Ep. 710: MeatEater Radio Live! Noodle the Morel Dog and Kayak Bassing

Summary

The MeatEater Podcast: Episode 710 Summary

Title: MeatEater Radio Live! Noodle the Morel Dog and Kayak Bassing
Host: MeatEater (Steven Rinella)
Release Date: May 30, 2025

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Garden Updates

The episode kicks off with Spencer catching up with Steve Rinella, Cal, and Brody about their respective gardens.

• Steve Rinella [02:34]: Steve shares that they're planting corn this year, a new addition requested by his boys, alongside standard vegetables like tomatoes, cucumbers, strawberries, pole beans, and various herbs. He emphasizes his reliable gardening success by meticulously watering and mulching, ensuring the garden thrives even if he’s away for fishing trips.

  "I just water the shit out of it and then put mulch down. And it's good." [03:10]

• Cal [03:30]: Cal announces that he and his partner have decided against a full garden this year due to overlapping travel schedules and low productivity from their setup. Instead, they’re focusing on garlic and onions. Cal also mentions his mother's farm in Montana for sale, highlighting its suitability for hunting geese with ample cottonwood trees for stands.

  "It's a sweet spot. Kill geese there all the time." [04:13]

MeatEater Radio Live: Noodle the Morel Dog and Kayak Bassing

Spencer introduces the live segment hosted from Meteor HQ in Bozeman, featuring discussions with Ellen and her mushroom-hunting dog, Noodle.

• Interview with Ellen and Noodle [09:03]:

  • Ellen [09:11]: Ellen introduces Noodle, her four-and-a-half-year-old half Labrador, half Border Collie, whom she rescued from a children's rodeo in Northern California. Noodle is trained to find various mushrooms, including morels, chanterelles, matsutake, porcini, candy cap, and black trumpets.

    "She just cracks the code and was off running 200ft away, just waiting for me to throw the ball for her." [10:22]

  • Training Process [10:27]: Ellen describes her spontaneous training method, emphasizing positive reinforcement with sticks and balls. She notes that distinguishing between edible and non-edible mushrooms was initially a challenge, but Noodle adapted quickly.

    "If she sniffed the wrong kind of mushroom, I'm like, no, that's not a mushroom. You don't get a stick." [11:16]

  • Mushroom Season Insights [15:05]: Ellen discusses a varied mushroom season in Northern California, affected by low snowpack and drying conditions, particularly at lower elevations. Noodle’s foraging success includes selling significant quantities of chanterelles to restaurants.

    "Over 50 pounds in... sold some to a restaurant. It was great." [15:00]

  • Safety Note [13:18]: Ellen warns that morels are toxic when raw, advising thorough cooking to prevent poisoning in both humans and dogs.

    "Morels are not toxic, but they're toxic raw." [13:18]

Meat Pole Trivia Game

A spirited trivia game tests Cal and Brody's knowledge about MeatEater listeners, with notable participation from the audience.

1. Question 1: Percentage of Listeners Who Have Washed Their Pickup in the Last Month

   • Answers: Brody: 71%, Cal: 41%
   • Correct Answer: 30.5%
   • Result: Cal earns the first point.

   "30.5% of media listeners have washed their [pickups]" [20:15]

2. Question 2: Percentage of Listeners Who Have Ever Bitten into a BB

   • Answers: Brody: 88%, Cal: 63%
   • Correct Answer: 65.9%
   • Result: Cal earns the second point.

   "65.9% have bitten into a BB." [23:30]

3. Question 3: Percentage of Listeners Who Have Fishing Bait in Their Fridge or Freezer Right Now

   • Answers: Brody: 50%, Cal: 38%
   • Correct Answer: 34.9%
   • Result: Cal secures a clean sweep.

   "34.9% have bait in their fridge or freezer right now." [25:32]

Notable Quote:

"Cal dominated today, very close on every one of these questions." [25:52]

One Minute Fishing with Christine Fisher

Christine Fisher, a seasoned kayak angler, participates in the One Minute Fishing challenge aiming to catch a fish within sixty seconds to earn a $500 donation for the Muskies Inc. Wisconsin chapter.

• Setup and Strategy [28:00]: Christine details her Hobie Pro Angler 14, 360 kayak setup with a motor and multiple rods, focusing on standing while fishing to enhance her reach and efficiency.

  "I can stand up and use these two little foot pedals... it's pretty effective for me." [29:12]

• Fishing Attempt [32:18]: Christine attempts to catch a white bass but doesn't secure a catch within the time limit. Despite the lack of a catch, she remains optimistic about the season.

  "I had a little group of them right there and yeah, I didn't catch them." [33:32]

• Advice for Kayak Fishing [30:14]: Christine advises anglers to fish within their strengths and preferences, emphasizing the importance of enjoying the fishing experience.

  "Fish your confidence, fish your strength... fish how you like to fish, that makes it a lot more fun." [30:14]

Interview with Brock Wall: North American Pronghorn Foundation

Brock Wall, founder of the newly established North American Pronghorn Foundation, discusses conservation efforts aimed at protecting pronghorn populations across North America.

• Foundation's Mission and Initiatives [41:25]:

  • Brock Wall [41:39]: Highlights the foundation’s nationwide focus, emphasizing habitat restoration, migration corridor designations, and fencing projects to aid pronghorn movement.

    "We're super excited... utilizing GPS collar data from pronghorn." [43:17]

• Challenges Facing Pronghorn [44:22]: Brock outlines declining pronghorn populations due to habitat loss, fencing barriers, and increasing winter mortality exacerbated by degraded forage landscapes.

  "Western United States was losing a million, just over a million acres of sagebrush per year." [46:47]

• Policy Actions [46:56]: Discusses the foundation’s support for removing feral horses from BLM lands in Wyoming to reduce competition for resources and restore native habitats vital for pronghorn.

  "There are a lot of, you know, published peer-reviewed research that supports this idea." [46:56]

• Supporting the Foundation [50:52]: Encourages listeners to support through memberships, merchandise, and donations via pronghorns.org.

  "You can buy memberships there... would love for you to give us $35 and let us prove that we are." [50:52]

Notable Quote:

"The sagebrush ecosystem is the most imperiled ecosystem in the world, not just the United States." [52:34]

Hot Tip Off: Parenting in the Outdoors

A playful segment where listeners share competing parenting tips related to outdoor activities, judged by Steven Rinella.

• Contestants:

  • Benjamin Hunter: Advocates for DIY fishing lures made from thrift store spoons, enhancing engagement and creativity with children.

    "Not only can this be an effective lure, but it is also fun to catch fish on a lure you've made." [54:58]

  • Matt Short: Introduces "kid poop bags" to manage bathroom emergencies during family outings, emphasizing preparedness and cleanliness.

    "Don't let your kids' incontinence or lack of judgment of when is a good time to drop a load end your next family adventure." [55:02]

• Judging: The chat votes overwhelmingly in favor of Benjamin's lure-making tip, citing its practical and engaging nature.

  "Ben wins with 72% of the vote." [63:55]

Notable Exchange:

"It's going to be hard to beat that... the kid's cute, all the way." [55:23]

Listener Questions and Final Discussions

The show wraps up with final Q&A segments addressing topics such as upland hunting, preparing rainbow trout, and coexisting with bears.

• Preparation Tips:

  • Steve Rinella [65:03]: Shares a French technique of "blue trout" preparation involving heavy vinegar to turn fresh trout electric blue when stunned.

    "It's like, it's really fun just to watch the thing happen." [65:43]

• Coexisting with Bears:

  • Cal [66:43]: Recommends removing deer feeders to prevent bears from tearing them down, stressing the importance of learning to live alongside wildlife.

    "If you love having them on your land, you're just going to have to learn to coexist with them." [67:19]

Final Quote:

"Today's kids are tomorrow's enemies." [59:40]

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Key Takeaways

• Garden Management: Maintaining a thriving garden requires consistent care, especially when balancing outdoor activities like fishing.
• Training Hunting Dogs: Positive reinforcement and selective training help dogs like Noodle excel in specialized tasks such as mushroom hunting.
• Conservation Efforts: The North American Pronghorn Foundation is pivotal in addressing habitat loss and ensuring pronghorn populations recover through targeted initiatives.
• Engaging Family Outdoors: Creative and practical parenting tips enhance the outdoor experience for families, fostering both safety and enjoyment.
• Coexisting with Wildlife: Effective strategies are essential for living harmoniously with wildlife, ensuring both human activities and animal populations thrive.

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• "I just water the shit out of it and then put mulch down. And it's good." — Steve Rinella [03:10]
• "We're super excited... utilizing GPS collar data from pronghorn." — Brock Wall [43:17]
• "Today's kids are tomorrow's enemies." — Dan Flores [59:40]

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This episode of The MeatEater Podcast offers a rich blend of gardening insights, hunting dog training, wildlife conservation, engaging trivia, and practical parenting tips, all delivered with the signature humor and expertise that listeners have come to love.

Transcript

[Steve Rinella]

This is an I heart podcast.

[Dan Flores]

Steve Rinella here. The American west with Dan Flores is a new podcast production on the Meat Eater Podcast Network. It's hosted by author and historian Dan Flores, who happens to be mine and our own Dr. Randall's former professor. By focusing on deep time wild animals, native peoples in the west, unique environments, Flores will challenge your understanding of the American west and he will help to explain why it is the way it is today. I count Dan Flores as a friend. We do not agree on everything, but he has had a massive impact on my understanding of American history. And I invite you to get challenged by him in the same way that I have. Catch the premiere of the American west with Dan flores on Tuesday, May 6th on the meat Eater Podcast Network. Subscribe to the American west with Dan Flores On Apple, Spotify, iHeart or wherever you get your podcasts. Listen to Dan and it will stretch your brain all out. And I mean that in a very good way.

[Cal]

Smell us now, lady.

[Spencer]

Welcome to Meat Eater Trivia, Me Eater Podcast. Welcome to Meat Eater radio live. It's 11:00am Mountain Time. That's 1:00pm for our friends in Simpsonville, Kentucky on Thursday, May 29th. And we're live from Meteor HQ and Bozeman. I'm your host, Spencer, joined today by Cal and Brody. On today's show, we'll talk to Ellen and her mushroom hunting dog, Noodle. Then we'll find out how much Cal and Brody know about their fellow outdoorsman with a game of meat pole. After that, we've got one minute fishing with Christine Fisher in Oklahoma, followed by an interview with Brock Wall about the newly formed North American Pronghorn Foundation. And finally, we've got a hot tip off with a special guest judge about parenting in the outdoors. First, Cal Brody. I don't want a hunting update. I don't want a fishing update from you guys. I want a garden update. How the garden's looking.

[Steve Rinella]

Garden's in. I mean, it's early days, right?

[Spencer]

What's going to be different this year, Brody?

[Steve Rinella]

Oh, we do something different every year. I let the boys pick. We're doing some corn this year, which will be new for us.

[Spencer]

Okay. That was of interest to them.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah, that's what they wanted.

[Spencer]

So what you leave behind to.

[Steve Rinella]

I just like buying the $6. Like 6 for $3 pack of corn at the grocery store.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Steve Rinella]

But yeah, standard stuff. Tomatoes, cucumbers, strawberries, pole beans, lots of herbs. Just standard stuff.

[Spencer]

You feeling optimistic this year?

[Steve Rinella]

Oh, yeah, man. I grow an awesome garden every year.

[Spencer]

It doesn't like, just go to hell when you leave for a week to go fishing at Fort Peck or something.

[Steve Rinella]

No, no, no. I just water the shit out of it and then put mulch down. And it's good, like, as long as it's later. If you did that this time of year, you'd, you know, be trouble, but in August, it's okay.

[Spencer]

Cal, give us a garden update. How are things looking?

[Cal]

We had a real serious talk, the lady and I, and came to the conclusion that it's just not worth doing a garden this year.

[Spencer]

Oh, okay.

[Cal]

Because of lots of overlapping travel, like nobody and, you know, it's just not a high producer anyway, with our setup. So we have garlic and onions.

[Spencer]

Okay, sure.

[Cal]

Yeah. But I. My mom is. If anybody needs a sweet little farm outside of the Billings, Montana area, the folks are selling out. 90 acres, irrigated, right outside of Shepherd. It's a sweet spot. Kill geese there all the time.

[Spencer]

How many trees are on this property?

[Cal]

Trees?

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah, for tree stands.

[Cal]

Well, a bunch of cottonwoods.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Cal]

Yeah, yeah.

[Spencer]

Would they fit it? Would a tree stand fit in one of them?

[Cal]

Oh, yeah.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Cal]

Yeah, yeah. And you. You would attract wildlife because it is, like, zero habitat anywhere around there.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Cal]

Because it is just wall to wall farming. Good sales, but, yeah, great spot. And if it wasn't. Just weren't so many people, I'd be buying that thing. Anyway, she's got a tremendous garden. Always has.

[Spencer]

And comes with the farm.

[Cal]

Comes with the farm. And now it's. It's pretty funny because it's just like all the volunteer stuff that's coming up. And so we picked cilantro and. And lettuce and hit the asparagus patch. And this is where the conflict comes in. We're pulling asparagus. Right. Because I'm like, yeah, you guys aren't. Place is gonna sell.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Cal]

And pulling asparagus. And my mom's like, what the hell are you doing youg got to cut that off beneath the soil line.

[Spencer]

Mmm.

[Cal]

Or it won't grow back.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Cal]

I was kind of like, well, you guys are leaving. What's the. Anyway, but then hop on a plane, go to Wisconsin, see bubbly dug. And out there at the Durin farm, they have a tremendous asparagus patch. Oh, and I notice that Doug's lovely wife, Trish, AKA Trish the Dish, as I like to call her.

[Spencer]

Who else calls her that?

[Cal]

Nobody. I'm trying to establish it, though. And I mean, she is such a sweet person that I just try to make sure that. That Doug knows that as well. And he does okay. But amazing asparagus patch. And none of them are cut off low.

[Spencer]

Oh.

[Cal]

And so I said, Trish, man, what's the deal? Aren't you supposed to. And she's like, yep, you are. I just never do. And look at the results.

[Spencer]

I just saw a Facebook argument about this like last week about the same thing. Someone was mad at their neighbor for stealing from their ditch asparagus patch and.

[Cal]

Doing it the wrong way.

[Spencer]

Well, not only were they thiefing it, but also those MFers were doing it the wrong way by not taking it down to the soil. It seemed like in the comments folks were mostly on their side saying you have to take it off below the soil. And then there were other people saying it doesn't matter. Never notice the difference.

[Cal]

Yeah. I mean there's foraging etiquette rules. Right.

[Spencer]

Sure.

[Cal]

That we should all live by because if done properly it's going to be there year after year after year.

[Spencer]

You hear the same thing said with morel mushrooms that like you're supposed to cut instead of pull. That one is totally false.

[Cal]

Yeah. Leave the stumps in the ground.

[Spencer]

You can pull those things right out of the ground. That's like plucking an apple off of a tree. You're not, you're just taking the apple. Even if you pull the whole thing out, you're not taking the whole tree away. All that mycelium underneath is still going to produce a mushroom if it wants to the next year. That little stump isn't going to help or hurt anything.

[Cal]

Yeah. But they, they'll grow in clumps. Right. So I've like gone back and picked the same spot.

[Spencer]

Sure.

[Cal]

During that, like that same like week long period of real fruit harvest. Right. And have seen plenty of mushrooms growing up next to stumps. But I know you're right.

[Spencer]

Yeah. It's just, it's hard to break that.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Spencer]

It's also a little cleaner if you take the whole thing off. Like if you pull it out of the ground you're getting. Yeah. Like 5 to 10% more mushroom. But you might trim that off at home anyway.

[Cal]

Yeah. And then in the bag that dirty stumps rolling around.

[Spencer]

Sure.

[Cal]

And it's getting in the gills of the mushrooms and it's just more cleaning.

[Spencer]

Plus you can look at it two ways. Either you are letting other folks know because I'll come across someone else's morel stumps.

[Cal]

Oh.

[Spencer]

Which is horrible. Damn it. They beat me here.

[Cal]

It's like coming across a giant surface poop with tons of white flagging all over the place.

[Steve Rinella]

Or a big gut pile.

[Cal]

Yeah, exactly. Fresh boot tracks that come in from some. You're the only truck at the trailhead.

[Spencer]

Yep.

[Cal]

Fresh snow on the ground to set the scene. Hell of a blizzard the night before the time, like, everything's right. You're the first person there.

[Steve Rinella]

One set of tracks, and you're like, that whole spot's blown.

[Cal]

And for whatever reason, somebody hiked over the hill from a different angle and he cut boot tracks about a mile in y. Then you're just like, oh, man.

[Spencer]

So when I find those stumps, someone else has bested me. They. They've like, got me there. But now I know there were Morales there, so they're. They're leaving me a little bit of information.

[Cal]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like people who have to put a trail camera up everywhere.

[Spencer]

Speaking of foraging, let's get to our first interview. Joining us on the line now is Ellen and her mushroom hunting dog, Noodle. Ellen and Noodle, welcome to the show.

[Ellen]

Thank you so much for having us.

[Spencer]

First thing, Ellen, tell us about Noodle. How old is she? What kind of dog is she? Where'd you get her?

[Ellen]

So Noodle is four and a half years old. I got her. Actually, it was a long story of kind of fate how I ended up with her, but I ultimately picked her up at a children's rodeo in northern California. She's a half lab, half border collie, as far as I know from an unwanted litter.

[Spencer]

Okay. And we can see noodle. Noodle is with Ellen right now for the interview. You should go watch this episode. You'll get to see the dog we're talking about. Plus, Phil has some photos of Noodle foraging. Now, how have you ever met another mushroom hunting dog in your life?

[Ellen]

You know, I've spoken to a couple people online who are maybe training or trying to. And I. I actually used to live in Italy where a lot of people use truffle dogs. So I. I was inspired by that. Oh, you want your ball, huh?

[Spencer]

And.

[Ellen]

And so that did inspire me, but I haven't met anybody in person yet. I'd love to meet up with somebody else who has a mushroom dog, though.

[Spencer]

Okay. And how long has Noodle had this special talent?

[Ellen]

So I taught her about three years ago. She was a little over a year old when I first taught her our first morel season.

[Spencer]

And tell us about the training process for teaching Noodle to find mushrooms.

[Ellen]

Yeah. So there's a lot of info out there on kind of proper scent training protocol. I'll just say I didn't do any of that. I just kind of winged it out in the woods. One day I pointed to a morel and I just said, where's the mushroom? She sniffed it. I immediately threw a stick for her because she is one of those dogs. She's just absolutely fetch crazy. She will die trying to get that ball. So I threw a stick for her. I called her back to the same morale, pointed at it through the stick again. Then I went to a third morale, and she really, within 15 minutes, had just cracked the code, and she was off running 200ft away, just waiting for me to throw the ball for her.

[Cal]

That's that Labrador brain right there.

[Spencer]

Now, what was the most challenging part of teaching Noodle to find mushrooms?

[Ellen]

You know, honestly, it was surprisingly easy, but I'd say at the beginning it was a little hard to get her to differentiate, okay, which mushrooms are good, which. Which mushrooms are bad. But she did. I mean, she figured it out quickly. It's like if she sniffed the wrong kind of mushroom, I'm like, no, that's not a mushroom. You don't get a stick. So she. She figured it out fast.

[Spencer]

Now, in most videos, I see Noodle finding morel mushrooms. What are the other good mushrooms that she'll help you find?

[Ellen]

So she has about seven varieties. We do morels. We taught her chanterelles afterwards. Then matsutake. We do porcini candy cap. She taught herself, which was pretty annoying because she saw me collecting them, and then she was like, I want to get in on this, and started trampling them. But we also do black trumpets, if I didn't say that one.

[Spencer]

Okay, sounds like Noodle has taught herself this skill for the most part. Now, how does she alert you when she finds a good mushroom?

[Ellen]

You know that position that dogs get in when they're waiting for you to throw the ball and they're kind of crouched down just at attention. She just crouches by the mushroom and gets that alert look on her face. And if I don't see it, I'll often say, show me. And then she taps it with her nose. And if I really. She thinks I'm being a total idiot and I really can't see it, she smacks it with her paw. Occasionally, she knocks them out of the ground completely.

[Cal]

That's awesome.

[Spencer]

Extra helpful. Now, you said the reward is throwing a stick or a ball. That's what you do every time she finds a good mushroom?

[Ellen]

Yeah, if it's a good one. If it's a little nasty, I say, ah, that's nasty. Find another. Or if she's really found a cluster and she's going from mushroom to mushroom, I say, all right, you have to just lay down and wait for me to collect all of these, and then you'll get your reward.

[Spencer]

That's great. Now, morels are not toxic for dogs. Does Noodle ever get to eat them or express any interest in eating them?

[Ellen]

Well, I will actually clarify that a bit, because while morels are not toxic, they're actually toxic raw. And there was even a poisoning that included some deaths in the last few years, I believe in Montana. That's kind of highly debated in the mushroom world, but they are toxic raw for both humans and dogs. So always cook your morels super thoroughly. You basically can't overcook them, but don't eat them raw. I, you know, she'll occasionally bite them or lick them, really. Not. Not much of a bite. She's not enough to eat anything, but I have her pretty well trained on not eating food that I don't want her to eat. So I haven't actually given her any mushrooms before. I don't really want to give her much of a taste for it. I've heard with truffle pigs, one of the risks, because they're not quite as trainable, they will bite the owner's hands or the trainer's hand while the trainers harvesting the truffle. So I want to avoid that more or less.

[Spencer]

Yeah. What has been. Noodles best every day of foraging.

[Cal]

Gosh.

[Ellen]

I mean, that's a tough one. Every time she finds. Every time I train her in a new species. So I would say the second. Second species I taught her in was chanterelles, and it actually took her a lot longer than the morels. We went up to Mendocino, and there's just. It's such a rich diversity of fungal activity. There were so many mushrooms everywhere. So she was getting distracted. But when she finally pinpointed, like, okay, these are the ones that she wants, she doesn't want any of these other ones. We found over 50 pounds in, like, you know, an hour or two. And I sold some to a restaurant. It was great. So that was a highlight for sure.

[Spencer]

That is great. How has the morale season been for you so far this year in Northern California?

[Ellen]

Yeah, it's been pretty hit or miss, I'd say. We got hot. We don't. We didn't have great snowpack in the Sierra this season. It dried up a little quickly, so my lower elevation spots, like 3,000, that. That range, the mid range, really dried up fast. And then now we're having some. I'm not having a bad season in the higher elevation.

[Spencer]

Okay, good. Good for you guys. Good for Noodle. If folks want to follow along with you and Noodle's mushroom hunting adventures, how can they?

[Ellen]

We've got an Instagram page. It's really good. Noodle. And I've got a lot of videos of her running around in the woods getting up to adventures together. And we do have TikTok as well. Same name, not as active there, though.

[Spencer]

One of my favorite follows on social media is Ellen and Noodle. Thank you guys for joining us. Please tell Noodle she's a good girl and we're very impressed with her foraging skills.

[Ellen]

Thanks so much for having us.

[Spencer]

Thank you.

[Cal]

That's sweet, Cal.

[Spencer]

I love Snort. Snort's a great dog. I'd rather have a mushroom hunting dog.

[Cal]

I think that's good. Hunting dog can hunt anything.

[Steve Rinella]

That's right.

[Spencer]

Okay. I'd like to see you teach Snort. It sounds like if. If the dog is into it, there's not a lot to. To do.

[Cal]

Yep. And I mean, yeah, it's the prey drive plus the praise drive.

[Spencer]

What kind of praise does Snork get when she's being a good girl on a hunt?

[Cal]

Well, you know, like, she doesn't want to be. I. I give her praise.

[Spencer]

Uhhuh.

[Cal]

Really? She wants food at the end of the day, but man, during a hunt, you can't hardly touch her.

[Steve Rinella]

She's like.

[Spencer]

Her praise is.

[Steve Rinella]

Her praise is just finding a bird.

[Cal]

Right.

[Steve Rinella]

That's all she needs.

[Spencer]

Leave her alone.

[Cal]

Oh, she wants that bird so bad. Yeah. Yeah.

[Spencer]

All right, our next segment is meat pole.

[Steve Rinella]

Show me your meat, boys and take my pole.

[Spencer]

Welcome to Meat Eater Radio.

[Steve Rinella]

I got a game to play.

[Spencer]

Meat Pole is a test of how much you know about your fellow hunters and anglers. I surveyed 500 meat eater listeners about the outdoors. Your job is to predict their answers. There are three questions. Whoever is closest to the correct answer between Cal and Brody gets a point.

[Brock Wall]

And.

[Spencer]

And whoever gets two points will be the winner. Also, the chat should play along because Phil is going to watch your answers and give a shout out to whoever is closest.

[Steve Rinella]

I'm not falling. What if. What if we both get two points?

[Spencer]

There's only three questions, so that won't happen.

[Steve Rinella]

Oh, my God.

[Spencer]

One of you is going to get a point each question, and that's. That's how we're going to settle this thing. All right, question one. What percentage of meat eater listeners have washed their pickup in the last Month.

[Steve Rinella]

We supposed to write this down?

[Spencer]

Write down an answer, hide your answer. That's right. What percentage of meat eater listeners have washed their pickup in the last month? Now, for this question, I said for pickup owners only, which happened to be about 90% of folks who took their survey. So what percentage of those people have washed their pickup in the last month? Cal, when's the last time you washed your pickup?

[Cal]

I am not a good vehicle washer. Never, ever, ever have been.

[Spencer]

Okay, that doesn't surprise me.

[Cal]

But part of my Memorial Day cleanup was vacuuming out the truck and with the dog hair in the sand and all the stuff. And then I did what? I wasn't intending to wash the truck, but I needed to spray out the floor mats because they were real gnarly. And so I did end up hosing off the truck.

[Spencer]

I bet I go through a car wash, I don't know, four or five times a year. Not that often I'm conscious of it. If I go on a hunt where I think I'm going to end up asking for permission. Oh, yeah, because when I go knock on someone's door and if I had just, like, a filthy, dirty, muddy pickup, they're going to be thinking, this guy wants to drive through my field. That's going to be a big no. Because one of the first things if I do get permission, they'll say is just don't drive anywhere. Don't drive through any gates, don't drive through any fields. So I try to be aware of that. I don't want to show up with a. With a sparkling clean pickup either, because then that sends a different message. But if that thing just looks like I drove it through a big old mud puddle, that's no good for me.

[Cal]

No, it's not. Yeah. I mean, but there's also, like, the noxious weed side of things, right? Like, vehicles are a huge vector for spreading bad things.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah. And that stuff, like, you're driving around, say, out in eastern Montana and the gumbo and that stuff gets glued to the bottom of your truck. You got to get rid of it.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Spencer]

Hey, Phil, do you have any bed of music to play while we. While we do this?

[Phil]

Nothing original.

[Spencer]

Oh, that's okay. Do you boys have an answer for what percentage of meat eater listeners have washed their pickup in the last month? Go ahead and reveal your answers.

[Steve Rinella]

The one came up.

[Spencer]

Okay. All right.

[Steve Rinella]

So I'm not sure.

[Spencer]

Go ahead. Brody says 71%. Cal says 41%. The correct answer is 30.5%. So Cal gets that first point. 30.5% of media listeners have washed their.

[Steve Rinella]

Dirt bags, not washing their stuff in the last month.

[Spencer]

One study showed that the average person washes their car 13 times a year.

[Cal]

Whoa.

[Spencer]

That same study showed that 79% of people go to a car wash versus 21% of people who wash their car at home. But when it comes to the interior, the average person cleans the inside of their car wash once a year.

[Steve Rinella]

I just paid my boys to detail my truck.

[Spencer]

Oh, are they, are they, Can I hire them too?

[Steve Rinella]

Well, depends on how much you want to.

[Spencer]

What'd you charge?

[Steve Rinella]

Quality of the job is going to be based on how much you're willing to pay.

[Spencer]

What'd you pay them?

[Steve Rinella]

I was a little underwhelmed and I had to up the, the ante was about 50 bucks. They split 50.

[Spencer]

Okay. Did it seem like a fifty dollar job to you?

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah, it was worth it to me. I didn't want to spend a couple.

[Phil]

Hours doing that, you know, Montana Hunter said 28.

[Spencer]

Oh, well done, Montana Hunter. You were two percentage points off. All right, question two. What percentage of meat eater listeners have ever bitten into a bb? What percentage of meat eater listeners have ever.

[Steve Rinella]

You're talking like any kind of pellet? Like not a bb, like a BB gun?

[Spencer]

Yeah, any kind of pellet.

[Steve Rinella]

Shotgun pellet, but it does like.

[Spencer]

Thank you, Phil. That ups. That makes it so much better, what we're doing here. What percentage of meat eater listeners have ever bitten into a BB? Cal, how many BBs in your lifetime? I'm gonna guess like five or six.

[Cal]

Oh, buddy, I got two cracked teeth in my face.

[Steve Rinella]

Five or six a year.

[Cal]

Oh, yeah.

[Spencer]

So how many, what's the number?

[Cal]

Oh.

[Spencer]

20.

[Cal]

I, I, I was gonna say 30, but I thought that sounded dramatic. But it's definitely higher than 20.

[Spencer]

Do you think you've gotten better or worse in your lifetime about cleaning BB's out of stuff?

[Cal]

Well, technology is a mother scratcher. Number nine. Tungsten.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah.

[Cal]

Holy cow, dude. Buried like, oh.

[Steve Rinella]

In the bottom of a thigh or a breast. Yeah.

[Cal]

Like you can't find that stuff.

[Steve Rinella]

Probably swallowed.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steve Rinella]

Several of them.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steve Rinella]

Without knowing their.

[Spencer]

How about you, Brody? How many BBs have you bitten into?

[Steve Rinella]

Dozens. Like, and I mean, like, there's degrees of biting too. It's like, oh, I feel it and I just spit it out. No big deal. And there's like, wham. You come down on it with both molers. That's rough.

[Spencer]

Yeah, I'm, I'm at single digits, but it's because one, like the last experience Was really bad where I'm like, I'm never going to let that happen again. I'm. I'm going to clean these things so thorough or I'm going to cut the meat so thin a BB is never going to make it onto my dinner plate.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah, they just find a way in there, man.

[Cal]

Yeah. When you get the one that we're like, it's. There's like a mammalian spinal reflex that happens when you're.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah, it's almost like it's not. It's like as shocking as a bad electric shot, you know?

[Cal]

Oh, yeah.

[Steve Rinella]

It goes all the way down your spine.

[Spencer]

Ruins the meal.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Spencer]

So what percentage of meat eater listeners have ever bitten into a bb? Are you boys ready?

[Steve Rinella]

Sure.

[Cal]

Yep.

[Spencer]

Go ahead and reveal your answers. We have Brody saying 88%. Kel says 63%. One of you is within three points of the correct answer. The correct answer is 65.9%. Cow is on fire.

[Cal]

Man. Of people here.

[Spencer]

80% of Americans over the age of 40 have had at least one cracked or fractured tooth in their lifetime. The most common foods that crack teeth are hard candy, nuts, ice, popcorn, kernels and bone in meat. That study I was looking at never said anything about pellets, But I imagine our audience is very familiar with that feeling you boys are describing.

[Cal]

I think you overestimated how many bird hunters we have. I think that's the.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah, but ducks, pheasants, turkeys, I mean, they're all birds.

[Cal]

One thing in common.

[Steve Rinella]

I know. Just like I'm a little disappointed.

[Spencer]

All right, question three.

[Phil]

We had the broke three gunner saying 67, so good job.

[Spencer]

Damn. One percentage point off. Here's question three. We'll see if Cal can get the clean sweep and make Brody run around the office naked, as is tradition when you get skunked naked.

[Cal]

Lap.

[Spencer]

What percentage of meat eater listeners have fishing bait in their fridge or freezer right now?

[Cal]

Oh, that's a tough.

[Steve Rinella]

I can tell you I do.

[Spencer]

You do what? What do you got, Jared? In the garden.

[Steve Rinella]

Got some crawlers and leeches.

[Spencer]

How are you going to spend those?

[Steve Rinella]

What do you mean spend them?

[Spencer]

Yeah, like where you use them? Fishing currency. What are you going to do with them?

[Steve Rinella]

Catch a bunch of walleye, hopefully. Maybe some perch.

[Spencer]

What percentage of meat eater listeners have fishing bait in their fridge or freezer right now? I have some deer liver that's earmarked for some catfish on the Yellowstone river later this summer, so I've got some in my freezer. How about you, Cal? Any bait in your home right now, staying cold.

[Cal]

You already asked the question, but I feel like old meat doesn't qualify for this question or shouldn't.

[Spencer]

I think folks would know if they put it in their freezer for the purpose of catching a fish. They probably answered honestly. What percentage of meat eater listeners have fishing bait in their fridge or freezer right now? Okay, boys, Ready?

[Cal]

Yep.

[Spencer]

Go ahead and reveal your answers. We have Cal saying 38 and Brody saying 50.

[Dan Flores]

Foreign.

[Spencer]

It's a clean sweep for Cal. The correct answer is 34.9%. Cal dominated today, very close on every one of these questions. He's declared it before. He's a man of the people. But this, this game really proves it.

[Cal]

Phil, will you take that? Spencer Newharth sound clip. That might be the nicest thing he ever says about me. And we need to memorialize that someplace.

[Spencer]

American spend $1.5 billion on live bait and natural bait each year. That's 50% more than they spend on lures and flies and 20% less than they spend on boat fuel. Bait accounts for about 13% of all fishing related expenses.

[Phil]

And Ryan Carlson said 34.5 damn point.

[Spencer]

4 percentage points off. 35% of people who are listening to this show have bait in their fridge or freezer right now.

[Dan Flores]

Steve Rinella here. The American west with Dan Flores is a new podcast production on the Meat Eater Podcast Network. It's hosted by author and historian Dan Flores, who happens to be mine and our own Dr. Randall's former professor. By focusing on deep time wild animals, native peoples in the West's unique environments, Flores will challenge your understanding of the American west and he will help to explain why it is the way it is today. I count Dan Flores as a friend. We do not agree on everything, but he has had a massive impact on my understanding of American history. And I invite you to get challenged by him in the same way that I have. Catch the premiere of the American west with Dan flores on Tuesday, May 6th on the meat Eater Podcast Network. Subscribe to the American west with Dan Flores on Apple, Spotify, Iheart or wherever you get your podcasts. Listen to Dan and it will stretch your brain all out. And I mean that in a very good way.

[Spencer]

All right, moving on. Our next segment is One Minute Fishing.

[Steve Rinella]

She using bait?

[Spencer]

Well, do you find out in a second. Go ahead, make my cast.

[Cal]

You brought in a ringer here, didn't you?

[Spencer]

We, we're trying to. One minute fishing is where we go live to someone who's fishing and they have one minute to catch a fish. And if they're successful. We'll make a $500 donation to a conservation group this week. Our angler is Christine Fisher, aka Midwest Fisher Gal on Instagram. She's on 10 Killer Lake in Oklahoma and fishing for a donation to the first Wisconsin chapter of Muskies Inc. Christine, welcome to the show.

[Christine Fisher]

Hey, guys, how's it going?

[Spencer]

We're doing good. Christine is pre fishing for a tournament today. So tell us about the tournament that you'll be competing in.

[Christine Fisher]

So I am practicing for the Bassmaster kayak open here on Lake Tenkil in Oklahoma. I think it's the third open of the year. I've only fished here one time before. We had a championship here last year. Share different time of year, but this lake is gorgeous. Has big smallmouth, largemouth. I've had a pretty good bite going, but the fish, the lake is about 7 foot flooded. The fish are kind of spread out. They're post spawn. So bites are few and far between. But when you can get them to eat, they're pretty, pretty good size.

[Spencer]

Okay, tell us about your kayak setup that you got there.

[Christine Fisher]

I'm fishing out of a Hobie Pro Angler 14, 360. I'm cheating. I got a little motor on the back because, you know, we get lazy in our old age. I have two low ranch grass up front. I've got about 15 rods with me right now. I've got a few different patterns going and trying to just break down this leg. I didn't get a ton of. Don't get a ton of practice on this one. But yeah, it's a pretty good setup. I love it. It's comfortable. I can stand up. I usually stand and fish and use these two little foot pedals. Right here are for control steering so I can set my motor on, you know, a mile and a half an hour, stand up, use my stands, power fish and run a pattern. And it's. It's pretty effective for me.

[Spencer]

Amazing little boat. Now, Christine has fished in 171 Kayak Bass tournaments. She's placed in the top 10 in 60 of them and took first place in 10 of them. So, Christine, give some advice to folks listening who want to catch more fish from a kayak.

[Christine Fisher]

So the best advice I can give, you got to get out there and do it. First and foremost, kayaks are great because it forces you to kind of really learn an area. So I always advocate for kayak fishing, but I always tell people, fish your confidence, fish your strength. If you, if you hear the dock talk that people are crushing Them on a crank, a square bill. And you don't necessarily love throwing a square bill. You're not going to catch those fish. So I always tell people when it's tournament time, when it comes down to putting fish in the boat, you need to fish your strength. No matter where you're at. Just try to find water that suits your strength. And because that'll. And that at the end of the day, fishing how you like to fish, that makes it a lot more fun, too.

[Spencer]

Good advice. Now for the one minute of fishing. What kind of area are you in and what kind of lure are you throwing?

[Christine Fisher]

Well, so like I said, my. My big smallmouth. Big largemouth bite is few and far between. So I came out to this little. Little island out here in the middle of the lake, and I found some scattered bait. Then there's some white bass. I've actually caught two of them while you guys were talking.

[Spencer]

Oh.

[Christine Fisher]

So I'm just. I really want to. Yeah, I want to be able to catch just a fish here. So I've got a little. Little paddle tail, swim bait, and there's a scattered bait, and there's some white bass kind of cruising in the area. I don't know if I can do it in a minute, but I'm gonna try.

[Spencer]

Okay. And standing or sitting?

[Christine Fisher]

I'm going to sit. Because if I stand and I'm setting you guys down, my kayak. 90% sure my phone will go in the water. So we don't want to donate a phone to the drink. I've done that a lot. Not today.

[Spencer]

That's right.

[Cal]

Is it intimidating to know that all of your tournament experience is culminating right now at Meat Eater One Minute Fishing?

[Christine Fisher]

I'm going to lie. I usually don't cave under pressure, but I'm feeling the pressure on this one. You guys, I want. I want the Wisconsin muskie guys to get. Get a little donation because I fish muskies up there all the time, and I. I don't know. I mean, this is more important than winning this tournament. Honestly, in my opinion.

[Cal]

I love that attitude. I'm rooting for you.

[Spencer]

All right, Christine, your one minute of fishing starts as soon as you make your first cast.

[Christine Fisher]

Okay. Let's see.

[Cal]

Pick your spot.

[Dan Flores]

Oh.

[Spencer]

All right. She's made.

[Christine Fisher]

I casted cast.

[Spencer]

Got an interesting perspective. I've never watched someone fish from the bottom of their feet before.

[Cal]

Don't.

[Christine Fisher]

Don't put this on feet finder.

[Spencer]

Christine, you're 15 seconds in. Doing a little paddle tail. There's some overcast today. Conditions look Good. Maybe a slight breeze.

[Cal]

Yeah, I like it.

[Spencer]

30 seconds to go. She's gonna make another cast.

[Cal]

Got time for another cast? I love it. That's some crucial mental game right there. Do you keep playing it or do you recast?

[Spencer]

20 seconds to go, Christine.

[Christine Fisher]

My heart's beating.

[Spencer]

10 seconds left. I need one white bass. Oh, they just came after. Oh, she had a bite right at the end. Your one minute is up. Tell us what happened there, Christine.

[Christine Fisher]

Man, I had a little group of them right there and yeah, I, I didn't catch them. They came after it. But like I said, I've caught two here in the last couple minutes. I think, I think I. I think they got smart to what I was doing.

[Spencer]

Okay. They knew you were now on the show and not just pre fishing for the show.

[Christine Fisher]

Dang things. I probably just thrown the. I've been catching these big smallmouth on a big 7 inch swim. Bait and under skipping and her docks and around some flooded cover. I probably just should have rolled the dice with that.

[Spencer]

I got one last question, Christine. 10 Killer Lake is known for a mythical freshwater octopus. Have you seen any evidence of the freshwater octopus this week?

[Dan Flores]

Week?

[Christine Fisher]

No, but I think isn't unagi. Isn't octopus. Isn't that Japanese? Unagi. That's one of my favorite, like sashimi things. So if I do find. Okay, I'll let you guys know how that tastes.

[Spencer]

Keep your eyes peeled. I'd love to know more.

[Christine Fisher]

Definitely not. Not seeing any.

[Spencer]

Okay. The ten killer octopus continues to be elusive. All right, thank you for joining us, Christine. Good luck in the tournament this week.

[Cal]

Thank you.

[Spencer]

Have you ever seen a kayak like that?

[Cal]

Man, it intense, like an arms race of kayaking. Like all things.

[Steve Rinella]

It's. Yeah, it's impressive. I mean, there's guys that are like doing offshore blue water fishing in those.

[Cal]

Oh, big time. Yeah, it's.

[Steve Rinella]

It's pretty cool.

[Cal]

Yep.

[Spencer]

All right, we're halfway through the show. Let's take a break for some listener feedback. Phil, what's the chat have to say?

[Phil]

Yeah, Leland, our guy says, Cal, what are you looking forward to most about BHA rendezvous?

[Cal]

Oh, yeah, we got rendezvous coming up starting. I'm gonna be there all week, but It's June like 14, 15, 16. Missoula In Missoula, Montana. Yep. Great people, fantastic people. We got a bunch of stuff to recap. We gotta keep folks motivated. On public lands. We got corner crossing cases is getting revived at this point. I kind of feel like we should be thanking Iron Bar holdings because they just keep. Keep it yeah. Because now it's going to the highest court in the land, which means corner crossing is going to be legal everywhere for certain, and it's going to be on their dime, which is great.

[Spencer]

What's kind of the general temperature on that right now? Are people optimistic that they're going to side with the hunters and public land users?

[Cal]

Well, you know, politics shouldn't come into play and stuff like this. Right. Like a judge is supposed to be impartial. But I think that is the idea is that they're going to lean way more conservative and they're going to somehow turn it into a private property rights thing where it, I mean, it just is not right. It's like you're stepping from public land to public land. There's a couple of bad actors out there that are, are trying to monopolize public land through the use of strategically purchased private land. But man, I feel really good about it. I mean, we have two federal court decisions.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah, that's the thing is like the Supreme Court has to find a good reason to not agree with the decisions that were already made.

[Cal]

Yeah. I think there's a high likelihood that the Supreme Court's going to be like, this is not worth our time or the taxpayers time to review this. We defer to the lower court.

[Spencer]

Sure. So you expect there to be some chatter about that at the BHA Rendezvous?

[Cal]

Yeah, I mean, we'll have some panels on, on all the policy stuff. And that's a huge reason that, that people show up. I mean, say, like here you get to follow your cash in person. Right. Become a member. This is what you're paying for. This is what we're working on. Here's all the, the issues that we're working across in North America. Plus there's really good food and just, it's, it's a refreshing kind of refill your cup type of experience. It's not draining like, like some of these events that we all put together are so.

[Spencer]

And Missoula is a good place to be in the summer.

[Cal]

Missoula is a great place to be in the summer.

[Spencer]

What else you got, Phil Spencer?

[Phil]

I don't know if you watched the show last week, but there was some, some debate about if they preferred the freewheeling Yanni show or the professional, you know, show that, that you run. But we've, we've got a lot of people. Oh, asking for, for random, for hunting stories, for meandering hunting stories.

[Spencer]

You boys have any hunting stories?

[Phil]

Anything new you haven't shared yet?

[Spencer]

I'm just trying to balance the shows out, you know, if we sat around. And I don't want us to just talk about haunting stories every week. So I'm trying to be the. The ying to Yanni's yang, and I think.

[Phil]

I think that's good. I think. I think it should be a different show, different flavor, based on who's hosting.

[Spencer]

I'll tell you this. Yanni is back in one of the host chairs next week. He's on a hunt right now. So expect some hunting stories then. But in the meantime. Cal Brody, anything to share?

[Steve Rinella]

No, man. Hunting season's over for me. For a while. It's fishing season now.

[Spencer]

Garden season.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah.

[Phil]

On that note, Sebastian says two days left of turkey hunting in New York. Run and gun or sit and wait.

[Spencer]

Go find them, Sebastian.

[Steve Rinella]

New York's a big state. Like, gotta know a little more.

[Cal]

I mean, if you're already on birds, I would say sit and wait.

[Steve Rinella]

Especially this time of year when things just are slowed down.

[Cal]

Yeah. If you can get them to talk to you one time, I'm like, okay, they know we're here. That's kind of like the best move you can make.

[Spencer]

But this late in the year, there's probably a lot of vegetation for you to be sneaking around in. What else you got, Phil?

[Phil]

Another one from Sebastian. Any update on the venison beef jerky contest?

[Spencer]

Oh, yeah, kind of. It's probably not gonna happen, Sebastian. The suits here at Meat Eater said we shouldn't do that. We shouldn't invite folks to send us food that we're then going to eat because someone's gonna get poisoned, and then we're gonna wind up in a lawsuit. Um, so I. I think we're maybe working on a pivot. Um, I pounded the table hard for us to do this. The. The idea being that we're going to, you know, bring in 30 venison jerkies from across the country, from listeners. We're going to eat them. We're going to rank the top three. We're going to hand out some big prizes. But the suit says, no, you're not. Um, so that's where we're at right now, Sebastian. Maybe later this year. Maybe 20, 26. That's. That's your update.

[Phil]

Russell says he's going out for Idaho Spring Bear, June 13th through 14th. A little later than usual. Should I not use the distress caller or. Yeah, should I not use the distress call or stay with it? He says he always spots and stocks, but this lady's looking for a cruising boar, Cal.

[Cal]

Man. Yeah, that. Believe me, I don't plug stuff just to plug stuff. But that Phelps fawn and distress call and you just make it sound like in your mind you want a crying human infant.

[Steve Rinella]

Like sick and dying human infant.

[Cal]

Yep, yep. And you gotta have that, you have that in your mind as you're hitting that call. And you are not going to see like a crazy amount of action, but it weeds out smaller bears. So you're either going to get a big sow or a very confident and should be large bore could end up.

[Steve Rinella]

Be right happening right in your face too.

[Cal]

Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I'm not afraid to scream on that thing. Love it.

[Spencer]

Find yourself a sick baby, Russell.

[Phil]

All right, one, one more quick one. Cody, can Phil make a new drop for the trivia tiebreaker question? I think you're, you're a plant from Spencer Cody because he's also asked for that. And I think I've got, I've got some spare time in the next couple weeks. I'll try to knock one out.

[Spencer]

Okay. The people are looking forward to it. Now. He's, he's made a promise on air, so it's gonna happen. All right, moving on. Joining us on the line last is Brock Wall, the founder of the newly formed North American Pronghorn Foundation. Brock, welcome to the show.

[Brock Wall]

Hey guys, thanks for, thanks for having me. I'm really excited to be here.

[Spencer]

Yeah, we are too. The North American Pronghorn foundation is the only conservation group that's dedicated to antelope. Tell us about how and why it was formed.

[Brock Wall]

Sure, yeah. First, I would like to say too that there are a couple of state based conservation groups dedicated to pronghorn in Arizona and South Dakota are the two that I know of. But we are indeed the only nationwide one that is focused on pronghorn throughout North America, the entire continent. So just wanted to make sure that those state based groups get some love there. But we really got started on Randy Newberg's hunt talk forum. There was just kind of a conversation that took place. Some guys are asking why, why one doesn't exist. And a few of us got together and said, well, there's no, no better time to start than now. So we filed articles of incorporation and in 2024 and got started and we really felt like, you know, there's a variety of reasons in terms of our why, but you know, everything from, you know, pronghorn populations just struggle a little bit, you know, habitat problems, migration issues, to also just, you know, the, with the amount of development that's going on and the amount of pressure that, you know, this western hunting is receiving. There's also just this need to get more resources on the ground, whether, you know, whether that's for pronghorn or sage grouse or mule deer. I mean, there's a whole host of species that benefit from the same landscapes that pronghorn do. So we really just felt like there was just no reason not to have this group and no reason not to get it started.

[Spencer]

And what are the current initiatives of the North American Pronghorn Foundation?

[Brock Wall]

Well, right now, you know, we're still new, so we're just. Just over a month old. We went live on April 21st here of this year. And so so far, the things that we've been focused on are trying to get some policy comments out there in for some BLM stuff and for some migration corridor designations. And then we're on trying to set up a fencing project here in northeast Montana. Not 100% sure if that's going to all come together here this year, but we're super excited about it because we're able to get some local stakeholders on the ground, both landowners, other conservation groups, and utilize some GPS collar data from pronghorn in that exact area. So we're really hoping to bring that added value to that pronghorn research in cooperation with a bunch of partners, and then really, I don't know that this will be really qualify as an initiative, but really, membership growth is a big priority right now. You know, we have some really lofty goals, and we'd really like to be able to do some big things around the entire West. And in order to do that, we're going to need a lot of money. And so membership growth is really something that we're focused on and really trying to grow that membership so we can take that money, turn it around and put it right on the ground.

[Spencer]

Data shows that pronghorn populations are down about 20% across the entire continent over the last few years. Talk to us about what the greatest challenges they're facing is and why that might be.

[Brock Wall]

Yeah, there's a few things that pronghorn are really struggling with, and one is, is winters, obviously. And. And I think, you know, you probably wouldn't be correct to say that. Well, there's not much we're going to be able to do about winters, and that's true. However, you know, it's. When we, when we highlight the fact that winters are increasing mortality, there's a couple of variables there that I think are important to point out as to what is making those winters. You know, so hard on pronghorn. And certainly, you know, extreme winters with a lot of snowpack, there's, there's going to be some die off and you can't really do anything about that. However, you know, we have examples from other research data, from observational data, anecdotal data from, from landowners where they're noticing that during those storms those, those pronghorn are trying to migrate and they're getting stuck in certain areas because of fences or, or man made barriers or, or another element would be, you know, maybe their winter range habitat where they're only planning or intending on being at in the winter is degraded so much or non existent that you know, they just don't have the nutrition on the landscape to make it through that winter. And you know, related to that, I mean something that's really interesting to think about when we think about habitat degradation for pronghorn is that in the last 20 years. So I think it was the USDA or maybe it was the USGS that came out with a study and they looked at sagebrush from the years 2001 to 2020 and over, over that 20 year time period, they found that western United States was losing a million, just over a million acres of sagebrush per year. And that's, I mean that's prime forage for pronghorn. It's prime winter habitat, it's prime fawning habitat. So you know, it's, it's things like that that we would really like to be able to throw some money on, throw some, some volunteer power on and some, some attention to, to, to really get things turned the other direction.

[Spencer]

Now I saw that your first policy action was to support the removal of feral horses from BLM land in Wyoming. Tell us about that.

[Brock Wall]

Yeah, so I know this can be a controversial issue and we certainly don't want to be insensitive to the folks that are really big horse fans. I mean I, we have nothing against horses. My, I grew up with horses. My mom was, was really big into horses and so I'm used to being around them but you know, it's pretty hard to deny and there's a lot of, you know, published peer reviewed research that supports this idea that you know, wild horses or feral horses can be really hard on Native Landscape 1 because their populations just blow up. They don't really have any natural predators. And so, you know, it's really not uncommon for them to, you know, double their population in a really short period of time on a landscape that is really not suited for them. And so what you end up getting is you end up getting a lot of damage to sagebrush, a lot of damage to winter range damage to water infrastructure. And it's just, you know, those horses are out. Competing native species, particularly pronghorn mule deer and sage grouse, are really, you know, some of those species that are most affected. And so the BLM has really been on a sort of initiative to try to get this under control and try to remove some of these horses from the landscape so we can start doing some work for the native species that I know a lot of the hunters and anglers like myself really want and so that we can start making some headway on sagebrush restoration and things of that nature. And so for us, it was really just about prioritizing pronghorn and their habitat over the feral horses that are not native and are. And almost everywhere, in every case, they are vastly overpopulated.

[Cal]

Brock, I just spoke with the rancher in California who has got a native population of pronghorn on his ranch. Not huddle, but he's gonna join us at field to table this year at Rendezvous. So you got to meet up with him and. And talk. He's actually has a fencing business where he goes through and does some of that mitigation work for wildlife passage.

[Brock Wall]

Very cool. Yeah, I'd love to meet him.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Spencer]

Brock, I also read you say that Wyoming has some of the best infrastructure in place for antelope, and some other states need to catch up. What does that mean exactly?

[Brock Wall]

Well, I don't want to make that sound like, you know, the other states aren't doing or pulling their weight. I think part of what we're. We're observing here is just the fact that Wyoming is sparsely populated, which gives them a little bit of advantage when they're trying to deal with some of this stuff in terms of wildlife and habitat. But, you know, they really have devoted a lot of resources. You know, they've gotten a lot of support for these things on a political level through a management level and administration level. And so, you know, they. They just have the right resources in place. They've had the right support for it, the right public support for it. And I think it's just put them in a position where they're able to utilize, you know, Cooperative Research Unit funding, you know, through the Wyoming Migration Initiative, has done some fantastic, incredible, you know, really groundbreaking work on migrations for a variety of species. And so I think, you know, when we look at places like Colorado or Montana or Idaho, Nevada, New Mexico, Arizona, you know, we're Starting to see some of that similar migration research and things like that being done. But I really think that what we say when we mean. What we mean when we say that is really just to try to get everybody else operating sort of with that same intent, to really try to figure out what Pronghorn need, where. Where they. Where they're at on the ground at different times of year and what their challenges are. And. And there's just, you know, very few tools out there that will beat a GPS caller to. To tell you all that stuff.

[Spencer]

Last thing. How can listeners support the North American Pronghorn foundation right now?

[Brock Wall]

You can go to our website, which is pronghorns.org so that's pronghorns with an S. And that is our website. You can buy memberships there. You can go to our merch store and order T shirts and hats, things of that nature. And then we also have an Instagram, which is nap official, so n a PF underscorefficial. And then you can look us up on. On Facebook as well. And we really want your membership. Like I said, we are really trying to grow this organization into something that's impactful. And so we would love for you to give us $35 and let us prove that we are. Are who we say we are. We're going to do what we say we're going to do.

[Spencer]

Again, that is pronghorns.org Brock, thanks for joining us and thanks for sticking up for Antelope.

[Brock Wall]

Thanks for having me, guys. Appreciate it.

[Spencer]

Cal, it's been too long for us to not have a pronghorn federation or foundation at a national level.

[Cal]

Yeah. I mean, for such a crazy, iconic, unique native species, like truly native, it's. It's really wild. Once you understand how pronghorn are managed differently state to state, or you could say not managed at all.

[Spencer]

Sure.

[Cal]

State to state. It's like a giant loophole. So putting some more. More focus, getting that magnifying glass on this species is. Is certainly needed. And Brock's correct. Right. Like that sagebrush ecosystem, our grasslands, we're losing about 2 million acres a year right now. So it's the most imperiled ecosystem in the world, not just the United states.

[Spencer]

Again, that's pronghorns.org consider joining the North American Pronghorn Foundation. All right, last thing for today is the hot tip off.

[Steve Rinella]

Hot T I B off.

[Spencer]

Turn your head and give cough.

[Cal]

What's that face? Don't use Goff.

[Spencer]

They're.

[Dan Flores]

I don't have any hot tips.

[Spencer]

Hot tip off is where two listeners go head to head with competing pieces of advice. And after we hear each tip, we'll declare which one is hotter. If you have a hot tip, take a one minute video on your phone and email it to radiothemedeater.com with the subject line hot tip off. This week it's Matt short versus Ben Hunter, and they're competing for a copy of catch a crayfish count the stars paperback edition as well as an MKC flat tail knife. And we have a special guest judge joining us today, Stephen Rinella. Because these are hot tips about parenting. And Cal and I have yet to reproduce and you have. So we brought you into the studio to decide who's gonna.

[Steve Rinella]

So, you guys, are you guys even voting or is it.

[Spencer]

Well, parents, I think, are the listeners vote?

[Dan Flores]

This is like very identity politics.

[Spencer]

Maybe Steve can sway their vote.

[Cal]

I think.

[Steve Rinella]

I thought we were weighing in.

[Spencer]

Corey, everybody can weigh in.

[Dan Flores]

You can weigh in. But I'm the judge, right? If I'm not, I mean, am I the say or not to say?

[Spencer]

Listen, what do we think?

[Steve Rinella]

I'm a parent too, man. I got rights.

[Spencer]

We're gonna let the chat decide.

[Dan Flores]

He's like, Brody's like, that's my truth.

[Spencer]

We're gonna let the chat decide. Those hundreds of folks are gonn.

[Steve Rinella]

Before we go, both of the people that are competing get a copy, not just.

[Spencer]

Oh, okay.

[Steve Rinella]

The real prize is the second blade right here that they're going to give to their kid. And so their kid can.

[Dan Flores]

Yep. Remember, tell your kid cut toward your buddy and not your body.

[Spencer]

That's right. Uhhuh. So, Steve, you're gonna need to watch the screen behind you. Phil is. Phil is gonna play these hot tip offs. Take it away, Phil.

[Cal]

Benjamin Hunter.

[Dan Flores]

Wow.

[Cal]

My name is Benjamin Hunter.

[Spencer]

And here's a hot tip for taking kids fishing. Make your own lures. Go to the thrift store and buy some cheap spoons from the silverware island.

[Cal]

Then go home and cut off the.

[Spencer]

Handles with a hacksaw.

[Cal]

File off the sharp edges and drill.

[Spencer]

A hole about an eighth of an inch from each end. Now, what you have should look something like this. Now attach a split ring to each end and put a treble hole hook at the bottom. Tie it off to your line and go fishing. Not only can this be an effective lure, but it is also fun to catch fish on a lure you've made.

[Dan Flores]

It's going to be hard to beat that.

[Brock Wall]

That's strong.

[Dan Flores]

I don't even want to see the other one.

[Cal]

Matt Short.

[I]

Hey, what's up, meat eater crew? My name is Matt Short from Firestone, Colorado, and here is a hot tip. Every parent knows that the the success of their outing with kids is dependent on keeping them fed, warm, and dry. But nothing will end your family fishing trip, day hike, upland hunt faster than a bathroom emergency gone wrong. I can't even count on my two hands how many times my own kids inability to judge when their next valve movement should be has ended one of our trips. That's why I've come up with kid poop bags. Pretty simple concept. Ziploc bag, toilet paper, dog poop bag.

[Ellen]

Right.

[I]

If you want to get fancy with it, grab yourself some sanitization wipes. If you don't have a dog and don't have readily access access to these poop bags, run down to your local park. I guarantee you there's a lovely little dispenser there. You can grab a couple for yourself. I put every single one. I put one of these in every single one of my bags. That way I'm always ready. Kid needs to take a dump. I go, great. Drop it on the ground. Pick it up like it's a dog. Wipe them up, hand sanitize myself. Everything goes back in my Ziploc baggie. I pack it out, we keep on trucking. Don't let your kids incontinence or lack of judgment of when is a good time to drop a load. End your next family adventure.

[Cal]

That's got Steve thinking hard.

[Dan Flores]

It's a tie.

[Steve Rinella]

We only got one knife, man.

[Dan Flores]

We're gonna have to find another one. I'll give him one of my personal knives out of my personal box of knives.

[Spencer]

You're gonna pick Matt poop bag over the little kid who's making his own fishing lures?

[Dan Flores]

Well, I like the kid because he's cute. Yeah, the whole thing's cute. It's just cuter and all. Get out the whole thing. Making lures, the fact that the kid presented well.

[Spencer]

Yeah.

[Dan Flores]

I love everything about it.

[Spencer]

Okay, that's good.

[Dan Flores]

I mean, it's all good. It's normally what would happen. Normally I would watch and I'd belittle one of them.

[Brock Wall]

Yeah.

[Dan Flores]

I mean, I would be like. But they're told they're so strong.

[Spencer]

You're in a good mood today.

[Dan Flores]

No.

[Cal]

And they have DIY components. Right.

[Dan Flores]

The material is so strong.

[Spencer]

Huh.

[Dan Flores]

And. And notice the guy with the poop bag, he's also getting into cleanup.

[Spencer]

Pack it in.

[Dan Flores]

He's not like, hey, just grab some toilet paper. Because then you just leave it behind. He's bagging it up. When it happens in an inopportune location, there's no way that I can in good conscience.

[Spencer]

That's why the chat is going to vote. Oh, Phil, is the. Is the chad voting?

[Steve Rinella]

I'm voting for the kid.

[Phil]

I didn't put up an official poll. I can if we've got like, yeah, give it another minute.

[Dan Flores]

I'm gonna bring in a personal knife for my personal stash.

[Spencer]

Wow.

[Steve Rinella]

And Benjamin, this new one's yours.

[Dan Flores]

Sure. That's the kid, right?

[Steve Rinella]

Yep.

[Spencer]

Yeah, I don't. Wouldn't it be special for the kid to have Steve Rinella's knife, though?

[Steve Rinella]

Oh, there you go. You could sign it.

[Dan Flores]

I don't care. I'm just not picking between the two.

[Spencer]

I would vote for the kid.

[Dan Flores]

Because he's a kid.

[Spencer]

Because he's a kid. Yeah.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah. But that's identity politics.

[Spencer]

Brody. Brody, who are you voting for?

[Steve Rinella]

I'd vote for the kid. I'm not down on the other one. You can always dig a hole. And honestly, man, I don't know how many times that's actually happened to me with my kids.

[Spencer]

What?

[Steve Rinella]

Like a total, like, oh, my God.

[Dan Flores]

Brody just makes him eat a bag of cheese curds before they go out. He just sack. We're going to fish all day. Eat this sack of curts no water.

[Steve Rinella]

It's just not like something that's happened to me enough times to like, well.

[Dan Flores]

If I came down. Listen, did I come down here? Are we whistling Dixie or we. Or am I the judge?

[Spencer]

Oh, you can be the judge. It's all you.

[Dan Flores]

I'm going to send him a private personal knife.

[Spencer]

The kid.

[Dan Flores]

The kid gets the nice fancy new knife. I'm going to send the guy from my personal stash. No, no, I'm going to send him something for my personal stash.

[Spencer]

Uncle Cal, what do you think? Who would you pick.

[Cal]

Man? I. I like them both a lot. They were both super prepared if I had to pick one. I like the recycling and the packing in. Packing out stuff, too.

[Dan Flores]

He's not swayed by the kid being a kid. Today's kids are tomorrow's enemies.

[Spencer]

Oh, that's what they say.

[Cal]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I. I have a running joke where I'm like, I'd like to shove that kid down £ when I see, I'm like, why can't people.

[Dan Flores]

Because it's easier now when he gets big.

[Cal]

Why can't the community enforce parenting now?

[Steve Rinella]

Granted, I think that, like, if everyone had the same attitude about the poop thing, like, adults are bigger culprits than kids, I think.

[Cal]

Yeah, bigger poops.

[Dan Flores]

Like the kid. I. I love kids.

[Steve Rinella]

I mean, I got most of them.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah, I mean, like, most of the time. I like mine. Like, I like, like, I like the idea of them. I like mine most of the time. Love him. He did a great job. Presents well, great material.

[Phil]

After 30 seconds left, I. I just.

[Dan Flores]

Can'T disrespect the dude. So let the kid win. Let him win. He wins. But I'm sending the guy a little something from the private stash and he gets a book anyway.

[Spencer]

There's a good reason I'm not a dad, but it's hard for me to fathom. Pick it up. A kid poop out in nature. Oh, no, thank you.

[Dan Flores]

I got a story.

[Spencer]

Not interested.

[Dan Flores]

Not mine.

[Steve Rinella]

Listen, after you change a few diapers.

[Spencer]

I'm not interested in that either.

[Steve Rinella]

You get poop under your fingernails. It's like, not a big deal.

[Dan Flores]

Do I really only have 30? Do I really only have 30?

[Spencer]

He was saying.

[Dan Flores]

Okay, can I tell a quick story?

[Spencer]

Yeah, go for it.

[Dan Flores]

So one time when I was in high school, we got a job. We. There's a guy building a log house, and he bought. There's this old farmer, old man Burns, and he had a big red pine plantation and he bought all these red pines from Mr. Burns, who one time on his farm. This is a little side story. A bull killed a kid on his farm one time.

[Spencer]

Wow.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah. Bull killed a kid on his farm.

[Spencer]

Like stomped on him.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah. So before my time, this is a deep past. He was a pumpkin farmer. I used to go and help him load the pumpkins and drive them down because he sold them to the local grocery stores. Anyhow, this guy buys these red pines from him, but he needs them cut and hauled out and stuck in a field. So we signed a little contract with him. He's gonna give us $5 a piece and use a Ford tractor of his to cut, limb, move out to where they can be picked up in a truck and put them up on stickers to get them off the ground. 100 trees, 5 bucks a tree. Well, we get done. And we had popped a hole as well as brine filled tires. We'd hit a stump and put a big hole in the brine filled tire. We get all done with the job and he informs us, hey, we're even. Oh, no, we're even because it costs so much to buy a new tractor tire.

[Spencer]

How old were you?

[Dan Flores]

High school.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Dan Flores]

We go home and tell our dad and that is just not acceptable to our dad. Our dad gets him on the phone and says, here's what's gonna happen with this 500. And then my dad says to us, he's waiting with your 500 at the job site. So we go to the job site, and he's gotta give us 500 bucks. But you know what the main thing, our main takeaway was he happened to be there with his grandson, and his grandson had just shat his pants. And as we show up, he's trying to clean up the grandson. And we thought at that time, before we had our own kids, we thought that that was the comeuppance.

[Spencer]

Oh, you got him.

[Steve Rinella]

He had to clean up.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah, like, ha ha ha. Right now. I've done that myself I don't know how many times.

[Spencer]

Oh, so you. You had something coming to you then.

[Dan Flores]

Well, I just felt like a punishment worse than losing 500 bucks would be to clean up a child's feet. And then you had kids, then I had kids, and then we just eat it now. Just eat it. Yeah, that. You're just drowning in it. You're drowning in it.

[Spencer]

Oh, man.

[Dan Flores]

Not anymore.

[Spencer]

You were telling me how great kids are with you.

[Dan Flores]

Huh?

[Spencer]

You were just telling me how great.

[Dan Flores]

Kids are for a while. You're not selling drowning and you're just dry. It's just everywhere. It's on everything.

[Steve Rinella]

They puke a lot.

[Dan Flores]

Just wipe it on your pants.

[Spencer]

Oh, yeah.

[Dan Flores]

Norovirus every other week now. Love that kid, though. That was a great.

[Phil]

Thanks for having me down with 72% of the vote, Ben. The kid wins, but wow.

[Dan Flores]

Landslide.

[Phil]

But we had a lot of people in the chat basically agreeing with Steve, saying that the poop bags. Probably a more practical, helpful tip, but the kid kicks ass, so.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah.

[Spencer]

Yeah, that's right. Well, as the guy who had to filter through about a dozen entries for this. Thank you, everybody, but this was tough.

[Steve Rinella]

Next time, we can't. We shouldn't mix kids and adults. We should do kids and adults. There you go.

[Dan Flores]

Pitting kids against each other.

[Spencer]

Yes. Yeah, yeah.

[Steve Rinella]

Survival of the fittest.

[Spencer]

That's good.

[Steve Rinella]

Lord of the flies.

[Cal]

And then eventually, you could see if there's a bracket system where the kid could out compete the adult.

[Dan Flores]

Put the kids against each other.

[Spencer]

Well done, Ben. Well done, Matt. Thanks for sending those in. And, Steve, you got time to stick around for the chat?

[Dan Flores]

Sure.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Dan Flores]

I'm having a time of my life.

[Spencer]

Oh, okay, Great. Phil, what questions you got? This is the end of the show. We'll answer a few questions. And Steve is going to stay around to help. Yeah.

[Phil]

If you have any questions for Steve, get them in there right now. You don't have a lot of time, I would say. Let's see. Leland, our guy. Once again, favorite way to prepare rainbow trout. Steve, if you've got something.

[Dan Flores]

Oh, you know, it's a lot of fun. There's a. There's a dish called. It's in French. What would be blue trout? Blue truth. All blue trout.

[Steve Rinella]

That's the approaching with where you.

[Dan Flores]

You drop them. It's gotta be real fresh and brand new. It's gotta still have its nice color. And you make this, this heavily vinegared like poaching liquid. And for whatever reason I don't understand the chemistry of it. When you lo. When you drop that brand new fresh trout and like the French will do it where they'll drop the. They'll like stun the trout and do it. You gotta do it that fast. And the trout turns blue. I'm not kidding you, it turns blue. Electric blue.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Dan Flores]

True doll. If it's like some old trout, it's been tied to a string out in the creek, you know it's not gonna do it, but it's gotta throw that.

[Steve Rinella]

One in the smoker.

[Dan Flores]

Yep, True doll. Blue is a lot of fun just to. Just to watch the thing happen.

[Spencer]

It's like a traditional, like gut em, leave the head on, stuff their tummy with lemon and herbs and. Looks fun. Just looks nice.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah.

[Spencer]

Cal. Brody, anything.

[Cal]

Tin foil packets. I mean, Leland, of your program. You're. You're running a bunch of volunteers out there. I'd have an assembly line with tinfoil packets like.

[Steve Rinella]

Yep. Yeah, lemon slices of lemon.

[Cal]

A lot of butter.

[Steve Rinella]

A lot of butter.

[Dan Flores]

My dad used to. They used to talk about wrapping them in leaves and then packing them in mud and cooking them.

[Cal]

Oh, that's cool.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah, I'd like to try that sometimes.

[Spencer]

Phil, what else you got?

[Phil]

Trey asks. Well, first he says, I love having bears on my land, but they're starting to tear feeders down. What can I do to keep them around but not have them tear things up?

[Cal]

Remove your feeders.

[Steve Rinella]

Bird feeders kill a lot of bears.

[Dan Flores]

Oh, is he talking about deer feeders?

[Spencer]

I imagine he's talking about trying to feed deer, be my guess.

[Dan Flores]

Well, I don't know that you're going to dissuade him from that, man.

[Steve Rinella]

No way to.

[Dan Flores]

Because you ever see that time they took that dead deer and electrified it?

[Cal]

Oh, that's amazing.

[Dan Flores]

Grizzly bear is like, yow. Five minutes later. Like, yow. Just like eventually he just gets the deer.

[Cal]

Yeah, eventually he just gets angry enough to where he's like, I'm just going to take it.

[Dan Flores]

He starts unplugging stuff.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steve Rinella]

I think if you love having them on your land, you're just going to have to learn to coexist with them. If you got deer feeders out, what else you got?

[Phil]

Phil Moor asks Steve, when was the last time you went on a hunt without cameras or last week? Yeah, I think people think that you are constantly being followed by. By cinematographers, but you go, you're. You're out there all the time.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah, mostly. I mean, a lot with my kids, so a ton, but generally with my kids. But we just got back from hunting.

[Spencer]

How'd that go?

[Dan Flores]

Great. My boy got his first bear.

[Spencer]

How many more bears died on that hunt?

[Dan Flores]

Our party had three.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Dan Flores]

Well, yeah, our little group had three, but we weren't all together. I was there for two of them, I was present for two, and I was 300 yards.

[Cal]

Everything went well?

[Dan Flores]

Oh, yeah, a great time.

[Spencer]

Bad weather.

[Steve Rinella]

You guys saw some, some bear love making on that trip, didn't you?

[Dan Flores]

We killed two boars that, that. I was there for one, not for the other one. That. We watched a boar breed a sow for 20 minutes. I'm not kidding you people think, like, I'm saying 20 minutes, like, meaning it was seven, but I'm saying 20. We watched a boar breed a sow for 20 minutes.

[Spencer]

Did the 20 minutes end when the boar was shot or would have. It kept going.

[Dan Flores]

I don't know why, but he walked away and started feeding.

[Spencer]

Okay. You don't know why he walked away?

[Dan Flores]

No, I mean, I don't know why he walked away, but that they would like. Like it was. I don't know. I haven't watched enough like, like the first one they watched, the. The saw was receptive. In this case, it was hard to tell, like, what level of receptivity there and what level of sort of like just. There's like a. A lot of display and a lot of foreplay. Well, like, like fitness. I don't know. Like fitness? Yeah, like, you're like testing fitness. You're like, she's like sussing out the cape, whatever. A lot of, like, theatrics. There were some kinds, like our, our. My initial instinct was those two bores fighting. Then at a distance, when I couldn't see clear, I was like, maybe it's just like two, you know, cubs always fight. Maybe that's what's going on. Then eventually I'm like, oh, no. It's like a mating ritual.

[Spencer]

I'm surprised it was that ambiguous that it.

[Dan Flores]

Because. Because they were through. There was.

[Spencer]

They were obscured.

[Dan Flores]

You could just see, like, a lot of black. Like, you know.

[Cal]

You know, but.

[Dan Flores]

But once we got clear, I mean, we were like, sure. We were. We were 60 yards.

[Cal]

Your. Your comment about, like, perceived time versus actual time.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah.

[Cal]

I ran a little experiment during turkey season, and because you're always like. You're like, all this major saga is playing out and. And how, you know, we gotta allocate the right amount of time to this and when to move and when not to move. So when I struck the bird, I hit the timer on my phone.

[Dan Flores]

Oh, smart.

[Steve Rinella]

Yep.

[Cal]

And then. And then we have this huge saga, like, no calling and then not responding and what the hell is going on? And then eventually the bird calls and, oh, my God, he's coming in and. And he skirts us. And then lo and behold, there's another tom down there. And, oh, now he's coming in and. And all these mental gymnastics. Shotgun goes off. I hit the stop on the timer. Thirteen minutes, man.

[Steve Rinella]

And it felt like way longer.

[Dan Flores]

He shut up on us.

[Cal]

Yes, exactly. Ah, it's so painful.

[Steve Rinella]

You're getting ready to walk somewhere else.

[Spencer]

Go.

[Steve Rinella]

Go get in the truck. Not somewhere else.

[Spencer]

Bill, let's do a couple more before we close this out.

[Phil]

Yeah, sure thing. Nick says question for Steve. Any plans to do some upland hunting in the near future? And I would rephrase that by saying, Steve, what do you have against upland hunting? Cutting.

[Dan Flores]

Does hunt bluegrass count? Yeah, yeah, sure. Absolutely.

[Spencer]

Okay.

[Steve Rinella]

Boy, we can't. We did some camping this past weekend, and those bluegrass were doing their thing. Oh, yeah. Everywhere, man. But I was trying to get my boys to sneak up on them. And that noise is so, like, you think you know right where they are. You go there, and then you're like, he's over there. Go over there. And you're like, he's over there.

[Dan Flores]

Yeah. You just feel the noise.

[Steve Rinella]

Yep.

[Spencer]

Struggling with this four wheeler again.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Dan Flores]

We were in a cool spot the other day when I was with my little boy Matthew there. We were in a cool spot where you could hear blues and roughed at the same time.

[Steve Rinella]

Yeah.

[Dan Flores]

And I was like, it's like, no, he's doing that with his wings.

[Steve Rinella]

Yep.

[Dan Flores]

He's doing that with his mouth, you know? Yeah. I like hunting bluegrass a lot.

[Spencer]

Let's do one more, Phil.

[Dan Flores]

Sure.

[Phil]

There was a favorite summer lure for largemouth from Bradley.

[Steve Rinella]

We're In Montana. That's a tough one.

[Spencer]

Favorite. If. If the. If it are top water friendly conditions, there is nothing more exciting in freshwater fishing than watching a largemouth just explode on a frog. So can I give some. That's my favorite.

[Dan Flores]

Can I give one from 1985, please? Back when I was a boy. When I was a boy, the thing that we most coveted in life was like, you get those pre rigged, it'd be a purple crawler with an orange spot. And the three hooks. Yeah, the three hooks on it. And it had a snelled loop like, you know, and you'd see him in the bait shop for like 79 cents. Dude, we. That was the lure. That was the lure, man. We call.

[Steve Rinella]

They must still make a couple crawlers.

[Spencer]

There you go. So Bradley favorite again would be something, anything. Top water. But if you just want to catch bass, throw a spinner bait or a worm. That's like, like Steve said. All right, that's the end of this show. Next week, the Meat Eater Movie club returns with hundreds of beavers. You can stream it on Tubi, Pluto TV, Amazon Prime, Free V, YouTube TV and Sling TV. We'll see you guys back here same time and place next week. Thank you.

[Dan Flores]

Steve Rinella here. The American west with Dan Flores is a new podcast production on the Meat Eater Podcast Network. It's hosted by author and historian Dan Flores, who happens to be mine and our own Dr. Randall's former professor. By focusing on deep time wild animals, native peoples in the west, unique Flores will challenge your understanding of the American west and he will help to explain why it is the way it is today. I count Dan Flores as a friend. We do not agree on everything, but he has had a massive impact on my understanding of American history. And I invite you to get challenged by him in the same way that I have. Catch the premiere of the American west with Dan flores on Tuesday, May 6th on the meat Eater Podcast Network. Subscribe to the American west with Dan Flores On Apple, Spotify, iHeart or wherever you get your podcasts. Listen to Dan and it will stretch your brain all out. And I mean that in a very good way.

[Steve Rinella]

This is an Iheart podcast.