The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan

Episode: Paul Stanley Pt 2
Date: June 18, 2025
Host: Billy Corgan
Guest: Paul Stanley (KISS)

Episode Overview

In this rich, insightful second part of their conversation, Billy Corgan sits down with Paul Stanley, co-founder and frontman of KISS, to discuss the band’s legacy, creative decisions, personal reflections, business strategies, and the ever-evolving landscape of rock stardom. They engage in a candid examination of success, integrity, reinvention, friendships, rivalries within the band, the impact of theatricality, the price of fame, and the enduring power of music. The conversation is friendly, sometimes raw, and delves deeply into the reality behind the KISS phenomenon.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. KISS Legacy, Biopics, and Celebrating 50 Years

[00:00 – 03:10]

• KISS Biopic?
  • Paul shares hesitancy: "I'm on the fence about it. I would rather it never happen than happen badly." (00:04)
• On the band's 50th anniversary and upcoming events:
  • Kiss fans' devotion—KISS cruises as an example of fan engagement.
  • “We’re celebrating 50 years. There’s always a reason to celebrate, but it’s 50 years since the Kiss Army. And it’s also a way to stay connected to our fans.” (01:57)
  • The Las Vegas celebration is likened to “a Kiss cruise in Vegas, in a hotel.” (02:09)

2. Artistic Integrity vs. Commercial Success

[05:22 – 09:28]

• Refuting the "money band" label:
  • “It’s never been about the money. However, if there is money to be made, it should go to us.” (05:54)
  • KISS blew large sums on ambitious stage productions; “if people really knew what that stuff cost…” (06:15)
  • Paul emphasizes: “I’ve always done this, and we’ve always done this ultimately, truly, because of the joy it gives us.” (06:29)
• On balancing integrity and business:
  • “Isn’t success where the artist gets rewarded for their effort and they maintain their integrity? In essence, they’re executing their vision. Isn’t that the ultimate win?” – Billy Corgan (09:01)
  • Paul agrees, adds: “Money gives you the ability to stop worrying about money. And it gives you freedom.” (09:17)

3. The Future & Immersive Technology After KISS

[10:09 – 13:07]

• Regarding posthumous legacy:
  • Madison Square Garden show “didn’t represent what we were going to do” with future immersive projects.
  • Paul’s aspiration: “That the core of this immersive experience is an accurate representation of the band at its best. Because nobody can be us better than us.” (10:39)
  • He likens the future of KISS to Disney’s legacy: “I think that I was part of creating KISS, but I can also step away from it. And it lives on as...” (12:52)

4. Early Influences & Songwriting

[15:11 – 27:39]

• Songwriting roots:

  • “The truth is far more interesting than anything that somebody could write. What we’ve gone through…” (15:11)
  • KISS’ predecessor, Wicked Lester, and recording at Electric Ladyland studio.
  • Songwriting influences rooted in British pop and power chord rock, particularly citing The Move’s “Fire Brigade” inspiring “Firehouse.” (25:07)
  • On harmonies: “My parents, my sister and I all had really good voices and we would sing. I grew up singing innately in four part.” (28:59)

• On vocal influences:

  • Steve Marriott and Robert Plant among personal heroes; “You only had to see Robert Plant in 1969 to bear witness to... gobsmacked... exuding this sexuality... but his voice was insane.” (17:11)
  • Discusses discovering his own upper range and unique vocal style in the 1980s.

• Songwriting process:

  • “Trying to write my version” of songs he liked (25:38).
  • Classic KISS lyricism referenced: “Put your hand in my pocket, grab onto my rocket.” (23:32)

5. Reflections on Band Evolution & Internal Dynamics

[30:16 – 44:07]

• KISS’s rise to global stardom:
  • The realization moment: “Dayton, Ohio... I remember, before we went on, I was all made up and ready, and we had a curtain like a kabuki. And I went out and looked down... this place is packed. And that’s when I thought, wow, this is happening.” (31:10)
  • The band’s early drive: “We were on a crusade. We were taking no prisoners and we were just going. We were going to conquer the world.” (32:11)
• On ambition:
  • “If you don’t want to be the biggest band in the world, I don’t want to manage you. And it was like, that’s our man.” (33:52)
  • Billy notes their Beatlemania-level cultural moment; Paul pushes back, saying, “Let other people do that. It’s an insane, just embarrassing,” but acknowledges they were a cultural phenomenon. (36:40)
• Navigating public and critical views:
  • “To discount music because of theatricality... that’s not credible. But there are other people who do it who are great, you know?” (38:53)

6. Removing the Makeup and Musical Reinvention

[39:36 – 44:07]

• Why remove the makeup?
  • “People were listening with their eyes and didn’t like what they were seeing... even though Creatures is a great album... we did take it off [for Lick It Up].” (39:37)
  • The transition led to revitalized commercial success and a new era of music.
• Reflecting on this decision:
  • Points out some longtime fans struggled with the change, but it ultimately brought new fans and influenced the emerging “hair metal” movement.

7. Partnership & Betrayal Within KISS

[46:02 – 47:52]

• On Gene Simmons’s outside projects:
  • Paul: “I felt betrayed. No secret. I felt that he was leaving me to do the heavy work, but continued to get paid. So... have the best of both worlds... but you're abandoning ship and you’re still my partner.” (46:32)
  • “I was angry, but I was hurt. Gene’s my brother. He’s been with me since I was 17.” (47:18)

8. The "Starchild" Persona & The Price of Fame

[49:19 – 58:18]

• Relationship to his alter ego:
  • “The star child grew with me... he became who he was as I became who I was... I can separate the two. He’s very much me, but he’s a separate entity.” (49:49)
• Physical toll of performing:
  • “I’ve beaten my body up... Rotator cuffs... popped my bicep tendon... knees scoped... hip replacement... everything comes with a price. Is it worth the price? Hell, yeah.” (57:49)
• Reflection on celebrity:
  • Paul traces his first awareness to Elvis and the chaos of rock and roll stardom.
• On doing it all again:
  • Would do it “in a heartbeat.” (57:49)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the band's business model and fan connection:
  • “We’ve always done things the way we thought they should be done.” – Paul (04:57)
• On money and artistic drive:
  • “Money gives you the ability to stop worrying about money. And it gives you freedom.” – Paul (09:17)
• On KISS’s lasting legacy:
  • “Nobody can be us better than us.” – Paul (10:39)
• On core motivation:
  • “I never started doing this with the intention, I’m going to be a millionaire... it was about, I want to be that guy. I want to be up there.” – Paul (06:56)
• On surviving and adapting:
  • “Nobody’s going to tell me when this band is over... If I got to be in the middle in a video, then let’s do that.” – Paul (44:07)
• On physical toll of rock and roll:
  • “I’ve beaten my body up... everything comes with a price. Is it worth the price? Hell, yeah.” – Paul (57:49)

Highlighted Timestamps

• Biopic skepticism: [00:04]
• On 50 years and KISS Army: [01:57]
• Integrity & money: [09:01–09:17]
• Post-KISS aspirations: [10:39–12:52]
• On songwriting and influences: [15:11–29:00]
• “Dayton, Ohio” realization: [31:10]
• KISS as a cultural phenomenon: [36:40]
• Taking off the makeup: [39:37]
• Feelings about Gene’s outside projects: [46:32]
• On the legacy of the Starchild: [49:49]
• The toll of a lifetime on the road: [57:49]

Tone and Style

The tone of the conversation is open, honest, slightly irreverent, and frequently reflective. Billy encourages Paul to explore the deeper meanings behind career choices, pain and pride, and what it means to leave a legacy behind. Paul is forthright about both his triumphs and regrets, never overly sentimental, but always candid and forthright, with flashes of humor and humility.

Summary Takeaways

• The KISS legacy, integrity, and innovation stem as much from risk-taking and staying true to vision as from commercial ambition.
• Paul Stanley remains deeply connected to KISS's past and its continued afterlife, appreciative of the unique bond with fans.
• The physical and emotional prices of fame are real, but Paul affirms the journey was worth it.
• Creative expression goes beyond one band, as Paul's love for soul, tradition, and songwriting highlights a lifelong devotion to music as salvation and joy.

This episode is a compelling, multidimensional look inside the world of KISS and Paul Stanley’s lasting philosophy on artistry, perseverance, and what it truly means to be magnificent.