Day 2 NFL Combine Reactions: Defensive Line Winners and What to Make of Abdul Carter’s Injury.

Summary

Podcast Summary: The McShay Show – Episode: Day 2 NFL Combine Reactions: Defensive Line Winners and What to Make of Abdul Carter’s Injury

Release Date: February 28, 2025
Host/Author: Todd McShay, The Ringer

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Introduction

In this episode of The McShay Show, Todd McShay delves deep into the second day of the NFL Scouting Combine, focusing primarily on the defensive line performances and discussing the significant injury update concerning Abdul Carter, the top prospect in the draft class. The conversation is enriched with insights from fellow analyst Chris Mortensen, providing listeners with a comprehensive analysis of the day's events, standout performances, and their implications on the upcoming NFL Draft.

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Abdul Carter’s Injury Update

Timestamp: [02:18] - [06:05]

The episode begins with Todd McShay addressing the turmoil surrounding Abdul Carter from Penn State, currently the number one overall prospect in the draft class. Early in the day, news breaks out about Carter suffering a stress fracture in his right foot, initially leading to speculation about potential surgery. However, further updates clarify that the injury is less severe and is expected to heal without surgical intervention.

• Todd McShay [03:35]: "Maybe it seems like a near miss, like a scare, but all should be good."

• Chris Mortensen [04:01]: "I get it on that end. But if the medical comes back and he's all right and teams are comfortable with the medical..."

Despite the initial concerns, Carter is slated to participate in Penn State's pro day on March 28th, aiming to alleviate any lingering doubts about his availability and draft stock. McShay emphasizes the importance of Carter working out to provide a clear evaluation for NFL teams:

• Todd McShay [04:27]: "I want him to work out his pro day to put this to rest."

The discussion highlights the delicate balance teams must maintain in assessing Carter's readiness while considering his potential impact as the top pick.

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Edge Group Performances

Timestamp: [09:07] - [27:02]

The conversation shifts to analyzing the performances of edge rushers at the combine. McShay and Mortensen discuss various prospects, spotlighting standout athletes who excelled in their workouts despite challenges and offering insights into their potential NFL trajectories.

Landon Jackson

• Timestamp: [11:23]
  Landon Jackson from Arkansas impresses with a remarkable 40.5-inch vertical jump, positioning him among the elite performers since 2003.

  • Todd McShay [11:23]: "At 6, 6, mind you. 264 pounds, 33 and a quarter inch arms. He had a 40 and a half inch vertical..."

  • Todd McShay [11:54]: "Officially a sub 4.7 at 6'6", 264 pounds with a 40.5-inch vertical showing that lower body explosion."

Shemar Stewart

• Timestamp: [12:26]
  Shemar Stewart delivers a solid performance with a 40-inch vertical, though his weight adjustment to 267 pounds raises some questions.

  • Chris Mortensen [13:11]: "It's a prototype, right? Not elite, but prototype."

  • Todd McShay [13:36]: "Trayvon Walker has a similar arm length and running speed, making him another top contender."

James Pierce

• Timestamp: [21:56]
  James Pierce from Tennessee emerges as another top performer, running a 4.56-second 10-yard split and showcasing exceptional athleticism.

  • Chris Mortensen [21:56]: "He had a 1,5,6,10 yard split, which is ridiculous to run."

  • Todd McShay [22:29]: "If you're a defensive line coach in the NFL, you are dying to get a chance to work with this kid."

Additional Highlights

Other notable edge rushers include:

• Mike Green (Marshall): Opted out of workouts due to a hamstring injury, creating opportunities for other prospects.

• Jalen Walker: An undersized off-the-ball linebacker with exceptional tape performance and leadership qualities.

• Tyler Barron (Miami): Demonstrates versatility and strong on-field presence, making him a sleeper pick.

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Interior Defensive Line Highlights

Timestamp: [50:52] - [78:45]

The discussion transitions to the interior defensive line, where McShay reflects on the depth and talent present, comparing the current class to the historic 1992 draft.

Comparison to 1992 Draft

• Timestamp: [50:52]
  McShay notes that the current class is one of the deepest since 1992, boasting around 20-24 top-tier interior defensive linemen.

Standout Performers

• Derek Harmon (Oregon): Delivered a solid performance, positioning himself as a potential late-first or early-second-round pick.

• Darius Alexander (Toledo): Rising rapidly with an outstanding combine day, McShay predicts he could become a top-50 pick.

• Aeneas Peebles: Exhibits excellent movement and technique, making him a notable contender.

• Ty Robinson (Nebraska): Showed impressive explosiveness with a 4.60-second 10-yard split, marking him as a valuable third-round prospect.

• Jared Harrison Hunt (SMU): Runs a 4.86-second 10-yard split and showcases effective movement skills, making him a compelling mid-round pick.

Challenges and Opportunities

McShay expresses frustration over several top interior linemen not participating or underperforming, creating a chaotic environment but also opening doors for emerging talents.

• Todd McShay [53:01]: "But I can't stand when I tune in to shows or I listen. ... These old guys are sitting there complaining that the young guys aren't working out anymore."

Despite the setbacks, McShay remains optimistic about the opportunities presented by standout performances from athletes like Jared Harrison Hunt and Ty Robinson.

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Linebacker Group Analysis

Timestamp: [74:25] - [78:45]

The linebacker group receives significant attention, with a focus on versatile players who can impact the game both in pass rushing and coverage.

Jalen Walker

• Timestamp: [32:01]
  Jalen Walker is highlighted for his exceptional tape performance, despite being undersized for the position. His ability to change directions swiftly and maintain a high motor makes him a valuable asset for teams seeking versatile linebackers.

  • Todd McShay [32:01]: "I want you to understand he's the second most complete prospect and player on the field of all these guys."

Femi Oladejo (UCLA)

• Timestamp: [41:56]
  Femi Oladejo is praised for his leadership and effort, making significant strides after transitioning to an edge rusher role.

  • Todd McShay [42:00]: "He's an off-the-ball linebacker who can play and unlike Jalen Walker, who's in the lower percentiles, get the lights back on."

Chris Campbell

• Timestamp: [75:03]
  Chris Campbell stands out with a 4.52-second 10-yard split and exceptional versatility, making him a strong candidate for early first-round selection.

  • Chris Mortensen [75:03]: "I wouldn't be surprised because his miles per hour is 22.6."

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Defensive Backs Preview

Timestamp: [74:25] - [79:43]

Looking ahead, McShay and Mortensen hint at an upcoming detailed analysis of defensive backs, emphasizing the critical role of measurable performance in positional evaluations.

• Todd McShay [75:44]: "No position, I'm telling you, no position that's affected more when it comes to draft than the cornerbacks and what they run."

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Implications for the NFL Draft

Throughout the episode, McShay and Mortensen discuss how the combine performances, particularly the standout athletic metrics like vertical jumps and 10-yard splits, will influence NFL teams' draft strategies. The impressive workouts from several edge rushers and interior defensive linemen are likely to bolster their draft positions, especially in a draft class considered one of the best in recent history.

• Todd McShay [28:07]: "That 10-yard split of under 1.60 seconds signals to them in their research that they have a different level of speed."

• Chris Mortensen [34:46]: "For every one of these guys, there's 10 others that washed out and didn't make it. So it is."

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Conclusion and Future Episodes

As the day wraps up, McShay and Mortensen express both excitement and exhaustion from the day's intense evaluations. They tease upcoming episodes that will continue to dissect the combine performances, especially focusing on defensive backs and linebackers, ensuring listeners remain informed about the evolving draft landscape.

• Todd McShay [79:43]: "We're really excited about the next couple of days. And then on Saturday, we're right back on for another show."

• Chris Mortensen [79:44]: "Thank you."

Listeners are encouraged to subscribe to The McShay Report for comprehensive draft access and to stay tuned for continuous updates throughout the remainder of the combine.

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Notable Quotes

• Todd McShay [04:27]: "I want him to work out his pro day to put this to rest."
• Chris Mortensen [21:56]: "He had a 1,5,6,10 yard split, which is ridiculous to run."
• Todd McShay [32:01]: "He's the second most complete prospect and player on the field of all these guys."
• Chris Mortensen [34:46]: "For every one of these guys, there's 10 others that washed out and didn't make it. So it is."
• Todd McShay [75:03]: "His 10-yard split is his path to success."

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Final Thoughts

This episode of The McShay Show offers a thorough examination of the defensive line performances at the NFL Combine, underscored by the potential impact of Abdul Carter’s injury on the draft landscape. Todd McShay and Chris Mortensen provide valuable insights, balancing statistical analysis with anecdotal observations, making it an indispensable resource for NFL enthusiasts and fantasy football strategists alike.

Transcript

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[Todd McShay]

Welcome in this Is It. Day one of workouts 2025 NFL scouting combine. I kind of forgot how big of a blur this whole thing is, right?

[Chris Mortensen]

Tornado.

[Todd McShay]

Absolute tornado. And it started early in the day with with news breaking, several defensive linemen didn't wind up working out. Unfortunately, three of the top four edge rushers did not run. The top three defensive tackles did not run. We'll get to some of that information as we go through the position groups. But the number one prospect in the entire draft class, Abdul Carter from Penn State, all of a sudden news comes out that no one was aware of. And let's go through the timeline real quickly. All of a sudden, Adam Schefter sending out X post saying that he's a stress fracture in his right foot and not knowing, it's not known at this point if he's going to wind up having to get surgery. And so like we're texting people what's going on? Everyone's trying to get caught up. It was breaking news and we're trying to deal with it in the moment and then all of a sudden we start to get information that, okay, pump the brakes a little bit. It is a stress fracture. It's not going to require surgery. It should heal on its own. And March 28th is Penn State's pro day and they're saying right now that Abdul is planning on working out there. So like you talk about the different by the way 56 days to the NFL draft meant you good?

[Chris Mortensen]

I'm good.

[Todd McShay]

All right, good. You talk about, like, waking up to a mess and thinking one extreme like this. We're talking about the number one overall prospect in the entire draft class maybe unavailable throughout this process, and maybe it lingers into training camp. Does this affect his draft stock to. All right, maybe it seems like a near miss, like a scare, but all should be good.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, I'm glad it's not more serious or it doesn't sound like it's more serious. And again, we have to monitor it. We'll see what happens going forward and whether there's more information that comes out. And maybe he decides not to work out his pro day to play it safe, to make sure he heals. But right now it sounds like it's not. Not too serious. And I do hope that he gets to work out of his pro day because this is a guy who has a chance to put on a show. We could run in the four threes at his size, so hopefully we get to see him do that.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, I don't even care what he does at his pro day in terms of numbers. I want him to work out his pro day to put this to rest. Because all of a sudden, as we get closer, is it. Well, we're not sure. Maybe he'll work out later. Then the speculation starts to build, the skepticism starts to build. And so this is something we're going to closely monitor because you got to remember how this whole thing works. Like, doctors come out and say one thing, right? And they say it to the teams and also to the people. For Abdul Carter. Abdul gets the information. He's in a. They go over to, like, you know, medical areas. I think they send him over to the hospital, you know, in certain types of situations. And so he's kind of learning this firsthand. And then. And then. And then Rosenhaus, Drew Rosenhaus, the very famous agent, well, you know, well known agent, gets wind of it. And so now he's scrambling. Scrambling to put some PR spin and sprinkle some dust on it. Right. And you just. I just want to see him work out.

[Chris Mortensen]

You want the first overall pick to be a clean evaluation.

[Todd McShay]

Correct. So I get it.

[Chris Mortensen]

I get it on that end. But if the medical comes back and he's all right and teams are comfortable with the medical.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, it would make teams, man. Like a team like Tennessee.

[Chris Mortensen]

Exactly right. Good point. If. If a team. If Tennessee is comfortable with it and, you know he's going to go first overall. Yeah, I'D sleep easier at night seeing him move around a little bit at the Penn State pro day. But ultimately it only matters to Abdul Carter and the potential teams that are going to draft.

[Todd McShay]

And I will say this a little bit of. And it's just buzzed. We're gonna. We'll tell you when stuff is like real and it will be reported and we were always going to stay in our lane. But there's like I keep hearing stuff just talking to people as texting and going back and forth like Tennessee and we've said this from the jump. The one thing I do feel good about is Tennessee is open for business with that number one pick. They recognize they are more than a quarterback away and that quarterback probably isn't in this draft. And so with that information, while they will it doesn't matter who they love in this draft. They look at this. If they get a deal worth moving back from number one, they're going to. I've heard that those talks may start to ramp up, let's just put it that way. That's what I'm hearing. And, and there are some teams that have put out some feelers and there's some senses and conversations and reading between the lines and the tea leaves. Giants being one of them. Interesting stuff about the Raiders at six. But yeah, I think the Giants are going to be interesting. Will they try to move up ahead of Cleveland And I think that information quite honestly and we'll get to all the combine workouts in a second, I promise. I think that information is starting to come out because there was a little bit of a scramble. Speaking of my boy Shefty, a little bit of a scramble when he came out and said the only thing that I'm feel, you know, almost certainty in this draft is that Cleveland will take a quarterback at number two. Well, when you hear that now everyone's like running to the Giants and trying to who do you know inside the Giants organization? What information do we. So I think there's there. Maybe it's all smoke, maybe it's people wanting it to happen and sending information out. But I'm hearing more and more about the Giants being a possibility moving up to number one. And that would only make sense if it's for Cam Ward, in my opinion.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

It's Shador. You stay home, everyone stays home. It's going to be Tennessee picking at number one. Very likely Abdul Carter. I think the 10% play would be Travis Hunter, one of those two players, a position player number two, if the information is correct from Shefty it's going to be a quarterback. In all likelihood, that's going to be Cam Ward.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

And so if, if it were Shador, you just stay home at three, you don't give up what it's going to take to move up to one, which is going to be probably a second this year and maybe a first next year. It's going to be a lot to move up two spots and then keep.

[Chris Mortensen]

An eye on Matt Stafford. You know, are the Giants a team that's going to make a deal for Matt Stafford and then that's no longer the issue of them having to wait for Cam Ward or Chador Sanders?

[Todd McShay]

There's.

[Chris Mortensen]

When we talk about. People are always. I think it's interesting that we say we're still kind of early in the process and it's, you know, late February. It's because of, you know, we have had no free agency and we have players that we know are going to be on the move. And so there's a lot of dust that still needs to settle before you can really be clear about who's going to need to make that move to potentially go up and get a CAM award.

[Todd McShay]

Right. And we've talked to, we've talked to GMs who have said we knew in February was our guy at quarterback with the number one pick. I mean, people have said it in the past. We talked to Eric Dasta who said that when they drafted Lamar Jackson, that people in the organization didn't even know that they were going to move up and make the pick, let alone they were going to take Lamar Jackson. And there were only two people in the room who knew at the time.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, everyone left.

[Todd McShay]

Everyone left to go do like the, the PR for their, for their other first round pick. Who was the, I think the tight end. Right. Hunter Henry.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Earlier in that first round. Pretty wild that Lamar Jackson went after was the second picker. The first. But anyway.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

So. All right. Lot to unpack. The edge group was a lot more impressive and kind of lived up to the standard than I would say compared to the interior defensive line group. We'll get to that in a little bit. There's a lot of information, information I think is fascinating with the interior defensive lineman. There's a lot we learned today from the interior defensive lineman. And, and it's a group that, like go back to 1992, if you want to find a defensive tackle group, an interior defensive line group that is going to have as many players drafted from that position in the same class there was. It's loaded 32, I believe in 1992. 32 or 34 or something like that. It was. It was 30 plus. And that's what this year's group is going to be. That we have around close to 20 grades in the first three rounds. Right. But the edge group, there were more fireworks, of course, and that's what we expected. And the fireworks for me began, I mean, kind of with the measurements, to be honest with you.

[Chris Mortensen]

Okay.

[Todd McShay]

But I, when I look at it, and I'm not. I'm not like taking phone calls about reservations and I've got all my notes right here because I don't have time to print and write everything down. So the first thing that jumped out at me, at me was this. And I think we have a graphic for this Tucker. The Highest verticals at 260 plus pounds dating back to 2003. Two of the four highest that we've seen since 03. We're talking 20 plus years. Were happened today here, Right here in Indy. Landon Jackson with a 40 and a half inch vertical. The edge from Arkansas.

[Chris Mortensen]

Ridiculous.

[Todd McShay]

Absolutely ridiculous. At 6, 6, mind you. 264 pounds, 33 and a quarter inch arms. He had a 40 and a half inch vertical and also a 10, 9 broad jump. Also best in class. Tape is interesting and we can get into that in a minute. But when you put up those numbers and I didn't see a 40 for him yet, I don't know that he actually ran. No, he did. It was a 4, 7 unofficial.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

And we'll see if we can get some officials while we're still on the air tonight. And stick with us here. We're doing it live because it's. It's the right thing to do. We're here. Four six, eight, four six, eight, official. So a sub four seven at six six, 264 pounds with a 40 and a half inch vertical showing that lower body explosion.

[Chris Mortensen]

Can we add a dunk contest to the combine or no?

[Todd McShay]

Here we go. Cynical Steve, always. Like, I'm trying to highlight.

[Chris Mortensen]

No, in a good way. I mean, it's just these. This is incredible numbers. Go ahead.

[Todd McShay]

The second one from this year's class, Shemar Stewart, as expected. We knew this guy was gonna work out, right? And we'll get to how special the whole workout was. But as you see in this graphic, we're. These are not like, oh, it's cute. We're talking about Miles Garrett, arguably the best pass rusher in the NFL the last several years. Right up there. Like put him in the top three however you want the last several years. And Mario Williams, who's the number one overall pick.

[Chris Mortensen]

Pretty good company.

[Todd McShay]

So we got miles Garrett with 41 inch vertical. Landon Jackson, 40 and a half from this year's class. Mario Williams, 40 and a half inch vertical. Shemar Stewart, 40 inch vertical from this year's class. That was when I was like, okay, here we go.

[Chris Mortensen]

It's unbelievable. Shemar Stewart. I don't know how much you want to get into this. We're going to jump around. He will be the case study for production versus tools. Well, he will be the ultimate.

[Todd McShay]

I don't. Listen, we're on the fly here. I'm. I'm texting graphics. Tucker. I don't know if we were able to build this one, but I did a little. Did a little work on this. Okay. The case study was Trevon Walker.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, I know, right?

[Todd McShay]

And there was a certain GM that just absolutely loved the traits and all that for the Jacksonville Jaguars and was going to take him over. The best football player in that draft class. Name Hutchinson. Aiden Hutchinson. And I'm not saying she mar Stewart should be the number one overall pick, not by a long shot. But I am saying traits factor into this and pressures factor into this as much as sacks necessarily. And I get it. All the people who want to make fun and Pollock, I know you're out there and I talked about it yesterday, going fishing, but like reeling in nothing. I got it. And you're a pass rusher. And so pass rushers, there's a certain level of pride for getting home and the art of getting home and. And that's absolutely factored into this. But what it also has to be factored in is the effort that you see on tape. The strength, the explosiveness, the ability to stack, excellent run defender, the fact that he's getting pressures at a very high clip. And now he shows up here. Shemar Stewart, 6 5, 267 pounds. Lean down a little bit. We were guessing he was going to be closer to like 275.

[Chris Mortensen]

I'm not super worried about it. It's £14 between the Senior bowl and the combine. He obviously lost a little weight to run faster. I mean, a lot of players do it. I don't love it. I don't hate it.

[Todd McShay]

But I want you to. I want to contextualize this. Shamar Stewart, 6:5. And you go back and look at. At Trayvon Walker, 6 5. Trayvon Walker was 272. Well, he's 267 here, but we know he's going to be in that same range. Same range, yep. 35 and a half inch arms for. For Walker. That was the big. I mean he just absurd but still 34 and 18 inch for. For Shemar Stewart. Still very long arms like. Excellent, excellent. Okay, now let's get to the testing. Trevon Walker four five one. Shemar Stewart's a four six zero unofficial.

[Chris Mortensen]

I don't know, five nine.

[Todd McShay]

Four five nine. So we're talking both in the four fives. One five eight is what I had for a ten yard split. And. And by the way, the only sub one six run today in the ten yard splits. Okay. And I'll get to that number in a minute. Why that's so important. So 158 for Shemar, 154 for Trayvon Walker vertical. Everything's been a little slightly better for Trayvon. Right. Except lower body explosion. We saw this on tape, man. That's the. When I saw Trayvon, I saw strong, I saw. I saw stout, I saw all those things. I didn't necessarily see that like drive from ground up through, generate power from the ground up through. I see it with Shemar 40 inch vertical 1011 broad. Whereas it's just a 35. And I say just a 35 and a half. A 35 and a half which is outstanding. But it's not 40 inches. This is special, this is different. And a 103 broad. Great. But it's not 1011. So unpack that.

[Chris Mortensen]

I mean it's what we've been saying all along. If you want to know why, and you're right, we're not saying that he's the first overall pick in the strap. But if you want to know why a player whose production is. Is been. I would say in terms of stat production, of sack production, which is overrated, we need to talk more about pressures and wins and all that. But in terms of sack production, it is very underwhelming for this player. But if you want to know why NFL teams are interested and why he's going to go so early, it's because of these tools. And you hinted at it. It's very important. When we're watching film down in Mobile at the Senior bowl and this guy is throwing two Missouri offensive linemen around like if it's like it's nothing on the same play, you do see it on tape. Maybe he doesn't get home to the quarterback, but you do see these traits on tape. He's not just someone who goes out and works well. It transfers to the tape so that's an important part of the evaluation, too. So I get why it's a difficult evaluation in terms of the production versus the talent. But, man, if you're a defensive line coach in the NFL, you are dying to be. To get a chance to work with this kid because you see what you can unlock and what he could potentially become.

[Todd McShay]

I thought. I just. I thought that it was fascinating.

[Chris Mortensen]

He didn't disappoint. I mean, we thought he could do this, and then he went out and.

[Todd McShay]

Did it, and he went out and did it. And. And on a day right. Where I remind you, and for different, varying reasons, and the vast majority, like, absolutely understandable or out of control for a lot of these guys, but it's still a group that didn't. That had a handful of guys that did not participate, including Abdul Carter, who we talked about at the top. Obviously he couldn't. He just had learned that he has a stress fracture in his right foot and like the day became a. He didn't even go, by the way. He didn't even do the heights and weights and the measurements because he was dealing with all this. Okay, so that's how, like, chaotic things have been for Abdul today. So an easy pass there. Jalen Walker, number two, edge on a lot of teams. Board on my board did not work out. From Georgia. Mikel Williams, number three, edge on my board did not work out. Shocking to me, by the way, considering that strength and conditioning program and the level of pride that they take in it. And I'm not knocking anyone for anything. And I understand the reasoning, but I'm just saying it was surprising because I want you to think back, like, who was it? We got. We had. We got Davis. Right. Unbelievable workout. Who really overshadowed devonte Wyatt that year.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yep.

[Todd McShay]

Okay. Jordan Davis and devonte Wyatt. It kind of started with. With this new regime of Georgia defensive talent. Just every single studs who also had the workout numbers to back up the production that you saw on the field. Trayvon Walker, we just talked about. Right. Oh, and Nolan Smith.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

We're like a four freaking four nine, you know, and so I was surprised that those guys weren't able to work.

[Chris Mortensen]

Out and talk about compete level like you're getting at this Senior Bowl. How was the compete level for Shemar Stewart? Through the roof. He's screaming in the stands. He's running around. How about on tape when they're, you know, they're up 50 in that game and he's running around. He's running around like it's. It's a seven.

[Todd McShay]

Some scouts would argue it was a lot of bluster at the Senior Bowl. I'm just, just about. I understand. I'm. But I want to make sure you.

[Chris Mortensen]

Show up here and compete like no one else.

[Todd McShay]

The same people I have conversations with are watching and listening sometimes, and I want to make sure that I'm representing whatever what the hole is in terms of the league. I think that was kind of his moment. But I, I. You and I sat and watched the same tape in the same hotel room at the same time, up 20, 27 to 7 or whatever it was. Up like 27 and 31 points, whatever. It was late in that game. And he's still going like it's fourth quarter of the national championship against Missouri. Yes.

[Chris Mortensen]

So then he shows up here and other guys aren't competing, whether they can't or whatever the reason is. But he took the opportunity to step into the spotlight and put on a show.

[Todd McShay]

So Abdul Carter, Jalen Walker, Mikel Williams, and Mike Green, considered by a lot of teams as the top four edges in this year's class. Okay, Mike Green from Marshall. Great Senior Bowl. I don't want to say weak because it was 48 hours. Great 48 hours at the Senior Bowl. Like Shemar, they decided to, as one scout said to me, they graduated the Senior bowl on Wednesday of practice, and it was time to move on. Mike Green, tightness in his hamstring felt last night and decided not to work out. Take it for what it is. Right. So what does that do? It creates opportunity, folks. Yeah, there was opportunity today, and two guys right off the jump, pun intended, took advantage of it with Shemar Stewart and Jackson. Landon Jackson from Arkansas coming out with those vertical jumps that happened before the 40s. You know, they were doing it before the 40s and then before the workouts as the defensive tackle class was still working out, they were doing their jumps, and all of a sudden it popped up on the screen, that graphic. So I thought that that was absolutely like that. That kind of stole the show, those two guys and what they were able to do that.

[Chris Mortensen]

There was one other player that I'm interested to see how you want to handle the conversation surrounding him.

[Todd McShay]

Take it wherever you want, man.

[Chris Mortensen]

Tennessee edge.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah.

[Chris Mortensen]

James Pierce. Go 4, 4, 7, 4, 0. He had a 1, 5, 6, 10 yard, so that might not have been official earlier, but he had a 1, 5, 6, 10 yard, which is ridiculous to run the. The way he ran today. I thought he put on a show. I thought he looked great during on field drills. There's going to be a lot of work to do in terms of some of the off the field stuff and how it affects him. Yep. But in terms of his workout today, he's another guy. I put on a show.

[Todd McShay]

It's interesting and it's always a tricky situation and I've learned over the years like until you absolutely know and you're in and there's reports when you're in this situation and you have information that maybe if nobody else does but you've triple checked it and all that, I just, I stay away. But, but I also have learned like we're not doing our job if we don't give a sense of what's going on for real. And the for real is Abdul Carter, outside of the injury today is a clean prospect. Jalen Walker is one of like the all time dogs in terms of football character, personal character, just like love of the game showing up doing all those things. Mikel Williams is not the vocal leader that Jalen Walker is. Jalen's the alpha. Just so everyone understands and that's fine. But, but Mikel is going to put in the work and he wants to be great and he's going to work to be great. He's just not, he's not going to be the loudest voice in the room. And that's from, that's from digging. Like I know this because I know this. Okay. There's information that we'll get to and I don't want to make a big thing of it but James Pierce, there's going to be some stuff that scouts have to sort through. Okay. And the same is true in this. We can, we're not reported. We can talk about because it's been reported and, and Mike Green spoke openly about it. The Marshall edge rusher. So these are two of the top five, four or five edge rushers that there's some stuff that's got to be sorted through. But if you go and just you know, do a quick Google search or look on, on social, you'll find that there have been multiple accusations of sexual assault.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

In his past that he vehemently denies. I'm not aware of charges or how charges were dropped but ultimately he was open in talking about that. So we can talk about it. And again, information that scouts are going to scouts and general managers and more importantly at this point it starts with the scouts. Right. And they, they information funnels up. Then it becomes a security group. Former FBI guys within each people, I should say men and women inside NFL organizations. And, and they'll get to the bottom of what the, the real is. And ultimately we'll, we'll find out, you know, at the latest on draft day, whether it affects their draft stock. But those are going on and Mike Green now doesn't work out and it's kind of, you know, not the most positive news coming out. So it's been kind of a sordid situation with these, with the edge rushers this week, but focusing on the positive, like we got two absolute physical freaks that we saw. And then a third In Pierce running a 4, 4 7, which is, is rare. I mean, you're talking, here's the thing with Pierce, all right, And I've said this before, but in a class where we've got Abdul Carter, who is what it is, he's the, he's the cream. Jalen Walker is an off the ball linebacker that's got a lot of work to do in terms of proving that he can be that guy. And I want to get back to Jalen in a second. Don't let me forget with the comparisons and the percentiles, but Jalen's an undersized off the ball linebacker who's gonna, who's gonna be an edge as well in the NFL and play that versatile role. Mikel Williams is a great physical specimen and is really good versus the run. Still very much developing. Right. When you look at James Pierce, I want you to understand he's the second most complete prospect and player on the field of all these guys, right. If he's totally clean and had he played maybe in a situation where he wasn't, where he's playing more snaps, like, I think the narrative would be different. I know the narrative would be different. This guy, at the end of the day, while he's not the biggest, he's 652. It means he's over 6 foot 5, he's 245. He's, you know, kind of got a linear frame but, but room to add bulk to it, to that, to that frame. Shorter arms than ideal, but still, okay, almost 33 inch arms, but he runs a 4, 4 7, 40 yard dash. And then I pop in the tape. And it's not just the speed around the edge, right? It's the outside in, inside out moves. It's the dip, the rip. It's. It's a guy who has a plan as a pass rusher, knows how to get home. So when we're talking about Shemar Stewart, you're who hasn't had the production, but is more of a big, strong, physical guy. And then you compare this tape. Pierce to me is the second most complete pass rusher in this class. He's bigger than Jalen.

[Chris Mortensen]

I don't know about you, but coming into the season the Pierce grade was very comparable to Abdul Carter. Yes. Abdul Carter was still making the transition. But you saw the upside. You saw the tools. He was moving from off the ball linebacker to edge. He had done some rushing, you know, in 2023. Don't get me wrong. Wrong. But now he was making the full time move to edge. And, and the, the grades were very similar. So James Pierce was a guy. He had a pick six. I remember in 2023 where he dropped and he. The way he moves, he could play off the ball. He can drop into coverage as well. These are both guys who are physically unique in terms of their tools. So if he's clean, to me he's, you know, the third edge in this class.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah. And I just, I just got officials. James Pierce. It was official four, four seven. I said the only sub one six zero. Yeah. Was.

[Chris Mortensen]

Was Stewart.

[Todd McShay]

Was Stewart at 158. That is official. But the fastest. And the other sub one six zero was James Pierce at one five six.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah. It's ridiculous. Bill Polian one six zero is a good bill Poly.

[Todd McShay]

And I had a lot of good conversations over the year. Six time executive of the year. You could say whatever you want. About what? Whatever you want to say. The guy did it at the highest level and put together an organization that won a Super bowl and is a wealth of knowledge. Okay. He was fascinating to talk to think about their undersized edge rushers. But the speed guys. Right. Especially on the turf. And we had a great conversation with Howie Roseman and we're going to have that for you next week as part of our decision maker series. And he was talking about the importance if you've got an offense that's high powered and Bill Polian had that with Peyton Manning in the offense of the Colts and obviously how he built that, built that through free agency a lot. And obviously drafting Jalen hurts. You have to have edge rushers to close out games. And it's so critical because teams are going to be playing from behind with you and you've got to have those guys. And so they did study after study, the Colts did and they made a decision we are not going to draft a guy unless they run a sub one six zero.

[Chris Mortensen]

Interesting.

[Todd McShay]

Right?

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

That. That 10 yard split of under one 1.60 seconds signal to them in their research that they have a Different level of speed that, that and especially on the turf. He was saying too inside, inside this dome here, right. Lucas Oil, it was the RCA Dome back then, right. That that was critical. And so when I see these numbers and I see that it's always in my brain who ran the one six zero or faster who ran it and the two guys that ran the faster. Interestingly enough, James Pierce runs the faster time 115 6. But if you do the watch the weight adjusted, right. Which she Mars Stewart at 267. 267. 6 foot 5. It's going to come out in favor of Shemar. Both numbers are phenomenal. Both numbers signal players that absolutely the, the number, the, the measurements, the times, the tests match up with a first round draft pick. That's what we, that's what we learned with them today.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah. Oregon, Jordan, Oregon's Jordan Birch, another guy who had a nice day.

[Todd McShay]

Okay, go ahead.

[Chris Mortensen]

279 pounds, 33 inch arms, hit a 166. Not quite as good there, but it ran a 4, 46 9. And the way he moves at that size, the way he moves in space jumped out to me. He had, he had on field drills. He was one of the guys that stood out to me.

[Todd McShay]

I mentioned before I wanted to get back to Jalen Walker and we're bouncing around. That's fine. Who cares? But, but it, but to kind of close out this ring again. If you look at our my edge rankings, right, I've got Abdul Carter 1, Jalen Walker 2, along with Mikel Williams, followed by James Pierce, Mike Green from Marshall, Shemar Stewart. Okay. Jalen Walker is different in not a great way, but he's different than all those other guys because he's an off the ball linebacker who's vastly undersized by comparison and by the NFL standard for an edge rusher. Okay, here's what's interesting. I don't know if we were able to make this graphic up. Jalen Walker, the percentiles, these aren't great things. His tape is fantastic. He's going to be a great NFL player. Like I'm certain of it because of the way he plays the game, his motor, his love for the game, the leadership that he brings. And he has an elite set of skills in terms of changing direction and sticking his foot in the dirt. You always hear this about a running back and zone blocking. When he has to change direction once he's gotten in the backfield, he has an, a sick ability to transition and redirect like very few others. I've Ever seen accelerate and then, and then accelerate out of it and get, get to the quarterback in a flash. But the numbers are not for everybody in the league. That's what. No, they're not.

[Chris Mortensen]

No, I know you're right.

[Todd McShay]

And so it's going to be a.

[Chris Mortensen]

Scheme which I think it's so interesting.

[Todd McShay]

It's going to be a scheme decision like he's not going to fit for every single team. At 61243 pounds with 32 inch arms as an edge rusher. Height is in the second percentile, weight is in the sixth percentile and arm length is in the fifth percentile. You're talking bottom 10 percentile in all three of those. Even as an off the ball linebacker, his height, weight and speed are not Great. His height at 6:1 is only 30th percentile. 70% of off the ball linebackers are taller than him. 37% are have a bigger bill or more bulk, more weight and 63% have longer arms at off the ball linebacker. So that scares you. Right. Then I bring Hassan Redick into the mix and that's the guy that you talk to anyone in the league that's show me general managers ask scouts every time they come in to come in the office, show me how he's going to succeed, show me the path, give me the comparison how he's going to succeed and then the net follow up is always well then tell me how he's going to fail. Well, the how he's going to succeed is Hassan Redick. 604-166-014. Sorry. Six one and a half. So only a half an inch difference. Height 237. He was six pounds lighter at the same, same point in time combine. Okay. Arm length nearly identical. 32 and 3/4 versus 32. So. So if you're pounding the table and I've been told by every producer, executive and person who's in charge of this show resulting there table. But if you're a scout pounding the table for this guy, you're going to Hasan Reddick is, is your example, right?

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah. I mean that's a good comp. But how many, how many guys have there been like this who you felt were going to be. I know there's been players I've evaluated along the way who are outliers. We'll call these guys outliers that I loved, I loved and they didn't work out. That being said, I believe in Jalen Walker. I think I'm, I'm on board. But if you're If I'm a GM and I'm playing devil's advocate, which I think all great GMs do, when a scout comes, comes into the room, hey, man, the. For every one of these guys, there's 10 others that washed out and didn't make it. So it is, it is. It will give you reason for pause if you're going to spend a first round pick on a player whose numbers are, as Todd pointed out, I mean, not even lower 10, like low 5, like 2%, 5% we're talking about. This is a significant benchmark for this player.

[Todd McShay]

Yep.

[Chris Mortensen]

Now I'm going to talk out of both sides of my mouth and come back and say the reason you do believe in him is all the things that Todd's already mentioned when you watch on tape and his ability to get after the quarterback. I also think you look at guys who are a little bit lighter, a little bit smaller, like Nick Bonito from Denver. He's a guy who's. He's a little bit taller. But the traditional of you have to be 265 to 270 pounds. 270 pounds. I think it's changing a little bit. I think people are able to go with lighter edge rushers. And the thing you like about Walker is you can use them in different ways. You can move him around. He does. He doesn't necessarily have to come off the edge, though. I do think he's going to do that a significant amount of the time in the NFL.

[Todd McShay]

I think it helps because the game's changing.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

And the game's changing in that you're in nickel and you're in dime personnel a hell of a lot more than you're in base. If you base has almost become nickel. And with the amount of spread formations and the ability tempo to a certain degree occasionally we see, you know, there's peaks and valleys with that, but trying to catch opponents stuck with their personnel on the field and trying to match up with different versatile weapons and all the chess pieces that are now used in the passing game. And with passing game becoming king over the last handful of years, you gotta have guys on the field that can do multiple things. Can be. We talked about it. Multiple. It's like I told you, a drinking game. If you find any defensive coordinator out there, any head coach is talking about or any general manager when they're talking about defensive players, you'd get drunk in the conversations you have about defensive players. Talking about multiple. I need multiple, you see, Allow me to be multiple. And a player like this allows you to be multiple.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

And then you look at some like the, you know, the NASCAR packages and all the different names where guys are lining up and the launch point as a pass rusher isn't always like all right, wide nine, pin your ear, go. It can be from a lot of different spots and he shows that on tape.

[Chris Mortensen]

And simulated pressures that you see time and time again, these simulated pressures where you have six people walked up, two drop, four rush. So you don't really have a blitz there. Jalen Walker is excellent at that. You, if you see Jalen Walker coming off the edge, you have to account for him and your pass protection and the next thing you know he drops. And I'll go back to what you just said a few minutes ago. If you're building teams the way that we've discussed and the way we believe is the blueprint for have a championship team and you have an high powered offense and you need a player who can end a game with a sack and get to the quarterback and end that game. Do you think that Jaylen Walker is a closer? And if the answer is yes, then you believe that he's an early first round pick.

[Todd McShay]

Princely Uman, me Ellen. Sorry. Princely Uman, me Ellen. I didn't ignore what you said. I registered it all. I'm just trying to.

[Chris Mortensen]

No, we're all over the place. It's great.

[Todd McShay]

No, I know. I'm intrigued by this guy. It's interesting because sometimes the numbers you're like eh, I'm all right. Like six, six four and a half, 244 pounds, kind of the standard, a little bit leaner than you like almost 34 inch arms. 33 and 78 inches. Good arm length. Right. So. So you like that line and you know that he's probably going to play it like 250, 255. Right. You look at the 40 right off the jump and you're like it's okay. I'm just looking at the official came out at 4, 72 me right mid fine me. But he had a 162 in that 10 yard split and that's one of the faster times. We talk about 160 being the elite. 160 or faster is the elite. So he's just off that a tick off of that. So it's a faster start than it is a finish.

[Mel Kiper Jr.]

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[Chris Mortensen]

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[Todd McShay]

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[Chris Mortensen]

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[Todd McShay]

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[Chris Mortensen]

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[Todd McShay]

Affiliates Price and coverage match Limited by state law not available in all states. Also the the jumps he was third. So we talked about these like literally record breaking in the conversation of the best in the history. That's what I should say. Not record breaking up there in the talking about the best vertical jumps for edge rusher showing that lower body explosion which is so critical in the history of the combine dating back to 2003. Two of the top two guys this year in Landon Jackson and Shemar Stewart were in the top four dating back to 2003 with Myles Garrett and with and with Mario Williams. Well number three on that list on both the vertical and the broad jump. Behind those top two guys was Uman Mellon. Good old Princely. Yeah, you know I kind of like him. I just kind of like this guy. 38 inch vertical and 10 six broad jump. Those are outstanding.

[Chris Mortensen]

Flash the week of the Senior bowl.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, he's 38 and a half tackles for loss, 25 and a half career sacks. Those are in his career Florida Ole Miss. Florida, then Ole Miss.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yep.

[Todd McShay]

And, and, and I remember too in big moments he and Ivy at points. But Uman Miellen in big moments this past season, big moments fourth quarter needed. He was showing up.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

And we talk about closers, right?

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah. And I they're very different. I, I love Ivy because I love his power but they're, they're kind of a different style where uma Miellen is going to win with speed and athletic ability. I don't want to say finesse because I don't think he's a finesse guy. But he wins with speed and athletic ability. That's one of the ways that, that's, that's the way he gets after the quarterback. So they're different players. I think he's a classic three, four outside linebacker. Guy's gonna go on day two and probably do real well forever. Drafts him.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, I thought he had a good day. Another guy that I just. I'm falling in love with.

[Chris Mortensen]

Who?

[Todd McShay]

Femi Oladejo, ucla.

[Chris Mortensen]

You love him, man.

[Todd McShay]

Well, we talk about off the ball linebackers that can play and unlike Jalen Walker, who's in the lower percentiles. Get the lights back on. Back in here. Look at Nick, hard at work, crawling around, making plays. Ola Dejo. Great story. We've touched on it before. I'm not going to go into great detail about it, but this is a Florida State transfer that goes to ucla. Off the ball linebacker for a few years, finds a home at edge. Rusher this past year. Production is like ascending player ascending, still ascending. You watch him at the Senior bowl and for all the alpha dogs there, he was the alpha, no question. Like vocally, no question between reps working like just. You can tell, you can tell the phonies too. And he ain't one of them.

[Chris Mortensen]

No, you could tell by the players. There are guys that are loud and you know, put on a show and then there are players that are loud, put on our show and players gravitate to them. This was a guy who I thought was elevating other players at the Senior bowl, picking them up, getting fired up about what they were doing, about what he was doing. I mean, it's hard to be. It's hard to like win over teammates in 24 hours, 48 hours. And he definitely showed that he could do that.

[Todd McShay]

It's also hard to do it in a 15 minute combine.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right?

[Todd McShay]

Interview. And I'm telling you right now, like one of the names that keeps popping up is, is. Is Femi. Okay? And what I love is when my phone goes dead on me. All right? What I love is that we talk about these off the ball linebackers that transition, right? He's, he looks the part. He's over 636032. 259, carries it really well. 33, almost 33 and a half inch arm length. Fine. And had. He didn't run the 40 today. But after killing it all week in the interviews and showing up a little bit bigger and stronger than you know, in terms of sturdier build than we thought. He had a 36 inch. 36 and a half inch vertical. Fourth best. So we got these top two like phenoms that are two of the top four best in since 2003 at the combine. And the next two up are guys that are just. Are intriguing in terms of Man Mellon and Ola Deja, to put it in perspective.

[Chris Mortensen]

Because we talk about this all the time. We do our measurables that matter, right? Yes. And so we have all these numbers. We have all these numbers for defensive ends. And so a vertical jump for a defensive end that's under 265 pounds is considered outstanding. Is 36 inches is what he jumped.

[Todd McShay]

Yep.

[Chris Mortensen]

So when you hear. It's just important to keep all these numbers in perspective as much as you can because again, like I said, this is a tornado of information. You're just trying to pull numbers. Everyone's heads are spinning just to keep it in perspective. That's an outstanding number. So maybe it's not the 40 inches that Stuart jumped. It's still a great number two guys.

[Todd McShay]

I'm going back to study tape on like immediately. I mean, can I guess one? We have a reservation at 9:00 tonight.

[Chris Mortensen]

We might be watching after.

[Todd McShay]

I might bring, I might bring this with me to dinner.

[Chris Mortensen]

Can I guess one?

[Todd McShay]

Yes.

[Chris Mortensen]

Maryland's Fidel Diggs.

[Todd McShay]

No, it's. It's Syracuse's Fidel Digs.

[Chris Mortensen]

Oh, sorry, Syracuse.

[Todd McShay]

I got the wrong school last night. I.

[Chris Mortensen]

This is how bad it is.

[Todd McShay]

Last night I yelled at you about a pronunciation and I was absolutely certain it's Syracuse. I'm sorry that it was me. And so I even tape on Syracuse, but I had to double check tonight. So it. So it wasn't two nights in a row that I made the same mistake because I could have sworn it was Savon Revel and Savone. And it's Savone Revel. So my apologies to you in front of the world to Fidel Digs and thank you by the way. I, I haven't said hello to anyone. Hi. I haven't said hello to anyone. Hi. We appreciate you being here. It's been welcome into our brains today. Okay. Just trying to gather all this information. We got Abdul Carter, like is he out for the rookie year to. He's going to be fine and work out his pro day and who's, who's working out, who's not working out. It's been a fun day, exciting, a lot of energy. But I would be crazy and unappreciative not to say thank you for joining us tonight. And we'll be here again tomorrow night, 7:00 Eastern Time for the second day of workouts. Tomorrow will be the defensive backs. My goodness, that's going to be fun.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, some.

[Todd McShay]

Some real times, like. And we'll also. We'll get into the linebackers a little bit more because we're still getting information as it comes in now. So we'll kind of wrap up the linebackers tomorrow. We'll get in the defensive backs. And Saturday we'll be back on for another show. We live, 7:00. If we confirm that, I think maybe from my hotel room. Because they're kicking tomorrow. They're kicking. No, Saturday.

[Chris Mortensen]

Saturday.

[Todd McShay]

Saturday, yeah. Saturday for the big day. Quarterbacks, running backs, wide receivers. We're gonna be somewhere, I think in our hotel. We're gonna be somewhere, I think in our hotel. Yeah, if our hotel does. Yeah, if our hotel doesn't put the kibosh on it. We'll. We'll find somewhere in Indianapolis show. Because they're gonna wrap this whole thing up here on Radio Row or whatever they're calling it. But thank you for joining us. Please subscribe. Like all the stuff that they tell me that I have to tell you to do, but. But we need it and we appreciate you doing it. So I don't even know where I was going, but, oh, the two guys I was gonna get back to. And then I might have to watch tape tonight because I'm so excited to like, I really need to dig into these guys now that I've done the top 100 edge rushers I didn't have in my top 100. Two guys that had damn good workouts today. And one of them is Fadil Diggs.

[Chris Mortensen]

Nice.

[Todd McShay]

From Syracuse.

[Chris Mortensen]

Got the school wrong with the name. Right.

[Todd McShay]

And the other is Tyler Barron, who I've watched.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

And I like, but I stay. I did. And I haven't watched Truth. Have not studied his tape. Updated it since this summer. So I've got to go back to my report. Kind of have a baseline for him. Did not know this explosion was here. Let's start with Baron and we'll work back to Fidel Diggs. Yep. Baron. 6 045. 258. We're talking prototype, right? Not elite, but prototype. What you think about when you think about a defensive end? An edge 33 and an eighth inch. Arms solid, you know, not elite. But again, prototype, big 10 inch hands. What stood out to me, the Guy runs a 4, 6 2, 40 yard dash and he was one of only a handful. We talked about the two guys who were sub 1 6. Yeah. One of only a handful of guys who ran a 10. A 10 split. That was, that was in that range. 161.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Okay. And then you look at the vertical jump in the broad. He was over, over 30. You said 35 and a half.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Okay. 35 and a half inch vertical and 101 broad. Outstanding numbers.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yep.

[Todd McShay]

So let's go back and let's, let's see what we got there.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

Is he moving up in that? We know he's got tools then diggs six, four similar 6043, 257. Okay, so you're talking almost identical. One's 6045, the other 6043. One's 258, the other's 257. One's 33 and 18 inch arm. The other's 33 and 3 eighths. Now let's get to the 40s. We talked about 162 for Baron. Diggs ran a four, five, seven. Folks talking about 161 for. For Baron in the ten yard split. Diggs ran a one, six zero, right. He's in that elite. When I think about Bill Polian trying to get sleep at night and I think about Bill Polian yelling at me, it's got to be 160 or faster. Todd. Like that's he's there.

[Chris Mortensen]

Same exact broad jump, by the way. Both 10:1. I think that's interesting.

[Todd McShay]

Really? Yeah.

[Chris Mortensen]

And then they also showed up on the field. You know, you want to see how they move in the field. Those guys went out and killed it. They, you know, not out of control. Under control. They were. They look quick, they change directions. Well, they both had had nice days.

[Todd McShay]

All right. I think we covered. Anyone else you want to get to that? I mean that's a good. Almost everyone who, who worked out in the edge rushers. Right. That's a good that that was considered in our top 100. That that stood out in one way, one way or another. Interior defensive line. I've sat here and I almost felt like a fraud. Right. Because like we've talked so much about how this could be the best class since 1992. I went and did the research today. I sent out an expost this morning because I was like I keep saying it's one of the deepest classes ever. I'VE given perspective for running backs. I haven't for the interior defensive line. So I went through it, I studied, I've got my database of all these, all these drafts. Even when I was in high school, when this, when 1992 happened.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

But I've imported all of this information, information. And I went through and there's a few years where you see like 24 or 25. Okay. It was 1992 and it was over. Was the only year over 30. You'd go back to 1992 to get a class that had over 30 interior defensive line taken. And that was like, that was empman. Sorry, Crazy Gilbert, you know, McLaughlin.

[Chris Mortensen]

I could see Gilbert right now.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, right.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah. That's funny.

[Todd McShay]

And I know we just totally sailed over. Yeah, there's who a lot of people in our audience's head. But it was, it was a very like well known class. And then yeah, the bust and this and you know, but you have to go all the way back to there. And this year we've got, we've got talk about interior defensive linemen. 16 of them in my top 100. Okay. And some teams you talk to like they've got 20, 25 starting grades. There's going to be over 30 interior defensive line drafted. So we pumped it up. We've talked about Mason Graham, Kenneth Grant, Michigan defensive tackles. Mason Graham in that top tier for me, top three prospect in this class, Grant, Walter Nolan. We've talked a lot about none of the three. Those, those three top guys worked out and it was frustrating. And, and, and Walter Nolan will work out at the Ole Miss pro day. But when the top guys don't work out, then it gives opportunity.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

Derek Harmon had a good day like all around. Derek Harmon did what you would expect from a late first or in Mench's mind, a third round pick.

[Chris Mortensen]

You almost got it by me.

[Todd McShay]

Nope. But he's six four and a half, 313 pounds, long arms, almost 30, 34 and a half inch arm length. Right?

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

And he comes in, he runs a really good time for that. Size 495 sub 5 second 41, 74 in the 10. But he didn't, didn't do the jumps. Right.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

And, and I don't have any of the other stuff. The, the, the results aren't official here. Like the three cone, the shuttles.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

So the opportunity was there for some other guys.

[Chris Mortensen]

It was an underwhelming start to the day.

[Todd McShay]

It was an underwhelming start, but there, but there were some overwhelming workouts by guys that we didn't expect it to happen. I want to go through a couple of things. I thought this was intriguing. Let me make note why the frustrations there. In addition to just. And I'm not trying to solo out or single out these, these top guys in, in Graham and Grant and Nolan. 8. Only 18 of the 40 interior defensive linemen, one of the most. The highest numbers we've ever seen, invited to a combine. It's like invite, like you've decided that we're gonna invite all these people to the party. It's the biggest party you're ever gonna throw. Only 18 of the 40 show up and decide to do anything or have fun.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right.

[Todd McShay]

Right.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, I'll come to the wedding, but I'm leaving that night.

[Todd McShay]

The other 22 are sitting in the corner.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Sulking, complaining about the apps. The drinks weren't good enough. So 18 of the 40. Only 18 of them wound up running the 40 yard guys.

[Chris Mortensen]

You know, I don't have the numbers for this, but I thought it was an interesting trend today. I don't remember this really being a thing. There's a lot of players that didn't run and then did the drills.

[Todd McShay]

Yes.

[Chris Mortensen]

So it wasn't even, they were trying.

[Todd McShay]

To say, admitting guilt. Yeah.

[Chris Mortensen]

There was no, like, there was no hiding it, no disguising it. They just didn't want to run the 40 today. So instead of, instead of just skipping everything like you might want to do to say, well, I couldn't do any of it.

[Todd McShay]

And it was. There was a lot of players. And it sucks. And it sucks. And it stinks. And it sucks. As one of my friends used to say, that stinks. And it sucks. And it stinks. And it sucks. And it does. But I also, I also, like, I can't stand when I tune in to shows or I listen.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, we don't.

[Todd McShay]

And like, it's like these old guys are sitting there complaining that the young guys aren't working out anymore. Like, I'm just not. We're never going to be that okay. Right. So, yeah, it sucked for a little while and then you get over it and you understand they're all going to work out and it's not going to affect their draft result unless they're hiding something that's going to negatively eventually affect their draft result. Right, Right. But at the end of the day, there were some really intriguing things that came out. I thought it was interesting. We had a lot of long armed interior defensive linemen.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Defensive tackles. I don't know if we were able to make this graphic, Tucker, but there were some defensive tackles with 35 inch arm length.

[Chris Mortensen]

That's three of them, right?

[Todd McShay]

You don't see a whole lot of that. Josh Farmer, Florida State, Vernon Broughton from Texas and Yaya Black from Iowa. Okay. Other notable guys that had long arms, 34 inches or longer. Derek Harmon, 34 and three eighths. Okay. Darius Alexander, we'll get to him in a minute. From Toledo, rising 34 inches. Alfred Collins, monster year. Two first rounders go off of the NFL a year ago. He's got one year to shine and he shines 34 and 5, 8 inch arm. So they're sorry. 34 and 5, 8 inch of an arm. So talking about a bunch of guys, there were long arms, interior defensive linemen that stood out to me. And then I just thought a few guys were absolute standouts. Okay, again, go back up and watch the tape and I'll let you talk about him more. But Jared Harrison Hunt from smu, I know you, you kept carrying on, but he really stood out to me. His movement skills, carrying his weight. He ran the third fastest miles per hour on the 10 yard split of the interior defensive lineman. Good vertical jump, 32. It was just a complete workout. 4, 8, 7 was his.

[Chris Mortensen]

486.

[Todd McShay]

486. Then was his official. What'd you see from him?

[Chris Mortensen]

I just, I mean I. He's running and I turned, I turned to you. We're in the hotel room, we're watching.

[Todd McShay]

Oh yeah.

[Chris Mortensen]

And he's running the 40. And I'm like, yeah, that's great. What is he, 270, 275. And then I see him on the field and he's moving around. This guy's got to be 275 tops. And then you pull it up and he's 290. And people, I don't know if people realize how good that SMU pass rush and that defensive line was. I mean they always talk about the quarterback and Rashard Smith, the running back. We talk about, you know, that offense, they spread it out, they were electric. That defensive line was really good. Elijah Roberts, the guy, he was 295 today, he's another edge to keep an eye on. This guy could. Harrison Hine could get after the quarterback and with the workout he had today, I think it, you know, it turned some heads. And he's, he's someone who definitely helped himself today because again, when you're looking at these players and as long as we've been doing it, you get a good feel for body Types and how this guy's moving and he just looked like he looked more like an edge than a defensive tackle. And then at £290 to just to, to run that well, he just had a great day.

[Todd McShay]

He did. And I'm intrigued now to go back and study him. You always hear, well, I'm going to go back and study. He's going to make. That makes me go back and study the table. The reason why is because you, you almost view it in a different lens.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right?

[Todd McShay]

Okay. So that's there, that's in him, right? Did I miss something? Now I know he has that explosiveness. Are there little things I'm not picking up on? Maybe you pick up on a moment where you're like, oh, I see it there more. So it is like, you know, so I'm just interested to go back and study his tape and study him more because again, like this process about getting the top 100, top 150 and now going back and really grinding from this point until I like to have all the evaluations done and in the books first week in April every year. That's been our process.

[Chris Mortensen]

I know.

[Todd McShay]

Trust me, I know. And you get nervous and I do too. I just, you know. But we Talked about the 10 yard split on Jared Harrison Hunt.

[Chris Mortensen]

169.

[Todd McShay]

169. There were only two. We talked about the 160 being that that line of magic for pass rushers. Edge. Edge rushers. Well, sub 1 sevens are also outstanding for defensive tackles. I think it's more important the 10 yard split for an edge. But if you're looking at what the kind of the number is for outstanding, anything 17 or faster. Only two guys from this class ran a sub 1710 yard split. That's Harrison Hunt and that's Tyrion Ingram Dawkins from Georgia.

[Chris Mortensen]

What a day.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, man. Like we know about Stackhouse. We know about, we know about Jalen Walker. We know about Mikel Williams. One hour. One hour. Guys, until, until our reservation. James. Guys, James Beard nominee. Where we're going tonight? Every we'll get to, we'll get to St. Elmo's, I promise. We got the cocktail sauce Saturday night, all the things. But like tonight I'm taking you on a little ride. Okay. All right. Tyrion Ingram Dawkins, 36 and a 36 inch vertical 104 broad jump, second fastest. I love how next gen our, our buddies at next gen getting more and more involved with the combine. Yeah, we spent a lot of time building database and like a lot of exciting stuff to do in the future. But they've got this thing now where they're in the 10 yard split, they're monitoring the fastest 10 split he had. The second fastest, the third fastest was Harrison Hunt. The second fastest was at 16.8 miles per hour was Ingram Dawkins. It was an awesome workout.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know what else to add to it. I mean he put up all those numbers and again you watch for what they do on the field and you know, I think that Daniel Jeremiah from the NFL Network, I saw it too. But he, he brought it up in the broadcast of. You look at how flat his stance was. Sometimes you just get a feel for how athletic guys are with the way they line up and how easy it is for them to bend and just get, you know, comfortably get down on the ground, how flat his back was, how well he bends and I mean he just, he checked every box that he could have checked today.

[Todd McShay]

Let me take you through my interior defensive lineman rankings. Okay. Okay. I know yours are slightly different, but a lot of the same names, let's say. Okay. Graham, Grant Nolan. We already talked a lot about Derek Harmon from Oregon. We talked about Darius Alexander. Really good workout today. We can go through the numbers. You can find them online. The things it's 606037. 305 pounds, 34 inch, 495 unofficial. Really liked his. I got notes about his work. A good dip corners welded really good in the bags, all that. Alexander is absolutely rising and is a player that we're going to see. I firmly believe he's going to be a top 50 pick. And there are some people I talk about, talk to are like, like I don't know if he'll sneak in late first but like, you know what I mean? So like he is skyrocketing. Alexander is, is like one of the absolute stories of the pre draft process.

[Chris Mortensen]

Another Toledo kid. It's awesome.

[Todd McShay]

Toledo. Remember the last Toledo kid who had an awesome pre draft?

[Chris Mortensen]

All right.

[Todd McShay]

Last year just won a Super bowl as a starting corner.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

You know, so like I'm telling you, this guy is different when you watch his tape. And I think everyone caught onto it at the Senior bowl where he was dominant. Right, right. And, and now you're looking inside.

[Chris Mortensen]

He was great.

[Todd McShay]

And now you're looking at his workout. That was awesome On a day where a lot of the top guys didn't work out. My point being this opportunity that's here. Right. Top three guys don't work out. Derek Harmon had a Solid day. Alexander's next up knocked it out of the park. Wasn't like exceptional but was just really damn good across the board. Other guys that are in that next sort of tier, I thought the standouts to me were Aeneas Peebles.

[Chris Mortensen]

Okay.

[Todd McShay]

And the other guy who's in, who's in my top 15. And normally you're like, oh, he's your 15th best interior defensive lineman. He's like late day three. Nah. Ty Robinson, I've got 74 grade on that's equivalent to like third round, 87th overall. Okay. He had an awesome workout.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Those two guys like I don't. Peebles and Robinson, you take it anywhere you want to go.

[Chris Mortensen]

So with. I'll take it with Robinson because I just. When I watch his tape I was not surprised that he worked out well because when I watched his tape and I watched him at the Senior Bowl I kept saying to myself man, I don't think, I don't think people realize how well he moves and how fast he closes, how quick he is, how disruptive he is. I love the way he uses his hands on tape. I was surprised to see him run a 48340. I didn't think he would work. I thought he would work out well. I didn't think he would work out this well. He had a day and these peoples. By the way, we're talking about another player that you know again draft starts at Mobile, right? These people was another player. I remember the first day, he's just living in the backfield and the first day of the Senior Bowl. So this is another guy. I mean this class is ridiculous. Another guy who's just killing the, the, the pre draft process. I'm surprised there's one player you didn't bring up because I thought he is just. I know he didn't run and I know he doesn't. He's not the biggest guy and all this but Norman lot from Tennessee.

[Todd McShay]

Oh he's. It's just.

[Chris Mortensen]

He's one of those guys that I feel like maybe, maybe is flying under the radar. I don't know, maybe because of the depth of class that.

[Todd McShay]

No, he is, he is. I've been screaming about him since, since like late in the season.

[Chris Mortensen]

And when you watch it again, he had a 311 1/2 inch vertical 95 broad. He's not going to blow you away with any of that. He's not, he's not tall. He's sub 300 pounds. But because he's not tall and the way he carries that weight, he's got a good frame. I like his frame. He's got that low center of gravity. But watch the on the field drills with that guy and how under control he is with the way he controls his body, the way he changes directions.

[Todd McShay]

I think he's the six best defensive.

[Chris Mortensen]

Tackle in this class to me.

[Todd McShay]

And, and it's. And I'm. I'm fighting not to bring him up even higher.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, it's tough.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, he's.

[Chris Mortensen]

And again, another guy that was at the Senior bowl who performed well, I will say this. One of the guys, you know, I talked about it earlier. One of. One of the guys that did not run but did work out was Ohio State's Ty Leak Williams.

[Todd McShay]

Oh, he looked good.

[Chris Mortensen]

I mean, he was at.

[Todd McShay]

I forget.

[Chris Mortensen]

I don't even know where the weight is. I think it was 322 pounds.

[Todd McShay]

I got it right here.

[Chris Mortensen]

320.

[Todd McShay]

Williams was 6,6027, just about 6'three 334 pounds.

[Chris Mortensen]

334 pounds. Give me a break.

[Todd McShay]

I mean, DNPs across the board didn't do one workout thing except the position drills.

[Chris Mortensen]

And then we're watching the position drills and we're both looking at each other.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, he's a dude.

[Chris Mortensen]

334 pounds. And he moves like that.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, it's.

[Chris Mortensen]

He's going to be. I mean, he's been one of those guys that. In at least on my board, in and out of the first round, all year. In and out of the first round. When I look at the way he moves, if he goes to his pro day and I hope he runs, I hope he has a decent time. But he's a guy that I wouldn't be surprised if he snuck in in late first round and I think is a top 50 guy.

[Todd McShay]

I just, I just look at these. I keep. This is what happens. Right. They're just workouts. Keep them in perspective. Everyone calm down. Got it? I'm calm. I don't seem like I'm calm. I'm pretty calm.

[Chris Mortensen]

This is calm for you.

[Todd McShay]

I got alarms going off. I can't stop thinking about dinner tonight. James Beard, table for seven. I got lists everywhere. Notes, but I'm calm. But when I start to look at these, these top lists and I see the same names and they're not the names. And that's why I just went through that list of the top. Were we able to get that interior defensive lineman the top. Let's throw that up again. I want you to look at the. These are the guys in my top 100. And the rankings are not even like I've updated them, but, but this, it's the same names. Okay. Not in those rankings are Tyrion Ingram Dawkins. Not in those rank. In those, in those rankings, Javari Ritzy from North Carolina. Not in those rankings is is Bigger. Zeke Biggers, Georgia Tech. Not in the bottom. Towards the bottom of those rankings is Ty Robinson from Nebraska. Well, we have another graphic here and go to your, your measurements that matter. Defensive tackles notes that you have. We print these, we update these every year. I even have them in red, right?

[Chris Mortensen]

Yep.

[Todd McShay]

The number one measurement that matters for, for interior defensive lineman is what vertical jump. Okay. And what's. And what is considered outstanding?

[Chris Mortensen]

33.

[Todd McShay]

Okay, let me give you another number beyond that. 33 and a half inches on a vertical jump. Only 25 guys have done it here at the combine since 2008. Okay, 25 defensive, interior, defensive linemen, defensive tackles. Got it. So that's a four, 16 year span.

[Chris Mortensen]

Crazy.

[Todd McShay]

Okay. 16 years. There's only 25 guys who have done it. This year we had four who jumped 33 and a half or higher. And these are not the names we expected. Ty Robinson's the only one on that list that, that is in my top 100. And he was at the lowest 33 and a half inch. Just above him was Zeke Biggers, 34 and a half. Just above him was Ritzy Javari Ritzy, 35 and a half. And just above him was the guy who, I mean, quite honestly stole the show today, Tyrion Ingram Dawkins from the interior defensive lineman. If you're, if you're saying, okay, who won the combine for the interior defensive lineman, it's got to be Ingram Dawkins.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Let me give you another list.

[Chris Mortensen]

By the way, zeke Biggers is 321lbs. 321lbs with that vertical jump.

[Todd McShay]

Sheesh. Is he really?

[Chris Mortensen]

Yes.

[Todd McShay]

I thought he was like 310.

[Chris Mortensen]

Nope. 6054, 321 pounds.

[Todd McShay]

Almost 35 inch arm length.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah. I mean, come on.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah. We're in a 54541 or 514. So yeah, 541 would be a disaster. 514. Yeah. So that lower body explosion, it's just something to keep in mind. I'm not saying, but let's throw up the other list if we have it. The next gen list of the miles per hour, 10 mile, 10 yard split, fastest miles per hour reach in the 10 yard split among the defensive linemen. Notice some of Those names at the bottom. Aeneas Peebles, top 100. Talked a lot about him. Virginia Tech 3 technique, get up the field. You expected that number. Darius Alexander, I'm talking about top 50 pick now. Yep, Toledo just talked about him. Three technique, rush off the edge as well. Can do a lot of different things. Athlete, we see it, carries the weight. Well expected that number. But then the top three guys. Ty Robinson's in number one in that list again, 15th on my interior defensive lineman group. And I like him, but he ran a 1698 miles per hour is the fastest on the 10 yard split in the next gen for miles per hour. And then the two names that we talked about earlier, there's like every list you come up with. Tyrion ingram, Dawkins, number two on that list. 16.8. Jared Harrison, Hunt, SMU, third on the list. So, so now we have to go back and we've isolated some names with Harrison, Hunt, smu, Ingram, Dawkins at defensive tackle, at edge. We talked about it before. Tyler Barron, Miami Fideil Diggs, numbers that, that pop. That make you say, all right, these are the four guys I've got to go back and I got to watch tape on because the numbers don't match up with what the seemingly can. You know, the, the thought is of them as players. Day three guys. And if nothing else, this is certainly going to help me break some, some clusters on day three.

[Chris Mortensen]

What about my guy?

[Todd McShay]

Who?

[Chris Mortensen]

C.J. west.

[Todd McShay]

Ah, I left.

[Chris Mortensen]

What about my guy? 316 pounds.

[Todd McShay]

How tall was he?

[Chris Mortensen]

Six one, I think. Short arms.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah.

[Chris Mortensen]

316 pounds. Okay. Why do you have to. Why have to get negative?

[Todd McShay]

I'm just play.

[Chris Mortensen]

Let's keep it positive. 316 pounds. 495-40173. 10 yard. And again not in that 33 and a half inch group for the vertical jump. But he still hit the 33 inch mark, which is outstanding for a defensive tackle. And when we talk about explosiveness again, does it translate to the tape or are we just watching a guy who's really good at working out, someone who trained very well for the combine. He's a good athlete, but when he gets on the pads and he goes out and plays, it doesn't show up well with CJ West. Yeah, he might have short arms, but that explosiveness shows up every time he puts the pads on.

[Todd McShay]

It does. Unfortunately. I got caught looking at the guy right above him. Dion Walker or Dion Walker?

[Chris Mortensen]

Dion Walker.

[Todd McShay]

He's massive. He just, he didn't work out at all. 25 inch vertical 8 inch. 8, 8 broad jump.

[Chris Mortensen]

He's an interesting player.

[Todd McShay]

He's an interesting player.

[Chris Mortensen]

Can he be an Eric armstead or a DeForest Buckner? It's very hard to be that tall and play interior. Defensive line.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, he's tough because he, like, he flashes and a guy like that shouldn't move the way he moves sometimes. But he wants to be a three technique and not a. Not a.

[Chris Mortensen]

Or an edge.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, a gap holder.

[Chris Mortensen]

He does play outside. There's scheme.

[Todd McShay]

I want to see my Tonka. Tonka did all right. Tonka Hemingway is my sleeper. I know, cuz I keep watching. I got off the plane. Where was it? Mobile.

[Chris Mortensen]

Mobile? Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

What did I say? You had.

[Chris Mortensen]

You had two things to say to me getting off the plane. One was, why doesn't anyone. Why isn't anyone higher on Tonka Hemingway? Every time I see him, he's flashing quick hands, athletic, making plays. And also your guy, number seven, the safety. Some things to think about, you know, is he always. Is he always around the ball? Is he. Is he always aggressive? Which I only bring up because you just love to give me a hard time about Nikki.

[Todd McShay]

I actually remember what I said.

[Chris Mortensen]

I said, you must watch four games on the way down.

[Todd McShay]

Oh, I did. I did. Because I've watched one. I'm like, I don't understand, like, why I got. Yeah, I love the other guy. I love tj. I love Sanders. But I. But there's something about this Hemingway. Like, he. He's just. He's making plays. He's. I just like his effort.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

And his. His workout wasn't bad. I got off the plane, I walked up to you and ear muffs. And I just looked you in the eye. I'll never forget. I don't know why I said it, but I was like. I was kind of annoyed. I was like, wrong with him anyway. And you're like, what? What? And you thought. I was like.

[Chris Mortensen]

I was like. I was like, is something wrong that you hurt?

[Todd McShay]

I'm like, no. What's wrong with him? Like, why not him? So I just. I like his tape, but let's go through his workout real quick. And this is just purely to appease me. Almost 6, 3, 2, 8, 4. 33 inch arm, solid. Did not do anything but the jump. 32 inch vertical, 9, 4 broad. So. All right, stay under the radar, Tonka.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Stay under the radar. Yeah. Linebackers, real quick. Let's go through. We don't have. I mean, I'm literally looking over. They just finished up the 40s. We'll see if we can get some of that. But we'll come back tomorrow. We have plenty of time to digest all this stuff. I did think a couple things were interesting. First of all, we talked about the Jalen Walker stuff. Right. With him as an off the ball linebacker. Jihad Campbell. I'm excited to see if we can get his workout numbers. If we don't tonight, we'll get him tomorrow, I think.

[Chris Mortensen]

Four, five, two.

[Todd McShay]

Here he is. Yeah. Man. Six three six zero two seven two. 35, 32 and a half inch arms, which is long for an outside backer. That's really good. Not elite, but it's good. 1, 5, 3 in the 10 yard split. 1, 5, 3. And the reason I point to that is. And we just talked about the edge rushes and all that. He's an off the ball linebacker. But what part of his appeal is his ability to rush off the edge? He's got some hybrid in him.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

And I can promise you this, talking to guys in the NFL, they're looking at him as another matchup piece, counter, if you will, a chess piece on the defensive side. Like, yeah, okay, you can do that with Jalen Walker, but I can also do that with Campbell. Yeah, okay. And so I was expecting a big day and we don't have all the results in. Let's see. Yeah. 10, 10, 7 broad jump. He didn't do the vertical, but 10, 7 broad jump, the 40 isn't official yet, but he ran a 4, 5, 2. Yeah, I mean the guy's like, like almost clipping a 4, 4 something, you know. Yeah, he's right, he's right there. So just exceptional.

[Chris Mortensen]

I wouldn't, Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised because his miles per hour is 22.6. I wouldn't be surprised if that 4, 5, 2 moved the, the high four force.

[Todd McShay]

You get the miles per hour.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah. 22.62.

[Todd McShay]

Is that the fastest?

[Chris Mortensen]

Let me see if we can get that to sort fast enough.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah, that can't be on. Yeah, yeah. You're useless.

[Chris Mortensen]

Thank you.

[Todd McShay]

Thank you. No, I, I said yeah because. Because I had the same problem that sometimes when you go to sword, like it's, it's going to need a little time. Swinger ucla.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Didn't run. I didn't expect that. I heard he was going to work out. Six, two and a half, 242 pounds. He's a guy who's moving up a lot. You talk to a lot of people in the league. Second, second best vertical jump. Didn't do anything else though.

[Chris Mortensen]

Interesting.

[Todd McShay]

I, I literally like results haven't populated no DNPs. They're okay DNPs. So but 30, 39 and a half inch vertical was, this was the second best. Teddy Buchanan from Cal. 40 inch vertical.

[Chris Mortensen]

Wow.

[Todd McShay]

Teddy Buchanan from Cal 461 unofficial. Teddy Buchanan from Cal 33 and a half. No, sorry. 40 inch vertical, 105 broad East West Shrine game had a really good week. 62 2, 33. Another guy we're gonna have to keep an eye on just first, first glance here. Eugene Asante, linebacker from Auburn. 448 unofficial 152-10-yard split.

[Chris Mortensen]

How about Danny Stutzman being done with disrespect. 452155.

[Todd McShay]

Yep. It's interesting that these linebackers had a good day.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, I can't wait to get in this later.

[Todd McShay]

Chris Paul just average 4, 6 5, undersized linebacker. Thought he would run a little faster. He's faster on tape. London smell London small London. 60222, 24. He's dropped some weight to get faster. Ran a 4, 5, 8 though 15 2. So we had some fast times, some good jumps in this linebacker group. So Schlesinger didn't, I thought to me Campbell and Schlesinger were going to be the stories today. Campbell was a story. Schlesinger, maybe not for the right reason, but the 39 and a half inch vertical though, the one thing he did at least, he did it at an unbelievable level.

[Chris Mortensen]

His tape and his production this year were awesome.

[Todd McShay]

Oh, here's my guy. Sleeper linebacker this year, folks. I, I, maybe it was that flight down to Mobile and I was in a mood, good or bad. But the two guys that pop to me the most in the tapes that I watch.

[Chris Mortensen]

Who's 17? Who's 17?

[Todd McShay]

17.

[Chris Mortensen]

Demetrius Knight Jr. Another guy.

[Todd McShay]

What's wrong with Hemingway? And who's 17?

[Chris Mortensen]

He's like, look at my notes, look at my notes. Who's 17?

[Todd McShay]

Because I didn't, I didn't, I didn't. We didn't have Internet on the flight, right? Yeah, I couldn't double check. I want, I needed to know, is that him? And it was him. 601-5235. Demetrius Knight. Great week at the senior box roll. Absolute just dog flies. Like everything he hits explodes.

[Chris Mortensen]

Right?

[Todd McShay]

Right. 4, 5 8. 40158, 10. Good numbers. So, all right, I guess that's it for now, huh?

[Chris Mortensen]

Did all right, right?

[Todd McShay]

Yeah. It always feels, I mean when you're sitting here and it just feels scrambled.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah, we like to prep. We like to Be we like things buttoned up a little bit more than this allows for.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah. But I think it's good for us. I think it's like therapy almost.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

You have to just leave it all. Let it. Let it go. We can come back tomorrow and finish it up. Close your computer. Yep. We'll be back tomorrow. 7:00pm Eastern Time.

[Chris Mortensen]

Thank you.

[Todd McShay]

Yeah. When men is saying thank you, you know, we're appreciative. Never said no. 7pm tomorrow. We appreciate everyone being here. I cannot wait for the corners I've already planted my flag in. Jade Baron. Don't need him to run well. We can have all the discussions and fights about that tomorrow night. Don't need him to run well. Do need them to run faster than the 4, 5, 8 we saw from Brian Branch or else there's going to be a lot of defending. Can't have a defensive back in your top 10 running a four or five, right, Todd? So I don't think he's going to run that. I'm not putting the whammy on him. I'm just saying we're going to get some answers tomorrow. And there's no position, I'm telling you, no position that's affected more when it comes to draft than the cornerbacks and what they run. And it's not just the 40, but that is like the last standing position where it really matters as much as the media hypes it up.

[Chris Mortensen]

Yeah.

[Todd McShay]

Can you combine that with the arm length and the 40 yard dash and that becomes a huge critical factor in the evaluation of cornerbacks. And we're going to be back here tomorrow, 7pm Breaking it all down. And in between, we're going to send some clips overnight. Hopefully just stay involved. We're really excited about the next couple days. And then on Saturday, we're right back at. At 7pm Again, live show, third or fourth? Fourth of four live shows here from the combine. And then on Monday we're gonna fly back on Sunday. Monday we're gonna have a review show. We're gonna go through the whole thing for you. So busy week. We're excited. Thanks for being here. Now it's time to go. You got to feed the big fella, man. James Beard. All right. Love you guys. Thank you. Must be 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 + and present in G7 visiting help 310 05.