Ty Simpson Pro Day Reactions, Mock 3.0 Second-Round Standouts, and More

Summary

The McShay Show – Ty Simpson Pro Day Reactions, Mock 3.0 Second-Round Standouts, and More
Date: March 25, 2026 | Host: Todd McShay, Co-host: Steve Muench | The Ringer

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into the much-anticipated Ty Simpson Pro Day in the wake of “Ty Simpson-gate” and the contentious debates about his NFL future. Todd McShay and Steve Muench discuss their nuanced evaluations of Simpson, address broader narratives around quarterback selection, and deliver in-depth reactions to McShay’s latest two-round mock draft—especially highlighting intriguing second-round standouts. Additional segments include rapid-fire updates from recent pro days across the country and the latest buzz on NFL hopefuls’ draft stock.

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1. Ty Simpson Pro Day: Hype, Performance, and Real Debate

The Scene-Setter and Media Frenzy

• McShay remarks on the coinciding Alabama and Ohio State Pro Days. He reflects on how pro days have become media events and how NFL teams and networks coordinate to avoid overlapping major quarterback workouts.

  “[03:19] The story of the Week and the Story of the Day Steve: Ty Simpson.” — McShay

Simpson’s On-Field Display

• McShay’s Live Reaction:

  • Impressed with Simpson’s “footwork, efficiency, the tempo… urgency in his drops,” and pocket mobility.
  • Acknowledges arm strength is not elite, but “better than people want to give him credit for.”
  • Grades the day as “A minus… B plus at worst.”

    “Ball came out high. Ball came out with some with good juice... I would say all in all, it was like a B plus, A minus... Nothing today would change anything that you think about Ty Simpson.” — McShay [05:14]

• Steve’s Take:

  • Concedes Simpson’s mobility and arm strength aren’t red flags, but “probably don’t like them as much as you do.”
  • Challenges McShay’s effusive (Picasso/Beethoven) analogies, saying Simpson still "holds onto the ball too long at times." [14:37]

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Media Narrative and the QB1 Debate

• The Orlovsky/McAfee/Tannenbaum Controversy: Discussion about Ty Simpson being touted as QB1 by several analysts, with questions about agency influence due to shared representation (CAA).

  “Orlovsky came out and said he would have him QB1... Mendoza is not. It’s RPOs, it’s quick reads, it’s efficient, but it’s not mind blowing. It doesn’t translate to what he’s going to be asked to do in the NFL…” — McShay [09:00–11:30]

• McShay’s Perspective:

  • Simpson: “It’s Picasso, it’s Beethoven, it’s the Louvre… he’s doing NFL stuff at an NFL level.”
  • Mendoza: “He has the frame, the experience… he’s shown up in big moments… Ohio State tape is the best I’ve seen of any quarterback, probably in two years.”
  • The conundrum: Simpson’s NFL-readiness/RPO mastery vs. Mendoza’s proven production and size/durability.

    “When you have… a passion for it… there’s something that just resonates with you. My gosh, he’s doing everything the right way…” — McShay [09:50]

  • On Mendoza: “He’s 6’4.5, 236 pounds… 35 starts. Ty is 6’1, 211, 15 starts, knocked out of the Rose Bowl. What do I do?” — McShay [13:13]

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Evaluator’s Dilemma: Tape vs. Traits

• Steve and Todd’s Tension

  “We disagree within a certain parameters… It’s a little over the top… for a guy that holds onto the ball too long at times.” — Steve [14:34]

• Both agree: Alabama’s poor run game and offensive line inflated Simpson’s struggles (ranked 126 or 128th of 136 FBS teams in rushing).

  “That which is just impossible for the mind to comprehend for Alabama.” — McShay [15:09]

• On Mendoza’s Growth:

  “I think that he improved his ability to get through his progressions… I like Mendoza more… but when you look at frame, injury, and lack of starts, there’s red flags.” — Steve [18:00]

• Why NFL GMs Worry about Simpson:

  • Only 15 starts, smaller/thinner frame, durability concerns compared to almost all current NFL starters. Best case comp: Brock Purdy “dropped into one of the great all-time situations.”
  • Fit questions: “I know the Steelers aren’t taking him. I know the Jets aren’t taking him… Where’s the fit?”

    “I want nothing to do with him going 16 to the Jets or 24 to the Browns. That’s where quarterbacks go to die until otherwise proven.” — McShay [24:55]

• Best Destinations for Simpson:

  • Arizona? Unlikely he goes top 10, but if selected late first or second round, “he’s starting by week nine,” most likely scenario.

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2. Second-Round Standouts: Mock 3.0 Deep Dive

[30:17 – 45:00]

Why the Second Round is More Fascinating Than the First

• Steve:

  “The second round of the mock draft was actually more interesting to you than the first round.” [30:18]

Key Picks and Insights:

• Caleb Banks (Jets, DT, Florida) [30:24]:

  • “He might be the most naturally talented player in the entire draft,” but major durability concerns due to recurring foot injuries.
  • Combine standout: 32" vertical at 327 lbs, ran 5.04 40-yard dash.
  • “Potential steal or classic Jets misfire if he can’t stay healthy.”

• Kenyon Sadiq (49ers, TE) and Eli Stowers (Panthers, TE) [33:45]:

  • Stowers: Great fit for Carolina, helps QB development. Steve likes Panthers continually targeting TEs early: “Stop messing around. Get one in the second round.”
  • Sadiq nearly given to Panthers at 19, ultimately 49ers at 27.

• Maxi Natur (Raiders, OT, Arizona State) [37:26]:

  • Top talent, “don’t understand how a dude like that gets out of the first round.”
  • More pro-ready than the ‘raw’ narrative suggests; “not as much of a project as people think.”

• Other Jets Picks:

  • Impressive haul: “Arvell Reese, Omar Cooper Jr., Caleb Banks, and Anthony Hill Jr.—good for them.”

• Chiefs (Kansas City) [40:10]:

  • “Monsoon Delane at #9—an absolute home run.”
  • Gabe Akis, Illinois edge: “Nineteen sacks over the last two seasons, wins with his hands. Love that pick.”
  • Chris Brazell II (Tennessee, WR): Liked, but Steve urges, “Stop chasing speed... take Jeremy Bernard if he’s there.”

• Dolphins [42:18]:

  • Well-rounded value picks including Makai Lemon at 11, Colton Hood (CB), Malachi Lawrence (UCF edge).
  • Makai Lemon: “Everything is full speed but under control… the toughness, the after catch ability… analytics: only five other recent WRs with ≥3.0 yards/route run.”

• Cole Payton (Rams, QB, North Dakota State) [44:20]:

  • Second-round backup QB, “phenomenal spot to land,” could develop behind the scenes.

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3. Pro Day Highlights & Late-Riser Buzz

[45:43 – End]

DB/CB Risers

• Mansoor Delane (LSU, CB):

  • Runs 4.38. “That only solidifies top-10 pick talk. Head and shoulders best corner in class.” — Steve [50:14]
  • Tape matches the metrics: “It is beautiful. You might want to throw this way? Beware.” — McShay [52:15]

• Keonte Scott (Miami, CB):

  • “Runs 4.25–4.32, 44” vertical at Miami Pro Day, would be best in class.”
  • “Love the physicality and zone awareness; speed confirms recovery ability. But, 20.3% missed tackle rate—needs work.” — McShay [56:54]

Defensive Playmakers

• Harold Perkins (LSU, LB):

  • “Sensational Arkansas 2023 game—but a roller coaster career. Played out of position, missed tackles (18.8% rate), but wow traits: just under 6’1, 220, 4.38 pro day forty, 35” vertical, 88 career pressures.”
  • “Could see a defensive coach or special teams coach take a hack round 4.” — McShay [54:21]

• Malachi Lawrence (UCF, DE):

  • Combine: 6’4, 253, 4.52 forty, 40” vertical. “Shades of Khalil Mack. True relentless motor, doesn’t stay blocked, needs control as a finisher.”
  • Could sneak into late round 1. — Steve [47:00]

Under-the-Radar Combine/Pro Day Standouts

• Will Pauling (Notre Dame, WR):

  • “Ran a 4.37, 42” vertical… but still a late round, depth slot WR. Speed is overrated for receiver evaluation.” — Steve [60:29]

• Jeff Caldwell (Cincinnati, WR):

  • 6’5+, 216, 4.31 forty, but hands questions at the Cincy pro day.

• Jake Golday (Cincinnati, LB):

  • 6.84 three-cone at linebacker: “That’s awesome at his size.”

• Trey Moore (Texas, hybrid LB/EDGE):

  • 4.21 shuttle, 7.08 three-cone—“looked awesome in drills, versatile, and hybrid potential.”

• Renee Conga (Louisville, DT):

  • Not invited to combine, but “4.78 forty at 300 lbs, vertical/broad leaps best in class among DTs.”
  • “Win rate (14%) puts him in territory with Jeffrey Simmons, Dexter Lawrence. A sleeper.”

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4. Notable Quotes and Moments

• “It’s Picasso, it’s Beethoven, it’s the Louvre…” — McShay, explaining his admiration for Simpson’s tape [09:50]
• “Zero run game… Alabama 126 or 128th... Impossible for the mind to comprehend for Alabama.” — McShay [15:09]
• “That’s where quarterbacks go to die until otherwise proven.” — On being drafted by the Jets or Browns, McShay [24:55]
• “Monsoon Delane… head and shoulders the best corner in this draft. It’s not even close.” — Steve [50:14]
• “This dude truly is a relentless pass rusher…” — Steve on Malachi Lawrence [47:00]
• “You have to have it as part of the argument without saying this is specifically why this happened.” — Steve on context in QB evaluation [15:57]

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5. Timestamps for Key Segments

• 03:19 – 14:45: Ty Simpson’s pro day breakdown & the QB1 media debate
• 15:09 – 22:30: Tape vs. traits, run game context, NFL starter comps
• 24:55 – 26:30: Potential landing spots and draft slot for Simpson
• 30:17 – 45:00: Second-round mock draft highlights and debates (Caleb Banks, Kenyon Sadiq, Max Natur, Jeremy Bernard, etc.)
• 45:43 – 52:35: Pro day risers: Mansoor Delane, Harold Perkins, CB class shakeout
• 55:48 – 66:13: Speedy combine/pro day performances—Keonte Scott, Chris Hilton, Jake Golday, Renee Conga
• 66:13 – End: Closing thoughts, various NFL draft prospects to monitor

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In Summary:
This episode offers a masterclass in the art and science of NFL draft evaluation, using Ty Simpson as a lens into the eternal debate between aesthetics/tape and historical, quantifiable traits. The mock draft deep-dive showcases talent-rich, high-upside fits beyond the first round, littered with “if it clicks” candidates on both sides of the ball. End-to-end, McShay and Muench bring a balanced, sometimes fiery counterpoint to mainstream takes—delivering context and candor for hardcore draftniks and casual fans alike.

Transcript

[Steve]

Foreign.

[McShay]

We've got a lot to cover. The draft is getting close. First of all, we've got Ty Simpson's pro day following Ty Simpson gate. Then we're going to go back to the second round of my mock draft and really drill in. And finally, we do actually have a lot of pro day updates and things that are relevant. And guess what? Just 29 days until the NFL draft. Mitch has got his red hat on. You good, buddy?

[Steve]

I'm great, man.

[McShay]

Tucker, roll my favorite beat, please. Interesting that Ohio State and Alabama have their pro day on the same day. You know, having worked at ESPN for a long time and being the really hon, honestly, the, the original, the OG of covering pro days. I was at the combine before anyone else was at the combine and I was at the pro day before anyone else is at the pro day because Kuiper wasn't leaving the compound. And and then they kind of grew into, I started going, I don't know, 2007, 2008 to a pro day here and there. And then it kind of grew into the spectacle that it's become. It's interesting now also watching Ohio's watching clips from Ohio State's pro day and clips from Alabama's pro day and I think ESPN sent a couple of people there to do a show later in the day, but there's no live coverage. So that's interesting as well. But knowing the history of it, what happens is the league and kind of colleges and networks all used to work together. I assume they still do. But to make sure that there wasn't Mendoza throwing on the same day as Simpson is the same day as Nussmeyer, is the same day as Beck and then all the other pro days kind of trickled in, you know, according. So that's kind of how it goes. But today Alabama has its pro day and There are some GMs and head coaches there. Ohio State has its pro day and there's a bunch more from my understanding. I don't want to say there were more, I believe. And I've got a list of all that as well. And we'll get to some of the pro day stuff. This episode is brought to you by TaxAct. From rookies to experts, Tax act helps you navigate every tax play with with accuracy guaranteed. Get tips along the way. Add expert assist to talk to tax experts or let our experts do your taxes for you with expert full service. TaxAct helps you find the deductions and credits you deserve so you can get them over with. Visit taxact.com to learn more conditions apply. See taxact.com for details.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

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[McShay]

But the the story of the Week and the Story of the Day Steve Ty Simpson Yep. Let's, let's start with Ty Simpson today, right? Okay, let me, let me give you a 30 second rundown. I just watched every throat touchdown touchdown Alabama on X go follow them. Did a nice job of breaking down the clips and I saw a bunch of other stuff in different places. So as expected, you know, I feel like it's always the same thing. I, I almost have PTSD when I start talking about quarterbacks at a pro day. As expected.

[Steve]

Thank you. Thank you.

[McShay]

Footwork looked good. No, but all serious.

[Steve]

Ball didn't hit the ground.

[McShay]

There was talk that Ty Simpson may not even throw there and he had all of his receiver Jeremy Bernard obviously Ryan Coleman Williams now is being full name. Yeah, Ryan Cole and Dash Williams who disappeared on him in late in the season and dropped a deep ball today as well. So it was right on. Right on. Brand among other some other wide receivers all catching the ball for, for Ty Simpson. The thing that stood out to me about Ty is what you see on tape and that's the footwork, efficiency, the tempo of it, the urgency in this drops sidestepping kind of on, on the move throws but also sidestepping or climbing and resetting and throwing. Ball came out high. Ball came out with some with good juice. He just, he's not going to blow you away with his arm strength or velocity on the ball. But it's better than people want to maybe give him credit for. His footwork and his agility in the pocket is better than people want to give him credit for as is his mobility taking off and running when he, when he occasionally does deep ball doesn't have a ton of it's not one of like Josh Allen. I was at that pro day. I was started all out. I think the very first pro day we ever covered at ESPN was me down in Baton Rouge with Jamarcus Russell was on one leg through it like 60, 70 yards in the air hit the goal post. So much for what that did for his Career. Right. So keep it all in perspective. But I would say all in all, it was like a B plus, a minus, you know, there. Not every throw was perfectly placed. But the, the thing that I always look for, you start with the footwork, right? And then you graduate kind of. Where is the ball placement on certain throws, like on the out routes? Is there energy at the end? Is he putting in that spot where the receiver's kind of reaching out to get, but can also turn the corner, turn the corner and get up the field? Is the deep ball out on time? Does it have energy? Is, you know, there's a lot of that stuff. And I again, let's give him an A minus on the day. I thought he looked really good, B plus at worst, but I didn't. Nothing to today would change anything that you think about Ty Simpson. That brings me to this, Steve, the story of the week. And we can thank Dan Orlovsky and Pat McAfee and, and is it CAA driven because they have the same agent and so does Mike Tanenbaugh. And I can tell you personally because that's it, because Ty Simpson's agent is at CIA. I used to be represented by ca, caa.

[Steve]

I know you used to get this a lot, right? People would come at you. I mean, this is, they would try to.

[McShay]

But I here, here's, here's an interesting part. For me. This doesn't mean it's the same thing for, for Orlovsky who in case you are, you know, have been under a, or in a cave all week. Orlovsky came out and said he would have him QB1. He ahead of Mendoza. He's pounding the table for Ty Simpson. We can get to that in a second. And then the, the doubters, the haters, the skeptics have come out and said, well, he's represented by caa. Then Mike Tannenbaum goes and endorses that. Says he's talked to people in the league who have that same, that same thought. Tannenbaum's represented by caa. Ty Simpson's represented by caa. I was represented at caa and it's a totally different division now. I knew some of the agents at caa, but I knew them from, from my work in, in football. I never once was told, hey, this is our client list and anything you can do for me, never once, not one time, doesn't mean it's not happening to Dan. I don't know.

[Steve]

Right?

[McShay]

So I'm not, I'm not defending, but I'm also saying like it's not my history of it. I am now represented as you are by Jim Ornstein and WME and Happy, and I don't ever hear anything about any client, you know, so take that for what it's worth. More interesting to me is. And here, let me give you all the behind the scenes because we. I want to do this. You know, just.

[Steve]

Here we go.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Full.

[McShay]

Full transparency.

[Steve]

Let's do it.

[McShay]

Dan and I were texting while he was watching tape of Ty Simpson. Man, I was saying, like, yeah, I see the same things. I. I really like.

[Steve]

You put them up to this. You're stirring the pot. You're like, you're the puppet master. I love it.

[McShay]

I was like, hey, Dan, you can say 10 to 12 GMS are agreeing with you, but I. I was agreeing with. With all, you know, we were talking, like, the football part of it, the quarterbacking, the. The scheduling, the processing, the control of the line of scrimmage, the anticipation, all those sorts of things. And then also talking about, you know, there it is interesting that at this point, this was probably three weeks ago. I can go look at my. My text three, four weeks, maybe three weeks ago, that there are people in the league that are seeing this and that there's not this gap. And some people actually like Ty Simpson more than Mendoza, but from a. From a tape standpoint, and it's interesting that no one's even discussing that. It's like a possibility that, you know, that some teams could view it this way. But. And I want to get your opinion on all of it, but I think there's a difference. Here's what I know. It's Picasso, it's Beethoven. It's the Louvre. It's. It's classic. Like, it's. When you're a purist of the quarterback position, when you. When you're like, a purist of football and when you have. You're an aficionado of quarterback play. And I'm not saying I am, but I sure as hell have been around this a long time. I played the position at a lousy level and played it. Played a lousy brand of it by the standard that we're talking about right now. But I grew up as a quarterback, and I have this. I have a passion for it. Right. When you see it and you actually know what you're looking for, and you actually care deeply about that position in this game that we all care deeply about, there's something that, like, just resonates with you. My gosh, he's doing everything the right way. The drops are with urgency. The pre snap stuff, he understands it, he's controlling it. He's manipulating everyone. He's got an NFL coordinator, Tim Ty Simpson does in Ryan Grub, who. The motions aren't just motions. They're not just eye candy, they're to their indicators. And the indicators he's picking up are almost always. He's accurate with it. Then the ball snapped and that cover two shell goes to a cover one or a quarters or you know, and he's recognizing that and he's, and like everything's happening fast because he grew up around ball and his dad has been UT Martin for 20 years as a head coach and, and he worked against Alabama's defensive practice every day. And so like he's not your 15 game starter like we're used to with a Sanchez or a Trubisky or Anthony Richardson. You know what I mean? You see all those things and you get drawn in, Steve. But then the GM hat has to go on and here's what I want to say and here's what I struggle with because I am in love with his tape. And then you got Mendoza, who RPOs 2 by twos. Cornerback goes here, I go there. Cornerback goes there, I go here. If that doesn't happen, I'm a tall, long levered guy who pressure starts to come. I don't have that agility. I can run on a straight line pretty fast. We saw that in the national championship game throughout his career. But this panic sets in and so I'm watching that tape and I'm watching the struggles for three and a half quarters against Oregon, Iowa, Penn State and then you see the brilliance in the fourth quarters. So I'm setting all this up because it's a tug as an evaluator because Ty Simpson's doing NFL stuff at an NFL level and he's doing it for nine games and it looks awesome. Mendoza's not. It's RPOs, it's quick reads, it's efficient, but it's not mind blowing. It doesn't translate to what he's going to be asked to do in the NFL to a certain degree, but he's showing up in these big moments. And by the way, that Ohio State tape is the best tape I've seen of any quarterback probably in two years of evaluating quarterbacks and the toughness and the mental aspect of it and his commitment to the game and the way that the country boys and the city kids, they all love them, you know, so there's all of these things that you gotta. And then it comes down to one guy's six, four and a half, 236 pounds when he measured at the combine and has 35 starts. The other guy, whose tape just looks so NFL and it's seducing, is six one, 211 pounds, 15 starts. Didn't hold up. Gastritis, 190 pounds in the rose Bowl. Knocked out of the Rose Bowl. So what do I do? And that's where we are. That's a healthy conversation to have about these two guys and not say that Orlovsky and. And McAfee and the gang yelling at each other isn't. It's entertaining.

[Steve]

It's entertaining. These.

[McShay]

But this. This is kind of a healthy conversation. Like, this is the reality of what we're faced with.

[Steve]

Yeah. No clickbait here. Kind of disappointing. I want a little more fire. A little more fire. But, like, listen, I hear everything you're saying, and I get it. And I think that you and I disagree within a certain parameters, if that makes sense. I agree with what you say about Ty Simpson. I'll say this. I don't think his mobility or arm strength are red flags, but I probably don't like them as much as you do. I don't see it as, you know, like, I think. And. And I get your. That you get carried away sometimes, and maybe you're not getting carried away here, but when you're talking about him being Picasso and the Louvre and. It's really good. It is.

[McShay]

Really. I'm just saying it brings out those. Like, I'm not a classical music fan, nor am I.

[Steve]

Right. Beethoven. Right.

[McShay]

Love. Right. Traeger DePietro is one of my best friends growing up. He's an awesome artist on Martha's Vineyard. I love his stuff because I love Traeger and I've just grown to love. But I'm not. But I'm guessing purists and, like, aficionados of those things kind of love Beethoven and Bach and they love Picasso. So that's. That's the comparison I'm making. I get it.

[Steve]

But I think it's. It's a little over the top for me. For a guy that holds onto the ball too long at times, it's a little over the top.

[McShay]

And I have five straight games of. Yep. Five straight games.

[Steve]

It's a little over the top for me. Yeah. With. With that. With that kind of a thing, with the way he played at times down the stretch. And again, we can. This is a. We can go down this conversation again. And I think it's worth mentioning. Zero run game. Zero run game. And I think his offensive line just sucked at times. Like, I'm just gonna say that I think his offensive protection sucked at times.

[McShay]

So Alabama 126 or 128th out of like 136 in the FBS in rushing. That which is just impossible for the mind to comprehend for Alabama. And I told you from Venables on. Venables came in. He's one of the great defensive coordinators and he's head coach at obviously at Oklahoma. And people think he cheats and he gets signs and all that stuff. But I'm telling you, from that point on, the Alabama pass protection from that game on, it was what they did and then other teams emulating. And so now they got the beat on all that stuff. And so no run game, pass protection breaks down. Ryan Coleman will disappears.

[Steve]

Yeah.

[McShay]

So those are. But, but are they just excuses?

[Steve]

I mean, that's, that's the, that's the rub here. And that's the question. And I.

[McShay]

It's.

[Steve]

And I don't think either one of us have a definitive answer there. I don't think either one of us is saying you just have to consider it. You have to have it as part of the argument without saying this is specifically why this happened. But you have to understand what kind of duress this guy was under. I'll say this on the flip side with Mendoza. I think that he improved his ability to get through his progressions. I thought he did a better of that as the season progressed. So I like that. I also will say

[McShay]

game was awesome to watch, man.

[Steve]

Like the stepping up in like these, like, I didn't understand the. This is the one thing I didn't understand from Orlovsky. I have no problem with him having an opinion that's different than mine. And I have a lot of respect for him as an evaluator. But when they were asking him about big games and he said what big games I. That, that one was. That's, that's, that's the head scratcher for me. You know, what's a big game. And maybe it's maybe like I understand how good the SEC is. I've been an SEC guy for a long time. Go try to beat that Iowa team in Iowa like that at Iowa. Like even going to Penn State and winning games there with the bad. That's a big freaking game, man. To go in Oregon and do what he did there.

[McShay]

Like, yeah, the big game thing, I feel like he was. He was backed against the corner and we've all been there and we all

[Steve]

just said and just said something he probably didn't mean.

[McShay]

I, and I do understand this, but I don't understand it coming from Dan is that yeah, they scored six points in the first three quarters against Ohio State but I watched the tape and there's nothing about his performance Mendozas that said anything to me about oh, this is a 6.3 quarter now. Iowa, I got that vibe. Oregon, I got that vibe. If you, if you took the scoreboard out and didn't allow me to see touchdown plays. If just watching the, the passing attempts from the dropbacks from Mendoza in all those games I would have said the six point games. Iowa, six point games. Oregon maybe, you know, 14 point game going into the fourth quarter, Penn State. But I would not have said it about Ohio State the way he was playing, you know, and he's, I don't

[Steve]

think, I think he's an outstanding preparer and, and I think he will only get better in this regard. And I think that he is Mendoza or Simpson? Mendoza. Mendoza. He has a mental capability to get there. This is why I kind of like the Jared Goff comp for Mendoza more than I like the Matt Ryan comp. Because I think Matt Ryan was coming out of Boston College was an NFL ready guy who's on another level in terms of processing than where Goff and Mendoza are coming out. Two former Cal quarterbacks. So that's why I kind of like that comp more. I think that Ty Simpson is more advanced there. I just think the Mendoza can, can get there and I think he got better like I said, over the course of the season with some of those reads that he had to make. I, I just, I like Mendoza more and when you look at the frame, the injury and the lack of starts, there's red flags all over the place and you can't, like you said, it's not, it's not very interesting. It's not very, I mean it is interesting, but it's not, it's not going to get a lot of clickbait here. When you start looking at historically these trends, you cannot, you just cannot ignore them. There's other quarterbacks who've done, who've put up numbers like Ty Simpson did. Maybe not played as high a level but you know, 28 touchdowns compared to five interceptions and the run that he was on, you know, all of that stuff and they just haven't worked out well. And no, he's not Anthony Richardson.

[McShay]

I get that.

[Steve]

I understand that. He's not Mitch Trubisky I get that. It's still only 15 starts and you have to. We. You talk about it when protections were getting figured out and all this stuff like you, it's the learning and evolving and he just hasn't had enough time to do that. And can you do that at the NFL level? We'll see. He's got a better shot than a lot of these other guys. I agree with you, but I'm scared. I'm. I'm terrified.

[McShay]

I'm just going down. Our lads right now for depth charts and you can sort by position.

[Steve]

Right.

[McShay]

Here's the, here's one of the problems. And it's not a six foot one. I can't see over the, over the, the line of scrimmage. And that. That's not what I'm referring to. It's the frame. Six one, £211, is not as thickly built as some of the other guys that have come before him. Some other guys. When you go through this list of starting quarterbacks in the league that you hold any value in, it's typically if they're around the 6:1 range, much thicker, sturdier frames. Also, most of them have an element of mobility. And while I think he's mobile, I, I see it, it's not this level of mobility. When I say that I'm talking about, I'm talking about.

[Steve]

I mean, Baker Mayfield stands out.

[McShay]

Baker. Baker Mayfield. I don't know that it's dissimilar their level of mobility, honestly.

[Steve]

Really?

[McShay]

Oh, I promise.

[Steve]

Oh, I, I disagree. I disagree.

[McShay]

I think that they're on the same. But Baker, remember, Baker's kind of got like a power of running backs, lower body. I've, like, I've spent time with Bacon. He, like, he, he's thick. Right, Right. But so similar mobility. But yeah, Jalen hurts the mobility. Similar Bill, but also thicker build.

[Steve]

But you think. Do you think the Ty Simpsons as mobile as Jalen Hurts?

[McShay]

No, I said, I said Jalen hurts is more mobile and. Okay. Yes. Okay.

[Steve]

I'm sorry.

[McShay]

The only one. I would say Baker, it's in the same. It's on the same level. And then you look at the rest of this league like, like Cam Ward, obviously, different level. And he's six, six one and a half, 220 thicker, I think. Right. I don't know that he's more mobile, to be honest, but he has more instinctive mobility. Josh Allen's a monster. Malik Willis athleticism. Drake May's a monster. Lamar Jackson's athleticism. And just. He's from a different planet. Joe Burrow, six what six four six three. Six four, right. Yeah. Six three and a half coming out of lsu. Stroud six three. I'm just going down the list. Trevor's like six five. Bo Nix is six two. Let's see Dak Prescott obviously is much bigger. Mahomes I mean Homes is from a different planet. Jared Goff, 6 4. Caleb Williams, different planet. Jordan Love tall and like all the traits. So really when I look at it like what could work in a similar frame. It's Brock Purdy.

[Steve]

Yeah.

[McShay]

And Brock Purdy as the seventh round pick got dropped into one of the great all time situations with no pressure coming out as Mr. Irrelevant. One of if not the like the mind offensively in the NFL in Kyle Shanahan and they didn't always have all these weapons but what it was, you know Debo and Ayuk and and Christian McCaffrey and George Kittle offensive line. So, so that's why I say let's put our GM hat on. You know because yeah there's a lot to factor in here because we talk I we did a whole show essentially on every quarterback with 33 plus starts in the league. That's that you would consider above that line of a good starter where you're not worried about who your starter is except for three names. Bryce Young and we're still finding out like where, where he's going to be and certainly you know encouraged by the way he finished last year and the two other guys are superhuman Patrick and Josh. So that's where we are and I want to finish it with this Steve. He's going in round one. Is it a team trading up like Arizona from 34 which I didn't reflect in the two round mock because with the ringer.com McShay our brand new website that houses all of this information now we're thrilled about and we'll get to the Mach 2.3.0 in the second round and kind of the things we want to in a minute but but when I I just am trying to figure out where the fit is and that's what I can't and I can say to you. Yeah I talked to a source who thinks there's a team that's more interested than we would think that might not be the ones that you're thinking of. Great. That does nobody any good. I know the Steelers aren't taking him. I know the jets aren't taking him. Unless again unless something changed drastically from from conversations I've had. I We know Mendoza is going one overall. Dolphins brought in Malik. Right. The Cardinals are sitting there. They're not taking them at three. Where. Where the Browns are not taking them at 6. There's talk maybe at 24. My gosh, I'd like. I don't want them. I don't want anything. I appreciate Ty Simpson's game so much. I want nothing to do with him going 16 to the jets or 24 to the Browns. It's where quarterbacks go to die until otherwise proven.

[Steve]

Is there another team lurking? Is that Matt, the mystery team?

[McShay]

I think it's.

[Steve]

I mean, the Cardinals seem like the most obvious landing spot. That's where you put them. And I think that makes a ton of sense. What I would. If we're going to further that conversation, more likely than not, he's starting by week nine, which. Kobe Brissette is your starting quarterback at the Cardinals. I think it's more likely than not that if you draft Ty Simpson in the second round or trade back into the first round, especially we trade back in the first round to get him. He's starting by Week 9 or Game 9 of the NFL season next year. Not ideal. Not ideal in my mind

[McShay]

with the Cardinals. Yeah, I'll take week nine. As long as it's not week one in week five, six, or seven or eight.

[Steve]

I mean, we've seen this before because Jacoby Brissette was the quarterback when Drake May got there. Right. And it's a different thing. Drake May is. Is, you know, Drake May is a different kind of prospect, man. He's on another level. And they were like, oh, we're going to sit him. We're going to sit him. And they get halfway through the year and things aren't going well. You're like, we might as well get this guy reps. I don't know.

[McShay]

I. I just can't. Like, the Seahawks are. The Patriots are. The Broncos are working in reverse order in the second round. The. The Rams were told no. Certainly with what their mission is right now, they're not using that 13th pick on them, and they don't pick again till 61. The Bears aren't. The Texans aren't. The 49ers aren't. The Jaguars aren't. The Chargers certainly are. The Eagles, the Steel, the Steelers, I'm told no. The packers, the Panther, like, the Lions, the Vik. The Vikings just got their guy, presumably. Like, yeah, I just don't know.

[Steve]

The Vikings is interesting.

[McShay]

The Vikings is mild, as I said that. And I want to pass over it.

[Steve]

It's a little interesting. I'm just saying. Did they get their guy?

[McShay]

I don't.

[Steve]

I don't know if they got their guy.

[McShay]

It's actually not. Yeah, keep an eye on that.

[Steve]

Put a pin on that one.

[McShay]

Yeah. So anyway, yeah, that's where we are on, on tight. And we will talk about it, I'm sure. A whole lot more coming up. But I wanted to. I feel like this is the week of Ty Simpson and Ty Simpson gate. And it turns out it's Ty Simpson's pro day today and he does everything you'd expect him to do. Doesn't change anything that you would think coming in. Whether you love him or this episode

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[Steve]

Somewhere out there is a Chevy truck

[McShay]

and the person who drives it, well,

[Steve]

that's a Chevy person. You probably know one, your buddy, your sister. Ones who always show up. They're the first to rise, the last to leave. They always have that little extra something

[McShay]

and maybe you've got it, too.

[Steve]

Chevrolet together, let's drive. Visit chevy.com trucks to explore the lineup.

[McShay]

Can't stand them. All right, let's get to this. The second round of the mock draft, which if you're a subscriber to the newsletter, the McShay Report. We appreciate you had a huge boot. Like people are jumping on this is the time this month. Google it. The McShay Report subscribe this is where the premium content is going to be provided. A second round on top of the first round. That's on the ringer.com mcshay I wanted to get your you said something interesting to me the other day men and it piqued my interest and it piqued Dan Comer's interest. And so when we had the conversation yesterday, we wanted to circle back on it. It you said and I don't know if it was a backhanded compliment or just a slap in the face or it was just kind of cool. The second round of the mock draft was actually more interesting to you than the first round.

[Steve]

Yeah.

[McShay]

Take me through what piqued your interest and we can bounce back and forth on some different things for different reasons.

[Steve]

And let's just start with the first pick of the second round. Let's talk about the jets getting Caleb Banks, the defensive tackle from Florida, 6 foot 6, 327 pounds, 35 inch arms. I think he might be the most naturally talented player in the entire draft. I think he has a higher ceiling than maybe anyone else. Here's the deal. He's got foot problems. He's got foot injuries since the end of the 2024 season. I'm not a big NBA guy, but I'm told that the taller, bigger guys with foot injuries is usually a red flag. So I was fascinated that you had him and then I told you this recently. I, I was like I, I either texted you or we were on the phone. I was like dude, Caleb Banks. You were right. I went back and watched the tape. The, the, I think he's played three games this year. He's an absolute monster when he turns it on. Like I have no other way he could play up and down the line. He's, he's on the, he's at the best on the inside but if you want to play him in a four eye and a base three man front, you can do that. I mean he can do really anything you want for him and his, his length, upper body strength.

[McShay]

Well you see here just in the Senior bowl when he goes and keeps his somewhat low. Look at that Mike.

[Steve]

Dude, that's a 300, that's a 327 pound guy rushing the passer. The film is dominant at times. He was dominant at times at the Senior bowl though. I for some reason that Tuesday the one on ones he was a little underwhelming but after that he just turned it on. Thought he played well. Maybe he doesn't do to talk as much as he does, but whatever, whatever gets you going.

[McShay]

He could get arrested for some of the things that comes out of his mouth, but go ahead.

[Steve]

So yeah, I mean a little out of control but the jets at 33 getting there is potentially an absolute steal. Or it's the jets are just jetting again because they take a guy who won't be able to stay healthy.

[McShay]

Well, if the whole play. This is my thought on that.

[Steve]

Fascinating pick. It's a fascinating pick if the whole

[McShay]

plan is to build to. When we're inserting a quarterback in 2027 and he'll be ready by all accounts like he'll be ready for, for training camp, but maybe not like you know, OTAS and, and rookie mini camp and stuff like that. You're not that.

[Steve]

By the way, I didn't even mention the combine workout by the way, I didn't even mention the combine workout that this guy put together. Unbelievable 32 inch vertical jump at, at 300 and what is it, 327 pounds. What are we even talking about?

[McShay]

Yeah, just over what is like a 50440 yard dash. You can see on your screen now 176. Is it a 10 yard.

[Steve]

It's supposedly. And supposedly already had the broken foot. I mean supposedly he already, he was doing this.

[McShay]

He did it the night before. Yeah, so, but yeah, so that, that's the concern. But we don't, we're not worried about necessarily what he's going to bring in his rookie year. Obviously you want to develop him get. But like there's not this rush to where you're not inserting him into a playoff run where you need him to play his best season as a rookie, you know, or get the most out of him. So that one was intriguing. There was another intriguing pick to me that I, I contemplated. Let me throw this one at you. Let's just go back and forth here a little. Okay. I contemplated, I thought I was just

[Steve]

going to get to snipe, but. All right, here we go.

[McShay]

Yeah, let's have some fun.

[Steve]

Let's go with it.

[McShay]

I had Kenyon Sadiq falling to 27 to the 49ers because what's interesting is if he doesn't go into a couple spots, there's not many teams that are like, it's not that they don't need a tight end or wouldn't like that upgrade and certainly you can use him with another starting wide tight end and have like, you know, in a league where we're seeing more jumbo packages and under center. Like it's kind of the cyclical things coming back around. But, but I can. I contemplated at 19 giving Siddiq to the Panthers.

[Steve]

Okay.

[McShay]

But like a couple other teams where I contemplated, you know, offloading him in the mock draft, it was like, man, but this, this tackle group's running out or they, they could really use this other position. But for, for the Panthers specifically, it was Blake Miller and I'm looking at like when I get to 51 of them, Carolina, if I didn't get my offensive tackle and they get icky is. Ikwanu is injured and they, they like got. They could use another offensive lineman.

[Steve]

There's some question marks there. Yep.

[McShay]

There's some question marks. Right? Yep. They can line up and play today, but they certainly, it looks like they're going to really want to bring in an offensive tackle or an offensive guard in the first three rounds. So I gave him Blake Miller with that first pick and then Eli Stowers is sitting there at 51 and I'm like, yeah, yeah. I just, I, I love that fit. You've got a young quarterback. What's the next step in the development? You brought, you brought in Teteroa McMillan last year and he had offensive rookie of the year. How about the middle? Like, to me, you look at middle field access yards after catch, Bryce Young needs some easy completions. And so what is he missing in that offense? I think like, look at, I looked it up today. Tommy Tremble, Jotavian, Sanders and Mitch.

[Steve]

That's what I was thinking. I was just trying to look up now. Yep.

[McShay]

They combined Mensch for 55 catches. 543 and three touchdowns all year. A good tight end, one alone is like seven to 900 receiving.

[Steve]

And they.

[McShay]

Okay, they took the, they also took

[Steve]

the kid out of Notre Dame last year too. Right? They took. Right. And they keep taking cuts. Third round, Tremble, fourth round, Sanders, fifth round, Evans. I think you keep. They clearly see I, I think that to me is an indication that they're viewing it the same way that you are because they keep trying to get this player. You know, they keep drafting tight ends. It's not, they're not drafting tight ends. They continue to do it. Stop messing around. Get one in the second round. Get a guy that you really think can be a dude. I like the Stowers pick.

[McShay]

Yeah. And you think about Dave Canalis offense too. When he was in Tampa Bay with Baker and like Kaden Otten and like they were. They really got those Tight ends involved. And I want to remind people like we had, we had Scott Goldman come on from AIQ and talked about sours as one of the guys that just popped and typically when a guy pops with the, the intelligence testing and like spatial awareness and reaction skills and all the different things that they test those guys have, typically there's a correlation to success in the NFL. And he's. He checks in at 603 6, 239 pounds, runs a 4, 5 1, a 1 5, 9, 10 and has combined best for position 45 and a half inch vertical jump, 113 broad jump. His tape doesn't show that much explosion but it shows explosion and I think there's more there for him.

[Steve]

I don't know.

[McShay]

I just, I, I was intrigued by that pick. What else jumped to you in the second round?

[Steve]

You bring up the offensive tackles. Because I, I just cannot wrap my mind around it. I love the Raiders getting maxi and from Arizona state at 36, I don't understand how a dude like that gets out of the first round. And I'll say this too. And, and I feel very comfortable. There is some left tackle versus right tackle considerations to take here and that left tackle Kaden Proctor from Alabama plays left tackle. Indian Rocher plays right tackle. I, I think you should be fired if you, you like to do the fireball offense. That's a fireball offense. If you take Proctor over Ian OTU or his tape, Proctor's tape is not.

[McShay]

But Proctor worked out so well today at Alabama's pro day. He looked brilliant. Field Yates is on, on the TV earlier today saying he's the talk of Tuscaloosa.

[Steve]

Oh my guy from here, great GM

[McShay]

there is talking about Kaden Proctor and the traits.

[Steve]

Great. My guy from Arizona State's 321 pounds, 33 and 78 inch arms at the combine, which means he probably has 36 arms at his pro day he ran a 4. He ran a 49140 with a 173 split in an. In a. I think It's. I said 9 foot 7. I think it was an 8 foot 7.

[McShay]

But whatever.

[Steve]

His broadjump is an outstanding result for a tackle. What are we talking about? I don't, I don't understand what like he. Maxi Natur is checked. Had a really good week at the Senior Bowl. He's checked so many boxes and I love his story and people talk about how, you know, he didn't start playing football until I think his second year of junior college was a basketball guy. You know, you Went through the whole thing. It's a great story. It's a great story. He's not as raw as you might think based on that story. There's things he's got to clean up. I'm not saying he's the most polished guy coming out of college, but this is not as much of a project.

[McShay]

I don't think some people think is that polished.

[Steve]

Kane Proctor and Kate don't listen. I don't want to like get into a negative thing here. I just don't understand the Kate Proctor love at all. I will go this far, and I've said this before, I understand that Blake Miller is a first round tackle. I've. I understand I've taken my medicine. I'm not going to go and say and start saying things just because two months ago I said or a month ago, whatever it is that I said differently. I'm going to evolve and I'm going to be correct at the end and, and say those things. I'm taking Maxi and over over Blake Miller. That's how, how strongly I feel about Ian Auror. I get it like Miller still go in the first round, but if I'm Carolina and I'm looking at a right tackle at 19, I'm taking Ian Oor. I think he's got more upside. I think he has better tape now. And as good as Blake Miller worked out, he had a great workout. Ian Archae's workout was better. Like, I don't get why people don't have him higher. So that was, that was the second one that jumped out to me. I love the Raiders getting them there. I just don't understand how he gets out of the first.

[McShay]

Were there any halls that you really liked in terms of?

[Steve]

Oh, well, first of all, the jets take advantage in your, in your draft, right? Like we could just both agree that it's hard to compete with that kind of a thing when you get Arvel Reese, Omar Cooper Jr. Caleb Banks and Anthony Hill Jr. The inside linebacker from Texas, they've been

[McShay]

just taking advantage of their whole front seven and they've got a wide receiver opposite Garrett Wilson now.

[Steve]

Like, good for them. Yeah, and I hope they do that. The other one that I really jumped out to me that I think is, is Kansas City. And when you get Monsoon Delane and we might get into this a little bit later, but the monster workout he just had at the pro day answered any questions they had about his, his speed, I mean, and ran like the, the four threes. That is such a good fit for them. That Pick at nine is value pick. So you're starting off right away with a number nine. You're getting an absolute home run. And I think their second pick is what, 29th. And they get Gabe Akis from Illinois, who you have been on for a while now. And I went back and was like, dude, what do. How is this guy not been ranked higher the whole time? 33 inch arms, 260 pounds. He's built like an NFL edge. He has 19 sacks over the last two. Two seasons. The way he gets to the quarterback and wins with his hands translates to the pro game. I'm with you, man.

[McShay]

I, I.

[Steve]

And so I love that pick. Now, the receiver they get in the second round is Chris Brazell. Chris Brazel, the second from Tennessee, and I like him. I like that. I don't mind that pick. I'm not mad at it. I think that's a good value pick there. But Jeremy Bernard is still on the board, and you stop chasing. Stop chasing speed Kansas City and start taking guys like, who's been your best draft pick.

[McShay]

Yeah, I don't, I don't disagree with that. I've said, I think. Look at Richard's reliability. Yeah.

[Steve]

Look at Rice's workout compared to Jeremy Bernard's workout and the type of the receipt in the frame and the type of the receivers that they are. I, I'm gonna. I mean, I'll talk about Jeremy Bernard when Jeremy Bernard as much as I possibly can on this pod. And I just think if you're the Kansas City Chiefs and you can get him in the second round. Home run. Home run. Again, I like Chris Brazil the second. I like what they do. It's a very good haul.

[McShay]

I liked what the Dolphins did. I just have a hard time getting in excited about the Dolphin. Like, I literally went through, and I was like, these are, like, where they got these players, man, I'd be pumped because they. They get Mai Lemon, who. I want to remind people, they get mai lemon at 11. They get Colton Hood at 30, which I think is the sweet spot for Colton Hood, the other Tennessee Cornerback opposite J. McCoy, who didn't play in 2025.

[Steve]

I love that pick. Right.

[McShay]

And then, and then I don't know, the Malachi Lawrence from UCF is going to be there. If you had to say, pick a shocking name that could go off the board in round one, I actually want

[Steve]

to talk to you about him.

[McShay]

Okay, so Malachi Lawrence, they got in round two at 43 overall. Okay. But like, Makai Lemon, I wanted people to understand. Yeah, he's 5 11, 192 pounds. And he ran somewhere between 448 and 45 3, depending on the Scout you trust at the USC pro day. And his heels touched on every stride. I saw that too. But like you talk about clean catching the ball, everything is full speed but under control. Like he's on a rail man, in and out of breaks, no motion wasted. The toughness he shows the after catch ability. First defender, almost. You watch his tape, find me put, come curious like a clip reel. You come up with the first defender after a catch, actually brings him down alone. It's not going to be a long reel. And, and then even like if you're, if you're an analytics guy, you posted a 3.0 career yards per route run versus man and zone. The only other guys to do that, jsn, Jalen Waddle, Jamar Chase, Devonte Smith and Dwayne Eskridge. So like it's pretty good company. So anyway, I, I like the Dolphins, but I just don't like what it's going to take a lot over multiple years. And you know, I love Jeff Halfley. He's, he's one of my guys.

[Steve]

Yeah, you're, you're a Halfley guy.

[McShay]

Yeah, big time. And, and got to know him here when he was, he was at the Heights at Boston College and, and John Eric Sullivan from the people I know in the league. He comes very highly recommended and has that, you know, the Chief's back background and Brett Veach working with Andy Reid. So I'm excited to see how they do it over the next two to three years. But it's hard to get excited about some of those hauls. You know, I am curious about your opinion on Cole Payton before we go to the other pro days. Real quickly, I had to get him in the second round. I had him going 61 overall to the Rams.

[Steve]

You know how I feel.

[McShay]

Be a pretty good backup man to handle some, some grunt work. It's.

[Steve]

If it's a great spot to land

[McShay]

for a couple years, it's a phenomenal spot to land.

[Steve]

It's the best position for him to develop and it puts him in a great job to a great spot to succeed.

[McShay]

Do some short yardage and gets creative goal line stuff. I don't know. That one's intriguing to me. I think Cole Payton's going to be one of the surprises of the draft, but it's just going to wait till maybe the second round for it to happen. But let me give you my, Let

[Steve]

me give you my Malachi North Dakota

[McShay]

State quarterback, by the way.

[Steve]

Right.

[McShay]

Go ahead.

[Steve]

Yeah. Who we've argued about a ton. But let me give you the Malachi Lawrence thing. You know, I'll try to be quick here. Okay. This is the Malachi Lawrence combine workout. He is 6 4, 253 pounds 33 and 58 inch.

[McShay]

You can see all this information on.

[Steve]

Yeah.

[McShay]

The ringer.com McShay and it's, it is fueled by my man mentioned myself and it is like it's our Holland's opus and it's just the first chapter of it, but keep going.

[Steve]

So 45241, 59 split 40 inch vertical 1010 broad. Now let me give you who I think he is. Shades of at this point. I'm not saying he's going to get there. This player was six three, 251, 33 and a quarter inch, arms very close in terms of size and length. He ran a 46540 with a 164. How about the same vertical 40 inches, a 10 foot 8 broad. Any idea who the con. Who I see shades of here or do you want to just. I'll just give it to you. It's another.

[McShay]

By the way, the size again. Say the size again.

[Steve]

663-251. Neither one of these guys played in the Power Four Conference.

[McShay]

Is he in the NFL today?

[Steve]

Yes. I, I think because there's been rumors that he might not be next year.

[McShay]

Khalil Mack.

[Steve]

Khalil Mack, man. And it's again, I think Khalil Mack was better against the run. Malachi Lawrence has got to get a little, a little better against the run. But the thing and this I'll say about Malachi Lawrence that I love, the dude does not stay blocked. He never gears down. If you, you block with two guys, you chip him. He doesn't gear down. He just keeps coming. He misses the quarterback, which he does way too frequently and drives me nuts. He's got to play a little bit more under control. I love playing with your hair on fire, but just slow down a beat, break down and finish the play sometimes. I mean, I thought he had could have like 16 sacks watching the tape. It was that insane. But the motor rushing the passer is so much fun to watch. I mean, he is we, we say relentless a lot. I, maybe I get carried away with it. This dude truly is a relentless pass rusher. Then I think when he gets in the NFL, people are going to be like, holy. I think he could sneak in the first round like you. I just think he's that. When you look at the upside and you look at the effort. Yes. He's got to get stronger against the run. He's going to be an outside linebacker and a base three man front. He's got to be in the right fit. He's not for everyone. I get all that.

[McShay]

That.

[Steve]

But you're talking about a guy who can get to the quarterback.

[McShay]

Yeah, yeah. He's. He's become one of my. It's nice to share a favorite, but you were first to market. I will give you that. I will give you that. I like the quarter zip today, too.

[Steve]

The kids always mixing it up.

[McShay]

It defines. It's like the. It's the culture these days. You're either a hoodie guy or a quarter zip guy. And it seems like you're a little bit more refined these days. I like that match.

[Steve]

My wife Iris may or may not be behind this, but, yeah, I'm absolutely.

[McShay]

All right. Stuff. Some pro day stuff. I don't blame her. I want to bounce around a little bit here because there's some interesting things. I think the obvious is. And you mentioned mansour Delaine at LSU, right? And he runs a 4. 3. I even said before we ran on our show on Monday, I was like, I don't even know if. If you like. Why. If you're not gonna. But he. But fast. Guys run fast. And he ran fast. And so that not only like squashes, but it's like, oh, he's a 438 guy, too. You know, with.

[Steve]

Yeah.

[McShay]

How smart and instinctive and the man and zone and all the things he's. And he's a 438 guy. I would have guessed 442, 445. Like, fine.

[Steve]

That's, like, psychedelic. Would have been psyched if you ran a four.

[McShay]

You told me you ran a four. Four, five. I'm like, check it. Let's go top. Top ten pick. Worst case, 11, Miami, 12 Cowboys. I'm not saying a 40 time, but no position does a 40 time effect positively or negatively, more and rightfully so than the cornerback position. The Giants too rich at 5.

[Steve]

We said the other day, before he ran. We didn't think so. We thought that they would go in another direction. But two. You know, I'm not afraid to pound myself on the back. I will. I'll do it. We said before he ran that he had to be considered at 5 because of how good his tape is. And you.

[McShay]

And you.

[Steve]

You had them going in a different direction, and that's fine. But you have to consider him, man. I think you have to consider him. He is head and shoulders the best corner in this draft. It's not even close.

[McShay]

I, I completely agree with that. I think the tough part is you're st, you're John Harbaugh in his first draft with the Giants with the assist from Joe Shane.

[Steve]

What do you mean? Joe Shane's not going to be there

[McShay]

next year and you're staring down the gun bar. I'm not saying he's not going to be there next year. I'm saying it's the assist of staring down the gun barrel of Jeremiah Love, Sonny Stiles, Caleb Downs, who did not run today at the we will not get times at the from Caleb Downs. Not surprising. But you're staring down the gun barrel of arguably the three best players in this draft. And I love Delane, but is he, you know what I mean? So that, that's going to be interesting. But like the worst case is but hold on.

[Steve]

You're, you're talking about styles and off the ball linebacker. You're talking about downs, a safety and we're talking about a corner.

[McShay]

No, I, I know I, I, I know I said but I think most would agree and maybe, maybe I'm like it's not that significant of a grade difference. I promise you that, that I think most would have have those other three graded slightly higher.

[Steve]

Slightly higher.

[McShay]

But some may not.

[Steve]

Yeah. I think Delane's made a real and good for him, man. With the steel and it started with. It all starts with the tape, man. He has made a real run at being a top five.

[McShay]

Tape is beautiful, man. It is beautiful. And he doesn't get shot. He early on, he, he, it's like he, he came out on the lawn and posted a sign like, right.

[Steve]

You might want to throw this way. Yep.

[McShay]

Beware. You know.

[Steve]

You know, there are times where it's like don't even throw to the side of the field because you think I'm doing one thing and I'm over here. I've got my. I know exactly how you're trying to attack.

[McShay]

Get there and make.

[Steve]

I, I don't need to stay with the guy that I'm supposed to stay with. I'll go get the ball.

[McShay]

Also from the LSU pro day. I thought it was interesting thing. Here's a name we haven't talked about probably since the fall, but like really kind of dug in since August. Harold Perkins. Harold Perkins. Where are we on good old.

[Steve]

Where are we on Harold Perkins? I'd love to ask you, like I. This has been since his sophomore year. I feel like this has been the ultimate roller coaster.

[McShay]

That Arkansas game. Harold Perkins in 2023, I want to say was one of the best individual defensive performances I can ever remember watching on television. He was out the sacks, the force fumbles, the. The hits, the sideline to sideline. He was absolutely awesome. And he did a lot of that throughout that season. But then he had the injury the following season. They moved positions. He can't take on blocks. He's not a good tackler. He's just not 18.8% missed tackle rate during his career and struggles with kind of the instincts in the field.

[Steve]

He seemed a little lost.

[McShay]

Correct. Now you got that part, but here's the other part. Just under, just a tick under 6 foot 1, 220 pounds for 35 inch vertical 104 broad 88 career pressure, 17 sacks. And I want to remind people, Sunny Styles, Arvell Reese, both being talked about. Top five picks ran 4, 4, 6. And we were like grabbing at each other's shoulders and like, like, like the hot. It was like the Hawks freaking out at the end of the bench when Larry Bird was, you know, had that. That night he. Perkins ran a 4, 3, 8 official time. They're calling it a pro day. I don't even know what that means, but. But in that he ran a sub 4, 4.

[Steve]

Good for him. Because I also think one of the things, one of the things that we'll talk like that should be mentioned in this is that I felt like he was the scapegoat in a lot of ways for what happened with LSU's defense. And I thought that was unfair, that everyone was like, oh, Harold Perkins this and Harold Perkins that. And listen, he didn't play up to the standard that we thought he was going to play. After watching that Clemson tape in the opener, which he was really good in that game, played really well in that game, we're like, oh, here it comes. He's turning, he's turning the corner and it just didn't come to fruition. I understand that and I understand he didn't play well at times, but the idea that it was Harold Perkins fault that LSU's defense wasn't as good at certain times, kind of crazy to me.

[McShay]

Defensive coordinator, he went into his office and it's like, yeah, you know, whatever

[Steve]

you want me to play, coach, man.

[McShay]

Yeah. And like, no, like, where do you want to play? Where do you feel? He's like, wherever you want. He's like, no, you tell me. And then. And they made the adjustment. So he's an intriguing guy. Like I don't do the traits.

[Steve]

Maybe like the potential teams guy that turns into a.

[McShay]

But I think it could have been a. You start to see these traits and you go back and look at the best of. I think a defensive coordinator and a special teams coach and all that could be like let's take a hack in the fourth round. You know, I don't hate it. I don't hate it. So that. That was an intriguing result. Keonte Scott, here's another guy I want to talk to you about Miami. A lot to love on his tape. A lot of stuff not to love. In 2024, didn't have the best season at Auburn, transfers to Miami.

[Steve]

He

[McShay]

in 2025 at Miami. Right. He has 64 tackles, five sacks, two interceptions, two force fumbles. Okay. He played during his career. Talk about experience. Over 2,000snaps. I don't have what is listed. I'll pull it up right here.

[Steve]

Do you want to get it?

[McShay]

I got it. Keante Scott at the combine was. I don't have what his size was. It didn't say at the pro day from Miami, but Keonte Scott at the comb. Eleven and a quarter. 193 pounds, 30, 31 and 3, 8 inch arm length, about average 9 and 5, 8 hand average, but did not work out. So he goes to Miami and he works out at their pro day, the Canes pro day. And he runs somewhere between a 425 and a 432 were the reports that I got. He also had a verified 44 inch vertical. Obviously those would have been best in class. I'm looking at the corner.

[Steve]

Sorry, did you say 44 inch vertical?

[McShay]

Yeah. D' Angelo Pons had a 43 and a half inch vertical and was best in class for the corner. So it would have been best in class in both. And I want to remind you, like it was one of the fastest cornerback classes ever. Just like every other position. So he goes out and does that and he's a guy now. Love the physicality. I love his awareness and zone. I love that speed. Now tells me he there's, you know, the recovery and everything else. Excellent awareness, an excellent feel. Just plays the game you want. You want your DBs to play. Especially as that nickel right again, just like Perkins, his missed tackle rate. I didn't realize it was that low. I mean I see it on tape. 20.3% in 2025. He missed like a fifth of his tackle opportunities according to. Pff. Yeah. So there's that to unpack. But this is a cornerback class that's got a, a good amount of talent. Man. When you start with, you start with Delane and we just talked about. And then you get to McCoy who's by the way, his pro days next Tuesday. Then you get to the, you know, the Colton Hoods and the Avion Terrell's and your boy Chris Johnson, who I love too. And I mean, here's the second round mock. There's. There's a whole bunch of them. Right. I did notice that was interesting going through the mock exercise. I had Avion Terrell, it was right after Hood went third 30. I had Avion Terrell going 35 to the Titans. I then had Chris Johnson. It was a dip. And this won't happen on draft night. I got to believe these guys earlier go earlier. Chris Johnson going 50 to the Lions, then Brandon C. Say from, from South Carolina going to the packers two picks later at 52. Then D' Angelo Ponds going at 58. So I don't know that number. I'm not saying it bumps him in the second round or anything crazy like that, but I think it's squarely like if you had any question, top 100, he's there. But I, I think it. Now it becomes intriguing. Could he be in the second round? Like those are traits that, that are highly coveted at that position.

[Steve]

I'm with you. I will. Since we're bringing up corners and I, I'm just kind of. I know we're talking about his counter Scott's pro day, but if Jamal McCoy doesn't work out at his pro day, he is.

[McShay]

I saw there's video of him doing, doing all the drills today that came up.

[Steve]

So he's gonna, he's gonna.

[McShay]

He is. Yeah. Yeah. They wouldn't be releasing that and promoting that. He's going. Okay, but. No, I know. I, I hear you. I know what you're trying to say. So. So there's that part of it. Then there's. There's some other guys I'm just gonna rip through a few. I'll go one at a time. And you tell me if this does anything for you. Will Pauling, wide receiver from Notre Dame, give you a little background on about 510, 190. Cincinnati began his career in 2022 at 12 catches for 122. Two seasons at Wisconsin, 23 and 24. Had 116 catches, 1241 yards, nine touchdowns. Goes to Notre Dame this year. They get a handful of guys competing the Notre Dame guys never have great production. Receiving 26 catches.381 Average 14.7 with six touchdowns. Volume Slot receiver kind of throughout his career with some vertical explosiveness. He runs a 4,3 7 with a 42 inch vertical. Not invited to the combine. Anything.

[Steve]

I think speed's overrated for receivers. I think we, we do this all the time. I'm, I mean, I'm, I'm definitely, I think he's a day three draft pick. I think he should have been invited the combine, but I don't, I just, We, I, I, I'm not falling into the speed trap with these guys. I'm just not. He's a smaller receiver, he's a slot guy. I think you can bring him in and you give him a shot like anyone else. I don't think that, that, that 40 times specifically, I'm gonna be like, we need this guy. This is pro day season for me, man. Like these like certain numbers, like the, the Scott number and the delay number I get and like a lot of that's great, but we knew Will Pauling was fast. We're not gonna sit here and be like, oh, now all of a sudden I'm gonna make him a fourth round guy. All right, all right, all right. Round guy.

[McShay]

Yeah. Yes. Late round guy was bummed he didn't get invited to combine. Like his tape more than people thought. He's a late round slot. Comes in, hopefully earns a spot on a roster as a number four, number five slot receiver. Yes. Okay. Another guy, Chris Hilton, I didn't love his tape. He was at the Hula bowl, the American bowl, the Shrine bowl, and then the Senior Bowl. He got invited late. LSU wide receiver, 6 foot 188. He ran a 4, 4 3, 38 and a half inch vertical. 6973 cone drop, 431 short shuttle. Reached top speed in position drills at 23.3, which is actually the most intriguing part of all those numbers to me. Just throwing that out there. Another day three guy, probably. Who?

[Steve]

Brian Kelly's player.

[McShay]

Okay. Yes. Jeff Caldwell, who blew up the combine at Cincinnati. From Cincinnati in Indianapolis. He blew it up. Remember, he had the 43140, 42 inch vertical. He's a monster 6, 5 and a half, 216 pounds. Had 112 broad jump. All those measurables. Right. Apparently he did not catch the ball well during. He dropped his handful of passes and like, didn't, you know, that's something, that, that's something of interest as we're talking about a Guy who's the, the measurements don't necessarily match up with the tape, but there's some really intriguing stuff on the tape.

[Steve]

Right.

[McShay]

Just, just thought that was interesting. Also at the Cincinnati Pro Day, Jake Golday, he ran a 6, 8, 4, 3 cone drill, which I actually put some stock into. Is that kind of linebacker and a guy who's kind of tall, thickly built in a 433 in the short shuttle, you know, but that, that 684 is fricking awesome for his, his size at that linebacker spot.

[Steve]

I'm a little higher on him than I think you are. It's a good off the ball linebacker class though. This is that, that off the ball linebacker classes. I, I mean I really like those guys, but I think all Day is a versatile player.

[McShay]

Rush.

[Steve]

He plays over the slot more than you think for a guy that size. I'm not surprised he worked out well. I think that there's been, there's a lot of mock drafts early on in this process that had him going lay first. I, I think he's going to be, I think he's going to go earlier than some people think.

[McShay]

I want to give you a couple names that I, I want to at some point circle back on. Okay.

[Steve]

Okay.

[McShay]

We never really broke down Trey Moore, the linebacker from Texas. He had a sensational combine and he ran a 4, 2, 1 in the short shuttle and a 708 in the 3 cone and apparently looked awesome in his drills, both as a pass rusher. He was listed as an edge, but he played. He was kind of that hybrid for them, kind of a jacker for Texas. I want to talk about him at one point. I also want to talk about this other linebacker. I, I haven't done his tape. Full transparency. Cincinnati's Jack Dingle. I'm watching next to Gold Day. He had a 713 cone, 35 inch vertical, 41 3. I talked about how. Yeah, but 4, 3, 3 for Gold Day in the short shuttle, he was a 413 hit 35 inch verticals to 23 bench press reps. He's 6, 4, 2, 35. He's got, there's some love, like a couple few visits. So he's another guy.

[Steve]

Six, four.

[McShay]

Yeah, six four, 235 pounds.

[Steve]

I, I love you, but as soon as you start, I was like, yeah, what is he, like five, eight? Michelle, like, what are we talking about? That's, that's, that's the inner dialogue for men this point of the year. Like, what are we talking about, dude, he's six' four and he moves like that.

[McShay]

I'm not bringing up names right now for my health. And Dan and Tucker are like, did you guys wrap up the show? I'm old. There are 400 reports from Pro pro days already that I could be listing right now. Yes. I think you have developed enough trust in me that I'm mentioning names that are important for us to circle back on as we are now 29 days from the draft. Teams are interested.

[Steve]

They shouldn't reach four. He's moving like that.

[McShay]

Skyler Bell. Fringe. Fringe. Top 100 guy, three cones, six, five, seven. Oh, yeah.

[Steve]

That was today, right? They worked. Or was it yesterday? They worked out, but yeah, yesterday.

[McShay]

6, 5, 7. Now one other scout headed 665. Either way, it's sensational. Cut the ball. Well, he's. He's an intriguing guy. Here's the last one I'm going to throw out today and I'll keep doing this as we go through because as pro day numbers come in, scouts start to text and team. You know, there's. There's a reason I'm mentioning specific names. Last one. I just finished up Grayson Halton's tape. I finished up Kaden Proctors from southeastern Louisiana in the middle of Zane Durant from Penn State. I'm doing all the three test techniques right now. Okay.

[Steve]

Yeah.

[McShay]

How about this? Sleeper from Louisville not invited to the combine. Renee Conga. Six foot four, three hundred is what he's listed. I got to find out what his exact measurables were.14% win rate. In. In. Yeah. Win rate in 2025. By comparison, Aaron Donalds was 20% Quin and Williams was 17%. Chris Jones was 16%. Puts them in the range of just Jeffrey Simmons, Dexter Lawrence. 14 and 13% respectively. Just as a backup. Yeah. And. And taller. You know, kind of linear frame for that position, but fits that mold then. You ready? 4, 7, 8, 40, 37 inch vertical, 102 broad jump, 4, 5, 6, shuttle and a 7, 2, 6, 3 cone. Which those numbers don't sound mind blowing because we just listed a bunch of receivers.

[Steve]

Right. But I want to.

[McShay]

I want to let you know and this and the jumps like they're indisputable. The. Even if the time was a little off, but the vertical, the broad, the shuttle and the three cone would have all been number one amongst the defensive tackles at the combine. And his 40 yard dash would have been second. Second to Grayson Halton, I believe. Right. So he's a guy to keep an eye on. Anything else

[Steve]

I've had, there's been a couple guys that I won't name re that I've watched recently that I was more excited about to watch based on their workouts. And they were kind of, kind of a letdown. So it'll be. It's always good to go back some

[McShay]

of the Kaden Proctor was a little bit of a let down and he's still a really good, good player and he still might be in the top 100. Yeah. Didn't dominate the way I thought. And it's frustrating when you finally get and you dig in. Like, I watched enough to know who he was, but then when I really, like, go through the whole thing and spend four hours of my day watching the tape. There's a very clear difference between the Peter woods, the, the Grayson Halton and then the.

[Steve]

Yeah.

[McShay]

All right, we gotta run, everyone.

[Steve]

Yeah. Dan's playing the Oscar music now. He's trying to play us off.

[McShay]

Yeah. Okay. You're a pain in the ass. But, but you got the, you get the, the three quarter zip. You get the red hat going. So you get five stars. As always. Men.

[Steve]

Thanks, man.

[McShay]

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[Steve]

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[McShay]

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