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The McShay Show
Senior Bowl, Day 2: Mike Green vs. Josh Conerly Jr., Small Schools Show Out, and Is Jack Bech the next Puka Nacua?
01:26:23
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- [00:01]
A
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- [00:31]
B
It's the McShay show, presented by FanDuel. You thought December was the most wonderful time of the year. Well, you're wrong. The NFL playoffs are just about here. And there's no better time to bet with America's number one sportsbook. Bet on new and fun markets like to catch a pass, same game parlays, highest scoring game across the Sunday slate, offensive touchdowns in the next drive, and so much more. The app is safe, secure and easy to use. And when you win, you'll get paid instantly. Plus get exclusive offers all playoffs long. So download the app today and bet the playoffs with FanDuel. An official sportsbook partner of the NFL. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and help lines available and listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Must be 21 and older and present in select states. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit RG D help.com It's Wednesday at the Senior bowl and only 85 days left until the NFL draft. Look who I got here, men. You good?
- [01:43]
A
I'm great, man.
- [01:44]
B
All right. Play me that sweet music, dj. Hey, you're always complaining, men. You're always complaining that I want to talk quarterbacks all the time. We will. We're going to get to the quarterbacks. Okay. And there was some stuff that we've got to get into, like really intriguing stuff from the second day of practice here at the Senior Bowl. But it, I mentioned it in the open. Today is the most physical day. We're talking full pads on Tuesday, the first day of practice. It's a lot of installs, kind of know, half speed a lot of the time. There are some physical aspects of it. Thursday is a lot of special teams. Thursday's a lot of, you know, making sure the body's ready for Saturday. Wednesday's the day at the Senior bowl. And quite honestly, it was all about the trenches today. Even I, the the quarterback offensive skill guy who loves to go watch the one on ones and the seven on sevens. Even I had to go down. We're on the field, we're right there. It's like, it's, it's like an Oklahoma drill, right? You've got all these scouts. I'm standing next to Mike Tomlin, we got John lynch down there, John Schneider, the GM of the Seahawks, like, and every NFL scout, offensive line coaches, defensive line coaches circling around, right? And it's these one on ones. It's the best part of the week and honest to God, it might be the best part of the entire scouting process is to be standing on the field in Mobile, Alabama watching these first rounders, second rounders, Alabama's, Georgia's of the world, going against Sacramento State and West Alabama, like, it's just, it's the best part of the process. And so today was that day. And hopefully you'll get, you can just feel the energy here. So much fun to watch. Let's start with this, okay? Of all the stuff, there were two plays that stood out to me that kind of, I don't know, embodied the day. We'll start with the first one. There was one play in the morning session. We've got Mike Green from Marshall, right? He's a defensive end, edge rusher, phenomenal season, and he's going to be a first round draft pick. He's going up against Josh Connerly, my guy. Well, in this play, my guy embarrassed me and it didn't go well. Mike Green literally got under his pads and plowed him. It was awesome to watch. And Mike Green kind of let everyone know who, like, who the real first rounder was there. Like, who's the dude? And just watching that play and there was a lot of other plays and they actually went head to head the next play and Conner Lee held his own. But watching that play, how can you not watch it and say, okay, and I do this all the time. And Bill Poly and I used to do the, you know, the practices together for ESPN at the end of the week of the Senior bowl. You can always be like this guy, this guy, this guy, this guy, this guy, and maybe this guy and that guy. Like they're clearly first round picks because they, they rose to the top. And you can see it, you thought coming in they might be. Some of them were cemented already, some of them were kind of on the fringe. But you can always see the guys that just elevate during the week. And I thought Mike Green, it wasn't just that play. We'll get into all of it. It Wasn't just that play, but it was kind of his, they call it Heisman moment during the season. It was his like first round moment watching that play.
- [05:15]
A
Senior bowl moment.
- [05:16]
B
Yeah, his Senior Bowl, I'm a first rounder moment. Yeah.
- [05:19]
A
Guys who come from schools like Marshall, who, you know is a Division 1, it's an FBS school, it's a good program, but it's not one of the Power 4 schools. Those are the guys who really give themselves a chance. Because you're coming in, you're like, I watched this kid from Marshall, he's pretty good, but we'll see, you know. Yeah, yeah, it's the Oregon kid. Because I watched the Oregon kids tape and I love the Oregon kid. So when he gets a rep like that, it sticks out in your mind of, oh, he's just not a guy who's putting up big numbers at Marshall. He's a guy who can win against the best. I will say this, I'm not overly worried about Josh Connelly after he gets beat on one snap. These things happen. I've seen guys, listen, we've seen guys here before, offensive linemen get beat in ways that, you know, I'm sure that they weren't proud of and they don't want to show that tape ever again. But it happens. And it happens when you don't play with sound technique. And he just, you know, Connolly got in a bad position. He wasn't ready for the power. I think he was anticipating another move and that's what happens. And also, you know, something I noticed being on the field today, being next to these guys, getting a feel for their body types, I think Conner Lee is still growing into that body. I think he's going to get 10 or 15 pounds heavier maybe. He's definitely going to get stronger. I think he's a guy that hasn't quite peaked. You look at a guy like North Carolina State's Anthony Belton, who's 345 pounds, he has 34 and 58 inch arms. He looks like when you call central casting and say, can you send over an NFL offensive attack? Yeah, that's the dude. So Connolly's not quite there yet. Not worried about it.
- [06:42]
B
Why?
- [06:42]
A
Because I've seen the tape and I've seen guys have bad plays here before. It's not the end of the world. He's still a great player. But on the flip side, great news for Mike Green. He had more on the, you know, more on the line coming from the program that he comes from at, man, the energy like I don't know if we're gonna capture it.
- [06:56]
B
Well, here's the thing. Like, we Ringer and Spotify did us the biggest blessing of all time. They said, all right, you clowns are going down to Mobile, Alabama. We're gonna send your trusted producer, Right, Dan Comer, down with us. But also ship like two of the greatest.
- [07:12]
A
Yeah, I don't know how that happened.
- [07:13]
B
Cameramen and people who've been around the game and around all of sports and Nick and Jake and they're capturing all this stuff for. But, like, just to give you an example, I'm sure on our video podcast you're watching on YouTube, you're going to be able to. You probably have already seen it. If you're watching on Spotify, you've probably already seen the play. Quick anecdote for you. You'll see it probably throughout, you know, the Twitterverse and X and social media. The play we're talking about Mike Green under the pads, standing Connor Lee up and just jacking him to the ground. It was the most physically dominant play that, that we've seen here in two days of practice. Okay, well, I'm the asshole who caught the second play who said, oh, maybe I should bring my phone out and get a video of this. This is starting to heat up. And I got the second play where, like, Connerly kind of won the rep, but the. The battle was over. And he, you know, it just. It wasn't. It didn't have. So I put that one on. I posted that on X. And so you guys can see that play that was really kind of useless, but that was. That's what. So that's why they sent Nick and Jake, the professionals for us. And so you guys get to see the actual play. So that's just a little.
- [08:20]
A
Listen, the energy was different today.
- [08:21]
B
Oh, my gosh.
- [08:22]
A
And you anticipated it. They're here for day. They've kind of got their feet wet a little bit. They're ready to rip. Coming out on Wednesday. It's a big day. A lot of teams, a lot of scouts are start leaving tomorrow afternoon. This is the day you really had to come out and shine. And when you got to those one on ones, that's where it's started to elevate. I mean, that. That rep from Green got people fired up. The next thing you know, Donovan as a Ruku from Boston College, the Edge is going against Marcus Bow from Purdue.
- [08:47]
B
And they're grabbing each other face mask.
- [08:49]
A
Everyone's getting chippy. Like, you just. The energy was up and you could Just, I mean, it was getting the juices flowing. I think even you've got all these ex players who are now like scouts or have been around the game for a while and you can see them like kind of like bowing up a little bit like, wow, this is. This is pretty good.
- [09:03]
B
It was awesome.
- [09:03]
A
So like right from the jump, right from those one on ones, man, it was, it was great.
- [09:07]
B
All right. The other play that was in the morning practice, right? That was with the, with the national. National team in the morning. In the afternoon, we get about a half hour in between. Then they bring in, they bus in the second group, the. The American group, which quite honestly, it has. It's. It's more the southeastern schools. Right. And as you would expect, there's just, there's. There's more talent in the trenches, also a bigger crowd.
- [09:29]
A
The locals.
- [09:30]
B
Oh, yeah, yeah.
- [09:31]
A
So you get more oohs and oz. And. And that also started to build a little bit. So all in all, great day. Energy wise.
- [09:37]
B
It was. But the second play came from that second practice, right? And it was, it was. I want to say it was. It was a team or an inside run. And it was Shamar Stewart who I think we told you. And if you follow mcshay13on. On X, you'll. You'll see mention I did like, I'm. I'm the worst videographer camera guy in the world, but I had to take it. But we were watching Shemar Stewart, number four for Texas A&M, number 14 here. If you're, if you're watching some of the clips here and just fell in love with his play. Like he's one of those guys. He's not like the elite first step and not elite speed, but the more you watch him and the hustle and when it's 31 to 7 and he's. And he's giving all like the best effort you've seen, as if the game's tied seven. Seven. It's the SEC championship game, like. And the power he has. We fell in love with him. I know I did. At least. I don't want to speak for you.
- [10:35]
A
About the Logan Brown rep you saw last night.
- [10:40]
B
Anyway, we'll get to all of this. But. But Shemar Stewart is a player that we like just coming into this process. We're excited to see he has this moment in the second practice going up against Emory Jones from lsu. Okay. Really good, really talented offensive lineman. There was some talk coming into the season. Maybe he's. The first round you got Will Campbell, the other. The, The Left tackle for LSU is going to be a first round or a lot of people are talking about him maybe as the first offensive lineman off the board. But Emory Jones, very likely a day two pick, let's just put it that way. Very talented player and has been through a lot of wars. You don't play at LSU for a few years without being going through a lot of wars. Shemar Stewart, just for some perspective on it, built like, talk about central casting. Six, five, 281 pounds, 34 and a half inch arm length, which is outstanding as an edge defender. Emory Jones, though, six, four and a half, 312 pounds. So he's got 19, 20, 21 pound advantage, right? And no 19, 20, 31 pound. My math, 31 pounded, 31 pound advantage. And similar arms, just slightly longer, 34 and three quarters of an inch arm. They go head to head on this in this initial rep and Shamar Stewart beats him badly. Like, just works him over and I don't know if we have the clip or not, but he just works him over and makes. Makes quick. My, the way I flash it back in my head. Made quick work of him, right? And when he was done, it was almost the post, the post rep that was more impactful or just as impactful. Like, I use foul language on this, but I can't repeat word for word what he said because, like, you know, there might be kids in the car, right? But it basically stood and looked. It was. I mean, it takes Kuyons, it takes onions, as I like to say. But he stood there after winning this rep and basically announced to every scout he looked up. You got to remember, like, when you're, when you're on the field and you look up to the right side, okay, and you see where the press box is. I'm sure, like Daniel, Jeremiah and those guys, NFL Network are in there calling, you know, calling practice, right. Right below and next to them you've got all the, like, NFL teams. A lot of them get, get suites in there. And so they'll, you know, the Ravens will be sitting here, the Bengals will be there, Chargers will be there, and then all the scouts, typically, if they're not one of the executives up in the, up in the press box, they're. They're all on that side of the field and they all sit in clumps with each team. He stands up after this play and starts beating his chest and basically like, I'm effing him and like, like, you know, and just goes on for like, it felt like 30 seconds. It was probably three or four and kind of announced it. Like, I'm, I'm. I'm the guy. Like, you saw Mike Green earlier. I heard about it. Not Connerly on, on his ass, but I'm the guy. And it was, I don't know, like, call it what you want, but the confidence he has. But that moment, I just, I thought it was awesome to watch.
- [13:43]
A
Oh, it was great. I mean, he's been dominant at times. Again, that's the guy who's coming in. They're all in different positions coming in. These are guys. So. Solidifying himself as an early first round pick, which is cool to see. Emory Jones. Listen, I gotta back up my offensive lineman. That's what I'm gonna do. I'm not an Emory Jones guy, to be clear. I thought he had, I thought he had a chance to move into the first round with a strong season this year that just didn't come together. He didn't play all that well. I was a little underwhelmed with yesterday's practice. I thought he had some downs as well as some ups today. But what I loved about him was that he kept competing after that. The very next rep after that, he got Stewart and Stuart ended up on the ground. It wasn't as dominant as a play by any stretch, but Stuart ended up the ground and. And Jones stood over him and showed a little bit of fight. And then later on at the end of practice, there was some one on ones where he went against the Texas edge. Baron Sorrel, who has been like one of the under the radar guys. Solid. He's had a really good week. I thought Sorrel got him on the first rep. Offense and defense start arguing. I know he won. No, he won. Let's run it back. They end up doing three reps. But I love that Jones was fighting. I love that he was in the battle. That he wasn't, you know, wasn't a head down after some maybe, you know, not having a great start to the. And then you look at his tools. He's got, you know, good length. You just mentioned all the numbers. He's a toolsy kid. He's a kid who's competing. When I look at that, and I was offensive line coach, I'm like, you know, maybe he's not the first round guy. We thought he was coming in the season, but he's a guy I can work with. Yeah, he's a guy we could bring in. And maybe he turns into a starter and ends up being that kid at the pro level that we thought he was going to be his last year in college.
- [15:14]
B
Yeah. So before we move on, I want to get to. Let's just go through the practices in the, in the trenches because that again, that was, that was the biggest story of today. Today wasn't the only story, but it was the biggest story. Just I want to give a little quick perspective. I think this offensive tackle group, we don't have a lot of the top guys that are here. Okay. Conner Lee to me is the most talented of the offensive tackles that's here. Right. Armand Membu from, from Missouri is, is here but apparently. And we'll try to get some reporting on it, but apparently he's, he's been sick and he hasn't, hasn't played. I think he might have caught a cold from all the first round mock drafts that put him there and his tape is awesome. And so anyway, but, but he hasn't been performing. So Josh Connerly from Oregon is probably the top offensive tackle here and is in the mix with other guys that you'll hear throughout this the process, like Will Campbell who mentioned, I have already mentioned from, from lsu, Kelvin Banks from Texas. Right. And. And also Josh Simmons from Ohio State who got injured pretty early in the season. But his tape for like the first five, six games of the year might have been the best offensive tackle tape that anyone put out there. So those are kind of the guys in the offensive tackle mix in the first round. Edge guys. What's intriguing is like, and I'm nothing is I'm saying changing but more solidifying and getting perspective on it. I think we all agree Abdul Carter from Penn State. Penn State's the number one overall player player in this draft. And if you don't think that if you've got Travis Hunter, the wide receiver cornerback from Colorado, then you've got him at least as the number one edge and probably at number two. So that's Abdul Carter. After that there's going to be a lot of debate. I personally, I think Mikel Williams from Georgia, again, not here is right there. But then I think like to me, Shemar Stewart and Mike Green could be next up.
- [17:06]
A
Wow.
- [17:07]
B
Three, like I personally right now have Shemar Stewart is number three edge in this class and then I would go with Mike Green number four ahead of like a Jalen Walker from Georgia who's kind of an off the ball. He's not Micah Parsons, but he's kind of the notch below but similar path. He's a hybrid type of guy. So just want to give a little perspective on how talented these guys are and potentially three top 25 picks that we just mentioned in Green, Stewart and Connerly. So now I want to get to the trenches. Let's go back to the morning class. Morning practice. You take us to class and, and go through some of your notes who stood out to you. You can go offensive line, defensive line, wherever you want to go, but just take us through it.
- [17:49]
A
Listen, I hate to do it, but I'm gonna do it. Gray's able from North. I don't hate to do it. I love to do it. Yeah.
- [17:57]
B
Yeah. You're a small school off of offensive lineman by trade. Like that's your history. How could you not be fired up to come out here and promote small school offensive linemen showing out on the biggest stage you could possibly have in pass. He's finally getting it and he's. Yes.
- [18:12]
A
So Gray's. Abel's having. He just had another great day. He's playing guard, he's playing center. Kids so competitive. He's athletic. I got a chance to stand next to him today. I know his arms are short. This dude is put together. I'm six five know, I, I've got a pretty good feeling.
- [18:25]
B
You're lean now though, man.
- [18:27]
A
I wouldn't say that.
- [18:28]
B
Stevie boy, he's in fighting shape.
- [18:31]
A
But I will say, I got to say I got stand next. This kid's put together, he's strong. And then when you see the quickness and the athletic off of the ball, you know some. A kid that I don't know we've talked about is a Florida State defensive tackle. Farmer.
- [18:42]
B
Yeah.
- [18:43]
A
He's got some length. I was watching him during warm ups, getting off the ball. He's got a quick first step for his size. He's flashed.
- [18:50]
B
He's just shy of 6, 3, 314 pounds. You mentioned the length. Holy. I don't think I knew this.
- [18:54]
A
Yeah.
- [18:55]
B
35 and a quarter inch arms.
- [18:57]
A
Yeah.
- [18:57]
B
That's like elite.
- [18:59]
A
He's a guy I'm really. I haven't watched a lot of his tape. I'm excited to go back and watch his tape and another guy like that and we, you know, we both. Again, you get down on the field today and you're standing next to these guys in the field and, and this has happened a couple of times this week where I go to say something or you go to say something. I'm like, that was, you know, Toledo. Darius Alexander.
- [19:16]
B
Yes.
- [19:17]
A
Good looking kid. I mean he's got the length, he moves well. He comes off. He's a Defensive tackle. I mean, I told Todd he was 300 pounds today and he was like, oh, I thought he was like a 280 edge.
- [19:27]
B
Yeah, he's 304. I looked it up after 6, 6, 3 and a half, 304, 34 inch arm length. But he, he carries himself like that. Like 285. I would have guessed 285. Just looking at him, I would have guessed that.
- [19:39]
A
And great power off the edge. Edge when he was rushing during one on ones. You know, those are three guys that I think really stood out. Again, Zable's becoming one of the stories for me here. Maybe a guy who's potentially playing himself into the top hundred. We'll see how it goes at the combine. All those discussions that go on. But you know, maybe this is an opportunity for us to talk about What a top 100 player, a third round grave versus second round grade, something like that. About what those guys might look like, what we expect from them.
- [20:05]
B
Yeah, the defensive lineman in that first, I mean the offensive line was great and I'll get to a couple of those guys, but there were three defensive linemen. One of them was Alexander. That really stood out. Guys that we're not talking about in the first round, but when you start to talk about the depth of this group and like we've actually had a chance, we're going to do a really, really cool series, we're working on it now of sitting down and talking to general managers in the NFL. We've talked to Nick Casario, we, we've talked to Eric Da Costa of the, the, the Texans and the Ravens respectively. And we're going to continue to kind of build it out and we'll, we'll keep you informed on how we're going to roll it all out for you, but not about like, who'd you like at practice and what do you, what are you going to attack in the off season? Who do you, who are you going to draft? It's more about like how you build and that team build and, and what you're looking for. So. But when I look at teams and the successful teams in the league, we've talked about this recently, Find your quarterback and build a damn good defense. Because your quarterback, unlike any other player in any other sport maybe, but certainly in football, can be the eraser. He can make up for all these different sins on the offensive side of the ball. So if we have a great defense with the guy who can make up for all those weaknesses and sins on the offensive side of the ball, we got A chance. That's why you see every year the Ravens drafting defensive line, the Chiefs since they got Patrick Mahomes loading up on defensive players. You talk about like all the Eagles. Are you kidding me? Like all the defensive guys, Georgia guys specifically. So when I start to see all these players and the depth at defensive tackle and at edge, it's exciting and I know it's exciting for these general managers who are here, Darius Alexander, who you mentioned winning with power and guys who can play versatile spots. Right. Who can play a three, who can play a five, who can power rush off the edge. Alexander's a guy to watch. Like, and when we start to Talk about top 100 picks somewhere in day two, I think Alexander's really making a case for himself. Then you get the all name team. Oluwafemi Oladejo nailed it from ucla and then Donovan as a Ruku, not as difficult from Boston College, Ola Dajo. I just, I, first of all, the thing that jumped out most is his energy. Like he's the one yelling for give me another rep. He's the one, you know, advocating for his, for the defensive line guys. He's the one getting everyone riled up. You start to see the leadership and the dogs that are here and like he jumps out to me. 99 from UCLA. Also love the fact that this is a, this is a guy who was a Mike linebacker. Right. For three years off the ball.
- [22:51]
A
Yeah.
- [22:51]
B
A mic moved him to edge and now you look at him and I don't pull up his numbers here for you. Now you look at him and you're like he's found his home. He's a versatile player who can drop into coverage every once in a while. He's 6, 2 and a half, 261 pounds, 34, 33 and a half inch arm length. Like not elite measurables, but a guy who was playing Mike that just fits better on the edge. And I thought he did some great things like long, strong, not elite athleticism. Like he's not like elite in terms of like inside out and quick agility, but he's got great speed, like straight line speed. When he gets a beat on a guy, he's going to track you down. And he, and he just, he loves ball.
- [23:34]
A
Just to back you up a little bit on that. I was watching them do bag work in the beginning. It was just defensive lineman working together and it was the last rep and they were making a big deal about it being the last rep and there was going to be a race between these two guys. And who do they call up? Marshalls, Mike Green and then Ola Deja. And there's other guys on that roster that you could call up. But they wanted Oladejo and I wrote down in my notes. It just feels like the staff really likes him, the coaching staff. And it feels like players are gravitating. I was seeing the exact same thing about you as a guy who's, you know, kind of, you know, alpha might be an over overused term, but, you know, that's kind of what we're saying.
- [24:06]
B
Ezruku is another one too. He's another dog. Like did you hear him at the.
- [24:11]
A
End of one of ones?
- [24:12]
B
Yes.
- [24:12]
A
No sir. No, he's like, that was like last rep and he's pointing at someone else. No sir. No sir.
- [24:16]
B
We got 20 seconds, officer gentleman. You know, like he's. But he, he on between those lines. He's an absolute maniac. But what I loved watching him do athletically, his dip and rip, dude, like, like the ability as an edge rush, I always talk about it. I don't. If you're not watching on video, follow me around here. But like edge rushers, there's that point of no return. It's that, that moment of truth when you get to the top of the arc and you've got to get around and you got to have. Whether it's a swipe, whether it's a club swim, usually doesn't work that effectively anymore. But the dip and rip to get through and the bend, like I always talk about torso flexibility, that was Brusky's big thing when we talked to him. Spent a lot of time looking at linebackers and defensive linemen, edge rushers, the ability to work through with that, that torque while, while bending in flexibility and to dip around like, just picture as you're going around the corner, you got to dip underneath to get underneath the hands and the pads of the offensive lineman. But to still have enough of that bend in your body to work and run that tight arc around his was awesome today. Yeah, that dip and rip coming around was so good. He's quick, he's got active hands. That bend, I just, I get, I get it. He's undersized, he's not going to be a first round pick. But when you're looking for depth and edge rushers early in careers and guys who can develop into starters and play in a rotation, I think Ezruko has done nothing but help his, his cause this week.
- [25:48]
A
I mean he's long for his frame. He's like 6, 2, 2, 48. But he's got good length, 34 and.
- [25:53]
B
A half inch arms for a guy.
- [25:54]
A
That small, that's unusual, but it's good length for an edge. And just to, to reiterate the point about that bend, why do you think when you go to the combine, you see the towels in the middle of those huge, you know, rings and you see them filming individual work today when they're, you're, they're asking guys to consistently bend around corners. They're trying to see how, how flexible that torso is. They want to see how flexible your ankles are. And when you watch tape of these elite pass rushers and you freeze it like we did with Shamar Stewart a little bit the other night, they are at impossible angles. It almost looks like it's an illusion at how well these guys can stay on their feet and bend. And other guys, you know, they get exposed during some of these drills and they'll fall. You'll see their feet come out from under them. And it's the difference between a good and elite edge bursar.
- [26:37]
B
I guess the only other note I'd say from the trenches, we watched tape the other day on Marcus Bow. It's spelled mbow in case you're confused on who we're talking about. He's a Purdue Offensive tackle, 6 4, 309 pounds. Short arms. We talked about, I think yesterday actually short arms at tackle, played right tackle. If he's gonna play tackle in the league, he's more of a traditional left because he's more athletic than he is a bulldozer, if you will. But the thing we both said when we watched the Oregon tape and it almost like the field was slippery, slippery. He was on skates a little bit. It just was not his best tape. I was kind of getting down on him. Then we put in Ohio State and he was awesome against better dudes on the outside. JTT Jack Sawyer controlling them, right. More physical, a little stronger, better with his hands. Then we saw Abdul Carter for Pence in the Penn State tape and, and denies Dennis Sutton on the other side and van over at times number 15, the number three defensive end for Penn State. And we watched that tape and he was great in that tape. But the thing that I kept running through my brain was, my goodness, he fits as a center. He's not, you know, he's not. His height is fine, his weight is fine, but his arm length at 33 inches and he's so athletic. I think he could be a great center. Now I put on on x Today, a post where he got beat on the inside. Oladejo. Right. But he was playing center and it was one of the first reps I've seen him this week. But clearly we're not the only ones who think he would make for a good center. So it's good to see Bo in that spot. And people have been talking about him maybe late first, early second. I just think it's center as a second round pick. This guy's got a chance to be really good. And I'm interested to see now on Thursday and then in the game the reps that he has at center and how he progresses there. Right.
- [28:23]
A
And when we talk about length, it's.
- [28:26]
B
Good to keep in perspective.
- [28:26]
A
It's not that we don't think there can't be outliers with guys who are short arms that can play offensive tackle. We do. But when you watch Marcus Bose tape, it's, it's great play, great play, and then there'll be a little bit of an issue. And usually when that, when that happens, it's a length issue. It's a guy got into his frame or he couldn't get into a defense, a defender's frame as a run blocker. The lack of length showed up on tape at times. Other, you know, he'd go for stretches where he'd be great. So it's the combination of those, those two things that makes us think that he's going to have to kick inside.
- [28:54]
B
All right, let's go to the afternoon in the trenches and we'll get back to the other positions very shortly. But the other, the, the other practice in the afternoon. Offensive defensive line, I'll let you take the floor.
- [29:05]
A
I mean, this is another moment where we, there's just been a couple moments where you look over, I look over Todd and we, you know, we look at each other like you see that. And it was the Sacramento State interior offensive lineman, Jackson later.
- [29:18]
B
He's got a name now, by the way. That's when you know you made it and when you're a small school guy.
- [29:22]
A
Right.
- [29:23]
B
Because, because if you talk to any walking in the hallway going your convention center to the, to the Renaissance where all the players are and the scouts are hanging out or on the practice field walking around, it's always a sac Sacramento State guy.
- [29:34]
A
Right?
- [29:35]
B
Right. Until he has a day like today and now he's got a name and, and it's Jackson Slater. And now we can call him Jackson Slater. Right. Like, truly, that's what happens. It's like, you see, you see West Alabama, Sacramento State. No. You see Slater.
- [29:48]
A
Yeah, right.
- [29:48]
B
Yeah.
- [29:49]
A
So the most impressive thing that he was doing and he did it twice, clearly did it twice, is when he gets out of position a little bit. His ability to sink his hips and recover his again upper body flexibility. He's not a tight guy at that size, that big and strong. His ability to recover when he gets a little bit out of position and win that rush rep is impressive. I thought there was times today where guys thought they had him beat and he was like, nope, I'm gonna slide over, I'm gonna stay balanced. And he just recovers very quickly and it's again simplifying the game. What does he do? Well, he stays in front of guys. Yeah, that's what he does. He stays low and he stays in front of guys. Simplify the game. I thought he, I thought he stood out yesterday.
- [30:28]
B
What do you think he can be in the league?
- [30:29]
A
I think he played garter center. Do I think he can be a starter? Yeah, in time. Yes, I do, I do.
- [30:36]
B
I actually don't disagree. I mean I've got a lot of tape to watch them. I'm not going to sit here and ride and say I've watched Sac State this year. Sac State. But like I think you put it best. Let's simplify things like sometimes like with, with, with Ferguson, the tight end from Oregon, it's like, why are we over overly complicating. He knows how to get open, he knows how to separate and he catches the football. Very simple. He does, it's the like he does what's required at the position very well. Slater does and he gets his natural balance. You talk about bend an offensive lineman, it's like how low man wins. You always hear about wrestlers and how they transition to playing offensive line. It's, it's a low man wins game and he just, he has a, a unique ability to stay low and take on bigger guys, maybe stronger guys, guys with helmets from much more decorated programs and just like it didn't matter. He just played his game. It was really cool to watch.
- [31:38]
A
Yeah, I just, I centered on the car right over here. I feel like the smaller school offensive line that have come here to varying degrees have all helped themselves out a little bit. You know the Alabama A and M offensive tackle, Carson Vincent has the longest arms here for of the offensive lineman. 35 and 18 inch arms. That's outstanding length. He moves well. I love the way he plays in terms of excitement. He's constantly, you know, he's just energy.
- [32:05]
B
He's a high energy. He loves the ball.
- [32:06]
A
He loves football. Loves the ball.
- [32:09]
B
Loves ball too. Right.
- [32:10]
A
But he moves well again as an offensive line coach. You're saying to yourself, he's ducking his head and he's whiffing, going, going up to the second level. There's things we need to work on, but I want to work on that with him. And then the.
- [32:22]
B
Well, it's also cool that Nagy, like Jim Nagy, the executive director at the Senior bowl. It's hard now. Like there's, there's a deep tradition here. Right, right. Of. Of bringing in small school guys and giving them an opportunity. And I know you go back, you know, you go back through the years and people who have run this, that you take a lot of pride in being able to provide opportunity. Right. Like a Sacramento State offensive lineman. Do you think at any point in his, in his mind he's like, I'm going to get to go play up again against like Alabama, Ole Miss, Georgia. Right. So. And now with the nil, you got to understand, this is the small school guys. Small schools have become training grounds and developmental grounds to. And it becomes a feeding frenzy. So Georgia and Alabama and Michigan, Ohio State, they go and pluck guys from places. Let's go take the best who they've already developed them after two or even three years and come bring them and bring them into play because they're ready. So to still be able to find guys like from Alabama A and M and Sacramento State and all these small schools is really cool. You know what I love is, you know, North Dakota State's not a small school, but still pumping out offensive line.
- [33:38]
A
I always, I always struggle with that one because that, that program's so good. But I think it's awesome that, you know, that people were like, oh, you know, there's been some grumbles about this guy dropping out and this guy dropping out. I really want to see him and that guy. And who's this kid from this school and where Nege and his staff have said, well, watch this. Like, they're actually bringing attention to these great players. And I love that, that aspect of it. People showed up here maybe disappointed about certain players and they're like, wow, hold.
- [34:04]
B
On, this kid can play the defensive line for that afternoon group is just, it's phenomenal. And I, you know, we've touched on it, but some guys that stood out to me, Walter Nolan had moments today where he absolutely looked the part. Talked about he's a first round prospect who, who showed why he is, you Know just the, the ability to disrupt the quickest power combination he has along the interior. I saw some things from Jared Ivy Flashes where he looked really good. Uman Miellon from Ole Miss, Prince Lee Uman Miellen. I thought he did some really good things. Kyle Kennard is speed to power. It was, it was really cool actually, with Kyle Kennard, the South Carolina edge standing next to him and he was talking to one of the coaches from the NFL teams and, and every rep he would, he would go participate in the rep show a different move, whether it was outside in speed to power, a dip rip, whatever it was, and would come back and immediately would race back to talk to this defensive line coach and wanted to ask about his technique. And like now when you look at Kyle Kennard and you, you can see the effort and the toughness and the instincts on tape. But when you look at Kyle Kennard and you see, well, he's six'three and a half. It's fine. 248. Yeah. Kind of undersized. 33 and 3, 8 inch arm. We're talking about guys with 34 and a half, 35. Yeah, it's fine. But then you see the production and you turn on even, even if you're just a fan of South Carolina or the SEC or college football, like you heard Kyle Kennard's name every freaking Saturday. Why? It's because what I saw standing next to him and I would, I got to the point where I would actually miss a rep here or there because I was so tuned into him technically trying to work between each rep to make sure. And it was. He wasn't using that move the next time. He just wanted to get better and make sure he's perfecting it. Like, those are the little things that you see when you're on the field that I don't know you, I, I'll always carry that with me. When he goes and gets drafted, that memory will be in my head. And then when he makes his first sack in the NFL, be like, that's a dude who cares so deeply and passionately about what he does in his profession now. And, and you can see why he's great. It's any field and anything you do in life. But like, those are the guys that get it and Kyle Kennard's one of the guys that just gets it.
- [36:30]
A
I feel like the Texas edge, Baron Sorrel, is kind of in that same school.
- [36:33]
B
Yes, he's.
- [36:34]
A
We talk about him, we talk about high ceilings, players, players that have the potential to be great you know, they have all these tools. We, we don't. I don't know if we talk about the, the high floor players enough and Baron Sorrel, to me, might not have the highest ceiling of someone here, man, he's got a great floor. I think he's going to go in and contribute right away. He's going to find ways to help an organization when you watch how he wins with his hands, his power, his effort. Just a player that I think that, you know, maybe not as flashy as some of the other players here, but has a chance to be a really good pro.
- [37:05]
B
I'll tell you one thing I'm learning, okay? Wide receiver group. And I'm not talking just as a senior, bro. I'm talking the 2025 NFL Draft class. The wide receiver group is not that great, okay? It's just not. I mean, you go back and you look at what we've had in years past, like all the Alabama guys like Henry Ruggs and Jerry Judy and Devonte Smith and that whole crew you've talked about the Texas wide receivers, the LSU wide receivers, the Justin Jefferson's that like you go to, like Jamar chases. It feels like every single year we've had this stacked group of wide receivers, right? For the last, I don't know, eight, nine years. This year's group isn't that good. Okay. It's just not. It's not that you. Hopefully we'll restack next year. We sure as hell are going to restack in 2027, starting with, with Jonathan Smith and. Yeah. And Jeremiah Smith and, and Alabama and, and Texas A Wingo and so we got that coming in the future. It's not this year. This year we all know about the running back class. It's absolutely loaded and we'll get to a couple of guys who stood out today. But I'm seeing this week more confirmation of what we're starting to see as we dive deeper into this, this defensive line class, both at defensive tackle and defensive end. It's loaded, man. It's loaded. And nothing makes general managers happier, especially ones that have quarterbacks, than then a draft that's loaded with defensive linemen. I also think you'll say, and I know it because you've said it to me, so I'll speak for you here. This offensive tackle class is a little better than expected. Yeah. And now we're seeing interior offensive linemen that maybe aren't first or second round picks, but are third round picks. It could be starters for you. So the trenches of this year's class. While it's not sexy, not going to like put asses in the seats, it's not going to, you know, ESPN and NFL Network aren't pumped about the ratings, right?
- [38:55]
A
It's not Williams Daniels, but I, I.
- [38:57]
B
Promise you, NFL gms love this class because it's deep and it's, it's got defensive and offensive linemen. So I just wanted to get that.
- [39:05]
C
This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. Here's the thing about prime, whatever you're into, it makes it even better. I love because we watch a lot of prime movies for the rewatchables. I love being able to pop up the X ray thing that tells you what actors and what scene. I love that. I love being able to rent movies that just came out or buy them. If I'm excited to do that. From streaming to shopping, it's on Prime. Visit Amazon.comprime to get more out of whatever you're into. This episode is brought to you by Hookah. I've gotta talk to you guys about the Bondi 9, the new daily trainer from Ahooka. The Bondi 9 delivers peak plushness for Everyday Miles. Overhauled from top to bottom, they've increased the stack height and added a new premium foam midsole to deliver that soft, resilient ride that's become synonymous with the Bondi. And look, I walk a lot. I walk all around la. You need good shoes for that. These are perfect. Everybody Bondi. Visit hooka.com, h o k a.com to learn more about the Bandai Nine.
- [40:08]
B
Off the plate the McShay show is brought to you by FanDuel. Every pass, every play, every prop, it's Super Bowl 59 and it's all happening on FanDuel. Bet on America's number one game with America's number one sportsbook any way you want. I'm talking spreads, live bets over unders, player props, special props, and so much more. As I look at these early lines, I, I kind of like this same game parlay. You ready? Saquon Barkley? You're telling me the super bowl is going to happen? Super Bowl 59. With the season Saquon's had and he's not going to be in any time. Touchdown scorer. No way. So let's start with Saquon, Barkley and then JuJu, Smith Schusters. Anyone else notice this guy's becoming a real serious part of the offense for the Chiefs. Over one and a half receptions. Let's get that together in the same game. Parlay I'm looking at FanDuel right now. It says +184. Let's, let's take that from them. Plus to make the super bowl even sweeter, new customers can score 200 bucks. When you make your first bet. Just place a $5 bet and if you win, you'll get 200 in bonus bets. Download the app or head to FanDuel.com McShay and bet with FanDuel. Official partner of Super Bowl 59. Must be 21 plus and present in select states or 18 plus in present in D.C. first online real money wager only. $5 first deposit required. Bonus issued as non withdrawable bonus bets which expire seven days after receipt. Restrictions apply. See terms@sportsbook.fanduel.com gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com now to the the juicy, fun stuff the quarterbacks where do I begin? Jackson Dart had a really good day. Jackson Dart from Ole Miss came in this week and we talked about how he's fighting to be QB 3. Jackson dart among scouts. I've talked to you, I've talked to you about the conversations I've had. There are people in the league who legitimately have him as QB2. Okay, the first day of practice wasn't a Jackson Dart thing. It was a practice thing. It just, you know, a lot of installs and all that. Today was a little bit more advanced in terms of what we got out of him. Thursday is always my favorite day for the quarterbacks because it's a lot of situational and then as I've said before, it's, it's when you get in the red zone and it's tight spaces. It's, it's making quick decisions. It's fitting balls in. Being smart, being efficient. You learn a lot in that session and then obviously in the game. Jackson Dart today, it was the next step, right? He saw more confidence out of him. Progressions. He's got a way about him. And I even was saying like, how am I going to frame this? As we were driving back over the bridge to come back to the convention center to do the show after practice. Now cough first before I frame it. The best way I can frame it is like there's this, there's this like ease and sense of confidence where you don't almost like he's a byproduct of lane right Lane Kiffin and I and I've talked about it so many times. Quarterbacks are byproducts of the, the coach that they played for for two or three, four years in college. Lane is an absolute madman, right? And he. He's like crazy with all this different stuff. And I mean that in the most positive way. And an offensive guru and all these. You know, he's got 3,000 plays and this and that, and they want to do tempo or go back from this. But when you hang out and you talk to Lane, the chillest dude in the world, kind of talk, low talking, and everything's easy going. Southern Cal guy by trick, you know, like. And with Jackson, even though he's a Hunter and a Fisher and he's more like. I've gotten to know him a little bit and interviewed him, he's more that kind of guy. But when you see him on the field, it's not a bunch of rock. It's not Baker Mayfield, right? And it's not this, like, mad, like scientists, almost like a Dylan Gabriel. That vibe you get where it's like Matrix, as you called it, or Terminator with the numbers flashing. He's just like kind of. It's like this relaxed confidence that he carries himself with. With that I. I have gotten to appreciate. Even though it's a little bit of a drop down the chute and a little bit of like that short stop, it's. I don't want to call it three quarter. It's a little bit of like this motion. I don't see many balls batted down the line on tape. I haven't seen any here. Okay. And he's just got a smooth stroke and everything is kind of in rhythm. And. And when you watch, like, if you get like five throws from Jackson dart, you're like, yeah, that was good. Yeah, that was good. I don't know. What do you want me to tell you? Right? So that's why I'm. I. I was kind of thinking in my head, how am I going to explain this? Because I want to be able to bring what I'm seeing and explain it to everyone who's tuning in. And so there's nothing that jumps out. Like, oh, my gosh, you see Jalen Milrone, his speed and how unbelievable he is in the open field. You see Josh Allen with his arm. You see Lamar and the Playmate. Like, it's not that. It's just like the consistency, the sweet stroke of the ball, timing, trajectory, ball placement, getting it out on time. And he's. It's like one of those things where you. You over time just grow to appreciate. And that's what I'm seeing with Jackson darts, what I've Seen on tape. It's what I'm starting to see this week in practice. It's not going to be in your face. There's no, like, specific thing that he does exceptionally well. It's the whole package. And you're starting to see him just kind of emerge as the guy who's like, I got this under control. That's Jackson Dart. They're not looking for him, like, the yelling and screaming. They're not looking for him to, like, get in the huddle or get to the line. They're looking for him. They're looking to him as the leader because he's got this under control, and that's what I'm seeing. And so it's fun to watch. There are certain throws. I mean, I can take you through a comeback route. He threw on time. Ball was the perfect trajectory. Got it over the linebacker, right out the sideline, right there. I mean, there were several throws today where I was like, that was a great throw. And I loved everything about it, mechanically. Trajectory, placement, all those things. But it's. It's one of those. He's one of those guys that you just. The more you watch is, the more you start to appreciate him. So that. That's the best way I can explain the experience so far with Dart.
- [46:30]
A
The entire time you're talking about him, all I'm thinking about is the, you know, the old Braves pitcher, Greg Maddox.
- [46:34]
B
Yes.
- [46:35]
A
Couldn't throw heat, couldn't throw whatever, but he was just smarter, always right with the right ball, knew how to attack hitters. And for some reason, you know, I don't know if it's great. Greatest comp. But that's what's popping into my head. Because, you know, you're not. You don't watch Craig Medics Maddox and you're like, oh, wow, like, that's Clemens or Randy Johnson or those old fireball throwers.
- [46:53]
B
Yeah.
- [46:54]
A
But he was so good and so consistent that he was effective. I mean, the guy's a Hall of Famer, and he didn't really have a fastball. Yeah.
- [47:02]
B
And it's. It's interesting because I, I covered Jackson, Darton, Ole Miss and Lane Kiffin. I did games on the sideline three years ago now. I guess it was. I think it was the Kentucky game was one of them, maybe LSU and. And it was more, you know, they were running the ball a lot. I remember back then, Quinton Judkins and another really good back. And. And there was a lot of tempo. It was like. And so I kind of. I didn't Want to say I wrote him off, but I was like, I'm not sure this is going to translate. Like, this is not, you know, but he got. He got better. The offense kind of evolved this season. I watched his tape, and I'm like, oh, it's kind of. This is a different version. This is like the 4.0 version of Jackson Dart. And like, yeah, I. I'm struggling, too. I saw the Florida game. I saw the interceptions, the three interceptions. Two of them counted in that moment. But that's not really who he is. But what he is is the guy who was just laying it all on the line and just brought this, like, the competitive juice that you look for. And it was the most important thing in the entire world to him. And he was giving everything he had for a team that was kind of was up against it that day, against a Florida team that got better, a defense that got better, and he didn't have his best weapons happen. And, like, all those things. And Judkins was playing up at Ohio State instead of seeing it through with Ole Miss. So I just. I don't know. I mean, he's growing on me, man. It's the best way I can put it. He's growing on me, and I'm excited to watch the rest of this process. Finish up his tape. Talk to scouts and GMs who are talking to him. I want to hear about him on the board. I want to hear the stories from Nagy and GMs and guys who have been around him a little bit more, more this week. Like, I just want more. I want to hear more, because every step I go further down the road with Jackson, the more I like the guy as a player, you know?
- [48:52]
A
Yeah, I'm seeing the same things. And you talk about how you don't really see the mobility here. That's a big element of his game.
- [48:58]
B
Yes.
- [48:58]
A
I mean, that's something you haven't really seen showcased here. But I just want to reiterate the fact that this kid can. He moves pretty well. He can make plays with his feet.
- [49:06]
B
The other quarterbacks, and I'll kind of breeze through it. Riley Leonard, he's been. He's been perfect. Perfectly fine. Yes, he's been perfectly fine. He's. I like, he's got a sweet stroke, short to intermediate, good touch. I want to see more. I feel like it's. It's hard because he's so used to. In that offensive system and in a lot of situations here, too. They're asking for checkdowns. They're looking to your receivers maybe didn't run the right route, the protection broke down. So it's either check down or tuck the ball and run. I want to see him stretch it a little bit tomorrow. I want to see him in those situations in the red zone where he has to make a throw where he's got to make. I want to see him just like purposely, maybe not go to the easy, quick read in the outlet and try to extend the play instead of just running. I just want to see him utilize this opportunity to showcase a little bit more. That's it. It's not. It's not even a knock. It's part of partly circumstance, partly what he's been trained to do this past year in that offense and that. That football team with so much defense and run game. I just want to see a little bit more to see what. What's the true upside with this guy? Where is he as a passer right now? And I'm having a hard time getting all that. And we'll go back and we'll watch tape from practice and maybe I missed a throw here or there when I'm down in the trenches with you and all the meatheads down there. But. But that's. That's been Riley Leonard. And again, just love the fact that he's even here coming off the national championship game and participating. One of like two or three guys from that game that actually came down and competed. Jack Kaiser is another one at linebacker. Had an interception today, and that interception, a good segue came against Jaylen Milro. Jalen Milroe is a phenomenal athlete. Jalen Milroe is going to be awesome in the game on Saturday, I'm guessing because of his ability to extend plays. And a lot of times in an all Star game, there's going to be miscommunication. Guys haven't played in the system a long time. Quarterbacks with mobility can kind of erase a lot of problems. He's got a lot of tools to work with. He's got a big arm. He's got unique blend of speed and power as a runner. And I know you can sense a but coming. And there is, I thought his deep ball today, like, it's not even on like that post corner he threw, dropping it in beautifully. It's fascinating to me because when he go like when the trajectory is up and it's beyond like 20 yards, he's like deadly accurate, accurate. His deep ball is, like, up there. He throws the best deep ball of any of these quarterbacks. And I'm I'm including the time, I'm including Cam Ward, I'm including Shador. Right. But it's something about when he's actually got to do this and it's not this. When not. I'm sorry, if you're. If you're listening, it's not throwing the ball up, you know, up and getting. Getting arc under it and beyond 20 yards when he's got to rip it, he's really struggling. He's really struggling with his accuracy. And we've seen Josh Allen, we've seen Lamar Jackson, we've seen dudes. And this wasn't always the case. Remember, this was a league in the NFL. There was all pocket passers. It was all the Manning brothers. It was all Tom Brady. It was all like, you just go down like Dan Marino. Everything was pocket passing. It's different now. And guys, because their mobility early in their career, get opportunities to stay on the field because they can create and they can erase some problems. And the stuff that they're not ready to answer yet or the stuff that they don't have the accuracy yet to do, they can overcome it early and still develop. And we've seen those guys that I just mentioned, and there are. There are several others who have improved their accuracy at the next level. And that is the. That's the. The career arc that we're looking at. Jalen Milroe will have to make. And all it takes is one offensive coordinator, one head coach, one general manager, one quarterback coach that falls in love with this guy, and there's going to be more than one that says, hey, we got a starting quarterback right now. He's got a year or two left on his deal. He's aging. Whatever the circumstance is, let's bring Jalen in. We Talked to Eric DaCosta today, and we'll play that interview for you at some point with the GM series that we're going to do, and we're excited about it. And he was talking about Lamar coming in with Joe Flacco there. Right. And we've seen a lot of those kinds of circumstances before. That's going to be the. The type of situation he goes into. But the two things I'm seeing from Jalen through two days here, and the reason I'm comfortable talking about them is because it's the same things we're seeing on tape. Right. And it's not a surprise to anyone. This is breaking news. He's not accurate, short to intermediate. He's missing, and he's missing by sizable amounts. And that it's concerning. And I think, too, I want. I just feel like it's going fast for him. Right. And a lot of quarterbacks come here and it's happening fast. And I think he's getting frustrated at times. Right. When you miss it. I played quarterback and I didn't play it very well. So I have a great history of missing three or four throws in a row. And you start to press and you get frustrated, and then you get away from your mechanics. You don't play relaxed. It's like being a golfer. After you shank one, the next shot's tough. And you got to really, like, focus in, but you got to find a way to focus and still relax. Right. He's pressing. And we saw the Kaiser interception that started this whole conversation. He didn't see him. He didn't know where his eyes should go from one read to the next. And so there's just been a lot in his. So it's been. It's been challenging for Jalen again. I think tomorrow's another opportunity. I hope he shows some great things in red zone, and I'm pumped to see him in the game as he now gets a greater understanding, like all the quarterbacks, of what to, you know, where to go with his eyes and what the read requires of him. But it's been a challenging week, and I think that that's. That's very fair to say.
- [55:03]
A
I think it's fair and I. But I would also kind of agree with some of the things you said that the draft's not out tomorrow night. You know, he's got time. He can. If he has a great day tomorrow, you can only control what you control going forward. He could have a great day tomorrow. He can go to the combine. I hope he throws the ball there. He could throw the ball well there. He could throw the ball well. As Pro Day again, these are issues we've seen on tape. We've now seen him this week. There's only so much you can do about what's happened in the past. You can just maximize his opportunities going forward. Because, again, you're right. I don't want to repeat you, but I'll just echo it. There are other quarterbacks who have gone through this and gone on to have very successful NFL careers. No one's trying to, for lack of a better way of saying it, it's maybe too harsh burying Jalen Milro today. No, he's just had a tough week. And you're hoping that tomorrow will take the most of the opportunity on Thursday and that will get some positive momentum going and we'll see how it goes going forward.
- [55:54]
B
Yeah, absolutely. I think it's all fair and balanced and. And I'm excited to see where it goes from here. Dylan Gabriel. I was kind of up and down. I love him. We know. We know what his game is. I thought there were some throws where he was. He doesn't have Josh Allen's arm. I can confirm that. I double checked. I double checked today. He does not have Josh Allen's arm. So like the miles per hour, we'll have to get to the bottom of that. But. But he's got a perfectly capable arm. We talked a lot about him yesterday, so I don't think we have to go into a whole thing on, you know, the two. A comparison. Less. Less size.
- [56:31]
A
All of that is who we thought he was.
- [56:33]
B
Yeah, he is. Yeah. And I thought today it's just interesting because some guys progress, some guys regress and then progress again. Like, I think today was like almost a tiny step backwards, but he still made a lot of great throws. It just, it wasn't as consistent as you're used to seeing in a system that he knows, like he did in Oregon and how comfortable he was and how quick he. So these guys are swimming in it, man. Like, I always. I always remind myself he's throwing in this receiver for like the eighth time in his life on day two of practice. Okay. And then the next guy that he's throwing to is. He's thrown nine times before and. And he doesn't know. He's struggling probably at times to remember his. His offensive line coach, his name. Right. And he's just got to know the name of the offensive coordinator and the head coach. And there's just so much swimming through these guys brains and not, not to mention like, okay, now I'm throwing an NFL football and I've got different rules and I'm setting protections and I. This. The play calling is different from the verbiage we use at Oregon or Oklahoma or ucf. So like, I don't know, I just. I keep it all in perspective. I thought Dylan was a little bit up and down today. I thought Chuck was good from little Louisville. I thought he had a better day. It's good to see that. I thought Canada was pretty good. I thought Canada had a nice day. I'll look up his name. Taylor Elkersma. I believe that's how you pronounce it properly. We'll have the proper pronunciation tomorrow. We'll double check it before we get off the show. Laurier My dad spoke French Laurier from Canada. That's the school he played at. So I thought he had a really nice day. Swear to God, Like, I really thought, like the ball was coming out, better timing, like he was placing the ball in spots. So it was. Overall, it was a good day for the quarterbacks. They got better. And I'm excited to see tomorrow if Wednesday's the day for offensive and defensive line at the Senior bowl. Because it's the most physical day of practice, because they spend the most time in one on ones because it's full pads and all of that. Thursday is the day for me with quarterbacks. So we'll get into a lot more on that tomorrow. All right, well, wrap it up. But let's get into kind of a quick hitting stuff here.
- [58:39]
A
I wrap it up.
- [58:39]
B
We should probably go 50 more minutes. Who knows with us? But I want to kind of just rip through wide receivers not by, not by practice. Overall, what jumped out at you? A wide receiver. Then we'll get the tight ends and then the running backs. Saw more of running backs and linebackers today because of the physical nature than we did yesterday. So some guys I want to get to there as well. But who or was there anything that stood out to you at wide receiver today?
- [59:02]
A
I mean, Jack Besh is quickly becoming one of the bigger stories.
- [59:06]
B
I totally agree.
- [59:07]
A
And it's great. I mean, and he's just, he just looks so like again, we're talking about being a natural pass catcher. It is so it's like an instinct. It's not even a. Like some guys fight the ball or they have like, you tell. They're trying to look it in for him.
- [59:20]
B
It's.
- [59:21]
A
It's second nature, which puts him in a great, better, better position to produce after the catch. I think he's had any. He's again, another high energy guy. I saw him run over to Milro, jump up and do that chest bump. He's playing with a lot of joy. And I think it's incredible to watch considering everything.
- [59:39]
B
Yes, the passing of his brother Tiger and Princeton, we covered that yesterday. But to see a young man who's able to be this focused and to put the performance out like, all right. I legitimately think he belongs, belongs in day two of the draft. I legitimately think in a Rams style of offense with a lot of west coast principles, with his physical running after the catch, with his speed, which is, which is pretty impressive when you watch him go vertical with his strength after the catch, I think he's got a chance to Be a legit at least. So we're going to talk a lot about floors and ceilings, right? He doesn't have the elite. He's not going to be Carol Owens, he's not going to be Jamar Chase, he's not going to be Randy Moss, you know, but the floor is so damn high with this guy. When you're talking about a mid round prospect or a day two prospect, that there's a comfort level there. First of all, as a gm, like, all right, worst case, he's gonna be a number four receiver. It's gonna block his ass off. When we get him the ball, he's going to be able to break a tackle, he's going to play special teams, you know, like, like that. When you talk about all those things that floor keeps raising and Besh's floor is pretty high and then you start talking about art, but the ceiling's like kind of growing for me in the right system. I just think like, and I can't get it out of my head now. Nagy said Puka Nakua. And I'm not saying he's the same guy as Puka, but I got to remind you, there were 31 teams that didn't, didn't draft him in the first five rounds. And the teams and the geniuses, Les Snead, who's a good friend of mine, and Sean McVeigh is an absolute offensive genius. It took him four rounds to get it right before they got him right in the fifth. Right. So like we all missed on Puka. Even the team that drafted him missed on Puka to a certain degree. And so I think armed with that, I think kind of benefits. Not saying everyone in the league's like, well, he's the next Puka. I'm just saying like those similar traits of being strong, physical, unbelievable competitor, tough guy, willing to do anything for the team. I think, I think, you know, teams are looking for that and specifically the system that the Rams run and with a lot of west coast principles and run after catch stuff, I think he's going to have an opportunity as a day two picks to make a legitimate contribution in the NFL. And that's been fun to watch this week. Truly. Also at wide receiver, another guy who just keeps making plays, Jalen Noel. I thought his teammate, I thought he's Jaden Higgins, the bigger guy. Six, six three, right? What is he, 6, 02, 17?
- [62:22]
A
I think.
- [62:22]
B
Yeah, Higgins is. I written down, whatever.
- [62:26]
A
He's, he's the bigger of the 217, 603, 603.
- [62:29]
B
Yeah, six. Three and a half, 217. Big guy, right? Thought he really struggled in the first day. Very surprised by that. But today I thought he played better, more just steady performance. A couple contested catches, running after catch, just. I thought it was better. But when you're comparing those two. And a lot of people had Higgins rated higher, people I talked to throughout the year than his teammate, Jalen Noel, who's only 5, 5, 9 and a half and only 196 pounds and has short arms, 30 and 1, 8 inch and small hands, 8 and a half inch hands small. He's been like, I don't. Tez Johnson from Oregon has been the hardest guy to cover at just £156 because he's so damn quick. But also this game and the practices make it easier for a guy like that because it's not as much like press in your face. You're not dealing with 10 other guys in the field. A lot of these Reps, you know, 10 other guys for 20 other, you know, 21 other guys. Right. So Tez has been the most, like, has the most wow factor in terms of getting separation. But Noel has been kind of just the most steady. Really, really good wide receiver here this week. And the thing I wrote down today that stood out to me the most, excellent hand, eye coordination and excellent balance as an athlete, like the control and balance that he has. And like, things would be thrown at him last minute, just like, no problem, pluck, take it, take it and go. You know, advance it. So I don't know. I just like his game a lot. He's not a first round pick, probably second round, worst case, third round, wherever he winds up going. But I see a slot receiver. I see a really good number three. If things work out perfectly for him in the right system, maybe he's a really good number two. But Jaylen Noel's having a really good week.
- [64:17]
A
I think you see the same thing on tape with him too. Great tape. Yeah. Very tough.
- [64:21]
B
Oh, and he's. He's fast too, right? Yeah.
- [64:23]
A
Oh, yeah. Juice, by the way, right away, I do think that Hagen still has a chance to go ahead of him because of the size. It's easier to find routine. I shouldn't say it's easier. Teams have had more success finding smaller slot receivers later in the draft than they do finding the. Those guys that make plays on outside. On the outside. So they tend to, to maybe push or reach for them a little bit. But I want to ask you about another guy.
- [64:42]
B
Yeah.
- [64:42]
A
And that's Washington State's Kyle Williams feels like he's popped a little bit. I know you said he. Don't put words in your mouth. I think you said that. He fought the ball a little bit. You see the speed?
- [64:52]
B
Yeah, he. I wrote my notes. Fight. He's fighting the ball today. I saw that a couple times. But he's 6-622-08. Ran the fastest zebra in time. The miles per hour on the zebra technology that we've talked about, which I absolutely love. NFL scouts, more importantly, absolutely love. See, like, true play speed. He had the fastest time, I think fastest wide receiver yesterday. And outside of defensive backs, he was the fastest player. I think it was on the first day of practice. We'll get those numbers for you tomorrow. And I'd rather look at him Thursday and say, okay, from the whole week because. Because you don't know how many guys get the chance to actually, you know, get to top gear in a certain practice, especially the first day. So let's get to the end of the week. But Kyle Williams, clearly one of the fastest players here. Okay, yeah, fighting the ball a little bit. I saw that today. But still just really sudden and fast for a guy who's got good speed, so certainly has helped himself. The other thing I'll say to another player, just mention them real quick. We. Daquan Felton, it's a freaking freight train, man. Like, I don't know how great he's gonna be, but it's so hard to find a big physical ex who can run through dudes after. After the catch. I think he's probably going to be like a number four in the league, but someone who can be an offensive chess piece. He's 6, 4 and 3 8. 222 pounds. You know, we're talking about just a big dude, dude, long arms. I. I wrote. Here are my notes. I'll just read them to you. Segmented route runner. Like not smooth, not quick. In and out. It's got a gear down. Getting in and out of brakes. Not fluid, but bigger receivers like this, there's two types of separation, separating with your quickness, like getting in and out of brakes. You like the. The Tez, right?
- [66:39]
A
Yeah.
- [66:40]
B
Tez Johnson. Talking about Jalen Noel. Talk about guys who just win with quickness and then the other guys win with their size and muscle in players. And Daquan Felton's going to have to be one of those guys. It's like he's a monster. He swallows the ball too. And he doesn't have the biggest hands, which is Surprising. Nine and a half just looking at this, but he just. He just engulfs the ball with his hands. Long, very long. And also he just. The way he runs after the catch, I wouldn't, as a db, want to have to take this guy down if he gets just a little bit of a run. Runway. So power back. He's another guy who jumped a little bit. I don't want to say he had this awesome day. It's not what I'm. I'm saying here, but I was impressed with him. But the most intriguing pass catcher to me today, I don't want to say the best, but the most intriguing pass catcher to me in either practice, okay, Was the tight end from Miami, Elijah Arroyo. He's an F tight end. He's not a blocker. Got it. Okay. He just has first round traits. He's not a first rounder. I'm not saying it, but, like, when you look at him on the field, he looks like an all pro F tight end. He's athletic. He gets in and out of breaks. He's got all. And I just keep watching him and I see it's not spectacular plays. It's just like getting open make, you know, and getting down the field and doing things that most tight ends, the rest of the tight ends kind of, I don't want to say can't, but they don't have the level of, like, athleticism that's fair. Right. To do. He's the most athletic tight end here, period. Ferguson has been awesome. He's the. He's the. The most consistent. He's the. The best football player of the tight ends right now. Mason Taylor's probably the most complete package in terms of football player matching athletic ability. But this Arroyo guy just keeps intriguing me. Why was he so awesome against Florida and then the production didn't match up the rest of the year? Was it a Cam Ward thing? Was it the system? Was it all the other weapons? I don't know. So I'm dying to find out more about him. Why aren't we talking about him as one of the top two or three tight ends? Why is he jumping? Why is he going to false start in team drill? You know, like, there's piece. It's almost like being a private detective.
- [69:01]
A
I was gonna say a puzzle.
- [69:02]
B
Yeah. Puzzle. How.
- [69:03]
A
Right?
- [69:04]
B
So, like, now I'm getting more pieces and I'm just curious. We're just gonna leave it. I'm very curious to find out what I'm about to find out about this young man and where he Is in his. In his development. What he is, is, you know, off the field, his work ethic. I'm just dying to know more about him. And that's. That is a compliment because he's so intriguing and what he. He's done that I think he's going to make a lot of people go back a lot of coaches who are just getting the process, offensive coordinators, tight end coaches, and be like, yo, so what's our grade on that Arroyo guy? Wait, what? Third? Fourth? Third. Why? You know, so very intrigued by him.
- [69:45]
A
I love when you get players like this because you are like a dog with a bone. And most. Most players you watch. You watch four tapes and you feel good about what you see. You feel good about. This is who this guy is. You know, we've done it long enough that, you know, when you do the background, you do the work. So I love it when you get a guy that you got to spend a little more time in your mind on, and you will get to the bottom of it by the end of this cycle. And you get a few of these players every cycle, right?
- [70:08]
B
Yes.
- [70:08]
A
There's always a few that you're like, why I. Why is he not. Why is there not more buzz up about him? Why am I not getting phone calls about him? Why is he not getting put in these mock traps? And I love it when it happens because it makes you. I just think it keeps you excited. It makes you work a little bit harder.
- [70:24]
B
Drives me crazy, right? It drives.
- [70:26]
A
So it's kind of cool when it happens. And he's. Listen, you saw it on tape. You see it here. I'm seeing exactly the same thing. The talent is so intriguing.
- [70:35]
B
Yeah. The running backs, I thought Damian Martinez from. From Miami, the transfer, Oregon, very productive early in his career. Very productive at Miami the first day of practice, you can't tell because they're not doing as much inside run. It's not as physical. Like, so just like we could see with the offensive lineman and defensive lineman, you could start to see, like, the real. On Wednesday, you could start to see the real running back and linebacker. Okay. The first day is like, yeah, we see some athletic stuff, some cover stuff. But, like, now, why are they here? Okay, well, Damian Martinez showed me why is it, why he's here and why he's considered by a lot of scouts as one of the top seven, eight running backs in the class, in a class that's absolutely freaking loaded. And. And I saw it today, and it's this combination of running low behind his pads with vision and patience. And I kept putting in my notes. He is, he is patient. He's got great vision, but he's still decisive. Like, it's, it's. We're always advancing it. I love the way he ran the ball. And I'm going to let you, you go wherever you want on these running backs. Laquint the Allen from Syracuse. Allen from Syracuse. My gosh, he catches the ball well, plucking over his shoulder, adjusting to the ball. That jumped out to me with him. And a lot of people think he might be in the, in the mix for, like, top five, six. I mean, there's so many guys. I don't know. Like, we obviously. No, Ashton Jinty is going to be the first running back off the board. Probably a top 15, 20 pick, depending on team need. But then you start getting into, like, all these other backs. We got North Carolina, we got Iowa, we got the Michigan back. We got like, there's so many backs. And so to see them, the guys who came here and elected to compete, it's giving them an opportunity. And I'm telling you, there are some guys in the league who think La Quint Allen is going to be one of the top six, seven running backs. And when you say that, it's like, so what? He's like the sixth or seventh running back. Take him. When you say that this year, you're saying he's maybe better than a Cam scaboo from Arizona State. You know what I mean? Like, that's. You're saying a lot when you put him. So it's going to be really interesting to see how this thing shakes out. I think he's done a lot for himself. Devin Neil, I just love his run style. He's going to be probably like in the like 15 range of running backs taken. But you see the low to ground, the center of gravity just weaving in and out. Got to see a little bit more from him today. And I know there's another guy that you're really intrigued by too.
- [73:02]
A
Yeah, the Delaware running back Marcus Yarns. I've seen enough here to get excited about the Juice. Haven't watched a lot of tape. It'll be fun to go back and watch him. He does not look like a fish out of water here, so.
- [73:11]
B
No.
- [73:12]
A
Which is great. So caught the ball well. Caught the ball well. Another guy that we loved coming in, RJ Harvey, ucf. I don't know if you saw this. He ran a wheel or a seam route and man, he could. He separated a little bit. He's not a big dude, he's. I think he's under five'eight but he's compact, he's strong, and he tracked the ball really well on that play. And just to get back to Martinez a little bit because, you know, he's my guy. You know, I love him. Love the way he hugs blocks. You know, you talk about that patient and that vision he gets. Get skinny and he. And he. Like, there were times today where the edges were trying to close in on him from the outside. They'd beaten their blockers, but because he had hugged the block so well, they couldn't get to him. I just, I think he's an impressive back. Not only here, but when you watch.
- [73:53]
B
The tape, I'm going to read this list to you real quickly. Bear with me. Producers are annoyed. Camera. Camera. Folks. Phenomenal. Saving our life this week. They're annoyed. It's time to go to dinner. Oh, reservations tonight. We got reservations tonight. Mention Marissa and I actually we. We cheated last night. Noble South, I've talked to you guys about this. If you're ever down in Mobile, Alabama, if you ever get to the Senior bowl one day, love to have you come join us. Noble south is one of the great dining experiences in. In the south and, and truly like one of my favorite restaurants to go to. And we, we got last night to. To meet Chris the owner who's a chef by trade and had a place over. I'm gonna say it wrong. Point. Point clear. Maybe somewhere around here. Found this property in downtown Mobile, fell in love with it. He's the executive chef owner of the place. He started it. He is a young son named.
- [74:50]
A
Noble's the middle name.
- [74:52]
B
Noble Warren. Noble is his name. Is his first. First and last name. Okay, named name the place. Obviously. Noble South Warren. Turns out we just found this after the fact. I did a whole thing early on in talking featuring Noble south and all the dining places we like. We talked the place we went Chuck's Fish on Monday night. Chris Eddings and his. My relationship with him and getting to know him in Tuscaloosa and here in Mobile. And so no, Noble south is a place we featured as well and said, you know, when we get down to Mobile, we're going to bring the whole crew and we're going tonight. We're going tonight. I'm not going to tell you what time, but we're going tonight. And last night we were going to go somewhere else to eat and these two thickest thieves, Marisa and Mensch are like, yeah, but can. Why don't we Just go tonight, we'll sit at the bar. I'm like, fine, we'll go. So we go and Chris is telling, he's in there and he's, he's got a new manager. He's training all the stories. He, he tells us the story. I just assume because they DM me. And we're like, hey, thanks for the shout out. Really appreciate it. A while back when we talked about him, I think in October or November, you know how he found out? I mean, you know now, but how he found out. His son's a huge football fan. Warren Noble restaurant named after him. He's 14 years old now. Said since he's like been like 9 or 10, he's been doing his own mock drafts. So he's one of us. He's like insane, just like the rest of us, right? They're driving in the car to go somewhere and we just start. I start on some rant about this place down in Mobile, Alabama and it happens to be their restaurant named after the kid who loves doing mock drafts. And he said, and Chris said, I gotta just say thank you. Not even about like, yeah, it's wonderful that you gave a shout out to the restaurant. But it was like one of the only times with the 14 year old son that I was cool. And he's like, so thank you for that. It was a true moment. So, yeah, he was great. And we're looking forward to going back there tonight. I know I was going somewhere.
- [76:52]
A
I know I've got Noble south in my mind, right?
- [76:55]
B
Running backs. And so now I get everyone even more pissed off behind the scenes here. Running backs. Just when we tell you like it's, it's kind of an honor this year to be in the top five, top seven, top ten. Just listen to these names real quick. Quickly. Ashton Jinty, like generational talent. Boise State. Caleb Johnson, I'm higher on than most. I just love him from, from Iowa, Omari and Hampton. Dudes in the league absolutely love him. He's, he, he just grinds through yards. Okay, Jordan James, remember Jordan James, like the phenomenal, highly productive on Oregon undefeated team for the vast majority of the season. Beyond that, Dylan Sampson, the offense ran through him with a freshman quarterback. Right attempt Tennessee. Then you've got Cam Scabo. The best performance of the entire postseason. And, and then the season he. How he wasn't invited to New York for the Heisman is beyond me. Quinshon Judkins, national champion Ole Miss transfer. Help. Help take them to that next level. In addition to his teammate Trayvon henderson From that 77 yard run on the screen or whatever. It was like the speed that he showed explosiveness. Right. RJ Harvey just mentioned his name. Then laquint Allen. I've got Damian Martinez. These are all guys that are here. Trevor Etn, also here from Georgia. The former Florida transfer, brother and obviously well, well known career. And you get down to like guys like Khalil Mullings from Michigan, linebacker turn running back. Awesome year for Michigan. He's here. So Jarquez Hunter, Auburn, here. Burchard Smith, that's my guy. Remember him? Burchard Smith, also cfp, playoffs, smu. He's here. So this class is just loaded with talent.
- [78:35]
A
Right? Good luck sorting it out.
- [78:37]
B
Yeah. Two linebackers really quickly before. We'll let you go. We'll let you go. And thank you for, for sticking with us here because I think the, the janitorial staff's going to come and shut down the Convention Center Center. But, but I just, I want to mention these two guys because the effort and the playmaking ability and it's frustrating as a linebacker in the first day of practice because you're having to cover these smaller running backs and you're out on an island and it's too big of an island and it sucks. But today they get their revenge because you're going inside team drill, inside run, all that stuff. Demetrius Knight, and you just talked about yarns from Delaware. He had his welcome to the NFL moment. Moment. The Delaware running back coming up to the big leagues today. Demetrius Knight. Absolutely trucked him. I'm on the plane and I don't, I didn't have my list on me. I'm on the plane watching tape of South Carolina. I didn't real. I knew they had the linebacker to me. I didn't know his number. I kept writing down, I put in my phone notes, my figure out who 17 is. Because this guy, all he does is make freaking plays. He's okay in coverage. When he turned him loose on a Blissey everywhere. Every tape I was watching, 17 was making a play after play. Then he knocks Delaware out cold today. And then you can see he's the alpha dog, okay? He like, everyone's rallying around him. He's what you think of when you think of a mike linebacker, right? Everyone looks to him. Make the call. The leadership. His instincts are awesome. He's a heat seeking missile. I hate when people use that phrase. I'm not sure why I did. But like honestly, when he gets some, when he gets the picture, his ability to get From A to B and the effort and the closing burst is awesome. Then the other guy I'll leave to you the Georgia linebacker, Small Munden. And I've had a. An emotional roller coaster relationship with Munden as a prospect dating back two years ago, right when we started to look at him potentially coming in the draft, ups and downs, injuries, all that stuff. But where is he now? What are you seeing?
- [80:39]
A
Well, I've, I've always been higher on him than where I've seen other people rank him. I just think he's a guy that's physical goods. He was banged up a little bit this year. I think he missed some time and maybe that's why some people have a little bit under the radar. But when I watch him, he's a physical, rangy run defender. I think he's a guy that can cover a little bit. You saw that in practice today. You saw the coaches getting fired up about the way way he was playing. You're talking about a guy played at Georgia also flash as a pass rusher. I just, there's a lot. He's a versatile player. I love the way he plays the game and it surprises me that he hasn't jumped up, but I think he might be moving up boards a little bit with the way he's playing because again, he's coming out of that, that Georgia program. And when you watch the tape, I mean I remember I throw on the tape, I was like, why this guy can play, man.
- [81:24]
B
Yeah. Yeah, he can. I I'm excited to see more. I think, I think he could be a day two pick and I don't think a lot of people thought that coming in the year after the, the year he had last year, it's been really cool to be here. Like really cool. First year since I was a senior in college that I hadn't been at the Senior bowl was last year. So to be back and to catch up with old friends and to have general managers and head coach like talking to Mike Tomlin today and John lynch and like to see like like excited for the show. Mensch got his first like welcome to Mobile celeb welcome to Mobile moment walked in and gave him a men she good. No they didn't wait said hello. Love the pod so men just feeling some love here in Mobile. Most importantly it's just cool to see people in the league excited about what we're doing to have a couple GM sit down down with us. We're going to do the series that I've mentioned. We'll figure out how we're going to do it and keep you informed. But thank you for watching. Please keep tuning in. We need some likes and subscribes. That's what they tell me. It's like algorithms and all this other crazy stuff that's over my head. But if you get a minute, click the buttons, you know what they are. And we're going to be here again tomorrow. This is two days at the Senior Bowl. We've got an awesome group with us and take him out to dinner and show some appreciation tonight. We'll be right back at it tomorrow and Thursday. Please check us out on social media. We talked to Mensch last night. We had to come into Jesus meeting with men. He's changing his freaking X Twitter handle. It's not going to be Scouts Inc. Mentioning.
- [83:00]
A
Feel free to send me suggestions.
- [83:02]
B
Yeah, we want suggestions. There we go. Let's get some suggestions. I think it should be Mention good at. Mention good. He thought maybe.
- [83:11]
A
I'm good, man.
- [83:11]
B
I'm good, man. Got it.
- [83:15]
A
I wonder if they sound bad now. I thought they sent a good.
- [83:17]
B
Yeah, send us some better ideas. He needs a new X handle. I can't say Scouts Inc. Mensch anymore in the show. So we're gonna get that done this week. But check out all of our stuff. We'll be on social media. We got Instagram. It's Team McShade 13. What's yours?
- [83:30]
A
Scouts Inc.
- [83:31]
B
Bench. Oh, my God.
- [83:31]
A
No, no, it's S. Bench 76. It's even worse.
- [83:34]
B
Yeah, I mean, we'll get working on it, but. But we'll be back tomorrow, third day, final day of practice this week and we got so much more to share. But again, thank you for joining. We appreciate it. Everyone on video, Spotify, the YouTube video, Apple, wherever you get your podcasts, please keep hanging with us as we work out through the kinks. But we will be back tomorrow on Thursday for the third and final day of practice. Excited to share with with you what we see. Must be 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18/ plus and present in D.C. gambling problem, call 1-800- GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com, call 1-888-78-97777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit Gambling Helpline ma.org or call 1-800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text Hopeny in New.