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- [00:00]
A
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- [00:31]
B
Since this is the Leadership Dance Podcast, I wanted to ask you, what does leadership mean to you on and off the stage?
- [00:38]
A
To me, leadership is being in the studio day in, day out, back to the daily grind, responsibility, coming to work, knowing why you're there, why you are, what you're doing, and being a good representation, especially for the younger dancers in the company. For the younger dancers on social media that are looking up to you. And I think that's really important to set a good moral for these young dancers that are looking up to you. Especially personally. For me, I feel like I have a lot of young dancers, young social media platforms that are following me and especially when I go out to the stage door, if I meet a lot of them after performances, there are a lot of younger dancers that are either in the summer program or just in the area watching. And I think providing good leadership skills in those moments when they meet you is very important and just to be respectful and kind.
- [01:27]
B
Hello and welcome to the Leadership Dance Podcast where we explore the art of leadership with trailblazers in business and the arts. If you enjoy the show, please share, subscribe and give it a five star rating. And if you're listening to this podcast right now, also check out our YouTube channel, Heladeership Dance. I'm your host, Alisa Su lynch and today I'm joined by one of the ballet world's newest stars, Chloe Mizzeldine. Described as astonishing and jaw dropping by the New York Times, Chloe is a principal dancer at American Ballet Theatre. She emerged as a standout young artist on the international stage, earning honors at Youth America Grand Prix and becoming a finalist at the Prix de Lauanne. She joined ABT through its studio company and rose rapidly through the ranks, captivating audiences in leading roles including Swan Lake, Giselle, the Winter's Tale and Sylvia. In 2026, she was named to the Forbes 30 under 30 list for art and style. Welcome to the podcast, Chloe.
- [02:35]
A
Thank you, Elisa, for that introduction and I'm very happy to be here.
- [02:39]
B
I want to start by talking about your epic promotion to Principal dancer at abt. You were promoted on stage by artistic director Susan Jaffe after your debut as Odette Odile in Swan Lake at the Met. Can you tell us about that moment? Was it a surprise? How did you feel?
- [02:58]
A
Yes. So that performance and that afternoon was very special to me. I was promoted to principal dancer on stage after my Swan Lake debut at the Metropolitan Opera House in New York. I was the first to ever been promoted on stage. So I. It was never the thing I expected to happen. So it caught me by surprise. She came onto stage after, while I was still bowing, while I was still soaking up all the last moments of being on stage with the audience. And she came out and it announced that I was becoming principal dancer. And it was such a surreal experience because, like I said, I was not expecting it to happen then and there at all. And I was just overcome with so many emotions and so much excitement. And it was so nice and so wonderful to have the audience be a part of that experience, to witness and feel the exact same emotions that I was feeling in that moment and to have all my friends and family in the audience as well. It was very special to me. And I'm so grateful to Susan to honor me in that way on stage. And I just carry that day with me every day.
- [04:08]
B
That's amazing. Did you know you were close to being promoted to principal?
- [04:13]
A
So that specific season, Swan Lake was my second full length that I debuted at the Met.
- [04:19]
B
What was the first?
- [04:20]
A
I danced Tatiana in the ballet Eugene Onegin. And that is a very dramatic ballet. That is a very in depth role to dance emotionally and physically. So I felt the contrast between that ballet and Swan Lake was very different. And I was able to gain many experiences from both. You know, because Swan Lake is such a technical ballet, and then Onegin is so artistically demanding that I felt I gained so much experience doing both of those ballets in the same season. But back to your question. I wasn't expecting it, but of course it did cross my mind. But being promoted on stage was definitely something I didn't think was gonna happen.
- [04:58]
B
Yes. Yeah. That was really amazing. And I know it got a lot of press as well. Can you talk to us about what was the training like for Swan Lake? That's a really demanding role to backtrack.
- [05:07]
A
This was 2024 in the summer, so in July, I premiered at the Met, but I danced it once before at the Kennedy center in February of that year. So prior to February, I actually started preparing roughly in, like, September. Oh, wow. I started doing Variations Rehearsals, just like kind of an introduction to the ballet. It wasn't every day, but it was quite a few times a week. So I started getting familiar with the steps, the story. And I didn't start intensely working on it until around December, January, every day with Susan in the studio. She was basically coaching me from the very beginning, you know, how to step onto stage as a swan, how to portray Odile versus Odette. And it. It was a long process. Because it took me some time for parts of the ballet. I felt that Odette came more naturally to me, but Odile was a bit more of a struggle. I wouldn't say struggle, but a little bit. It was just harder for me. Just the character interpretation and the seduction of it, it didn't come naturally to me, as Odette did.
- [06:13]
B
So for listeners who aren't as familiar with Swan Lake, talk about what is the character of Odette versus Odile.
- [06:20]
A
So Odette, in the story, she is. She's a saddened maiden turned swan. She's fearful. She doesn't know what her future entails. So there's a little bit of a vulnerable act in her dancing in the second act, the white act. That is where Odette dances the most. So I felt that was easier for me to portray, in a way, because the movement was so slow. It was very detailed. It was easier for me to adjust to that. Meanwhile, Odile is more of a seductress queen, fierce swan. She wears, like, a black tutu, black headpiece and everything, so. And the technique was very demanding. The Black Swan pas de deux is one of the hardest pas de deux in the female repertoire, ballet repertoire. So it's always very stressful coming out on stage and doing that pas de deux because you know how hard it's gonna be, technical wise. But then the minute you get out on stage and you're starting the pas de deux, you kind of lose all those nerves. You just get. You progressively get more tired throughout the pas de deux. Variations in coda.
- [07:29]
B
I've seen you perform the Black Swan pas de deux, and you totally embody it. So even if you didn't feel it took some time, feel it when you were training. Yeah. I think you have really achieved that mastery.
- [07:42]
A
Thank you so much. Beautiful. Thank you.
- [07:44]
B
So I want to go back to your childhood and where it all started. What was your childhood like and how did it influence how you thought about your career?
- [07:53]
A
Yeah. So my childhood, I have been always been a part of ballet. Ballet has always been a part of my life. Ever since I was little. My mom Used to be an abt. She was a soloist before I was born. So I grew up with her coaching at the school and the company that I grew up around, which was in Orlando, Orlando Ballet School and Main Company. So she was teaching there. I was taking classes as well. When I was very little, my whole childhood kind of revolved around that. And I was always watching her on the tapes, her VHS tapes, or I would wear her pointe shoes at home. Now they don't fit because her feet are like, very little. My feet are much bigger, so I can't wear them anymore. But when I was young, I used to stand on pointe at home. I think that's where my strong ankles come from, is standing on pointe at like. Yes. To like, gain the strength in my ankles and calves. But when I was little, before I moved to New York to join EBT Studio Company, I was in private school up until my freshman year. So my freshman year was my last year of high school, of high school, before I transferred to online for about half a year before I moved to New York to join the Studio Company. So I lived a relatively normal life. I went to school, I had friends there. I actually had a special schedule where I was able to be from school about an hour or two hours early so I could go to ballet school. But, you know, I woke up every morning at 6:37, went to Lake Highland Preparatory, which is where I went to majority of my life. Went to school, did all the academics and then left early and went to ballet.
- [09:30]
B
Did you go to football games or homecoming and things like that?
- [09:35]
A
I went to a few here and there. But then because I only did freshman year, I kind of missed out on most of the high school experience because 10th, 11th, and 12th, I was gone already.
- [09:44]
B
Yeah.
- [09:45]
A
But, you know, I had my. My fair share of experience, so I really value those. That time I had in school, it brings me a lot of memories when I see friends from that time or if I go visit the campus when I'm home. So it's nice to have that part of my life to remember.
- [10:02]
B
Yes. Yeah. I also studied ballet all the way up until college.
- [10:05]
A
Oh, really?
- [10:06]
B
But was really just focused on ballet like high school on. So I dropped. I used to study flute and piano. So I decided, no, I'm gonna focus on ballet. And then it was, yeah, every day after school. And I did miss out. I did feel like I missed out on a lot of high school things. But we learn a lot from it.
- [10:26]
A
We did. I actually played piano as well for about eight years, all the way from my elementary to basically high school. I think that also helped in my ballet. Absolutely. You know, musicality. I feel like I have very good musicality. I think it's help me become a better dancer.
- [10:42]
B
Yes, you're a very musical dancer.
- [10:43]
A
Yeah, very musical.
- [10:45]
B
Okay, so I want to talk about your mom. You mentioned she was a soloist with abt. She's now rehearsal director for the ABT Studio Company.
- [10:53]
A
Yes, she is.
- [10:53]
B
And she teaches at the ABT school. So what is it like to work in the same company with your mom? Was she a tiger mom or a dance mom?
- [11:03]
A
No, definitely not.
- [11:04]
B
No. Okay.
- [11:05]
A
No, she was never a dance mom. I mean, of course she is, quote unquote, a dance mom because she is my mother and she knows ballet. But she was never one to overstep, ever in my career or in my youth when I was training. So I work with abt. I have my coaches, I have Susan. I have all the rehearsal directors at ABT helping me in the studio, which I could not continue doing these roles without their help. But it's also very helpful in works for me that my mom is also my coach on the side as well. You know, I go to her for advice, for coaching, even back to the basics, like, can we do a ballet class? Or can we go through this variation very slowly? Can you help me? And I'll send her videos sometimes to, like, look over, to give me some notes. So I have her to work with me. I mean, she knows me so well. She knows me almost better than I know myself. And we have such a great relationship. And she's never once been like, to overstep or anything. Even after all my big performances at the Met, I'm always telling her, you should come backstage, you should come to the stage door, all of this. Come see the dancers. But she's like, no, I don't want to overstep. I don't want to get in your way. And I'm like, but it's okay.
- [12:18]
B
But you're my mom and other parents are back here.
- [12:20]
A
No, I know. Exactly. So. But she started to do it more often now. So it's really nice to have her come backstage after the show or come to my dressing room while I get unready and everything. Yeah, so. But we have such a great room relationship. And I'm so grateful to have her with me. And we work in the same building because the fourth floor is the educational department in abt. And then the main company works on the second and third floor. But I actually never see her. I feel like we never cross paths because I rarely go to the fourth floor. I mean, I'll go and visit. I'll sometimes have rehearsal up there, but I feel like we don't really see each other very often. Yeah.
- [12:57]
B
How about outside of, outside of work?
- [13:00]
A
Well, if we happen to end at the same time, I'll be like, do you want to go get something? Do you want to go get dinner or anything? Yeah. But usually I'm done way later than she is, so it doesn't always work out that way. But I try to hang out with her as much as I can because I love hanging out with my mom.
- [13:16]
B
Yeah. Oh, that's amazing. It sounds like you're great friends as well.
- [13:19]
A
We are, yeah.
- [13:20]
B
And how about your brothers? I know you have two brothers.
- [13:22]
A
I do. I have two brothers. I have an older brother and a younger brother. So my older brother, we're six years apart. He actually lives in New York. He lives in my building. So we're basically neighbors. Him and his wife, now wife live in my building and I love having them so close. I can just go downstairs and hang out with them or bother them or anything. Sometimes Liz, my sister in law, she'll text me like, oh, we are making this for dinner. Do you want to come join? Yes.
- [13:50]
B
That's really nice.
- [13:51]
A
So it's really great to have them so close. And then my younger brother, he is about two years younger than me. He actually is graduating university this May, so he hasn't decided what he wants to do yet, but hopefully that is moved to New York.
- [14:07]
B
Oh, that would be amazing.
- [14:08]
A
But we'll see. He's going to graduate and then he's going to do something different, maybe move out of Florida because he's living in Florida now. But yeah, I'm very close with my brothers and I don't know what I would do without them.
- [14:20]
B
Did either of them dance?
- [14:23]
A
Not really. My younger brother did some classes, like a summer program maybe when he was very little, but it didn't really go anywhere.
- [14:30]
B
Yeah. Are they athletic though?
- [14:32]
A
Athletic? Yeah. Both of my brothers did lots of sports in high school and college. I also live on a lake at home. We're big boating families, so we love all the skiing, all the paddleboarding, all the even tubing behind the boat.
- [14:44]
B
Okay. You don't get nervous doing other sports? I always felt like, oh, I can't, you know, ski or do something where I might get injured.
- [14:53]
A
No, exactly. I actually don't really do much of that anymore just because I'm a bit nervous about like knees and stuff. Once in a while, I go on the paddle board. I go on the jet Ski.
- [15:02]
B
Yeah, paddle board.
- [15:03]
A
I'll do the safe, safe things. But both of my brothers still do all the skiing.
- [15:07]
B
Right.
- [15:08]
A
I probably could be fine, but I just don't want to.
- [15:10]
B
Yeah, you probably would be with your balance and everything.
- [15:12]
A
Coordination.
- [15:14]
B
So tell me, what have been some of your most memorable moments performing on the stage, whether it's a particular role or choreographers you've with.
- [15:23]
A
Well, I absolutely love performing on stage, so I just love the feeling of having the audience, the music. Just the whole feeling of being on stage is incredible to me. But there's so many ballets that I've loved performing, and it's so hard to just pick one that is like a special moment, I will say. My first major role was my first year in the company. I danced one of the flower girls in Dong Kyu. So my premiere for that was at the Kennedy as well. And then I performed it at the Met. And that was the same year I was promoted to soloist after that summer. But I just remember having the most fun on stage dancing that role. It was very nerve wracking because in the third act, I have to dance solo. And it has these Alyssa Gon turns. Very difficult turning sequence in the middle of the variation. So it was always very stressful. But the whole first act, second act, every time I was on stage, I was just having such a great time because I love Don Kiu and it's such a great ballad. And we're actually bringing it back this Met season and I'll be premiering Kitri, so I'm happy to come back. Thank you. Come back to the ballet and work on a different role in the ballet. Yeah.
- [16:30]
B
Well, what are some of the other favorites then? You said it was hard to pick one.
- [16:35]
A
So I really enjoyed dancing Sylvia and Frederic Ashton's Sylvia this past summer at the Met. It's a very demanding ballet. The technique is very difficult. There's a lot of jumping. So the stamina, you need to have very good stamina to be able to get through the ballet. The first act, there's this section, it's called the Hunt. So she has this bow. Her name is Sylvia. She has this bow. She's like queen of this land, this mythical land. She is fierce, she is strong, independent woman. But she has this dance with these other her attendants. So it's called the Hunt because we're on the hunt for, I guess, men, I'm not sure. And it's so difficult. It's a lot of jumping. It's a lot of running around, and you have to dance with this bow and you have to transfer from different hands, and then you have to hold it or you have to transfer it to the middle. So it took quite a few months just to get used to working with it. But I just remember being so well prepared for the performance that I was just so excited to get out on stage. I remember the morning of. I'm just like, I want 7:30 just to be here by now, which is the start of the performance. So I just wanted to. I couldn't wait to get out there and just enjoy every moment of it, even though I knew I was gonna be so exhausted.
- [17:44]
B
Yeah. Well, it sounds like you like taking on these technical challenges.
- [17:49]
A
I do, I do. I have to be, like, very well prepared for these. Because for. If I'm well prepared, I'm just excited to get on.
- [17:56]
B
Yeah.
- [17:56]
A
Get on stage. But it's. It can be stressful if you're under prepared.
- [18:00]
B
Right. So do you find that once you learn something and you prepare for it, rehearse for it, that you can then let go more on stage?
- [18:08]
A
Definitely. You feel more comfortable on stage with the music, with the steps, even with the costume. It was like for my Swan Lake, I was so prepared. I wasn't even that nervous. If I'm going to play, you didn't
- [18:19]
B
have to think about it.
- [18:19]
A
I didn't have to think about it exactly. I just knew my body was going to take over, my instincts were going to take over in that I was gonna be fine.
- [18:26]
B
Yes. That is really an incredible feeling. So thank you.
- [18:29]
A
Yeah, no, I'm very lucky to have experienced that. That's the goal for every performance. But sometimes it's not necessarily the case. Once you get more experience on stage, you know how to navigate those feelings and what works best for you.
- [18:41]
B
Have there been moments on stage where you've forgotten or you feel like you're not completely in the moment and like, how do you get back into it?
- [18:52]
A
Sometimes it's just a split second. You know, you kind of panic for a second, but then you just have to pull yourself together. Even if you're in the middle of dancing. Because that's happened to me quite a few times. You just have to stay focused. You have to keep thinking, like, I'm a type of dancer that has to, like, think about the steps as they're going. Unless it's something that I've done, you know, over the years, it's just literally second nature. But like, for example, we were just Performing Christopher Wheeldon's the Winner's Tale. And I was dancing as the role of Perdita, the younger daughter. And the steps are very different. They're very unique, I would say. They're not like a traditional classical ballet like Swan Lake, where you kind of know exactly what's gonna happen. So I had to prepare for months for this role just so that the steps can naturally come to me. Yeah. And even on stage, like, I might have a blank moment, but because it's so in my body, my muscle memory kicked in and I was able to continue and it didn't affect me at all. Yeah. It's just for that split second.
- [19:48]
B
Right. And you kind of have to trust it's going to. My body will know, even if my mind maybe blinds for a second.
- [19:54]
A
Exactly.
- [19:55]
B
Are there any barriers or setbacks you've had to overcome to get to where you are?
- [20:00]
A
There was one specific moment, actually. It was this past Met season. I didn't have a normal injury. I didn't do anything specifically to myself, but I did have a little bit of a foot problem during the Met. And it was a six week performance season. And during the end of the second week, I was dancing Myrta, which is the queen of the willies in Giselle. Giselle. So I was performing at that performance. It was actually Olga Smirnova's performance. She was a guest artist that came to abt. She danced for a full out, sold out performance. And I was her Mirta. And it was so wonderful to be on stage with her because she's one of my favorite ballerinas. But at the end of dancing, I, like, landed funny or, I don't know, something shifted in my foot. So there's a bone called the cuboid bone. If it shifts or if it drops, it is excruciating, like the pain. But it's. There's technically nothing wrong with you. Like, you didn't break a bone or you didn't do anything, but it feels like you broke your foot. Like, walking hurts. Any form of, like, movement because it's at the bottom of your foot. Okay. And if it kind of misplaces, it's so painful. And I have this, like, little ball that I step on to, like, kind of roll it out, maybe shouldn't.
- [21:09]
B
It probably really hurts.
- [21:11]
A
It really hurts. And I could not get it back into place for, like, it was a Saturday performance in that I felt that in the show. So the following Saturday, it was my Giselle debut. I was actually dancing Giselle at the Met. I performed it Elsewhere on tour. But this is my first time in New York. I had family flying from all over the world coming to watch, and I was so nervous because my foot was hurting a lot, you know, and Giselle has a lot of jumping. And, you know, it's one thing to dance, like, kind of injured in the studio, but the minute you get out on stage, it's like a whole nother ball game. Dancing while injured is probably the worst experience because it's so.
- [21:48]
B
Well, it takes your mind off being in the moment.
- [21:51]
A
Exactly. Because all you're thinking about is how to land to make sure my foot doesn't hurt. So I had that whole week of stress, and it definitely clouded me mentally because it started stressing me out in ways that I shouldn't be stressed. Definitely. The pain felt extremely better since the first day compared to the week later. But it was still very painful. I went to a lot of physical therapy. I was going every day and nothing was really working. I think it had to do with my alignment or something was misplaced. So it kind of resulted all the way down to my foot. But luckily it resolved because two weeks later, I had to dance Sylvia, my Giselle, into Sylvia.
- [22:27]
B
Wow. Yes.
- [22:27]
A
I think I did Winter's Tale in between, so I was able to have another performance of onstage just being comfortable. But luckily I was fine for Sylvia. By then, I kind of recovered and I was able to dance because that includes a lot of jumping and jumping hers a lot. When you have a dropped cuboid bone.
- [22:45]
B
So you think it's alignment related?
- [22:47]
A
Potentially, I think so.
- [22:48]
B
It was like a dressing that, like,
- [22:49]
A
I think I was tight elsewhere, so it kind of all correlated to my foot. So it was something. So now I roll out a lot. I do a lot of exercises to strengthen, like, foot exercises and knee exercises to strengthen those muscles. So something like that doesn't happen again. Yeah.
- [23:05]
B
Well, I'm glad it went away.
- [23:06]
A
Thank you.
- [23:07]
B
And I've seen how hard you work, so I've seen some videos you've posted or others have posted of you working out in the gy. Talk about, like, what is your overall workout routine in addition to, you know, ballet classes and rehearsals on top of,
- [23:21]
A
like, you know, going to the gym? Well, first, before ballet class, I always arrive at least around 30 minutes early. Sometimes it's 15, but I try to get there early to stretch and do the proper warmup exercises, so I feel ready to start ballet class. But on the weekends, I see a personal trainer. He lives very close to me, and he used to be a dancer with abc. His name is Joel. I love working with him. I usually work with him on Mondays on my days off. But, you know, for example, we might be away on tour or I might have to do this rehearsal. So it doesn't necessarily align with my schedule. So we try to fit in times that work. So. But most of the time I go see him on our days off and he really works with me on again, alignment, on mobility, especially on my knees, like tracking. Because, you know, as a tall dancer, there's a lot of length and you know, when I try to jump, I
- [24:11]
B
don't know about that.
- [24:13]
A
It's hard sometimes. Height wise, I talk to my mom about it a lot because she's much shorter than me. So for tall people, even though we have the length, somehow it's much more. It's very difficult.
- [24:23]
B
All right, Chloe, we're gonna do some rapid fire questions.
- [24:26]
A
Yes.
- [24:26]
B
I didn't prepare you for this. My first one was actually Odette or Odile Odell.
- [24:31]
A
I kind of answered that.
- [24:32]
B
You already answered that. So who is a ballet dancer that you've looked up to?
- [24:37]
A
So there's so many. This is a very interesting thing because I've always been such a big fan of Nina Anishvili. She is a Georgian ballerina. She used to dance with abt. She was a private ballerina with ABT and the Bolshoi Ballet. And I actually got to work with her closely on Swan Lake and a little bit in Giselle in the studio. I just admire her dancing, her fierceness. She's such an incredible jump technician. She just goes for it. And I just love watching her dance. I mean, of course she doesn't dance anymore, but you know, from her videos from when she was in Bolsha or when she was in ABT is incredible. She's the director of the State Valley of Georgia in Georgia, the Country. And she invited me to come dance her Swan Lake two summers ago. I think it was the summer I got promoted to principal dancer. So I got to dance. I went to the. I performed at the London Coliseum in London.
- [25:28]
B
Wow, that sounds good.
- [25:29]
A
With her company, it was wonderful. One of the most amazing experiences. It was my first full length as a guest and as a principal dancer. So it was very special to me and I got to work closely with her. She believed in me and trusted me to lead our company. So I have such fond memories working with her. Back to your question before about Giselle. Giselle's one of my special ballets to perform because Susan, my director, actually brought Alexandra Ferri to come coach me for three weeks.
- [25:58]
B
Alessandra's wonderful.
- [25:59]
A
She is.
- [26:00]
B
She was actually a guest on this podcast.
- [26:02]
A
Oh, really? Yes.
- [26:03]
B
I'll send you her episode.
- [26:04]
A
Oh, that's cool. Yeah. I know this is supposed to be rapid fire, but I just keep talking. That's okay. That's okay.
- [26:09]
B
Okay. This one maybe will be fast. Classical or contemporary?
- [26:12]
A
If I had to pick classical. Yes. But I do love contemporary.
- [26:15]
B
Favorite place you've traveled to?
- [26:17]
A
I love to travel. I can't say favorite, but I'll just say I love Korea, I love Italy, I love Lausanne, and I love China.
- [26:26]
B
Favorite ice cream flavor?
- [26:28]
A
Oh, pistachio. Is that weird?
- [26:32]
B
No.
- [26:32]
A
Kind of like pistachio.
- [26:34]
B
Where do you go on the. I know in New York City sometimes
- [26:38]
A
I go to Van Leeuwen's once in a while.
- [26:40]
B
And then. What music do you listen to when you're warming up? Do you listen to music?
- [26:44]
A
I do. I actually love classical music. I know. Not just like ballet classical, but I love any form of classical music. I have many different playlists of different composers or different artists.
- [26:54]
B
It's incredible music. Classical music. I mean, we talked about. We both studied piano.
- [26:59]
A
Yes, exactly. So I love it.
- [27:01]
B
My mom was a piano teacher, so I would wake up in the mornings hearing her playing piano in the house.
- [27:07]
A
That's so nice.
- [27:08]
B
So I also love classical.
- [27:09]
A
Oh, nice. Yeah.
- [27:11]
B
What do you still find challenging for you in dance? What are you working on?
- [27:15]
A
The pressure of, you know, leading all these ballets. It can be very. It's very demanding. I'm still learning how to navigate that. How to navigate putting together three different ballets at one time and not let the stress overwhelm me. But I'm very lucky to have such a great support system. Family, friends, management at abt. So I feel very grateful to feel so comfortable talking to people or expressing how I feel to some close friends or family. But yes, definitely. The demands of being a principal dancer can be very stressful. Performing and having to look a certain way all the time, and it can be nerve wracking.
- [27:53]
B
Are there certain practices that have helped you dealing with the pressure?
- [27:58]
A
Be prepared for the performances. Yes.
- [28:01]
B
As dancers.
- [28:02]
A
Yeah, exactly.
- [28:02]
B
Perfectionists or perfectionists. We prepare so that we can be our best. At least that's how I think about it.
- [28:10]
A
Yes, I agree.
- [28:11]
B
So you were recently recognized on the Forbes 30 under 30 list. Congratulations. Thank you. How has your life changed since you were promoted and gained more recognition? Talking about pressure, maybe not just of being a principal, but being a more
- [28:24]
A
visible ballerina, I was very stunned to see the Forbes 30 under 30. My aunt actually sent it to me, and I thought she was joking. I know they didn't contact you. They didn't. I mean, I. Well, my life. So my aunt, she comes. She lives in Connecticut. She comes to all my performances at the Met when she can, but she has this alert, so anytime my, like, name pops up, she gets, like, the information about me online. So she got this Forbes 30 under 30. So she, like, sent it to our family chat. And I was in rehearsal or something, so I was getting all these notifications, like, wow, Chloe, congratulations. I'm like, what's. What's happening? Yeah. So I opened it and I saw it and I was like, wow. That's. Wow. I did not expect that. So it was fun to see all. Everyone, like, so excited for me in my family chat.
- [29:07]
B
I didn't realize that that was kind of a surprise thing. So they.
- [29:11]
A
Well, I actually got an email from them that I should provide information. Provide information regarding this. But I did it last year or the year before, and I didn't get it. So I was like, oh, maybe not this year. Okay. So it was a nice surprise. But eventually they contacted me, like a couple hours later. I think it was just. She got the notification right as it came out, so it was just funny.
- [29:31]
B
Do you feel pressure from a social media perspective, like, trying to build a following or not so much.
- [29:38]
A
I know I don't really do much on social media, and I probably in theory should, but I never felt any pressure from social media at all.
- [29:47]
B
So since this is the Leadership Dance podcast, I wanted to ask you, what does leadership mean to you both on and off the stage?
- [29:55]
A
To me, leadership is just being in the studio, day in, day out, back to the daily grind, responsibility, coming to work, knowing why you're there, why you are, what you're doing, and being a good representation, especially for the younger dancers in the company, for the younger dancers on social media that are looking up to you. And I think that's really important to set such. I wouldn't say a high standard, but set a good moral for these young dancers that are looking up to you. Because, especially personally for me, I feel like I have a lot of young, young dancers, young social media platforms that are following me. And especially when I go out to the stage door, if I meet a lot of them after performances, there are a lot of younger dancers that are either in the summer program or just in the town in the area watching. And I think providing good leadership skills in those moments when they meet you is Very important. And just to be respectful and kind.
- [30:51]
B
What do you hope to accomplish in the future?
- [30:54]
A
Currently, I'm performing a lot overseas, but hopefully in the future I'll get to do more of that. Get to go to the places that I.
- [31:01]
B
As a guest artist.
- [31:02]
A
As a guest artist or even with abt, you know, touring. I love traveling. I love meeting new people, new dance with new partners, meeting new directors, company members, all of that. So I really enjoy that. But definitely in the future, you know, maybe after I retire, I'm not exactly sure what I would like to do, but I do love teaching, I do love coaching. Sometimes I'm a little bit shy about it, but I do love that feeling of helping younger dancers.
- [31:30]
B
Well, I think you have a long performing career ahead of you still.
- [31:34]
A
Yes. Hopefully I'll do that first. Yeah.
- [31:36]
B
So I want to pick up on something you brought up in the rapid fire questions, which is that you're half Chinese.
- [31:41]
A
Yes.
- [31:43]
B
So I'm 7 8th Chinese and then 1 8th Japanese.
- [31:46]
A
Oh, wow. So majority majority Chinese. Yes. Yeah, yeah.
- [31:49]
B
I identify as Chinese. So how has that been a part of your identity or not or.
- [31:54]
A
Well, definitely. My mom is from Shanghai. She's full Chinese, grew up in Shanghai, and then she did like an exchange program with San Francisco Ballet when she was 16 for about six months to a year. So she actually with her school, Shanghai Ballet School in San Francisco, they did a exchange program. So she lived in San Francisco for a year. She spoke 0 English, didn't know anything. So that was her experience. First experience in the US and then later on in her life, she moved to the States and danced with Washington Ballet before joining ebt. But she's definitely been such an influence on me growing up. And then every time I get to travel to China, whether that's for abts touring or if I travel on my own, I am so grateful to have a foundation there. Family, friends, and people that can help me when I go to places where I'm not so familiar with. But it's been a major influence. And also tomorrow's Chinese New Year.
- [32:49]
B
Yes.
- [32:49]
A
So that's why I'm wearing red. I mean, I don't know when this
- [32:51]
B
is gonna air, but a little bit after. A little bit tomorrow. But that's.
- [32:56]
A
I'm wearing this for Chinese New Year, so my mom's not here, unfortunately, in New York at the moment, but I'll do a little FaceTime with her. I think my Chinese heritage is such a big part of me, and I'm still looking to go in depth with it. Yeah.
- [33:10]
B
Do you speak any Chinese?
- [33:11]
A
I speak a little bit. I spoke a lot more when I was little because my grandparents lived with us.
- [33:16]
B
Oh, nice.
- [33:16]
A
Okay. So because my dad doesn't speak Chinese, he is from South Africa. He only spoke English when they first met. So growing up, me and my brothers, we primarily spoke English at home. But when my grandparents were living with us, they did speak a little bit of Chinese. So we understood and started speaking more. But then when they left, they kind of lost it. Unfortunately.
- [33:36]
B
It's hard when you don't speak it every day. So I lived in Shanghai for two years for work.
- [33:41]
A
Oh, really?
- [33:42]
B
And before that, had studied two years of Mandarin in college because same thing. Like my parents, they spoke Chinese to each other but decided to speak English to my sister and I. So I grew up up speaking English.
- [33:53]
A
Oh, I see.
- [33:54]
B
So even when I was in Shanghai, they could tell I had an American accent.
- [33:58]
A
Of course.
- [33:59]
B
But I still, you know, I did learn some and was able to get around on the streets.
- [34:02]
A
I need to do that. And you said you're 18 Japanese.
- [34:06]
B
18 Japanese.
- [34:07]
A
So does that come from your mom or your dad?
- [34:08]
B
On my mom's side, her. My great grandmother.
- [34:11]
A
Oh, I see.
- [34:12]
B
Okay. Was Japanese.
- [34:13]
A
Oh, wow, that's so cool.
- [34:14]
B
Married Chinese and you've a little bit in your. Yeah, I've just recently been learning about that history.
- [34:20]
A
Oh, cool.
- [34:20]
B
Yeah.
- [34:20]
A
That's so nice. Yes, fascinating.
- [34:24]
B
So what gives you joy outside of dance?
- [34:27]
A
There's so many things. I mean, I love experiencing the city. I love traveling. Majority of the time when I travel, it's for work or for performances. So any chance that I can travel not for performances is very. I'm very lucky to do that because it's very rare. I love experiencing new restaurants, new parts of the city. I live near Central park, so I love walking down Central park if it's not too cold. I like to meet up with my friends every once in a while and I just stay connected with my family. Family's super important to me. So any chance I get, I can hang out with my brother that lives in New York or call my dad or call my mom if she's downtown and I'm uptown. Yeah. So. But family's very important. I try to stay close with them. Yeah. And especially my sister in law who they just got married this past summer. So it's so great to have her officially in the family even though she's been a part of this family for a long time.
- [35:22]
B
So sounds like you're good friends.
- [35:23]
A
Yes, we're Very close. Yeah. So I'm very lucky to have her.
- [35:26]
B
Is there anywhere you're looking forward to traveling this year?
- [35:29]
A
This year? Well, actually ABT is traveling to Abu Dhabi in April.
- [35:33]
B
Very cool.
- [35:33]
A
I'm looking forward to that. I've never been, so I have to dance Theme and Variations, which is very difficult. I have to dance that there. It's a very hard Balanchine ballet.
- [35:42]
B
You'll have some time to explore though. It's pretty cool.
- [35:45]
A
I don't know, I'm not sure because, you know, I have to dance this hard ballet and I feel that I'm not gonna be able to enjoy myself until after that. Until after. But that kind of depends how long the schedule is. Yeah. But after Abu Dhabi, ABT has a two week layover. But I will actually be going to Puerto Rico in dancing Swan Lake there. Oh, okay. So I'm looking forward to that. I've never been to Puerto Rico.
- [36:07]
B
Yeah, it's a lovely island.
- [36:09]
A
Yes.
- [36:10]
B
Bad bunny go.
- [36:11]
A
Yes, exactly. And then I think I have it because that's the first week and then there's another week off. So I think I'm gonna extend my trip by like two days and vacation a little bit.
- [36:21]
B
Yeah. I've traveled a lot for work and if I'm able to, I always like to arrive a day early or maybe stay a day late. I was actually in Japan two weeks ago for a board meeting and I stayed an extra day just to be able to see some of the sights.
- [36:37]
A
That's nice. We're in Japan.
- [36:38]
B
Tokyo.
- [36:39]
A
Tokyo. I've never been to Japan and I really.
- [36:41]
B
Oh, you'd love it.
- [36:42]
A
It's one of my.
- [36:42]
B
If you like South Korea.
- [36:44]
A
Yes, I love. I think I really want to go to Japan. Yeah, I've been to Korea four times already, so Japan needs to be next on the list.
- [36:52]
B
Yes. Yeah. Okay, last question. What advice would you give to your younger self or to younger dancers about finding their voice as an artist?
- [37:02]
A
So for me, confidence was the biggest part. I felt that I didn't gain confidence in myself until recently. And of course that comes with time. You know, not everyone is going to come. Come with that feeling and that security in yourself. But for me, like advice to give to younger dancers or to myself if I was younger was just stick to the basics, stick to the work. I think that's so important and that's what's going to get you to your goal in the future or in dance or wherever. What else, Whatever you do decide to do, I think that's just so important. To stay humble and to be true to yourself, because I think that's something that nobody can take away from you.
- [37:43]
B
Yeah.
- [37:43]
A
Yeah.
- [37:44]
B
Well, that's something I admire about you, Chloe, is.
- [37:46]
A
Thank you.
- [37:46]
B
Your humility is. Thank you. Like, you are a big time ballerina and you're just so approachable and always kind.
- [37:54]
A
Thank you. So thank you. I appreciate that. No, I just, I. Because I remember what it was like to be a young dancer who was seeing these stars for the first time, and I just. I remember all the ones that were so nice to me. So I try to keep that going, you know, because like when I. Like when I joined Studio company, I remember I was in the bathroom at ABT and I met Isabella Boylston for the first time and she was just so nice to me. And so, like, I think because I was in the studio company, so I was like, have been in the company for a short period of time, but it was during the summer program. I was in Stuco, but I was dancing in the summer and I remember she remembered my name and I felt like the coolest girl in the whole summer program. So, I mean, now we're such good friends, but I just remember moments like that. So.
- [38:41]
B
Yeah. Sometimes you don't know your impact on others, so you might as well be kind.
- [38:47]
A
Yes.
- [38:48]
B
Well, Chloe, it's been amazing to hear about your leadership dance, and I'm really excited to see you perform in Fire Bird this upcoming season. You'll be wearing red.
- [38:58]
A
I'll be wearing red hair. In my hair and on my face.
- [39:01]
B
Amazing. So thank you so much for joining the podcast.
- [39:04]
A
No, thank you for having me. I've really enjoyed chatting with you.
- [39:08]
B
Like, follow and share the leadership Dance, where we explore how to choreograph the career of your dreams and chat with visionary leaders in business and the arts. Until next time, keep dancing single.