Ep. 672: MeatEater Radio Live! Clearing Trails, Getting Roasted, and Beaver Pillows

Summary

The MeatEater Podcast
Episode: Ep. 672: MeatEater Radio Live! Clearing Trails, Getting Roasted, and Beaver Pillows
Release Date: March 7, 2025

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Introduction and Overview

In Episode 672 of The MeatEater Podcast, host Randall Williams leads a vibrant live show from MeatEater’s headquarters in Bozeman, Montana. Joined by Maggie Hudlow, Brody Henderson, and Phil, the episode introduces new segments, engages with experts, and delves into various outdoor topics ranging from trail maintenance to culinary adventures.

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1. Trivia Segment: Fake News

[02:34 - 12:16]

A lively new segment titled Fake News kicks off the show, where Randall poses hunting or fishing-related headlines, and Maggie and Brody compete to identify the true one among multiple choices.

Notable Moments:

• First Headline: Rocky Mountain National Park has too many... A) Trails B) Elk C) Visitors D) Moose
  Quote:
  Randall Williams ([04:56]): "The actual headline... Colorado is a noteworthy exception. In Rocky Mountain National Park, wildlife managers are concerned that a moose population growing at 5% year over year is having a deleterious effect on wetland habitats and willow growth."

• Second Headline: Can Wildlife Heal? The Science behind Nature's Unexpected Remedy.
  Correct Answer: B) PTSD
  Quote:
  Randall Williams ([06:53]): "Researchers from the University of Massachusetts studied 19 veterans with PTSD and observed notable psychological benefits..."

• Third Headline: California officials urge residents to eat invasive...
  Correct Answer: Rodents (Nutria)
  Quote:
  Randall Williams ([09:37]): "According to an article in the Guardian, this call to action came during National Invasive Species Awareness Week..."

Despite some initial hiccups with dropped segments and humorous banter, the segment was well-received for its engaging and educational content.

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2. Interview with Rebecca Powell, Bob Marshall Wilderness Foundation

[12:33 - 26:39]

Rebecca Powell, Program Director for the Bob Marshall Wilderness Foundation, joins the show to discuss the organization's efforts in stewarding the 1.6 million-acre Bob Marshall Wilderness Complex. She details the foundation’s programs, including trail maintenance, education, and volunteer initiatives.

Key Topics Discussed:

• Role and Mission:
  Rebecca Powell ([13:00]): "We help steward the 1.6 million acre Bob Marshall Wilderness complex... We do a lot of education about wilderness."

• Volunteer Work:
  Rebecca Powell ([15:48]): "Volunteers clear trails, brush off alder, improve tread, and maintain admin cabins."

• Impact of Forest Service Cuts:
  Rebecca Powell ([17:18]): "Workforce cuts have reduced backcountry crews significantly, creating barriers for public and organizational efforts."

• Funding Challenges:
  Rebecca Powell ([20:39]): "Our program budget was cut 50%... Funding from the Great American Outdoors Act is currently frozen."

• Support Opportunities:
  Rebecca Powell ([22:40]): "Support through fundraisers, business partnerships, license plate sales, and monthly donations is crucial."

Rebecca emphasizes the importance of community support and adapts strategies to continue their conservation work despite funding challenges.

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3. MeatEater Roast: New Culinary Show

[28:06 - 35:38]

The episode highlights the launch of MeatEater Roast, a new culinary competition show. Randall and Chili walk viewers through the behind-the-scenes process, showcasing contestants preparing wild game dishes with mystery ingredients.

Highlights:

• Concept Explanation:
  Chili ([29:30]): "Two ordinary wild game cooks face a mystery protein revealed at the start, with 90 minutes to create a delicious dish."

• Contestant Engagement:
  Randall Williams ([35:18]): "I'm going to take the helm at that stove. So I wouldn't really count your chickens before they hatch..."

• Creative Challenges:
  Chili ([30:03]): "Every episode, there's a protein or a chunk of meat that's unknown until revealed."

The segment combines humor and culinary expertise, setting the stage for an engaging viewer experience.

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4. MeatEater Movie Club: Discussion of "The Bear" (1988)

[45:11 - 73:08]

In the MeatEater Movie Club, Randall presents a detailed analysis of Jean Jacques Anod's 1988 film The Bear. The discussion explores the film's portrayal of wildlife, ethical filmmaking practices, and technical achievements.

Key Insights:

• Film Overview:
  Randall Williams ([56:08]): "The Bear offers a mesmerizing glimpse into the wilderness through the eyes of its ursine protagonists."

• Technical Achievements:
  Randall Williams ([58:56]): "Authentic performances from real bears, stunning cinematography capturing nature's brutal reality and grandeur."

• Production Challenges:
  Randall Williams ([60:17]): "Bart the bear injured Anod during a photoshoot, resulting in a two-month recovery."

• Critical Reception:
  Roger Ebert's Review ([58:56]): "Their words are not meant to be language, but simply the sounds made by the animal named man."

• Host and Guests' Opinions:

  • Maggie Hudlow ([61:55]): "I have a hard time calling it a movie. I think it's propaganda at best."
  • Brody Henderson ([62:07]): "Anthropomorphism at its finest."

The discussion is interspersed with humorous critiques and personal anecdotes, reflecting the hosts' diverse perspectives on wildlife representation in film.

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5. Listener Feedback and Community Interaction

[35:38 - 73:48]

Throughout the episode, Randall, Maggie, Brody, and Phil engage with listener questions and comments, fostering a sense of community.

Notable Interactions:

• Password Joke:
  Listener ([36:02]): "Why does Randall always look like he's trying to remember his AOL password?"
  Randall Williams ([36:13]): "I am really bad with passwords..."

• Trivia Tournament:
  Listener ([36:42]): "Are we going to see some suck it Randall stickers to replace the suck it Brody stickers?"

• Turkey Predation Inquiry:
  Brendan from New Jersey ([37:12]): "Are we going to see some suck it Randall stickers..."

• Crossword Puzzle Scores:
  Listener ([42:15]): Inquiry about Randall's crossword scores.

• Birthday Wishes:
  Spencer in Chat ([73:25]): Wishes Brody a happy birthday mistakenly, leading to a humorous exchange.

The hosts respond warmly, sharing personal tidbits and encouraging further listener engagement through upcoming projects and segments.

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6. Closing Remarks and Call to Action

[73:48 - 76:07]

As the episode draws to a close, Brody announces the launch of the 2026 Effed Up Old Trucks Calendar, encouraging listeners to submit photos of their rugged hunting rigs. Randall and the team emphasize the calendar’s purpose: to donate a portion of sales to support backcountry hunters and anglers battling public land challenges.

Quote:
Brody Henderson ([73:57]): "We'll take submissions... donate a portion of the sales to backcountry hunters and anglers so they can keep on fighting these attacks on public lands."

The episode wraps up with final interactions and humorous exchanges, leaving listeners anticipating future shows and projects.

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Conclusion

Episode 672 of The MeatEater Podcast seamlessly weaves together informative discussions, interactive segments, and community engagement. From tackling environmental conservation challenges with Rebecca Powell to exploring culinary competitions and dissecting wildlife films, the episode offers a comprehensive and entertaining experience for outdoor enthusiasts and history buffs alike. Notable quotes and timestamps enrich the narrative, providing listeners with memorable insights and fostering a deeper connection with the MeatEater community.

Transcript

[Stephen Rinella]

Hey, American history buffs. Hunting history buffs, listen up. We're back at it with another volume of our Meat Eaters American History series. In this edition, titled the Mountain Men 1806-1840, we tackle the Rocky Mountain beaver trade and dive into the lives and legends of fellows like Jim Bridger, Jed Smith and John Colter. This small but legendary fraternity of backwoodsmen helped define an era when the west represented not just unmapped territory, but untapped opportunity for those willing to endure some heinous and at times violent conditions. We explain what started the Mountain man era and what ended it. We tell you everything you'd ever want to know about what the mountain men ate, how they hunted and trapped, what gear they carried, what clothes they wore, how they interacted with Native Americans, how 10% of them died violent deaths, and even detailed descriptions of of how they performed amputations on the fly. It's as dark and bloody and good as our previous volume about the white tailed deer skin trade, which is titled the Long Hunters 1761-1775. So again, you can buy this wherever audiobooks are sold. Meat Eaters American History the Mountain Men 1806-1840 by Stephen Rinella.

[Chili]

Smell us now lady.

[Randall Williams]

Welcome to Meat Eater Trivia Meat Eater Podcast welcome to Meat Eater radio live. It's 11am Mountain Time. That's 7pm Hungary time for those listeners in Hungary on Thursday, March 6th. And we're live from Meat Eater HQ in Bozeman, Montana. I'm your host Randall Williams, joined today by Maggie Hudlow and Brody Henderson. On today's show, we're kicking off a new segment called Fake News. We'll call in with Rebecca Powell from the Bob Marshall Wilderness Foundation. We're going to take you backstage for a look at Meat Eater's new culinary show, Meat Eater Roast. We'll chat with Caitlin Lo Spinoso, AKA Old Trapper Kate and we'll round out the show with another long awaited Meat Eater movie Club. Maggie and Brody, how are you guys doing?

[Maggie Hudlow]

Doing great.

[Brody Henderson]

Not so bad.

[Randall Williams]

Lovely.

[Brody Henderson]

How are you doing, Randall?

[Randall Williams]

I'm doing well. I'm doing well. It's great to have you here at Bozeman hq.

[Brody Henderson]

It's good to be here.

[Randall Williams]

Well, first up in a new segment we're calling Fake News, I'm going to share a selectively edited hunting or fishing related headline from the news and Brody and Maggie need to fill in the blank with multiple choice options. Only one of these is true according to this news article. And here's where we'll Add Phil's drop in later. Phil's just had a real busy week. Apologies to the listeners out there. Phil, what do you have to say.

[Phil]

For this to disappoint anybody? It's been a crazy week here at Meat Eater hq. We got a lot of new projects happening, and so I didn't have time to make a drop this week. I do have an idea. But then we thought we'd bring Chili in, and then he wimped out. Chili, if you're watching, good job. And so now we have nothing for you. And frankly, it's all Chili's fault.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yeah, yeah, Chili's working on Meat Eater Roast right now.

[Phil]

Phil.

[Randall Williams]

Well, the thing is, is he. He had agreed to do this, but then he said he couldn't figure out the cords, the chord progression, so.

[Maggie Hudlow]

So he did wimp out.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Phil]

So just imagine something. If you guys want to make some pitches in the live chat, I will read them. Not necessarily take them into consideration, but if you have a really good one, you might break through the ceiling.

[Randall Williams]

And I know it. It sounds like we're just killing time here, but I really think that with the announcement. With the announcement of the new segment, folks were keyed up. They were ready to go.

[Phil]

They're ready.

[Randall Williams]

So just imagine in your head what this would sound like.

[Phil]

The live viewer count.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Not to mention that Phil's drops are the best part of the whole damn show.

[Randall Williams]

I know, I know. I already feel like this show's a flop. Onto our first headline, Phil.

[Phil]

Sure thing. I'm using this slideshow for the very first time. There we are.

[Randall Williams]

Hey, so this is our first headline. Rocky Mountain national park has too many A, Trails. Rocky Mountain national park has too many B, Elk. Rocky Mountain national park has too many C, visitors. Or Rocky Mountain national park has too many D. Moose.

[Maggie Hudlow]

So we're looking for the one that's. That's fake.

[Randall Williams]

You're looking for the one that's true.

[Maggie Hudlow]

For true.

[Randall Williams]

The actual headline.

[Brody Henderson]

Okay, I'm gonna say be Elk.

[Randall Williams]

Mag says Be Elk.

[Maggie Hudlow]

God, I think I just read an article about something else. Like, I know they've had too many elk at one time, but I think the headline might be moose.

[Brody Henderson]

That was my other thought.

[Randall Williams]

Moose is your final answer. Brody gets it. Phil, do we have, like, a ding, ding, ding?

[Phil]

If I were a professional engineer, I would have one prepared, but unfortunately I don't.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Although I could find you a headline that says they have too many elk.

[Randall Williams]

I could find you a headline that says they have too many visitors as well. This one comes from our friends at Outdoor Life. While moose populations are down across much of their range in North America, Colorado is a noteworthy exception. In Rocky Mountain national park, wildlife managers are concerned that a moose population growing at 5% year over year is having a deleterious effect on wetland habitats and willow growth. A single moose can consume up to 45 pounds of willows in a day. And some areas of the park have seen a decline of up to 80% of their willows since 1999.

[Maggie Hudlow]

The wolves will take care of that problem for too long.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Just.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Just give it a little time.

[Randall Williams]

I almost added wolves in there as an option, but I thought it might be too on the nose and perhaps, you know, traumatizing or triggering to some of our audience. On to our second headline here, Phil. Can wildlife Heal? The Science behind Nature's Unexpected Remedy. The first answer is a chronic pain. The second is ptsd. Post traumatic stress disorder. C is autoimmune disorder. D is hypertension. What are we thinking here, gang? What can nature heal according to this article?

[Maggie Hudlow]

Go ahead, Maggie. You pick yours.

[Brody Henderson]

Ha. I'm gonna go B again. Ptsd.

[Maggie Hudlow]

I'm gonna go with C.

[Randall Williams]

Well, it's one to one, gang. The correct answer is B. Ptsd. Thank you, Cory. This is show's really taking off. This One comes from SciTech Daily. Researchers from the University of Massachusetts studied 19 veterans with PTSD and observed notable psychological benefits, particularly reduced levels of anxiety among those who engaged in visits to wildlife sanctuaries, participated in wildlife care at rehabilitation centers, and engaged in bird watching. According to Dr. Donna Perry, while many studies involving interactions between humans and other species aimed at improving psychological or physical health have involved domestic animals, few studies have focused on wildlife.

[Maggie Hudlow]

I think that's great news, but I don't think it's new news. People have been doing, you know, like, when I was a guide, we used to do, like, wounded warrior things.

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah.

[Maggie Hudlow]

In the outdoors.

[Randall Williams]

And the news is that we have the study to back it up. Phil, why don't you read me the date on that article?

[Phil]

It says March 6, 2025. Holy crap.

[Randall Williams]

That's today's news, Brody.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yeah, well, like I said, don't think it's new news.

[Randall Williams]

Boy, Rocky. Start here onto our third headline. I kind of like this bit, though.

[Phil]

It's fun, and I would. This is kind of a dry run. If people like it, we'll be back with. With bells and whistles, and hopefully Brody will be more excited.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yeah, well, it's not that I'm not excited. Like, I like it because I like arguing and you know, and trivia. Spencer just doesn't put up with arguing about his questions, so.

[Brody Henderson]

You know, I know the answer to this one 100%.

[Phil]

We should.

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah.

[Maggie Hudlow]

This one's been all over the place. You don't even know.

[Randall Williams]

But I thought my answers are so clever.

[Phil]

Well, let's. Let's read the headline for the audio listeners here.

[Randall Williams]

Blank for dinner. California officials urge residents to eat invasive. Blank. Your options are Skate for dinner. California officials urge residents to eat invasive stingrays, frog legs for dinner. California officials urge residents to eat invasive bullfrogs, Rodent for dinner. California officials urge residents to eat invasive nutria or D Cactus for dinner. California officials urge residents to eat invasive African prickly pear.

[Brody Henderson]

It's C C Nutria.

[Randall Williams]

Well, we've got a tie game, gang.

[Phil]

There's a sound. I found one.

[Randall Williams]

The correct answer is rodent for dinner. California officials urge residents to eat invasive nutria. According to an article in the Guardian, this call to action came during National Invasive Species Awareness Week in late February. Nutria were believed to have been eradicated from the golden state in the 1970s, but a growing population was detected in the Sacramento San Joaquin river delta in 2017. The California Department of Fish and Wildlife has removed some 5,500 nutria from these wetlands so far. And federal officials are trying to make the consumption of nutria somewhat enticing by drawing similarities to the taste of rabbit or dark turkey meat. Resources including recipes for nutria dishes such as stews and chili are available on nutria.com.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah, the new York Times really didn't do a good job of selling it. Their headline was keep invasive species in check. Eat a big rat like rodent.

[Maggie Hudlow]

I think the funny thing about this is that this is coming out of California, which is like one of the most anti hunting states in the country, and they're like, oh yeah, go kill these things.

[Randall Williams]

That's a lot of dead things.

[Maggie Hudlow]

I know, but they need to call our old friend Mark Kendrick, who managed operation Rolling Thunder in the Chesapeake Bay, which is like the only place they fully eradicated those things.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, I gotta say, I wasn't. California nutria weren't on my radar.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yeah, I think they scattered those things all over the place to create, you know, a fur industry back in the day, I believe.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. I will point out that there is an invasive African prickly pear cactus called the Devil's cactus.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Sounds nasty.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, I did a little bit of research.

[Brody Henderson]

Can you eat it?

[Randall Williams]

No, I don't think so. We don't have a tiebreaker yet. That's a little wrinkle we should add next time we do this.

[Phil]

So let's. Hold on. I just want to make sure we have this all correct. There was no drop.

[Randall Williams]

Yes.

[Phil]

No sound effects. I'll take credit for that. Yes. No tiebreaker.

[Randall Williams]

Right.

[Phil]

How do we feel this segment went?

[Randall Williams]

You know, I like it. I think it's got real potential. I think it's got real potential. Brody observed to me yesterday when we were sort of going over this that this would be a segment best played with some of our less. Less news following crew members.

[Phil]

Yeah, sure. Online.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, the less online people would probably have more fun with this one. But I was pleased that you both didn't get all of them right.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yeah, yeah. So learn something new every day, man.

[Randall Williams]

That's a start. Fantastic, gang. Thank you. Joining us on the line first is Rebecca Powell, the program director for the Bob Marshall Wilderness Foundation. Rebecca, welcome to the show.

[Rebecca Powell]

Hey, thanks for having me. Happy to be here.

[Randall Williams]

Great to have you.

[Rebecca Powell]

Great show.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Oh, man.

[Randall Williams]

It can only go up from here. So.

[Phil]

I love the honesty, Rebecca.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, yeah. You're glad that that first segment didn't kill. It's a tough act to follow. First thing, can you tell us a little bit about the Bob Marshall Wilderness foundation and maybe for folks that are not from this part of the world, what the Bob Marshall Wilderness is?

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah. So I am the program director at the Bob Marshall Wilderness Foundation. We're a non profit partner of the Forest Service and we help steward the 1.6 million acre Bob Marshall Wilderness complex. So the Bob Marshall Wilderness complex is in northwest Montana, kind of below Glacier national park, above Yellowstone and Missoula area. And it makes three wilderness areas. So there's the Great Bear to the north, the Bob Marshall in the middle, and the Scapegoat Wilderness on the south end. And together that makes up the 1.6 Bob Marshall Wilderness complex that we all just refer to as the Bob. So that is a little bit about the Bob Marshall Wilderness and us as a nonprofit organization. We're pretty small. We have seven full time year round staff. We've been around for almost 30 years. And you know, the Bob foundation started as a place for volunteers to get together and help clear those secondary trails and do some of the trail maintenance that wasn't getting done as Forest Service was facing those budget cuts. As we've evolved, you know, we've gone from more than just moving dirt. And now as an organization, we do a lot of education about wilderness. We do have a pretty robust internship program. We have some Traditional skills programs such as packing. We have Artist Wilderness Connection program, where we partner with the Hockaday Museum of Art in the Flathead National Forest and place a few artists in the backcountry each season to do some art. And then, of course, the Bread and Butter is our volunteer program. So we have about 40 projects usually each season that we take volunteers out. We have anything from, you know, a day like National Trails Day, doing a day of trail work, to 10 day trips where you're in the backcountry for 10 days. All of them are led by one of our crew leaders. We provide food and pack support, all the tools. And those opportunities are free for anybody who wants to join, given that it's within your physical limitations to do it. Yeah, and a lot of our work with the volunteers is clearing trails, is brushing, you know, all that alder off the trails, clearing drains, and improving tread. We do some work on some of those admin cabins in the backcountry, you know, rebuilding corrals, that kind of stuff.

[Randall Williams]

And there's some. There's some unique challenges to that type of work in a wilderness area. Can you tell us a little bit about what a. What a day of trail maintenance looks like for a volunteer crew?

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah, so I always tell our crew leaders that they have the hardest job within the complex because they're training new volunteers each. Each week. You know, so depending on their hitch schedule, volunteers show up at a trailhead. We have up to 8 to 10 volunteers each project that meet a crew leader at the trailhead. We have volunteer packers that use horses and mules that carry in all the food and tool and group gear into a backcountry site. And we set up a base camp and work out of that base camp for however many days the trip is. And because it's a designated wilderness, you know, no mechanized use within the wilderness. So we're using cross cut saws, hand saws, Pulaskis, loppers, that kind of stuff. And all the stuff that we get is transported into the backcountry with horses and mules. So it's primitive. It's just how we like it.

[Randall Williams]

A lot of sweat.

[Rebecca Powell]

It is a lot of sweat. And, you know, volunteers are. They're. They're into it, man. People like to work hard, and it's impressive to see the amount of people that come out and want to do hard work with us.

[Randall Williams]

That's great. Recently, we've been covering a lot of the layoffs affecting our public land management agencies, the Forest Service included. Can you speak to how those cuts at the Forest Service are affecting your organization, sort of how you interface with the Forest Service?

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah, there's a lot of ways that that's affecting our organization. We are like, you know, we pride ourselves on the relationship that we have with the forest. The folks at the district level within those. There's five districts that manage the Bob Marshall Wilderness Complex, and we are close with all of them. So each season around January or so, we meet with those trails and wilderness folks and ask them, like, hey, where do you guys need help? How can we help you get some volunteers in? And that's how we build our summer schedule and work through that. And then once the field season starts, those folks that are on the ground for the Forest Service, those river rangers, those trail crews, those backcountry rangers, those are the people that we're communicating with on our trips. We're checking in on the radio every day with those folks. We're. They're flagging out the work we need to do. Maybe they're out there a couple days before that we show up, and they're flagging out where to put a drain, you know, or to clean up a campsite or that kind of stuff. And the complex has experienced significant workforce cuts over the. Over the last few weeks. You know, Rocky Mountain Ranger district had a backcountry crew of 11, and now they're down to three. Spotted Bear is similar that they had a backcountry crew of 20 something, and now they're down to four or five people. So that's going to create significant barriers for the public and for us to be able to achieve the level of work that we hope to do. You know, as an example, we work with the Forest Service. We have. Our seasonal workforce that we ramp up to is about 26 folks. That's crew leaders, that's interns, that's packer apprentices. Usually we hire two. Two wilderness river rangers to go out with the. With the river ranger at a Spotted Bear. And that. That position no longer is there. And so we can't have those two interns go out on their own without any supervision. So we're. We're readjusting.

[Randall Williams]

We're.

[Rebecca Powell]

We're getting creative. We're trying to think of ways that we can still be effective and help out and be of service to. To what's left out there.

[Randall Williams]

Gotcha. Do you have sort of concrete plans looking forward to the summer, or are there still a lot of uncertainties at the moment?

[Rebecca Powell]

There's never any concrete plans. Right. We're used to plan A, plan B, plan plan D. You know, we're always adapting for weather and whatever, injuries, illness or anything. This is definitely a big hitch in our, in our program because of, I mean, shortages aside, workforce cuts aside, our program budget was cut 50% because of a lot of that fun thing that we get is frozen currently. So the funding from, you know, the Great American Outdoors act, that helps fund our interns and our trail crews and that kind of stuff. Some of the grants that actually fund paying for the food for our volunteers, those are all currently frozen.

[Maggie Hudlow]

And hey, Rebecca, Rebecca. That's money that was already approved to go to you guys, correct?

[Rebecca Powell]

Correct. That's money that's approved to us. That's like for instance, the, the America the Beautiful grant that we get that, that funds our invasives crew. So we have an invasive species coordinator that works for us and he has four interns and a crew leader that go around the complex and spray and map and base of weeds all summer long. That's funded from the America the Beautiful grant, which we're in year three of a five year grant of that. And that has been frozen. So this is the time of year that we're hiring all of our interns and placing all those folks. And we kind of put a temporary pause on that because we don't want to hire all these folks and then be like, hey, guess what? We don't have the funding, so you can't go out there and do the work. So we have decided to just keep moving on as if we have that funding in place. And then we've made a deadline that if we don't have, you know, confirmation of that funding at a certain time, we'll, we'll call it off and re group our summer schedule. I mean, there's, like I said, there's seven of us year round staff and like five of us are ready to roll up our sleeves and get in the backcountry. You know, it's folks that still spend quite a bit of time doing work in the backcountry. So we can still do some volunteer trips, we can still do some packing, we can do some other things. It'll just be quite abbreviated from what we had hoped and planned.

[Randall Williams]

So if folks are interested in supporting your work, how do they either go about volunteering and getting out there with you guys this summer? Or if they maybe live remote or can't do trail work themselves, how else can they support your mission?

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah, well, we do a lot of fundraisers right now. We partner with the Telluride Mountain Film Festival and do a fundraiser and kind of circumnavigate the Bob Marshall Wilderness Complex on Friday. Tomorrow we have a show in Big Fork. We have a show in Choteau, Montana, in Helena and Missoula and Whitefish. So anybody can go and buy tickets to come see us at those events. And we have raffles and fun stuff and a lot of great films on that. We also have like business partners. So if you're a business owner and you want to be part of the, of the Bob Marshall Wilderness Complex and supporting that, you can join our business, become a business partner. Big fundraiser for us actually is our license plates. So we have like the Bob license plates. It's when you go to the dmv, it's the one with like a pack string on it. Get those on your car. That's super supportive of us. We have monthly donations, all kinds of different donations. You know, like I said, really only 20 of our funding comes directly from the Forest Service. The rest is all donations and fundraisers and merchandise sales and all that stuff.

[Randall Williams]

So good deal.

[Rebecca Powell]

Any of that support is great.

[Randall Williams]

And as far as the volunteer side of things, if, you know, if I get in the weight room or get in shape and ready to grab hold of crosscut saw, what's my next step there?

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah, so traditionally we've launched our volunteer projects by March 1st. That's on pause for right now. So we get confirmation that we have the funding to go ahead with that and hire our crew leaders and, and you know, buy volunteer food and all that stuff and pay for the pack support that, that joins us out there. Our trips are all posted online on our website, on our social media. We'll promote that once we launch those. Some of our trips fill up really fast, some of them don't. We, we like to have a large variety of trips. So we'll have like I said, some like just one day trips that are like lopping or pulling weeds or something. And then we have like, I think our, our most popular trip is like a five day trip. So you hike in, you work for two days, you have a day off, you work for two more days or one more day and then you hike out. And those, you know, there's, there's different variations of, of the fitness levels you need for that. And we, we advertise that on our website. Some of them, you know, you're hiking 14 miles into the backcountry over a mountain pass and that's more strenuous. And the work you're doing is like clearing A trail that's, you know, had a significant blowdown, and you're on a cross cut all day. Some of the trips that are even longer are you hike six miles into a backcountry site and you work on campsite restoration and, you know, getting rid of fire rings and burying poop and all that kind of stuff that. That's a little less strenuous. So we. We have everyone, is what you're saying.

[Randall Williams]

For everyone. Excellent.

[Rebecca Powell]

Yep.

[Randall Williams]

Well, Rebecca, I think I can speak for everyone in the building that we love the Bob Marshall Wilderness as we love all of our public lands. And so we appreciate the work that you do, and hopefully we can maybe get a couple of us out on a crew with you this summer, the next.

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah, that sounds great. We have partner trips, too, so if you want to just grab your friends and come join us, the whole Meat eater crew can come out and.

[Randall Williams]

Oh, I like that you can't film.

[Rebecca Powell]

It because we're in wilderness.

[Randall Williams]

So I like that idea very much.

[Rebecca Powell]

Yeah, you can take some pictures.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah.

[Rebecca Powell]

I appreciate you guys taking the time to hear from us and. And kind of shed some light onto the work that we're doing and our. And our passion for the public land and the place. And thanks for. For having us.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, happy to do it. And good luck. We appreciate you.

[Rebecca Powell]

Thanks for being.

[Clay Newcomb]

Phelps has a new thing this spring. They're coming out with what they call the prime cuts, turkey diaphragm calls. And one of them is called the clay Newcomb prime cut. And I'm not just going to talk about it. I'm gonna. I'm gonna blow on it here. I'm a simple turkey hunter who likes a simple system. I usually carry one, maybe two diaphragm calls and a single pot call every year. Don't even carry a box call. I wanted a versatile diaphragm call that was the best of two worlds. I wanted loud and raspy, a call that I could cut on, but also one that was soft and subtle that I could purr. Kiki, run on. I love to make those raspy cuts and the soft, subtle purrs on the same call. And I find many of them. I can't do both. And this call that I worked with Jason Phelps to build simplifies my turkey kit. These prime cuts come in a three pack. There's the clay Newcomb call, but also Steve Rinella and Jason Phelps favorite turkey diaphragm cuts. You can check all these out along with all the other meat eater and Phelps turkey [e-mail].

[Randall Williams]

Now, here's a transition we didn't rework after a little edit to our script.

[Phil]

Oh, hold on. Here, I'll help you out. And I guess that's why they call it fake news. There's an Elton John drop. That's good.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Very good.

[Phil]

Throw in something about like the pee tape or Pizzagate, and then, you know, you got yourself a drop right there.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, that's good.

[Phil]

Yeah, that's how the magic happens right here in this chair. And you guys got to witness it live.

[Randall Williams]

That's great. That's an example of someone adapting and making it work in the show. But I'm gonna read a transition that has not been reworked. Speaking of our new show, Meat Eater Roast, Corey, why don't you walk down the hallway to the kitchen and see what's cooking? Oh, great idea, Randall. Hey there, bud. You guys were making me hungry with all that chatter about meat eater roast.

[Phil]

Just walking down the hall and I just want to. I don't want to understate how this is like a first time experience. People are getting to see the behind the scenes meat eater headquarters right now.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, keep it going. Who's that?

[Brody Henderson]

Is Yanni juggling.

[Phil]

Holy cow.

[Randall Williams]

Yanni. What's cooking?

[Chili]

Well, I'm just tenderizing these avocados. Oh, careful. In case they have to use these for a part of their meal today. What do you want me to do? You want me to just explain what? Meteorosis?

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. What are you guys doing in here?

[Chili]

It's Meat Eater's new competition cooking show where we have two ordinary wild game cooks, which up to this point have all been meat eater employees and not just the ones that you expect to be good wild game cooks. You've got folks like Corinne in here, Maggie Hudlow. Maybe you would expect them to be.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, I'm not sure I would take that. Corinne or Maggie.

[Brody Henderson]

All right, Ani.

[Chili]

You know what I mean?

[Maggie Hudlow]

No, what do you mean?

[Chili]

The challenge or the mystery or what makes their competition. Well, we have two people, which makes it a competition, but every episode, there's a protein or a chunk of meat that is unknown to the contestants until the moment that I reveal it. And like right here in this cast iron mini Dutch oven, whatever they call these, is what meat is for the episode we're going to film today. So I'm going to reveal it to the contestants, and then they're going to have 90 minutes to cook me. And the two judges that we're going to have here, which one of them is going to be Maggie? Hudlow. We also have the most famous butcher I know, Anna Borgman, going to be judging today, and they're gonna have 90 minutes to cook us up something delicious with that meat. The best part about this show, this is episode number four that we're filming today, is that we've come to see that wild game cooking is not that hard. Everybody that's participated so far has whipped up some amazing stuff in a limited amount of time, not knowing what they had to work with when they started. So the energy level is high. People are digging, producing it with us. So I'm hoping that the viewers are going to like it, too. Any questions, Corey, or from the next door? I can just walk over there, too, if you guys want to talk to me in person.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. Giannis, I wonder if you're a little overconfident there in your assessment that the show is demonstrating that wild game cooking is not that hard. I will be joining you there in about an hour, and I'll be taking the helm at that stove. So I wouldn't really count your chickens before they hatch, as the old proverb goes. I think I might set a new standard for incompetence.

[Chili]

A difficult chunk of game meat for you, too. You're not gonna have. I'm not giving you, like, a. An elk tenderloin to work with, so put your thinking cap on, Randall.

[Randall Williams]

Oh, you hear that from Max? No.

[Chili]

Here in an hour. You're late.

[Randall Williams]

Oh, geez. Got 30 minutes. Well, we better wrap this sucker up then. Anything you'd like to add, Chili?

[Chili]

Yeah, you know, really rooting for you, Randall. And the other contestant as well, but.

[Randall Williams]

He, who should not be named Shelly.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Just wants to make sure you keep the kitchen clean while you're working.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Chili]

I just walked up.

[Randall Williams]

Chili's done a great job remodeling this kitchen. Check out some beautiful artwork. That's our new art gallery for those of you watching. Well, which way? This way, Sam. There's the brains behind the whole operation and the creative. The creative engine behind it all. Sam, why don't you say hi to the folks instead of hiding behind the. Hi, Lovely.

[Brody Henderson]

There's some real interesting stuff on that shelf behind Sam, too.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. What are some interesting ingredients that these folks have to work with here in the kitchen?

[Chili]

Corinne, she's attracted to the. The craziest stuff that is available in the outdoors, and so she really wanted to use the python oil. I can't remember who sent this to Steve, but unfortunately, or fortunately, depending on how you look at it, it's Rancid. So if you see this in an upcoming episode, you will know that. That the person that used it lost really wanted to use.

[Brody Henderson]

Did not smell good.

[Chili]

Yeah, we got grizzly bear fat, which we did use some grizzly bear grease the other day. I wish I knew the story on how they legally obtained it. Maybe they got it from Alaska, I guess, but it was actually very delicious. Oh, and then what the. Maggie Ankarin the other day used bison garum, which was. It basically tasted like an extra rich soy sauce, like mega umami.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah, I'm really curious how that was made. I would love to learn how to make garum. It was delicious.

[Chili]

We also, if you've never seen this exotic pasta from Italy called penne penne ran.

[Randall Williams]

I thought the E was silent. Just peen.

[Chili]

Maybe used to. Randall Elbow macaroni, also from Italy.

[Randall Williams]

Huh. Got any wonder bread? Any ketchup?

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, yeah, yeah, buddy.

[Phil]

We.

[Chili]

We have. We have like a crush shell. We have a crush shell for those that. That can't get it done with, you know, from scratch. You can use ketchup, wonder bread, that sort of stuff. And I'll be happy to eat it. But it's probably going to cost you a little bit of in the creativity point.

[Randall Williams]

You don't know what I'm going to do with it yet.

[Chili]

I don't, I don't. But I feel like that stuff's a little bit of a crutch. It's a little bit of the easy. But.

[Randall Williams]

Well, I'm going to see what I get for my mystery ingredient today and we'll just proceed from there. How's that sound?

[Chili]

We'll see you.

[Randall Williams]

See you in a little bit.

[Chili]

Entertaining these folks.

[Randall Williams]

Okay, thank you. Thank you, sir.

[Brody Henderson]

Now, Randall has teased me with the prospect of a meat smoothie today.

[Randall Williams]

Yes. I've been told there's a blender and if all else fails, can't nail the texture on the hot pan. It's going in there. Take it through a straw.

[Brody Henderson]

I hope I'm not drinking my meal today.

[Randall Williams]

You very well might be. Phil, what do we got for some listener feedback here?

[Phil]

Yeah, just a reminder. Now's a good time to submit some questions for the crew today. Maggie, Brody and Randall. Yeah, this one was just funny to me when you were looking at the tv, Randall, someone said, why does Randall always look like he's trying to remember his AOL password? Which. That's just a funny joke.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, you know, it's funny. I am really bad with passwords, so this is. I usually. I don't Know what I look like when I'm trying to think of myself?

[Maggie Hudlow]

I think you're just making sure you're saying what you're supposed to say.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, that's true, that's true. You know, just trying to stick to the script.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Speaking before you think can get you in trouble.

[Randall Williams]

We like to have a nice clean show here. That's right.

[Phil]

On that note, and I'm trusting you guys right now. I'm putting a lot of faith in and you for not spoiling what's coming up next week. But Juan Gonzalez asks, if Randall wins the trivia tournament, are we going to see some suck it Randall stickers to replace the suck it Brody stickers?

[Maggie Hudlow]

We'll have to come up with something better. And suck it.

[Randall Williams]

From the man himself. You heard it here.

[Maggie Hudlow]

That one's copyrighted to me.

[Phil]

This is something that I'm curious about. Maybe it'll be a short answer, but Brendan asks. He says, hey guys, y'all have any issues with lower turkey numbers due to predation? My turkey flocks that I've hunted for years got decimated by coyotes over the winter. I don't know where you are, Brendan, but if you're still in the chat, if you want to let us know.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yeah, that's like very location dependent. I feel like I would say out here numbers are, are more influenced by the severity of winters and whether turkey flocks have access to this. Some people might not like hearing this, but where turkey flocks out here have access to cattle pastures in the winter, they're going to do a lot better because they like getting down in that cattle pasture and pecking through the cow poop. And where they can do that, they do pretty good. But we had a cold winter, well, a long stretch of cold. So it's yet to be seen. What's going on with turkey numbers in Montana? I can't speak to anywhere else.

[Phil]

Brendan says. He's in New Jersey, by the way.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yeah, I mean predation is certainly a problem, like a nest predation. I think probably raccoons are doing as much damage as coyotes.

[Randall Williams]

This might be a question for Caitlin for share with our next guest.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, yeah, yeah. She knows a lot about turkeys and coyotes.

[Phil]

She's smiling in the waiting room. I hope that's a good sign. Good, good in the woods asks Maggie, what's the craziest article you've written for Meteor? And I'll extend to like maybe. Maybe your favorite or something you're the most proud of that people should check out too.

[Brody Henderson]

I wrote one about seafood Fraud a few years ago.

[Phil]

Oh yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

I think it was titled something like Hog bung of the Sea, because people actually use hog bung and slice it up as calamari and sell it as calamari. And there's like other instances of, you know, like Chilean sea bass. It's. I forget what it was actually called. It's like something toothfish.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

And it's just like this renaming, rebranding. Selling seafood is something that it maybe isn't just to market it to the consumer, which is really interesting because people still consume it and buy it.

[Randall Williams]

And that name really took hold after it was served for lunch at Jurassic park headquarters in the Patagonian food. Jurassic Park. Yep, that's right.

[Brody Henderson]

That's what it is.

[Randall Williams]

That's right.

[Brody Henderson]

So just took a little bit of a turn.

[Randall Williams]

Clearly they must have the coast of Isla Nublar. Fictional island where Jurassic park was set.

[Phil]

That's right.

[Randall Williams]

Phil, you got anything else from the chat?

[Phil]

Does Randall like Skyline, Chile?

[Randall Williams]

Oh, I love it so much. I love it so much. Dawson, do you have any. Send it to me. I just made some. I just made some fake Skyline a couple weeks ago.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Maybe you'll be making some in half an hour.

[Randall Williams]

I could. Yeah.

[Phil]

Yeah. In a blender. We'll see.

[Brody Henderson]

Do you put beans in Skyline Chili?

[Randall Williams]

No, you can add beans.

[Brody Henderson]

Beans and noodles. Seems weird.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. So typically it's served in a number of ways. You have a three way, which is chili. It's. It's spaghetti, chili and cheese. And then you can have a four way where you either add chopped onions or beans.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, chopped onions.

[Randall Williams]

Or a five way where you add both or you serve them on a Coney hot dog. Little mini hot dog.

[Brody Henderson]

Hot dog with noodles.

[Randall Williams]

Oh, no, you could, but that's typically not the traditional way. Be a. Dawson. I could go on for hours about Skyline Chili. I love it. Also a gold star, man. But Skyline really is probably my number one.

[Phil]

A question from Mogor. He says he finished the new audiobook this week, the one that you made with Steve. He really enjoyed it. Congratulations. His question is how much research was needed for the project. And I guess you could say that in terms of months or books or hours.

[Randall Williams]

I'll just say that that's my full time job. Trivia and podcasts and radio live are just sort of the icing on top. But none of that is in my job description. It's a full time job. I don't really know where to start with number of books, but yeah, we probably worked on that for. Oh, I guess Maybe seven months for the first draft and then rewrote a bit and then recorded it probably nine months out from when we started. So it's like a year long life cycle basically between getting it started and then the launch and promotion and everything.

[Maggie Hudlow]

You're already researching the next one, aren't you?

[Randall Williams]

In the spare time that I have, yes. We've got another one coming out on the Buffalo Hidehunters, which is kind of a subject near and dear to Steve's heart. So that's been a fun one to get started.

[Phil]

There was a question regarding your crossword puzzle scores, Randall, that we haven't gotten an update in a while. But then Spencer, our very own Spencer Newharth, responded that Randall's scores are posted at the top of every crossword puzzle. If you go look at any of them, you'll see his score in the first sentence. Do you know what that means?

[Randall Williams]

Probably in the little lead in instructions thing. Yeah. So when Spencer puts together a crossword every week, he and Logan, who plugs it into the website, give me that link a day in advance. You take it first and I take it first. So then everybody can. And this week, let me just point out here that this week I scored a 395 with a record time of a minute and 34 seconds. Pretty proud of that one. Thanks, Spencer.

[Phil]

That's great.

[Randall Williams]

Crosswords are another part of my job that aren't in my job description, curiously.

[Brody Henderson]

Enough, because you have superhuman ability to get them done in that amount of time.

[Randall Williams]

I just don't have much else.

[Phil]

Let's do one more on the heels. Let's do one more on the heels of the Meat Eater behind the scenes hq. Yeah. This is kind of a big question for everyone, but Michael asks, what's your favorite part of working at Meat Eater? That could be anything from crossword puzzles to researching mountain men for months.

[Randall Williams]

Who wants to start?

[Maggie Hudlow]

My favorite part is turning in a finished manuscript. The rest of it isn't necessarily that fun, but man, when you're like, holy shit, we're done, like, that's a good feeling.

[Brody Henderson]

That's gotta be satisfying.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, Maggie.

[Brody Henderson]

I would say just like the content that we get to work with day in and day out is really great and fun. And we, like everyone that we work with, is a fantastic person.

[Phil]

That is true.

[Brody Henderson]

It's just a really great community here.

[Phil]

I didn't think about that.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, sorry I interrupted. I just couldn't help myself.

[Rebecca Powell]

No.

[Brody Henderson]

Every and every time I come into the office, I'm reminded of like all the Good folks that work here. So it's nice. You don't always get that. So I try not to take it for granted.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, I would probably echo some variation of that. I enjoy coming into the office and just having fun all day long.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Like today. All you're doing is having fun all day long.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. Just make a couple stupid jokes and act like a buffoon. You know, a lot of jobs require you to maintain some level of professionalism, and I like that. I can just be a weirdo.

[Phil]

I'll second that.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah. Let it shine.

[Randall Williams]

Just let it fly.

[Phil]

Cool. Well, let's keep sending those questions in. We'll do one more round of those at the end of the show, please.

[Randall Williams]

Those are some good ones. Thank you. Joining us on the line is wild turkey researcher and fur trapper Caitlin Lo Spinoso, or as some of you may know her better on social media as old trapper Kate. Caitlin, welcome to the show. Hi.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

How are you?

[Randall Williams]

We're doing great. How are you?

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

I'm good. Mentally recovered?

[Phil]

Oh, no.

[Randall Williams]

Off the bat.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

She'll be back, but, you know, we'll get there.

[Randall Williams]

Good, good. Well, Caitlin, tell us a little bit. You are a wildlife researcher and a fur trapper, and anybody who's following along on social media knows that you've been rather busy lately with your trapping season. Can you just give us a quick overview of your trapping season, kind of when that starts, when that ends, and how hard you go?

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Yes. So it's been a crazy season. Land trapping wrapped up here. The season closed on Friday. So I've been taking this week for some R and R. Just kind of relaxing before I start setting for beaver. We have another month of water trapping coming up here, so I had a great land trapping season targeting bobcats and coyotes. I'm trapping all on public land, so I can't run a huge line. I probably average about 12 sets at any given time and just run those as I can while I'm working. And I did fantastic on bobcats. It was a record year. I doubled my goal. I was hoping I would get four. I got eight.

[Randall Williams]

Nice.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

And two of them were amazingly spotted. Just beautiful cats. Yeah, that was actually my. My last hurrah last week on them. I doubled up, and that spotted one was just a beautiful tom. But, yeah, I got nine coyotes as well. And it was. It was a grind this season. I really, really enjoyed it. Had a great time.

[Randall Williams]

Very cool. How did you get into trapping, if you don't mind us asking?

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Yeah, very non. Traditionally, I didn't have any history of trapping in my family, I didn't know any trappers. I just. It was totally not on my radar. But I love the grind. I. I taught myself how to hunt on public land. I taught myself how to bass fish like a pro. I just always loved having some kind of really complex problem to solve in the outdoors. And I found myself in that kind of dead space between deer season and turkey season, just really trying to find something I could go hard on and really get into. And I had the hardest time figuring out what that could be until I went into undergrad and I had a wildlife management course where trapping was discussed as a method for both research and harvest. And it kind of got my wheels turning. And I actually remembered the Wyoming beaver trapping episode that. That was in, I think, season six of Meat Eater, where Steve snared one. And I. It just clicked, like, instantly. I was like, that's the next step. That's it. I can do that. And I had tons of beaver in the creek bottom that I was hunting on public. So I. I went in there. It took me two days, got my first beaver, and it just snowballed from there. I was. I was hooked. And now. Now I'm. I'm doing everything that I possibly can. Coyote, bobcat, raccoon, possum, skunk, beaver, hopefully otter. I'll get back into. There's not many here where I'm at here in Kansas now, but these pillows.

[Randall Williams]

Here that are on the screen, those. You set those in for the auction house of oddities, if I recall.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

So not those ones in the picture. There's. There's a photo of me holding two. Those are the ones that I sent in. But, yeah, I started. So when I started trapping and. And I started out with beaver, I was getting all these, you know, beautiful pelts. And looking at the fur market, obviously dried fur, it's been talked about a lot. Like, the fur market was just in the tank. Beavers come up a little bit with the. With the western hat craze. But at the time, I was trying to figure out how can I use this fur in. In kind of a unique way that I'm going to be able to turn more of a profit than I would if I just sold the. The dried pelts to a fur buyer. And I started thinking about, like, how can I make it a novelty? And the first thing I thought it was, like, man, these are. These would make, like, a really awesome throw pillow. So I just took. You know, I took the beaver that I got that first season. I tanned myself and. And I just Got to making them into, into pillows and selling them on, just through Facebook and they were selling really well. So then I thought, you know, what about Etsy? If I really got a store going and sold, you know, wall hanger pelts and, you know, different fur items that I could make myself and yeah, just kind of went from there. And those, the ones that I donated when I made them, I really loved that pair was this beautiful dark kind of chocolate beaver pelts. And they match perfectly. And I was just sitting there like fixing them up and I was going to the Meat Eater live show that night actually when I finished them and I was like, I wonder, I wonder if they would take this for the auction house. Because I was like, that would be a really cool thing to see, you know, how much these could get for the, for the cause. And yeah, I messaged Spencer and he was like, yeah, we'll take them. Heck yeah. And I was, I was super worried that they weren't gonna do much in the, in the auction, but they, they actually did really well. So that was awesome.

[Randall Williams]

Do you remember what they sold for?

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

I think it was 805, if I remember.

[Randall Williams]

Wow.

[Brody Henderson]

Nice.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Yeah. And I mean they were a beautiful set and I like, I, I was gonna keep them for myself. I was like, oh, like if this can go to, to raising some money for the cause and, and obviously just like a super cool thing to do.

[Randall Williams]

So very cool. We appreciate it very much.

[Brody Henderson]

What do you typically sell a beaver throw pillow for?

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

So I had been selling them for, depending on the size, probably 80 to 180, depending. Because I would make some like really little tiny ones that are like, like just a cute little thing to have. And then I had some that were like 18, 20 inches that would be. And depending on the backing that I put on them, like if I just did a basic kind of corduroy backing, obviously that's much cheaper. Some of them I did suede, which is, which is a lot. Yeah, Spencer just confirmed 805. Yeah, I did, I did suede on those. So it was really, those were a really nice set. But yeah, I've done, I've done double sided fur, which is going to be the most expensive. But yeah, the backing material adds, adds a. That's a big variation in the value and then the size.

[Randall Williams]

Sure.

[Brody Henderson]

Did you already know how to sew or did you learn that as well as learning how to sew?

[Randall Williams]

The same question, if that's another thing you just figured out for something to do.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

I, I learned to make the pillows, you know, I was like. The idea for a pillow came into my head and I was like, I don't know how to stitch like a pillow cover. And so I. Yeah, I learned that on the fly. And it's. It's so much fun. It's just, you know, another. Another thing to keep me engaged with it and do something more with that. With that fur. It really. It. It makes me very happy to, you know, make as much back on that harvest, like, make that harvest as meaningful as possible and get as much use as it out of it as I can. So, yeah, I really enjoy that part.

[Randall Williams]

Very cool.

[Brody Henderson]

It's impressive.

[Randall Williams]

So how are the critters in your neck of the woods doing this year? What are your takeaways from the season as far as hair and hides and the health of. The health of the populations?

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Yeah, so they've been. They were really, really healthy. Started the year, the coyotes were as about as fatty as I've seen them and super primed up. They stayed prime all the way through the end of the season on Friday, I think, you know, obviously it was just talked about. We had a really hard winter. The last couple winters have been kind of mild to where getting into February, they would already have some rubs and. And just losing those guard hairs. But this season they were. They were primed like I have not seen since I've been here. This is my third season trapping here. So they're. They were just fantastic. I was. I was over the moon with it, especially, like Friday, I picked up my last coyote of the season and she. I was expecting her to have rubs and stuff, but she was still super prime. So this, this is not a. I mean, Kansas. It's not, you know, a top tier first date usually, but the. The animals that I pulled this year were very, very well, doing very well. So.

[Randall Williams]

Very cool.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Yeah, they had some. I saw some crazy injuries, which I sent in a picture of one that. That coyote that I pulled on Friday. She was super big, healthy. You wouldn't have thought that anything was wrong with her. And when I got to skinning her, got down to her face and I hit metal and I was like, oh, gosh. Right around her eye. I hit metal. So I like, pull the skin back and there's a broadhead sticking out of her eye socket.

[Randall Williams]

Wow.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

She's just gnarly. It was just. When I got in there and started digging around, it was just sitting under her eyeball like, yeah, you can.

[Randall Williams]

Oh, there you go, Phil. Thank you.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Yeah. You could not tell that anything was wrong. She had like, a little lump under her eye that was healed over, scabbed over, and when I got to skinning I hit metal and I could not figure out what it was and had to clean it up before I could see that it was a broadhead. But yeah, you wouldn't have known her. Her one eye was like up a little higher than the other because it was resting on the broadhead. But the eye wasn't punctured like she was. She was doing great. So yeah, pretty crazy stuff. They're tough and they made it through very well this year despite the harsh weather. So.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh yeah, that's incredible.

[Randall Williams]

Well, thank you for joining us. I know you've got to rest up before you kick off your spring beaver trapping, so appreciate the update and we will check in with you again here soon.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Yep, sounds good.

[Brody Henderson]

Thanks.

[Caitlin Lo Spinoso]

Thank you for having me.

[Randall Williams]

Our next segment is Meat Eater Movie Club. Thank you, Phil. Jean Jacques Anod's 1988 feature the Bear offers a mesmerizing glimpse into the wilderness through the eyes of its ursine protagonists. This largely dialogue free film follows an orphaned cub who forms an unlikely, dare I say, unnatural bond with an adult male grizzly while fleeing human hunters in the Canadian wilderness. The arc of the film, though simple, carries surprising emotional weight. We witness terror, playfulness, curiosity and tenderness through the bears experiences. In my own reading of the film, the human hunters are portrayed not as unredeemable killers, but as yet another species on the landscape, prisoners of their own nature, which adds a layer of moral complexity to the tale. Above all else, the Bear is a noteworthy technical achievement in the underappreciated genre of animal movies. Anod somehow elicits authentic performances from real bears, only rivaled in my mind by the profound work of Sam the Orangutan. As the title character in the 1996 comedy Dunstan Checks in, the bear manages to create moments of genuine emotion without excessively anthropomorphizing its subjects. Although I think we might have some discussion on that later, I did add the qualifier excessively. The film's stunning cinematography captures both the brutal reality and sublime grandeur of nature as it is read in tooth and claw. Most remarkable is the film's successful execution of what can only be described as the peculiar artistic vision of its French director. Ennaud had long been fascinated by non verbal communication and specifically sought to make an animal the lead character in a psychological drama, a revolutionary concept that challenged conventional Hollywood wisdom. He boldly inverts the traditional literary conflict type of man versus beast, placing humans as the antagonists rather than the protagonist. Whereas films like the Gray parentheses Meteor to Radio Live Episode 2 Position Large carnivores as an existential threat to human survival, and those like the Edge parentheses mediator radio live episode 15 employ them to heighten familiar conflicts rooted in the human experience. The bear elevates animal consciousness to the narrative center. This radical perspective shift forces viewers to confront uncomfortable questions about our fundamental relationship with wildlife and our place within nature's hierarchy. The bear is a unique cinematic experience, particularly after a few glasses of wine. It's a testament to the power of filmmaking that transcends language barriers to speak directly to our primal understanding of survival, family, and the wilderness. Phil, I appreciate your screen grab there. Now, what do the critics say? Roger Ebert gave this film 3 out of 4 stars and had this to say about the dialogue of the hunters. Quote, their words are not meant to be language, but simply the sounds made by the animal named man. And I have a couple quick facts for you here. It's based on a 1916 novella called the Grizzly. King Brody characterized it as a book written by a repentant Frenchman.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Guilt ridden Frenchman.

[Randall Williams]

A guilt ridden Frenchman. It was filmed over 19 weeks in the Dolomites in Italy with three actors, 23 bears, and lots of other critters. They had to teach this bear how to fish because he had been living in captivity in Utah and didn't have experience with fishing. So they hired a guy to come on set every day and release a fish into the pond. But the bear was initially afraid of the fish. And then. This is my final note here. This one might go on a little bit. One day during production, Bart the bear injured Anod while the two posed for photographers. Anod's wounds, which included claw marks on his back, had to be drained with a shunt for two months. Then I happened to find this quote from an interview. I believe it's translated from the original French. So I'll do my best. I was a very good friend of the bear. One day, the photographer had to make the usual picture of the director and the star of the film. I add to show that my star was huge. So I stood on a little mound. Of course, all that protected me was a flimsy fence. So I went into his part, his domain. I was standing, but he was so high I could not see his head. To make it even more apparent, I decided to squat. I always carry my viewfinder, you know. I took it like this. He had never seen my viewfinder. I immediately understood that I did something wrong. Ooh. La la. He didn't add that. I did. He leaned down with his mouth open. That means you are not my friend. I knew what to do. I decided to go limp.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Bin great German accent.

[Randall Williams]

I really tried not to make this German.

[Chili]

Randall.

[Phil]

It's really good. You're kind of toeing the line. I'd say it's more French than German, though. I'm giving you credit.

[Randall Williams]

He stroked me on the shoulder, and I went six, seven meters down. I heard his mouth go, ek, ek, ek ek. His trainer says, okay, good boy, good boy. Clearly, he too wanted to kill the director. This stench was incredible.

[Phil]

I felt you missed an opportunity.

[Randall Williams]

Oh, and crab. I felt that this was my mistake. Very fortunately, I had read the book called Bear Attacks, and they explained that the only survivors of a bear attack.

[Phil]

Now it's very German. Yeah.

[Randall Williams]

Were those who were playing dead. Apparently, that was the only time I was a good actor. That's German. When I was playing dead. So I trusted that I was dead the last two months of shooting. I had to go to the hospital every morning and evening after the shoot as I was seriously wounded. Otherwise, I should be in a wheelchair today. Ze very touching. Zing. Is that for the rest of zee shoot, Bear never met my eyes again. Each time I was moving on z set, he looked away like a dog, feeling guilty.

[Brody Henderson]

Well done, Randall.

[Randall Williams]

So I. I just thought that was too good not to share. And we couldn't play the video because it's in French.

[Maggie Hudlow]

So well, you could have translated in that voice.

[Randall Williams]

What do you guys think of the movie here?

[Maggie Hudlow]

Big picture. I have a hard time calling it a movie. I think it's propaganda at best.

[Brody Henderson]

Anthropomorphism at its finest.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Ladies, it's like. It's like nature good man bad hunting, worse. And like, we were talking about Roger Ebert's. Roger Ebert's review. That man, who was a very respected movie critic when he was still alive, said, like, part of his review is, like, it gives you a glimpse into how bears live, which tells you, like, how much that guy knows about, like, how bears live. Like, I would have had more respect for this movie if it was a Disney Channel or a Disney movie where the bears talked and they had the funny raccoon sidekick that followed him around. Like, it would have been better if it was done that way.

[Randall Williams]

All right.

[Brody Henderson]

I would have more respect for this movie if they didn't use a monkey and a child to make. That was my note the noises that the cub makes. Because if you haven't watched the bear the entire time the cub is just like making these.

[Randall Williams]

So that was a monkey.

[Brody Henderson]

I looked it up. It was either a monkey or a child making those noises.

[Randall Williams]

In my notes here, right between the note that says, oh, this is too sad, and the note that says steep ass country, I have a note that says this bear is giving off strong monkey vibes.

[Brody Henderson]

So monkey or child? So they couldn't just use.

[Randall Williams]

The noises were bad.

[Brody Henderson]

The noises were bad. I think it, like the cinematography in the movie is beautiful.

[Phil]

It's really striking. Like, this movie looks incredible.

[Brody Henderson]

Like the Dolomites. It's really cool. And I think if they just had like music, like a good score, I think it would be a lot more powerful than these horrid whimpering noises coming out of the bear.

[Phil]

It's not the bear either. The Foley work overall is kind of rough, as I see at the very beginning when the mom is cleaning off her cub with her tongue and it sounds like a human being slurping jello.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, yeah, it's bad.

[Randall Williams]

Now, Phil, for those of us who aren't in showbiz, a Foley is a. Oh yes, Foley.

[Phil]

A Foley artist to someone who records sounds after the movie is shot. Basically fake sounds. Not. I mean, the sounds aren't fake, but.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Something you have a lot of experience with.

[Phil]

I do, yeah. I. Not just at Meteor, but for, For TV shows. I, I worked, I worked on Mountain Men on the History Channel. And all those footsteps you hear through the snow are my footsteps walking through snow. That's Foley. You record something after the fact and then plug it in in the. In.

[Randall Williams]

I think moments like that are my favorite part of.

[Maggie Hudlow]

I think this movie should have ended with the Foley of that male grizzly crunching that cub's skull. That's how, like that's how it would have ended in real life.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah. Not the cub licking the bullet wound.

[Randall Williams]

I mean, that was, that was my least favorite part of it was just the dynamic between the cub and the boar. But otherwise there were a lot of times where if I wasn't paying attention to what was coming out of the speakers, I was just like, man, I'm looking at some bears doing bear stuff in beautiful country.

[Brody Henderson]

But the bear acting was really impressive. And apparently Bart the bear almost got an Oscar for not killing the cub like that specifically.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, I mean, there's also, there's a whole book about how they made this and there's also a 50 minute documentary on YouTube of Behind the scenes footage.

[Brody Henderson]

Did you watch it?

[Randall Williams]

I skimmed through it and you get to see the trainers trying to stimulate the bears into making different faces and then sort of leading them around through their steps on the scene, you get to see the lion.

[Maggie Hudlow]

I think Bart the bear was better in Legends of the Fall when he rips up. Brad Pitt.

[Brody Henderson]

Agreed.

[Randall Williams]

Totally. Totally. But I think one of the things that bothered me the most, I mean, my notes are just chaos.

[Brody Henderson]

Same.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Were you just watching a movie with a coldie in your hand, writing stuff down?

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, yeah. And it was not a movie that I felt I had to pay particularly close attention to. But when he's cleaning the gun and there's not. It's like this beautiful gun, and he's got the action open, and there's not like a drop of grease on it anywhere. There's no grime or grit anywhere. That was the thing that just jumped out to me the most, is that.

[Maggie Hudlow]

You appreciated that or you felt it.

[Randall Williams]

Was unrealistic or it was unrealistic for that guy. The way that guy looked. I don't think his gun was as clean as it was.

[Brody Henderson]

I don't think he would have had that pretty of a gun either. I think this was, like French director wanting to have this. Like, he's a bear hunter. He has a bear gun. He has this pile of dead bears that the cub lays on, you know? But I did think it was a really cool gun, and I looked it up, and apparently it's Tom. Is this man's name.

[Randall Williams]

Yes, Tom.

[Brody Henderson]

I'm assuming you didn't pick that up in the.

[Maggie Hudlow]

No, I picked it up in French.

[Randall Williams]

Reading the Wikipedia article.

[Brody Henderson]

Yes, same. So this is Tom. And that's a Winchester 1866 Yellow Boy rifle, which is a very cool name. And what cartridge and very cool gun. I believe it was.44 rimfire.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Not one you'd want to be shooting a grizzly with.

[Randall Williams]

Well, clearly. You know the other note I have.

[Brody Henderson]

When he cuts the tips of the bullets.

[Randall Williams]

When he shoots. No, when he shoots the bear and he goes. The guy goes, ah, you spooked him. And I was just thinking that you usually don't. If someone shoots something in the front half and there's a big gaping wound, you usually don't call it spooked. Right.

[Brody Henderson]

You hit it.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, you hit it. And probably grievously wounded it. But spooked was the. The word choice of the. The screenwriter there. So.

[Brody Henderson]

And then the bear goes on to kill a mule.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

Like seriously injure a horse and then leave.

[Randall Williams]

I wrote here.

[Phil]

I also like how the guy said, my gun jammed after he. I don't know how that affected It.

[Randall Williams]

I wrote horse wounds are wild. Cause they did have a lot of animal blood in this film.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, and the dog guts.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah.

[Maggie Hudlow]

What about the sex scene?

[Brody Henderson]

Oh my gosh. Speaking of animal noises, there did not need to be that level of grunting. It was unnecessary.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Just like a regular old movie with a sex scene.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

And the kid just watching.

[Maggie Hudlow]

With a kid watching.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, that, that. You can't do that if humans are your protagonist.

[Maggie Hudlow]

No, you can't. No, you can't.

[Randall Williams]

So would you recommend this film?

[Chili]

I.

[Maggie Hudlow]

It's so hard for me. Like when my boys were younger, they would have watched it and probably enjoyed it, but I wouldn't have been able to watch it with them because I'd have just been like, that's not right. That's not. Yeah, that's not right. That would never. So I mean, it's a, like. Has its moments, I guess, but.

[Brody Henderson]

No, look, when I was like 10 years old, when I was a child, I watched Old Yeller on repeat. That was like my go to movie.

[Maggie Hudlow]

That's some real shit there.

[Brody Henderson]

That is some real shit. But I also enjoyed like. Do you guys ever see Wild America?

[Randall Williams]

Yeah.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Marty Stouffer. Was that his name? Marty Stouffer?

[Brody Henderson]

With really, really awful animatronic bears. But like, I loved that as a kid.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Isn't that the guy that got in trouble for like. For raising bears?

[Randall Williams]

Yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

For like staging wildlife. Yeah.

[Randall Williams]

If this movie is 97 minutes long, there's probably 50 minutes of it that I could clip out and just play on repeat with a different soundtrack. And I just glance over at the monitor every now and then when I'm watching an NBA game and they go to a TV timeout and I could just watch the bears kind of moving across the landscape.

[Brody Henderson]

I'm saying if I was a 10 year old, I would have been. This would have been my jam.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah.

[Phil]

Randall, you said that you watched a little behind the scenes documentary.

[Randall Williams]

Yes.

[Phil]

And saw some kind of wild stuff.

[Randall Williams]

Yes. Like what? I'm sorry?

[Phil]

Well, I just suggest you like some scenes where they used puppets or how they were kind of. Oh, well, they had the bears chained up.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, they did use. So they did use like puppet or animatronic bears for some of the fighting scenes, but otherwise it's just real bears and.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah, they were in the dream scenes.

[Randall Williams]

In the dream scenes. Yeah, when he eats the Mario mushrooms, the Super Mario mushrooms, and just goes wild. That reminded me of a time that I went to Chuck E. Cheese. When I went to Chuck E. Cheese and I was much too old to go to Chuck E. Cheese, and the animatronic animals kind of pop out of the wall and there's purple lights flashing around.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Made you uncomfortable.

[Randall Williams]

Horrible flashbacks to that. But yeah, I mean, to move the animals around, they had chains on them and they would kind of like walk them on the rocks, like across the river. And you could see them sort of setting the bear on that piece of wood that he floats down on. It was pretty weird stuff. Pretty weird stuff, but also interesting. I think that brings us to the end of Meat Eater Movie Club, another flawlessly executed segment until I dropped Phil's little prompt there at the end. But I think it turned out all right. Phil, what's the chat saying?

[Phil]

Well, there was a funny little conversation that happened. Canadian Hunter asked us, now that you no longer have an intern Nate, are you looking for a new intern Nate? I'm assuming Canadian Hunter's name is Nate. And then our very own intern Nate piped in and said, intern isn't a title, it's a way of life. Once an intern Nate, always an intern Nate. And then Spencer said, get back to work Nate. I just thought that was funny. Jax fishing asks that his kids or her kids love Meat Eater trivia. Is there any more coming up soon? There will be more Meat Eater Kids episodes this summer. We are currently in pre production on those, so stay tuned. And honestly, that was pretty much the only question we got between the last.

[Maggie Hudlow]

No reactions to the movie.

[Phil]

A lot of. A lot of reactions. I don't know. I don't know if a lot of people watched. Watched the movie, so they didn't have a lot to say, but they had a lot of comments, mostly suggesting new movies. Like Leland suggested the Legacy of a Whitetail.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, there's been a number, a lot.

[Phil]

Of hundreds of beavers suggestions and I know. And that's a newer movie, so that might be kind of fun to do.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah, that is one that's on the list. Corey's been helping us curate our selections.

[Phil]

So Jessical guy said that Brody was the only one old enough to see it by himself, which isn't true. This movie came out in 1988. Randall was alive, I believe.

[Randall Williams]

I bet I was two years old.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yeah. And it's just like Ben, like, it's. People are still. Like, it's been around.

[Brody Henderson]

It's on Amazon.

[Phil]

That's right.

[Randall Williams]

Yeah. It's very accessible for those of you with an Internet connection.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Like, people think they can hit me with those age jokes. And I'm telling you, like, it just doesn't matter. Give up.

[Brody Henderson]

Get them, Brody.

[Phil]

Also, Spencer pulled a guy, another good one, and wished you a very happy birthday today, Brody. Happy birthday, Brody.

[Maggie Hudlow]

What's that?

[Phil]

Spencer wished you a happy birthday in the chat and you have a lot of happy birthday messages from people. So I just thought. But I, I'd extend that to here.

[Brody Henderson]

I didn't fall for it this time, Spencer.

[Maggie Hudlow]

I'm not following.

[Randall Williams]

Spencer gets a ride.

[Phil]

Spencer about once every once a month. Spencer wishes happy birthday to someone in the chat and it's when it's not their birthday and he gets a kick out of it and it's. I'm glad he does.

[Maggie Hudlow]

I'm glad.

[Randall Williams]

Well, gang, before we go, Brody's got a special call to action for you folks out there.

[Maggie Hudlow]

Yes, Sir. For the 2026 calendar, we are doing another effed up old calendar this year. It is going to be effed up old trucks, which you should interpret as effed up old hunting rigs. So we'll be taking submissions. Kids, if you're listening, close your ears. The email to submit photos of your fucked up old hunting truck is fucked up old trucks atthe meat eater.com we are this year the calendar. We're going to donate a portion of the sales to backcountry hunters and anglers so they can keep on fighting these attacks on public lands. So that, that's like that reason alone is, is why you should buy the calendar. But they'll be, they'll end up being some really cool photos of, of old trucks. And we'll sort through them, we'll get a bunch of them hopefully. Then we're gonna have run a little contest for the fans where they can hop on the website and choose. We'll narrow down the selection to whatever 50 or 100 that we like and then our fans can hop on the webpage and vote. And those, the ones that get the most votes will end up in the calendar.

[Phil]

And this is an example of a fucked up old truck. And you can tell that it's actually in pretty good shape, but it's got a lot of character here. This is an example.

[Maggie Hudlow]

It's a chop down Suburban, I believe.

[Phil]

If you would like an insane conversation about the parameters of this prompt, please listen to Monday's next.

[Maggie Hudlow]

When Randall and Giannis were telling Steve and I how to make the calendar that Steve and I are making, that was great.

[Randall Williams]

I wasn't telling you how to make the calendar. Well gang, it's been fun and we're running a little over time. So with that I think we will bid you Adieu. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you here next week. Live from Meat Eater hq, signing off.

[Clay Newcomb]

Phelps has a new thing this spring. They're coming out with what they call the prime cuts, turkey diaphragm calls. And one of them is called the Clay Newcomb prime cut. And I'm not just going to talk about it. I'm going to, I'm going to blow on it here. I'm a simple turkey hunter who likes a simple system. I usually carry one, maybe two diaphragm calls in a single pot call every year. Don't even carry a box call. I wanted a versatile diaphragm call that was the best of two worlds. I wanted loud and raspy, a call that I could cut on, but also one that was soft and subtle that I could purr Kiki run on. I love to make those raspy cuts and the soft, subtle purrs on the same call. And I find many of them. I can't do both. And this call that I worked with Jason Phelps to build simplifies my turkey kit. These prime cuts come in a three pack. There's the clay Newcomb call, but also Steve Renella and Jason Phelps favorite turkey diaphragm cuts. You can check all these out along with all the other meat Eater and Phelps turkey calls at store themeater. Com.