Ari Lennox Sparks A Convo: Independent Women vs. Male Ego: Who’s Really the Problem?

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Independent Women vs. Male Ego: Who’s Really the Problem?"

The Latest with Loren LoRosa
Host: Loren LaRosa (The Black Effect Podcast Network & iHeartPodcasts)
Air Date: April 7, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into one of the most contentious and relatable issues in relationships today: the dynamic between independent, accomplished women and male ego. Host Loren LaRosa, joined by show producer Brandon and caller Shamika, breaks down how modern women’s success often triggers insecurity in men, the ways both sides struggle with asking for or accepting help, and how unlearning old patterns is crucial for healthy, lasting love.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Ari Lennox “Poor Minds” Interview Sparks Debate

[04:00]

• Loren introduces a conversation Ari Lennox had on the Poor Minds podcast about how her ambition and achievements are often a “deterrent” to men she dates.
• Ari realized men “minimized her accomplishments” and even avoided celebrating her success—prompting a broader debate about what men are really drawn to.

Notable Quote:

• “I thought that would be attractive…None of [the men] would ever, ever talk about how exciting it is that I have invested in properties…All my accomplishments were minimized.” — Ari Lennox clip [04:24]

2. Caller Shamika Shares Personal Experience with Intimidated Men

[07:00]

• Shamika, a successful, independent entrepreneur and CNA, recounts dating a man who eventually pulled away, citing “you don’t need me.”
• She observes that while she’s not “falling out of control,” her drive still made a man who had his own accomplishments feel inadequate.

Notable Exchange:

• Shamika: “He was a homeowner, veteran dental assistant…He said it wasn’t me. So that’s why I said it’s the state of mind.” [09:24]
• Loren: “Did you find yourself not depending on him—even for small things—like asking for help?”
• Shamika: “I never asked him for help…never.” [11:32]

3. Brandon Offers a Male Perspective on Money, Ego, and Emotion

[12:18]

• Brandon points out how men’s finances are tightly linked to their emotions and sense of worth.
• He explains that when men feel unable to provide or “keep up,” they may end relationships rather than communicate financial struggles.

Notable Quote:

• “Our finances directly correlate to our emotions and our ego.” — Brandon [12:18]
• “If a man starts beating you out of nowhere, he just went broke…” [12:20]

4. The Challenge of Accepting Help as Independent Women

[15:32]

• Loren reveals her own struggles with being vulnerable and asking for help, even in a supportive relationship.
• She acknowledges her upbringing and life experiences shaped her independence to the extent that even when she wants a partner, it’s hard to “let him in.”

Notable Moment:

• “I literally had to have a conversation recently where I was like, I want you to know I don’t know how to ask you for help. So…don’t expect me to always know how.” — Loren [15:32]

5. The “Accomplishments Don’t Attract Men” Debate

[19:16]

• Brandon argues that, contrary to popular belief, men don’t value women’s success and assets the way women think—emphasizing, instead, companionship and personality.
• Loren and Shamika counter that women face social scrutiny for dating “below their level” in a way men don’t.

Notable Quotes:

• “Men build attractiveness by their success and money…but for some reason, women think it’s the same for them. It’s not.” — Brandon [20:15]
• “Men will go find a girl with nothing but one pair of panties and build her under the bridge.” — Loren [19:36]

6. Deeper Patterns: Projection, Insecurity, and Toxic Dynamics

[26:23]

• Loren highlights a cycle: accomplished women often insist on being self-reliant as a shield against future manipulation or feeling controlled—especially by equally “accomplished” men.
• Brandon points out he’s seen successful women look down on men who aren’t as accomplished, and admits he understands why some men fear that scenario.

7. Thrill-Seeking vs. Seeking Peace in Relationships

[29:13]

• The trio discusses the “good guy vs. bad guy” trope, with Loren reflecting on her younger days craving drama, but now preferring stability.
• Brandon notes that women’s desire for “thrill” can often mask underlying self-worth issues.

Notable Quotes:

• “You can get you somebody that'll sit with you...It’s not about ‘good guy boring, bad guy thrilling,’ it’s about what am I attracted to and what does that say about myself?” — Loren [29:03]
• “The thrill fades as you mature—you start to value peace.” — Brandon [30:14]

8. Self-Sabotage and Learning to Enjoy Healthy Love

[32:57]

• Loren describes her own ongoing journey to not sabotage good relationships by always bracing for disappointment.
• Both hosts emphasize unlearning dysfunction modeled in childhood or past relationships.

Notable Quotes:

• “A good man doesn’t mean he’s a perfect man…it just means he’s a good man. His character is good…But I also have to trust it.” — Loren [32:57]

9. Wrap Up and Shamika’s Final Thoughts

[21:01]

• Shamika’s closing advice: “Just be yourself when it comes to dating…Don’t let anybody, you know, don’t try to get validation from anyone…What’s for you, is for you.”

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Memorable Moments & Quotes

• “It’s all about an individual state of mind, ultimately.” — Shamika [08:20]
• “Sometimes…the place I put myself in mentally…I always have to talk myself back off the ledge.” — Loren [34:57]
• “There's no right answer, it’s constant learning.” — Brandon [35:28]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [04:00] Ari Lennox’s perspective: women’s success as a “deterrent” in dating
• [07:00] Shamika’s real-life story of male intimidation and independence
• [12:18] Men’s emotions and ego as shaped by finances
• [15:32] Loren on the difficulty of vulnerability and asking for help
• [19:16] The debate over what men actually value in women
• [26:23] Why accomplished women stay guarded (“bunker mentality”)
• [29:13] Bad boys, thrill vs. peace, and adult relationship evolution
• [32:57] Self-sabotage and embracing healthy love

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Conclusion

The episode offers a raw, unfiltered look at the enduring tension between independent women and the male ego—with all parties agreeing that deeper conversations, self-awareness, and healthier emotional habits are the only way forward. Loren champions vulnerability, Brandon exposes the emotional wiring behind male behavior, and Shamika encourages listeners to know their worth and avoid seeking external validation. Above all, this episode is a candid reminder that love—for both men and women—requires unlearning, relearning, and a willingness to be both strong and soft.

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Transcript

[Lauren LaRosa]

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[Lauren LaRosa]

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[Brandon]

Whether you calling the wise women in your life, video calling your girlfriends across the country, or checking in on someone who always knows how to make you smile, Staying connected matters those small conversations, shared laughs and quick hellos are what keep relationships strong, even when life gets busy.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Some of the most life giving conversations

[Brandon]

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[Lauren LaRosa]

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[Brandon]

You know she don't lie about that, right?

[Commercial Announcer]

Lauren came in hot.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Hey, y'.

[Shamika]

All.

[Lauren LaRosa]

What's up? It's Lauren LaRosa, and this is your daily dig on all things pop culture, entertainment news, and all of the conversations that shake the room, baby. So on this episode, we are getting to the listeners. This is on the Line with Lauren the Rosa. We've done this before, but it was some time ago, and you guys loved it, so we are bringing it back. And here with me for this segment, we have Brandon.

[Brandon]

Nice to see y' all again. Thank you for having me back.

[Lauren LaRosa]

I'm excited. You know your timeline here. It's my timeline. You're the one who told Michelle Obama to show.

[Brandon]

Yo, see, you made the people hate me first. I thought we could move all the heavy.

[Lauren LaRosa]

You guys will remember Brandon.

[Brandon]

I thought they didn't remember me the first time.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So you guys will remember Brandon from him telling Michelle Obama.

[Brandon]

That's crazy. I did not know.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So disrespectful like that is actually, like, just even saying that. I feel like I'm like, this. Dishonoring the country.

[Brandon]

Said no such thing.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Okay, well, okay, so we're going to get into it this episode. We want to talk about a few different things. I feel like there's always these very healthy and sometimes unhealthy conversations between men and women. And recently, my girl Ari Lennox sat down with the Poor Minds podcast. Everybody in the room, I just love them. I love the Poor Mind podcast host. I love Ari Lennox. So great combination. Great conversation. But they sat down and they talked a bit about how when you're a woman with things, when you come to the table with things, how men, Brandon, how y' all receive it?

[Brandon]

Explain things, though. You mean like assets, success?

[Lauren LaRosa]

Well, we'll let. We'll let. We'll let the clip explain it. So you guys take a. Take a. Listen to this clip. All of these ambitious goals of mine that I've been able to achieve. I thought that would be attractive. And in meeting men and dating a lot of successful men, none of them would ever, ever talk about how exciting it is that I have invested in properties or would ever even want to come to see my house. All my accomplishments were minimized. Just realizing, wow, I think it deters them. It does. It intimidates them. I agree with that. Cause I used to feel that way, too. Like, I used to think, he gonna care that I got my degree. He don't care that I'm. He don't care that I got my own shit. I pay my own bills. No, men do not care about that. I always say, just get rid of your shit. Cause they like girls. Without him, it's so crazy. Cause it really is hard to find a man that can just really support you and be happy and be like, look at my girl. Like, you think that everybody wants to praise Jay Z and Beyonce, but a lot of y' all could not be Jay Z sitting there in the crowd cheering for her like that. They can'.

[Shamika]

That's.

[Lauren LaRosa]

And Jay Z be like this. And y' all be praising. Yeah, but y' all not Beyonce. Okay, but you not Jay Z either. So we are going to get into it. We have a caller on the line. We solicited some callers. We have a caller on the line, and we'll engage in the conversation as well, too. All right? And we want to see you guys in the comments or on social, if you are listening. Lauren LaRosa everywhere. L R E N L O R O S hey. So let's get the caller on the line.

[Shamika]

Hello.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Hey, how are you?

[Shamika]

Hey, how are you?

[Lauren LaRosa]

I'm doing good. I heard you want to talk to me about some things.

[Shamika]

I do. Thank you for giving me the time of the day.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Yes. And Brandon's here as well, too, our producer for the segment.

[Shamika]

I'm excited. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So you are now on the line with Lauren LaRosa. This is a new segment that we're implementing within the podcast, and you've been listening to the podcast. You're one of the lowriders.

[Shamika]

I have, I have.

[Lauren LaRosa]

How long you been.

[Shamika]

Congratulations. Recently. But I've been following you forever. But I've been tuning into your podcast. Congratulations on your one year and black girl power. I love it. I love it.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Thank you. Well, look, speaking of black girl magic and brown girl grinds in power, Ari Lennox sat down with the host of Poor Minds podcast and had a conversation about, you know, just how it is having all that power. And when you come to the table dating with all that power, I know you got a chance to take a look at the clip. What did you. What did you think about it? Have you ever experienced that?

[Shamika]

I did. You know what? I do have an example. I was getting to know a gentleman, and everything was well. He didn't have anything negative to say about me. We clicked. We had a great connection. But he made a comment. He was like, you don't need me. And so that. I'm like, I don't need you. You know, And I didn't get it. But reflecting on it, in hindsight, I just feel like that can be intimidating if you're doing your thing. And I'm not falling out of control by far, but I do have great things going for myself. I am determined. I'm making moves. Yes, that in itself can be intimidating to a guy. You know what I'm saying? Just depending on their head. You know, head frame. Their way of thinking and doing things and maneuvering if they don't feel like they measure up are good enough. But, yeah, it just. Every guy is different. Some men, it's like, hey, you got to bring to the table what I'm able to bring to the table. It's all about an individual state of mind, ultimately. But, yeah, that was my experience. And he. He did get married and had a baby recently. And I'm like, okay, okay.

[Lauren LaRosa]

I was gonna ask, you know, you

[Shamika]

said he needed him, and that worked for him, but I don't. I was raised not to need anyone.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So you guys.

[Shamika]

So I'm very independent, but I am in my soft girl era, and I'm gonna accomplish things and do things. So I think it's unfortunate, but. And you can miss out on your blessing. I don't get it. But this was just one date. I'm still trying to maneuver through it, but I thought that was. That was something. When I took a look at the clip, and I'm like, wow. You know, even she is as successful as she is. She's struggling with men. That's on her level.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So you guys only went on one date?

[Shamika]

Oh, no.

[Lauren LaRosa]

You guys only went on one date?

[Shamika]

No, we went on multiple dates and really got to know each other. And I would say a good two months in.

[Brandon]

Okay, what made him say that? Like, he saw what a car, your house, or what made him. Do you feel like God made him feel intimidated?

[Shamika]

I have a. I live in a townhouse. Nothing immaculate, you know, nice. I don't have a flashy car. You know, I'm not driving anything flashy. I don't know. And he was a homeowner, veteran dental assistant. You know, he had great things going for himself. He was a single father of three. Great dad. I have no idea. I mean, he just spoke positive things about me. He said it wasn't me. So that's Why? I said it's the state of mind. But it had to be something that he saw that was like, you know, what, this,

[Brandon]

what was your interactions like? Were you like trying to fix him or something? Or were you telling him he needs to do this, this and this with his life? Like, what were your interactions like? Nothing like that.

[Shamika]

Nothing like that. I mean, we would, we would go to lunch, we would do next break, we would have great conversations, we would be on the phone for hours. I. Your guess is as good as mine. Like I said, he was a homeowner, very responsible. He was a single. He was a single father of three boys. Very great with them making moves on it, you know, on its own.

[Lauren LaRosa]

I have a question. What do you do for work? Or like, what is your.

[Shamika]

So I'm a certified nursing assistant and entrepreneur, so I work for myself. I have a private client that I work with and I do well with, you know, with that and I have my mix it up brand. But yeah, I mean, I'm nothing over the top or crazy were there ever.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So because you're an entrepreneur and it seems like you're very goal oriented, did you find yourself at any point ever just naturally not. Not depending on him for things like, just small things, like needing your car washed. He's there, even letting them take the trash out, going to him about things that you need and help with. Like how. How good were you at saying I need help?

[Shamika]

I. I never asked him for help. I never asked him for any help.

[Brandon]

Honestly, I still don't think that's the reason to leave though.

[Shamika]

The only thing that I can think of, Lauren, is maybe like, because he was a single father of three and a homeowner, his money wasn't. He did make that known. His money wasn't where it needed to be.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Okay, hold on real quick. Don't even continue. Can I just say right here, that and Brandon is the man in the room. What I've learned about men is instead of just saying, I'm not in a space to like, receive all of this right now. You guys will want to stick around. We'll do the things. And then it's like, now we're trying to figure out what we did wrong when realistically, you guys are just not good at being like, not right now either. For finance, especially if it's a financial reason.

[Brandon]

Yeah, I mean, that our finances directly correlate to, like, our emotions, your emotion and your ego. I seen a meme the other day was like, if a man starts beating you out of, out of nowhere, he just went broke. I think we'll.

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[Lauren LaRosa]

Hey, y', all, what's up? It's Lauren LaRosa. And you know I give you your daily dig on all things pop culture, entertainment news, and all of the conversations that shake the room, baby. And for me to give you all the factual content when I get into the details. I gotta make some phone calls. I'm calling lawyers, attorneys, managers, publicists. Shoot, I'll even call your mama if she's the person that's gonna give me the exclusive I need. But did you know that 2026 will mark the 150th anniversary of the first ever phone call? It took place on March 10, 1876. And from the call that sparked it all to the first long distance phone lines, the first line across America, the first line across the Atlantic, the first round the world call, the first commercial cell Service, the first 911 system. AT&T has been connecting people for 150 years in so many different ways. I'm just happy that somebody's going to answer the phone because how else would I bring y' all the news all up in the people business. But they answer. Thank you. AT&T. Connecting changes everything.

[Shamika]

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[Lauren LaRosa]

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[Shamika]

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[Shamika]

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[Brandon]

Do our best in that situation. Like, we'll continue to date, see if we can really handle it. And if we can't, it's like, ah, yeah, I gotta cut ties. Like, if we can't, you know, keep up or we feel like we're drowning in this situation because finances, I can't take you out as much as you would like, or you want to go on a trip. A dude would start an argument if you, if you start bringing up trips, My count is in the negative.

[Lauren LaRosa]

I'm out of that phase of my life. Okay? I'm in a very good, you know, my man does very well for. He takes very good care of me.

[Brandon]

That's great.

[Lauren LaRosa]

But. But learning partnership is a thing. And that's why I asked you that, Shamika, because, like, I've always been. I didn't realize until I got what a person who is, like, able to do and not even just financially, but just like, because he's, you know, we're both in very good places in our career and like, even though we're still building, we're. We're in spaces where, like, we can do for each other. I'm not used to having that. I'm used to being a person that does everything for everybody in my businesses and my work life. I literally had to have a conversation recently where I was like, I want you to know I don't know how to ask you for help. So, like, when I say to you that, like, you know, I might get mad and be like, I don't need you. And it's like, no, I really do. I'm just upset. Upset that I don't know how to tell you that and that you don't just naturally know to, like, see that in me. And I was like, that's not fair. So I had to have a conversation with him and be like, I don't even know how to tell you I need you sometimes. So, like, I don't want. Because he was like, well, am I supposed to, like, read your mind? And I'm like, I don't want you to read my mind. But, like, then I started thinking about it. I'm like, how can you even answer that? Like, I don't want you to read my mind. But what, Lauren? Like, it's either you do or you don't. So I had to be real with myself and be like, okay, because I've never seen a woman really rely on a man. I've never had men in my life that I could like, fully, solely 100 rely on. But I'm telling God, like, Okay, I want a partner. I want someone whose vision I can trust. I want to, you know, I'm telling God all that. Then this person is brought into my life and I'm like, girl, you in your own way, like, you're. It's like you're moving a goal post and you're setting a. Like a. A finish line that he doesn't even know is there.

[Brandon]

Well, you know what? That's not your fault if you had to do that, because essentially whatever task needs to be done, so you had to take that role. But I think if you are a man that is fit to lead, you're going to earn it regardless, you know what I mean? So I don't even think you should, like, I don't think you should have left you. Shamika, by the way,

[Lauren LaRosa]

Listen, if you think you lonely now, you shouldn't be. That's what

[Brandon]

I mean. If he was, like, fit to lead, he would have, you know, eventually earned it. Naturally.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Yeah, figured it out.

[Brandon]

Well, yeah, figured it out, you know, but I was able to take out the trash. He would do that on his own. And just like, you know, I use

[Lauren LaRosa]

that as, like, a surface level thing because I think sometimes with women, like, you know, taking it back to what Arlenex said, right? Like, she was saying how, like, she keeps meeting men that she's so secure in herself that they don't even, like, they don't like her because of it, sometimes you do meet men who are just jealous of the women that they encounter. That is a thing for real. Like, that happens. But I think sometimes if we are looking deeper into it and looking at, like, where both of us come in, I think everybody has these insecurities around being wanted and needed, but none of us ever want to admit it.

[Brandon]

Can we talk real quick, though? Because you think him approaching and texting Ari Lennox and being on the phone and dating, he didn't know who Ari Lennox was and he didn't expect her to have her.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Let me tell you, some. Some men get off on. I've conquered a woman like Ari Lennox, and I can make a woman like Ari Lennox question herself. And women I like, I literally tell, like. Like, I have so many homegirls that are like. Like out here, like, when I say, like, killing it, I mean killing it. But there are men in their lives. And I'm like, you don't see the pattern? Like, this man gets off on making you feel like you are not who you show up every day to the world to be. And there are men because. And I don't think that it's like, all men are horrible. And that's why I think men have their own insecurities. I think men have their own trauma that makes that okay in their mind, and it's not okay. I don't think no woman should stick around for that. Vice versa, too. I know women who, like, they need to date men who are doing less than them. And I was like, at one point, I thought I was gonna end up like that.

[Brandon]

I think women think that all those accomplishments is gonna make her more attractive, and it doesn't. I think men don't care.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Let's get into that.

[Brandon]

I don't. I don't think men care. Yeah, as long as you like taking care of yourself, you're not like, I guess, bleeding us dry, essentially. Like, I don't think men really care about, like, I don't think y' all don't.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Y' all go find a woman, become

[Brandon]

a baddie because he affiliated.

[Lauren LaRosa]

That means men will go find a girl with nothing but one pair of panties, and we'll build her under the bridge.

[Brandon]

But she bad, y'.

[Commercial Announcer]

All.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Would y' all do anything? Men literally do anything.

[Brandon]

But why not anything? If she's a nice lady and she's.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Because for a woman. Because I think it's the stereotype. Because. Because for a woman. Shemeka, you can assess to this too. For a woman, if you are a woman that has your job, she mean, you said, you know, you got your town home, so you a homeowner, you got your car, you're comfortable in your life. If you bring anybody that is other than what you can equally doing for yourself. You hear from friends, family, like, they're confused why that you're even dating that person. A man doesn't get that.

[Brandon]

I think off my point a little bit. My point more so is that men build attractive by their success and. And money and stuff like that. And I think for some reason women think it's the same for them, but it's not. I don't think men care. Some do, obviously, but I don't think for the most part, like, we're looking for.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So what are y' all looking for? Because when we say it's just the physical, then I mean, yeah, it's not.

[Brandon]

The physical is a big thing for men, but, like, the companionship. Can I hang out with you and

[Lauren LaRosa]

really be so who you are as a person?

[Brandon]

Yeah, I think we care much more about that.

[Shamika]

Really.

[Brandon]

You. You've seen other people.

[Lauren LaRosa]

I'm joking. I'm Joking. I'm joking. Shameika, you still there?

[Shamika]

I'm here.

[Lauren LaRosa]

We just wanted to say thank you for calling in and sharing your story and, you know, add into the conversation. Did you have anything else that you wanted to add? You know, just in what we were talking about.

[Shamika]

So, yeah, I definitely. Brandon, you highlighted some things. Lauren, you highlighted some things. But ultimately, just be yourself when it comes to dating. The person that gets you will get you. You know what I'm saying? And don't let anybody, you know, don't get. Try to get validation from anyone. You know what I'm saying? The gentleman that I was talking about, guess what? He married a young lady that worked with him. They had a baby together. So what's for you is for you. And that's about it. I love these healthy dialogues and seeing both aspects of it from a man and a woman, and that's a part of my brand as well. Mix it up at my battle of the sexist game. So, yeah, where can people get your

[Lauren LaRosa]

game and where can they follow your brand? Mix it up for these conversations. And I know you said you do events too. Where can they follow you to find out more information?

[Shamika]

Sure. So mix it up. Game time on Instagram. Shamika Life on Instagram. And the website is www.mixitupgame.com.

[Lauren LaRosa]

got you.

[Brandon]

And Shamika's DMs are open, am I right? Shout out to Instagram.

[Lauren LaRosa]

She ain't say no either.

[Shamika]

What God has for me, God has for me. I'm definitely. I'm open. And it's funny that we're speaking about Ari because she was on. On Instagram Live last week promoting for her tour vacancy, I think. Stephen. Is that what it is?

[Lauren LaRosa]

Yeah.

[Shamika]

And I told her the album. Yes. I gotta catch her when she comes to Atlanta or Charlotte. But I told her, I said, I can matchmake you. And she was like, what's this sign? I said, Libra. She said, I could deal with a Libra. They. They're liars, but I'll give it a roll. So I'm putting that out in the universe. Maybe I can help Ms. Lennox with her. With her true love. So I'm open. And yeah, I'll vouch for the Libras, you know, go through with it.

[Brandon]

Okay. Thank you, Shamika.

[Shamika]

Thank y' all so much, Brandon and Lauren, I had a great time. Thank you. Later.

[Commercial Announcer]

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[Lauren LaRosa]

Friday.

[Commercial Announcer]

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[Lauren LaRosa]

under 13 day or night. VRBO Care is here 247 to help make every part of your stay seamless. If anything comes up or you simply need a little guidance, support is ready whenever you reach out. From the moment you book to the moment you head home. We're here to help things run smoothly because a great trip starts with the right support. And hey, a good playlist doesn't hurt either. On the Serving Pancakes podcast, conversations about volleyball go beyond the court. Today we have a little best friend compatibility test. Okay, how long have we been best friends for? Since the day we met. As the League1 volleyball season heads towards its final stretch, there's no better time to tune in. We really are like yin and yang, vodka and tequila. You'll hear unfiltered analysis, behind the scenes stories and conversations with leaders making an impact across the sport. Today we have Logan Lednecki. I feel like our fan base in general is very connected. It's like a comforting feeling getting to play at home. Whether you're following the final push of Love Season or just love the game, serving Pancakes brings you closer to the action and the people shaping the future of volleyball. Jordan Thompson had that microphone out. God forbid we make mistakes or cuss at our coach.

[Shamika]

Like when talking.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Open your free iHeartradio app, search serving Pancakes and listen. Now. This has been Serving Pancakes and we'll catch you on the flip side, okay? Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports, WSECU isn't just one of Washington's best credit unions. We're a Forbes Best in State five years running. Why? Because we put you first. Lower fees, early paydays, financial guidance and service second to none. As a member owned cooperative, we love Washington as much as you do. From the Olympic mountains to the rolling palooz. Join us and discover how much we care about your financial well being. Because what we really do best is invest in you. Visit wsecu.org today to learn more. Washington let's Credit union. It's crazy though that we're at the age now where, like, I think it's just, like, even if men can go grab a woman with nothing, and y' all love to do that, Substance matters.

[Brandon]

Yeah.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Like, what I'm hearing from you, even though I was like, fake surprise. It do be surprising though, like, because there are a lot of men who, like, substance does not matter. It's all about the look. And a lot of times Ari Lennox is talking about experiencing men with things that don't. Like women who come to the table with things. Child, try experiencing men with things who want to control you because of those things. Like, so many women operate from a place of, like, I'm a show you. I don't need you because I don't want you to manipulate me. It's sad. It's not even like, a thing of, like, the man doesn't want you to have things or whatever. It's like a defense. Like, just in case you ever try. I'm gonna make sure I got my own. And the type of love that I always want to be in and experience. Especially, like, talking about marriage and stuff. I never want to feel like that.

[Brandon]

Yeah.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Like, I never want to plan for, like, you know, let me. Let me go build my bunker over here in case the war go down over there. You know what I'm saying? But, like, that happens too, with, like, men that are successful and that come with their own things as well.

[Brandon]

And on the flip side, I have seen where, like, very successful women do talk down on. And I'm not talking all.

[Lauren LaRosa]

No, I had to get better about that.

[Brandon]

They do talk down on a man that's not doing as well as them. And obviously, like I said, says not all women, but I have seen those cases, and I feel like I can understand a man that doesn't want to be in that situation.

[Lauren LaRosa]

That's true. And even I feel like, too, like, what I've had to gather my lips to shut up and not happen is I think sometimes when you're so used to being, like, the person that everybody goes to for everything or whatever, your attitude is so much like, but who gonna check me, boo?

[Brandon]

Yeah.

[Lauren LaRosa]

And then you meet somebody that, like, y' all should be. It's. It's checks and balances across the board. And it just. You. You just have to learn a whole new way of life, vice versa. But it sounds like an Ari situation. Whoever she was sitting down with is a little toxic, and I don't know why. All right. I love you, sis. Every guy that is just always so

[Brandon]

toxic that she meets.

[Lauren LaRosa]

It sounds like it.

[Brandon]

She. She says she gets bored of the nice guys.

[Lauren LaRosa]

She did, Ari.

[Brandon]

She did another clip.

[Lauren LaRosa]

I know you're gonna see.

[Brandon]

Yeah, she should have said that.

[Lauren LaRosa]

I know you're gonna see this, right? And I know she was explaining more about the. The guy that she had talked about while she was on the Breakfast Club and people were pissed off about her too, and that was a toxic situation as well. But, Eric, all right, when you see this, what I had to learn was it's not about like, good guy, boring, bad guy, not boring. It's about like, all right, what am I attracted to? Why am I attracted to it? And what does that say about myself? Because you can find somebody that, like, you not going to play around with and he don't have to be super toxic either. Like what?

[Brandon]

Sorry, go ahead.

[Lauren LaRosa]

No, that. That I'm just. Because. Because I think a lot of women, especially the younger you are, that's your mindset. It's like, I want to run around with the bad guy. And it's like, no, you can get you somebody that'll sit.

[Brandon]

You sound like she still needs some, you know, amount of that thrill. So I would suggest just getting you a nice guy that could still fulfill some of that excitement and thrill somehow.

[Lauren LaRosa]

But you know what I learned when the time that I was single from my last relationship that I was in for a super long time to like being by myself, what I learned was that the need for that thrill, or not even need for the thrill, because you can have thrill in a person. If you're attracted to a person, things are going to bring you through, right? That I feel like we. As we met, when we say stuff like that, we mask it as, oh, my God, I need that thrill or I need him to be rough or I need this. And it's like, no, you don't understand that you're worth enough for someone to treat you good. You think that that thrill, that excitement, it. It.

[Commercial Announcer]

There.

[Lauren LaRosa]

There's something that it like, brings in you and it's a feeling it brings in you. But like, to be honest, like, when I started thinking back about like the people that I was dealing with and why and the things that I like them for, I'm like, dang, what do I think about myself?

[Brandon]

So I've. I've had this conversation with some female friends and it seems like, especially when they hit like 30s, when they get more mature, they more so want piece. But what, like, I want to hear, like, what your point of view is, like, what kind of like Changes. And what do you replace that, what you're seeking for?

[Lauren LaRosa]

It doesn't. When you meet the right person, it doesn't replace, like, it's still there. That whole, like, you know, for me, I definitely, like, I'm not for everybody. Like, I need somebody that's going, you know, get with me a little bit, you know, my mouth a little crazy sometimes. I also want somebody that, like, you know, I can take around my family, my friends and, you know, where I'm from and all that. And they're comfortable. So, like, cut from a certain cloth is. Is definitely like, you know what I want. But at the same time, like, I thought. I remember being younger and thinking it was just like, I thought that it was so attractive that, like, I'm arguing and I gotta. You're cheating and you're. It's like, okay, it's the bad boy. That is the stupidest thing ever. Like, I.

[Brandon]

It is. But I get it also, because some people come from that world where it's like, if you don't care, you're quiet, you yelling and showing some passion and some means you care.

[Lauren LaRosa]

But if you with a person, y' all gonna yell about something. And the yelling, true, but the yelling can happen. I don't want to yell about, are you cheating on me? I don't want to put my body safety at harm. I don't want to raise my kids in a household where they're used to seeing their dad treat me like, you know, ways that I don't want my daughters to be treated like. It's so much things now that I think about. I'm like, yo, you. That was crazy. Like, you. You thought that, like, that meant, like, that you had that man feeling a certain way. No, if you really had that man feeling a certain way, it wouldn't even feel good to him to hurt you. Yeah, because the yelling, and that's what I'm saying, like, that whole passion and the thrill and like, whatever, that's going to come in so many other ways other than he treats you horribly or he's putting his own life at risk trying to figure out certain things or whatever. Like, that thrill comes so many. Oh, my man. That. That thrill comes so many different ways in so many different, like, things. Once you really find and lock in with a person and once you emotionally mature. But like, man, I Sometimes I think back, even I watch old Breakfast Club segments when I was, like, single, and I was like, just like, not too long ago, and I'll be sitting there like, like, what. What was my Mind state about myself at that time.

[Brandon]

Yeah. I don't know. I think it was you talking about it, and maybe we could wrap it up with this. But you were talking about how you accept good thing things. Like, you. Sorry. You were talking about how you don't want to mess up. Like, you have a good man. You know what I'm talking about? Yeah, you have a good man. Like, how do you not, like, mess it up? Because.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Yeah, because sabotage. Because I'm so used to, like, bullshit. And what I realize is everybody comes with their shit. Like, a good man. Doesn't mean he's a perfect man. It just means he's a good man. His character is good. I know he's going to treat me good. I can trust that. But I also have to trust it. So for me, it was like. And even now, like, sometimes it's any little thing, I'm like, oh, nope. See, that's why I got my own. And I'm trying to, like, really teach myself to not be that way. Because I feel like you. You take away from your experience. Like, it's. It's like if you're outside in the summertime, 90 degrees, it's not supposed to rain, but you're anticipating rain, so you outside, all bundled up, hot walking, like you're not getting to experience the full summer day. Like, think about that, right? Because I'm really trying to explain, like, sometimes, like, the place I put myself in mentally. And I always have to talk myself back off the ledge because even my crash out around it, it'd be like. And it's like, yo, you just did all of that. And it's like, why? So I think there are men and women. I know men who have experienced this too. But I think that that's a. That's also something that, like, you realize not even as you get older, just as you get away from certain things and you see people in, like, good situations. Like, I always thought, like, I. I didn't know people who were happily married. For real. For real. Like, maybe only a few of them, but not no young people. I have, like, one, maybe two young couples that are happily married, too, that I can think of right now. Other than that, I. You know, my friends that have kids, like, you know, it's not like you're married. You're happy and kids are blessings. But, like, what I saw wasn't what I wanted.

[Brandon]

Yeah.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So I just was doing what I knew. You know what I mean? And then I realized, I'm like, girl, you gonna. You're never gonna Enjoy that summer day like this, you. And then you're gonna run that man away, even though he not perfect too. You're gonna run him away. Like, I. I don't want to be the reason that, like, I mess up something good. If it's not meant to be, it's not meant to be, but I don't want to cause the issue.

[Brandon]

I recently too, learned something I have to unlearn with, like, just not being so comfortable, like, arguing all the time, like, trying to, like, talk it out more. Because I kind of grew up in a house where, like, my parents, like, would argue, but they're really homies. They know each other since, like, high school.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So they were like, at the end

[Brandon]

of the day, they're probably watching tv, laughing. So I always thought that was like, you could really argue all the time and still be like, that's your dog. But, like, some people just don't want, you know, so I'd be surprised, like, you want to bring up because we're arguing too much. Like, it was confusing, but I was like, some people, it's just like that.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So, man, it's so much out here that you gotta figure out in relationships,

[Brandon]

like, so much, and there's no right answer. That's this constant learning.

[Lauren LaRosa]

No. And sometimes, to be honest with you, I feel like, like what Ari Lennox is talking about in the dating phase, sometimes you experience stuff like that so you can know what you don't want to experience again too. So, you know, everybody go through Ari. Girl, you going to be good. You might need to just take some time of, like. Like, just cleanse to yourself. Like, I don't know. But this has been another episode of the latest with Lauren the Rosa. We were on the line with Lauren the Rosa today, talking all things men and how they can't handle when you bring your own table to the table.

[Brandon]

Great.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Let's see you in the next episode. This is an Iheart podcast. Guaranteed human.