Stephen Pearcy | The Magnificent Others

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan

Episode: Stephen Pearcy | The Magnificent Others
Release Date: January 7, 2026
Host: Billy Corgan
Guest: Stephen Pearcy (Founder and vocalist of Ratt)

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Overview

This invigorating episode of The Magnificent Others features an in-depth, candid conversation between Billy Corgan and Stephen Pearcy, frontman of the legendary band Ratt. Together, they trace Pearcy’s upbringing, his evolution from a SoCal beach kid to a hard rock pioneer, the foundational story and artistic direction of Ratt, the highs and lows of band life, creative processes, 80s rock culture, resiliency in the face of personal and industry upheavals, and the enduring legacy of “hair metal” and their music in popular culture. The episode is filled with personal anecdotes, deep musical insights, humor, and heartfelt reflection.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Early Life, California Mythology, and the Drag Racing Bug

• SoCal Upbringing

  • Pearcy reminisces about coming of age in California, debunking the idyllic Midwest vision of constant sunshine and Disneyland:
    • "Well, as a kid... go to the beach, sleep overnight, surf, wake up, surf at 5, 6am, smoke a lot of pot, and, you know... try to get the girls." [01:42, Pearcy]
  • Humor and nostalgia pervade his stories of sleeping on the beach and the sense of safe adventure in that era.

• Drag Racing Influences

  • An early fascination becomes formative:
    • "I got into racing really young... you'd be sleeping under a truck, going to a race..." [03:31, Pearcy]

• Life-Altering Accident

  • At age 14, a car accident leaves Stephen hospitalized for six months:
    • "I get run over by a car, you know, and break both legs and made a mess of me. And like, you're not going to walk again kind of stuff." [03:42, Pearcy]
    • This traumatic event leads to receiving a guitar as therapy: "Somebody gave me a guitar... just to give you something to do in the hospital." [04:54, Pearcy]

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2. Musical Awakening and Influences

• Forming a Unique Voice

  • Pearcy starts playing guitar, then sings reluctantly, eventually embracing his role as a frontman.
  • He cites non-standard influences for a hard rock artist: Bowie, New York Dolls, Sweet, Adam Ant, Duran Duran, Blue Öyster Cult, Kiss:
    • "When I first heard you sing and I first heard your band, I was like, this is different." [00:09, Corgan]
    • "Even to today, I hear your music because most heavy metal guys...have almost a limited set of influences. Where your influences...were broad." [07:28, Corgan]

• The Power of Live Music

  • Early concerts seen at San Diego Sports Arena heavily shaped his musical ambitions:
    • "You see like Black Sabbath, Blue Oyster Cult, Fog Hat one weekend... the next weekend you'd get Blue Oyster Cult... concerts almost every weekend." [05:19, Pearcy]

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3. From Mickey Rat to Ratt: Chasing LA Dreams

• Founding the Band, Early Struggles, DIY Ethos

  • Mickey Rat dominates the San Diego scene, but real ambition drives a move to LA.
  • Pearcy draws direct lessons from Van Halen’s ascent:
    • "I was taking notes, man. I was looking at the lights, the clothes, and then going back to San Diego..." [14:40, Pearcy]

• Early Days on the Strip

  • Navigating LA clubs (Troubadour, Whisky), hustling for gigs, and developing a business sense.
  • "Out of the blue, Doug goes, you can't play anymore here anymore under the name Rat. And I go, why? He goes, it makes the club look bad." [29:57, Pearcy]
  • Solution: play as "The Gladiators," but demand for Ratt leads to a triumphant return.

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4. The 'Classic' Ratt: The Robin Crosby Era and Songwriting

• Finding the Right Chemistry

  • Meeting Robin Crosby crystallizes the band’s direction:

    • "With Rat, Robin and I...we knew...we need an image, we need to do this. And it was that time...the whole European maiden, Leop, Motley was happening..." [18:22, Pearcy]

  • Songwriting and musical arrangement are collaborative but often built on Pearcy's original riffs and vision:

    • "A lot of my direction, because these guys were all over the place. I'd have to...I was pretty much arranging things around." [20:52, Pearcy]

  • Two-guitar sound shaped by both Robin and, later, Warren DeMartini:

    • "There’s something about the way Robin plays guitar, Warren plays leads, and the...glam influence...when you guys click, it’s like, that’s the sound." [20:33, Corgan]

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5. Breakthrough Songs, Recording, and Industry Realities

• Early Singles and Self-Production

  • First single "Dr. Rock" is a moment of taking things seriously: "I have to put out a single. It feels serious." [14:08, Corgan & Pearcy]

• The First EP and the Atlantic Deal

  • DIY approach: "It didn’t cost much…we went in there over Thanksgiving weekend…recorded next day, mixed and it was done." [32:13, Pearcy]
  • The band’s big break came with a showcase at Beverly Theater, catching Atlantic’s attention:
    • "Atlantic was there and they signed us on the spot." [43:05, Pearcy]

• Studio Shifts and Bo Hill Era

  • Working with Bo Hill, balancing commercial pressure with musical integrity:
    • "He wanted more commercialism. I mean, hit, hit, hit..." [45:35, Pearcy]
    • "I was open to...because, hey, I always did what I did. Write songs. Either works or it doesn't..." [47:09, Pearcy]
    • "We would never trade that for that. No...That's why Ratt never went like..." [74:01, Pearcy]

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6. Creative Identity, Integrity, and 80s Legacy

• Fashion, Image, and Being Misunderstood

  • Embracing visual flair, glam influence, and the "gang"/pirate aesthetic set Ratt apart:

    • "We wanted all of us just to look like a gang, you know, like pirates...that was our cement...our image..." [35:58, Pearcy]

  • Pearcy embraces the "hair metal" legacy, but sees Ratt and Motley as fundamentally distinct within it.

    • "We're a rock band..." [54:44, Pearcy]
    • "Ratt was different. Right. I can actually say that. That the band is different than a lot of the..." [55:15, Pearcy]

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7. Struggles, Endings, and Endurance

• Band Tensions, Addictions, and Losses

  • Being "the last man standing"; attributing the band's first dissolution to "Too many cooks" and the chaos of success: [51:54, Pearcy]
  • On Robin Crosby's decline: "When Robin was going down and...passed, that was it. I knew it. I went, well, we did it...went into my stupor...came out of it years later." [24:01, Pearcy]

• Pearcy’s Own Battles and Resilience

  • Surviving cancer and the shifting business:
    • "Yeah, I had a bout with cancer. Liver cancer...when that happened, I just...that was it." [77:25, Pearcy]
    • "If it wasn't for Christy keeping me in order...I'm very lucky. And don’t take that anything for granted." [78:59, 79:32, Pearcy]

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8. Ratt’s Enduring Impact, 80s Nostalgia, and Musical Relevance

• On the 80s Revival & Modern Legacy

  • Pearcy reflects on how "hair metal" has been reclaimed and commercialized, and how classic bands are finding new life and audiences:
    • "Embrace that. If you’re not in the hair metal scene 40 years later, you should, you should be lucky..." [25:17, Pearcy]
    • He celebrates the fun, fans' devotion, and embraces OG status: "I love talking to the fans because they're so hardcore and sincere..." [57:22, Pearcy]
    • "I still go wow. It's cool, man." [69:37, Pearcy]

• On Success, Competition, and Artistic Freedom

  • Pearcy reflects with humility but also pride:
    • "We did what we were supposed to do." [73:10, Pearcy]
    • "You hit a nerve. And it's a blessing. Hey. Round and round forever." [74:55, Pearcy]

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9. Later Years, New Projects, and Final Reflections

• 90s and Beyond, Artistic Experimentation

  • Discusses post-Ratt projects (Arcade, Vicious Delight) and adapting to a changing scene.
  • On not being bitter about grunge: "I don't believe that...I didn't struggle with that term [hair metal]...I enjoy [that era], that's why it came off on me." [61:19, 62:19, Pearcy]
  • On musical longevity and the return of the 80s: "I’m always writing, working, whatever. So...now when we go out, I have a great time..." [57:21, Pearcy]

• Songwriting Philosophy

  • On writing, competition, and the unknowable nature of hits:
    • "When you write a song, you don't know if it’s going to be a hit." [82:07, Pearcy]
    • "You just write. You write great songs, you know, so it's like I can relate to people when I go, wow, man, guy's a good writer..." [79:43, Pearcy]
    • Referencing George Harrison as inspiration for internal band competition: "Well, I always think of George Harrison, right?...just write a better song than me..." [81:51, 82:07 – Corgan and Pearcy]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Life After Trauma and Turning Point:
  "I get run over by a car...I'm like six on my back in the hospital...I got into music. Somebody gave me a guitar...and I kind of adapted to it, you know." [03:42 & 04:54, Pearcy]

• On Witnessing and Being Changed by Van Halen:
  "When I saw Zeppelin, forget it...Enlightened. Right...But the day I went out by myself, I drove out by myself...And there's Ed [Van Halen], right? ...So anyway, when I Saw that four piece. I went, yeah, okay. Anyway, next. And then a whole new world began." [07:57 & 11:08, Pearcy]

• On Band Chemistry:
  "With Rat, Robin and I...we knew...It's almost like we wrote out. Wrote it out. We need an image; we need to do this." [18:22, Pearcy]

• On Musical Legacy:
  "Ratt was different. Right. I can actually say that. That the band is different than a lot of the [other LA Strip bands]." [55:15, Pearcy]

• On Surviving the Industry:
  "I'm the last man standing and I'm proud of what we did. It's like guys, you know, we did a good thing..." [53:15, Pearcy] "Now...it's almost a surreal thing. Like, as you know, that, well, you're going all. It's been around for 30 years." [76:19, Pearcy]

• On Surviving Cancer:
  "Yeah, I had a bout with cancer. Liver cancer...when that happened, I just...that was it. Anyway, long story short, if it wasn't for Christy keeping me in order and us...we take care of business, you know, so it's. Besides having her support, we have business." [77:25, Pearcy]

• Favorite Overlooked Song:
  "A song called Reach for the Sky...that we recorded early seller that I found and actually re-released on the 40th anniversary 'Out of the Cellar' box set...should have been on Out of the Cellar." [82:48, Pearcy]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Pearcy’s Crash & Musical Awakening: [03:42 – 05:17]
• Key Early Influences & Shaping the Ratt Sound: [06:34 – 08:55]
• Story of Moving to LA and Van Halen Epiphany: [11:07 – 13:10]
• Formation of Classic Ratt Lineup: [17:00 – 19:32]
• On Robin Crosby’s Influence and the Band’s Chemistry: [21:13 – 22:23]
• Getting Signed to Atlantic – The Breakthrough Moment: [42:23 – 43:14]
• On 'Hair Metal,' Legacy, and 80s Nostalgia: [25:17 – 27:58, 54:30 – 56:54]
• Struggles, Endings, and Personal Resilience: [23:38 – 25:17, 77:25 – 79:32]
• On Songwriting and Industry Changes: [79:43 – 82:26]
• Underrated Song Recommendation: [82:48 – 83:36]

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Tone & Style

• The episode is informal, direct, and personal—much like a late-night jam session conversation among veteran musicians.
• Stephen’s candor is matched by Billy’s informed, respectful curiosity and dry humor.
• The tone is nostalgic but clear-eyed about both the glories and pitfalls of band life, fame, and the music business.

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For Listeners New and Old

Whether you’re a lifelong Ratt fan, a curious student of rock history, or an artist seeking wisdom from someone who’s fought—literally and figuratively—for each chord, this episode delivers both the inside story and enduring insight into making meaningful music against the odds and trends. Stephen Pearcy’s story is one of tenacity, innovation, and a relentless love for the craft—even when it means sleeping on the beach, playing under assumed names, or coming back after setbacks.

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In Pearcy’s Words

"We did what we were supposed to do." [73:10]
"You hit a nerve. And it's a blessing. Hey. Round and round forever." [74:55]
"I still go wow. It's cool, man." [69:37]

Transcript

[Stephen Pearcy]

When we went out there, we were like, fired up, man. I'm talking, you know, I would put up. I'd put my band up against anybody.

[Interviewer]

When I first heard you sing and I first heard your band, I was like, this is different.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Out of the blue, Doug goes, you can't play here anymore under the name Brad. And I go, why? He goes, it makes the club look bad.

[Interviewer]

I was listening to a lot of hard rock at the time, and I.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Remember thinking, this is weird.

[Interviewer]

No. I remember thinking, this is the kind of band I want to be in.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I still go, wow, this is cool, man.

[Interviewer]

Don't give it away. We gotta market.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Steven, thank you so much for being here. I wanted you on my show for so long, so I'm very honored to have you here.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Thank you, brother.

[Interviewer]

With a rock and roll life, you can jump in at any point, but I think with you, the simplest way to do it, because there's some musical points I want to get at, is to kind of start at the beginning. San Diego area, late 50s.

[Stephen Pearcy]

No, that would be. I was born in Long beach, but anyway, end up insane.

[Interviewer]

There's not a lot of great biographical information about your life.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. And even in the book, there's another one coming someday. But I ended up in, you know, Los Angeles and whatever. I wasn't. I listened to music, but wasn't.

[Interviewer]

But I want to talk about your early life. Just. I'm not trying to cut you off, I'm just saying.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right, right.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Just keep me your early life a bit. Because, you know. Well, so. Because, you know, for kids like us growing up in Chicago, this part of the world was the magical land.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right.

[Interviewer]

You guys had Disneyland, you had sunshine. We didn't have any sunshine or Disneyland.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So there's kind of an idyllic version that we have from the Midwest of what, California? Yeah. So I want you to give me your version. As a kid.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, my. As a kid. God. You go to the beach, sleep overnight, surf, wake up, surf at 5 a 6am, smoke a lot of pot, and, you know, you know, hang out, try to get the girls.

[Interviewer]

And.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And it was cool because you could actually sleep on the beach and not worry about somebody plummeting you with like a baby seal. I wouldn't do it nowadays. Yeah. But, you know, you have your little gang and stuff and, And. And I got into racing really young. I'd always see a race car across the street from my school, a funny car. Nhri Drag racing. Funny car. So I was like, wow. And I drew a lot So I draw, you know, and this and that and go touch it and everything. And then we moved again in la and there was another race car in the neighborhood. I'm like, well, this is interesting, right? So I go bother this guy.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Next thing you know, we're moving to Westchester. I'm riding my bike. There's a dragster. Right?

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I become friends with this guy and I'm like 14 and become his pit crew guy. Right. It was crazy.

[Interviewer]

This would have been like, wait, about.

[Stephen Pearcy]

68, something like that. I was like, yeah, yeah. And I just got the bug for drag racing. It was like every weekend it's loud, fast, exciting.

[Interviewer]

And in that time in American culture, drag racing had a huge. A much bigger place than it does now. You think that's fair? Yeah, it was kind of celebrated. Evil Knievel. There was a lot of that kind of daredevil.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. And these guys were nuts drag racers, especially back then, they were the real guys. Now it's, it's, it's, it's millions of dollars and, and the road cages.

[Interviewer]

But back then they were.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And it felt like when I was with them, you'd be sleeping under a truck, going to a race, you know, and that's what we did. And I was expected to go, I want to be a driver at 16.

[Interviewer]

Mh.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, that didn't happen. I went to San Diego. We ended up moving to San Diego. My mom had remarried and we lived on this, this hilly area. Anyway, not even a year being there, I get run over by a car, you know, and break both legs and made a mess of me. And like, you're not going to walk again kind of stuff. And you're a kid going, holy, take.

[Interviewer]

Me back through that story. Because there's the information on, on what I could find was very sketchy on this because. Yeah, because I think I have a theory that our lives are often defined by trauma. Like they send us in a particular direction.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Definitely.

[Interviewer]

Okay, so you're just walking down the road. So he runs you over.

[Stephen Pearcy]

No, I'm on a bike. Leave my friend's house. We were smoking out, you know, and I could do. And I'm on a bike and collision course. And anyway, it busted me up and I was like six on my back in the hospital and, you know, wow. Wow. Anyway, through a lot of prayer and, you know, in wheelchair to graduating, to crutches. Then I got into music. Somebody gave me a guitar. Acoustic guitar?

[Interviewer]

No, just to give you something to.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Do in the hospital. So I'm like, oh, okay. And I kind of adapted to it, you know. And then when I got out and I was at home, all I could do was, you know, I was in a wheelchair and recuperating. So it was play. So I started playing then. It was like, you know, really going to see the bands. The San Diego Sports arena was real close.

[Interviewer]

So who would you have you seen in that?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, man, you see like Black Sabbath, Blue Oyster Cult, Fog Hat one weekend, the next weekend you'd get Blue Oyster Cult. And so, and so they were always there. It almost seemed like every weekend it was a concert. Right. David Bowie, you know, it was great. So I really got into. And then I started really playing guitar. First became a guitar player and then somebody coaxed me into singing. And I started singing once in a while in bands, you know. You play at the beach? Sure, you know, we play in the canyon.

[Interviewer]

Once you figure out there's. There's. There's.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Excitement, attention, money and girls attached.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right, right. And free. Everything, you know, and which, which created the, the. The catastrophe. The band Rat.

[Interviewer]

We'll get there. We'll get there. You know, don't.

[Stephen Pearcy]

But so I'm, so I become this like, oh, I'm okay, I'm singing. I'm just this long haired beach guy. Okay. They like my hair. So can you sing? It was like, just like, okay. Nothing better to do. Smoke a lot of pot and have fun. Go to the beach, sing with these bands. And I got to play guitar and then I started singing and playing guitar and then really getting into it. That was around 1976, 77.

[Interviewer]

Can I stop you there for a second? Yeah. Because when I first heard Rat, and I'm not trying to jump ahead as much as I'm just trying to define why I want to talk about this so much. I was a typical suburban Chicago heavy metal fan, like a lot of us were in the Midwest. But when I first heard you sing and I first heard your band, I was like, this is different. So doing research to talk to you today, I saw references to Kiss, Bowie. Gosh, I wrote them down. It's good because I think it really. It kind of gave me a sense of New York Dolls, Alice Cooper. But I mean, who would, who would you. Who would you say kind of gave you that non typical hard rock influence? Because I've always heard that in your music.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Even to today, I hear your music because most heavy metal guys or rock guys or whatever, in a weird way, they have almost a limited set of influences. Where your influences. I. I Always felt. So I want you to kind of.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Tell me were broad.

[Interviewer]

Okay, so give me some of those so I can understand.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Like, I. When I. You know, I bought Jeff Beck Blow by Blow, the album I liked live albums. I'd buy Jimi Hendrix live, Led Zeppelin live. And then. Until when I saw Zeppelin, forget it. It was.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

In 73, I. It was over. It was like, whoa. Enlightened. Right.

[Interviewer]

So the musician in you, circa 76, 77. What would you define what it was you were hoping to do? Or was it still too soon to figure that out?

[Stephen Pearcy]

No, because we had backyard parties. You charge a buck and, you know, and you needed better gear. So we started. I started figuring out the. The little business aspect of it, you know. And, you know, in doing so anyway, I was really into Blue Oyster Cult, believe it or not. Like hardcore. I think some of my chords and stuff that I write with are Blue Oyster Cultish.

[Interviewer]

Very interesting. Very interesting guitar band and Sweet. Okay, so that's what said the glam kind of part of your.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And Bowie, Ziggy Stardust. Forget about it. And.

[Interviewer]

But, you know. You know, most rock guys, if you sat down and talked to him, they know who Bowie is, but they didn't sit there and listen to Ziggy Stardust. Sure. But I always heard that in your music.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You brought a broader kind of glammy sense.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And, you know, I had a direction. And when I. When I started really Mickey Rat, we actually became a band. Like, I'm gonna do this for real.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

That was 70, late 78, 79. Going through a couple guys or whatever. And then I became this singer, guitar, rhythm guitar player guy. And I liked it. I didn't want a noodle. I didn't want it, you know. So that's where the Kiss thing came in. I'll be that Paul Stanley guy, you know, and I'll play guitar and. And I'll be. You'll be the lead guitar player. Like Buck Dharma, which. My guitar player was lead guitar player at that time.

[Interviewer]

So you had a vision of it rhythmically from you here. And then.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And then when a friend of mine kept hounding me. We were living in San Diego, we were playing big gigs. I mean, I. Mickey Rat was. You know, we had no competition. Robin had his band Phenomenon. Jakey Lee had his band Teaser.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Warren had his band Exciter and then had Mickey Rat. And there were other bands that were kind of big, but Mickey Rat kind of became a big band. We played all the Golden Hall, Plaza Hall, Bing Crosby Hall. We were playing These big places, but nothing was happening, right? So a friend of mine, I mean, you think about, wow, I want to be on a record, you know, I want to record. And to this day, I still record off the cassette or anything I can find, you know, preferably a cassette, you know, normal. And I started doing that back then, so a little off the track here. So I kind of. When friend told me you got to see this band in LA called Van Halen, I was like, all right, okay, okay. Van Halen, another band, okay. We had gone up there before and saw Quiet Riot and made trips here and there just to see. But the day I went out by myself, I drove out by myself and I don't know if I brought gear or anything. A pocket of weed. And I knew there was a backstage at the Whiskey. My friend said, there's a backstage. They go up this. You know, these things. We had not played there. I mean, Mickey rats 70. This was 78.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

So lo and behold, I see, you know, true story. It's bitching because it was. It's so surreal, you know, I. I kick myself sometimes and go, do you know the kind of. You've seen? And, and. And it was like, no big deal. But it was. It was a big effect in my life. I saw David Lee walking up the steps. I said, that might be. Do I go, hey, you want to SM a giant? I'm yelling at this guy, right guy.

[Interviewer]

Right guy to ask.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right guy to ask, right? I wasn't interested in him. My friend went, you got to see the guitar. Guitar player. Because we were. I was a guitar guy. So anyway, I smoke a joint with him and I go, later, where's the guitar guy? And I'm tripping around the whiskey backstage by myself. You know, I was ready for anything. And. And there's Ed, right? I go, you're the guitar guy, right? And. And yeah, and somehow we just connected and just started talking, right? And we're talking about equipment. Yeah, I love Vox. I got an old Vox 30. And he just lit up like a firecracker, you know, he goes, well, I got one and I need another one. Can we exchange numbers? You come up to la, come to my pad and bring it. And I go, what, are you nuts? I just got done watching something that was like a circus, you know, you're looking at Dave and I'm like, I don't want. I got to figure out my. My system, what I'm actually going to do in this business. Be a singer. Be a guitar singer guy. So anyway, when I Saw that four piece. I went, yeah, okay. Anyway, next. And then a whole new world began.

[Interviewer]

And so if I'm following your flow here, Van Halen helped you define, like, okay, if this is going to be the standard, if this is what's coming, I got to get serious. And I need to figure out who I am in this game.

[Stephen Pearcy]

100%. I went. I move into LA. And I went, January 1st, 1980. Who? And gone. We're living in a garage about this size, and we're gonna pray, practice there. And. And I'm gonna hustle and get a Skins.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And that's exactly what I did.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And. And. But in the meantime, I kept going up to see Ed and. And, you know, and saw their whole. The biggest band in the planet. I saw. I was like, holy US Festival. I mean, backstage you're going, this is. I mean, whoa.

[Interviewer]

It was. It was bonkers. Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Mickey Rat, come on, you got to do something different here. So anyway, as my band was. Mickey Rat was imploding around 1981, Jakey was in the band. He left. And.

[Interviewer]

Can I stop you there for one second, though?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Before we get to Robin Crosby.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I mean, Jake's obviously a phenomenal guitar player, but I'm just curious because, you know, you guys did the single Dr. Dr. Rock.

[Stephen Pearcy]

He's not on it. And he didn't write. People think he did, but. No.

[Interviewer]

Because everywhere you look, he says he's on it. Okay, so set aside Jake. Nothing against Jake, but, like, was Dr. Rock sort of the first time where it's like, it's serious. You're putting out a single.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I have to put out a single.

[Interviewer]

It feels serious.

[Stephen Pearcy]

100.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And we. And I found a studio in Venice, California, because we lived in Culver City.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And that wasn't. We weren't into Rat Mansion west yet. The one bedroom apartment.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Stephen Pearcy]

We were still in the hunt, so. And anyway.

[Interviewer]

Where were we? Well, it's something about Dr. Rock to me. I'm. You know, because I. I'm. I'm. I'm a fan from the beginning, so I. You know. But it's interesting to go back and follow the bouncing ball. Right. You know, it's coming. But it's like, okay, at what point does this thing kind of get serious and clicky?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, as soon as I moved into town, because I had been watching van Halen from 78 to 1980, and I went. I saw what they did. They went to Gazardi's, they became the house band. Then they worked their way to the Whiskey Became the house band. And that's exactly what I did. Yeah, I followed their schematic. I was taking notes, man. I was looking at the lights, the clothes, and then going back to San Diego, people were going, mickey Rat's crazy. You know. Well, I'm learning some things, you know.

[Interviewer]

But Dr. Dr. Rock seems to be the first time you, you step forward as a fan of your music. It seems the first, first time it'. Okay, there it is.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I have to write a song.

[Interviewer]

No, but, but also, there it is.

[Stephen Pearcy]

There it is.

[Interviewer]

Like, there's the foundational formula what ends up being a huge.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I couldn't get in the door. I tried to get gigs, you know, I was walking around. I was my own agent. I didn't know anything, you know, but.

[Interviewer]

But it's, but, but I, I, I love music in that. It's interesting to watch. Like, there's that moment where Jimi Hendrix becomes Jimi Hendrix, right? Like, you see clips of him playing behind Little Richard or something, and you're like, there's Jimi Hendrix. Like, but he ain't Jimi Hendrix yet.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sure.

[Interviewer]

It isn't. Until he goes to England and he works with, you know, Chaz Chandler. It all happens. Jimmy Page was.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, right, right. John Paul Jones, you know what I mean?

[Interviewer]

He ends up being in the Yardbirds. He needs a lead singer. He asked Steve Marriott to join. Steve Marriott says, no, thanks, because I'm Steve Marriott.

[Stephen Pearcy]

People did.

[Interviewer]

Right, right. I don't need you. I mean, he's Steve Marriott. He goes out and finds Robert Plant at 19 and John Bonham just happens to be attached to the singer. So I'm saying it's always interesting when things are successful. You can find that moment where it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sort of clicks kind of put. Well, it happened with others. With us, it happened. You know, we had a good thing with Jake. He just wanted to be one guitar guy, but I, I heard two guitars in my songs. So when I wrote Driving E and Dr. Rock, we, we just had to have something to get in the door. Here is my band, have a photo. So, you know, I did whatever I could.

[Interviewer]

But now, is it Rat or Mickey Rat?

[Stephen Pearcy]

It was, it was Mickey Rat, but Rat was bigger. You know, I was trying that transformation. And the reason that came about is where the Kiss thing again comes in is I love their logo. That it was just one thing, four things. And I went, Rat.

[Interviewer]

And Rat's such a great band name.

[Stephen Pearcy]

It's trippy.

[Interviewer]

How did no one think of it before?

[Stephen Pearcy]

I know. Yeah, right. And, and so I designed the logo and, and it went through whatever. But anyway, what really clicked was, you know, when Robin used to come to our shows a lot because his band imploded when he brought it to LA and my band was getting ready to plug. So when Jakey finally left to do Deal or whatever it was. And then he got odds. Odds.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

But Robin used to always come to our gigs and. And force his way on stage and play. He just wanted to play because he was living in la. His band abandoned him. Right. So he was like a mainstay. And then we were always tripping around, me and Robin going to see the new bands, Motley, you know, etc. And then it was like, you know what? One night Robin and I just went, let's start this band. Let's be really serious about this and start. Let's start Mickey. Rat and I went. I mean, Rat and I went, let's go. And there you go. The phone call started happening. So.

[Interviewer]

Because before Robin shows up in your life as a musician, I can certainly hear what you were going for. But something about the way Robin played guitar and wrote riffs seems to suddenly like click.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Ye.

[Interviewer]

Did you feel that?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. Because Mickey, rap music was. Is different than rap music.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, it's almost like my soul stuff. I like to go all over the place. But with Mickey, with. With Rat, we, Robin and I, we knew it was almost like we wrote out. Wrote it out. We need an image. We need to do this. And it was that time, you know, 81, you know, 82. The whole European maiden Leop Motley was happening. We became friends and we. Everybody started getting a little showy, showy. So, you know, and of course we love Barrel Smith. That's why we do Walking the Dog. And so I heard two guitars and Robin heard two guitars. And Robin was happy being this guitar. Just holding down because he, you know, when you mentioned Hendrix, he wouldn't. He would go places, you know, and then you have Warren. And then when we got Warren, everything changed, you know, and then it was almost like overnight on a cellar tour. That guy just became this wow, brilliant guitarist.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, Warren. And we just clicked the way we wrote. It's like, what do you got? Like round and round. It was written at Rat Mansion west, sitting around two tape recorders with guitars and me just. And so we kind of created a system of writing, you know, can you.

[Interviewer]

Walk me through that? Because I love, I love, I love this.

[Stephen Pearcy]

It would be like, you know, who's got what? Because it was four guys and.

[Interviewer]

Are you writing riffs too?

[Stephen Pearcy]

100? Yeah, probably. Yeah. Say something that you know. But, yeah, a lot of the riffs. I would come in with riffs and let them do what they do, you know.

[Interviewer]

Is it fair to say. Because I love the way Robin plays guitar.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Is it fair to say that even if you wrote the riff, the way Robin plays it becomes like, that's the sound 100%.

[Stephen Pearcy]

With war now.

[Interviewer]

No, I get that. And I didn't really realize it because, again, I've been listening to you literally since. Well, we'll get to that.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Day one.

[Interviewer]

No, no. Well, not day one, but close. There's something about the way Robin plays guitar. Warren plays Leeds, and the kind of. The glam influence sort of piped through early 80s LA. Sunset Strip music. It's like, there it is. And when you guys click, it's like, that's the sound.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Okay. See, that turned. It turned to that with. I. I'd have to say a lot of my direction because these guys were all over the place. I'd have to. Well, I was pretty much arranging things around.

[Interviewer]

But that's why I was asking about Early Influence. Because when I went back and listened to the early stuff. I hear you doing Rat before Rat, but isn't it. Isn't it interesting that you had the blueprint?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sure.

[Interviewer]

You had the sort of vision of what you were after.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I didn't have the components. Well.

[Interviewer]

But again, you know how it is with musicians. You can. You can bring one drummer in a room and say, hey, play this beat right? And it does nothing for you.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Correct.

[Interviewer]

And another drummer come and play the exact same beat and you go, that. That's it. Right. So something about the way Robin. Even if Robin was playing your riffs, something about, oh, yeah, 100. It's like. It's so stark to me once I think it through.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, Robin was a huge Hendrix fan. He was huge Scorpions. He listened to stuff that was like, you know, I mean, he went up there and abused his guitars. You know, he. There's no. He started out being the main guy, and Warren got so good so fast. We kind of went, well, we're gonna make Warren. I mean, we actually thought out our moves. Robin. And yeah, for the band. We're gonna make war on the guy now. You're gonna. I'm gonna kick back and be the rhythm guy.

[Interviewer]

Not a bad decision.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And. And we put him in the forefront because he was progressing like just.

[Interviewer]

He's phenomenal musician, you know, slow down. You know, even now, even if you watch, because I'll. Sometimes I'll check in on what you guys are up to. And I'll see clips of him playing now, 20, 25.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I gotta tell you, it, it's. It's so crazy, but, you know, and then here we are, we can get into that, you know, years later. And, and it's like the 19. It's like being on stage in 1980s again. I. I mean, there's the guy, right? Yeah, there's my guy.

[Interviewer]

But he plays at such a phenomenally high level.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And we, we cover each other on stage. You know, if I'm up or misses up, he'll give me a kick, you know, I mean, nothing's changed out there. And we laugh just like this. We go all these. That's funny.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Or we have a little chat up there going, this is insane. You know? You know. You know those moments. Oh, you know. Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

It's like there's no time passes. But then here you are and you're still in this garage somewhere. Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right. It's surreal.

[Interviewer]

Let me ask you this question, because you'd spent years trying to put together what became Rat. Now, that's easy to say. It's like, well, there's the success. But obviously it just didn't happen in a hot second. But no, was there. Was there something you were looking for in the people you were working with? Like, was it a focus or a dedication or a musical vision? Or is. Or was it right? People?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Like, it was dedication. And what happens with success, besides excess is the other cess. And that's the one, you know, where you spit out for a while and you don't know who's doing what. Everybody's in their own world and just ain't gonna work, you know?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And then the tires start falling off and. And that's what happened. And. And, you know, but like I say, when Warren's up there, like now, we. We did the Invasion celebration playing the music of Rat. Yeah. But it's like, why isn't it Rat? I'm like, that's not the point. The point is Warren and I have the main guy. Two main guys haven't seen each other in eight years. Can we get to acquainted, you know, before we start talking about a rat, you know, because as far as I'm concerned, it's Rat. You know, all I can do. We can do is play the music. And I knew when Robin, to be honest, and I say it all the time, is I knew when Robin was going down and. And he finally passed, that was it. I knew it. I went, well, we did it. I see, you know, and went into my stupor for a bunch of years and, and came out of it years later and, and. But, you know, you don't need 40 years later. It's like you look at what's happening with the 80s scene right now, which really trips me out. It's very commercial now. It's like beyond commercial. It's hair metal now, you know.

[Interviewer]

Sure.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Whatever they call it today, it's punk. It's this. So I tell peers, hey, man, embrace that. If you're not in. In the hair metal scene 40 years later, you know, you should, you should be lucky, you know, because bands are out there with one guy and.

[Interviewer]

Well, Rudy Sarzo, who sat in that very.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Exactly.

[Interviewer]

You know, he's out there with Quiet Riley and.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And you see, he's. I, I get it. I get it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, it, you know, you know, it is.

[Interviewer]

At the end of the day, it's about the music, right?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sure. And. And it's supposed to. I have so much fun out there now the last however many years, because we have a whole new direction. Everybody's. Like I was saying out there, there's business and then there's business business, you know, and granted, if it's there, I'll do the business business because I like the music business. I don't like a lot of it. I don't like that nobody can make money anymore. Nobody can make, you know, make records.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Why are you afraid to like. And I'll make them all day long, you know, I write every day. What are you going to do with this? Yeah, you know, I already have enough of it sitting around, you know. But, you know, I got to tell you, this whole scene how like we were mentioning out there, it's the comeback or whatever you want to call it, the 80s is so huge, you know, these people really loved that time, you know.

[Interviewer]

Well, I never had a problem with it. I mean, I was considered part of the generation that helped kill the 80s music. But I love that.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, right. But yeah, why not? And now a lot of those guys, I mean, who was it recently was playing round and round? I got a clip of it. Anthrax.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And I go, I'll sing that with you guys. Nuts. And I told them too, you know, I'm. That I love that. If I like, you know, want to get a kick, I'll go, which I do. I'll go, you know, I had the story with. About Duran Duran, and I go, you know, I'm gonna re record Girls on film. And send it to Simon. That's what I did. Just have fun or I want to do Wanderer. I've always liked that song. Let's go play it. That's what I love about my guys.

[Interviewer]

You know, but that's what I. That's what I was trying to set up before is this idea that I think the endurance of your music. Because, as you know, when you've had success, people tend to focus on one particular period of time. I deal with it too. And at the end of the day, it's great. It's fine. But.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, but there's more to it.

[Interviewer]

There's way, way more to it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Way more to it. Because I listen to and play music that people would go, what? You know, And I'm going to take it there on this next record. Like I told you, you know, hope, you know, you and I could get something there. But don't.

[Interviewer]

Don't give it away. We got to mark it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, yeah. And, and, but nowadays I, you know, I've slowed down a bit, but I still like going out there. To me, it's like exercise.

[Interviewer]

It's an interesting odyssey in your musical life that you ended up on Metal One for Metal Blade.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Isn't that crazy? With Metallica and Steeler and they re released actually recently. You know, I'm. I was going to bring you something. The Reach for the sky 45, the single I found 40 years later. But Metal Massacre, you know, when that went down, I was telling br. See, you know, as a trip is as I would be strolling down the strip, trying to get gigs, right? Banging the tuber in the day. No, I would see Rick Rubin and I'd see Brian doing the exact same thing.

[Interviewer]

Hustling, hustling.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And. And then years later, I'm like, holy, there's that dude. We used to trip and bump into your Dr. Hey, wait a minute. I used to bump into Rick Rubin all the time. You know.

[Interviewer]

So you were the one knocking on the Doors, getting the.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, yeah. I was the one hustling, taking care of business. And, you know, it was a trip. Yeah. Let me tell you, you know, it wasn't always.

[Interviewer]

Give me this. Give me the. Like you're in an unknown band.

[Stephen Pearcy]

They go, well, I'll tell you. Trippy story. Like Jupiter, right?

[Interviewer]

All right, so it's like you guys are the troubador. Just blows my mind.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, I was at the Trooper. So we start playing, you know, I want to gig at the Tubular. So anyway, they go, well, you gotta go to the guy's house. I'm like, okay, who? Doug Weston? I'll.

[Interviewer]

No, this guy says on the side, Doug West.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Let me tell you, he was a wacky. And anyway, I got in and out of that house as fast as I could, but I left my. Well, lo and behold.

[Interviewer]

Okay, wait, why'd you run out of the house?

[Stephen Pearcy]

It was too. Just not right, you know, that feeling like, this is a trip. Because we used to trip around with Motley and those guys in the. In the. You know, you'd be on a bus at 3:30 in the morning trying to go to. Back to the garage, you know, and you'd see some weird. Or end up at a weird party. Those guys and us and chicks with dicks. I mean, you know, just. Just wacky, right? But Hollywood, you go, that's all right. It's Hollywood. So anyway, that was my first thing. So I get into the Troubadour, right? And people knew us, you know, and we brought in some people, but you had to play, like, how many stages did he have there? He had 1, 2, 1. And then the main one was the one you wanted, but we ended up playing there. And then we played there about half a dozen times. And out of the blue, Doug goes, you can't play anymore here anymore under the name Rat. And I go, why? He goes, it makes the club look bad. And I'm like, gotta be kidding me. So you know, Motley guys and the Rat, couple of the Rat guys, you know, me, Robin, we used to run around and call ourselves the Gladiators, right? And, you know, cause trouble. So anyway, I go, all right, Doug, I'll play here under the name Gladiators. Full blown, have the ticket still. But there's a rat stamp on it. And we had a line sold out. And then he went, okay, you can come back as Rat. And I go, doug, I don't want to play here anymore, man. The Whiskey's my gig. That's the next step. Boing, boing. You know? Yeah, yeah, because if you play here, you can't play there a month later, two months later, you know, whatever. But it was kind of cool.

[Interviewer]

And.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And lo and behold, I got my way into the Whiskey and followed the schematic and it worked.

[Interviewer]

Talk a little bit about the. The first ep. Was that on Atlantic or you guys did it on your own, right?

[Stephen Pearcy]

We did it Marshall.

[Interviewer]

It later came out.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Okay, that's. That's why I get confused.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. He was like, you guys need a record. Motley had just put out two Fast for Love and they were selling him.

[Interviewer]

Out of their trunk.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And they were doing good. Molly was. And we were right behind him.

[Interviewer]

Who financed the record?

[Stephen Pearcy]

A partner. Marshalls. And it was only. It didn't cost much. We went in there over Thanksgiving weekend, if correct. Bobby knows everything. I was, you know, but I think it was over a Thanksgiving weekend or something. And we went in, recorded next day, mixed and it was done. Or one day, pretty much a couple day. A weekend event. And that was it. But it was us live. That was. We were recording live in there. And it. That record is so bad, I. I still want to try to get it out or I will. I'll get it out.

[Interviewer]

But what's prohibiting it coming out or being reissued or.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, some things need to be finalized, you know.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Before. But it's out there. So it's like. It's not even going to make a difference if I put it out there. It's already there. People had it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

40, 43 years later.

[Interviewer]

So here's where I come into your story. Somehow I'm in Chicago, living in a basement. 1983, I believe is the year. And somehow I get the. You think you're tough? Sing 7 inch.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

So that's the first time I ever heard Rat Wow. Before the first album.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Then you got the Atlantic.

[Interviewer]

No, I got.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, we re. Released it.

[Interviewer]

I know, but I got the. I got the.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

The single on the original vinyl. The original label. Time Lapse or.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, Time Coast.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, keep it. Keep it. There's only so many of those.

[Interviewer]

So somehow one of those found its way to me and I. And I was listening to a lot of hard rock at the time and I remember thinking, this is weird. No. I remember thinking, this is the kind of band I want to be in. Because. Because. No, because it had those other influences.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You know, the. The knock on heavy metal and I love heavy metal. So yell at me if you want. Not you. Them. But. But. But you know, the knock on heavy metal from. People don't Left. Heavy metal is a stupid.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Or it's too much about Vikings and.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, right, right.

[Interviewer]

But your music didn't. It sounded. Because I was also listening to Adam Ant and.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Me too.

[Interviewer]

Okay. So I'm listening to this and I'm like, this is different. But I couldn't. You know, it's whatever. I was 15. I could.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Different. I'm telling you, dude, Adam Ant was a big influence on. And I hate to say it, Duran Duran, because I love fashion and Is it.

[Interviewer]

Is it influenced kind of the way you Used to sing Up Top because you didn't sing, like, when your voice is high, you don't, don't sing like a lot of rock singers. You almost sing more like an alternative singer, I hope you know what I mean by the genres.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I would say maybe. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You know, alternative singers sing a more, a little bit more emotionally.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sure.

[Interviewer]

It's not about hitting the big note or being tough.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, yeah, right.

[Interviewer]

I, I, it's more of a vibe. That's why when you think Adam, at the way he sings up high, it's more of a thing. So when I think of you up high, it's like a thing. Does that make sense? I know we're not talking music.

[Stephen Pearcy]

It does. I don't know if it would make sense to somebody else, but it, to us, it makes sense.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, but it's weird. I tell people, Adam, and Yeah, I mean, I, I got turned on to them in like 82. Yeah, 84, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

One. And I'd go to these dance clubs.

[Interviewer]

It'D be Duran Duran, Stand and Deliver, all of that.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And it was so, and I go. And then, and then when the image thing came around, we were kind of fashiony.

[Interviewer]

Nope.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You could think, what are you trying to. Heavy metal, Duran Duran now. I was like trying to do anything right. Find our niche. We didn't want to be the leather studs.

[Interviewer]

Well, even when you, but even I remember seeing you on television, early 80s, and you looked more alternative to me.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, we did, we did.

[Interviewer]

And, but I'm saying you in particular. Yeah, but was that conscious in your mind or was that just who you were?

[Stephen Pearcy]

No, what was conscious was we wanted to look, look different. We wanted to look like our, A gang, you know, like Motley had their own little thing, you know, we wanted all of us just to look like a gang, you know, like pirates, you know, and that was our cement, you know, our image came up and Robin and I kind of created, you know, we were cement pirates, man. You know, and, and so we might as well look it, you know, and then.

[Interviewer]

I like that.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, right.

[Interviewer]

Walking up and down the Strip in your, in your ship.

[Stephen Pearcy]

But at one time we were getting a little fashiony and actually fashion metal. I, I, it was, we tried in it. I, I, you know, you do what you have to do. Because the OG guys in the 80s scene, believe it or not, were people from Metal Massacre. They were Armored, Saint Rat, Wasp, Motley. There were other bands. Snow. There was not Snow. Venice. There were plenty of other bands that were huge that didn't make it, but the OGs. It's really interesting, you think about it, you know, I don't know if Betsy Bitch is on there or Bitch is on that one, but Metallica. I mean, we did a couple gigs of Metallica. You know, one at a roller rink. Billy Barty's Roller Rink.

[Interviewer]

You know, Billy Barty. Wow.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Billy Barty's Roller Rink. Metallica and Rat. How about that? And then we played together with Saxa. Okay. That's really what kind of opened the door for us, you know.

[Interviewer]

How did the. How did the. The harder rock metal fans see you guys at that time? Were they cool with you? Or they. Or were you too melodic? Because.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Interesting. No, because when we went out there, we were like, fired up, man. I'm talking. You know, I would put up, as I put my band up against anybody.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I mean, dead serious. Like, you want to go there? Let's go. You know, get up. And it was all about just, you know, and we were heavy.

[Interviewer]

Oh, yeah. That's what I'm saying. When I heard you think you're tough. I'm like, heavy.

[Stephen Pearcy]

But it's cool. Really melodic. Right.

[Interviewer]

But it's cool, too.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

It doesn't have swagger or something.

[Stephen Pearcy]

There you go. Talk about Robin's writing. That's Robin. I just arranged it.

[Interviewer]

And what a.

[Stephen Pearcy]

What did the lyrics.

[Interviewer]

What a riff, you know.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I know, right? And we probably got in trouble for that too, because you'd go see bands, right? Yeah, as a matter of fact, I think we did.

[Interviewer]

But tell me, tell me.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, I think I actually know the band too.

[Interviewer]

We.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Robin and I went to Orange county to see. Who was it? Probably WASP and some other band. What was their name? But they had a riff like that. And I think Robin kind of took it in and really not going, you know, and just turned. Well, knock knock here. You've swiped our song and.

[Interviewer]

But you can't really copyright a riff, I think. I think that's my. That's my legal understanding. I'm not a lawyer, but.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, you can't trademark. What is it? Song titles.

[Interviewer]

Oh, okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

That's what it is. But yeah. But anyway, we got. We got slapped. But it was a great song. I remember the first time hearing that again. Rob and I were always out. Out on the Strip, right. Always doing a scene. And I remember we're coming home from who knows where and you think you're tough comes on one of the big stations, kmet. We're like, whoa. You know, songs on the radio. Yeehaw. And then we turn it to another stage, it's on again. Right. And we're just looked at each other and went, okay, here we go.

[Interviewer]

Was there's, you know, unfortunately, when people think of Robin's life, they often think about his issues with addiction and obviously his health issues. But, but, you know, you're standing at, let's say, let's say you were right at the moment before you guys take off. And when you take off, you take off like a rock.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Was he having issues at that point or was he just. Everybody was just partying and it was just.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Everybody was just everybody. Nothing changed. I mean, we were just the way we were.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I mean, all of us, all five of us, you know, no one of us can say no. I had my. Together.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Stephen Pearcy]

If it wasn't for actually Marshall keeping everybody in line for as long as he, he did. And I talked to him to this day, you know, and. Because we shared some in crazy moments, man. You know, he headlined Madison Square Garden. You know, you do that kind of. And to be honest with you, and I say this, and I've said it before, I don't remember a lot of those years. It's almost like it never existed.

[Interviewer]

Is it because you were messed up or is just a blur? No, it's just. Was it just a blur?

[Stephen Pearcy]

It was, it's just, it was just a blur. I, I, I acknowledge the, some great things like headlining home, you know, your arena at San Diego or the form or, or Madison. But anything else in between, it's like, wiped from my memory. And it's, no, I'm, I being serious.

[Interviewer]

Well, why, do you have a reason for that, you think?

[Stephen Pearcy]

No, it's just, that was just, you know, somebody put something out about the life of musicians recently, and I sent it to Christie, actually. I go, here, check this out. We were just talking about it.

[Interviewer]

Christie's your wife.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. Yeah. How weird it is for musicians. You know, you, you're in front of how many thousands of people and all of a sudden you're in a room. Silence.

[Interviewer]

Well, I think except for the whistling in your ear, but.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right. And, and because there were times we couldn't. And, and especially when you're like, in Japan and stuff, and it's just like surreal. It's almost like, is this really going down? You know, I get it. We're popular and whatever, but some of this is kind of funny, you know, So I kind of maybe out there, but I, I don't, and I tell people sometimes, I go, man, you, I don't know. What happened. But I. I lived through it, you know.

[Interviewer]

All right, well, let's light the fuse on the rocket. Yes, we're lighting the fuse on the rocket.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

So Atlantic shows up at some point.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Tell me, tell me that day.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Beverly Theater, if I'm correct. We have a showcase and I don't know if it's the one with lead afford opening, but we had some Atlantic eyes come down because we were drawing big Motley had man next step. Went to the next step. Opening up for Aussie and Arena, whatever. And we were next. We couldn't play in LA anymore. We played Santa Monica Civic. You play here? Well, we're gonna play. Can't play anywhere. Okay. So we showcased at Beverly Theater. Great gig. Atlantic was there and they signed us on the spot.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. It was that crazy. And me and, you know, Robin and I would be going, if it's good enough for Zeppelin and the Stones, it's good enough for Rat. And off we went.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know. And what was your.

[Interviewer]

Because the producer was Bo Hill. Bo Hill. Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well.

[Interviewer]

But before Bo Hill sort of shows up in this mixture, this cocktail, what was your vision for the album? Well, were you thinking we have to pivot to be slightly more commercial. We got to do exactly what we're doing.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I think our. Our whole trip was like, we have the opportunity now to really try to make a record. And we got serious, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

A lot of those songs on the record we had played live. So, you know, we wanted that live thing on the record. Low was a staff producer. It's kind of like we. We got signed, but only if that guy is producing the record. Doug Morse.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

So it was a weird thing. We didn't care. We were in the studio. Go, let's rock. You know, nothing change. We're a party, do our thing, you know, and we, you know, laid it.

[Interviewer]

Down and because there's not a lot. There's not a tremendous amount of difference in your musical vision before Bo Hill shows up as producer. But he obviously harnessed something. Yeah. Important. So give me that part of it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Okay. With Bo and I still love it to this day. Is. Is we actually had a system of working with me because he would come up with ideas and I would be open minded. Why not? Right. Hey, whatever works.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, so you do the best you can. And then. But he had some great ideas and, you know, some words and things. But as we went along, like another platinum plus record. Another platinum plus record. Another platinum. You know, it started getting trippy to where I didn't even want to write lyrics until I give them my songs. I go, here's one of my songs. You guys work with it, you know, so we have all the songs. I'm talking like maybe Reach.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Or Dancing or one of those. And to where it got weird the guys and I didn't know what I was singing because Bo would always make me change. So I would never get really hung up on what I was writing after first two records.

[Interviewer]

If you can quantify what he was asking you to be as opposed to what you had sort of brought in.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, he wanted more commercialism.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I mean, hit, hit, hit. I mean, you gotta understand when sell it happened and round it was like we didn't know the one else. We did another one and we had no break. That's another downfall of, of, of this, of the band is we never had a break.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, you were tour, record, tour, record.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Tour, and good luck. Okay. For the first two records, it' but after that, you know, as you know, you can beat yourself up. And that started happening. But in the studio, it was cool because I like Beau. He would give me great ideas and I'd try him. Why not, right? And I appreciate it more now because over the years and on some of these records, I've had the opportunity to write with some of the best writers. I love it. I mean, man, Desmond Jim Valance, Hudson. I love it. Knowledge, you know.

[Interviewer]

So you were cool with. I know this is a lame trying.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Anything, but let's call it the cool without giving it. Giving it up.

[Interviewer]

Well, because, because we did. Because I, I know, I know Nikki decently well. We were friendly for a while and talked a lot. Nikki had always struggled with Motley Crue's integrity, how fans viewed Motley as a, as a rock band versus the commercial necessities of being a big band. And Nikki, Nikki was a commercial writer. Sure. So, you know, he wrestled with that. So in your case, it seems like you didn't really wrestle with that. You were kind of.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I was open to, to, you know, because, hey, I, I, I do. I, I always did what I did. Write songs.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Either works or it doesn't work. Those guys take it, they arrange it and. Or Bo gets a hold of it and then it's like, like, wow, that's way cool. And I'm literally talking the song way cool. You know, he has a lot to do with that, you know, because the.

[Interviewer]

Width, the width in your singles is pretty wide.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

It's not like there's this kind of, this One rat sound. You guys had success. There's some really interesting choices. Different feelings, different.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And I love that. See, I see. That's one thing that only we could. We got away with, you know.

[Interviewer]

Well, of your, of the bands, of your particular generation that came out of that. This scene in la.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I mean, and I'm proud of that because we tried and it worked for us. Like way cool rock band gets.

[Interviewer]

But I think it has a lot to do with the way you sing.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. Presentation, sure.

[Interviewer]

No, but I go back to the quality of your voice being sort of different. I think you didn't fall into like the traps that rock singers fall into. Like, I gotta sound tough or I gotta do this.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And you know, it's interesting as we were talking about singing and stuff, it's like, you know, when you're out there, I've had a peeve lately about people bitching about. Tell me your peeve about people, be it fans or other musicians or whatever, like given other musicians, you know, for like. Well, he doesn't sound like he sounds. Well, 40 some years later. I don't think so. Do you sound like you sound 40 years later? Yeah, he doesn't move like that. I mean, granted, there are some guys that should kind of pull out of the. Pull out out. You know, I, I even tell my peers, hey, whatever, dude, but that's only love, right? But, but I, I go, no, no, I don't sound like that. There's no way I'm gonna go body talk, you know, some of these songs. I mean, shame, shame, shame, forget about it. You know, hey, can we do a song like, are you out of your mind?

[Interviewer]

I know I do did within the last couple years. I, I do this with artists I really love. I'll go back and I listen to the. The albums all in a row. You basically how they came out. And it does seem as your albums went on through this, the. Let's call it rat period, number one, the ten year. Okay, whatever. But you seem to sing higher and then higher. And what was that about?

[Stephen Pearcy]

I don't know. And you know what? It's like by the end of that.

[Interviewer]

Run, you're singing so freaking high. I don't.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And dude, I was beat. That still bo. It beat me up. But I gotta tell you, the other day I heard one of our songs and it was so fast, I'm like, turn it down. I mean the speed down. It was like. And I'm like, oh God, I got. I try to complain about that. You know. Who put that out there? You Know, granted, it's not like Paige going, house is the holy.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Spin it up to make plants, you know, but no. No intention. But Bo, it just worked my, like, shame. Like shame. Right. We did the Detonator tour. Yeah. I might have gotten away with it a little now and then, but, you know, you work with it.

[Interviewer]

Okay. So. Because it's. Obviously, it's the most explored part of your life. That's why I'm least interested in exploring. Not because I'm not interested. Just feel like a lot of that information is out there. But so it's not to skip past these incredible years because there's a lot of great music.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. A lot of good stuff, you know, but.

[Interviewer]

But now that you know, you know, and you know how it ended, let's call it Rat period, number one. Like, what's your. What's your take sitting here today on. On how you view that period? Do you have empathy for yourself? Do you. You think I would have done it differently? I'm cool with it, how it all.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Went down, or 1,000%, I would have done it differently because when I created the band Rat, as my boys know and they know now, that everything would have kept working if you just, you know, I didn't have all the answers. I just created the thing. You know what I mean? And I liked my, you know, and there was a lot of my songs, you know, the whole EP is all me. I wrote the whole ep, except for Tough, you know, I give Robin credit because he was my right hand man. You know, it's like, yeah, brother, why not? You know? But, you know, I did a lot of those riffs and, And. And stuff, and it could have been cool. It just got, you know, so what's. What happens?

[Interviewer]

It happens.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I get it.

[Interviewer]

In a summary way, what if you're. If, if. If we're sitting, like, we're sitting here. Give me, like, your two or three reasons, like, why did it go sideways?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Too many cooks, you know?

[Interviewer]

Okay, I'm gonna freak you out here. Ready? Okay. There's literally a line here on my notes. Lots of cooks in the kitchen.

[Stephen Pearcy]

100. Because it was cool the first few years, you know, with Robin and me directing the madness. And those guys know, we. We knew what we were doing because, like I say, I followed the Van Halen schematic. Blame it on them. My work ethic was like, we're gonna kick ass. We'll look great. We're gonna do this. It was like, just go for it then. It wasn't that anymore.

[Interviewer]

What do you Attribute that to. Is it ego, is it drugs, success, everything.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Okay, Whatever comes with success, you know.

[Interviewer]

But, but I'm speaking like a brother here, but like, when I look at musicians that I've dealt with when they can't handle success or the juice or the glare of the lights, I mean, at the end of the day, isn't it ultimately on them?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, but when you start wanting to do things against the grain and, you know, you've got like, like Mutiny on the Bounty and they all, you know, they all went after me and they all fell. So, you know, I'm the last man.

[Interviewer]

So the mutiny. Are we talking the mutiny at the end of the 80s, early 90s, period? Are we talking about even now?

[Stephen Pearcy]

I'm still fighting and, and, but I'm the last man standing and I'm proud of what we did. It's like, guys, you know, we did a good thing. It's like Marshall Burroughs says, hey, man, you had your moment. It was crazy, you know, but it was a beautiful thing. And I just don't know why. You know, it confuses me sometimes how I don't know what happens to some people, you know, especially when you give them something that really isn't theirs. You know, they get a piece of something that they really don't know how to handle or control or, you know, call me out. Most the, you know, I know where it's at. They don't know how to do their. I do. I made it work many times.

[Interviewer]

It's part of your. Is part of your. Is the center for you. Because look, this was your vision from the beginning. It start. You know, you, you were doing this before they all kind of showed up. So even today, that, that, that's the thread that follows all the way back. I just want to understand.

[Stephen Pearcy]

They might, you know, I don't think they, you know, there's animosity for that and whatever, but I didn't have all the answers. I just, you know, like I say, you created something really good and, and you give some away for no reason, you know, just to be cool.

[Interviewer]

Playing the parlor game. Rat. Of all the bands that get kind of lumped into the hair metal category, I didn't. I never thought of you guys as hair metal. I just don't think that's right for you. I don't know why. I think. I think Rat is one of those bands that stands almost like Motley.

[Stephen Pearcy]

We're a rock band, but.

[Interviewer]

But Motley. And you guys stand out. Out of all the other bands. I don't know why? What they. It's the influences or the swagger or the attitude or the openness.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I think it was. If with them it was. And as it was just man or tenacity and. Tenacity and. And.

[Interviewer]

But you not see what I'm talking about from a musical point of view. Yeah, I'm not arguing, I'm just saying.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, yeah, yeah, sure, sure. Yeah, I get it.

[Interviewer]

Because there's. There's a lot.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Rat was different. Right. I. I can actually say that. That the band is different than a lot of the.

[Interviewer]

It's to me, strip band.

[Stephen Pearcy]

To me.

[Interviewer]

To me as a fan and observer of the time. It's. It's not.

[Stephen Pearcy]

But you know what? I have to. And I. And I've learned to love this. The hair metal thing, because when you. Somebody says hair metal, they go, oh, yeah, you mean Rat, Def Leppard. And then you're, you're. There's there. I'd rather be there than not at all. That's called business.

[Interviewer]

I'm just making a qualitative musical argument. But so the reason I was going down this. The rabbit hole was. And I want to talk about what happened when Rat kind of dissolves there for a hot minute. But Rat, of all the bands, I would say even more than Motley, was uniquely positioned to not transition into grunge, but actually ride the wave that grunge brought in. Because the riffs of. I'll tell you, the riffs of Rat are not that different than the riffs of alternative music.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sure, sure.

[Interviewer]

Some of it's kind of the same. Ish.

[Stephen Pearcy]

See, it is. It is. And. And I. That's probably.

[Interviewer]

I mean, you must have laughed when. Sorry. You must have laughed when you heard grunge because you're like, this is really not that different.

[Stephen Pearcy]

No, it's not at all. And.

[Interviewer]

And that's why the down tuning and all the.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, yeah. That's why I get off on. On these. These new bands. Because I see, I. I get it. I get where they're coming from. I get their. Their whole trip and. But don't, you know, make mistakes that we did in our day?

[Interviewer]

Oh, they're going to make the mistakes. Don't you worry about it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Of course, they already did. And. And you know, it is.

[Interviewer]

Somebody could have come to you in a time machine in 1982 and said, it's going to go like this and you're going to do this. And you're. And don't do this mistake.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sure, sure.

[Interviewer]

And you'll still do it. It's just the musician brain.

[Stephen Pearcy]

That's right. And. And I'll tell you. But you know, like, like bro says, but, you know, I got to tell you back to now and, and actually, you know, I mean, I play with a lot of my guys again, but some are. Is unnecessary. It would only put a negative in the. In the. The positive. Like when I'm out there playing, I want to have a good time. That's why I'm still out there.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, it's not necessarily for the buck. It's great, but, you know, stop giving, you know, I won't do it. You know, I love kicking back and feeding deers and chasing, you know, doing whatever I do and. But I'm always writing, working, whatever. So, you know, but anyway, the bottom line is, is now when we go out, we have. I have a great time and I love talking to the fans because they're so hardcore and sincere. I mean, you know, besides the tattoos. Rat tattoos, their kids and clothes and presents, it's like. It's like a whole new world again, you know, it's exciting and dangerous and colorful again then kinda, you know, because some of us are out there embracing it.

[Interviewer]

Sure. Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I'll wear the same I wore back then. Why not? That's why you did it then. You know, somebody made a complaint about, you know, musicians or said something about musicians, and I kind of went, you know, what are they supposed to look like? If you're in a band 40 years ago, why can't you at least have some kind of that character now?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

What do you need to. I don't get it. I still love, you know, do it. Dressing up and looking like I want to do something out there.

[Interviewer]

I think people get confused by the OGs, if you know what I mean by that.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I do. I do too.

[Interviewer]

You know, I mean, like, if you're an og, why would you change what you do or who you are? Because you're an og.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. Yeah. And I just feel I. I think with me, I have just progressed with the help of direction, you know, as a person and. And, you know, besides getting sobered up and learning from mistakes. But I'm still. And I will still fight wars for the band I created, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

It was an important. It's still important to me. It always will be. And. And so no matter. So that's why I. I really love. I mean, me and Warren are really taking this and like, man, 40 some years later, dude, we can do this, right? You know, we can have a great time and that's what happen this year.

[Interviewer]

Let's take this walk here for a second because I'm curious. I'm repeating myself, but to me, if I'm you and I'm not you, but if I'm you and I'm looking at what's coming in early 90s with what is now commonly called grunge, you can't be thinking we're not that different than what's coming out. Right.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, I didn't get it.

[Interviewer]

Okay, good.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So how do you view that period now in hindsight? Like, because on one hand you're trying to start. You did Arcade. You did some records with Arcade.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sure. And I did vd, which was Vicious Delight.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Have you ever heard that? Yeah, I did, like, brutal. It's like. And I intended it to be the shortest hardcore songs I could do.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And just.

[Interviewer]

And your voice fits right into that type.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. That music more like grunge.

[Interviewer]

But that's my point.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. So I love it.

[Interviewer]

So. So you're over here running this track. But of course, you know how the world works. It's like. Yeah, well, you're the guy from Brian.

[Stephen Pearcy]

They don't like it. And it didn't work. You know, Fred. It worked for a bit with me and Freddie, with Arcade, Fred, Corey, we had a great tour. We did stuff with, you know, Bon Jovi or whatever and then. But the record did well and that was great songs. And then we did the second one and it just got started getting dark and that's when it went boom, you know, so.

[Interviewer]

So over here you're doing what you're doing, right? You're trying to do. And I've been there. You're going down that road, you know, and then you're watching all these artists blow up. Some of them are legends, some are long forgotten and rightly so, in my personal opinion, as being there. So we share some of that. But. Yeah, but I'm saying, well, how do you view that period now? Because like I said, people commonly do the thing and it's kind of a lazy take, you know. Grunge killed hair metal.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I don't believe that. I mean, they call it.

[Interviewer]

Well, it didn't, because the people. Because so many of the great bands of the hair metal world are still out there playing big games.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, and. And. And deservingly so, some of them. I mean, the copycats of them. What, are you kidding me? Some of those bands are being played more now because of this hair metal tag than they ever were in the 80s.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Kiss the Ground guys get it. Get, get, get paid.

[Interviewer]

Well, there's. That is the Sirius has the hair metal channel. Right, right, right.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And. And, and so. So, you know, I. I didn't struggle with that term. I went, you know, that's kind of funny. And then I started thinking about hair metal, you know, and then. But, but, but what? After Arcade, when I was going, oh, I'm pissed off. And I. Vicious Light happened, you know, it was no different than what was.

[Interviewer]

But I'm saying, how did you start to ask again, but how did you view the 90s bands? Because some are. Some now Earths are bitter about it. Some artists are like, whatever. No.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And you know what?

[Interviewer]

What?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Their. Their turn is happening now. Just like the 80s.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Turn was. I'd say the last five years had had its moment and now it's there. I think the same thing is happening now to the 90s very much now. Look at Corn, look at Limb Bizkit, look at Evanescence, look at so and so. They're doing huge shows. Will Hunt trump. I forgot to say but so. And look how big they are now. People still want the good.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So you were cool with that musical scene at the time?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, yeah. 100. I look at. I enjoy. That's why it came off on me. You know, it dwindled, you know, it was put in my head to where I wrote these crazy Vicious Delight songs, you know, like a dog. And.

[Interviewer]

And is that. That stuff's not on Spotify, though. It on streaming service.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I don't know. I don't do Spotify. I don't. I don't.

[Interviewer]

I was trying to find that stuff. I mean, I found it, but it was like I had to dig around.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And actually Bo Hill remixed Vicious Delight. And he was like, what the is this? I go, bo, I put him in a really good studio.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And I go. I go, do your thing with this. Do mix with this. It's hardcore. And he didn't know what to do with it, but he did try to buff it up. And what I hear. And it just.

[Interviewer]

It didn't work. Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

No, no, no. And. And that's when I knew.

[Interviewer]

Wow. So. So in these years were rats sort of floating.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Floundered.

[Interviewer]

Floundered or float apart or whatever. Did you maintain any personal relationships with anybody or was that thing. You're kind of divorced and. Well.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, with Warren, like I say, it was just a while before that was inevitable that him and I would. You know, it happened before. Years and years apart, you know, not playing or whatever. Yeah. And because he does this trip. I get it. But the other guys, I, I talked to Bobby quite often and the other.

[Interviewer]

Guy I'm talking about, I'm sorry, but I'm talking about then because you guys did reform.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Sure.

[Interviewer]

Did another album. I did.

[Stephen Pearcy]

That's what I'm saying. I thought, you know, I actually would run into Warren occasionally on the downtime period. Nothing was happening there. Wars and this legal and you know.

[Interviewer]

Who, who, who did was. Was part of the contention who owns the name or was it that stuff?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, yeah. And it, you know, it's been back and forth, back and forth, and, and, and the outcome will, you know, inevitably happen, you know, with what partners are left. And I don't dwell on it because it's like I say, look, we created this, this music. We created this entity. When Robin was out of the picture, I knew it was done. I went, okay, we can go out there and play and, you know, call it rat. And some people get it and not. But it didn't work. You know.

[Interviewer]

Why do you think it didn't work?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, when you throw in different components with no disrespect to some of the musicians, you know, I mean, one guy had a rat out there, you know, with all these different people. They replaced me with somebody and went out and, you know, there's those weird.

[Interviewer]

Like mid-90s where it's without you, which is hard for me to.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And then I had to come in, step in, in 97 and put, you know, regrouped. Everybody put together collage and said, we're, we're going to get things in order and try to. Wasn't going to work. And I, I, I say it because, you know, Robin was such a big part of directing this monster, you know, he really was. And besides being a heart and soul guy, he was, he was really dedicated until he, he got lost, you know, and once it was done, once he was out, it was over. I mean, like I say, it was Mutiny on the Bounty.

[Interviewer]

In your mind, when, when, when does he go from just your typical partying LA musician to. He's like, got a real Nader.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Okay, the last album. So that's 90 90, 91.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, it was, it was terrible. We should have never went on the road. The record was a mess. And, you know, you do what you can because you're ordered to, and that's the way it is.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And that's part of the business. I changed for myself because I release my own records, I do my own thing, I have my own distribution. But back then it was like, whoa, man. And then the business really started changing. You know what I mean?

[Interviewer]

That is true.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Here you got all these channels here. You got that. And. And. But then again, I found another direction of. Of the business that I like and that's like music for movies, TV commercial and you know, that kind of stuff. And you know, I love some still what. What's happening, you know, in the music business. There's some of it I could give about, you know, I love. And. And the touring part, you know, it is a blessing that Warren I got back together because we forgot how important. How important we were to. To each other. You know what I mean?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I get that.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You go, hey, man, you. You. We were. We're buddies.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. You know, it is interesting when you've had those experiences with somebody. Like, it bonds you in a way. Like people. Obviously we didn't go to war, but it. It's the. I call it the foxhole. Like, you can never not have that with each other.

[Stephen Pearcy]

That's right. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And look, you Only Live twice, so.

[Interviewer]

Sounds Like a Rat. Sounds Like a Rat song title.

[Stephen Pearcy]

It might be.

[Interviewer]

And.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And. But you know, when I say that, I mean, you know, a lot of the. With me, I see things. Things very differently with the business and my life. I separate the two.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I really do. Sometimes I don't know that dude that goes out there once. I. You know, I don't even put it this way. I don't do sound checks. I. I want to walk right on stage to unpredictability. I want to. I don't want to see the stage. I don't want nothing. I just want to go out there and do what I used to do.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

With that surprise. You know, that element. I don't like, like, you know, I like. I don't know what it is.

[Interviewer]

I get it. I get it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, and then I have a great time and. And it's. Man, I see people smiling and singing. You know, it's a trip, man. You. You gotta.

[Interviewer]

You understand how trippy everything you say I feel in here.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Business is so weird, you know. And then you get into the business. Business part. That it up Because. Yeah. You know, know, it is a beautiful thing. People like you for what you do. And you're like, well, why. Well, your song and this and that's like, yeah, man. I meet people at airports in the weirdest places. And I go, how do you even recognize me? You know, I got a dog tail up here looking like. And people go, oh, hey. I still go wow. It's cool, man. You know? Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Embrace. I got a cool Warren story for you.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

So 96, we released this big album and. And one of the band members ends up leaving. So I end up coming out to LA in 97, making this depressing record called A Door. My mother.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Solo record?

[Interviewer]

No, my. My bass player later said it should have been a solo record. This is a different story.

[Stephen Pearcy]

She gave me her book, that girl.

[Interviewer]

Oh, no. You're thinking of a different bass player. I've had a few. Okay, well, you've had a few bass players, too. Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right.

[Interviewer]

Anyway, the reason I'm telling you this is. So I was out here at Sunset Sound making this very depressing record. My mother had died. My mother had died. And I was going through a lot. It's life stuff. And a buddy said, do you want to meet Warren demartini from Rat? And I was like, yeah. So I made friends with Warren, and he used to come visit me in the studio while I'm making this super depressing record.

[Stephen Pearcy]

No way.

[Interviewer]

And so he.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, my God.

[Interviewer]

So I always have this love for Warren because he was around during the making of this record, and he would show up like an angel. He would just kind of come in and just talk to me, and we just hang out. Talk guitar.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Whoa.

[Interviewer]

And I was so such a fan of you and him, and. And it was like. It was like he was this angel who just show up on the right day at the right time and just kind of. Kind of help me through this really difficult period of my life.

[Stephen Pearcy]

What a trip. Yeah. I'm gonna tell him that I talked. I'm gonna talk.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Please send him my love. Because it's one of those things where it's like, you know, there's the public story of the record, but the private story of the record is Warren is intertwined into that record.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

And I. To this day, I still regret that I didn't ask him to play on it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, no way.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And it wasn't because I didn't want him to play on. It just was one of those things. It just didn't kind of work out. I. Or I. Maybe I felt weird just asking him. Like, I didn't want him to feel we weren't friends first and he. All I wanted was something out of him and. But to this day, I almost. I wish he played on it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, that would have been crazy. Well, that's interesting.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. You know, I got. I gotta tell you, I. I love so many musicians that are out there because I Know, most of the real guys that are still out there, 40 something years later, like a Rudy Sarza or somebody who really respects what they have done and what they do and what they can do and smile about it because it only happens once. You know what I mean? And. And it's fleeting. And. And then we deal with, you know, who likes, who doesn't like. And then me, I could give it who likes? Because that was our motto back then. Yeah. And that's why we're here. We're here is because I want to play whether you like it or not. I'm still gonna sing. Whatever. I have to stop singing because I'm gonna be 70. Yeah. I forgot how old I am. So it's like, what am I supposed to stop? Or I can't wear cool clothes.

[Interviewer]

Okay. Two more things.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And thank you for indulging me. We all live in this world of, like, halls of fame and top 50 lists, best song and Da da da da.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

How do you rate your band in the generation? I think it's always fair to start with the generation because. Because it's one thing to take a band out of their generation and say, how do they match? But, but, but you would have responded differently in a different generation than the. You responded to the one you were.

[Stephen Pearcy]

In 100%, which is 80s.

[Interviewer]

Sure.

[Stephen Pearcy]

That generation.

[Interviewer]

So how do you. How. Which. How do. Where do you guys sit in that totem pole?

[Stephen Pearcy]

For you, the. The group Rat, I would say they sit firmly in the psyche of that generation. You know, I don't know. That's a weird one. I think that we're, you know, that was a good band. You know, I don't know how. How to. How to put that. That's like, you know. How do I see Rat? Well, we did it. You know, I don't know. We did what we were supposed to do.

[Interviewer]

But, you know, every generation has commercial. Some artists are more commercial and they're sellouts, but they have a lot of success.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And you as a musician from the inside, you know what they're doing and why they're doing it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. We would never trade that for that. No.

[Interviewer]

Right. Okay. So.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Never did. That's why. That's why Rhett never went like.

[Interviewer]

Like, that's kind of what I'm asking.

[Stephen Pearcy]

It was destined to have, like, somebody said something about Zeppelin, like, they're only supposed to be here for those years. For those. They weren't even together eight years, something like that.

[Interviewer]

Right. Well, they started, I think, 68. And. And Bonham unfortunately, passed away when he was 1980.

[Stephen Pearcy]

So.

[Interviewer]

12 years. Yeah, 13. Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

So the way I see it is that always comes into my mind with us, like, you know, we are only supposed to make. We are only supposed to do it for that long.

[Interviewer]

Sure.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, that was supposed to be our moment. And it was and still goes on because it was. You hit a nerve.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And it's a blessing. Hey. Round and round forever. I mean, maybe, maybe.

[Interviewer]

Maybe a different way. To ask you the question, from your generation, rock bands, who do you rate in sort of top three to five? Who are the people that you go. I still respect the game because definitely.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Well, who's in the game?

[Interviewer]

Like Zeppelin. But no, I'm talking about. I'm talking about. About your generation, your. Your. Your age range, the groups that came out. What are the ones that you still go, okay, they did it right? Or I respect, you know, they did it right.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And some bands had to pull out. But, I mean, there were a lot of, you know, like, kicks, you know, Motley, you know, let's see, my job. You got wasp. You still got guys trying. You not trying. You still have a lot of us out there trying to do it. Like I say, in one manner of form, for whatever reason, their reason is to do it. But enjoying it should be the priority because, you know, it just trips me out. It really does. It's like 40 years later, it's almost a surreal thing. Like, as you know, that, well, you're going all. It's been around for 30 years.

[Interviewer]

All four members of Motley Career are still alive. Start there.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah. And, you know, another thing is. Is I trip on, is they better knock on some kind of wood. Because most successful bands lose somebody, you know, but, you know, there's a lot of great bands, but they're not the band anymore. So put it this way, soon enough we'll be delivering something, you know, but the Sunset Strip Experience is. Is something that we're working on. That's going to be cool, because soon enough, dude, you're gonna have. If it's not happening now, the only thing out there that's gonna represent the 80s is trippy bands.

[Interviewer]

I see.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know what I mean?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

It's already happening.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

You know, you got tribute bands for days. And why. Because it could be cheaper than the.

[Interviewer]

Real guys or great songs, I think.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, great.

[Interviewer]

I think it's all too much about great songs. Okay, last bit, because. Because I. I didn't know this, that you'd been through this intense health. Health thing. Can you talk about that.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, yeah. You know, you use and abuse, you know, and as I did. As we did, and. Yeah, I had a bout with cancer. Liver cancer. It's kind of freak. Kind of up, because, you know, when somebody goes, hey, you might want to get your things in order. Okay, look, I've been run over. I've been. I've had broken bones, rods, wires, this, that. I'm. I am the bionic man. No knees. Kneecap, you know, fake knees. But. But when that happened, I just. That was it. Anyway, long story short, if it wasn't for Christy keeping me in order and us creating a beautiful support system for me and business, we take care of business, you know, so it's. Besides having her support, we have business. And that keeps me. Any direct drive, you know, I see in place, I don't think about, you know, but yeah, I went in and had surgeries and. And this and that, and thank God that it's from, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. If they give you a. Because my mother had liver cancer. That's why it particularly struck me when my mother had liver cancer in 95, somewhere on there, they said her chance of survival was 5% or under. Better. Yeah, I know. It's gotten better.

[Stephen Pearcy]

How long did she live after?

[Interviewer]

Six months. Oh, after diagnosis.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, okay. Yeah. And. And that's like my mom, she had liver cancer too. And they couldn't operate because it was so close to a man. Otherwise, she would have survived. I was lucky. It wasn't near anything weird. And they just went in and just took out, burn, freeze, whatever the. They do. But anyway. Yeah. And so I'm very lucky. And. And don't take that anything for granted. What I do now is just try.

[Interviewer]

To enjoy what you seem in a great place.

[Stephen Pearcy]

What I'm here. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And I love, you know, it's. It's a trip because I. I really do like playing. That's. You know, you get into it because you like it. You write because.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I don't know where it comes from. I just wrote, you know, you just write. You write great songs, you know, so it's like I can relate to people when I go, wow, man, guy's good writer, you know, I'd love to write with them or write with them because life's short, man. And, you know, what we did, whether we did it or not, made it or not, or should have been bigger or should be doing stadium tours, it doesn't mean. To me, you know, if it's supposed to be, it'll be.

[Interviewer]

Well, I'm sure I'm. We all. We all, somewhere in our brain, think we should have been in a bigger band. But I think one of the reasons that your music endures so strongly is that it always had a root of musical integrity.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

That even though you had a commercial focus, there still is, like an edge to your. Yeah, I hate that word.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Oh, real. We were real. You know, we were. You know, we didn't, you know, and say, hey, we're gonna like, put on these little car. You're gonna do this. And, you know, it was.

[Interviewer]

If, If I have any agenda talking to you today, that's that I would want to come through the camera lens. Is that for people who think they know your music, they need to go back and listen one more time and really understand why your band is so highly regarded with musicians. Because it's a cool band and wrote great songs.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Thank you. And we tried, you know, I can literally say all of us wrote, you know, but then when it got to be like, we've got to write, we've got to write because there's publishing. We gotta write.

[Interviewer]

Gosh, why does that sound so go.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Here's a million bucks.

[Interviewer]

Why does that sound so familiar?

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right? And then, then it turns different and then, you know, the. All those guys who do all the writing, you know, all of a sudden we're bad men. Well, write songs, dude. You know, I don't know what the. But, but.

[Interviewer]

Well, I always think of George Harrison, right? Imagine. Oh, yeah, he's writing and it's like he's trying to outright John and Paul, but look at the songs he wrote.

[Stephen Pearcy]

I saw something on him recently and that was exactly his subject. And he was just smiling, talking about like, well, at least I got a song there.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. You know, imagine competing against those guys in there.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Pro. Oh, God. God.

[Interviewer]

You know, but he did it.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

What I would always say. Sorry, but I would always say to my band mates, because I wrote most of the songs for the band, would be like, just write a better song than me. Sure put me. Put me in a position to turn down a better song.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Right. And the thing is, you know, as. As you know, when you write a song, you don't know if it. It's going to be a hit.

[Interviewer]

Nobody, you don't sit and go, it's.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Going to be a hit. Well, let me tell you now, you say you, hey, AI, write me a hit song. It sounds like, so you know, where the business is going, you know.

[Interviewer]

Okay, let's, let's, let's stop here because I yeah, because. Because we have to. But. Yes, but one question for you because I am a fan.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yes, sir.

[Interviewer]

Tell me. Tell me the. Tell me the great rap song that I probably missed. Oh, like. Like you were sure it was a can't miss song. I was listening to your music today, coming here to. To see you.

[Stephen Pearcy]

A song called Reach for the Sky.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

That we recorded early seller that I found and actually re released on the 40th anniversary out of the seller box set. That's what I was going to bring.

[Interviewer]

Oh. It's a sort of a forgotten. Yeah.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And I found it. Okay. It's called Reach for the sky and.

[Interviewer]

You kick yourself because you didn't put on the record.

[Stephen Pearcy]

It should have been on out of the Cellar. But I get it. It cowboy song, just like Wanted Man.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Stephen Pearcy]

So Bo is probably going, oh, one of those. Hey, you got two cowboy songs here. We'll take Wanted Man. That's the only thing I can think of. Why it did. Because it's a great song. I found it 40 years later. It's in that. And I'm going to get it to. And it's a. It's a bitching single. And we made a cartoon video of the song too, so you can look it up.

[Interviewer]

Oh, great.

[Stephen Pearcy]

Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

And.

[Stephen Pearcy]

And that's just, you know, the I like to do. But that, that and because we played that song live in our set, you know, early on with like, you got it. You think you're tough. Reach for the sky, you know, back for more before they were even an ep, you know. But why the song didn't make it, I don't know. But I got it out and that's what I've been trying to do 10 years. But yes, sir.

[Interviewer]

Thank you. God bless you. Love you, man.