The Lord of Spirits – Episode Summary

Episode: “But We Have the Mind of Christ”

Date: July 9, 2021
Hosts: Fr. Andrew Stephen Damick & Fr. Stephen De Young
Theme: The Seen and Unseen World in Orthodox Christian Tradition, and how Ancient Christianity understands knowledge, perception, and the spiritual mind—the nous.

Overview

This episode explores how the Orthodox Christian tradition understands "knowledge," specifically focusing on the concept of the nous (the spiritual mind/eye of the soul), contrasting ancient and modern approaches to knowing reality. The hosts discuss the limitations of modern epistemology, ancient categories of knowledge (like epistemi, doxa, phronesis, technē, sophia), how spiritual perception works, and how our engagement with thoughts, the world, and the divine shape us.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Modern vs. Ancient Notions of Knowledge

Timestamp: 01:07–20:00

• The modern world equates knowledge with scientific demonstration ("studies have shown").
• “Science is a valid way of knowing the things you can know by it, but it doesn't give you knowledge of everything.” (Fr. Andrew, 17:54)
  • Epistēmē (scientific certainty) is only one narrow way of knowing, even in Ancient Greece.
• Most human knowledge—like history—cannot be replicated, proven, or demonstrated the way science requires; such knowledge falls into the realm of doxa (opinion/seeming/perspective).
• Orthodoxy's “doxa” does not mean “worship,” but rather “the right viewpoint, the right perspective…the right opinion.” (Fr. Stephen, 10:44)
• The collapse of all knowledge into “objective scientific proof” or “mere opinion” is a modern error; the ancients had a broader, richer view.

2. Testimony, Interpretation, and Subjectivity

Timestamp: 10:18–29:00

• Knowledge by testimony (courtroom witness, personal experience) is valid and inescapable in daily life.
• The “subject-object” distinction in knowledge is modern and flawed—no knowledge is truly “objective,” since subjects (people) are always involved.
• “You've never known anything objectively…there is always a subject, a viewpoint, in all knowledge you ever have because you are finite.” (Fr. Stephen, 27:39)

3. Types and Ways of Knowing (Ancient World)

Timestamp: 34:28–79:56

a. Moral Reasoning / Phronesis (Prudence)

• Knowing good and evil: not about deliberative ethical dilemmas but about being formed to instinctively choose the good (“becoming like God”).
• “You're moving towards something and away from something else by these choices…the kind of reasoning we're talking about is not about ends, it's about means.” (Fr. Stephen, 39:10)
• Ascetic struggle and redirecting passions are tied to this kind of practical reasoning.

b. Techne (Know-how/Art/Technology)

• Making and crafting as a kind of knowledge: “Jonathan Pageau knows things about working with wood that I do not know…” (Fr. Stephen, 69:34)
• Techne is morally ambivalent; it can be used for good or evil.
• Ancient technology was seen as a gift that could bless or curse, depending on whether one was rightly prepared.

c. Wisdom (Sophia)

• “Wisdom is the patterns built into creation. Wisdom is knowing them, discerning them.” (Fr. Stephen, 72:12)
• Proverbs: Go to the ant…look at the lilies—see the divine order in all things.
• Christ is “Logos" and pre-incarnate Wisdom/ordering principle. St. Maximus: the logoi of creation lead us back to the Logos (Christ)—the knowable, meaningful patterns by which creation reflects its Creator.

d. The Nous (Spiritual Mind/Eye of the Heart)

• The highest faculty: organ of spiritual perception, enabling encounter with God, the saints, the angels, and the powers of darkness.
• Not the same as brain/mind in the modern sense—a faculty for receiving and focusing thoughts.
• “The mind [nous] is essentially an organ of perception, like your eye or your ears, that it receives thoughts, that thoughts come from the outside….” (Fr. Andrew, 98:22)
• “Thoughts come into the nous from noetic beings. Your inner monologue is not you.” (Fr. Stephen, 112:14)
• The goal of prayer and ascetic struggle is to focus the nous on God and guard against harmful or demonic thoughts.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Stop saying that orthodoxy means right worship…It’s not what the word means. Etymologically, right.” — Fr. Stephen (11:17)
• “No one lives their life that way [demanding scientific demonstration for all knowledge] ... you don’t go master mechanical engineering before you get in your car and start it.” — Fr. Stephen (19:19)
• “Every good thought that you receive is from the Lord. So think about that for a second. Focus on that for a second.” — Fr. Andrew (129:18)
• “Once we understand that what we allow into our mind and entertain there changes us…we should realize the dire danger that we're in living in modern Western culture.” — Fr. Stephen (134:51)
• “Looking is touching because looking is transformational.” — Fr. Andrew (123:01)

Important Segment Timestamps

• Modern/Ancient Knowing: 01:07–20:00
• Subjectivity, Testimony: 10:18–29:00
• Moral Reasoning & Virtue: 34:28–49:26
• Techne & Technology: 61:40–66:57
• Wisdom & Patterns: 71:01–80:01
• The Nous: What and Why: 82:22–130:03
• Combatting Modern Overload/Spectacle: 129:44–135:04

The Role of the Nous in Orthodox Spirituality

• The nous must be purified by prayer and ascetic discipline; spiritual life is about learning to receive and focus on the right thoughts (from God), while rejecting demonic or harmful thoughts.
• Orthodox spirituality is not about repressing or ignoring the mind but redirecting its focus to the divine, through “monologistic prayer” (the Jesus Prayer) and participation in the liturgical life of the Church.

Listener Q&A Highlights

• James: Where is the spiritual center in the body? (Answered: The spiritual and material are interwoven, but not tied strictly to specific organs. Makes a preview for the next episode.)
• Troy: Is the “essence/energy” distinction applicable when we know other humans or angels? (Answered: Yes—one knows another through their energies, not their essence.)
• Scott & Aaron: What is the soul? What’s the difference between soul & spirit? (Answered: The soul animates and gives form to matter; soul is “life,” while spirit can refer to the immaterial capacities/personhood.)

Concluding Takeaways

• Orthodox Christianity affirms multiple modes of knowing—beyond the modern scientific method (epistēmē)—with the nous at the center for perceiving God and spiritual reality.
• Spiritual growth involves retraining ourselves to focus the nous on Christ, to guard our thoughts, and to recognize that what we dwell on transforms us.
• In a world bombarded by distraction and spectacle, deliberate engagement in the spiritual disciplines is necessary to become truly human and receptive to God.

For Listeners New to the Topic

This episode is an illuminating guide to how ancient Christian tradition views the mind, knowledge, and the spiritual universe—not as abstractions or superstitions, but as domains directly impacting daily life, spiritual health, and how we see (and become) reality itself.