Interrupted by Matt Jones - Episode 29: Kat Rosenfield

Date: January 23, 2026
Host: Matt Jones
Guest: Kat Rosenfield, culture writer for The Free Press and novelist

Episode Overview

In this episode, Matt Jones engages culture writer and novelist Kat Rosenfield in a candid, wide-ranging conversation about polarized political culture, the dynamics of journalism and media, the phenomenon of “fandom politics,” and the unique isolation in modern American life and media. Rosenfield sheds light on her approach to cultural analysis, the challenges of fostering civil discourse in today’s environment, media failures around #MeToo, and her new novel. The tone is thoughtful, probing, and occasionally wry, with both host and guest seeking nuance over hot takes.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Defining the Role of a Culture Writer

• Kat explains "culture" as the “water we all swim in”—the realm where everyone participates and influences, unlike national politics.

  "Culture is like what's happening between us socially. ... It's also art. ... So, it's this sort of nebulous, 'how do we connect with each other as people?'" (Kat, 04:17)

• She prefers the title “culture writer” over “social critic,” chasing cultural significance over political hot takes.

2. Experiences at The Free Press and Audience Shifts

• Matt notes The Free Press’ shifting audience, especially post-Bari Weiss moving to CBS.

• Kat describes an increase in online criticism but says her audience mostly seeks "something that fills in some of the blanks left by legacy media."

  "I think that the people who are coming over as readers tend to be in search of something that fills in some of the blanks that are being left by the kind of contemporary, like, legacy media landscape." (Kat, 07:44)

• She practices not reading comments ("exquisite art... good way to drive yourself crazy," Kat, 06:49).

3. Breaking Down the Minnesota ICE Incident

• Matt references Kat’s piece on the tragic police shooting of Renee Goode in Minnesota.

• Kat isn’t interested in blame, but rather in how cultural failures led to the tragedy, faulting both the federal government's unserious messaging and local authorities' abdication of responsibility.

  "Everybody who was in a position to influence this series of events failed to take it as seriously as they should—was treating it like some kind of game or role playing exercise or performance." (Kat, 10:21)

• Discussion of rhetoric of "invasion" from both anti-immigration and anti-ICE perspectives leading to inevitable conflict (11:00–14:30).

• Unserious Communication:

  "The graphics on this thing look like they were designed by ... the on screen graphics for Maury Povich's 'you are not the father' segments in the 90s..." (Kat, 12:50)

• Failure of local governance: Minneapolis police were barred from crowd control during ICE raids, leading to confusion and dangerous situations for protesters like Goode.

4. Accountability & Modern Policing

• Both agree the shooting was tragic, but differ on how much responsibility can be assigned in a "split second" scenario due to current legal standards granting law enforcement broad latitude.

  "This is something that happened in a split second, and ... I just don't really feel qualified to weigh in." (Kat, 16:36)

• Kat highlights the "fruitless" online re-litigation of viral videos:

  "People rewatching this video over and over as though they're going to ... figure out who was at fault." (Kat, 16:38)

5. How Media Shapes Outrage and Division

• Both criticize media figures who profit from outrage and division—on both right (Jesse Watters) and left—fueling polarization and incentivizing risky activism.

  "Somebody persuaded [Goode] that she should interpose herself into a situation where a law enforcement officer with a gun was trying to apprehend somebody ... and did not tell her that she was risking her life by doing that." (Kat, 24:05)

• Kat: Engagement with ICE is now so volatile, "if you give them a reason to tackle you ... they're going to tackle you." (Kat, 26:57)

6. Politics Permeating Culture ("Fandom Politics")

• Matt notes politics’ total infiltration of culture post-Trump; Kat calls it "fandom politics":

  "People basically substitute political engagement for having a personality. ... It's really this performative kind of rooting against somebody who you've cast as the villain in the national morality play." (Kat, 29:07)

• Both see Trump as a unique phenomenon (“showman,” “irreplaceable”) and wonder what comes next.

  "If you just get ... the policies and the political attitudes, but not the showmanship, I think that that's a very, very dark timeline." (Kat, 33:28)

7. The Jay Asher Case & Lessons of #MeToo Mob Justice

• Kat details her reporting on Jay Asher, “13 Reasons Why” author, who was destroyed by unsubstantiated and anonymous comment-section accusations.

  "This story is an incredible example of the power of weaponized gossip, groupthink, witch hunting dynamics." (Kat, 39:07)

• Media repeated and embellished the accusations without verification:

  "The organization that said it had investigated him and found him guilty for harassment lied." (Kat, 40:34)

• Kat warns about how quickly movements can move from legitimate critique to weaponization.

  "The MeToo movement started from a place that was legitimate ... It was very, very quickly ... weaponized by people who just had been disappointed by a man ... and wanted revenge." (Kat, 43:21)

8. Media Incentives and Incentivizing Extremes

• Matt recounts being attacked for expressing nuanced views (e.g., expressing respect for Rush Limbaugh’s radio achievements upon his death).
• Kat insists, “You got to do it anyway,” when it comes to saying difficult truths (48:23).
• Both lament journalism's move from “truth-seeking” to tribal narrative-pushing.

9. Fragmentation of Culture

• Matt and Kat mourn the loss of unifying cultural moments—nothing now parallels the national commonality of “Seinfeld” or “Survivor.”

  “We are all increasingly inside our own siloed ecosystems ... There’s very little cross-pollination.” (Kat, 50:54)

• National culture is replaced by microcultures, with little overlap and shared reality, even as major events momentarily force cross-silo interaction but with wildly differing interpretations.

10. Prescriptions and Preferences

• Kat recommends returning to “great books” as a possible cultural anchor.

  “If I was going to prescribe something, I would say, you know, go back in time.” (Kat, 58:30)

• She confesses to being a Law & Order "completist" and enjoying both high- and low-brow content.

11. Kat’s New Book

• Kat plugs How to Survive in the Woods, coming March 10—a “highbrow airport fiction” literary thriller about three hikers on the Appalachian Trail, with only some returning.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On The Role of Media in Division:
  "The people who are leading the national conversation about culture, television, art and so on, they are generally in a rarefied sphere. ... They're speaking to what is popular amongst a very particular ... cohort." (Kat, 53:26)

• On Internet Rage and Truth-seeking:
  "If a thing makes you outraged and it’s, like, perfectly calibrated to make you outraged, you probably should investigate it that much harder, because there may be something not quite right there." (Kat, 46:34)

• On Fragmented Culture:
  “We are all in these sort of paywalled gardens … just, you know, consuming stuff that rings all of our particular bells." (Kat, 51:25)

• On Cultural Memory:
  "We used to have a kind of ... common understanding of, you know, where these narratives come from." (Kat, 57:25)

Timestamps for Important Segments

| Timestamp | Topic | |--------------|------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 02:46–05:09 | What is a culture writer? Kat’s approach to covering culture | | 07:44 | The Free Press audience and media landscape | | 09:05–17:48 | Minnesota ICE shooting discussion and culture’s role in the tragedy | | 21:51–26:17 | Media, outrage, polarization, and risky activism | | 28:10–33:47 | Culture and politics post-Trump: fandom politics, polarization | | 38:22–46:51 | The Jay Asher story, #MeToo, and media failures on due diligence | | 50:54–52:19 | Fragmented culture and siloed ecosystems | | 56:27–59:08 | Kat’s recommendations on consuming (and creating) culture; “great books”| | 59:10–60:36 | Kat's new book: How to Survive in the Woods |

Final Thoughts

This episode explores the uneasy intersections of culture, politics, and media in a fragmented, outrage-driven era. Kat Rosenfield’s focus on context, complexity, and humility in both writing and life offers a rare, measured antidote to the simplified, conflict-amped landscapes dominating American culture and discourse.

How to read more or listen:

• Kat Rosenfield’s writing: The Free Press and her podcast Feminine Chaos
• New novel: How to Survive in the Woods, out March 10

Summary compiled in the tone and style of Matt Jones and Kat Rosenfield, emphasizing balance, clarity, and a little self-aware humor.