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The McShay Show
The Latest Intel on Lane to LSU, Golding at Ole Miss, Penn State’s Next Move, and DeBoer at Alabama
01:02:49
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- [00:00]
Steve
Foreign.
- [00:05]
McShay
Boy. There's a lot to cover on the coaching front today. So much so we're bumping tape. Trues to Tuesday, Kiffin hits the ground running in Baton Rouge. We've got intel you're not getting anywhere else. Plus, Jimmy Sexton is the most powerful man in college football. Kiffin and the subsequent SEC dominoes made that more obvious than ever. And it's also bad news for Penn state fans. Just 143 days until the NFL draft. I've got to ask you good men.
- [00:37]
Steve
I'm great, man.
- [00:38]
McShay
Roll my beat, Tuck. Hey, Steve.
- [00:58]
Steve
What's going on? Anything good?
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McShay
Just a couple things.
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Steve
Just a couple things.
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McShay
Let's get right into it.
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Steve
I can't wait.
- [01:06]
McShay
Lane Kiffin. You know he had four 10 win seasons at Ole Miss. It's tied with Vought. Vought had a stadium named after him. Vought Hemingway. The McShay show is presented by FanDuel. FanDuel's got it all. Same game parlays, quick bets for jumping in live and your way so you can build the bet that fits your play. Plus, don't miss out on holiday offers and surprises all month long. Download the FanDuel app or head to FanDuel.com McShay to get started. Must be 21 and older and present in select states or 18 and older and present in D.C. kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800- gambler or visit rg-help.com, call 1-888-678-97777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut. Eight players drafted last year, the most since Arch Archie Manning's class in the 1970s. Okay. Lane stayed six years. Best six year run in Ole Miss history. A historic year this year. So why leave? We know why leave now. It's because of the calendar. And I think it's January 2nd, right? Is. Is. Is. Is a huge day on the calendar with recruiting or portal. I believe at that point the calendar is a disaster in college football. We could do a whole show on that. We're not here for that today. Yeah, the. The why now is is obvious because. And. And we'll also get into what he tried to pull off with Kevin Carter. The AD mission in terms of coaching throughout the College Football Playoff and even waiting for that Alabama Auburn final to show up. And it wasn't just about coaching in the SEC championship, although that was a big reason why. We'll get to all of it. But why leave Ole Miss? Everyone says, well, you're doing it here at Ole Miss. You're you're having these 11 win seasons, you're. You're playing better than LSU. You've got the supporting staff, you've got the support of Oxford, you've got all the money you need, right? So why leave the interesting part? I had a lot of conversations last night and even this morning we were late taping the show because I've been on the phone and texting and calling with people. At the end of the day, there were factors, right? Family is always a factor. The cachet of a job is a factor. But I can tell you on good authority, the number one most important reason why Lane Kiffin is in Baton Rouge today and not Oxford High School recruiting. At the end of the day, that's why high school recruiting portal is fruitful. The transfer portal brings in a lot of good players. And when you hit the portal the way Lane Kiffin has hit it the last couple of years, think about that defense in 2024. Think about what he was able to bring in, even his quarterback from Division two, right? Trinidad Chambers. Come. Yeah, I mean, and, and he handpicked him and he was. Chambers was like 260something, right? Steve in the, in the portal rankings at quarterback, nobody liked him. Lane did. But the Portal, while fruitful, is also dangerous and it's inconsistent. Look at Florida State. Look at what Mike Norvell has tons of talent from the portal. But every year, if you're relying on the portal, you've got to coach a bunch of guys, young men up into your system, your scheme. You've got to get them all to work together. Sometimes there's reasons why they're in the portal and it's not a foundation, right. It's not the consistency. This episode is brought to you by Fox 1. Fox 1 is now live stream all your Fox favorites together in one place from NFL on Fox to big noon Saturdays with Fox one. You get it all live. Start your seven day free trial today. Offers are subject to change. Go to Fox one for complete terms and conditions. Fox one streaming now. They had to rely a lot on the portal at Ole Miss. And we knew about it with the players they brought in, especially in the defensive side a year ago that we saw this year on both sides of the ball, especially on the offensive side at lsu, you have the state of Louisiana in your backyard. It's the hotbed of NFL talent in terms of per capita and major college programs in that state. And his recruiting creates a foundation. The high school recruiting at LSU in the state of Louisiana creates a foundation like no other avenue in college football. So if the goal is to become the next Nick Saban in college football, LSU is the place to do it. Yesterday, prime example. Fresh off the plane, getting screamed at by Ole Miss fans, understandably so. Frustration. Best, best season in Ole Miss history. And you're going to get on that private plane and there's a second private plane to bring some other coaches from that staff, family members to fly to Baton Rouge to accept the job. Yesterday, fresh off that plane, what do you, what's the first thing you see after the, the crowds cheering for Lane and, and the staff members and the family and everyone from Baton Rouge and. Just like the polar opposite of what we saw when he's leaving Oxford.
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Steve
Right, right.
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McShay
But the first thing that Lane sends out of substance is a picture with the number one recruit in the land. ESPN's number. ESPN 350. Number one recruit. Excuse me, Lamar Brown, defensive tackle.
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Steve
Yes, Dud.
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McShay
Defensive tackle. So when we look at that, right, Steve, I mean, I've been asked that question more than any other question is why? And I, I can tell you on good authority the answer is the high school recruiting. And, and, and listen, Ole Miss was going to match the money. It's, it's seven years, 12 million with incentives beyond. So we're talking about $90 million. He could have got that same same amount of money Ole Miss was giving him basically carte blanche with, with money for, for his roster. Right. The collective. And LLSU has committed 25 to $30 million depending on the reports and who you talk to per year, both for high school recruiting and for the portal. But what you can do at LSU is you can create a foundation of players who come in as 18 year old freshmen and develop them and if they're not ready right away, you can wait till their sophomore year, you know, and so that foundation is going to be different at LSU than it was at Ole Miss. And at the end of the day, with Lane Kiffin, where he is right now personally, sobriety, family, life back intact, comfortable in his own skin, just knows who he is in his mind. He's more ready today, more mature, more advanced as a coach and as a person than he's ever been before. He's been, he was, he thought he was ready for this in his 20s and 30s. He's now at 50 years old, more capable than he's ever been before. Play caller, talent evaluator, program runner. And for all the winning he's done and all the programs he's built and all the different things he's done, he's never been a championship head coach and this is where he believes he can do it. And the reason is high school recruiting. And so when you, you look at, and I don't know, Tucker, if we have that, the picture that he's him in the, the office with Lamar, Lamar Brown. But yeah, there it is. Welcome home. Lane. Lane Kiffin. That's Lamar Brown, the number one recruit in the country. Lamar Brown grew up going to Tiger Stadium. He was going to lsu. But Lane's going to make sure that he secures that nothing changes. New head coach, same commitment. And this is what's going to happen there. They're going to wind up being, it's going to be a recruiting hotbed. And I did some digging and talked to some people and they're like, check out the, check out the NFL talent that comes from the state of Louisiana. It's not number one in the country. I don't know if we have that list in front. There we go. This is at most NFL talent mensch. Look at this list by state. Texas has 304 players. Florida has 287 players. California is number three with 200 and 287. Florida, 278 for California, 221 for Georgia, 105 for North Carolina, 102 for Louisiana. You say, well, McShay, that's the six on the list. But it's ahead of Ohio, it's ahead of Michigan, it's ahead of every other.
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Steve
State and Georgia and Florida right next door. And Texas is not far away.
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McShay
Well, my point is in Texas you have Texas and Texas A M and TCU and Texas Tech, right?
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Steve
Yeah.
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McShay
In Florida you have Miami, you have Florida, you have Florida State. In Georgia you have Georgia and Georgia Tech and those and those. The Carolina schools that come pluck, the Florida schools that come pluck in North Carolina, they don't all go to unc. Some go to unc, some go to NC State. But, but you've got, you've got Clemson in South Carolina coming up to pluck right in Louisiana. If you just put a barrier around that, you're the only major college football program in the state. Think about all the schools in California when you see that list near the top, right. The uscs, the UCLA is the cows like the Stanfords.
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Steve
So, right.
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McShay
This, this is unique. And now he's got it in his backyard at his disposal. And so after talking to people who are in the know, and you know, I have a relationship with Lane, you know, I know people around. Listen, the best part about Sitting in this seat, whether it's about the NFL draft or college football. I'm not a reporter. I'm not Marty Smith being held hostage for 20 something hours in the Ole Miss facility or Marty Smith. Marty's a friend of mine, man. And no, here's. There isn't a better dude. There isn't like a more fun dude to be around. Like I, some of my, like, I don't want to overplay my relationship with Marty, but we text and we like, we work together and we did some things. Marty's the best man. He's entertaining, he's engaging, he's a great storyteller and he gets information because he's so much fun to be around and people respect him and people appreciate him. That was a shitty spot to be in for Marty, but he still was in the middle of it and it was still good for him in his career. But the. But you can't. When you're at an ESPN or CBS or an NBC or. Absolutely. There's a news desk and there's. We've got to have multiple sources and all that. I'm not reporting anything. The beauty of this seat, Steve, is I get to tell our audience what I'm hearing and people can go with that information and be informed with that information and know that I'm not Pete Thamling it. You know, I'm not Adam Scheftering it. I'm not saying being a report that I've multiple source, I've sourced out and all that. I'm just telling you this is what. When I'm talking to college coaches, NFL coaches, general managers in college, general managers in the NFL and the sources that we've built for 25 years of doing this. And I'm getting information, it allows us to be the first. When you ask me the question after the Texas A and M loss, lsu, I can say to you, hey, I'm not saying I definitively know the timeline, but I know enough people in Baton Rouge and I know enough people who are power brokers in college football to know Brian Kelly might not be there on Monday morning.
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Steve
Right.
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McShay
I've literally been kind of working that story since August that this is coming. And when James Franklin loses the big game right early in the season to Oregon and then they have another loss, I come out and say, James Franklin's not, he's not going to last. And then I tell you all the backstories about James Franklin and Pat Kraft and everyone else. And we're first to market on James Franklin. We're first to market on Brian Kelly because I'm not reporting it and I don't have to go through all the. I'm just telling you what I know and being able to share that information from agents, coaches, general managers all across the landscape. And it's a beautiful seat to be in. It's why I love this job more than any job I've ever had in my entire life. Yeah, I mean, listen, you could do.
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Steve
All those numbers, but let's just quickly. And you know, look, we could just quickly play the Game of Greatest LSU Players vs. Greatest Ole Miss players. And you get into Ole Miss, you're like, Eli Manning. A.G. brown was a pretty goddamn good receiver for Ole Miss. Do some calories to the running back there. I'm sure there's players that I'm missing. I'm just coming, I'm just reacting to what you're telling me.
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McShay
Yeah, the man, Archie Manning. Eli Manning. Yeah, yeah.
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Steve
You look at, you look at the lsu. Let's start talking about LSU and just go through the receivers. You know, Odell Beckham, Jr. Malik neighbors, Jarvis Lander is a hell of player. I'm not even sure he's near the top of the top LSU receivers. Justin Jefferson. Jefferson, you talk about what it means to put on that uniform and what. And let me say this, I want to be clear about this. If you play for Ole Miss, if you get a chance to put on that uniform, if you get a chance to play for that team, it means something. It's a big deal. I think that's a really good program. LSU is another level. It's just a different level. And I think when you're looking at recruiting and what's attracting kids, that just, it just comes out. And you can talk about all the numbers, but really a lot of it's just put yourself in the shoes of a 18 year old making that decision of whether or not you can play for a program with the history of an LSU versus a program that is done really well recently, but isn't. Doesn't have anywhere near the history of an lsu.
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McShay
According to data from the Sports Source analytics and Connor, our executive producer, sent me this and it's beautiful. Just backing up the points that I was just making in the. In the graphic that Tucker created for us. Louisiana has produced 757, three, four and five star recruits over the last 10 years, the seventh highest total in the country. But on a per capita basis, the state ranks fourth since 2016. Since the 2016 recruiting class, Louisiana has produced 68 NFL draft picks. The fifth highest total nationally behind Texas, Florida, Georgia and California. And I want to remind you, this is the most important part. LSU is the only SEC school in the state of Louisiana and the only major power house college football program in California. In Texas, I just mentioned Texas, Texas A and M, Texas Tech, TCU in Florida, Florida, Florida State, Miami, Georgia, Georgia, Georgia Tech, and the Carolina schools and the Florida schools. You're getting plucked everywhere. California, usc, ucla, Stanford, Cal. I'm missing a, a few, too. And then a bunch of other mid level schools. That's the reason. And when he calls Pete, Carol, Lane, Kiffin, and he calls Nick Saban, two of his mentors, and he asks them, what do I do? I trust you two more than anyone in this business. I've worked for both of you and I have a great deal of respect. And yes, I butted heads with you, Nick, and I couldn't stand you. Certain aspects of how you did the job and you couldn't stand me even more. So certain aspects of the way I carried myself, including, including my hat on backwards at a team meeting and, and kicking me out.
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Steve
Oh, man, I can only imagine.
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McShay
Oh, the stories. But those are his mentors and those are pretty damn good mentors to have, right? And they both told him, you got to take this job because it's different at lsu. And, and he, and he listened, you know, and Pete Carroll, in fact, told him that you're. Hey, listen, your dad, who you have more respect for than anyone in the world, who recently passed away, would tell you, lane, you got to take this job. And the high school recruiting, while it's not the only reason, it's the biggest reason why Lane took this job at lsu.
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Steve
I hear you, and this is a nuanced conversation, and I think you're, you're doing a great job of recognizing that in the way you're framing all this. And I just want to say this again. I like to put myself in other people's shoes. My ass is on that plane in Louisiana. I mean, there is no question that I would do the same thing if I was in Lane Kiff and shoes. I want to be very clear about that. I am surprised and I wonder what your take on this, too, is that him, that Lane and his team haven't handled this maybe a little bit better. And in the way that they're framing this, the way things are coming out, I think he could have handled this a little bit better. I'm not sure there's anything you're going to do to make Ole Miss fans happy I get that. But I feel like there's things he could have done to just, you know, kind of keep your head down and get out of town and. And just. That's the way to go. And there will be a time like you, You. You led this conversation and you're right about the success that Lane has had at Ole Miss. And I think there will be a time where you can go back and. And celebrate that. And I hope that Ole Miss fans are able to do that at some time. It's not today. Ole Miss fans don't give a shit about what he did there. Like, they don't care today because they have a team that's a national championship contender that he's walking away from. And that's. That is the reality of it. I mean, there is that. There is that reality of it, and that's the business. And again, I'm on that plane. I'm doing the same thing. But I'm not ignoring, like, what's going on there. And I'm not talking about what I did on the way out. I'm just saying I'm really sorry. I understand this is the right move for my family and I hope this team does well. And, you know, that's really about as much as I can say. And then you're out. Like. Like, I don't understand the talking about it. I don't understand releasing something and saying that, you know, I tried to coach this team to the playoff and they wouldn't let me. That's a behind the doors conversation. And once it's over, it's over. There's no reason to come out and talk about that. There's just not just move on. I get.
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McShay
I get everyone's position in this. LSU needed an answer 100%.
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Steve
The timing is the timing.
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McShay
The portal window in college football is the dumbest thing in the world. It's. So we're gonna. We're gonna put the free agency window and it's nuts. Todd, during the. During the NFL playoffs, the portal window is. Window is January 2nd through the 16th. That's when the College Football Playoff is going on.
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Steve
It is nuts.
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McShay
So LSU can't afford to not announce that hire. They have to have stability and portal transfers potential portal transfers to LSU have to know Kiffin's there. Agree Ole Miss and Kevin Carter also did nothing wrong. You can't let.
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Steve
No.
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McShay
And I think Kevin Carter had. I'm going to paraphrase, but something that you quote something along the lines of nationally. I get it. And I get why Herb Street And Nick and other people are saying on game day, you got to let them coach. The players deserve it, and they're not wrong. The players kind of got screwed over. And I'll get to the players in a minute. But his job isn't to serve the nation. Kevin Carter's the AD for Ole Miss. His job is to serve Oxford, Mississippi, Ole Miss alum and the Ole Miss school and program. And you can't allow a coach, let alone Lane Kiffin and his. The way he handles things. And, you know, I love Lane. We, Elaine and I are good. But Lane will be the first to admit he's. He's going to troll. He's going to, you know, the way he does stuff. And it's made him special and unique, and he is the face of college football right now. He has become, in the last couple of months, the face of college football. Nick Saban's gone. Jim Harbaugh's gone. Urban Meyer's gone. Kirby Smarts, the most successful coach in college football. Dabo Sweeney was the most entertaining when he was winning. Ryan.
- [22:50]
Steve
Ryan Day needs a little more love.
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McShay
Ryan Day needs a little more love, and he's now becoming the most successful college coach. And it was, it was Kirby for a, for a good chunk, and now it's shifted to Ryan Day in Ohio State. But Ryan's not. His star doesn't shine as bright.
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Steve
He doesn't sell like Lane sells.
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McShay
No. And, and by the way, that fits perfectly in Columbus mid.
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Steve
I'm guessing he's. I'm guessing he's fine with that.
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McShay
He loves it.
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Steve
Yeah.
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McShay
You know, so the, the, the most successful biggest names in college football are not the biggest stars. The biggest star in college football, and you could argue one of the biggest stars in all of. The biggest star in all of college sports is Lane Kiffin, 100%. And that has happened in the last 60 days. He was one of them. But through the winning and the drama of this situation, this is a movie. This is a Hollywood movie. This is a documentary in and of itself. We already had. We just had the Lane Kiffin documentary come out of six, six or so weeks ago. This is part two, and it's more interesting. The first one was pretty damn interesting, but this one is not made for Hollywood. Lane Kiffin is the face of college athletics right now. Okay? And you look at this situation, there's so many different layers, Steve. I, I've been on so many texting calls in the last 72, 90 hours, and, and then this morning, trying to put together the pieces okay. We were. And I started with this and I was talking about Marty Smith and Pete Thammel and, and all the, you know, and they have responsibility to multiple source and if you go to like you have that information. The beauty of what I have is I get a text on Friday night, we come on it and I send out kind of a cryptic text. I knew what was happening. I told you I knew what was happening. I told our group I knew it was happening to shut up. But it's exactly what I was told by unbelievably reliable source. An unbelievably reliable source who was with people who were actually texting with Lane Kiffin. Lane Kiffin may or may not have had a house purchased or, or finalized in Baton Rouge a week earlier. Did you know that?
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Steve
No. It's. I'm kind of surprised that no one caught on to that. They us. I, I feel like that's, I wonder whose name it was under Property things.
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McShay
Wife grew up in Gainesville, went to University of Florida, dad was a star quarterback there, went on to play for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers like so. So they did give it a good look. The difference was the stability and the structure and the high school recruiting element at, at lsu. But the reason I say all this is we were able then to come on our show at 3:30 and we're kind of counting down to that 4pm meeting on Saturday as Michigan Ohio State had just ended and we, we waited to talk about Michigan Ohio State because I had this information that we had to get out there because we didn't know any, any minute Lane could wind up deciding. And what I didn't know in that exact moment was. But I had, but we mentioned it on the, on the show on Saturday. I'm pretty sure according to my sources, Lane's not going to decide until after the, after the Alabama Auburn game, the Iron Bowl.
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Steve
Yeah.
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McShay
And the vast majority of that reason is what we stated on Saturday, playing in the sec. People around the country, I don't think understand unless you live in the SEC in that area, in that region of the country, don't understand how important that SEC championship is. The Big Ten championships, nice. You want to win it. But really it's about Ohio State, Michigan and now the college football player. The Big 12 championship's nice, the ACC Championship's nice. But it's not like it is ingrained into your being. It is part of your DNA. If you grow up in the sec, SEC country, winning the SEC championship means something. Okay? And so that was part of it. I'M also told and I want to. And I'm going to reiterate what I said on Saturday and expand upon it. Jimmy Sexton, the agent for a lot of these coaches as of last year, at one point he had 14 of the 16 head coaches in the SEC. Also had James Franklin and others, is the most powerful man in college football, maybe the most powerful man in all of college sports. He is to college football what Scott Boris was Major League Baseball and still is to a certain degree.
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Steve
Right.
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McShay
And folks at the league offices in New York City, you know, will disagree. But deep down in their hearts, they know that Boris is the most. Was and maybe still is, but definitely was for a large stretch of time, the most powerful man in Major League Baseball. David Falk was that to the NBA, Right. Jimmy Sexton, because it is the wild, wild west, because there is no governing agent. There is no. Roger Goodell is the most powerful man in college football and all of college sports. And so he's been able to puppeteer this whole thing. Okay.
- [28:44]
Steve
Yeah.
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McShay
He also knows his client and his client is Lane Kiffin, one of many clients, but currently the most important client that he has. And if you notice when Lane made the decision and it was finalized, all the, all the dominoes started to fall. Right. Ole Miss hires Pete Golding full time Florida, John Sumrall from Tulane and Dave Caldwell as the general manager. We'll get to that. Jake Rosenberg's going to join us. If it's not later this week, it'll be next week. But we're going to have him on. He's, he's with a separate company that is helping some of these colleges adjust to this new landscape and put together front offices. He comes from the Philadelphia Eagles good friend. I got connected with Jake Rosenberg through our good friend Joe Douglas who we played college ball with at Richmond, who's the general manager of the New York jets and worked a long time with the Philadelphia Eagles and Howie Roseman and is back with the Eagles now. And Jake was a good buddy of his and remains a good buddy with his. I was texting with Jake this morning and Jake said he just got a text from Joe, but Jake left the Eagles before the Super Bowl. Unfortunately he has regrets but not really to. To start this company to help schools adjust to the new landscape of nil and transfer portal and everything going on. It's too much for a college football head coach. A guy who's been a high school coach and coaching ball and now he gets coordinator job at a, at a college program. Now he's the head coach. It's. I, I mean, there are very few that can control it, even in the NFL. And even the ones that control it still have right hand men. You know, like when Belichick in his best years had Pioli. Right.
- [30:34]
Steve
Yeah.
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McShay
So to ask a college coach to handle all of this and essentially run an NFL franchise, it's, it's too much responsibility. And, and honestly, the difference is in College from the NFL is in the NFL, there's not recruiting. Your phone's not blowing up literally 24 hours a day, seven days a week. In college there is. And so Jake in this group has helped. And they're not the only ones helping. And certainly some, some programs have done it on their own, but Oklahoma has become one of the gold standards. I've talked to you about Jim Nagy, who was a good friend of ours, most recently prior to taking the GM job at Oklahoma, was the executive director of the Senior Bowl. Well, he, he helped place that and place the foundation and the structure there in Norman, Oklahoma. And now the big news coming out is it's not just Summerall coming from Tulane for Florida. It's coming with Dave Caldwell, who is an NFL general manager. The Jaguars, right? Yep.
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Steve
Yes, that's correct.
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McShay
And that they're, they're following that same lead of let's get it. Let's not just bring in a head coach in Summer all who's a great coach and program builder. Let's get a structure in place to help him succeed. And Jake Rosenberg and his group is, is, has been key in, in putting all that together. This episode is brought to you by American Eagle.
- [32:00]
Steve
Gift.
- [32:00]
McShay
Gift.
- [32:01]
Steve
Hooray.
- [32:02]
McShay
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- [32:39]
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McShay
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McShay
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- [33:36]
McShay
The domino started to fall when Lane's decision was made. And like I said, Ole Miss wisely, I don't know if he's going to be the long term answer and provide the success that Lane Kiffin provided, but they've got, they're holding on to this, this once in a, literally once in a lifetime opportunity. If you're an old Miss fan, you know exactly what I'm talking about. To make a run at a national championship. And Pete Golding gives them the stability they need. And I'll get into Pete and the player reaction to that in a little bit. But all of a sudden it's Golding at Ole Miss, summer all at Florida. Alex Goldish, usf, going to Auburn. Auburn, yeah. Great line, by the way. His quote when he had a player meeting. I don't, I don't golf, I don't fish. I don't have hobbies. I coach ball. Oh, really? That was good.
- [34:28]
Steve
I saw the beginning of it. I didn't watch the whole thing. Yeah, I didn't hear that one. No.
- [34:31]
McShay
Then, then. And also it's Arkansas, Ryan Silverfield coming in from Memphis. Right. And the deal was already done. And I, I don't even think it's, it's public knowledge or it hasn't been finalized, but there's a deal in place with Bob Chesney, JMU head coach, going to ucla.
- [34:51]
Steve
You're right. Some smoke about Fitzgerald going to Michigan State too. Right now that's, that looks like that's going to happen.
- [34:59]
McShay
But my point is, who's behind all of that super agent?
- [35:06]
Steve
Your guy, the puppeteer.
- [35:09]
McShay
The puppeteer. And also, and I started this by saying his biggest client is Lane Kiffin. And Lane Kiffin wants to be the next Nick Saban when his career is over. He wants to be viewed in that same light. Who wouldn't be? We all have goals. Nick Saban is the gold standard and he worked under Nick and he views. I, I took a lot of the, the elements of Nick that make him special and I'm going to do it in my own way with this more aggressive, in your face, offensive minded versus defensive minded approach. But I'm told there may have been an element too. And Kaylin DeBoer is a client of Jimmy or yeah, whoever the client is. But Jimmy Sexton represents Caitlyn DeBoer. And there was legitimate concern knowing the Alabama frenzy that occurs when it comes to the Iron Bowl. No different than Ryan Day winning all a million games and championships and everything else, but not beating Michigan. Had they lost in the Iron Bowl Saturday night, there could have been a knee jerk reaction. And all of a sudden that Bama job opens up. No way. Wow.
- [36:30]
Steve
Would have buried the headline. I mean, Elaine stuff's great, but oh my God.
- [36:36]
McShay
No one will ever admit this is true. So people are gonna be, oh, you know. But there was an element. Let's just, let's wait and see. Let's see who's playing in the SEC Championship game. Maybe it's us, maybe it's Ole Miss. Maybe this will give me there's more urgency because the College Football Playoff, we have weeks to adjust to it. But if you're, if you're Kevin Carter, the Ole Miss athletic director, and all of a sudden there's a game in six days to win the SEC championship in the SEC Championship means something. As I said, maybe that gives Kiffin a little bit more leverage to remain the coach for a little while. And so let's. So like every four or six hours there was this meeting scheduled, right?
- [37:24]
Steve
Wow.
- [37:24]
McShay
But when Alabama won, all of a sudden it was a meeting. And then calling for a meeting the next day it was 1 o', clock, then it turned to 2 o' clock eastern. And so at that point it was, lane's out. Lane, you're not invited to that 2pm meeting tomorrow. That will be for the chancellor, myself, administrators, the players and, and Pete Golding, who we're going to announce is not only our interim head coach, but our permanent head coach. And then there was this race to see on Lane. Lane side was, hey, there's a plane. Pick two planes coming to pick me, my family up and every staff member that comes with me will be with me and have a job in Baton Rouge at lsu. And if you don't get on that plane, you ain't ever Coming. So think about what's going on in that little town of Oxford from. We won the game. We won the Egg Bowl. Now we got to sit and wait on Friday. Now we got to sit and wait on Saturday. And the Iron bowl is prime time game at night. That's not going to end till 11, 11:30, right? I think it ended around 11:30 that night. And that's when I was getting texts from people saying, hey, no, that was Friday night. But I. We had already known the night before that he was leaving. It was a done deal. But that's when I was starting to get more texts about, like, what's going on? And this, this Alabama game was important. Now Alabama won, Deborah staying. They're playing the SEC Championship game. And now it's. Can Lane talk them into Chuck Carter, into the athletic director staying to coach the playoff? But Carter, like I said, he's got Oxford and Ole Miss to worry about.
- [39:16]
Steve
Yeah.
- [39:17]
McShay
Not what the nation is saying. And, and, and for the players, it was about giving stability, not only for now, but moving forward with, with Golding, and in doing so, telling Lane, yeah, get on your planes tomorrow. Bring all your family members, bring some of your offensive coaching staff. And Lane's taken a bunch of, like, the wide receiver coach, the coordinator, the quarterback. I forget who. It's like two or three other staff members with him from the offensive side. But Golding is staying to hold on to, you know, secure things and the split.
- [39:54]
Steve
How do you, how, how do you feel about that ultimatum, by the way? Giving a position coach an ultimatum of you. You either come or you.
- [40:01]
McShay
I don't understand.
- [40:02]
Steve
Tell me where I'm wrong.
- [40:03]
McShay
I'm.
- [40:04]
Steve
I'm sincerely asking this question. What's the problem with them? If you're so into the players that you're leaving and you want to give them the best chance to succeed, why do you need your wide receiver coach in that plane? And he can't hang. He can't stay behind and coach this team through the playoff. What, what kind of jump do you need there?
- [40:20]
McShay
Because, Steve, if I told you tomorrow we're going to take an opportunity, and that opportunity is bigger and provides more support and structure than whatever opportunity we're currently in. I don't want to use, like, the Ring or Spotify compared to something like, I'm not using that. I'm very happy here. Very. I'm saying, I'm saying this. I, I told you throughout the summer that I'm getting ready to do something. There was no chance in the world I was letting you Go do something else, man. And if, and if you decided to. I love you dearly.
- [40:58]
Steve
I know.
- [41:01]
McShay
But I'm going to try to build something massive, and I need to do it with you. But if you, if you don't have that commitment, then I've, I've got to find someone who, who does. I don't blame. I hear you. I, I.
- [41:13]
Steve
Here's the thing, though. It's not apples to apples. I mean, I don't even think it's close to apples to apples. Like, it's just not a thing. It just, It's a different you. It's a more unique situation. And to me, I don't understand it. I don't. If anything, you know, those, though, if I'm. If. Hear me out on this. Let's, let's play the hypothetical game. And I know we're already, we're already running a little long, but go ahead. What were you gonna say?
- [41:36]
McShay
It's. It goes back to the town, man. It always comes back to the town. And, like, we're gonna go, we're gonna mess some people up. People are gonna get hurt. I'm never going to be able to tell you what it's about. You can't ask any questions. But are you coming with me? And all I need you to say back to me is, who's cow we taking? Yeah, I, Listen, I get it. It's not as.
- [42:03]
Steve
It doesn't wrap up like that for me because hypothetically, you're, you know, you're running back on Ole Miss, you're a wide receiver on Ole Miss, and you are now playing for a chance to play in the national championship game, and your position coach isn't being allowed to stay, is leaving. And, you know, I don't, I would not use this word, but if I was a player, I might. Abandoning you. And now you're going to find out in, in, you know, six weeks that you have a chance, you know, like, you could go and transfer to lsu. Like, that might hurt your. That might leave a sour taste in your mouth. That might be like, I'm not going there. I'm not doing this after what they just did. I would think if your position coach stays behind and coaches you through that playoff run and then leaves for lsu, you might be like, man, I'm gonna follow that guy. That guy stuck with me. There's some things that are interesting to me, and maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm naive. I don't know. I don't know. I'm being sincere about this. I don't know. I think this is a unique situation. I'm trying to ask honest questions when I don't have. You know, I'm not just gonna come in here with hot takes and opinions because I don't think it's worth our time. But to me, there's just some. Some interesting perspective on this. I don't. I don't get the ultimatum. If I'm an Ole Miss fan, that leaves a real sour taste in my mouth. Like now. You know, like, it does feel like you're hurting the program in ways you don't need to on the way out.
- [43:18]
McShay
I don't.
- [43:18]
Steve
I just don't get it. But there's. Maybe there's something I'm missing. Maybe there's something.
- [43:22]
McShay
No, no, no. I think you're making great points. And we've also been in a locker room, and we know what it's like, and it is very much an isolated bubble mentality, and it's hard to think outside of that bubble. Right. I think a couple things are important when you. When you look at this, I think Kevin Carter, the ad for Ole Miss, did the right thing. I can't. I can't let you stay here into that transfer portal window of January 2 through 16, presumably, if you're. We're still playing and allow you to be recruiting for lsu, talking to players in the portal and. And instead of bringing them here to Oxford, siphoning them over to. To Baton Rouge, I can't allow you extra time with the players that are here to talk them into. Hey, told you I'd stay. I'm the guy. I'm your guy. Told you I love you. I was able to stay. But come with me when this is over. It would have been a mass exodus. And I still think there are going to be a handful of players that go from Ole Miss to LSU in the transfer portal. Okay. But I also think Lane maybe overplayed his card. Now, it didn't hurt him necessarily, but he was trying to leverage. He was trying to leverage this. What this current system has done in college football with the NIL and the transfer portal is it has created a bunch of mercenaries. Yep. Hey, Pay for play.
- [44:59]
Steve
Right?
- [45:00]
McShay
It's just so you can't be mad at the coaches, you can't be mad at the players. It's just the system. And until we get a governing body over it and a commissioner of it and everyone I've talked to the highest people up, I'm blessed to have had the positions I've had and to be able to Literally talk to the people who are in the highest positions of power, every single. From GMs to head coaches, the most, the biggest names you can imagine. I've talked to all, like a high percentage of them in the last two years. Everyone says the same thing. None of this is going to get regulated and fixed without a governing body. And a governing body will not be put in place because there's too much money out there on the streets for it to be allowed to get put in place.
- [45:50]
Steve
Yeah.
- [45:50]
McShay
Because the people who currently have a good amount of the power love this system they're stealing. Okay. It's not going to get put in place until Washington, D.C. gets involved. And then you're counting on people who don't really know the situation and don't really understand the culture of it all in government to make the. To come in and make. I think eventually they will get involved, but will they make the right decision on how it's structured and everything else? So it's created a bunch of mercenaries, and Lane knows that. Lane even had some cryptic quotes about the college player today is different. The college player today cares more about where's the money coming next and. And views all of this as opportunity. I can go from here to there. I don't. I'll pack up a couple bags in my dorm room, my apartment, and I'll. I'll head on, get on the highway, and I'll be down in Baton Rouge in a few hours. And they're not that worried about their head coach. They're worried about their situation. This system has created that. But Lane was trying to leverage the system and the mercenary culture and going into meetings with Kevin Carter and saying, hey, you don't let me coach, I'm going to take all these players, I'm going to take all the staff. What are you going to be left with? It's going to be an embarrassment. Well, Kevin Carter was smart enough to realize, I've got one guy in this building that has enough cachet with these players to actually stabilize things short and long term so that that doesn't happen. And also we can remain focused on this ultimate goal of having the best season that we currently are in the midst of the best season in the history of Ole Miss college football. And we can still make a push. And that man is Pete Golding. And this is the. This is the thing that caught me even a little bit off guard. They were told the players, we have a player meeting at 2pm I think it was 2pm it was like one. Whatever it was it was one o' clock and two o' clock and one was central, one was eastern and whatever it was, I think it was 1pm originally and then it got pushed to 2. When you come into that meeting, all cell phones will be collected. Well, someone broke that rule.
- [48:17]
Steve
Yeah.
- [48:18]
McShay
Brought a burner phone in or whatever it was and recorded the audio of it. And there were a couple speeches that the, the Chancellor gave a speech. How proud we were and like. And then, and then I think it was the, the ad. Carter started giving a speech and announced the. Pete Golding would be the, the permanent coach. And when he did, the response from the players, I, I would have expected like, all right, you know. Yeah, good. It was like the Marcus Freeman thing.
- [48:53]
Steve
Yeah.
- [48:55]
McShay
And the best.
- [48:55]
Steve
I didn't make that connection until just now. But that's, that is really. Yeah, that's dead on.
- [49:00]
McShay
Do you remember the video of Mark.
- [49:02]
Steve
When he walked into.
- [49:02]
McShay
It was the weight room. Yes. And they went nuts.
- [49:07]
Steve
Yes.
- [49:08]
McShay
And when the AD announced that Golding was the guy, it was the same kind of reaction. And so that's really interesting. This system has created mercenaries. But these mercenaries love their teammates, they love their program and they, they, I think they love Lane. But maybe not as much as Lane thought.
- [49:30]
Steve
Yeah. And maybe not as much, maybe not as much today as they did last week either. When you think about it. I mean these, these players, again, I would not use the word abandoned or, or those words. I think that's overly harsh. But if you're a player in that bubble and that scheme and that, and that team, you're feeling, you're feeling one way about it. Man, I, I gotta believe you're feeling one way about it. Like, yeah. You know, I can sit here and be an adult and say that's a great opportunity but man, we have a chance to go do something and, and you're not going to be here for it. You got us all the way to the end and then you're in and you're walking out.
- [50:03]
McShay
And I was, I'm fascinated to see.
- [50:06]
Steve
Who, who actually does go from ole Ms. To LSU. It may not be the number that we think it could be.
- [50:12]
McShay
Right. Based off of that reaction. And, and that I was on with Bill Simmons last night and, and, and Van Latham. Right. We had an awesome van. It was the first time I met Van Lathan and like he's awesome. It was a lot of fun. But Bill asked the question because Bill's, Bill's NBA, NFL. Like and he's self admitted like college. He's, he's has a growing appreciation and love for college football, but he's kind of playing catch up. And he admitted it. I wouldn't say it if he didn't, you know, openly say it on his show. Even last night he asked the question like, is there a parallel you can draw to this? And I said, honestly, it's. This one's more extreme because they're in the College Football Playoff and it's going from Ole Miss in conference to LSU right down the highway. But the only other one, and I went back and looked the only other one that you could, you could compare the two and remember the backlash too was Brian Kelly going from Notre Dame. They, they were 11 and 1. They just missed out on the College Football Playoff. But when he took the job, they didn't know if they were going to be in or out. I went back and read articles to make sure that was 20, 21. 10 year deal, 100 million lasted four and a half years. And just, just currently or just recently it was decided that he's going to $54 million buyout from LSU.
- [51:40]
Steve
I got a pro one.
- [51:42]
McShay
Yeah.
- [51:43]
Steve
Bill Parcell's Patriots to the Jets.
- [51:45]
McShay
That's what Bill said.
- [51:47]
Steve
Yep. I didn't see it, but that's, that's the, that's. I, I promise you I'm not stealing that tape. No, no, that's the one that, it's the one that jumps out to me.
- [51:57]
McShay
And Bill's point was as a lifelong Patriot fan and he went back to like 78. That was only one at the time. So I don't remember it. And I can't remember the coach right now.
- [52:06]
Steve
He couldn't have been that, he couldn't have been that old at that point.
- [52:09]
McShay
Yeah, I think he's probably like 7, 8, 9 years old, something like that. Yeah, but, but Bill was saying there, there was one back then with the Patriots. She goes, but the most, most app. Comparison would be the parcels. One. He's like. But even with Bill now, because he was, he was basically asking will Ole Miss Ole Miss fans ever get over this and, and look back on these days fondly. And he was like, you know, with Bill, like we hated Bill for a long time. But then like six, seven years went by and we're like, yeah, I don't mind Bill. Bill's a legendary coach. He kind of, he kind of came in even though he hated the way he exited. He came in and he fixed things and allowed. He showed ownership and, and people involved, how organization needs to be run. So he kind of Set the foundation. So I'm cool with Bill. And so he was saying that maybe that would happen.
- [53:04]
Steve
But I do find if Ole Miss wins a couple national championships, that'll happen. I mean, we're preparing the fact that New England won everything after that. So. Right. If Ole Miss has that kind of run. Yeah. You know, Lane will be fine. Yeah.
- [53:18]
McShay
And. And with Lane coaching in the same conference and, and presumably there's a strong chance that Lane wants that Ole Miss winds up getting their ass kicked by lsu. Whether it might not be next year, but there may be a 3, 4, 5 year run where it's just a beating. And Van was saying last night is not dissimilar from, from Nick going. Lsu, Dolphins, Dolphins, Alabama. And then it became this annual like baton death march. You know, knowing we had to go either go to Tuscaloosa or Tuscaloosa was rolling in and we were just going to get our teeth stomped, I think is what he said.
- [53:57]
Steve
Yeah.
- [53:58]
McShay
But the Brian Kelly one's interesting not just because Kelly also left for lsu. Right. But the. There's similar. And Kelly left during what could have been a college football playoff run. And the timing of it and all very, very similar. But what else is interesting? The two parts that are interesting to me is it was the offensive minded coach leaves as the head coach and the current defensive coach, defensive coordinator gets elevated to head coaching job.
- [54:31]
Steve
Interesting.
- [54:32]
McShay
Freeman at Notre Dame, Golding at Ole Miss. And when they get announced, the players aren't like, yo, that's good on Pete. You know, it was like, ah, yes. And there are quotes coming out like that's our guy. Yeah.
- [54:51]
Steve
The media, the media kind of raises some eyebrows. The media of, oh, this is the, this is the guy that's interesting hire and is he really ready for this? And I think there's a lot of correlation there.
- [55:04]
McShay
Last thing on this and I'm. I'm transitioning. Unless you have anything else you want to get to on the. I mean, I don't think we could cover any, any deeper than we just did.
- [55:13]
Steve
This might be its own show.
- [55:14]
McShay
I, I think Tucker, you might have to break this thing up. I'm going back to Sexton and I promised Penn State fans I'd keep them abreast and there's more stuff and we will keep as funneling stuff. But I did get an interesting nugget. Jimmy Sexton, as I mentioned, is the most powerful man in college sports and is orchestrating a lot of this stuff. Jimmy Sexton also outside of the SEC and having all those clients And I mentioned James Franklin is a client of his. Right. James Franklin was fired. I believe he deserved to be fired.
- [55:57]
Steve
Yep.
- [55:58]
McShay
And if you're out there and you're a reporter on the Penn State stuff, go do some more digging on the Nike Adidas thing and the timing. Go find out about this $38 million situation. And go find out when the timing was on, information being passed to James Franklin, maybe a fight with athletic director Pat Kraft and what subsequently happened the next couple weeks with losses to teams they should never have lost to. Go dig into that. But Franklin gets fired and Kraft fires him, and Franklin is a Sexton client. Or how. Or vice versa.
- [56:45]
Steve
Right.
- [56:46]
McShay
And it left a bad taste in the mouth of Jimmy Sexton. Not a good idea. Unfortunately, Sexton's so powerful that when you're an athletic director like that, you're gonna want to consult with, have discussions with, and keep. Keep Sexton in the loop. Doesn't sound like that happened. And I told you from the jump, Pat Craft, like, they're building things and. And let's get McAfee out here and get every. Like, there some magic tricks going on in terms of. But there's also a massive stadium debt, and there's. There's this Nike and Adidas stuff going on and information coming to Craft and. And Phil Knight and Franklin finding out from other places. And then there's a feud, and then you're gone. And Sexton's mad because he loves. He loves James Franklin, just as I hope Jim Ornstein loves me and would protect me. My agent at wme. And so you watch this Penn State thing, you're like, well, where's all these dominoes are falling? And. And now lanes at LSU and Golding's at Ole Miss and. And some rolls somewhere else at Florida and Goldish is at Auburn and Silver Fields at Arkansas. What's going on with Penn State? I'll just leave you with this. It's probably not going to be a Sexton client, and Chesney was a Sexton client, and I told you about that. And there might have been a. There might have been a flight that the Craft was called in the middle of a. Of a flight to go see Chesney and told, let's not do that. Chesney's going to ucla. And if Sexton is Boris, Scott Boris of college football, you better get into bed with him if you like it. Whether you like it or not. And now you're sitting that back and you're a Penn State fan, and you're like, what are we doing? Because every name that has popped up that. Drinkwitz, right. Clark Lee, every name that's popped up that Penn State has had interest in that, that coach has wound up getting an extension. Guess who represents drink wits. Guess who represents Clark Lee. Jimmy Sexton. Okay, so Penn State program wise president has got to be looking at this and saying, do changes need. Like what are we. Are we good? Right. Do we have the right people? I'll say this too. If you're one of those flight tracker people, there may or may not have been a plane from Happy Valley to. To Provo in the last 48 hours. So if you really Penn State reporter, national reporter, trying to get. You might want to. Might want to track that Kalani Sataki, someone you might want to keep an eye on. And I can tell you this, the people, the people at Penn State really want Terry Smith to stay as the head coach. Oh, a lot of people there. And I think part of it quite honestly is let's not go buy out Saki for 14 million or whatever that number is when we're already in debt with the stadium stuff. We, let's just, let's keep this guy for a little while, see if it goes great and if it doesn't, let's have the leadership in place and, and have let the dust settle and make a, make a bigger decision in a year or two. That's my update for you Penn State fans. That's all we got on this front. I think it's more than enough. In fact, with, with Tuck, with Tucker in my ear, I just made it an executive decision. I actually didn't make it. Tucker did. I'm not gonna lie. But he's not wrong. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna ride with my guy Tuck. That's a show in and of itself.
- [60:58]
Steve
Yeah, it has to be.
- [60:59]
McShay
And we got a full tape truce coming up for you, so we're going to keep that separate. Yeah. Match. I'd give it 4.9 stars because I talk too much. But. But how could I give you anything but five stars must be 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18/ plus and present in D.C. kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-Gambler or visit RG D help.com call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit MD gambling help.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gambling helpline ma.org or call 1-800-327-G5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text Hopeny in New York.
- [62:13]
Steve
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