Gilles Mendel (1:52)

And yeah, I mean, as I said, it's quite an experience, I have to say. I just saw recently, you know, a documentary on Ferragamo, you know, the shoemaker. And he was talking. I mean, the experience was the same, you know, from the love of a product, the love of making something beautiful. From the understanding he came to America, you know, and he developed. He basically dressed all these big celebrities as well. And it was the same principles, you know, the principle of loving the making, the making the product, you know, the respect of the material. I mean, this whole love into the artisani, which is basically what I come from, you know, this. This mastery of artisan that proud of their work. I mean, this is like what fire was behind my experiences.

Interviewer (2:38)

So the. My aspiration in interviewing you and the reason I Asked you is because most people really don't understand the fashion business. I mean, they have a sort of celebrity tinged hue of what it's like. But obviously because we've been family for many years now, I have an insider view. And I realize in talking to people in my life, most people really don't understand the grind of the fashion business and the. And it starts with the love, but we'll get there for a second. But I want to get into your background a bit, if you don't mind. So you were born in Post War France, 1955?

Gilles Mendel (3:13)

Yes.

Interviewer (3:13)

5155. Is that.

Gilles Mendel (3:16)

Yes.

Interviewer (3:17)

Lucky numbers, right?

Gilles Mendel (3:18)

Yes.

Interviewer (3:19)

What are your memories of post war France? Because Paris obviously, famously was not bombed.

Gilles Mendel (3:27)

No, I mean, you know, I mean, I grew up, you know, I mean I grew up in an area in Paris called Neuilly, you know, which is a little wood of Boulogne. In fact, I was born at the American Hospital in Paris, which is the American hospital, who do know that later on, here we are. Here I am, you know, in America. I mean, you know, I grew up surrounded by obviously my parents that had such tremendous experience with the war and so on. So it was during my whole youth they tried not to impose in me what they went through. Even my religious. I have not been religiously educated in any way. It was very free because they really suffered enormously. My mom went to a terrible concentration camp. I just read recently that in Drancier, where she was staying, where she stood during the war, 70,000 people went in and only 2,000 went out. And she was one of them. So it's like incredible. And you know, to date, unfortunately, she passed away. But till the last moment, she really never really wanted to talk about it. I mean, it was such a trauma. I mean, you could imagine. Just can't imagine.

Interviewer (4:39)

It's almost unimaginable, unimaginable what people went through.

Gilles Mendel (4:42)

Incredible. And my dad, the same thing. You know, his, his story is incredible. This man was a man of multi talented. But you know, he was, he grew up as a furrier because he was, you know, in the Jewish family. The first son, the first boy, you know, tries to become a doctor. They tried to give him an education. The second, my dad had to go and work with a family. That's how it is. So from the age of 6, 7 years old, he was already starting to work and help, you know, the mother and my grandfather, you know, as a furrier, you know, to do things. And so he. During the war, which is crazy if you think of it you know, he. I mean, first of all. Should I talk about that for a minute?

Interviewer (5:24)

It's right here.

Gilles Mendel (5:25)

Okay.

Interviewer (5:26)

So you're doing it for me? Yeah. Okay.

Gilles Mendel (5:28)

I mean, it's insane. I mean, this is a man who was barely educated for a long time. He was really purely educated as a master furry. I mean, he learned from my grandfather, you know, the trade and so on. But when he was in his twenties, you would think that. How do you. How do you, you know, the war started and, you know, what makes you fight and become a part of the Resistance? You would think. Well, he wrote a book, my dad, after a while. And, you know, and in his book, he says that basically the story was that he fell in love with a girl, you know, and that girl happened to be in the Resistance. And the next day, you know, he wanted somebody to date her, that she took him one day and he said, okay, come over. We have something. We're going to go and bomb a bridge. And he was sudden, suddenly, in a car with a grenade between his legs going, you know, to bomb the bridge where the Germans were coming. And that's how he started the war. Then the Germans, you know. You know, obviously after that, the Gestapo, you know, were searching for him. And he went for one year in the south of France, hidden in a little farm where he couldn't get out. He had to hide because, you know, they were looking for him. So the only time he could get out maybe is at nighttime a little bit. But anyway, so he started to read. And he read everything he could find, right? So until that moment, since I know my dad, till his last, he would send me first, you know, faxes before the emails. But he would send me faxes and stories, and he could never talk to me without poetry. He would write. It was always beautiful. He would even say to me, gilles, maybe today you should do this, you know, in work, or you should, you know, I advise you to do that. He would come with maybe a poem from Baudelaire or something. He would come out with. It was insane. You know, the man was kind of. Kind of a special guy.

Interviewer (7:11)

Is it true he was decorated after the war by Mitterrand and. Yeah, well, he got a Resistance fighter.

Gilles Mendel (7:16)

He got a medal. Yes, he was decorated and. Yeah.

Interviewer (7:20)

But, you know, talk a little bit about how your parents met, because it's this unlikely sort of meeting.

Gilles Mendel (7:27)

I mean, the. I mean, how they met, I'm not sure. I mean, they met through family. You know, it's. In those days, you know, my mother had many brothers and you know, they had. When you had to meet, if you met some. My dad, in order to meet her, had to meet all the brothers. She couldn't go out without the six brothers behind her going. They met in Paris. That's where they met. And during the war. After the war. They just met right after the war. But nothing. I don't think there was anything particularly.

Interviewer (7:55)

I thought your daughter had told me a story that involves something a little bit more poetic, like a movie scene.

Gilles Mendel (8:01)

Oh, really? No, I don't recall that, no.

Interviewer (8:05)

Well, we blame her for giving me the wrong information. So you're the fifth generation of your family that entered what we would loosely call the fashion business, but it was really the furrier business.

Gilles Mendel (8:21)

Yes. Yeah. I mean, you know, from, you know, 1870, you know, in Lenin. I mean, from Nicolas II, where I'm sure they had, you know, the Jews were, as, you know, during that time in the late 19th century, you know, they were kind of segregated in some areas of Russia. I mean, it was, you know, I think it was called the Pelset Settlement. You know, it was an area between Belarus and Ukraine. And, you know, there was an area where they could live and if they had special skill of some sort, you know, you would be able to go to. And go to Russia, go to Leningrad and eventually, you know, do things like my great grandfather was doing, you know, for the tsar. He could make fur. He could do, you know, he had this extraordinary talent and artistry. He brought to there, you know, the knowledge of making of all the making of the firm, the artisani. His technical skill were very high. And I think that's why, because of his skill, he was able to start.

Interviewer (9:22)

Can you define what that skill would have been in the late 1800s?

Gilles Mendel (9:26)

Oh, well, the skill was really. I mean, you know, I mean, it's to make a fur coat, if you think of it, you know, it's very, very complicated and very artistic effort because, you know, I don't want to be too literal, but, you know, there's a lot of cutting, a lot of symmetrical things. You have to understand an animal doesn'. You know, the same character from the neck to the bottom of his. You know, the skin has a. The hair has a different. So in order to make a garment very uniform, you have to really understand the leather on the leather side, how to cut the skins to make it right. So there is a huge, huge amount of technical knowledge that in those days, you know, was required. And my grand. My great grandfather, you know, you know, got this from you, from his Trade. I mean, the Jewish people, you know, I think the fur trade was. Comes from hundreds and hundreds of years, you know, so it's. I think he was highly skilled. He was extremely skilled. And when he came. When my grandfather, you know, left after the revolution, you know, this Russian area and came to France, he brought with him this, you know, his knowledge, his technical knowledge. And that's how he started to build something in Paris.

Interviewer (10:42)

What. What economic situation were your parents in when you were young? You know, were they poor or were they sort of middle class or.

Gilles Mendel (10:53)

They were. No, they were a little bit. They were middle class, maybe a little bit better than middle class. I mean, you know, my. But, you know, my father would come home at night and continue to do his work, watching television, you know, at home, on front of the tv, but still trying to make up a little bit so he could, the next day, have already advanced his work. He had an atelier originally. When I was little, my dad had a beautiful little shop, but, you know, with an atelier with one sewer. And he was making. I mean, those days there was maybe four or five styles, you know, that he would offer to the clients. And they were all bespoke pieces. Basically, every time somebody would come, he would make them for custom. And, you know, it's. It's. But from him I learned. And when I was little, you know, I was. I would go to the workshop and I, you know, smelled, you know, the workshop and all this, the noise of the machine. And I would look at this man who was very handsome, with long hands, a little diamond ring. And I would look at him nailing the skins on a board, and it would be like looking at the architecture of Versailles, the gardens of Versailles. All these skins were laid out on the board. And he had old nails and a tool that maybe belonged to his father. Femme, old tool. And he would do nail by nail, stretching the skin, wetting the skin, stretching the skin on a board. And at the end, it would be immaculate. It was like, I mean, as I said, like a plan of Paris. You know, it was very beautiful. So, I mean, I saw him and I saw him doing that for many years, till one day he moved to Rue Saint Honore in Paris. And, you know, it was a time my mother was very, very, very visionary. And she knew that this man was so talented, he needed to be more exposed to the world of fashion and so on. And Rue St. Honore was the street, and he's still the street in Paris to be in.

Interviewer (12:50)

So it was your mother that sort

Gilles Mendel (12:51)

of pushed my Mother, Yes. She was the one who really put. My dad would have stayed where he was. He was very happy.

Interviewer (12:56)

Was her vision that he could sort of elevate himself in the fashion folk world.

Gilles Mendel (13:01)

And, you know, it's. I don't think up to that time, there was you talking so much. I mean, there is fashion. I think I have been more the one who brought more even this idea of fashion to the world. I mean, that embraced more the fashion element. My dad looked at himself like, you

Interviewer (13:18)

know, like a craftsman.

Gilles Mendel (13:21)

A craftsman who was making unbelievable things he didn't want. He didn't need to do quantities. He didn't want to do anything that was beyond, you know, the artistry of his work. And he was very proud of it. And there was something my mom was the one pushing and saying we should try to do to be more involved. You know, you're so talented. You have so much to offer. Why don't you give that. Why don't you show that to more people?

Interviewer (13:42)

I see.

Gilles Mendel (13:43)

And I was the instrument of that, basically. You know, when I decided to move into my family's world, in the work world, I basically. I'm the one who instigated this connection with designers, because my mother was basically this little bundle of beauty who was always, constantly. I would be one day in Paris and she would arrive in a little Mini Cooper with a famous designer next to her, like Azina Laiya, you know, and she had many very famous designers around her that loved her. And it was not about the spending of the money or it was more because she was very charismatic. She loved to dress, and she really was so inspiring. And she's definitely one of my best inspiration.

Interviewer (14:35)

Yeah. When we were last in Paris, your daughter and I, we went to the Alaia Museum.

Gilles Mendel (14:39)

Yes.

Interviewer (14:40)

And she was talking about, imagine, my grandmother used to come here.

Gilles Mendel (14:43)

Yes. Yeah, it's. Yeah. And I went. When I was little, she would take me to the atelier of Alaia. And. But she was. Yeah, she was incredible. She really introduced me to that. And, you know, and when I was at that age, younger, I would go to the atelier. And that's how I discovered, in fact, completely fashion, because I saw those designers in the space, you know, and I saw their collections, and I saw those assistants sketching for them, and I was looking at those fittings with clothes that felt, like, surreal to me, you know, so looking at my dad, who was making this most immaculate, beautiful product, but one of a kind every time, and seeing those guys, you know, exploring, you know, the infinity of beauty, really Raised in my. I mean, definitely inspired me to.

Interviewer (15:29)

At that point in your life, like, let's say you're teens, your late teens is your idea. You're going to follow your father into the family trade or you're going to do something different?

Gilles Mendel (15:39)

Yeah, I never really thought I would follow my family's. Follow my father's, you know, steps and continue developing it. But I somehow, you know, I mean, you know, I did the business school. I was not too good in business school. I knew I cheat pretty well, so,

Interviewer (15:57)

I mean, business school just makes me laugh.

Gilles Mendel (15:59)

Yeah. Thank you very much. So, believe it or not, during that time, you know, I mean, I was trying to keep going by playing music. You know, I was. I had a band. I was playing. I had a band called Silver Hill.

Interviewer (16:11)

Silver Hill.

Gilles Mendel (16:12)

Silver Hill. Ask me why. I have no idea. But anyway, I was trying to escape from school as much as I could, you know, so I traveled a lot while I was at school. I, you know, even traveled to Guatemala. I discovered.

Interviewer (16:24)

We're getting to Guatemala, okay. Yeah.

Gilles Mendel (16:26)

But, you know, I did some. Some travel. But when I came back to Paris and I tried to be a businessman, you know, my best friend had a. His dad was a famous guy who was, you know, buying grains and selling grains, you know, all over the world and edging his buys at the Chicago trade, you know, world trade. I mean, anyway, I was doing all that, and I said, chill, what are you doing? I mean, this is not right. And I was always in. I mean, I drew always very well. I was very. That's something that I naturally had in me. And my mom was such an inspiration to me. And, you know, and by discovering those designers and so on, it really pushed me to say, you know what? I'm gonna try to take this little jewel box of my father. And instead of saying that I'm coming in, I would have. Because I knew right away that I could never be the master that he was. I mean, that master, he was impossible. But I could bring something he didn't have. So I said to. I used my mom's connections, and I introduced the first few months when I decided to work with him. I said, look, I come in, but let me bring designs. Let me bring a designer, a famous designer to do a collection with you, and maybe we'll go from there. So we had the first. The first designer was Jean Charles de Castel Bajac, which is, you know, someone very renowned in France. And we did a collection. We did a Runway show, and it went very well. My father was very Happy. We got suddenly pressed all over the place. You know, we were in l' Officier Vogue. It was incredible. And then I said, what do I do? And you know, I couldn't be in the shadow of this huge tree of my father. It was impossible. I could have never developed be myself. So for some reason, I decided out of the blue, without any kind of preparation, I said, I'm gonna go to America. I had a sketchbook of ideas that I wanted to design. You know, some, you know, I had some ideas, but I was not really totally prepared. So I'm gonna go to America and maybe I'm opening a store on Madison Avenue. Why not? You know. So I went on a tourist visa to New York and I walked the streets of Madison up and down. You know, it was the, you know, early 80s. Everybody at that time already you had, you know, all the stores with all the fur disappeared. At this point in the early eighties in New York City, you know, you already had a lot of anti fur movements, you know, posters about, you know, I want to be naked and wearing fur and all these things. So it was not like too good. But anyway, I was, I. So I realized very quickly that a store on Madison was not gonna happen because you had to have three, $400,000 in those days to spend. It was already like kind of a million dollars that I didn't have neither. My parents were gonna invest in this kid coming to New York after just few months having worked with my dad. And you know, I went on and on and on and I realized and I said, okay, I'm gonna go to Bergdorf Goodman. You know, the store. I happened to have to be connected because some public relation in Paris that I knew said, why don't you go and see Dawn Melo, who at the time was running Bergdorf Goodman. I showed my sketch and she very nicely, politely said to me, you know, thank you, but, you know, maybe go to the second floor, there is a third department, it's Fendi. Talk to the gentleman there and maybe, you know, so I went downstairs and gentlemen, very nicely said, yes, but thank you, but goodbye. So I was, I literally two, three days before I had to go back to Paris. I go to this restaurant which was in the third district in New York, which in those days was so colorful. A lot of little Jewish restaurants in corner streets and so on. And there was one called Traders, and it was like a salon. Billy, you know, you go in, you know, the doors would open like this, you go in and the women were passing by, you know, with, you know, sandwich, pastrami sandwiches and gefilte fish and whatever. And I'm sitting there with a broker of my father who was buying the skins. And I said, alvin, I'm going back. You know, I can't find anything. And the man introduced me, he said, you know, let me talk. A gentleman passed by in front of the door in front of us and said, you know, meet Gilles and so on. And the man said to me, maybe you should go back up. There is a place called Elizabeth Arden on fifth Avenue. And if you. There's a gentleman there, his name is Jerry Solovey. And if you go, you'll see on the second floor they sell fashion. But the mannequins are a little bit like this, you know, they're not too, you know, it's not really doing so well. Maybe, maybe you never know. You go and talk to them. I'll go short. I went up there, I met Jerry Sullivan. I saw this incredible second floor parlor room on fifth Avenue. You know, I was like. I was shaking. And believe it or not, we connected. He took me to meet Joe Ronchelli, the president of Elizabeth Arden in those days. A day later and on a shake hand, I swear on a shake hand without contract, 20% on sales. He said to me, you can have a little room on the second floor in the parlor room. And we have 13 locations all over America. If you like, you could travel and do your thing. And I became, you know, the Frenchman with his strong cases meeting the who's who of America. Yeah, that's made me start what's going back to the beginning, how I got to let's.

Interviewer (21:53)

Because we skipped over this one thing.

Gilles Mendel (21:54)

Sorry.

Interviewer (21:55)

It's a very interesting story. So talk about you. Why did you decide to go to Guatemala? Somewhere in this. It's a little before this, but it's generally the same time period. Tell that story.

Gilles Mendel (22:07)

Guatemala was a different story, you know, I mean, I wanted to discover America. I wanted to go.

Interviewer (22:12)

Why Guatemala?

Gilles Mendel (22:13)

Guatemala was purely because I wanted to go. The first trip I went in America, I went all the way to California. I remember I thought I was going to go to California, take Route 60 down the coast, get to and go to Mexico. I speak fluently Spanish and I thought, Gilles, are you going to. Let's go to Mexico. It's going to be fun. It's, you know, I was still, you know, I travel in buses, you know, youth hostels, whatever. And when I went down to. I passed by Tijuana and I went back to Mexico. I got really you know, scared. I thought, oh, this is not really for me. You know, the. The city was very crowded. Everything was not my thing. And I said, you know, maybe I should continue. It's not too far. I'm gonna go to the next frontier, which is Guatemala. And I went literally out of the blue. I remember I crossed the frontier by foot. I mean, to tell you how not prepared I had. I had just a little knapsack with my toothbrush. No camera, nothing. No drugs. You know, I was really completely in a mood of discovering something that I've experience in Europe. I don't even understand to date how my parents let me do that. It was insane because it was not a time of telephone, cell phones or anything. And the moment I stepped in Guatemala, in those days, for some reason, I felt totally at ease. The people were beautiful. The dress, they were dressed in those multicolored pajama outfits. The bags, the banana bags in multicolors. I loved it. And we went into buses that had another engine in the bus, and we would go in the jungle, and I had this people sitting on my knees with the chickens. But it was such an extraordinary experience, and I was lucky. The reason I stayed there longer than expected was because I discovered on the lake of Atitlan, there's a volcanic. Atitlan. Volcanic area. And there's a lake. And when I went, you know, it's beautiful area, and I met this chief of a tribe there and, you know, right on the beach, and we became friends. And he. It took me to all those little villages and, you know, the fact that I was not coming with cameras, I was not coming with kind of a, you know, I was not like a tourist. I was more. I wanted to blend. I think I was searching for, you know, something, and I found it there. And it was. I loved it. I felt there was no more judgment. I was not the son of a furrier. I was not, you know, I was just an in person dealing with beautiful, loving, extraordinary people. But my trip had to get cut short because I was, you know, mosquitoes love me and they. I mean, my feet were like, completely destroyed by mosquito bites. And, you know, in the jungle, it gets very. The humidity and so on. You cannot really getting infected. So I had to go back. And on my return. May I tell you a quick story? On my return, I want you to

Interviewer (25:11)

tell the whole arc of the story.

Gilles Mendel (25:12)

On my return, I go back and I make a mistake. So I had to fly back to Guatemala City right away. I mean, my feet were. And so I had to Take a flight back to Paris. And on my return, I made a mistake or somehow I had to stop in Boston. And I've never been to Boston. In fact, I've never been to Boston since. So to tell you. So I'm telling you a story that I remember from then. So I arrived at the airport in Boston and it was nighttime. So I said, what do I do? I said, oh, I should go to see Cambridge University. Since my flight, the next flight to Paris was the following day at night. I had one day to kill. So I said it was 2am So I said, how do I go? Because Cambridge University reminded me of my university because I went to a business school, which was also kind of a tough school to get in. Very similar campus, whatever. So I remember I took a train over the city. I arrived there and I fell asleep on the grass at 4 or 5am in 5am you know, I didn't know where I was in Guatemala. I was sitting in Guatemala. Literally. Curly hair up to my. You know, long curly hair. I had a banana bag from Guatemala. So I look, and I was very dark, and I'm sleeping on the grass. You know, somewhere there and there's a gentleman, an old man with a beard and a pipe pushed me. You know, he says, hey, where are you coming? Where are you coming from? And, you know, I look up and I said, well, I tell my story. And the man happened to be an old teacher of Harvard who kind of became friendly with me and said to me, well, how long have you been traveling? And I said, I've been traveling for the past three months. Have you read a paper recently? I said, no. In fact, I've been a little bit out of everything for the past three months. Anyway, he took me to the library. He showed me the first Gutenberg book printed. It was insane. And I spent the day with this gentleman. He gave me this whole tour of Harvard. Good. And went back to Paris. It was great.

Interviewer (27:14)

Beautiful story. So you're in New York. You have this deal with Elizabeth Arden.

Gilles Mendel (27:23)

Yes.

Interviewer (27:24)

You're strictly focused on making furs. Because that's your yes and no.

Gilles Mendel (27:28)

Because, you know, the whole principle of the whole. My whole principle was at those days, you know, you had furriers. You know, the furriers is like. You go to a store in those days and you had, like, fur coats. That was not my thing. Me, I wanted to show the artistry of making fur with fabric and transforming, really, making more fashion out of it. I was not searching just to do a fur coat. So my store was you know, there was a lot of cashmere, there was a lot of fabric mix, you know, capes and so on. So when you came to my store at Elizabeth Arden, you felt like you were in a fashion salon, even though primarily it was fur. But, you know, there was a lot of other things that matched together and, you know, so. So, yeah, when I started at Elizabeth Arden, that's how I presented myself. And. Yeah.

Interviewer (28:15)

What was your impression of New York at that time? This is late 80s.

Gilles Mendel (28:21)

Yeah, early 80s, mid-80s. New York was extraordinary. I mean, it was fun. It was incredibly. You know, for me, it was such an extraordinary experience. You know, the uptown, downtown mix I was living, you know, I was in one hand. I would be making a coat for Brooke Astor. At the same time, I would be having dinner with Keith Haring downtown. I mean, something totally surreal. Yeah.

Interviewer (28:44)

You were friends with Keith Haring and also you hung out in Warhols.

Gilles Mendel (28:47)

Yes, yes. I mean, without knowing really where I was, I mean, that was beyond my education. You know, I think in those days I was this little Jewish kid coming from Paris, you know, sheltered by my parents, even though I went to Guatemala. But, you know, when I remember, I always remember going to the Factory and having lunch with Andy War, who was in those days. I wanted to be in the Interview magazine. And I remember my whole experience with him, I didn't understand a single word, you know, because he was mumbling, the way he was talking, and I couldn't understand anything. I think I left. I didn't know what happened, but I was watching around. It was fabulous. I saw how he was printing his work and it was, you know.

Interviewer (29:29)

But I remember you telling me once, the Keith Haring offered you something of his and you. Yeah, I mean, you turned him down.

Gilles Mendel (29:36)

Yeah, turned me down. I didn't know because, you know, there was a lot of people around him, around this crowd. There was a lot of people with. Taking advantage of his work. Always, I always had a friend. You know, there was a lot of drugs, even though I was not into drugs, but, you know, a lot of cocaine. A lot of. In those days, it was, you know, people were. The nightlife and the art world was mixed with the uptown world. And it was interesting for that reason. At the same time, a lot of parasite around these artists. And, you know, and I, you know, I had my thing. I was doing fashion. I was developing something I loved and I loved to. To mingle with them, but, you know, it's. I never really fully understood in those days the value of taking a piece of Keith Haring's work and so on.

Interviewer (30:19)

You know, did you chart your success now that you're in this, you're in. Immersed in this world? Like, did you feel you were successful right away? Did it take a while to find a clientele? Like, walk me through that a little bit.

Gilles Mendel (30:34)

Yeah, it was a slow success, slow growth. But it's. Elizabeth Arden was such an extraordinary experience for me because imagine the who's who of America was going to Elizabeth Ireland for their hair done. You know, there was a hair salon in every. You know, the people were. It was a beauty place. You know, you would go on the red door, the red door on fifth Avenue, and the women were like pampered. So basically, you know, from the Marshall family, I mean, the names, you know, you gave me the list of all the celebrities. But, you know, there's a lot of people were not celebrities, but very well known people in the world of politics and so on who were going to Elizabeth Arden. So I had very quickly instant recognition and success because I would travel to all these stores from Rodeo Drive to the best locations, bring my trunk cases with my little cashmere trim coats and all this thing. And I was starting to dress really the who's who of America. So basically growth went slowly, but enough to allow myself after a few years to open finally my store on Madison Avenue. So, you know, even though, and I have to say it's a record because if you think of it, I've been. I was, I think I stayed about 10 years at Elizabeth Arden and there was really difficult years where fur was really, really hard when, you know, nobody wanted to be associated with this idea of fur. I was in a cosmetic company who had so much more to lose than me. And they kept me all along because I was successful. I was really doing well for them. So it shows you that there was a. A good. There was a very good partnership.

Interviewer (32:13)

Yeah, I think

Gilles Mendel (32:17)

for.

Interviewer (32:18)

Because, you know, fur is still a hot button topic. It's still being debated in American culture and you no longer are involved in fur. So I think people would need to know that because why we're talking so casually on it, it's not callous because I know one of the first discussions you and I ever had that had any depth about fashion was I wanted to understand you working in fur. And that was sort of the end of the. Yes, but I want you to talk a little bit about how you end up transitioning into dressmaking. Because as the story, as I remember it was PETA kept attacking your storefront. And so you made a couple dresses just to put in the window to keep people from attacking your store.

Gilles Mendel (32:57)

Yeah, it was. Yeah. I mean I was. The story is that when I opened Madison Avenue, my first boutique finally, even though I have to say having windows on fifth Avenue at Elizabeth island was quite something. But when I opened my first boutique, yes, everybody said, you're crazy, they're gonna break your windows, you know, not gonna last more than a week. So yeah, the first thing I did, I. There was a little coffee shop next to my store called Viond. Still there, little tiny place. I took a studio, a 200 sq ft little studio above, put two machines and I started to make little dresses. So I thought at nighttime instead of leaving the furs which are gonna break the windows, I'll put a coat and a dress to match, a little matching thing and see what happens. And then the, you know, being on in the 60s on Madison Avenue, you know, around there, there were ladies passing by and seeing my dresses and started to come in. So I said, wow, this is really amazing. I can really do this is really working. And you know, it create the attention a lot of people, inclusive, Bergdorf Goodman, who, when they saw that, you know, I was moving on Madison Avenue and I was doing this fur trim pieces, cashmere coats with match, they came to me as well. And that's how I started even to open my own store at Bergdale stuff

Interviewer (34:15)

because it eventually intersects into how we know each other.

Gilles Mendel (34:18)

Yeah.

Interviewer (34:20)

How did you fall in love? With my wife's mother, Jenny.

Gilles Mendel (34:25)

Oh gee.

Interviewer (34:26)

But how did you guys meet? Because, you know, as the story goes, my. My mother in law is. Is a bit of a Taiwanese princess. Yeah. Who, you know, born in Taiwan but end up living in Los Angeles. How did you and Jenny meet? Because I actually don't know that story.

Gilles Mendel (34:42)

You don't?

Interviewer (34:44)

Okay, well, do you want to tell that story? Yeah.

Gilles Mendel (34:46)

I mean this. Yeah. There was a club in New York called Aubar on the uptown, like an uptown club, you know. And a friend of mine, you know, took me there one night and we were dancing and so on, and I saw this beautiful, beautiful woman that was there, you know, beautiful little Chinese doll. She was gorgeous. And yeah, very simply, you know, we. I connected and for a while we. We dated, but there was nothing very serious. And one day I had a problem with my back and I had to have surgery of my lower back and I didn't want to see anybody. I went to the hospital. I said the night before, I don't wanna see anybody. You don't wanna Be bothered and so on. And this woman out of the blue came. I remember like a Chinese delivery she delivered to me at 8pm at night before food from the most delicious place in New York City. And I thought to myself, is really something, someone amazing. She went through all these efforts even to do that and I got invited and I married her.

Interviewer (35:54)

So back to fashion. Obviously I get to see it behind the scenes a bit and I hear about it every day, which is a different thing. But talk a little bit about the date because I think coming in from the outside, not knowing much about fashion, I mean I intersected with fashion house is through being famous in the 90s. But it was always kind of a show up and somebody lets you look around a bit kind of thing or gives you a coat. But I think the most shocking thing for me coming in from the outside and basically marrying into a fashion dynasty is the day to day grind of the fashion business. So for people who don't know about the fashion business but are curious, talk a little bit about the day to day grind of what is it like, like the seasonal calendar. The.

Gilles Mendel (36:40)

I mean fashion is, you know, is.

Interviewer (36:42)

The word I would use is relentless. It seems to me from the outside. And I thought the music business was bad. The fashion business is very punishing. It's relentless.

Gilles Mendel (36:51)

Yes, definitely. No, it's really, really hard. You know, you have to, you know, you have, you know, you normally have four collections a year to present. You know, spring, resort, fall, you know, I mean you can't. There's always something bridal, you know, you know, you constantly do colle. You have to recreate all the time something new. I mean I always felt very. I think fashion is really hard because if you think of it, if I was designing furniture and I'm successful at it, you repeat that piece of furniture forever because it's a classic in fashion. It doesn't work that way. You know, once a woman wears, you know, these dresses, you need already to change to a new style.

Interviewer (37:31)

So is that the drive for innovation in it? Because I don't really understand it even to this point is. Is it's always about what's the new thing? What's the new thing for the crowd that's buying?

Gilles Mendel (37:42)

Not in my world, but in the world of. In the most mass market world, yes it is. You have to constantly move on and bring some newness constantly. So that it appeals for the store to buy the stores. Why would they buy something if they had it already before? So you constantly have to recreate something in order to create attraction.

Interviewer (38:02)

Can you least. Again, for those that wouldn't know it, can you define a little bit about that kind of class of. Mostly women, obviously, but men too. But the. Is it the. I don't. What you call them, the wealthy couture class or the. Or the fashion groupies? I don't know what you call that group of people, but there's a group of people who drive the biggest fashion houses in the world to innovate in the couture end of the thing.

Gilles Mendel (38:29)

Yes.

Interviewer (38:29)

Because it's about creating buzz and vibe and who's on the ascendancy. Can you talk about that?

Gilles Mendel (38:35)

I'm not sure I fully understand. When you do Runway. I mean, most of the companies create runways in order to show newness in their collection, to bring some new styles. Today, we're living in a world, obviously, where everything is mediatically shown to the world quickly through social media and so on. So they have. There is a huge industry behind the showing of the collections to then to find. To have the celebrities, you know, promote them so that the celebrities promoting them create desire for the people in the, you know, to follow social media.

Interviewer (39:14)

But I'm also talking about, like, you know, the. The. The woman in Dallas who's married to a billionaire who will buy, you know, $100,000 couture piece because she wants to be the only person in the world.

Gilles Mendel (39:27)

Yes. I don't.

Interviewer (39:29)

I'm surprised.

Gilles Mendel (39:30)

I don't see it that way.

Interviewer (39:31)

Tell me if I'm wrong, but I'm surprised that that. That element of society also drives the fashion messaging as well. Maybe it's not as public as the celebrity.

Gilles Mendel (39:40)

I don't think it's as public as, you know, the celebrities.

Interviewer (39:44)

But I'm saying behind the scenes.

Gilles Mendel (39:45)

But behind the scenes. Yeah, it's a huge.

Interviewer (39:48)

Okay, that's what I'm after. Yeah.

Gilles Mendel (39:49)

Yeah, for sure. I mean, you know, this is the crowd that I'm following. For example, with House of Gilles, you know, we. But this crowd is sometimes more low key than you think, because, you know, they are. They follow the brands, they see, you know, the extravaganza of the brands, but at the end, you know, they want something bespoke, unique. They spend a lot of money, but, you know, the money they spend is also for, you know, this. They get something extraordinary, exclusive for them that is. That has a lot of.

Interviewer (40:16)

But to the average American, and I grew up as an average American, you know, lower middle class, you know, these figures that you hear thrown around, you know, somebody paid, you know.

Gilles Mendel (40:26)

Yeah. A few Hundred thousand dollars for. For a dress.

Interviewer (40:29)

Yeah, yeah. I mean, by the way, wear it one time. Time.

Gilles Mendel (40:32)

Yes.

Interviewer (40:33)

That's shocking to most people in the West.

Gilles Mendel (40:37)

Yeah.

Interviewer (40:37)

That's not to put it on you, because that's the business that exists. It exists with or without you.

Gilles Mendel (40:42)

Yeah. But I mean, you know, the value of what they buy, you know, they're spending, you know, there's a lot of work put behind. It's really one of a kind. You know, there's a whole lot.

Interviewer (40:53)

I can attest to that. The amount of hours that goes into it.

Gilles Mendel (40:56)

There is value to it. It's not a hype compared to many other things in fashion that I could call more of a hype.

Interviewer (41:01)

Sure.

Gilles Mendel (41:01)

You know, because, you know, the markup between sou. Something that is made cheaply and sold, you know, highly priced.

Interviewer (41:07)

If you go into one of these fashion houses and you buy with the logo, you're buying basically a hundred dollar parka.

Gilles Mendel (41:13)

That is correct.

Interviewer (41:14)

That somebody's charging. Yeah. 50 times markup because you spend.

Gilles Mendel (41:17)

Because all the money that they are spending in advertising and promoting and fashion shows and. And designers.

Interviewer (41:23)

Well, also that you're buying. You're buying. You're buying the vibe.

Gilles Mendel (41:25)

Correct? Correct.

Interviewer (41:30)

So you build J. Mandel up to the point where it's. It's a multi. Multi million dollar company. You have at some point a billionaire investor come in. What was the biggest sort of period of time for Jay Mendel when you were running it?

Gilles Mendel (41:45)

I mean, up to Rene, you know, during the time, you know, up to. I remember, you know, when we do a Couture show in 2016, where your wife, my daughter, you know, came to Paris with me and we started with. It was a lot of fun. I mean, there was really heights. I loved it. You know, it was a very extraordinary experience for me because, you know, I like to do everything. So for me at J. Mandel, it was, you know, from the windows. I love doing windows. So, you know, doing the windows on fifth Avenue on Madison Avenue was really my joy for a while in Paris we had a store and I would do the windows as well. And, you know, I got the best compliment because I always remember Albaz. Albaz was a designer of Lanvin. And he always made the most fabulous windows on Faubourg Sat Honoree in Paris. And one day I'm walking and this man walked and we met, you know, he knew me, I knew him. And he came to me and said, gilles, I love your windows. And it's like from a master saying that to me. You Know, made me really happy because I really. I enjoy this experience. I enjoy the window making. I enjoy when you're in the store, you know, meeting the customers, listening to their. You know, there's something about it. So when I did this for a long time, and I really enjoyed it, and it was fun, but it became also more and more becoming, you know, something less personal as you grow, you know, you make more products. You can't control all the product. And I like to control what I do. I like to. I like to put, you know, I have this imprint in me of this artisan, of this love of the product, respect of the product, which is really what I learned from my father and my grandfather. And I wanted to go back to that. And I think, you know, there was a point after 2016, and then when Covid came in, you know, I mean, a few.

Interviewer (43:32)

The results of the economic.

Gilles Mendel (43:34)

Yeah, there was an economic situation that lowered. Became also more difficult. But I would say most of it was this desire to move on, really. To do something that I really love and go back to the roots of something that I enjoy. And in addition to what. It's such a family experience that having my daughter joining me was such a. It's extraordinary, you know, it's nothing more extraordinary than that.

Interviewer (44:09)

Yeah. Okay. So speaking of your daughter. Oh, some. Around 2012, I show up in your life.

Gilles Mendel (44:15)

Yes, I remember that.

Interviewer (44:17)

So let's talk about that a bit.

Gilles Mendel (44:20)

Well, it's.

Interviewer (44:20)

I guess I'll put you on the spot a bit.

Gilles Mendel (44:22)

Yeah, you do. I mean, I'll be very honest, you know.

Interviewer (44:27)

Please.

Gilles Mendel (44:28)

When somebody said Smashing Pumpkin, I say, what? I had no idea, you know, to

Interviewer (44:33)

be fair, when somebody told me Jay Mendel, I didn't know what the hell they were talking about. So even on that score, I always

Gilles Mendel (44:39)

remember my daughter took me to a little tea house downtown. And she was. She wanted to talk to me. And I, you know, I. She said to me, dad, you know, I think I want to. You know, I don't think I'm staying in that school, you know, the. The Art Institute. I met somebody, and I think I'm on. He lives in this place and he tells. She tells me about this, you know, this mansion on the lake. Kind of freaky, you know, Kind of. What the hell is that? You know, this Adler. David Adler's house and all these details, you know, very dark, you know, it's like, you know. Okay, then she started to describe you a little bit more, you know, and, you know, I said. I mean, I didn't know who you were. So it was like I said, how old is he? Yeah. Oh, he's kind of a bit older. So I said, chloe, why don't you. Why don't you just don't go crazy, you know, Come back to New York. We spend all the time, you know. But she was so decided she really wanted to stay in Chicago. So I knew that I had very little chances to convince. And I always remember, you know, I went back home and said, what the hell? What is my daughter doing? I cannot believe it. You know, I started to look in the Internet who you were, and that became even worse. You know, I saw some of the women you dated prior to my daughter, and I said that. What the hell is going on here? I cannot just believe it. You know, it was like a world. I mean, a completely different world, as you can imagine. Yeah. So I said, what is Chloe finding so attractive about this man? I mean, you know, he is.

Interviewer (46:11)

I asked myself the same way, you

Gilles Mendel (46:12)

know, I don't know if you remember, we had a call together.

Interviewer (46:14)

Oh, I remember.

Gilles Mendel (46:15)

Oh, that call was so incredible. You are the perfect person to talk to when you have these kind of issues, because whatever you said to me, I didn't understand. So it's another Andy Warrell moment for me. You spoke to me so well, so eloquently. You persuaded me. You could have said any. You know, I was saying yes to everything you were saying because it was like I had no argument about nothing. You made me. I mean, I cried, cracked up. But anyway, yes, I freaked out. I. For a while, I was kind of worried. But you turn out to be an incredible person.

Interviewer (46:48)

Thank you. I love you, too.

Gilles Mendel (46:50)

Yeah, no, no, it's. And it's extraordinary.

Interviewer (46:52)

But back to that conversation, since we're talking about it openly.

Gilles Mendel (46:56)

Openly.

Interviewer (46:57)

Well, your cons. Well, your concern at the time was that your daughter would not fulfill her dreams.

Gilles Mendel (47:05)

Correct.

Interviewer (47:06)

And the thing I remember telling you on that phone call, and we didn't really know each other much at that point, was just, I don't want somebody who's just gonna sit at home. I want somebody who's. I can be proud of and successful. So.

Gilles Mendel (47:18)

Yes. But, you know, in those days, you know, I mean, looking back and knowing who you were at that time, or at least from what I could be,

Interviewer (47:26)

I was a mess. So I.

Gilles Mendel (47:27)

That's what I'm saying, you know, it was hard for me to. I mean, you could say whatever you were saying.

Interviewer (47:31)

I think the thing we could say, say. And I would say it if somebody was interviewing me I would say it the same as I'm saying it to you is your daughter. My wife is such an extraordinary person. She's changed both of our lives, and I think that's really. It's a testament more to her than to me.

Gilles Mendel (47:49)

Yes, definitely, Definitely.

Interviewer (47:51)

So that's where I'm blessed, you know?

Gilles Mendel (47:53)

Yeah, I'm blessed too.

Interviewer (47:54)

And you're my father in law, so I got you in the deal too, which was awesome.

Gilles Mendel (47:59)

Thank you.

Interviewer (48:00)

So let's back back to business here.

Gilles Mendel (48:04)

Well, she's in business now with me, so back to business.

Interviewer (48:06)

Well, we got to go back. We got to go back a little bit because it talks a little. It gets. Because it gets into the. The fur issue as well.

Gilles Mendel (48:11)

Okay.

Interviewer (48:13)

I think she told me 20 Maison Ati started you and Chloe with an investor friend of yours?

Gilles Mendel (48:21)

Yeah, yeah.

Interviewer (48:22)

Caddy Maison Rouge.

Gilles Mendel (48:23)

Yes.

Interviewer (48:24)

You guys started Maison Atia, which was a faux fur business brand.

Gilles Mendel (48:28)

Yes.

Interviewer (48:28)

I loved it because I thought what a cool way to continue the great tradition of the Mendels in fur.

Gilles Mendel (48:35)

Yes.

Interviewer (48:36)

But avoid, of course, the. And I remember us having a conversation, and maybe it's a good time to bring it up. It's not to convince people of why fur should still be in the fashion business because you've gotten out of fur. Right. So that's. It's not an ethical issue for you at the this point, but I remember you talking very eloquently about. I guess I asked you a question which is, what's the most positive way to look at fur in fashion? If there is still a place for fur and fashion. Is that something you want to speak on or are you at a point now where you think it's the. That ship is sailed. In essence, is there an ethical place for fur in fashion? I guess that's the most challenging question I would ask you.

Gilles Mendel (49:22)

Yeah, it's really a challenging question because, you know, know it's been, you know, I mean, you know, you. You cannot. It's. It's. It's. It's a. It's. It's a subject that can go. Can be endless in. In response, my response is. I don't know what to say because in one hand, you know, talking about sustainability and all this, you know, obviously there's a lot of hypocrisy about talking about faux fur that is made of chemicals and all that stuff. When you think about fur, which is auto gradable, you know, you know, it's a small industry, it's a tiny industry. You know, it's not really, you know, but animal cruelty is an issue, and there's nothing I can fight about that. And I have to say, in some ways, everybody, it's understandable that there could be issues on that, but it's a small thing. It's a small business. It was never. I don't know. To me, I was a diamond cutter, and the diamond became radioactive. And today I am not cutting diamonds anymore. That's where I stand. And honestly, I had bigger vision because I felt like I had such a desire to be in fashion. And fashion is not just fur by itself. Fur, to me, is a beautiful product. I mean, it's extraordinary. And if it's treated with respect, understanding, and there's no reason why it should have been totally destroyed and had to disappear, there's room for it.

Interviewer (50:46)

But you've accepted it as sort of

Gilles Mendel (50:48)

a kind of a. I accepted the fact that we can also live without, you know, that the world. Where the world is going.

Interviewer (50:55)

Yeah, it seems to be that's where the world is going.

Gilles Mendel (50:59)

But I'm confused. Where the world is going, but that's a different subject. Yes.

Interviewer (51:08)

So Maison Atia lasted about five years or so, but part of the challenge was you guys were actually getting traction.

Gilles Mendel (51:14)

Yes.

Interviewer (51:15)

Or doing quite well. And then the pandemic.

Gilles Mendel (51:17)

Correct.

Interviewer (51:17)

Kind of wiped that business out.

Gilles Mendel (51:19)

Yes. Yes.

Interviewer (51:20)

So the silver lining in that is that you and Chloe decided to start what is now House of Gilles. So tell people what House of Gilles is. Because I'm part of that. Because I'm part of the family.

Gilles Mendel (51:30)

And yes. I mean, House of Gilles is a beautiful new story, you know, that I. We started. I mean, it really started with this idea, first of all, you know, when you. You know, you were getting married with Chloe, you know, we. We had to do this beautiful gown, obviously, for. For Chloe. And it was a. It was a start. I said to ch. And we discussed it, and we said, you know, why don't we take this first step, this first stone we're gonna initiate a couture house. I always dreamed to have a couture house. I always dreamed to have to bring back the artisan. A special atelier in New York City, which is something unique. And finding the right ingredients.

Interviewer (52:10)

It's kind of funny that they don't really exist like they used to, Right?

Gilles Mendel (52:13)

No, because it's a trade that many people, they're getting older. The people who really knew how to sew. And the pattern makers at certain level come from those houses of European house are very scarce in New York, in America. But, you know, I was so Chloe and I, we felt like it would be such a great idea, you know, to go back to the roots of the house.

Interviewer (52:33)

But it was really inspired by her wedding dress.

Gilles Mendel (52:35)

Yes, the wedding dress was really the beginning. You know, I thought, you know, what a great way to show to the world that we're back on track with beautiful gowns. And, you know, obviously your wedding was beautiful. Chloe looked amazing. And, you know, it started like that. We, I mean, I mean, I did a dress for the Med Ball, and then Chloe and I, we said, okay, maybe let's set up a little place in New York and let's do. Let's be more serious and try to create a couture place where women could come and meet the designer, meet his daughter, who also is fully participant with the design and experience what couture can be in America. And I think it's, you know, so far it's been an extraordinary experience.

Interviewer (53:23)

It's a nice thing because when I try to explain what you and Chloe are doing, anybody, I sort of say, hey, go to this Instagram page or check out these pictures. Everybody has the same reaction, which is just like, wow. It's almost like they didn't know that that level of craftsmanship was. Was available, you know.

Gilles Mendel (53:43)

Yeah. I mean, if you had seen today, we did a show today, we present a bridal collection in our little studio. But the reaction of everybody was the same. Same thing all the time. Like, how can we. This is happening in this studio. Those flowers, those lace detail, you know, it's all those hands, those we call

Interviewer (54:01)

petite mind for people that wouldn't understand and just give me an average. But on a bespoke gown, where somebody comes in and orders from you and Chloe a specific gown. Gown, mostly bridal, but also some celebrities have come in and asked for custom for Met Ball and things like this. So on a bespoke piece, what would be the normal amount of hours that would go into a bespoke piece? Can you give an estimate?

Gilles Mendel (54:30)

Well, it takes.

Interviewer (54:31)

Because it's kind of mind boggling.

Gilles Mendel (54:32)

It takes for one dress. It takes about two to three months minimum to make it by stage, because that's a whole experience. You know, what's beautiful with Chloe is that, you know, we basically we give the customer, you know, that extraordinary experience where she comes in and we take her measurements and then it progress into, you know, we discuss her desires or views or, you know, her inspirations and so on. And, you know, we give her really a journey through this experience, which is fabulous. Chloe on that is really Good in giving that expectations and give the woman, the client going beyond her expectations in what we create.

Interviewer (55:21)

When we were all in Paris together recently, we went to see that show about the House of Worth, which was like the original bespoke couture house in Paris run by an English guy.

Gilles Mendel (55:32)

Yes, yes.

Interviewer (55:33)

I guess going back to like 1850s. But mostly they were making garments for the royals.

Gilles Mendel (55:38)

Yes, correct.

Interviewer (55:39)

So basically, what you offer, and this also goes into your family's tradition, fur, you're offering basically the level of.

Gilles Mendel (55:47)

Of couture and refinement and artisan.

Interviewer (55:50)

But they used to only be available to people in the royal class, which is crazy.

Gilles Mendel (55:54)

Correct, Correct. And yeah, it's a trade that is, you know, I try to revive some few. You know, these are things that you don't have to be experiencing in fashion to feel what's the electricity, the magic of the place when you come to us because you see it. Beauty is beauty. There is nothing. You cannot change that.

Interviewer (56:16)

Okay, last round, I wrote out these questions because I thought these sort of interesting because I want your sort of take and you can go as long or short on them as you like. What's the future of fat fashion?

Gilles Mendel (56:31)

Wow, that's a. That's a deep question. You know, it's. I'm troubled because, you know, it's not an easy answer to give you. The world today is changing so quickly that it's really hard to give you an answer because, you know, fast fashion doesn't seem to go too well these days. There's a lot of issue, you know, about it. I hope that the future this way I would look at it. I hope that the future, and I think it's going into more sustainability and more quality oriented, more. Less volume, less trash, less all these things. So I hope the future. I don't see a very bright future.

Interviewer (57:20)

Okay.

Gilles Mendel (57:21)

At.

Interviewer (57:25)

If elegance in class is one side of the equation, what's the opposite side of the equation? Is it like what you said is a trash fashion? Is it disposable?

Gilles Mendel (57:33)

Yeah, it's. Yeah, disposable fashion. I mean, you know, fashion that, you know, lasts pieces that you buy and that, you know, there's so much waste, you know, because people buy things, you know, I mean, now everything is so easily accessible. You know, you can buy things by mail everywhere where you could buy. So there is. There is a. It's very wasteful. So I think that hopefully, you know, people will more and more appreciate quality and. And try to buy less. But products that are better made.

Interviewer (58:03)

Yeah.

Gilles Mendel (58:04)

And yeah, I Mean, it's.

Interviewer (58:11)

We face similar dynamics in business in different ways. How do. How do you compete as a. As a. As a. As a. As a house. The house of Gilles. How do you compete against these mass, massive multinational corporations?

Gilles Mendel (58:26)

I think you don't compete. You're so unique that you are what you are in the time where you compete. Meaning, I'm not looking to be the same.

Interviewer (58:34)

I don't need dollar to dollar.

Gilles Mendel (58:35)

Okay, okay. Well, you can't compete with those big houses. You have to not even think about competing, because you can't. The power they have in social media and mediatically is so high, so big. The millions they spend on every. It's impossible. Possible. But you have your own voice and it's. I mean, I can. You see, we are really successful at it. So it means there is a place for uniqueness.

Interviewer (59:03)

Why make the same argument in music?

Gilles Mendel (59:06)

Yeah.

Interviewer (59:06)

You know what I mean?

Gilles Mendel (59:07)

Yes.

Interviewer (59:07)

And I also make it with my wrestling company. There is a place for quality. Always, Always. When people are coming to you, I mean, obviously they're coming to you, say, for a gown, but what are they really looking for? Are they looking for a personalized experience? Are they looking to be. Are they want to have something that they feel special and ownership of? Like, what's the. What's the most common thing that you see that people are really looking for at the foundation?

Gilles Mendel (59:38)

They really. I mean, I think they're really looking for, first of all, for good advisors. They want to feel, you know, they're looking for. I mean, when they come to us, obviously, you know, they come to. They meet the designer who has, you know, a past of making very beautiful, but also very feminine and a certain aesthetic. So when they come to us, they're looking for maybe a vision of themselves they haven't thought about. And I think that's what we can bring. We bring, you know, we bring something more unexpected to them because they just to look at a. You know, you can go to a store or you can have a stylist propose to you 65 different shapes of clothing and so on. And when you meet, really the designer who makes those clothes and he has his vision to, you know, based on your inspiration, your ideas. The fun part is really to give them, you know, a different variation, a different vision. Of what? Of themselves. Wouldn't you want to have this? I mean, I would die if someone to do that for me. I'd love to come someplace. They could say, gilles, you know, enough of your, you know, of your. Of this look. Why don't we propose you, and that's what we do. And I think it's.

Interviewer (60:42)

Maybe that's what I need to do. I need to give you my version of your look.

Gilles Mendel (60:46)

Please do. We could do that. You know, we could flip one night.

Interviewer (60:49)

Oh, my God, I'd be so scared. It'd be like trying to cook for a master chef.

Gilles Mendel (60:53)

No, no, no, no. But it's fun to do that. You know, it's really. It's extraordinary because people come to us and they have these, expect they. They get excited, they see the transformation.

Interviewer (61:04)

Yeah.

Gilles Mendel (61:05)

And you know, now with the iPad, you know, you could, you know, I draw on an iPad and I have this stupid program. Basically I do old fashion.

Interviewer (61:13)

Yeah, you. I've seen it. Where you can literally show somebody what it will look like.

Gilles Mendel (61:16)

Basically. You know, I make a picture of you and I start to dress you while you're there. So much fun.

Interviewer (61:22)

O. Okay, One last question and then one little story that I want to tell. Okay. Do you have a vision? Because. Because my wife is your business partner. We talk a lot about what House of Yille could become. And I don't say it in some self serving, commercial way. I say it in the sense of. Of like as entrepreneurs, the vision of what you hope a business can become, where you're putting your passion and you're putting in those extra hours and you're dealing with the bull that anybody in business deals with. What for you is the vision for House of Gilles in terms of growth, like past what you're doing and what you're doing is amazing. But as you and I know, that's not a sustainable path.

Gilles Mendel (62:14)

Yes.

Interviewer (62:14)

Past a certain point.

Gilles Mendel (62:15)

Yeah.

Interviewer (62:16)

Because you're always fighting the headwinds of change. Trend.

Gilles Mendel (62:20)

Yes. I mean, you know, it's a car, it's a base. You know, if you look at all those big houses, those famous houses, you know, they always. They always keep couture somewhere. So couture is the base. It's like, basically it's kind of creates a legitimacy of the house. You know, Chanel, you know, has. Does couture. They also acquire all this little atelier in Paris where they. Where they do the feather work, where they do. So, you know, couture is like what makes, to my point of view is create the legitimacy of the house.

Interviewer (62:52)

I see.

Gilles Mendel (62:53)

And then from there, you know, you develop the place to wear. So I think that couture for us is. Really makes us so unique in our own ways that ultimately we can either find later on, more collaborations, more we can find other Ways to expand because we have this prestigious image about us, whether perfume, whether it's unique.

Interviewer (63:13)

I love that it's unique. I went in on the perfume division. So last story, and I say it to hopefully make you laugh. You were working on something custom for me. And as you guys do, you're tugging and you and Chloe are arguing about the buttons. And I'm sitting there and I'm like, I want to be anywhere else on the planet than having you guys tug on me and argue about the buttons. And I started grousing as only a husband can about, do I have to sit here and listen to you guys talk about the buttons? And my wife, your daughter, turned to me and said, we care just as much about the buttons as you care about the way your songs sound in the studio. Why do you sit in a studio all day and fuss over a guitar sound? And for the first time in my now 13 year relationship with your daughter, I understood. Yes, that is just as important to you as those guitar tones are to me. Yes. And in reverse. And I say this in fellowship. I don't know why I care so much about the damn guitar sound. Because you could argue after about an hour. Any sound after that's pretty good.

Gilles Mendel (64:23)

Yes.

Interviewer (64:24)

But why do I have to do it for three hours? What is that? That little thing, that little advantage, that little thing that says, no, this is my. This is my signature.

Gilles Mendel (64:32)

Yes.

Interviewer (64:33)

So I feel like I understand and it's exactly. Maybe it brought us a little closer together. No.

Gilles Mendel (64:38)

100%.

Interviewer (64:40)

Did you have fun?

Gilles Mendel (64:40)

Yes, of course I did. Good to see you. I love you.