Ep. 688: MeatEater Radio Live! Our Biggest Catches, Endangered Orcas, and Fishing for Treasure

Summary

The MeatEater Podcast – Episode 688 Summary

Episode Title: MeatEater Radio Live! Our Biggest Catches, Endangered Orcas, and Fishing for Treasure
Release Date: April 11, 2025
Host: Steven Rinella (Spencer Newarth)
Guests: Stephanie Raymond (Orca Network), Dan Johnson (Trout Unlimited), James Kane & Barbie Augustini (Magnet Fishermen)

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1. Masters Golf Tales and Hunting Anecdotes

The episode kicks off with hosts Spencer Newarth, Giannis Boutellis, and Brody Henderson sharing personal stories from their experiences around the Masters Golf Tournament in Lincolnton, Georgia. Spencer reminisces about dining at Papa's Old South, a Southern-style trailer house offering hearty fried foods.

Notable Quote:

“It's so southern that I couldn't believe that it was real... If you live in Georgia and attend the Masters, make the drive to Lincolnton to visit Papa's Old South.”
(03:10) – Giannis Boutellis

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2. Interview with Stephanie Raymond – Saving the Southern Resident Orcas

Guest: Stephanie Raymond, Program Manager at the Orca Network

Stephanie provides an in-depth look at the southern resident orcas, one of the world's most endangered whale populations. With only 74 individuals remaining, these orcas are distinct from other killer whale populations due to their specialized diet of chinook salmon and their unique social structures.

Key Discussion Points:

• Species Distinction: Southern resident orcas are now considered a separate species due to genetic and behavioral differences.
• Population Decline: Factors include declining salmon populations, high toxin levels (PCBs and PBDEs) from bioaccumulation, and vessel disturbances affecting their foraging behavior.
• Conservation Efforts: Stephanie highlights the significant impact of dam removals on improving salmon habitats, thereby supporting orca recovery. Notable projects include the Klamath and Elwha dam removals, which are expected to boost salmon runs.

Notable Quotes:

“These whales are primarily threatened by a lack of food... salmon fisheries have declined throughout the Pacific Northwest.”
(15:36) – Stephanie Raymond

“If a vessel is within 400 yards of a female southern resident, we see that she stops foraging.”
(16:20) – Stephanie Raymond

Recent Developments: Stephanie shares optimistic news about the birth of a new calf, J63, and the thriving condition of baby J62, signaling potential positive trends for the population's recovery.

Notable Quotes:

“We just had a baby J63... she appears to be the first calf of a whale known as J40 Suttles.”
(27:11) – Stephanie Raymond

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3. One Minute Fishing – Supporting Trout Conservation

Segment Host: Giannis Boutellis
Guest: Dan Johnson, Desert Terminal Lakes Basin Project Coordinator at Trout Unlimited

Dan takes listeners to Hot Creek in California, discussing its unique geothermal inputs that create optimal trout habitats. He alerts the audience to the ongoing threat of exploratory gold mining by Core Mining, which poses a significant risk to the pristine environment of Hot Creek.

Key Discussion Points:

• Hot Creek's Importance: The geothermal waters support healthy trout populations, essential for both the ecosystem and recreational fishing.
• Threat of Mining: Although permits for gold mining were temporarily revoked after community backlash, the threat persists as gold prices remain high.
• Conservation Efforts: Trout Unlimited is advocating for protective designations to safeguard Hot Creek permanently.

Notable Quotes:

“Hot Creek has wild populations of brown trout... we are working on a protective designation for Hot Creek, outstanding national resource water.”
(34:30) – Dan Johnson

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4. Listener Feedback and Q&A

The hosts engage with listener questions covering a range of topics:

• Best Golfer Among Hosts: Lighthearted debate on who excels in golfing.
• Feeding Hunting Dogs: Discussion on diets for high-energy hunting dogs like Mingus.
• Upcoming MeatEater Roast: Teasers about the next event featuring guests Corinne Schneider and Maggie Hudlo.
• Cartridge Choices for Hunting Elk: Recommendations favoring the 6.5 Creedmoor for its versatility.
• Balancing Family Vacations with Hunting Trips: Strategies to integrate hunting and family time seamlessly.

Notable Quote:

“You take family vacations that are hunting trips or fishing trips.”
(43:06) – James Kane

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5. Top Threes – Biggest Catches

Each host shares their top three biggest fish caught, relative to their species, accompanied by personal anecdotes and reflections.

Spencer Newarth's Top Catch:

• Kokanee Salmon: A massive kokanee salmon weighing approximately 24 pounds, showcasing the species' potential size.

Giannis Boutellis's Top Catch:

• Northern Pike: A formidable 42-inch pike weighing just over 20 pounds, caught in 2017 after intense effort.

Brody Henderson's Top Catches:

• Redfish (Bull Drum): A significant catch off North Carolina, highlighting the thrill of saltwater fishing.
• Lingcod: A 43-inch lingcod caught near Steve Shack, underscoring the challenges of deep-water fishing.

Notable Quotes:

“The biggest fish I ever caught is this kokanee salmon... it's like pushing five pounds or so.”
(56:46) – Spencer Newarth

“We caught a 42-inch pike, just over 20 pounds. That’s a pretty good one.”
(55:10) – Giannis Boutellis

“We caught a redfish roughly that size... it was quite the tussle.”
(53:36) – Brody Henderson

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6. Magnet Fishing – Unearthing Treasures and Mysteries

Guests: James Kane & Barbie Augustini, Magnet Fishermen from New York City

James and Barbie introduce the audience to the intriguing world of magnet fishing—a hobby involving the use of powerful magnets to retrieve metal objects from water bodies. They share their experiences, including notable finds and the challenges faced.

Key Discussion Points:

• Getting Started: Basic gear includes a strong magnet and sturdy rope. Beginners can start with affordable magnets before investing in higher-powered ones.
• Common Finds: Items range from everyday objects like bottle caps and rebar to more extraordinary finds such as safes, firearms, and historical artifacts.
• Notable Stories: Barbie recounts retrieving a safe filled with hundreds of thousands of slushy bills, necessitating involvement with law enforcement and the Bureau of Engraving and Printing for restoration.

Notable Quotes:

“Magnet fishing is where you take a giant magnet, put it on a string, and throw it in the water, waiting for the bite.”
(65:37) – Barbie Augustini

“We found a World War II grenade confirmed by the bomb squad and grapeshot cannonballs in Central Park.”
(69:55) – Barbie Augustini

Demonstration: James showcases his magnet throwing technique, demonstrating both successful and unsuccessful attempts to retrieve various objects from the water.

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7. Final Listener Feedback and Closing Remarks

In the closing segment, listeners continue to engage with the hosts through questions about hunting practices, favorite fish dishes, and conservation opinions.

Key Takeaways:

• Hunting Practices: Emphasis on ethical hunting and selecting appropriate gear.
• Favorite Dishes: Hosts share their preferred ways to prepare and enjoy fish, ranging from beer-battered fish to creamy Midwestern chowders.
• Conservation Views: Strong support for species-specific conservation efforts and sustainable practices to prevent further extinctions.

Notable Quote:

“If you could bring things back from extinction, let's focus on the things that we caused to go extinct, like the dodo or passenger pigeon.”
(88:49) – Giannis Boutellis

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Conclusion

Episode 688 of The MeatEater Podcast delivers a blend of heartfelt conservation efforts, thrilling hunting and fishing tales, and unique segments like magnet fishing. Through expert interviews, engaging stories, and interactive segments, listeners gain a comprehensive understanding of both the challenges and triumphs in the natural world. The episode underscores the importance of conservation, ethical hunting, and innovative ways to connect with and preserve our environment.

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Highlighted Quotes with Timestamps:

• Stephanie on Orca Diet:
  “They are primarily salmon eaters. Over 80% of their diet is chinook or king salmon in particular.”
  (12:32) – Stephanie Raymond

• Dan on Hot Creek Conservation:
  “Hot Creek is a very, very unique stream... we're working on a protective designation for Hot Creek.”
  (34:30) – Dan Johnson

• Brody on Feeding Hunting Dogs:
  “We just feed Mingus some meat, too, some scraps.”
  (42:07) – Brody Henderson

• Barbie on Magnet Fishing Finds:
  “We caught this kokanee salmon... it was like pushing five pounds or so.”
  (56:46) – Spencer Newarth

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This comprehensive summary encapsulates the essence of Episode 688, providing insights into endangered orcas, conservation efforts, personal hunting and fishing experiences, and the fascinating hobby of magnet fishing, all while maintaining an engaging and informative narrative for both regular listeners and newcomers alike.

Transcript

[Spencer Newarth]

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[Giannis Boutellis]

Turkey season is here, and it's time.

[Spencer Newarth]

To break out those calls.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Every serious turkey hunter knows every bird is a little different.

[Spencer Newarth]

You never know what will get them going. You may need a trusty old box call, light purrs from a pot call, or maybe some sweet yelps from diaphragms.

[Giannis Boutellis]

To seal the deal on that old gobbler. But sometimes the hardest part isn't calling them in, it's finding them in the first place. That's where our locator calls come in.

[Spencer Newarth]

From curl calls to owl hooters. We've got everything you need to get those shot gobbles out of those old.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Toms unwilling to give up their position.

[Brody Henderson]

Get fully geared up this season with.

[Spencer Newarth]

The best tricky calls in the game. Check out the full lineup@phelpsgame calls.com and make every call count.

[Brody Henderson]

Smell us now, lady.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Welcome to Meat Eater Trivia.

[Spencer Newarth]

Meat Eater Podcast.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Welcome to Meat Eater radio live. It's 11am Mountain Time. That's 1pm for our friends in Lincolnton, Georgia on Thursday, April 10th. And we're live from Meat Eater HQ in Bozeman. I'm your host, Spencer Newarth, joined today by Giannis Boutellis and Brody Henderson. On today's show, we'll interview Stephanie Raymond from the Orca Network about one of the world's most endangered whales. After that, we'll do one minute fishing with our friends at Trout Unlimited, followed by the top three biggest fish we've ever landed. And finally, we'll talk to James Kane about the day he caught $100,000 while magnet fishing. Lincoln, Georgia, is a place I visited last year while attending the Masters. It's Masters Week right now. I had one of the most unique dining experiences of my life. There it was. It was so southern that I. I couldn't believe that it was real. It's called Papa's Old South. You went into a little trailer house and you ate from their Buffet, sorts of Southern fried foods. It was so satisfying. If you live in Georgia, if you're ever attending, the Masters make the drive to Lincolnton to visit Papa's Old South. But I got, I got one master story to tell you because the Masters teed off today.

[Brody Henderson]

Hold on, before you tell us that, tell me what you ate there.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, everything they. They had.

[Brody Henderson]

Well, give us your top three.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Every protein was fried, so, like fried chicken, that was delicious. Their cornbread, that was great. And then catfish. Oh, of course they had catfish. Yeah, they had mountain catfish. Yeah. They would shame you if you didn't take enough on your plate. It was that kind of place. And maybe that sort of experience is more common than I'm aware of. And I'm just ignorant to like how southern folks treat you and how just dang nice they are and how excited they are about their food. But go to Papa's Old South. I loved it. I can't believe it exists in 2025. And then the other best thing was the dessert. It was a cherry pie, I believe. Oh, interesting. We were in there with all the good church going folks while we were head to the Masters.

[Brody Henderson]

How much was this buffet?

[Giannis Boutellis]

I don't know. Probably like 20 bucks or something. The price didn't feel very Southern. That, that made sense to me. I was like, oh, that's. That's relatable. The rest of it was very different, though. One master story to tell you. You know our friend Brian Harmon, who's been on Trivia, he's been on the regular meat eater podcast. We were there on a. Which is when things are like, less serious than the actual tournament. So you can just like a little more leeway for the patrons. They call them patrons. You're not a fan when you're there because you're not fanatical. You're just like, very respectful. And you're a patron. Anyway.

[James Kane]

They have all kinds of vocabulary, things they have to say.

[Giannis Boutellis]

It's very Masters, very different.

[James Kane]

It's not the rough. It's a second cut. Can't say rough.

[Giannis Boutellis]

It's very different. And say fans, I'm glad it exists in that one place. If the entire golf world was like that, I'd be like, this is so pretentious. It's disgusting. But having it exist in that one sort of place once a year, I. I enjoy that. Anyway, Brian Harmon, it was on the first practice day, I was with a few buddies and I was like, do you think he'd, like, look over if I made a little turkey call? There are no turkeys that live on Augusta. But he was probably 75 yards away, and there are hundreds of people around at this point. You're hearing birds all day long. So, you know, let's. Let's watch this. And so I did that. And sure enough, his head turned on a swivel over to my direction. No one else, though, in this crowd of hundreds of people, acknowledged it. That was just very satisfying. That's why I'll always cheer for Brian Harmon.

[James Kane]

So there is a lot of birds. They don't pipe in the bird noises.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You know what? You don't see a lot of birds. You hear a lot of birds. And conspiracy theorists would tell you that, yeah, there are speakers around that you can't see. I would bet there are speakers piping in some of those other tournaments have been busted for doing exactly that. But that place.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, really?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, that place is so manicured. Like, you stand under a tree and you look up and you see that all of the branches off of the main trunk are, like, tied with some wire to each other because every little blade of grass, every leaf is so impeccably placed and thoughtful that nothing escapes them as far as what this place should look like, smell like, sound like. So if they were piping in bird noises, that would not surprise me.

[Brody Henderson]

Brody, the epitome of cleaning up the woods.

[Giannis Boutellis]

It's wild.

[James Kane]

That's what it is. The natural environment.

[Brody Henderson]

Well, no, I'm saying it's. It's not. But you know, my. So my elders, you know, my. My. The generation of my dad's parents. And so they were like my great uncles and whatever, they were big into that. Like, when they had little.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Cleaning up the woods.

[Brody Henderson]

Cat. When they had little cabins, cottages, whatnot, like, that was a thing they did. I mean, they were just working people. They loved to work. So they would go up to their cabin. Instead of just, like, laying around drinking beer, getting sun, they would work and they would do things like clean up, clean out all the, you know, seaweed. Not seaweed, but whatever, you know, plant was growing in the pond.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Sure.

[Brody Henderson]

Or go into the woods and literally rake the woods clean. Right. And it was just like, in their mind, they're beautifying.

[James Kane]

Right.

[Brody Henderson]

I mean, a lot of people do that now. I mean, let me look at lawns. I mean, it's.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Sure.

[Brody Henderson]

People love to manicure. Oh, man. Like, humans love that look. Nature really doesn't.

[James Kane]

I. I worked on a golf course ground crew all through high school and college. And this time of year in the north, they're like, Way past this down where the Masters is going on. But, like, when. When it was first time to go to work in the spring, that's all we did was pick up sticks off the ground. Like, hours and hours of picking up sticks.

[Giannis Boutellis]

What other work did you do for the golf course? Were you, like, spreading fertilizer, cutting grass?

[James Kane]

Yeah. Ground screw, everything.

[Giannis Boutellis]

And did you ever swing a golf club in those days?

[James Kane]

Once in a while. We'd around. But like, I. I'm just like, you.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Know, what about your peers working there? Were they not, like, deeply.

[James Kane]

No.

[Giannis Boutellis]

In love with golf?

[James Kane]

No, that. No. Like, guys, like, we had a little, like, crew of friends that worked out on the course. And it was a job. It was a job, but it was a cool job because you start at 5 or 6 in the morning, be done. Like, the latest we'd work was two. You'd have the rest of the day to do what you want.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Was that place covered in deer and turkeys?

[James Kane]

Yes, that course. We used to hunt on that golf course because we were like, buddies with the dude, the brothers that owned that course. So we'd now and then hunt on that golf course.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That. That'd be a dream. Permission to get is on a golf course somewhere. Not Augusta, though. No turkeys there. But for Brian Harmon, he thought for two seconds that there was so cheer for him this week.

[Brody Henderson]

Do you think you'd actually like hunting a golf course?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Would I? Yeah, absolutely. If you. If you're out there and you got permission or you own a golf course, you're a manager at a golf course, and that place is covered up in deer, you let me know. I'll come hunt that thing for you. Why wouldn't you like it? That's no different than hunting a cornfield.

[Brody Henderson]

No, it is a lot different.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. I don't think so.

[James Kane]

I'm kind of leaning with. If you're to compare it to a cornfield, it ain't that much different.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah. Them deer being deer when they're out on a golf course.

[Brody Henderson]

Okay.

[Giannis Boutellis]

I. I also like the idea of hunting them in a unique spot. I've never gotten to do an urban hunt. I've lived in places that have had urban hunts and I've, like, haven't drawn the tag. That would be a unique experience that I would also embrace. If you're, you know, 40 yards off someone's back patio. Boy, that'd be fun. I don't want to. I don't want to spend the rest of my life hunting golf courses.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah. I guess for an experience, I would do it. It just would seem that for me, aesthetically, it wouldn't be as pleasing as hunting in the woods.

[Giannis Boutellis]

We're not disagreeing there. If you got a golf course that you can let me hunt, you go.

[James Kane]

Some golf courses have a lot of woods. That one that I worked on.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Johnny, is your line season over with?

[Brody Henderson]

No, I've got like, there's like four days left in the season. Season ends on the 14th, which is next Monday.

[Giannis Boutellis]

But does it feel like it's over with when there's four days left or is it like still good hunting conditions?

[Brody Henderson]

It's. It's tougher hunting conditions. I don't mind them. I think it's. It's good for the dog. I'm gonna definitely go out at least one more day this weekend. And you know, there's probably a lot of people that have given up by now. A lot of folks, you know, once.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Because of snow. Why?

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah, or just, you know, it's like anything. It's like turkey season. If it's a six week long turkey season, you know, there's sure 8, 90% of the people are out there in the first week. And then the numbers just atrophy, you know, from there on out, I imagine the same thing happened. I mean, I know it happens with elk season. I mean, our season is, I don't know, five months long. So. Yeah, but it's, you know, obviously the animals are still out there and you can still catch them and you don't necessarily need to have fresh snow. Fresh snow makes it easier to find the original track. But yeah, we had a tough hunt the other day where Mingus just ran a lot of trash, which I don't really like that term, but that basically means when he's running anything besides what he's supposed to be running. And give me an example.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Fox. Sure.

[Brody Henderson]

Fox, coyote, deer. Uhhuh. And he was in with another pack of dogs. And I'm not blaming that other pack, but okay, similar to humans, you get into a, a group and the mentality changes about what individuals can do and what the group can do. And yeah, he gets caught up in that and does what they call a lot of booger barking. Which I was thinking about where that comes from. And I was thinking maybe they, it's like a term for being like, oh yeah, they're just, they're literally. Instead of smelling the scent on the ground of a lion, he's literally smelling his own boogers and barking at them. I don't know where that came from.

[Giannis Boutellis]

When I hear that, I Think of, like, a turkey hunt getting boogered. Just like things went wrong.

[Brody Henderson]

Sure. So I would definitely like to go out and finish on a little bit better note, because right now, when I came upstairs this morning, I saw Mingus crawling out of his bed, looking at me, and I was like, you're a piece of dog.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, wow. Okay. Well, he's got four days to redeem himself. And then after that, Yanni, you get us a full recap of live season here on Media Radio.

[Phil]

Okay.

[Brody Henderson]

I'll come back and tell you I had a successful hunt a couple weeks ago, but I imagine we burned up our time for me to tell you about that one.

[Giannis Boutellis]

I'm. I have a fear that we have. That's all right. All right, let's get to our first caller. Joining us on the line now is Stephanie Raymond, the program manager from the Orca Network. Stephanie is here to educate us about one of the world's most endangered animals, the southern resident orcas. Stephanie, welcome to the show.

[Stephanie Raymond]

Thanks so much for having me. I'm happy to be here.

[Giannis Boutellis]

First thing, Stephanie, tell us about what makes southern resident orcas different from the other 50,000 killer whales that live in our oceans.

[Stephanie Raymond]

Well, so, yeah, orcas are one of the most widely distributed mammals on the planet. So on the face of it, it might seem like there are plenty of them out there, but the different populations of orcas around the world have very different characteristics. And we used to call these different ecotypes, but now we're starting to regard them as separate species. And just last fall, the southern resident orcas were designated as their own specific species.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, interesting.

[Stephanie Raymond]

Relative to, you know, the. The wider population, also the Biggs orcas. So there's two different orcas in the Salish Sea that share that ecosystem, but they do not interact in any way. And both of them have been designated their own specific species.

[James Kane]

Now, Spencer and I are arguing about this earlier, and, like, I'm a lumper, and obviously he's a splitter. Like. Like how. Like, who's deciding their different species? And how is that decided? And, like, you know, a lot of people would look at them, yeah, as one species.

[Stephanie Raymond]

There is some formal body, and I don't know their precise title, who gets to decide this stuff. But the reason the decision was made is that for about 20 years now, there has been research about the genetic differences between these groups and the behavioral differences, the vocalization differences. These different populations of orcas around the world have really different characteristics. Each group has unique vocals and culture. They have behavior that's learned from their mothers. Each has a specialized diet, depending on what's available to them in that environment. They're very like humans in this, except that where human groups of different cultures and languages and dietary preferences tend to intermingle. The orcas don't do that. So the southern residents are a unique, genetically distinct population of about 74 animals who range from Vancouver island in British Columbia to Monterey Bay, California. They are coastal animals. They don't tend to go far offshore. They are made up of three large extended family groups that we call J Pod, K Pod and LPod. And within this population, the young whales never leave their mothers. They are always there. So it's a big group around, you know, some, some common female ancestor who may not no longer be living. But these groups are, have all formed in that way. They are primarily salmon eaters. Over 80% of their diet is chinook or king salmon in particular. They also will eat coho and they've been known to eat lingcod and halibut on occasion. They have good taste in fish. So they are fish eaters. And that is one of the things that distinguishes them from the other orca population that shares their territory because that other population feeds exclusively on marine mammals.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, so 74 of them left in the wild. What's caused that decline?

[Stephanie Raymond]

Boy, a lot of things. So these whales, primarily their primary threat right now is lack of food. As salmon fisheries have declined throughout the Pacific Northwest. You know, that's been a big challenge for them. It takes a lot of food to Sustain A, an 18 month gestation and have a healthy calf and then feed that healthy calf. So being able to reproduce without enough food to supply, that has been a challenge. They also, these animals have a high toxic body burden. They're carrying a lot of chemicals in their bodies, persistent chemicals like PCBs and PBDEs, flame retardant chemicals, because they're eating high on the food chain. And the salmon that they're eating in pretty much every case are passing through estuaries that, where there is this historic contamination in the sediment that gets into these young salmon and then stays with them. The reason that the salmon are a preferred food is that they have a high fat content and that fat is where these persistent chemicals store. So the animals themselves are accumulating that, that toxin in their fat, the orcas themselves. And then if they don't have enough food to eat, they start to metabolize that fat. The blubber that they're, you know, would normally be there to keep them warm. They start to metabolize that, and that releases those chemicals into their different organ systems. And we see both reproductive effects, neurological effects, and immunological effects as a result of that toxicity. So that's another challenge. And then we have evidence that shows us that, first of all, big freighter traffic, in particular, when we have the big container ships coming in and out of these ports on the west coast, the sound of the bubbles that are generated by their propellers as that. As those bubbles collapse, it's called cavitation. And the cavitation sound is happening exactly at the same frequency that these whales use to communicate and to echolocate to find their food. Finally, if a vessel is within 400 yards of a female southern resident, we see that she stops foraging. So vessel disturbance is another issue that these whales are faced with, Stephanie.

[James Kane]

They're down to 74. What was their historic high? Like, how. How far have they dropped? And then, like, what. What amount of time?

[Stephanie Raymond]

Yeah, so we don't know exactly how many were present prior to the era when they were being captured from marine parks, because nobody had done a census. And there was just sort of this assumption that there were whales coming in from the ocean into Puget Sound. And, you know, they were just. They would just keep doing that. It wasn't until the 1970s that the initial census was taken, and at that point, the population was pretty close to where it is now. The estimates are that maybe between 150 and 200 would be like the normal carrying capacity for the population. And we did see some recovery following the end of the capture era. The population rebounded to close to 100 animals. But then in the late 1980s, we saw salmon fisheries crash. And along with that came the corresponding decline in the southern resident population. And there has been a. A lot of effort made to restore salmon habitat and, you know, legislate different regulations around how vessels should behave around these. These animals. But we're not seeing yet the recovery that we really would like to see.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Talk about that capture era, Stephanie, and how differently these whales were treated in the 1950s and 1960s.

[Stephanie Raymond]

Yeah, these animals used to be feared very much. People just assumed that if you found the water near one, that was it. You know, it was kind of the. The great white shark of its time, that they were just aggressive, vicious animals. Killer whales.

[Brody Henderson]

Right.

[Stephanie Raymond]

You call them killer whales, and people make assumptions. Also, fishers didn't want the competition for salmon. My own grandfather was a commercial fisher, and, you know, when I was a little kid in the 70s and was, you know, starting to get really turned on about These whales, he would tell me about how he had a permit to shoot him if they got too close to his nets. So, you know, they were not animals that were really well loved in the way that they are now. There was a whale that was. That was nicknamed Moby Doll. She was one of the. Or he was one of the first captive orcas. He was shot multiple times because somebody wanted a model for a sculpture to put at the Vancouver Aquarium when it was first open, it opened, and the whale survived the. The shooting and survived for a while in captivity. And this was when we started to realize that they weren't aggressive toward humans, despite how the humans had been treating them. And then we had Namu, who famously was caught in a fisherman's net and sold to Ted Griffith in Seattle and was on display in the Seattle waterfront for a while. Again, you know, Ted really bonded with that whale and was able to ride on his back and. And people, you know, at that time would go in the water with the whale and people would be like, oh, my gosh, it's an accident, and what's going to happen? And then it turned out that was all part of the act, that Nammu was not a vicious creature. So in captivity, the ant, the intelligence of these animals became apparent, and there were very few incidences of aggression against humans. You know, we know since then, there have been some notable exceptions, but that also aligned with the observation that there's never been a documented incidence of aggression against a human from killer whales in the wild. So people began to see them as friendly, which, you know, that's a human value. That may or may not be true, but the population census and the way the whales behaved around researchers in the wild began to point to something really special about these animals and how they seem to have a natural curiosity about us, but also an uncanny ability to know our intentions. You mentioned in the questions you sent me the Seymour Narrows in British Columbia. They were going to place a gun there to target practice, do target practice on these whales when they pass through. And they chose that location because that was a spot the whales were known to frequent. Well, after they set the gun up, the whales never went there, as though somehow they knew. And we can't explain that, but, you know, there are many, many stories of situations like that where somehow the whales seem to understand what the humans were up to in a way that we don't understand what they're up to. So it's. They're. They're very. That by themselves is such a compelling thing. I think a lot of researchers and a lot of the general public are really drawn to this population in particular, because we know, we know them intimately, we know them as individuals. They all have nicknames that the public may know them by, and we know their stories. So it really has been a 180 degree shift in attitudes and, you know, just a little bit more than 50 years.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, I've seen a lot of headlines in the last six months about the southern resident orcas. So I want to talk to you about some of that news. First thing, tell us about the salmon hats and why people cared about that last fall.

[Stephanie Raymond]

So this was a really interesting human phenomenon as much as an orca phenomenon. In the 1980s, late 1980s, there was one summer when it seemed to be the thing to do for the southern resident orcas to carry salmon around on their heads. And you know, if our, if the image we have of, of orcas is a whale in a tank, that's a very sterile environment. They don't have a lot of things to interact with. But in the wild, these whales are very tactile, very interactive creatures. They like to manipulate things in their environment. They are curious about them. They're, you know, they want to play or, or do other things. And they do have these social trends that happen, whether it's a behavioral trend or in this case, maybe a fashion trend. So we've also seen years where, you know, everybody's got a piece of kelp draped over their dorsal fin or some eelgrass or something like that. And what happened last fall, we had an just incredible salmon run here in the Salish Sea, Just record breaking across the board. And one of our volunteers snapped a picture that had a salmon sitting on the head of an orca. Well, somebody grabbed that from one of our reports that we put out and it went viral. And everybody's like, oh, they're reviving the trend. But the reality is that that was part of a series of pictures in which, you know, the picture before and the picture after did not show a salmon on the orca's head. And so we don't know exactly how that fish wound up on that whale's head for just a second, but it did not appear to be actually carrying it. There was one other researcher who witnessed a salmon on the head of an orca for a second as well, but didn't get a picture of it. And that was it. And the reality is that when these whales come down into Puget Sound, which is what they do in the fall, because that's when the salmon are running into the sound. There are hundreds of people on the shorelines with cameras documenting their presence, getting their pictures. And if there had been a widespread revival of that salmon hat trend, we definitely would have seen a lot more evidence of that than we actually did. It was just really interesting how compelling it was to humans. Again, you know, here's this interesting behavior. Look what they're doing. They're doing something like us. They have a fashion trend. And it just really. We were getting media requests from as far away as germany and new zealand for people asking about this particular situation. Situation.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. And Stephanie is skeptical that the salmon hats are back and fashionable. All right.

[Stephanie Raymond]

We haven't. Haven't seen it since.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Now, last year, the largest dam removal project in u. S. History took place when four dams were destroyed on the klamath river. Talk about what that means for these southern resident orcas.

[Stephanie Raymond]

So what that means is that there's now more habitat for these chinook salmon to spawn. And we know that the further the chinook have to travel upriver, the bigger those fish have to be. It also really, you know, has a big influence on the spring chinook run. These were salmon that would enter the rivers in the spring, but they didn't spawn until fall because it took them that long to get all the way up to the upper watersheds. So when we open up this upper watershed habitat, we are really improving the salmon supply for the southern residents to eat. And that's true all up and down the coast, of course, because as I said before, they. They go down as far as monterey bay. All of the salmon beari streams on the pacific northwest coast Potentially can supply them with additional salmon to eat. What we've seen as the fisheries have declined Is that there are not only fewer fish, but they tend to be smaller because they have less range to spawn in. And that means that the whales are working harder. They're spending more energy to find smaller fish, so they have to spend even more energy to get enough food to eat. So bigger fish are great. More spawning habitat for those fish is great. And, you know, both the. The klamath and the elwha dam removal projects are potentially going to boost that supply of salmon. And hopefully that's going to make a big difference for these animals.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, let's. Let's end this interview on some more good news. It's news. It's only a few days old. Tell us about the newest member of the southern resident j pod.

[Stephanie Raymond]

Yeah, this is really exciting. We just had a baby J63, so it won't be Given a nickname for at least another six months or so, there's not a lot to say at this point. She appears to be the first calf of a whale known as J40 suttles. And suttles has a long history of being kind of an auntie or babysitter to other new calves, but has never been seen with a calf of her own. So so far, baby looks great and we are cautiously optimistic. But of course we'll need to have a few more sightings to confirm that Suttles really is mom and that things are continuing to go well. And the other piece of good news is that baby J62, who was born in December, is also appears to be thriving. That little one seems to be doing really, really well in recent observations.

[Giannis Boutellis]

And last thing, if people want to help southern resident orcas and support their conservation efforts, what can they do?

[Stephanie Raymond]

So it really goes back to, you know, a lot of the stuff that we're told is good for the environment is going to be helpful for these whales ultimately because we're all connected in that way. If you're in the Pacific Northwest, being aware of your watershed and what you're contributing to it is really important. Avoiding toxic products for lawn, garden or farm care, maintaining your vehicle so you're not leaking oil or make, and making sure your tires are properly inflated. It turns out the dust that erodes off of tires, it's actually really toxic for some types of salmon. So that's another piece that, that we're, you know, as we're uncovering the different ways that we can restore salmon habitat, that's one of the things that's being looked at. Conserving electricity is huge because again, you know, we're here in the Northwest, we're so used to abundant, inexpensive hydropower, but we know now what a devastating effect that has on the salmon population and wherever you live, you know, because we, our power grid spreads all over the place. That's helpful. Advocating against proposed dams or removing existing dams that we don't necessarily need anymore. Advocating for good conservation policies for salmon and for orcas. All of those things are things that people can do to support this population.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, everyone listening is going to do their part. Thanks for joining us, Stephanie, and congrats on the exciting J63 news.

[Stephanie Raymond]

Thank you. And thanks so much for having me.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You boys feel differently about orcas now? You all excited?

[James Kane]

I mean, they're super cool animals, you know, I'm glad to hear they're, they're, they're potentially going to be doing better.

[Barbie Augustini]

Do you see them.

[James Kane]

I was surprised to hear. I was expecting to hear that there had been some precipitous decline in their population, but the fact that their numbers have remained steady for 50 years makes me think that, you know, maybe things aren't as bad as the picture isn't as bad as people might be painting.

[Giannis Boutellis]

I don't think we fully got the scope of it talking to Stephanie, but one piece of news I'd seen is that like 60 or 70% of the calves die in the first year. And I think that's the thing they're really fighting right now is how can we make sure that when a calf is born, which is already a lot to ask for, that the thing survives to adulthood. So I think that's. That's what I mean.

[James Kane]

They have the unfortunate fate of living in basically an urban marine environment.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Totally.

[James Kane]

Which, you know, makes things tough.

[Spencer Newarth]

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[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, moving on. Our next segment is one minute fishing. Do I feel lucky?

[James Kane]

Well, do you, punk?

[H]

Go ahead, make my cast.

[Giannis Boutellis]

One Minute fishing is where we go live to someone who's fishing and they have one minute to catch a fish. And if they're successful, we'll make a 500 donation to a conservation group. And for the whole month of April, our friends at Trout Unlimited are joining us for one minute Fishing this week. Our angler is Dan Johnson, the Desert Terminal Lakes Basin Project coordinator at tu. Today he's on Hot Creek in California and fishing for a donation to Trout Unlimited. Dan, welcome to the show.

[H]

Hey, thank you all so much for having us and for highlighting to you this month and highlighting this, this beautiful stream by me.

[Giannis Boutellis]

It is a beautiful place, also a windy place. Now, first thing, we asked Trout Unlimited to highlight some important watersheds across the country for this segment. Tell us about Hot Creek and its greatest threats.

[H]

Is a very, very unique stream. It starts as Mammoth Creek up in the eastern Sierras. There flows down. It's really small, very narrow as it hits the valley. But about a couple hundred yards upstream of where I am, it has a number of geothermal inputs. This hot water that comes out, it's actually perfectly in that 60 to 67 degree range that is Optimum for trout growth and, you know, longevity and reproduction. But we've been involved in hot creek for a number of years because just over the hill, I can see it from here, There is a project to start exploratory gold mining Right on just a ways over the banks. There's in 2021, the company core mining. They were awarded permits to drill. After a huge amount of community backlash and litigation from other NGOs in the area, those permits were revoked for the time being. But, you know, gold is near all time highs. And we are actually working on a protective designation for hot creek, outstanding national resource water, which we feel would, you know, neutralize that mining threat once and for all. And I mean, at trout unlimited, we're realists, right? I drove a truck here today, and it's built out of things that were pulled out of the ground at one point. You know, we need mining, we need to work these landscapes, but also we need places like hot creek. You know, that's a part of our American tradition. I actually roped my father in law in. He's my cameraman today. And I come out here with my daughter and yeah, Trout unlimited. We're just working to protect the places we love to fish.

[Giannis Boutellis]

We're grateful that tu is involved. Yeah. What do you got, Brody?

[James Kane]

Hey, Dan.

[Brody Henderson]

What.

[James Kane]

What kind of land are you. Is hat is hot creek like a public. Primarily a public river. Are you standing on, like, what land entity manages the land you're standing on right now?

[H]

Yeah, so hot creek, you know, it's actually interesting. We're in the very valley stage of our portion of hot creek, and it ends up going in some pretty dramatic canyons. It's a mixture of u. S. Forest service mostly to the across the stream from me blm down below. There's also some private property and some. Some tribal trust land as well. So. So the fair number of.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[James Kane]

The gold. The gold mining would occur on. Is the proposal to. For the gold mining to occur on public land?

[H]

That's correct. On forest service.

[James Kane]

Gotcha, Gotcha.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, Dan, let's talk about the fishing. What are you targeting today? How are you doing it, and what fly are you throwing?

[H]

Yeah, so we are. Hot creek has. And of course, I just got stuck on my pants. Hot creek has wild populations of brown trout, is kind of the main quarry. There's also some rainbows. At this time of the year, none of the really big stuff is hatching. So I am throw in a size 18 blue wing olive, if you can see that, and then a size 20 zebra midge down below, so the real small stuff, but we did have a hatch going off a bit earlier. We've been watching fish rise here. I've been, you know, whispering words, reassurance to my tiny flies the last 10 minutes and I'm feeling good about it.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. Have you made a cast yet today, Dan?

[H]

I fished a little bit downstream, but we've been trying to do our best to leave this hole intact and not, you know, not mess with them at all. I don't think they, I don't think they know that we're here. So this is the one we've been reserving.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Great. Well, your one minute of fishing starts when you make that first cast. Let's do it.

[James Kane]

Better get in there before someone high holes ya.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, to the edge of the creek. Yanni, describe what you're seeing there.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, just a beautiful creek. I'd have to just stand there and enjoy the view for a while before I even wet a line.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's right. All right, he's making his first cast.

[Brody Henderson]

Snow capped mountains, dropping into some like deserty up high country. Sage.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Huh? Looks like a place you'd find some, some muleys or black tails and snow. Some antelope.

[Brody Henderson]

I like that.

[James Kane]

He's kind of being a purist here because if I was going for the one minute deal, I'd probably have a San Juan worm and an egg on there.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, did, did we have a hook set there, Dan?

[Brody Henderson]

He thinks, yes, we did.

[H]

We missed it.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, you're 30 seconds in.

[H]

He got, he bit the tiny little zebra midge.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh. All right. Feeling optimistic.

[Brody Henderson]

Burning a lot of time on that false cast, Dan. Get it back in the water.

[H]

I know.

[Giannis Boutellis]

20 seconds, guys.

[H]

I gotta, I gotta dry them out.

[Giannis Boutellis]

20 seconds to go. 10 seconds left in.

[Brody Henderson]

Eat it.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Not gonna happen today. Dan, tell us what happened on that, that one fish that made an offering at your fly.

[H]

Yeah, so I could see him. It's actually really clear water here, so I saw him move for the zebra midge and I mean, I hope you.

[Brody Henderson]

All don't mind if I keep fishing while we talk.

[H]

I know it doesn't count, but yeah, he went for, he went for the zebra midge and I, he just didn't commit to the, the bite and. Yeah, we'll see. We're gonna hang out here the rest of the day too, so maybe I'll, maybe I'll text y'all a picture or two.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. Good work day for you, Dan.

[James Kane]

That's the line I, my clients used to always use, like, oh, he missed it like they never missed the fish. The fish.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's right.

[H]

And, and if I may real quick, if you're looking to get involved with Tu's work on public lands, just go to tu.org and we have a little bar at the top that says take action. We're. We're likely working in your neck of the woods right now.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, good message. Dan. Thank you for joining us. Good luck with fishing the rest of the day, and thanks to Trout Unlimited for doing what they do.

[Brody Henderson]

Thanks, Dan.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, we're halfway through the show. Let's take a break for some listener feedback. Phil, what do you got?

[Phil]

We've got a question from our producer, Corey Calkins. He asks who's the better golfer, Spencer, Giannis or Brody?

[James Kane]

Ain't me.

[Giannis Boutellis]

I imagine it's me just because I play the most, but I am not a good golfer at all. If Yanni wanted to go golfing five times this year, he might be better than me after those five times. I'm, I'm, I'm. I just enjoy the camaraderie of it.

[Brody Henderson]

Maybe we don't. We don't need to spend any more time on this.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Corey asked that question because he's the best golfer in the office or top two. So. So good for you.

[Brody Henderson]

Who rivals him?

[James Kane]

Man, I used to like Corey and then I found out he's a golfer.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Well, he's. You'll like him even more when I tell you this, though. He's a phenomenal golfer who doesn't golf. He'll go like once a year, and that's good enough for him. But if I had Corey, if I had Corey's skills, I'd be out there even more. But it'd be Corey and Colin, the best golfers. What else you got, Phil?

[Phil]

Question for Giannis from Durman. What are you feeding a top level hunting hound like Mingus?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Piece of crap hunting hound. You described him as earlier.

[Brody Henderson]

I just feed him dog food, buddy.

[James Kane]

Didn't you used to remember your old dog Mud? Didn't you used to feed her meat?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

I mean, we feed Mingus some meat, too, some scraps. You know, I'll save my trimmings and feed it to him. But yeah, for the most part, we just, just. I vary it up. I don't feed him the same stuff all the time. We're actually going to switch over to whatever Costco is selling. That's what I'm buying next for Mango.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Do you know who makes it for Costco?

[Brody Henderson]

I imagine that I don't, but I had a couple people tell me that they thought it was good and it was cheap, so that works for us.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah. I'm not buying into the whole thing that my dog needs to eat the same diet that I eat.

[Phil]

Rashad asks, and this is for Giannis as well. I'm assuming you know the answer to this. When's the next Meat eater roast coming out? I loved the first one.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, well, I'm glad you like the first one, Rashad. The next one is coming out early May. I don't think there is an actual drop date yet, but look for it in early May. It's a good one. We got Corinne Schneider, meteor podcast producer, and Maggie Hudlo, director of website content, squaring off with each other.

[Giannis Boutellis]

I heard they put on an exceptional show.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, buddy, they made some cooking.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Was delicious food coming out in early May from Peter.

[Phil]

Question for Brody and Yanni. What cartridge are you going to use for your kids when they go from hunting deer and antelope to elk?

[James Kane]

Man, I started my older son on a.243 and he hunted with that for three. No, four seasons. Three was last year. Last year was four. This year he's going to a 6.5 Creedmoor, and I would be completely comfortable having him shoot an elk with that cartridge. And he killed now with a.30 06 last fall.

[Brody Henderson]

So, yeah, we've been shooting the 6.5 Creedmoor, and I imagine we'll stay shooting the 6.5 CreedMoor and just not shoot it too far.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Let's do one more, Phil.

[Phil]

Oh, man. Okay. From Eric. How do you guys balance family vacations and hunting trips? If you have limited time off.

[James Kane]

You take family vacations that are hunting trips or fishing trips.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You two boys are pretty good at that.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, for sure. Yeah. I'd say there's very few hunting trips that if they're not work, that are, you know, that are hunting trips or hunting trips without my family. So the only one I can think of off the top of my head is like, I'm gonna go to Wisconsin, hunt with my dad for a few days for turkeys. But otherwise, if it's not a work trip, I'm hunting with my family, and otherwise I'm hunting with a camera.

[James Kane]

Yeah, I mean, I definitely do some. Some solo hunting, but, like, you know, most of our family vacations involve hunting or. Or a lot of fishing, too.

[Brody Henderson]

So you're kind of asking the wrong guys because we get to hunt for work sometimes, so we don't actually have to balance family vacations and hunting trips because, yeah, we get to hunt for work sometimes, but. Yeah, I hope that helps.

[Phil]

Eric, sorry to make.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Probably doesn't. All right, moving on. Our next segment is top threes. I will.

[Brody Henderson]

Having trouble over here. Such a beautiful void. It is sure.

[Giannis Boutellis]

So beautiful. Phil, do you. Does the computer have to help you hit that high note or is that all. That's all wrong.

[Phil]

That was. That was natural.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Wonderful.

[Phil]

Natural, baby.

[James Kane]

Wow.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Now, this week we are ranking the three biggest fish we've ever caught. And to be clear, it's not literally the biggest, it's the biggest relative to other fish of that species. So, you know, for today's show, it would be more relevant if you caught a two and a half pound bluegill than if you caught a 30 pound tarpon. So these are the three biggest fish we've caught relative to other fish of that species. Brody, you go first. What's the third biggest fish you've ever caught?

[James Kane]

We need the picture because I can't remember what order I put them in.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, big old trout.

[James Kane]

That. That's a big old whopper. That's the third biggest fish. Spencer wants me to say that's the third biggest fish I've ever caught. Then I can talk about it.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's right. Yeah, talk about it. Tell us about it.

[James Kane]

Well, it's a big ass rainbow trout.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Look how young you were.

[James Kane]

How old were you, man? That was probably like 20ish. Nah, well, maybe. Maybe like 17 years ago, let's say.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, so how old?

[Brody Henderson]

I don't know.

[James Kane]

Mid-30S.

[Giannis Boutellis]

I didn't know you were ever in your mid-30s.

[James Kane]

Yeah, man, I wasn't born 53 years old.

[Brody Henderson]

Now is that a pellet head or is that. Or is that not.

[James Kane]

Well, I mean, not on the rip. I don't think it was on the river that it was caught on.

[Giannis Boutellis]

How big was that fish? For people who aren't watching this again.

[James Kane]

Spencer and I were talking about this earlier.

[Brody Henderson]

I don't.

[James Kane]

Generally don't carry a tape measure around with me or a scale, but that fish was over 30. Like I'm guessing 32ish. And it was caught this time of year in the spring. So it's a female full egg. So I'm guessing 12.

[Giannis Boutellis]

She's got a big old belly on.

[James Kane]

12 pound.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Ish.

[James Kane]

Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

What were you doing when you caught that fish?

[James Kane]

What do you mean? What was that like what.

[Giannis Boutellis]

What fly were you throwing?

[James Kane]

Oh, I caught it on an egg. Big old egg pattern.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. Was that a good day for you fishing?

[James Kane]

Yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

Can you tell us the river? Is that sure.

[James Kane]

What was the Roaring Fort?

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

It kind of tailed off at the end there. Felt like you were regretting telling us.

[James Kane]

That's not a secret, man. There's probably 20 boats on the Roaring Fork today.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You ever gonna top that trout, or is that a once in a lifetime fish?

[James Kane]

I don't know. I don't, I don't have a crystal ball for trout. That may be it because I just don't do that kind of fishing as nearly as much as I used to. But who knows? Anything could happen.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, Yanni, you're next.

[Brody Henderson]

Well, the third biggest fish I ever caught was.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Say it is.

[Brody Henderson]

You want me to say this fish?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

Yes.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Whatever fish is on the screen that you're talking about.

[Brody Henderson]

See, I labeled them wrong. I was gonna finish with this one.

[Phil]

No, see, I think you, you, you labeled it number three, probably meaning that you want it to be shown third.

[Giannis Boutellis]

But I can't believe how hard this segment is. All right, so the, the third.

[Brody Henderson]

We told you you had problems before we started. This is a sailfish that I caught recently down in Guatemala, which.

[James Kane]

Did you pull your tape measure out for that one?

[Brody Henderson]

No, no, no, I pulled one out of the water. Sailfish. I showed you guys a picture of that on an earlier episode and a couple folks remind me that you shouldn't take those fish out of the water. It really increases mortality. So, yeah, it was. I, I've only caught a few sailfish. They were all roughly the same size to me.

[James Kane]

And you caught that one on a fly pole, though?

[Brody Henderson]

Well, I don't know if it was exactly that one that I caught on, on the fly rod, but yeah, it was, it was a great trip. We had three anglers. We, we all caught quite a few of those sailfish and. Beautiful place, beautiful water. Rough seas, though. Rough seas.

[James Kane]

Did you.

[Barbie Augustini]

Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You. Don't. You.

[James Kane]

Were you getting a little.

[Brody Henderson]

No, I was wearing the. So I was good. But those guys, you can see there, the guy on the left is Zan and my brother in law. They decided on day three that they were all good with the patch and they didn't wear one on day three and it caught him.

[Giannis Boutellis]

How'd they take that picture?

[Brody Henderson]

GoPro on a stick.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Good looking photo. Good looking fish.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, yeah. They know what they're doing. We were fishing with the Selfish Lodge of Guatemala. I don't know. DM me on Instagram if you want to know more about them. Great outfit.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right. The third biggest fish I ever caught is this perch. Now that, that I got a tape Measure under it. Like Brody was saying, I, I did have a tape measure with me. I was 14 and a 4 inches. It was 2 pounds exactly. I was south. It was in South Dakota. It was 2012. I was fishing by myself that day. I was pulling plugs for walleye. Did not expect to find that fish in that place. There's not a lot of perch in that lake where I caught that.

[Brody Henderson]

No.

[James Kane]

That gets me excited, Spencer. That's my favorite fish right there.

[Giannis Boutellis]

And he hit a number five Rapala shadrap. And when perch get to that size, everything just looks wrong. Like they develop shoulders that they don't normally have.

[James Kane]

They get that hump on their back.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah. Their, their fins look too small. You start to. They like, they look so lethargic. They're like, how is that thing staying well fed enough to grow to that size? But then you're reminded when you're pulling plugs for walleye and it smashes a shad wrap that you'd expect, you know, only larger fish to be keeping up with. And then I got another picture.

[James Kane]

Did you eat him?

[Giannis Boutellis]

No, I threw that one back. Two years later I caught another 14 incher. That one also weighed 2 pounds. Through that fish back as well. It was, it was almost the same place, same time of year, same lake doing the same thing. Pulling plugs for walleyes hooked into a big old perch. You can see pictures of these fish on our meat eater YouTube.

[James Kane]

Don't let those things go, Spencer.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's okay. You know what? I. I've like since I've gotten older. If I were to catch that fish today, it's probably more likely I would keep it. But then I felt like I was. I was really doing the Lord's work, letting the 14 inch perch go. But now I realize that like that thing probably had a year life left on it. There was no harm in me keeping that big old perch in the middle.

[James Kane]

Of the good fish sandwich right there.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, Brody, you're up next.

[James Kane]

Okay. I don't remember. Oh, the second biggest fish I've ever caught.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Now that.

[James Kane]

This is a lingcod. Oh, I'm supposed to wait for that.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Do whatever you like.

[Brody Henderson]

That's a nice link.

[James Kane]

Well, link, link. Cod get. Can get quite a bit bigger than this. The reason I put this one in here is because at the time I caught that up around Steve Shack, that was as big of a lingcod as you could keep legally. So that's why it's there.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That and how big is it?

[James Kane]

The slot that year was 30 to 45 inches. So it was, it was like 43, 44. It's hard to get an exact measurement in the bottom one of those skiffs. You can hang them and measure them. But it was, it was just under the slot. So that's, that's a good one. And now like that slot has gotten progressively smaller every year, so you wouldn't be able to keep that thing anymore.

[Giannis Boutellis]

So how much bigger are the bigger ones that you've caught than this one?

[James Kane]

There's actually a second slot in that part of Alaska and it's 55 and over, you know, and nobody's ever.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[James Kane]

Seen one of those. They've got to be down there somewhere. But they can get you. They can get five feet long, 50 pounds. But that's a pretty good one.

[Giannis Boutellis]

One beautiful fish there. Yanni, you're next.

[Brody Henderson]

Well, Spencer, the second biggest fish I've ever caught is that big old redfish.

[Giannis Boutellis]

It is a big redfish, also known.

[Brody Henderson]

As a bull drum, that was caught off the coast of North Carolina with my wife's cousin, Captain Rob Orr. Also had my brother in law and his son with him. It was a great even. We went out for like the night bite. So I didn't start fishing until it pretty much got dark. And we were fishing a shoal with just some cut bait. Pretty simple. And we basically made three casts and we each got to catch a redfish roughly that size. And it was quite the tussle.

[Giannis Boutellis]

The head on that thing.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, it's amazing. Yeah, the head and shoulders and you know, that's what I love these days. Being a freshwater angler for so many years and then doing more salt water in the latter part of, of my life, these fish just, they fight you, you know, they actually pull back, which is what I enjoy so much. Where you know, the trout, you know, it's more of a finesse game to get them to the net. But like that joker, you just don't know if you're gonna actually win the. Win the battle there. But that one we did release. Yeah.

[James Kane]

Are you even allowed to keep them that big in North Carolina?

[Brody Henderson]

You know, that fish is probably. That fish is definitely out of the slot.

[Stephanie Raymond]

So.

[Brody Henderson]

No.

[James Kane]

Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Beautiful fish.

[Brody Henderson]

Thank you.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Again, like the proportions. When fish get this big for their species, the, the head.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

It's just unbelievable.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah, you can imagine that thing doesn't run away for much. It's things. Most of most things are running away from it and that giant mouth.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right. The second biggest fish I ever caught is this northern pike that Phil has shown us a photo of now. That was in 2014. I was a senior in college at that point. That was the biggest pike I had ever caught. I was, I was by myself pulling plugs for walleye. He was just under 40 inches. And then three years later, in 2017, I caught a bigger one that then became my biggest Spencer.

[James Kane]

I thought this was the three biggest fish, not the six biggest fish.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Well, so I'm just giving you some context. This, this pike then was 42 inches. He weighed just over 20 pounds. He ate a number seven Rapala bleeding olive minnow wrap, which is a plug they don't even make anymore. They have, they have minnow body crankbaits, but they don't make that specific one anymore. And, and I was again pulling plugs by myself. This was 2017. I was in the same leg doing the same thing when I, when I caught that other pike, let both of those fish go. That, that was.

[James Kane]

Got a big old gouge in his back from another pike or something.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, yeah, it was, that was fun. That, you know, we were just talking about actually getting to fight a fish getting to fight a 20 pound pike. That, that doesn't even compare to it. Like, you know, the walleye that I was actually targeting that day. So that was my second biggest fish ever. 42 inch pike, just over 20 pounds. All right, we're at our biggest fish.

[James Kane]

Brody, for the biggest one ever. Now, when do I wait for this noise to come in?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Phil, here's what you do. What is, what kind of fish is that? Tell me.

[James Kane]

Well, that's the biggest fish I've ever caught, and it's a kokanee salmon.

[Giannis Boutellis]

So here's what you do. You say the biggest fish I ever caught is this kokanee Salm. And then Phil plays the buoy.

[James Kane]

Gotcha.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yep. Okay, great job. Now tell us about it.

[James Kane]

That's a kokanee salmon, which is a landlocked version of a sockeye salmon, or they call them red salmon. Alaska, in most places where there's kokanee fisheries, freshwater kokanee, lake fisheries in the. Mostly in the western United States. Those things are like 12 inches long. People love fishing form because they're, they're good to eat. That, that thing's like a monster for a coconut. And it's like maybe pushing five pounds or so. I didn't measure it, but, you know, it's like. Yeah, kept it.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay.

[James Kane]

I think it was somewhere 22 to 24 inches. I don't know exactly, but that's like for the species that's an extremely large kokanee snail.

[Giannis Boutellis]

What were you doing when you caught that fish?

[James Kane]

Perch fishing, buddy.

[Giannis Boutellis]

O. Oh. Was that the only kokanee you caught that day?

[James Kane]

Only one we caught that day.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Wow.

[James Kane]

Just happened again.

[Brody Henderson]

I never caught a coconut. You ever caught a coconut?

[Giannis Boutellis]

No, never. Although I don't know how many times I've even been in a lake that had coconut. It's been pretty rare in my fishing days. That's. That's special fish.

[James Kane]

Yeah, it was like. It was. It was good eating, too. It's very good eating.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, Yanni, you're up.

[Brody Henderson]

All right. The biggest fish I've ever caught, which was. This is supposed to be my third biggest fish, but it doesn't matter. And I actually didn't even personally catch this.

[James Kane]

Oh, there she is. My girl. Lindsay.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah. Do you remember Lindsay's last name?

[James Kane]

Meyer.

[Brody Henderson]

Meyer, yeah. Lindsay. And what was her husband's name?

[James Kane]

Yeah, I just tried to steal one of my clients from. For a little while.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, successfully did or not.

[Brody Henderson]

I don't know. They fished with me for a while. I don't remember. I. I left town. So Brody got him back, I guess.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, all right.

[Brody Henderson]

But Lindsay and Jim, they were the classic example of.

[Phil]

I still don't think we've said the kind of fish.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, it's a rainbow trout. Very similar to Brody's third biggest fish and classic example, these two. She always was in the back and was like, oh, I'm really not that into fishing. I'm just here for the views and the good time. And Jim would be fairly serious about it, but really.

[James Kane]

But she wasn't serious, man. She got real serious with me after a while.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You must have been a better guy.

[Brody Henderson]

I put her on a bunch of fish like this. She got. She got serious, but. But she would listen to what the guide was saying. Jim would. Or not that Jim wouldn't, but she did a much better job of. Of listening. And so she would always out fish Jim from the back of the boat. But was interesting about this particular deal is this on the Colorado river, and it was early season, water was still on the high side, and we had had a particularly big runoff year, and fish like that weren't normal ever on this section of. Of the Colorado River. And all of a sudden, I think it was. I think I was with another boat, actually. And I want to say we floated through this pretty slow, deep hole, and both boats hook up with these giant fish, you know, and it. As a guide, you're like, oh, my gosh, you know, what is that thing coming up underneath the boat? It's a leviathan. So you kind of do anything and everything you can to land a fish like that. Get a lot, get lots of pictures. And those fish hung out in that hole and in that area for quite some time. And whoever I was with, I remember being like, dude, we cannot tell anybody else because everybody's going to want to float through this section just to hit this one hole. Best we could figure is that there was a tributary near there. Best we could figure that there was probably a stocked pond upstream on that tributary and it probably got blown out and then these fish just swam down the tributary and got dumped into the river.

[Giannis Boutellis]

So this was a short lived experience catching these pigs.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, yeah, yeah. So how, I mean, in my experience, I. I don't know. Again, I didn't have a tape on me. I can't remember. I don't think it was quite 30 inches, but you know, it's probably close. But yeah, just, I mean, that fish is like more than double the size of the average trout.

[James Kane]

That section of river.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

When you hooked into it, was there any question as to what it could be like? Did you know this is a big old rainbow?

[Brody Henderson]

I mean, I guess you could hook into a big mountain whitefish that would, but it wouldn't be that big. But eventually you get a look at it, you know, but when the rods is bent over double and it's sitting down deep. Yeah, you don't know what it is.

[James Kane]

And usually if you're float fishing, especially with a client that hasn't fought a lot of big trout like that, you got to follow them around in the boat for a while.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah, that's the cool thing. Like as the guide and rowing a boat geared, almost doing as much fighting as the angler is because you're flipping the boat around, positioning it and then obviously fighting the current and, and you know, trying to stay in that slow water, because nothing worse when you got a tank like that on and then you got to like row through a riffle or a small rapid, you know, can go wrong real quick.

[James Kane]

I can tell you that that Giannis did a very good job of, of releasing that fish in good shape because our buddy Alvin Ado had a client catch it like a week later.

[Giannis Boutellis]

How do you know it's the same.

[James Kane]

One in this picture? Yeah, I mean, it had to be.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay.

[Brody Henderson]

But there was a couple of fish, I think maybe that were in that hole.

[James Kane]

Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Beautiful trout. All right. Biggest fish I've ever caught is this paddlefish. Now this is sort of cheating because I was working for the U. S. Fish and wildlife service. That's a picture of my boss that I took of him. This was right after I graduated colle. I worked at this, this fish hatchery and we raised a lot of things, but primarily pallet sturgeon and paddlefish. And we raised.

[Brody Henderson]

That dude is not you.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's not me.

[Brody Henderson]

That he has a remarkable resemblance to you.

[Giannis Boutellis]

He's not me. That was, that was my old boss Craig. This was, this was 2015. We, we would provide all of the paddlefish that were stocked in South Dakota's reservoirs. And so to do that we'd have to go out and net adult paddlefish, bring them back to our hatchery, take their eggs, take their milt, raise the young, and then at the end of the summer, early fall, we would release these 12 inch.

[James Kane]

What kind of nets were you using to get those things?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Just big old drift nets, just like 100 foot long drift nets that had holes in them or if it was big enough for a paddlefish to swim in and get stuck.

[James Kane]

Like gill net stuck or. No, because that would kill them, wouldn't it?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Well, you're grabbing them asylum pretty quick. Yeah. So this day it was just me and Craig egg on the boat. He was running the boat, I was running the nets. That paddlefish was just short of 7ft long and it weighed 129 pounds, which would have broken the state record at the time. And she gave us hundreds of thousands of eggs. We released her about a month later. None of these people in this picture are me either. But this shows us taking her eggs after we gave her a hormone shot. And that took three adult men just to handle this one fish and then another person to capture the eggs.

[James Kane]

How old is that fish?

[Giannis Boutellis]

So that fish, it came from Lake Francis case, which is a reservoir. And any adults that we were catching in that time that big were born before the dams were put in. That dam was put in in 1952, so that fish was 65 plus years old when we caught it. I'll never see another fish of that size. And my boss and I were absolutely thrilled. I remember feeling like such a badass that day when we got back to the boat dock that the two of us had did that. And I remember back in the boat, down the boat dock and turn on the radio and Tom Petty's won't back down his plane. And I cranked that up and we were so thrilled. We went into Chamberlain that night, drank our faces off. Man, we were excited. That was A once in a lifetime fish. I caught it using nets. I didn't catch it on a rod and reel, but I'll never forget that old girl. There we go. Those are the three biggest fish we've ever caught. We're gonna figure out that segment someday. Six months into this show, we're still working out some kinks.

[Phil]

Yeah, let's give it nine.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, moving on. This is our last segment of the day. Joining us on the line last is James Kane and Barbie Augustini. They are magnet fishermen from New York City who had a life changing cat hatched last year. James, welcome to the show.

[Barbie Augustini]

What's going on, guys? Thank you so much for having. Barbie is actually away at the moment with a little stomach issue, but.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay.

[Barbie Augustini]

He'll be back in a bit.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right.

[Barbie Augustini]

Got my bro here.

[Brody Henderson]

How you doing?

[Giannis Boutellis]

What's up, bro? All right, for those not familiar, explain what magnet fishing is.

[Barbie Augustini]

So magnet fishing is where you take a giant magnet this size. You know what I mean? You put on a string and you throw it in the water and you're.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Waiting for the bite.

[Barbie Augustini]

Like you guys.

[Giannis Boutellis]

The click. The click. Okay, I like that.

[Brody Henderson]

Now hold on. I got more questions about that. This part, because you're gonna move on.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Go ahead.

[Brody Henderson]

Are you dragging it? Are you moving it? Are you changing cast locations? Like how power. Like if there's a piece of metal that's five feet away from that magnet, will it pull it over to it it or do you need to land it right on top of it?

[Barbie Augustini]

The ferrous connection point to. To these giant magnets you think would be that big, but actually it's more like. Especially when you're on the water, I think the pool. The pool. This is maybe 5 to 6 inches at max. So you do have to change location. You have to throw like you're still high school softball. So you got to throw it as far as you can.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's.

[Barbie Augustini]

That's the secret no one's gonna tell you.

[James Kane]

Let one rip. Let's see your throw.

[Giannis Boutellis]

We're getting to that at the end. No, no, not yet. James, hold on. At the end of a call, he's going to show us how it's done. We're going to learn more about magnet fishing. First, though, what got you into magnet fishing?

[Barbie Augustini]

So believe it or not, my family and I were very bored during COVID and we started watching videos. I always wanted to do treasure hunting as a little kid, but never had the background education, never had the financials to go on a boat and the gear and this and that and then I saw someone putting a magnet on the water on a string on, on YouTube. There are other channels down south that actually do it, you know, quite often. And I said, you know what, let us try this. My kids were like, you're not gonna do it. You don't do nothing. So I actually took the challenge and we went to our local pond and yeah, it goes from there.

[Brody Henderson]

How much does the gear cost to get going in magnet fishing?

[Barbie Augustini]

So the rope is 20 bucks for like 100ft. 20, 30 bucks. The, the magnets, the level we're at now is a lot more powerful. So we have magnets that range from 2 to $300. But when you get, for when you first want to start, you can go on Amazon and spend 30, 40 bucks just to see what it's like so you don't have to, you know, drop three hundies on a freaking giant powerful magnet. You can still get stuff with the low powered magnets, but when you become obsessed, you want, you want the good stuff.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

The bigger pull forward. Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

And what kind of areas do you typically target when you're magnet fishing?

[Barbie Augustini]

So when we first started, we were just going any bodies of water? Now I tend to look for. So we're obviously, we're in the middle of New York City, so anybody of water that there's a lot of foot traffic and houses and roads nearby. That's when people toss and stuff right out the, right out the cars. And that's the best spot to go. Crowded, sometimes dangerous neighborhoods is the best spot.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Dude, love that. Now normally when we're talking about fishing, we want to go where people are not. But not. Not magnet fishermen.

[Barbie Augustini]

Right.

[Brody Henderson]

Do you use any sort of mapping apps like OnX to maybe Scout areas?

[Barbie Augustini]

Google Maps. Google Maps. And then I sometimes you can find Google historical maps. Like I like to do research locations that we're in. And there's sometimes historical items you can find by using the older maps as well.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's good. Now what are some of the most common maps? What are the most common things that you hook while magnet fishing?

[Barbie Augustini]

Bottle caps. Rebar. Rebar and nails. Tons of rebar. I don't know. I guess when the constructing or whatever they're doing, the guys are dope. The people are done that.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Huh. And do you ever get skunked or you're always catching something?

[Barbie Augustini]

We have gotten skunked a coup skunked a couple of times. Yeah, definitely. I think you always in high salty areas. Like on we have our bay areas which mix into the east river over here in New York City. Something about the tides, which, you know, I don't. I don't fish. Maybe you guys can even explain that a little more. But when the tides are moving fast, the stuff is taken out into the ocean, so you don't get nothing. Like Coney island in Brooklyn off the piers, you're not going to get nothing unless it's really heavy, the salt's eating it up, and the tide's taking it out.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Now, besides the safe that we'll get to in a little bit, what are some of the most unusual catches that you've had?

[Barbie Augustini]

Oh, what I can say on here, I don't know. I usually, believe it or not, I tell people when they're. When they're watching. I used to say, oh, you never imagine what you can get. But now I tell them, you keep crazy. What you can't imagine is going to be okay.

[Giannis Boutellis]

So guns. How many guns have you caught?

[Barbie Augustini]

What, in the two years we're almost on two years, we found about 35.

[Giannis Boutellis]

My goodness.

[Barbie Augustini]

Yeah. Crazy 35 guns.

[James Kane]

What are you doing with those when you. What are you doing with those when you find them? Are you contacting law enforcement or throwing them back in or what you have to.

[Barbie Augustini]

Yeah. I used to think to call 911-911 right away. Now we actually. I try to call precincts.

[James Kane]

Yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

And then the precincts. Precincts will tell you, no, you got to call 91 1. And I was like, it's not too much an emergency. I have. We have all the guns we have. Sometimes we find grenades. So we do have to call. I'm a New Yorker. My brother's a New Yorker.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

It's impossible. It's nearly impossible to get a. Any kind of firearm license. Yeah. You want to get caught with one. Not in New York City. Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Have you ever. Have you ever learned about the history of one of those guns? Like what crime it was used in or who owned it or anything like that?

[Barbie Augustini]

In the beginning, I was. Believe it or not, I was. I was actually scared. You know, I was nervous. Like, I wasn't brought up around firearms.

[Stephanie Raymond]

I'm not.

[Barbie Augustini]

Don't have a military background. So I was nervous at first. Like, oh, real gun.

[Giannis Boutellis]

What am I gonna do?

[Barbie Augustini]

And then I find out in the future that there is, like you said, there are stories with them, and we have found some that are so fresh that were used only a week ago. And then you research and you find out, wow, this person passed away. This young person passed away. And sometimes detectives will actually call Us with possible subpoenas to go to court. Yeah, it can get a little, it can get a little weird.

[Giannis Boutellis]

A little weird.

[Barbie Augustini]

I, I, I choose sort of not to follow them.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Uhhuh.

[Barbie Augustini]

But there are other magnific that want to know the history and, and actually who's going to jail and who's.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

What crime you can get solved from it. But I'm sure we helped out a lot of people a lot.

[Giannis Boutellis]

So. Other weird things that you've caught. Anything really historic? Anything really old?

[Barbie Augustini]

Yeah, yeah. We got, we got a World War II grenade confirmed by the bomb, the bomb squad, and Sheep Said Bay, Brooklyn. Yeah. We have two grapeshot cannonballs in Central park in New York City. Before the park was made, it was a, there was a garrison there for the War of 1812. You know, it didn't happen over too much over there, but they would practice over there. So we got those and some really, really old horseshoes on the Valley Stream. We must have like a 3,300-year-old horseshoe. Oh, lots of coins. A lot of coins. You know, other countries, coins are all magnetic, so.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh.

[Barbie Augustini]

In America, the only magnetic coin is the 43 penny. Still haven't got one yet. It's a goal.

[Brody Henderson]

Okay, let's, let's talk about, hold on. What happens when you latch onto something that is too big to, to yank out? Like, you know it's there because you, you got the click, but it ain't budging. What do you do?

[Barbie Augustini]

What I like to call it is you got to jerk it off. You just gotta, you gotta take it right off the back. You gotta pull really hard.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

Because when it's. Because these things that didn't work out too well.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That was a big safe, actually.

[Barbie Augustini]

Yeah, a lot of safes in New York City as well.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, let's talk about what happened last year on May 31. Tell us where you were at and what you caught.

[Barbie Augustini]

So we were actually in a park called Flushing. Flushing, Queens, or Corona Park. And we were throwing over there. This is like my second time over there. And we do have, we have found safes just like this one you're watching. Clicked onto it, and I was like, oh, it's just gonna be another safe. And I stick, stick my fingers in the hole and I feel something mushy, which really sounds weird, but it was stacks of bills. And in my mind, I'm, I'm scared right away at this point. Like, like when I feel the money, I'm nervous because there's no way we're gonna keep It. You know what I mean? And I was like, babe, I just want to get something. We're gonna go for pizza. We're gonna grab something, you know, good. But the money is so bad. The money is so mush and slushy.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, yeah, you can.

[Barbie Augustini]

And I'm just going crazy right now. In my mind.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You can see this video of James catching this safe and going through it on our YouTube channel right now. So after you reel in the safe, the police had to get involved. What was that process like?

[Barbie Augustini]

Believe it or not, to this day we get ranked on, like, why we actually contacted the NYPD and proposal in New York City that anything over a hundred dollars is supposed to call in. And we're trying to, you know, get our channel out there. I'm trying to do whatever I can. Maybe someone lost it. And if they can get their money back, I was, yo, dude, here's your money. Let me get like 100 bucks. But the police were. Were in shock as well. They didn't believe any of it.

[Giannis Boutellis]

It.

[Barbie Augustini]

They didn't believe it. Then a whole squad comes down. If you watch towards the end of our video, and they actually gave us the money. And FBI got involved in the same thing as well and did their investigation. Took a few hours, and we walked off with all the money in a Ziploc bag.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Amazing. So it's determined. Go ahead, Yanni.

[Brody Henderson]

I was just gonna say I'm surprised. It was only a couple hours. And then you. You literally walked away that day with that muddy, muddy.

[Barbie Augustini]

Yeah. Yeah, I was in shock. I was in shock as well. We had to go to Washington, D.C. yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

So we got to keep the money. And for those who aren't watching on YouTube, those stacks of bills were covered in a black sludge from being underwater so long. So how do you go about turning those filthy bills into usable currency?

[Barbie Augustini]

So the process is done in Bureau of Engraving and printing in Washington, D.C. we did some research. They found out what happened. They. We went right on the bus. Times Square, took a mega bus right to DC and went to the engraving and printing, handed them the money. They explained to us the process. We didn't get to see too much of the lab and how they do that, but it's all going to be put back together piece by piece. Even the money we didn't. Didn't bring because there was more in the safe that was just tiny, obliterated pieces.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Wow.

[Barbie Augustini]

They said we should have brought it because they can put it all. They can put it all back together. It's going to Take about. About two and a half years.

[Giannis Boutellis]

We have zero cents at all.

[Barbie Augustini]

We have one group of people that do it. Yeah. There's only like seven people that do it for the entire America. Put all the money. It's ridiculous. Takes a long time.

[Giannis Boutellis]

And how much. How much money was it destroyed?

[Barbie Augustini]

They estimated between 50 to 80,000.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Only. Okay, only, only. Only now, during this process with the police and the Bureau of Engraving and Printing, have you learned anything about the origins of the safe? Like how old it is or is it that still a mystery?

[Barbie Augustini]

I can only go on by. Honestly, by the bills that were in there. We had some as far back as 2007 and 2009. They had the magnetic strip in. So I think the oldest bill is like 2009. Honestly.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, it's not.

[Barbie Augustini]

Not that old. It looked like it's been after the barnacles weren't there. Crazy.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, so you're. You're still like two years away from getting this cash back, though, give or take.

[Barbie Augustini]

They said it could take up to two and a half years, so it could be any day now. All right, you know, well, James, Barbie.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Now, James is standing at the pond where he caught the save. And he's got his Barbie on here now. Oh, what's up, Barbie? So James is standing at the pond. He's got his magnet. Can you show us how it's done? See if there is any treasure left in that bit of water? I mean, they got the.

[Barbie Augustini]

We're gonna take. I'm gonna take a big toss with the 10, 9 pound magnet here.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay.

[Barbie Augustini]

I like to throw like I'm still in high school playing. Playing baseball, basically. You just. Some people can swing however they want. I like to swing like we're playing baseball.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. You know, have you gotten better at this, James, over the years?

[Barbie Augustini]

Oh, dude, yeah. Challenge me. That's what I'm saying.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

No one throws as far as I can, and I'm actually known for that. I actually want a belt. I actually won a leather championship belt for the longest toss in so far.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. What a treat. We're gonna see the world champion magnet thrower give it a toss. Do your thing, James.

[Barbie Augustini]

I'm not gonna throw that car because I don't have that much broken.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yanni could throw farther than that.

[Barbie Augustini]

Oh, I can. I don't have my.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. Okay. So what do you. What do you think you might grab in there? Maybe some nails like you talked about?

[Barbie Augustini]

Dude, we're in the near air in the middle of New York City, so it's probably going to be in a weapon. Could be. It could be a firearm. It could be a toenail clipper.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Now, if you were really a good guest, James, you'd have planted a handgun in the water for us or something. Yeah, right.

[Barbie Augustini]

We don't do any of that.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, so you've got the magnet back to shore. Okay, see what we got. Don't know what it is. Oh, is that a car part? It is.

[Barbie Augustini]

Looks like it's one of the New York City fire light posts.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay.

[Barbie Augustini]

So got some icebreakers. Don't know why. That's what I get it.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, there might be something in there.

[James Kane]

Yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

Let's see what's in the icebreakers.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

And then. Yeah, that. That went so fast. James, can you give it another toss for us? Let's see what else we can catch. Okay.

[Phil]

We can clear out the rest of our schedule.

[Brody Henderson]

Sure. Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

What do you guys got going on today? Okay, what do you do with. When it's just straight garbage that you catch?

[Barbie Augustini]

We collect all the garbage in a bucket and then we dispose of it. All the receptors?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Hell yeah. All right, James is gonna give a second toss. Really, really put your body into this one. I want to see how far you can throw that thing. Okay. He's giving himself more line. He's confident that this thing's gonna touch the other shoreline. You guys got any other questions for James?

[Brody Henderson]

No. I want to return back to the giant safes that you left. Like, I don't know how you could ever.

[Barbie Augustini]

That was a big one.

[Brody Henderson]

The guy told you that. He's, like, hooked on a giant safe, and then you just moved on. Like, what happens with the giant?

[Barbie Augustini]

Yeah, it was stuck and we couldn't move, but it's still there by the end point.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[Barbie Augustini]

I'll take a bigger throw, but.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, bigger throw.

[Stephanie Raymond]

Go ahead.

[Barbie Augustini]

Okay.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, that's better.

[Brody Henderson]

There you go. All right.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, that's a good throw. We're going to get something really nice.

[Barbie Augustini]

It's ten pounds. You know what I mean? That's ten pounds.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. Yanni is stuck on the safe.

[Brody Henderson]

I'm stuck on the big safe. So you know where it is. You can't get it out, but there's a. Underwater. You're not gonna cut into they.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, they chopped into the safe so it was empty.

[Barbie Augustini]

We could see there was empty in there. We just wanted to try and get it up to the land. We couldn't get into it.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, to be at least like 6 inches.

[Barbie Augustini]

That was huge, dude. That was the biggest safe. Obviously. It had a little spin handle on it. It wasn't safe. The one we left was a vault.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah. Okay. Now, it looked like you got snagged on something there, James. Was that something magnetic or were you just dragging it over a log? Log.

[Barbie Augustini]

It could be logs. It could be rocks. Sometimes they're stones that people throw in the water. You know, it could be bikes that are too deep.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That we.

[Barbie Augustini]

That sometimes.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, James is bringing the magnet to shore again. Let's see what we got. This toss. You can go see the world champion magnet tosser on our YouTube channel. Watch James do his handiwork.

[Barbie Augustini]

We got a paperclip. Oh, look at that. Treasure.

[Phil]

Oh, nice.

[Barbie Augustini]

An actual thing about magnet fishing. Sometimes you're going to get a paper clip. Sometimes you're going to get $100,000.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You don't know that's right. All right, James, if people want to see more of your magnet fishing, how do they go watch it?

[Barbie Augustini]

You can literally just go on online and type in let's get magnetic. We're on all social media platforms, but mainly YouTube if you want to communicate and say, what's up?

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay. All socials. Tick tock. Instagram, YouTube, Facebook page.

[Barbie Augustini]

You know, one of the. One of the interesting thing is we get a lot of lures and I always wanted to know if these things have value or not.

[Giannis Boutellis]

I have.

[Barbie Augustini]

We have like a box.

[Giannis Boutellis]

You text me some photo, James. We'll get to the bottom that. Well, thank you for joining us. Thanks for teaching us about magnet fishing. Thanks for cleaning up our waterways and good luck getting that cash refurbished.

[Barbie Augustini]

Guys, thank you so much for having us on. Hope everyone has fun. Everybody.

[Brody Henderson]

Thank you. That was fun. That was great.

[James Kane]

Yeah, that was fun.

[Brody Henderson]

Save the best for last.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's right.

[James Kane]

You know, the one bummer about it is just shows you what kind of dirt bags people are.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[James Kane]

Not those guys.

[Brody Henderson]

No, the people they're cleaning up. I mean, that's who you want. Representing the great city of New York right there.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Totally.

[Brody Henderson]

I mean, he's like, yeah, if someone else can say that it's their 100k, just give me 100 bucks. I just want to go out for pizza. God, that guy's great.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, we'll check in with the James again.

[Phil]

But yeah, there. I want to just plug their. Their page. They've got an Instagram page too here. It's just. Let's get magnetic. It's all. No, no apostrophe, all one word. He's on YouTube and Instagram.

[Giannis Boutellis]

So, yeah, doing. Doing something fun. And they're cleaning up Our water while they're.

[James Kane]

Yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Brody, you said your son had a magnet, but he gave up on lost interest pretty quick. Yeah. He needs to live in a place like New York City to really appreciate magnet.

[James Kane]

Yeah. Maybe it's a good thing that he never really found anything cool. And he went right back to regular fishing after. After, like an hour doing the magnet fishing.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right, that brings us to the end of the show. Phil, let's get some final listener feedback.

[Phil]

Yes, sure thing. Let's see here. I'll just grab this one because I'm. It's the first one I saw this.

[Brody Henderson]

Phil.

[Phil]

Hunter. Fish. The answer is kind of, sort of.

[Giannis Boutellis]

What'S the biggest fish you ever caught, Phil?

[Phil]

I couldn't even tell you. Yeah, I mean, people. A lot of people know this. I was not a hunter before I started working here, and I still probably wouldn't consider myself a hunter. But I've gone out several times. The only person who really invites me out is Cal. So thanks to Cal and. No, thanks to anybody in this room.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh, no.

[Phil]

But yeah. Yeah, mostly I've just, you know, I've done upland ducks, turkey, Just pretty much just birds. So far. That's kind of all I'm really interested in. I'm not really chomping at the bit to get out in the woods, but I wouldn't say no.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay.

[Phil]

That's what I'm saying.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Would you take some meat if we had meat for you?

[Phil]

Oh, yeah. Okay. Totally.

[Giannis Boutellis]

We can do that.

[Phil]

Let's see. You can plead the fifth on this one, but maybe it'll just kind of show your true colors here, buddy. Leland asks, if you had to join just one conservation organization, which one would it be?

[James Kane]

That's a toughie.

[Giannis Boutellis]

I think we've talked about this before, but if. If I was just joining one and my membership always ran out, I'd join a different one the next year then. So I spread my memberships around. But for the rest of my life, I don't know what the answer would be. What. What do you boys think?

[James Kane]

I. I mean, yeah, yeah, it's. It's a tough question. Maybe tr. I mean, TRCP doesn't. You don't really have a membership there.

[Stephanie Raymond]

Yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

But you can still support.

[James Kane]

Yeah, like some, like, I like them because they're like, in D.C. like, hopefully like, affecting policy that, you know, that's. That's a good choice there.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

I think any of the groups that are non species specific that really work across the entire country and for all, you know, outdoors people. So maybe TRCP or the Sportsman's alliance or Howell, you know, that are really involved across the board.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah, the ones that I benefit the most from probably National Deer association and Pheasants Forever. Because in my home state of South Dakota, they do a lot of great habitat work. And that same habitat work is, is good for deer as well. But I'd probably go with something that's oriented towards access, like bha, because if I didn't have places to go hunting, fish wouldn't matter.

[James Kane]

But man, look, if you got like a, a critter you like the most, turkeys or mule deer or whatever, like, it's not like you're not making a bad choice by supporting those groups either.

[Brody Henderson]

That's right.

[Giannis Boutellis]

What else you got, Phil?

[Phil]

Caleb asks, as a beginner to turkey hunting, what would be the crew's go to call? We're a Phelps family here, but if you guys have any sort of specific Phelps calls that are beginner friendly.

[Brody Henderson]

No, for me, it's answer is easy. It's always just a basic slate call.

[James Kane]

Pot call?

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah, basic slate, pot call. Very easy to use. Can make all kinds of sounds. Loud, quiet, that's it.

[Phil]

Great. Colin asks, what's your favorite fish dish, Whether to prepare it or eat it.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Beer battered fish. Can't beat it. It's my favorite.

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, you're a beer batter guy.

[Barbie Augustini]

Yeah.

[James Kane]

I can't do the beer batter, man.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Why not? Not.

[James Kane]

I just, I like, I like, I've, when I eat in restaurants, I'm like, this is way too much around the fish. And then when I've tried it at home, I haven't been able to like do it to the point where I'm like, this is better than breaded, fried, breaded fish, sure.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah.

[Brody Henderson]

I'd like to see you or I'd like to try your version and see how you pull it off. Cuz, Yeah, I know other people that are big beer batter folks. But yeah, I'm kind of with Brody. I'm like, ah, yeah, it's good for the first couple pieces. And then I'm like, yeah, it's a lot of, a lot of stuff.

[Giannis Boutellis]

We'll have a fish fry sometime.

[James Kane]

But it's like, this is a tough one to pick one fish dish because there's like very different kinds of fish. Right? Like there's fish like perch and walleye that are awesome fried, but then there's like salmon, which is like awesome grilled. So that's what I go with. Fried fish, grilled fish, depending on what kind of fish it is.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Giannis.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah. It's not the dish so much. I'd say that more of just the species itself. And one of the fish I was going to possibly use for my. Our top three fish segment was a yellow eye rockfish I caught years ago at Steve's Fish Shack. And you know, that thing is like a. It's like a grouper and a scallop. Had a baby. You know, that's what their flesh is like. Like, you literally just don't need to add anything to it, you know, besides a little bit of salt and. And again, just cooked. Very plain and simple, you know.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah. If I. If I wasn't picking beer. Banded fish. I do like a very Midwestern chowder that would be very creamy, have some corn in it. You can put about any fish in there besides maybe a salmon.

[Brody Henderson]

I do like a good fish.

[James Kane]

We do it. We do a salmon chowder is great.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Sure.

[James Kane]

It's popular in Northwest.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah. Put any fish in there, Phil, what else you got? Let's do a few more.

[Phil]

Okay. This is the by far the question we've been getting the most, but there's a lot of misinformation about it out there. But we should probably just say a few words about it. What does the crew think about the direwolf de extinction?

[James Kane]

They're not dire wolves, number one.

[Giannis Boutellis]

The branding is all wrong.

[Phil]

Cover of Times Magazine.

[James Kane]

Look up our buddy Jim Heffelfinger's post on. He's got a good Instagram post on it. I think it's like a giant marketing campaign. I don't think it's conservation as they're proposing it is. And I'll leave it at that.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah.

[Phil]

And if you want more information. Straight from the horse's mouth. Episode 564 of the Meat Eater podcast. We had Matt James of Colossal Biosciences on the show. Giannis and Brody were in the room for that talk. So, yeah, you can check that out for. For more info.

[Giannis Boutellis]

And if we. If we had the ability to actually bring things back from extinction, let's focus on the things that we cause to go extinct. Not some critter that died during the Ice age. How about the dodo or passenger pigeon? Is it the white rhino that we're got like one left of in the world? Let's. Let's de extinct those, but.

[James Kane]

Yeah, or keep shit from going extinct.

[Giannis Boutellis]

That's right. We got a lot of efforts that we could focus on that area.

[Phil]

Yeah, we'll do one more kind of run running out of them here. But Chris asked, does the crew have an aversion to hunt the Pacific Northwest temperate rainforests obviously prove a serious challenge. A fine game, but could definitely make for some awesome content. Cheers. From the Olympic Peninsula. I have noticed that it's a bit light on Pacific Northwest content. Is there a reason for that specific.

[James Kane]

I mean, south, southeast Alaska?

[Phil]

Oh, yeah, sure.

[James Kane]

Climate very similar. Very similar. So I don't think. I think that's probably like, Steve owns a place up there, so that's why they're going there. I don't think there's an aversion to it, is there, Yanis?

[Brody Henderson]

No. I've been looking at, you know, maybe going hunting blacktail deer in that neck of the woods, but for a lot of the other species, they're. Or those states just generally aren't very friendly to non residents. It's not easy to get tags in Oregon and Washington, so I know there's some out there. I'd love to go Hunter Roosevelt at some point.

[James Kane]

Yeah. I mean, Phelps and those guys, they hunt.

[Phil]

Yeah, that's. That's Phelps home turf over there.

[Barbie Augustini]

He's.

[Phil]

He's in the, in the forest deep.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Yeah. Is it Oregon? I don't think they do preference points. Am I thinking of a different.

[James Kane]

No, Oregon does. I think that's one reason why it's.

[Phil]

Real tough to get and it's very different climate wise. But Cal's done several things in eastern Oregon that you can see on. On YouTube.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah.

[James Kane]

And Washington's a tough state for non residents too.

[Giannis Boutellis]

All right. Is that it, Phil?

[Brody Henderson]

Oh, I like Matt's question about once in a lifetime tags.

[Phil]

Oh, yeah.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Okay, last question.

[Phil]

Am I blind?

[Brody Henderson]

Here right above the one you had highlighted. There you go.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Oh.

[Phil]

Matt asks, what are the room's thoughts on, quote, once in a lifetime tag drawings? The PA Game Commission is pushing to change the bullet tag to a once in a lifetime format.

[James Kane]

I mean, my thought is.

[Brody Henderson]

A lot.

[James Kane]

Of the tags that aren't once in a lifetime tags like, like that aren't done that way, like sheep or mountain goat or in a lot of cases, moose in the lower 48, they're once in a lifetime tags anyway. Really. Right. So I don't have a problem with, like, if I draw a bighorn sheep tag and kill a bighorn sheep in Montana, say, I'd be fine if it was once in a lifetime.

[Brody Henderson]

Yeah, I think it should be that way. I prefer it that way because, yeah, it is such a limited resource. And if I was to get. Get so lucky to draw two.

[James Kane]

Right.

[Brody Henderson]

And there's hundreds of the other people that are, you know, waiting and waiting and want that experience. Like, yeah, I don't think I should get a second opportunity. I think someone else should get their first.

[James Kane]

And for, for, I mean, we're talking specifically lower 48 here, right? Like, if you did, if you drew a mountain goat tag in wherever, Colorado, and it was once in a lifetime and you really wanted to go hunt one again, you could, could, you know, go hunt them in Alaska or somewhere like that.

[Brody Henderson]

That's right.

[James Kane]

You know, that's right.

[Giannis Boutellis]

Agree with what you boys said. All right, that brings us to the end of the show. See everyone back here next week. Thanks for watching. Thanks for listening.

[Spencer Newarth]

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