes Colbert on Late Show workplace lingo, adding warmth and a behind-the-scenes peek into the show’s culture.

Key Segments & Discussion Points

1. Late Show Vocabulary Game

(03:11–09:46)

• Becca introduces a new segment: staff-submitted words and phrases unique to The Late Show culture, asking Colbert to explain them.
• Memorable Terms:
  • "Brappin on the poof" (03:40–05:03):
    • The phrase used to describe ending a cold open, referencing drummer Joe Saylor’s signature "brap" note and a puff of smoke—a tradition from the earlier days of show tapings and often written on their rewrite room wall.
    • Memorable quote:
      • "Brappin on the poof is... what we call the end of any of the cold opens... when you get to the final joke... Joe Saylor, our drummer, jazz cowboy... goes brap. That's how he starts the song every time." – Stephen Colbert [03:40]
  • "Dollar sign" (05:11–06:18):
    • Used in Late Show scripts to denote a spot where a better joke is needed; "funny is money."
    • Memorable quote:
      • "Dollar sign means we drop a dollar sign into any script where we think we need a better joke in this spot... All you have to do is search for dollar sign and you can find it in the script... because funny is money." – Stephen Colbert [05:14]
  • "Sack, sack, sack, sack, sack" (06:22–09:46):
    • A quirky weekly tradition where staff members each put a dollar in a sack, with a dramatic drawing to pick a winner (and a humorous "loser" first).
    • Colbert shares inside jokes, rituals, and the importance of maintaining tradition.
    • Memorable quote:
      • "On Thursdays, there's a sack on my desk... everybody goes around the building and gets a dollar from everybody... then I pull out who the winning dollar is, and I start it. I always say it has to happen the same way every time. Because I'm a creature, because I'm neurotic, I have to say: sack. Sa. Sack. Sack. Sack." – Stephen Colbert [06:25]

2. Extended Interview with Ocean Vuong

(10:02–18:13)

Introduction

• Stephen Colbert introduces Ocean Vuong as a New York Times bestselling author, National Book Award nominee, and MacArthur "genius" grant winner.
• Vuong’s new novel, The Emperor of Gladness, is celebrated as an instant bestseller and Oprah’s Book Club selection.

The Premise of The Emperor of Gladness

(10:25–12:15)

• The novel opens with a young man contemplating suicide, but stopped by an 82-year-old woman with dementia; they form an unexpected bond over a year.
• Vuong draws from his personal history, including the suicide of his uncle.
• Notable insights:
  • Vuong emphasizes the act of suicide as paradoxically tied to hope:
    • "Suicide is still an act of hope. One does it with the hope of ending tremendous suffering... a hopelessly hopeful act." – Ocean Vuong [10:49]
  • On staging the novel after the “ledge moment”:
    • "Usually stepping away from the bridge happens at the end of a book... What a wonderfully tense and capacious way to start a book. To ask, what does day two look like for someone who chooses to live, God willing, despite not having the ability to do so?" – Ocean Vuong [11:37]

Kindness Without Hope & American Dreams

(12:15–13:44)

• The protagonist works in a fast-food restaurant; Vuong reflects on his own experience at Boston Market.
• Vuong distinguishes between the “American Dream” and “Americans who dream”:
  • "I'm not interested so much in the American dream as we know it, so much as Americans who dream…in every fast food restaurant you see, it's full of people with dreams. Despite not being able to execute them, they still hold onto them and they strive towards it." – Ocean Vuong [13:15]
• He highlights the acts of kindness among coworkers knowing there may be no “afterplace.”

The Role of Hope

(13:44–15:03)

• Colbert asks if dreams constitute an unconscious form of hope.
• Vuong frames hope as the “North Star” and a teacher’s job to “push the horizon back” for students.
• The classroom is depicted as “a laboratory of possibility.”
• Notable exchange:
  • "Hope is still the greatest engine. And it begins with language. It's not empty... a classroom is the most hopeful place. Even before a single person steps into it... the condition of the classroom is aspirational." – Ocean Vuong [14:15]
  • "Cynicism masquerades as wisdom." – Stephen Colbert [15:00]
  • "Often cynicism can be misread as intelligence in our culture. And hope is often the most courageous thing because it means you’re all in…" – Ocean Vuong [14:43]

On Being a Fool and Artistic Risk

(15:03–15:44)

• Colbert quotes E.E. Cummings, which leads to an exchange about their shared birthday (October 14th).
• Vuong:“Everything worth doing risks being foolish.” [15:03]

Oprah’s Book Club and Vietnamese American Representation

(15:44–18:13)

• Vuong describes hearing Oprah’s voice as transformative, tying it to daily life at his mother’s nail salon.
• He honors talk shows for democratizing access to culture:
  • "To bring cultural work to the center of people and say, you have permission to access this discourse… it brought the idea of culture and widened it into a town square. And that town square happened to be in the middle of a nail salon in Hartford County. What luck." – Ocean Vuong [17:22]

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On the risk of hope and foolishness:
  • "The worst thing, you know, to be in our culture is a fool. But everything worth doing risks being foolish." – Ocean Vuong [15:03]
• On the meaning of hope:
  • "Hope is still the greatest engine. And it begins with language." – Ocean Vuong [14:15]
  • "Cynicism masquerades as wisdom." – Stephen Colbert [15:00]
• On the power of cultural democratization:
  • "Talk shows in general... bring culture to working people. Because a book... still takes eight, ten hours to read. People like my mother worked... 8am to 8 at night... what was beautiful for me was that it brought the idea of culture and widened it into a town square." – Ocean Vuong [16:54 & 17:40]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 03:11–09:46 — Late Show Lingo Game (Brappin on the poof, Dollar sign, Sack tradition)
• 10:02 — Begin Extended Ocean Vuong Interview
• 10:39 — Vuong describes novel’s premise and personal history
• 12:15 — Kindness without hope, fast-food work, and dreaming
• 14:15 — The meaning and risk of hope; teacher’s role in hope
• 15:00–15:03 — "Cynicism masquerades as wisdom" exchange
• 15:44 — Oprah’s Book Club's impact on Vuong and his community

Tone & Language

• The conversation blends Stephen Colbert’s characteristic warmth and wit with Ocean Vuong’s thoughtful, poetic reflections.
• The episode shifts seamlessly between playful insider anecdotes and deep meditations on life, literature, and hope.

Conclusion

This episode stands out for its mix of late-night humor and literary gravitas. The playful lingo game provides an insider’s look at The Late Show’s culture, while Ocean Vuong’s interview is moving, insightful, and rich with reflections on hope, loss, and what it means to dream in America. It’s a must-listen for fans of the show, lovers of literature, or anyone seeking wisdom on finding light in dark places.