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The Legal Department
Office Hours: Questions From Aspiring GCs With Deborah Solmor, Founder, Ready Set GC [E96]
00:37:21
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- [00:00]
A
This episode of the Legal Department Office Hours is brought to you by filejet, the intelligent way to manage entity compliance. Formations, dissolutions, annual filings, business license renewals, service of process, notifications, they all come with risk if they're missed. Fines, penalties, and even deal delays. It adds up fast. That's why in house legal teams trust filejet. Filejet centralizes every aspect of entity management into one platform. Powered by intelligent automation and designed to handle complexity at any scale. Purpose built to increase visibility and control. You get real time status tracking, clearer oversight, and total confidence that nothing's falling through the cracks. Filejet built for growth, trusted for compliance. Learn more and book a demo@FileJet.com welcome to the Legal Department, a podcast for lawyers who want to learn, connect and grow their careers. I'm Stacey Bratcher. I'm a general counsel, and I'm excited to share these conversations to help you level up in house. On today's episode of the Legal Department. I'm excited to welcome back for third or fourth time Deborah Salmore, who is the general counsel of the Wisconsin Alumni Research foundation and founder of ReadySet GC. She and I were just together at a ReadySet GC event called Ascend in Chicago, and and we sourced some questions from that group and Deborah and I are going to bat those around for office hours today. Deborah, great to have you back in the legal department.
- [01:42]
B
Thank you, Stacey. Thanks for having me here. I think I do have to go on record and say it's four. I'm very excited about that. So maybe after this one people will start getting sick of me. I hope not.
- [01:52]
A
It's a four, Pete. Okay.
- [01:53]
B
Yeah.
- [01:54]
A
There you go. Well, before we dive into the questions, let's just take a couple minutes. And there are audience listeners who are familiar with Ready Set GC and Ascend, but for those of them who are not, can you give us just a couple minutes about what it is?
- [02:09]
B
Sure. So the Ready Set GC Ascend program is our second program we started offering in February of 2025 of last year. And what it is, is it's designed to help those women who are aspiring to their first GC seat. And it's sort of a companion program to our original program, which is to help women who are in their first few years, what we call the foundational years of their first GC role.
- [02:33]
A
Well, it was fun. It was in Chicago, your hometown, and really great to meet all of the different women from all over the country, actually. So it was excellent. And I really appreciated you doing the call out to the Audience to get some questions for our conversation. So without further ado, this is a topic, number one, is a topic that I feel is a phrase that comes up time and time again for general counsels. It's sort of like very mushy. People don't know what it means, means. And here we go. How do you demonstrate that you're a, quote, strategic advisor?
- [03:12]
B
Such a great question. And I think it's one of the first things you see in the job description for a general counsel. Right. Strategic advisor. You see terms like revenue defender, growth enabler, drive the business forward. And I think you're right. So I look at it in sort of two buckets. One bucket is what does it mean? And then the second bucket, which I think is really even more important, is how do you do it? How do you know that you're doing it right? So what does it mean? I think in your GC role, it means that you are thinking less like a lawyer or not a lawyer all the time and thinking more like a business person. And so people say, well, what does that mean? So to me, that means, how are you helping drive outcomes? How are you helping your business meet their strategic initiatives and priorities, which is different than just identifying risk and providing legal guidance? And so I think that's sort of the mind shift that you need. And I think one of the ways you get there. So the. How. How do you get there? You definitely get there by first and foremost, understanding your business. Understand how your business makes money, understand what its pain points are if you're publicly traded. Read your SEC filing, listen to your investor calls. I've spent my GC career in nonprofits. Understand your nine hundred and nineties, understand your audit statements. And I think that is so critical because you can't deliver the type of strategic guidance that your leadership team is looking for if you don't understand how your business does what they do. And so that would be, I think, step one.
- [04:40]
A
Yeah.
- [04:41]
B
Understand.
- [04:42]
A
I would say the same thing. And the other thing I would add is, you know, and so much of the GC rule is about communication and how you frame the advice you're giving or the conversations you're having. Like, I try not to lead with a legal issue or a legal response to somebody's question. I try to think about, where are they in there? Who am I talking to? Am I talking with the chief marketing officer? Am I talking to the CEO? What does that person most care about? And try to put myself in their shoes and. And then weave in how the legal issue might impact them. And the way they're approaching the business,
- [05:26]
B
I would definitely agree with that. And I think one of the sort of mantras I try to keep is I'm trying to help solve problems, not create them. And oftentimes in our role, when we think we're identifying risk, the business thinks you're creating problems or you're identifying problems. And so to your point about communication, if you bring problems, or as you might look at them, risk issues to a meeting, your business partner may not be able to solve them. So instead you're saying, oh, well, there's this risk or there might be this problem. The person is likely thinking, I brought you to solve those problems. Now you're giving me more problems that I'm not a lawyer and I don't know how to solve. So I think messaging is critical and building your relationships to get to the point where you have to message. So I think you need to take a step back and think, what am I actually bringing to this conversation? And if I am bringing risks that somebody may not have thought about or may not have identified, how do I communicate them in a way that says, we've got this, or I have some options for you? I'm not going to send you back to your office with your head swirling about risks you didn't even know existed.
- [06:34]
A
That is so true. And I just want to pause because I think especially lawyers who are more junior, you know, you. You got points in law school and maybe at the firm for issue spotting. And on the other side of issue spotting, for people who aren't trained and don't know what to do with those issues, it creates anxiety. Like, oh, shoot, I had this whole plan. I was going to roll out this new marketing program, and now you're telling me we can't do it because we're misrepresenting something and we're going to have an FTC investigation, like, right.
- [07:07]
B
Nuclear. Right. All of a sudden.
- [07:09]
A
All of a sudden, yeah. So, you know, one thing as you were talking occurred to me is that, you know, lawyers have an ethical duty to communicate with clients about issues. And I think that we shoulder that duty. And so we're like sort of, you know, dogs bringing the stick back. Like, oh, hey, look what I found here. I'm communicating with you. But as you're saying, communicating without a plan is just, you know, kind of torturing the other person.
- [07:37]
B
I'm going to build on that and say, I think we're trained to think. That's our value add, which it is. I'm not. I'm not taking away from it. Definitely. Identifying risks and keeping a strategic initiative on track within the bounds of risk management is definitely our job, but I think it's sort of putting yourself in the place of the person that you're talking to. So you've got this great new marketing campaign. You've probably talked to other people in the organization about it and multiple times. And now someone's saying to you, well, wait a second, have you thought of this? And so your job is to say, well, how do I tell them that? In a way that doesn't make them either say, oh my gosh, no, I didn't think of that. But it's sort of like, how do you communicate that? And I think to your point, junior in house lawyers aren't always great at that by no fault of their own. It's just not. It's not the skill set that they were sort of using at an outside counsel role. I think so, yeah, that's really. That's a really good way to look at it.
- [08:30]
A
Yeah. I really want to underline that the big part of the GC role is communicating and doing that at and as. As an executive all number two. How did your organizational skills have to change when you became a gc?
- [08:49]
B
This is such a good question and I'm actually glad I had time to think about it and I didn't have to like answer it on the spot because I really wanted to sort of ponder that. So technically my organizational skills changed in that I didn't think of myself as much as an individual contributor in my role. Before being a gc, I was deputy gc. I had a team. So I. Some of those things were the same. I was managing people. But I definitely think as the gc, my organization thinks more to strategic priorities of the organization. Lots of moving pieces all over. All over my company as opposed to maybe the central lens I had as the head of litigation. So that's definitely it. So my task list isn't about the 10 things I personally have to get done that day. It's really what are the 10 things going on in the organization that needs mine or my team's attention? So I think you look at your day very intentionally in a different way. So I definitely sort of notice that I do that. Some of my organizational skills I think are the same. You know, I try to do it. I try to think about my day in the morning. I try. I'm not very good at it, but I really love the Pomodoro type Timer. I like 25 minute blocks. Give me, a five minute break. I turn off my outlook notifications while I'm doing that block of water so that I'm not distracted. The research on how long it takes you to, like, lose focus and then get back to what you were doing before is crazy. We think we're really good multitaskers. I don't know that many of us are. So the shift in thinking about how do I think about my executive team, my board, my own legal team and all the issues they're dealing with is very different than how I used to think about the 10 pieces of litigation on my desk and the two investigations I was working on. So I think that's probably the biggest shift. I delegate a lot more. I think that becomes critical. I think I'm one of those people, which I'm going to guess you have a little bit of this in you too, which is I either want to do it all or I think I can do it all, or the time it takes to delegate, I probably could finish it. And so really understanding that I'm not supposed to be doing everything. And another one of those buzz phrases is high value use of your time. What is the highest value use of my time? Yes. And it's probably not a high value use of my time to do certain things that other people can do.
- [11:18]
A
Yeah.
- [11:18]
B
Delegation is that much stronger in this.
- [11:22]
A
Yes, Yes. I mean, I want to underline that. I think for all of us in all areas of our life. I would say even at home delegating, you cannot do it all. We all have these big dreams and big ideas of what we think we can do. And yes, you know, I have this conversation with my team all the time. Yes, if you did it, it would be perfect. It would be the way you wanted. But sometimes perfect's the enemy of the good. It's gotta be just good enough sometimes. So trust the people you delegate to.
- [11:52]
B
I also think when we take on too much strategic thinking, time right is so important. It's so hard to get right. You put it on your calendar and, you know, I book it out probably one block a month. Two blocks a month.
- [12:06]
A
You do. I want to hear. Tell me more. Tell me more. What do you do at this time?
- [12:10]
B
So I block out two to three hours for what I just put in my calendar. Strategic thinking. And what I plan to do with them is, I don't know, like a week before I sort of like, think, okay, I have this time coming up. What do I really just need to sit and think about? What do I need to work on that's not, you know, get this board resolution done or, you know, look at this, you know, something very intentional. But I find that it's always the first is really. It's the first to go. That said, if you don't block that time and you don't spend that time thinking, you're really just reacting. You're doing a lot of reacting, reacting, reacting sometimes. Where I am now in Madison, my office is literally right on Lake Mendota. So for me, I like to go outside and take a walk. Because if I'm taking a walk, then arguably I'm not thinking of something specific. And that. That time, I think sometimes ideas just sort of come to me. When I was in Big Law, there used to be this story about, you know, the thinking time in the shower. So I feel like the walk is my equivalent of thinking time. But I'm very good at putting it on my calendar. I'm not as good as I would
- [13:17]
A
like defending it, but it reminds me.
- [13:19]
B
It reminds me you really do need this time. And I feel like in my current role, a lot of what I do is sort of helping think about big, big picture things. And in my organization, that is definitely valued. So I try to protect that time to help contribute to that.
- [13:36]
A
Well, I mean, it kind of goes back to the first question, like, how can you be a strategic advisor if you're not thinking about the company's strategies and priorities?
- [13:44]
B
And I think having, like, conversations to that point with the people on your leadership team to understand what is their strategy. When I was a GC in higher ed, I used to have, within the first month or two of every fiscal year, I would have each of the college presidents that we supported come to my legal team meeting and give us an overview of what were their goals for the coming year.
- [14:06]
A
Oh, that's brilliant.
- [14:07]
B
Different. And I would say this is your time to sort of put the message on our team's radar about the things you want to accomplish and how we can help you get there. And I thought it was really important. I heard about it in board meetings, I heard about it in leadership team meetings, but my team didn't. So I thought it was really important to set the team's sort of perspective of what people were trying to accomplish in the coming year.
- [14:30]
A
I took a note on that one. Great, great suggestion. One other thing that just I've done organizationally, and I'm sure this is rings true for you too, is when you're in the top job, you have to know what else is going on outside of your Vertical. So one thing I do, I'm very cognizant of board calendar, committee calendar and backing up as we're presenting, we know we're going to present XYZ priority to the board on, you know, in July. And what is the work that needs to get done up until that point? Like being cognizant that my work isn't just what's happening on my desk, but it's. It contributes to the larger efforts of the organization.
- [15:13]
B
I agree. And actually that was one time management skill that in my first GC role, the executive coach that I work with, she sort of pushed me to calendar backwards, right. So if I was working on, you know, I had a big piece of litigation I was managing, and so if we had a brief, she would sort of have me put the brief date on there and then think about when do I want my outside counsel to get me the brief do I think I'm really going to have much input on it and sort of thinking about that with board meetings and other things I was working on. And again, that was really hard to get me to slow down to do that. But I would laugh when something came up on my calendar that said prepare for X meeting. And I would think, God, I'm really glad I did that because otherwise I would have just been the day before saying, oh, so it's a great calendaring tool. You just have to slow yourself down long enough to actually calendar backwards.
- [16:05]
A
Well, and to back to the point on communication, sometimes what I'll do is when we have those larger things that may be legal as driving, I build in time for meetings with the key executives or a subgroup to bring them along, get people oriented to what I'm presenting. Like, I'll never present something to the board that I haven't shared with my, you know, peers in the executive suite. So. Okay, so now onto some more I. I'm going to call these kind of personally questions about, you know, your own career progression. We had people ask, you know, there was a lot of folks there that are, you know, actually actively looking for their first GC role or their first leadership role. And you don't always stick the landing. And so, you know, question about how you keep your confidence up when you're the runner up to a in a search.
- [16:58]
B
That's a tough one, right, because you'll find all kinds of reasons to think of why you didn't get the role. And I think the short answer is in most job searches, people who don't get the roles or the finalist doesn't get the role is likely not due to them, it is due to factors that are outside of their control, particularly in a GC role. So in a GC role, your closest advisor, you are one of the closest advisors to the CEO. And that relationship has to click. And so that's first and foremost. And you know, just like you click with other people, I click with certain people. Your CEO has to click. And so I think looking at being disappointed, being upset, getting through that emotion very quickly and looking at the reality and then asking was there something about the role that it really wasn't the right role for me. And when we talked about this concept of being the silver medalist at the Ascend program, it was really in the context of executive search and how they, they really like sometimes the silver medalist because they, they know they got so close to the job that they're likely to, to be a good fit for the next role. And I was a silver medalist to the executive search firm that actually placed me here at warf. And when I look back on that, that was the right outcome. That wasn't the right role for me for several reasons for me and I'm sure for several reasons for the CEO there. And so I think it's just recognizing that you are waiting for the, for the right fit and it will come. I think one of our colleagues on our Ascend planning committee with you always says your CEO is out there, you need to find your CEO. And I think that's true. And again, it's hard, but you're going to do lots of hard things in your job. You're going to have lots of things where they don't go exactly the way you want and you're going to have those sort of moments of doubts and moments of sort of feeling a lack of self confidence. But I think you just have to sort of do your download and then keep moving forward. And every time that you get that far right, it's a great opportunity to interview. And I also think people should take and step back for a moment and recognize that the job process, the job search is a two way street. Not only are they looking for you, you're looking for them. And so you should be taking things away from what worked well in the, in your interview process, what didn't work well, things you might have saw that you say I don't want that for me or oh, I really like that in my next job, you know, my next interview, I'm going to look for a company that does or doesn't do something.
- [19:28]
A
Yeah, you know, I'M I'm. The point about the CEO fit. I think again, if you're not in the GC role, you don't see how much that relationship is just core. If you don't have alignment with the CEO on values, that's what I would say. Like, you know, I always say my job is a hard job, but it's much easier because I align with the corporate values and the values of the leadership. I was in just a silver medalist moment. I'll share. I was in a GC search several years ago and I had a friend who was at the company who was kind of giving me, you know, I had interviewed with them as well, and they told me, you know, wow, I think you have it by a mile. And when I didn't get it, I was extra disappointed because I thought, you know, this person had kind of the inside track and, you know, the CEO actually called me to tell me, you know, like, don't. This isn't about you. You know, I. It's just this other person was just a better fit. So you're going to land this one day and thanks for being part of it.
- [20:29]
B
So I think if you haven't been in the GC role, one thing I think you don't understand is, and this goes back to your first question about being a strategic advisor is that the true practice of law is very. Is a tiny portion of what.
- [20:44]
A
Yes.
- [20:45]
B
So then people say, well, what do you do? And I always say, I have a pie, and the slice, the sizes of the slices change. But that in that pie is, I am a lawyer, I am a finance person, I am a diplomat, I am a politician, I am a psychotherapist. So it's sort of all of those different hats have to fit with whoever is your CEO is going to be. I mean, they have to think, oh, I can get legal advice from her, she can support my board, she can be a politician and be diplomatic. She can be the therapist I need to talk to when I just need to vent about things. So I think that's, you know, that, that it's more than just, well, I'm a great lawyer. Why isn't it you didn't want to hire me?
- [21:25]
A
Yeah.
- [21:26]
B
Yeah.
- [21:26]
A
Well, that's really important, Deborah, because as you're saying that, I'm thinking about how you show up in that interview to, to demonstrate some of those skills. Because again, I think if you haven't been in the gcc, you don't realize how much time you just spend talking with the CEO. I mean, I can't even count the hours that I would spend in their office just. Just talking, just actually listening a lot of times to things that had happened in their careers or things that were important to them. And they're not necessarily bringing you in there to have you solve their legal problems. They're like, they want to know that you're a trusted person that can be, you know, that. That ear.
- [22:05]
B
And I will say that when it, when it works and it's the right fit, it's a really fulfilling, great feeling. Right. And so if you're. If you don't have it or you can't find it, you should keep looking for it, because when you do get it, it really is extraordinarily rewarding. The other thing I would say about the search and the silver medalist is you also have to think about the leaders, the other people on the leadership team, because those are the people that you will be guiding about risk management and guiding about legal. And when they meet you, they are definitely going to be thinking about, is this a person I want to work with? You know, does this person look like a team player or do they look like they know everything about the law and I'm not going to be able to work with them? So it's stressful to think, what's the expression? You only get like, one the first time to make a good impression. But that's what you're doing, and that's what people on your leadership team, in addition to your CEO, are thinking about. And then I'll. One last layer. If you have to interview with the board. So for my wharf role, I interviewed with the chair of our board, the chair of our governance committee, another one of our board members. And so then you've got a whole nother constituency that already met you. And so you need the CEO, the board, and the other C suite executives to all be aligned on the same person. I think when you put it that way, it's really hard to think. Yeah, everyone will align on the same person.
- [23:31]
A
Yeah. Purple unicorn. I want to also, another question that came up, and I get this, a lot is in. It's. I mean, it's kind of a time management question. But it's also, you know, how do you carve out time for, quote, extracurriculars and why should you. And you and I both do a lot in the extracurricular space? So I'll just say for me, and I mean, this conversation with you and our relationship has come out of extracurriculars. I mean, I just want to give you a big shout out and appreciation. I mean, you hosted my leadership team at WARF and helped us shape our innovation agenda. I mean, that would not have happened but for our extracurricular activities and our connection so.
- [24:21]
B
Well, that is so true. And it was so wonderful to be able to bring you and your team in and to say, oh, you know, my friend is going to be here and, you know, she's doing this really great thing with her organization and how could we help? And just sitting in, I. One of the things I thought was so great about that conversation is you and I are the lawyers that brought everyone together.
- [24:38]
A
Yeah.
- [24:39]
B
But didn't really have a whole lot to say in the conversation. We just watched our respective business partners, like, just get so interested and involved in sort of, you know, what you're trying to do at cott. So, yeah, that was really. That is a good point. You know, when it comes to this, I sort of think I go back to thinking about raising my kids, my daughters, and thinking like, I am not one to give parenting advice, but one thing I did learn with my children is that when it comes to their extra curricular activities, they have to wanna do it. And no amount of pushing them is going to change the fact that if they're. It's not in their heart and their soul, they're not going to do it. And I think I carry that into my own personal extracurricular activities. So the things that I do are things I'm passionate about and I carve out time for them because I love doing them. Now I'm at a point in my life right now where my. My kids are in their 20s, and so I have extra time, but I think there is a sort of pressure to get lots of things done. I don't want to put more pressure on people that already feel that pressure. But I do think if you want to have an impact in a GC role, part of what you bring to the table is sort of what you do outside of being a lawyer. And it gives you different ways to think, it gives you different relationships, it gives you different skill sets. So I always say when people ask about, like, board service, should I be on a board? I don't know if you should be on a board or not, but what I do know is if you want to be on a board, you should pick a board that you're passionate about, whatever the board is doing. Otherwise it's just going to become a chore. So I laugh because I don't know if you and I are the ones to take advice from about what to do in the world of career activities, since we seem to do a lot of those.
- [26:22]
A
Yeah, I mean, I echo that. You should do something that you like. I do. I mean, I. I look at the extracurriculars through the lens of connection. So, you know, a lot of the things that I do are because I am hungry to connect with people, and those connections are helpful to me personally. They're helpful to me professionally. It's an opportunity for me to make a contribution. And so that's the lens that I come to it. And, you know, I'm kind of cringe about this, but there is this perception, and I actually think it's right. It's unfortunately true, is that in a GC role, people are expecting you to have a presence, a brand, you know, be known. So I do think that serving on panels, being, you know, was talking to, I think somebody at the Ascend program about. I worked with a lawyer who had been like a state bar leader, which I think among the lawyers, you sort of think, like, what a thankless volunteer opportunity. But the business people thought that this lawyer was like the bee's knees because they had served as a state bar president. You know, so having a presence, being known, I think is something that people are looking for in a general counsel.
- [27:41]
B
I think that advice goes to most C suite positions. Right. And I think being active and involved in some sort of association or group in whatever your industry is, is also very helpful. You know, one of the things I think is that we all love our outside counsel and we all love to be able to leverage them if budget allows and when the issue requires. But I have found that I have learned so much about issues that are germane to me from the relationships I've made with. With trade associations in higher ed. It's been nacuad in here at Tech Transfer. It's autumn. And so I think that makes me a better GC because I have found colleagues that I can talk to about various issues. So the answer isn't always, well, I need to retain somebody. I can solve things from the networks that I have. And it does feel good when you get to say to somebody, oh, wait, I know somebody who's at X place. Let me just call them and see. So I think you're right. I think it's. There is this pressure. I need a brand for my next job. But it's also good for you. I mean, you get so many things out of it that are so rewarding.
- [28:51]
A
Yeah, no question. No question. Okay, last question. And it's maybe a Sensitive one. After our program, one of the attendees reached out to me and asked about how to negotiate comp in a GC role. And I'm gonna put a link to an episode that I did with John Gilmore, who's one of the principals of Barker Gilmore on comp in the legal department. He had some great tips. But, Deborah, what do you say?
- [29:17]
B
I think first and foremost is know your value, know your value and know your worth. And I think that drives your ability to advocate for yourself. I think a lot of us come up through Big Law. And in my days in Big Law, it was lockstep, so I didn't have to learn how to negotiate my comp till I was very, very senior in my career. And it's a little scary even knowing this. Know what you're worth, be able to go in. So I think data points, having a point of reference so that you can talk about whatever it is that you're asking for and being able to say why you're entitled to it. We hear CFOs in our ReadySETC program talk about this. When legal comes with an ask, you sort of like, oh, I need another lawyer.
- [30:02]
A
And.
- [30:02]
B
And why and what is the lawyer going to do? Is the lawyer going to save money? I think that applies here as well, which is having your justification understand, to the extent possible what other people in your organization are getting paid. And also think about the reasons why what you want may not be what you really are entitled to or what is really right and fair. And I think people I've talked about this concept with is fairness and equity. I want to be paid fairly and equitable for the job I am doing. And then the question becomes, is your number fair and equitable versus what you're making or what somebody is responding to you within your ask. But I would say, yes, it is a sensitive question. And not everybody's good at it. Right. You would think we're supposed to be really good at it because I'm a litigator by training, right. So I litigated for a living. So you would think. But once you start, it becomes about you. It's personal and it's much harder and it's much different.
- [31:05]
A
I think having benchmarks is right on. John Gilmore talked about knowing what the other peers in the C Suite are making because, you know, they don't. The CEO wants to have some sort of equity across the band. And so I think for nonprofits, people may or may not know this. The tax returns, the 990s that are publicly available will show the comp for the highly paid executives. And actually if the GC is not on there, to me that's kind of a red flag.
- [31:36]
B
And I also think, though, in that vein, it's also thinking sometimes there are roles that honestly suite that do make more money. Right. So if you're one common is revenue generator versus non revenue generator, but also preserving the company's risk and supporting the governance. These are important roles. And so I think a GC should probably be in that, you know, higher range of the C suite executives. But I think you're right. A good organization will have a place where the CEO has equity and fairness across the C suite. Because then if you're working with your peers and you feel significantly undercompensated or they think you're significantly overcompensated, you know, that doesn't necessarily breed a great team.
- [32:22]
A
Yeah. Let me just. In terms of the how and you know, I had an experience in my career. This wasn't. I mean, I was the. So I wasn't. I wasn't negotiating for myself, but I had a member, a potential team member, and they made the comp negotiation so painful that it made me question whether I wanted to hire them. You know, how you show up and I mean, it was like the numbers were being crunched and it was, you know, just every little dollar was just scrutinized. It was really, really not fun. And so how you present yourself in those sorts of. Because that's a sensitive conversation, you are showing kind of who you are to the company. For some more tactical feedback, I would. This is an early episode of the legal department, episode 11, with Dinah Beasley and Heather Fine of Major Lindsay in Africa. There's towards the end of the episode, we talk about negotiating comp. So there's some good tips there.
- [33:20]
B
But, you know, I think I thought of the question more for negotiating in your role when I was answering. But I think you make a great point about when you're negotiating to join an organization. You know, it's that pennywise and pound foolish. Yes. Yes. You need to really be thinking about what does it say about you. And one piece of advice I would give because I thought a lot about this, which is there shouldn't be a stereotype that because you're a lawyer, whatever they offer you, you have to ask for more so that you can demonstrate that you know how to negotiate. Because I would say knowing how to negotiate also entails knowing when not to. When not to. That's exactly right. And I think that we as lawyers sometimes think oh, well, if I don't ask for more or I don't negotiate, they're going to think that I'm not going to negotiate well for the organization. And I think you're absolutely right. Sometimes people leave a bad taste in the mouth of the team that they're joining because they made it so much about the benefits and the compensation.
- [34:18]
A
Yeah. All right, Deborah, those are our questions as we're wrapping up here. Do you want to talk a little bit about the next Ascend or what you've got going on with Ready Set GC this year?
- [34:29]
B
Sure. Thank you. That would be great. So we just wrapped up a very long set of programs. We did a GC program in Seattle our first time, and we also did the GC program in Chicago, and we also did the Ascend program in Chicago. So we're going to take a short break to reset. And then the last week in September, we're going to come to New York and we're going to host both the GC programs. So those are for women in the first few years, one to four years of their first GC role, and the Ascend program for aspiring GC women, all in the same week with a very generous and gracious sponsorship of Cooley. So they hosted our New York program last year, so we're super excited to partner with them again. And we've got a couple webinars coming up in the next couple months, so you can find those on readysetgc.com and I'm looking forward to seeing you again in New York. I did want to just give a plug you mentioned that you were there, but I want people to understand you aren't just there. When we launched that, when we decided to launch this program, we put together this planning committee of people around the legal community that we thought would really help Ready Set GC develop really good content that would help people in their search and not just sort of be spend the day with us and we'll tell you someday it'll be a gc. And so you graciously agreed to join that planning committee. So I just want to give you a shout out for that. It's been a really fun ride. This program has just really, just blossomed and I'm very excited to see where it goes next.
- [35:57]
A
Yeah, know, it's, it's really, it's fun. It's very rewarding. And I encourage everybody to go to readysetgc.com and check out all the programming and materials. Deborah, thanks for being here in office hours with me times four. Appreciate that.
- [36:13]
B
You're very welcome. I appreciate that. I keep getting asked back, so I'll cross my fingers and hope there is a fifth. A five peat. Whoa, whoa.
- [36:20]
A
A five, Pete. And as we wrap up, I also want to thank filejet for sponsoring the Office Hours series. If you haven't checked out filejet, I encourage you to do it. They're not fancy. It's not like sexy software. But if you're an organization that has a lot of entities, this is a great tool to help you manage it. You don't have to worry about all those filings. The tech does it for you. So thank you to the filejet team. And Deborah, I'll see you again soon.
- [36:48]
B
That sounds great. It was great spending the hour with you. Take care.
- [36:54]
A
Hey, before you go, if you want more content from the legal department, check out TLD Goal Getter on Substack. It's a mix of free and subscription based content to help you level up your career. That's TLD Goal Getter on Substack. Hope you check it out.