The Learning Leader Show with Ryan Hawk

Episode 674: PJ Fleck – Building Elite Culture, Nekton Mindset, Selecting > Recruiting, Intrinsic Motivation, Row The Boat, and Transformational Coaching
Date: February 9, 2026
Guest: PJ Fleck, Head Football Coach, University of Minnesota

Overview

In this in-depth episode, Ryan Hawk sits down with PJ Fleck, the energetic and famously culture-driven football coach of the Minnesota Golden Gophers. Together, they explore the foundations of PJ’s unique leadership philosophy, delving into the origins of his “Row the Boat” mantra, the power of transformational coaching in an age of transactional college sports, the crucial difference between recruiting and selecting, firing up teams with the Nekton mindset, strategies for intrinsic motivation, and applying elite athletic culture to any leadership domain.

The conversation is packed with practical leadership insights, powerful stories of personal resilience, and actionable wisdom for anyone looking to build or sustain an elite team culture.

Key Themes and Discussion Points

1. The Value of Playing Experience and Human Connection

• PJ on playing days and connecting with players
  • PJ shares the importance of coaches showing their own history as athletes to their players, making them more relatable and human.
  • His team enjoys "Guess That Gopher," a fun way to showcase coaches' old playing highlights.
  • “It’s important for them to see you as a human being, to see that you actually did it.” (04:12, C)

2. Honoring Mentors and Paying It Forward

• PJ’s key influences: Jim Tressel and Mike Nolan
  • Wears a tie to honor both mentors.
  • “Jim Tressel taught me how to care about the entire team... Mike Nolan taught me how to be incredibly transparent and very honest.” (06:43, C)
  • Shares the story of being cut and hired as a coach in the NFL in the same conversation.

3. Finding Meaning in Adversity: The Origin of ‘Row the Boat’

• Personal tragedy as fuel for leadership philosophy
  • PJ’s son died in 2011—a major turning point.
  • “Row the Boat” was born as a response: never give up, use pain for a higher purpose.
  • “Row the boat just means never give up. But it’s really his life. We’re the only college football program whose slogan is directly tied to charity.” (11:18, C)
  • Transparency about adversity becomes a cornerstone for authentic leadership.

4. Life vs. Living: Choosing Minnesota & Staying for the Right Reasons

• Making big decisions and knowing what matters
  • PJ’s family rule: choose the challenge that scares you.
  • “My wife always asks me, ‘Does it scare you?’ And when Minnesota came about... I’m like, hell yeah, it scares me... She goes, ‘We’re going.’” (14:58, C)
  • Stays at Minnesota for the quality of life and deep community ties, not just “a great living.”

5. Competing in the Big Ten: Aligning Expectations and Reality

• Resources, money, and the changing landscape of college sports
  • Discusses NIL, transfer portal, donor support.
  • Cautions about the gap between expectations and resources: “If those don’t align... the gap gets bigger and it’s always filled with frustration.” (18:17, C)
  • Stresses adaptability while keeping the core culture intact.

6. Recruitment Philosophy: Selection and Fit over Simple Recruiting

• 80/20 Rule: 80% high school selections, 20% transfers
• Focuses on selecting, not recruiting:
  • “We don’t recruit. We find selection and fit. I shouldn’t have to convince a kid to come here.” (20:53, C)
  • Looks for intrinsic motivation, academic/social fit, and resilience.
  • “We’re kind of dinosaurs, but I’m a cool dinosaur. I’m like a T-Rex.” (22:53, C)
  • “I am really, really difficult to play for. I’m a high, high thinker, overachiever... everything I’ve done, I’ve had to do it the hard way.” (24:13, C)

7. The Nekton Mindset and Culture Building

• Defining the Nekton mindset (inspired by Navy Seals)
  • “Nekton: always attacking, never full. I want hungry dogs. I want people who love and attack their life.” (24:13, C)
  • Intrinsic drive is critical: “If I’ve got to start your motor every day, you’re the wrong fit.” (27:22, C)
• Chip vs. Crack:
  • “A chip is proving to everybody else you’re good enough. The crack on your shoulder kids are proving to themselves.” (27:45, C)

8. Core Pillars: The H.Y.P.R.R. Culture System

• PJ’s “Hyprculture” (How-Yours-Process-Result-Response):
  • “Row the Boat fits in the hyperculture. We name our culture. Go figure. It’s called hyper. H is How. Y is Yours. P is Process. First R is Result. Second R is Response.” (30:57, C)
  • Focuses on people (How), personal vision (Yours), work/process, data-driven results, and body language/response.
  • Elite responses taught via body language classes, response vs. reaction, and a ban on blaming, complaining, and deflecting (the “BCD’s”).

9. Practice Philosophy: Efficiency, Intensity, and Adaptability

• Radically efficient, high-intensity practices:
  • “I wanted to cut all the fat off practice. Practice has to be harder than a game, and truly mean that.” (42:17, C)
  • Practices capped at 95 minutes, with a running 32-second play clock to condition urgency and execution.
  • Focus on preparing players for the biggest jump: high school to college.
  • “Everything we do, I want to be at an elite level. Even the execution of it. And then the game and what you’re doing eventually slows down.” (43:30, C)

10. Transformational Coaching in a Transactional Era

• Practical ways to still drive transformation:
  • Ongoing “Gopher for Life” program for personal growth, relationship skills (month ly “date nights”), racism education (HERE initiative), and coaching development series.
  • “Teaching people how to be human beings, how to date, in a filtered world. That’s transformational.” (52:26, C)
  • Leaning into unique team themes, fun traditions (children’s book readings, weekly theme shirts), and always finding real-life lessons.

11. Lifelong Learning and Borrowing Insights

• PJ as dedicated learner:
  • Attends cross-industry seminars, e.g. with Green Berets and Navy SEALS at Texas A&M.
  • “I don’t watch anything for entertainment. I constantly watch it for education. And that’s how I think I can relate to my players.” (47:06, C)
  • Continuously celebrates progress, balances the “disease of success” with ritual and meaningful reflection.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On perspective from pain:

  • “Perspective really comes from tragedy and adversity. If you don’t have any of that, you probably have a real poor perspective of life, of sport, of challenges, of changes.” (11:18, C)

• On leadership legacy:

  • “Sometimes when you go up the ladder, you’re like, here’s how I did it. ... I have nothing to do with really me. If it wasn’t for those two men [Tressel and Nolan], I wouldn’t be where I’m at.” (06:43, C)

• On selecting, not recruiting:

  • “I consider our program incredibly difficult because it challenges you to be the best version of yourself—tomorrow or today, not yesterday. This is not a rear view program. We’re rowing the boat, man.” (24:13, C)

• On practice design:

  • “I have ADD, man. I need to move. ... I wanted to make sure practice is harder than a game and truly mean that.” (42:17, C)

• On body language and response:

  • “Our players are not able to be like this [slouched]... Our players stand up and we say, big chest. ... There’s a difference between reaction and response.” (38:20–39:10, C)

• On being a transformational coach:

  • “I’m still willing to do a lot of things that I think—I’m not sure a lot of people are willing to do. ... We have a relationship course. It’s called date night. Our players bring a date. ... That’s transformational, in my opinion.” (52:26–52:50, C)

Highlight Timestamps

• PJ discusses old playing highlights: 03:17–06:17
• Paying tribute to mentors: 06:17–10:40
• Personal tragedy and the origin of ‘Row the Boat’: 11:18–14:43
• Life vs. making a living; picking Minnesota: 14:58–17:48
• NIL, Big Ten competition: 17:48–20:34
• The 80/20 selection model and ‘selection vs. recruiting’: 20:34–24:07, 24:13–29:09
• Nekton mindset, intrinsic motivation, and culture: 24:13–30:51
• H.Y.P.R.R. cultural system: 30:57–38:09
• Body language and elite response: 38:09–41:31
• Practice structure, intensity, and adaptability: 41:31–46:48
• PJ’s learning mindset and cross-discipline growth: 46:48–51:55
• Transformational coaching in the transactional era: 52:03–58:57
• Final leadership lesson (“Coach’s job is to teach and demand.”): 58:57–59:36

Closing Takeaways

• Stop recruiting, start selecting. Look for those who genuinely fit your mission—don’t spend your energy convincing those who aren’t aligned.
• Efficiency beats duration. Make every moment count—intensity and focus are more valuable than time spent.
• Intrinsic motivation is non-negotiable. Elite teams are filled with people proving their worth to themselves, not others.
• Great leadership is teaching and demanding; elite teams are ultimately player-led.
• Embrace adversity. Your scars are the roots of your resilience and the source of your leadership perspective.

Final Words

PJ Fleck’s approach, grounded in deep personal adversity and relentless self-reflection, offers a blueprint for any leader aiming to build and sustain a high-performing, value-driven culture. His blend of discipline, creativity, compassion, and accountability creates an environment where teams don’t just perform—they transform.

“A coach's job is to teach and demand. A player's job is to prepare and perform. Elite teams, players lead. Average teams, coaches lead. Bad teams, nobody leads.” (58:57–59:36, C)

Row the Boat. Sky U Ma. Gophers!