Ep. 792: World Record Burbot, Dock Dogs, and Butt Out | MeatEater Radio Live!

Summary

The MeatEater Podcast

Ep. 792: World Record Burbot, Dock Dogs, and Butt Out | MeatEater Radio Live!
Release Date: November 14, 2025
Host: Steven Rinella (plus Spencer Newhall, Cal/Ryan Callahan, Phil, and guests Sean Conrad & Steve Powell)

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Episode Overview

Main Theme:
This lively MeatEater Radio Live episode features record-breaking fishing tales, the world of competitive dock-diving dogs, and an irreverent gear guessing game. The crew deep-dives into “buck fever,” discusses hunting culture and etiquette, and brings on guests with extraordinary stories—especially how to land a world record burbot and what it takes to have the ultimate dock-diving dog.

Guests:

• Sean Conrad: Holder of multiple (including all-tackle) world records for burbot and rainbow trout fishing
• Steve Powell: Co-owner of North American Diving Dogs

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Key Discussion Points & Highlights

1. Opening Banter: Hunting Culture & Camaraderie

• Hunting as a Workplace Priority:
  The team jokes about how MeatEater staff rotate responsibilities to ensure everyone gets time for hunting, reflecting a workplace culture that values nature and adventure (05:26).
• Respect for Permission & Landowner Etiquette:
  Spencer shares his determination to secure hunting permission the right way—even reaching out to a landowner’s adult child at work—emphasizing the importance of ethics and resourcefulness (07:01).
  • Quote (Spencer, 08:11):
    "Let me put this out there first. I think what I'm doing is very inappropriate by reaching out to you here at your work email. This is... you know, who I am. I got permission from your parents last year. I'm trying to get permission again."
• Buck Fever Confessions:
  Extended, humorous, and honest conversation about experiencing “buck fever” (the adrenaline rush before/during a big hunting or fishing moment), how it changes over a career, and the personal quirks involved (09:13-13:50).

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2. Interview: World Record Burbot & Trout (Sean Conrad, 25:41–42:14)

Sean Conrad’s Fishing Legends

• Background: With his twin brother Adam, Sean has caught 14 world record fish, including all-tackle records for both rainbow trout and burbot.
• The World Record Burbot (26:11):
  • The brothers targeted a specific fish known to be gigantic, tirelessly fishing and sleeping in their truck to pursue it.
  • Quote (Sean, 27:54):
    "I remember hooking that fish, and I had thrown my rod out, and I was eating a sandwich... and my rod just kept bouncing... and I knew when I was reeling [it in]... I had the world record on..."
• Techniques/Secrets:
  • Focus on drop-offs and holes with bait on the bottom (ciscos, smelts).
  • Success comes from relentless movement and adapting to fish behavior—even when conditions change yearly (30:47).
• Why March for Burbot?
  • March is prime because of pre-spawn: fish are heaviest and congregate densely (28:53).
• Eating Burbot:
  • Preferred size: 5–10 pounds (“delicious—backstrap, tail meat, belly meat”).
  • Frying belly meat or preparing it like calamari is a favorite (29:34–29:45).
• Advice to Aspiring Record Chasers:
  • “It’s honestly the same as deer hunting. You have to know what lake produces big fish... do your research and then figure out your techniques and learn.” (38:10)
• Record-Keeping Insights:
  • Sean explains IGFA’s line class and all-tackle categories—how testing and certification works, and the dedication required to ensure a catch is official (33:23–35:12).
• Memorable Moments:
  • Sibling rivalry: Sean and Adam have each broken the other’s records but focus more on learning and improving than competition (36:10).
  • Why Lake Diefenbaker produces giants: A dam creates constant forage (chopped ciscos) and fish feed heavily (37:10).

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3. Buck Fever: Both the Rush and the Anxieties (09:13–18:38)

• Personal Tales:
  The hosts and Phil get real about the emotional and physiological surge before a shot.
  • Steven Rinella’s Theory (13:02):
    "I feel that there is a finite amount of whatever it is that gives you buck fever... I’ve used a lot of it up."
  • Mentoring Kids:
    Steve notices differences in how his children process the nerves, with his daughter verbalizing anxieties and his boys focusing only on success (15:14).
• Hunting Anxiety & Paranoia:
  • The team discusses the competitive, anxious feeling when encountering other vehicles at trailheads (17:12); always assuming others have their same motives, even for niche pursuits like mushroom hunting.
    • Quote (Steven, 18:14):
      “If I see another car... in my head they’re doing what I’m doing. Meaning, if we’re like mushroom hunting and I see a car pull over, ‘Son of a– is mushroom hunt.’”
• Management Strategies:
  • Some try to “block out” adrenaline to focus on execution; others embrace it as part of the fun (16:06–16:41).
  • Beta blockers are discussed in jest (“I’m usually looking for reasons not to take drugs”—Steven, 20:54).

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4. Listener Feedback: Q&A and Rapid-Fire Gear, Food, & Tactics (42:38–46:28; 73:58–79:56)

• Office Hunting Policies:
  • PTO vs. flexible hunting days for MeatEater employees (42:52).
• Leopard Shark Eating Tips:
  • Proper trimming for good flavor—must remove fat and bloodline (43:38–44:12).
• Historical Deep-Dives:
  • Interest in podcast episodes on the French voyageurs and Cour du Bois (44:24).
• Mental Game on the Mountain:
  • What keeps minds occupied on long hikes: songs, self-composed ballads, and sometimes dwelling on one’s likes or dislikes (45:08–46:26).
• Target Panic in Archery:
  • Cal’s irreverent advice: "Don’t believe in target panic at all. Don’t listen to those people. Don’t be around those people." (75:01); the group discusses mental checklists and technique switches to manage anxiety (75:22–76:14).
• Pike Cooking / Pickling Tips:
  • Best to pickle to eliminate Y bones; also recommend processing into fish cakes (78:16–79:18).

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5. Game Time: MeatEater Price Is Right (52:16–66:17)

Format: Guess prices for quirky outdoor products, Price is Right-style, with audience participation in the chat.

Featured Items:

1. Butt Out 2 (game processing tool):
   • Humor: "Or anything with an anus." (56:26, Cal)
   • Price revelation and banter about whether anyone actually uses these tools (57:50–58:41).
2. Taxidermy Beetles Super Kit:
   • For DIY skull cleaning; surprisingly expensive ($246.50); sparks speculation about the cottage industry of bug-breeding (61:09–61:50).
3. Autographed 8x10 Steven Rinella Photo:
   • Market comparison: Steve’s signed photo ($85) is “between Playboy and Don McLean” in price on eBay (66:17–66:38).
   • Quote (Steven, 66:35):
     “Someone’s like, ‘How famous?’ I’ll tell you exactly how.”

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6. Interview: North American Diving Dogs – The World of Dock Diving (67:02–73:50)

• Steve Powell's Dock Dog Primer:
  • Dock diving: any dog, any size; just needs drive and love of water (67:41).
    • Quote (Steve Powell, 68:06): "If you have a dog that is psychotic and you don't want any part of dealing with it, most of the time, that's probably your best bet because they'll just do whatever you want them to do."
  • The current world record is held by a whippet named Sounders—jumping 36 ft, 11 in (68:26).
  • The sport’s human parallels—competitive spirit, “my dog can beat your dog” (68:53).
  • Dock diving is now expansive: 90+ US facilities, AKC partnerships, and events broadcast on ESPN (70:55–71:41).
• Hunting Dogs Welcome:
  • Many competitors are also hunting dogs; crossover is common (70:23).
• Canine Cognition:
  • Steven ponders whether dogs understand shifting environments, like when a dock into water suddenly becomes dock into ice (72:09).

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Buck Fever:
  • "There's a mental decision to cave to it or block it out." (Cal, 09:24)
  • "I feel that there is a finite amount of whatever it is that gives you buck fever... It doesn’t squirt as much out as it did when I was young." (Steven, 13:02, 13:28)
• Sibling Rivalry:
  • “What makes Sounders so good? — Sounders is fast, Sounders is athletic, and he just wants that toy.” (Steve Powell, 68:38)
• Classic MeatEater Humor:
  • “Or anything with an anus” (Cal, on Butt Out 2, 57:00)
  • Price is Right: “Steve’s signed photo is between Playboy and Don McLean.” (Cal, 66:29)
  • “Someone’s like ‘how famous?’ I’ll tell you exactly how.” (Steven, 66:35)
  • On archery target panic: “Don’t believe in Target panic. Don’t listen to those people… If that causes a divorce or something like that, that's better for you in the long run.” (Cal, 75:01)

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Important Timestamps

• [25:41] – Start of Sean Conrad interview: world record fishing stories
• [42:38] – Listener Q&A segment (work/hunting balance, shark filleting, etc.)
• [52:16] – Price is Right game segment begins
• [67:02] – Steve Powell interview: Dock-diving dogs
• [73:58] – Live Q&A wraps up: Skunk spray, target panic, gear/gift recs
• [80:00+] – Final hunting stories & episode close

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Conclusion

This episode combines gritty record-chasing fishing tips, tongue-in-cheek gear reviews, and stories about family, workplace culture, and the thrill of the hunt. Fans are treated to a rich sampling of what makes The MeatEater Podcast a staple: expert guests, relatable humor, and deep affection for the wild.

The memorable tales of Sean Conrad’s relentless pursuit of record fish, the celebration of canine athleticism in dock diving, and the candid, often hilarious confessions about "buck fever" make for an episode that’s as informative as it is entertaining.

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For anyone who hasn’t listened:
You’ll come away with insights on catching record fish, coping with adrenaline in the outdoors, the quirks of outdoor gear, and just maybe, a new appreciation for the odd hobbies and competitions that bring the outdoor community together.

Transcript

[Steven Rinella]

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[Cal]

Ask for O'Reilly Veriskan today.

[Spencer Newhall]

Oh, oh, oh. O'Reilly Auto Parts.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay, only 10 more presents to wrap.

[Cal]

You're almost at the finish line. But first there the last one.

[Steven Rinella]

Enjoy a Coca Cola for a pause that refreshes.

[Cal]

Smell us now lady.

[Steven Rinella]

Welcome to Meat Eater Trivia Eater Podcast.

[Spencer Newhall]

Welcome to Meat Eater radio live. It's 11am Mountain Time. That's noon o' clock for our friends in Birmingham, Alabama where the Meteor Live tour will visit in a few weeks on Thursday, November 13th. And we're live from Meat Eater HQ in Bozeman. I'm your host Spencer, joined today by Steve and Cal. On today's show we'll interview Sean Conrad about catching world record fish. Then Steve and Cal will compete in meat eaters prices. Right. And finally we'll interview Steve Powell, the co owner of North American Diving Dogs.

[Cal]

Gonna whoop your ass, Steve.

[Spencer Newhall]

There we go. Steve R. You gotta, you got something to talk about here first before we do the rest of the show?

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. If people are wondering why I'm, why I'm dicking with my phone, it's our, our friend and colleague Dave Smith at. You know Dave Smith Decoys sent this thing this morning. There's a hunter who's a good friend of Dave's named Devin Dobeck who on October 30th sent a satellite text message in Mount Hood National Forest. Sent on October 30th at 7pm Sent a satellite text message saying he'd killed a buck. It was going to take a while to pack it out. No one's heard from him since. So hundreds of volunteer searchers, Search and rescue, Sheriff's department can't find them. They're going to call off the search. Dave sent me a GoFundMe link because the family really would want some closure here.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah. It's been two weeks.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. And so they're trying to raise money for. To keep people in the field, cadaver dogs, whatever, you know.

[Spencer Newhall]

What's the GoFundMe called?

[Steven Rinella]

And Dave's been helping out on it, man. I think it's called Help Find Devin Dobeck, Mount Hood National Forest. Fish Creek. That's gotta be what it's called, right, Cal? I mean, if that's the big title.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Help Find Devin Dobeck. D E V O N D O B E K. I'm trying to right now put a thing on Instagram about it.

[Cal]

Can we put a link in the chat, Phil, does that work?

[Phil]

Yeah, yeah, I'll find a link, a share link and put it in there.

[Steven Rinella]

So Dave's been. Dave's been volunteering in the search.

[Sean Conrad]

Oh, just.

[Steven Rinella]

What a feeling.

[Spencer Newhall]

Sad story. If you go to the GoFundMe, you can try to help bring Devin home.

[Steven Rinella]

So that's what I'm doing right now. All right.

[Spencer Newhall]

We. We are deep in the bullpen of meat eater radio host. Today it was supposed to be Randall in. In Cal seat. And then yesterday afternoon, Randall said, boy, I'd really like to go deer hunting. Corey, could you co host tomorrow? Corey said, yeah, I'll do that. And then last night at like 9pm, Corey texted and he said, hey, I would really like to go elk hunting in the morning. Cal, can you host? Cal, what'd you tell him?

[Cal]

Said, no problem.

[Spencer Newhall]

No problem. So we're on our third relief host here today. Ryan Callahan taking over for Randall, taking over for Corey and I. I've heard some good news from Corey this morning. He killed a bull.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, thank God. He's getting a little pouty looking yesterday.

[Spencer Newhall]

Oh, was he?

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, yeah, he's looking a little salty and pouty.

[Cal]

But I think that's. Yeah, I don't know. I think that's awesome. You gotta. Gotta chip in where you can get folks some days in the woods.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, Steve. Steve has really created a culture around here of skipping work to go hunting.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

So it's an adult culture battle that, man, you are like a no hunting rule until.

[Cal]

Until Steve's tagged out.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, that's right.

[Cal]

No, it's. It's the adult culture of get your stuff done, don't make it a hassle. For somebody else. But, yeah, you were here.

[Steven Rinella]

Didn't you get a pouty feeling off Cordy Cory yesterday?

[Cal]

Yep.

[Steven Rinella]

Been helping a lot of other people feel their. Fill their freezer. I mean, that's true.

[Cal]

Helping other people.

[Steven Rinella]

He didn't say, like, by golly, I've been helping other people fill their freezer.

[Phil]

I think Cory's. Cory's earned the right to be a little snippy. He's. He's such a. He helps out everyone around.

[Cal]

He does.

[Steven Rinella]

That's coming from the king of snip over there.

[Cal]

Cr.

[Phil]

I'm proud of that title.

[Spencer Newhall]

So as we. As we sit here, Corey right now is on a mountain. He was texting me with satellite texts this morning. Maybe he'll join us later on in the show if you can get some good cell signal and we'll get that first look at a bull.

[Cal]

Heck yeah, dude.

[Steven Rinella]

Just having such a technical struggle. Go ahead. Keep doing the show. I'm almost with you.

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay. I just got home from a hunt. Steve, you just got home from a hunt. Cal, I'm sure you're either coming or going from a hunt right now. Can I tell you boys about the time I killed the biggest buck of my life?

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

I want to hear this happen.

[Spencer Newhall]

Just.

[Steven Rinella]

That's the biggest buck of your life?

[Spencer Newhall]

Biggest buck of my life.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. Bigger than all those big old white tails you got.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah. I'm flattered to think you killed. I. That I killed bigger deer than that before. That's. That's my biggest.

[Steven Rinella]

I just feel like you guys in South Dakota shot all those giant whitetails all the time.

[Spencer Newhall]

I mean, not. Not as big as this one.

[Steven Rinella]

Dude, I'm about getting wrapped up over here. But keep going.

[Spencer Newhall]

I. The hunt story itself, not that terribly interesting. I think the interesting part is how I got access to this place. This was just a door knocking.

[Cal]

I wouldn't tell people how to do that.

[Spencer Newhall]

I know. Well, I got permission here last year. This year I was trying to get this permission again. Struggled to get a hold of the landowner. From what I gathered, they were snowbirds. So my landline phone number I had was not reaching them. The letter I wrote them was not reaching them. I just need to confirm that I could hunt there.

[Ryan Callahan]

Exactly.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Because you didn't want to do that. Well, you gave me permission one time a long time ago. Therefore, I'll hunt the rest my life.

[Spencer Newhall]

That. That doesn't fly. So I. I was desperate to get in touch with these folks. I did something I'd never done before. I found out their Adult child who lived in another state. And I. I figured out where they worked, and I took a guess as to what their work email could be. And I reached out to that person and I. I opened the email, but.

[Steven Rinella]

I didn't line up with a restraining order.

[Spencer Newhall]

I said I was gonna say, so.

[Cal]

I slept in the parking lot. So I. I told this, Followed them home.

[Steven Rinella]

I put myself in a large box.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's right. Their oldest child. I opened the email by saying.

[Cal]

I.

[Spencer Newhall]

Let me put this out there first. I think what I'm doing is very inappropriate by reaching out to you here at your work email. This is. You know, who I am. I got permission from your parents last year. I'm trying to get permission again. It all worked out. I got in touch with them just hours later because of that. And then I went and I killed my biggest deer ever. That Phil has a few pictures of this. Muley was coming off of a winter wheat. I spotted him.

[Steven Rinella]

I wish you wouldn't have gotten that.

[Spencer Newhall]

What do you wish? I got honest.

[Steven Rinella]

I wish I knew he was just still out there.

[Cal]

You know, it's kind of interesting because that's a young face to me. But great forks.

[Spencer Newhall]

I mean, he had an enormous body. The biggest body of any deer that I've ever dealt with. So I don't think that that was a young face.

[Cal]

Oh, I know that spot.

[Steven Rinella]

I'm too jealous to be. I'm not happy for you. I'm jealous for you. What's it called when you just don't. When you just see something and it makes you upset?

[Cal]

Right?

[Steven Rinella]

Jealousy.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, Jealous. See? Okay. Yeah.

[Ryan Callahan]

Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

So, so very thrilled.

[Steven Rinella]

Blind squirrel.

[Spencer Newhall]

Something that. That happened there was. I got the worst case of buck fever I've had in quite a while. Yeah. Like, when do you guys not get buck fever anymore?

[Cal]

Certain circumstances.

[Spencer Newhall]

Like what?

[Cal]

I'll tell you. Like, I can feel it creeping in, and there's a mental decision to cave to it or block it out.

[Spencer Newhall]

I. I agree with you. This. This buck in particular. Thankfully, the moments of me realizing just how big he was were very brief between me learning that and me shooting him. So the buck fever set in, and I shot him. And it didn't build up. The worst buck fever I'd ever had in my life was my previously biggest deer. I killed with my bow. And I had to watch that deer walk in for a half hour before.

[Cal]

I could shoot him.

[Spencer Newhall]

I was an absolute wreck by the time he got there. Just totally shaking, on the verge of falling out of my tree. I. I didn't Know that a person can feel that way for that long until that happened. But this, this deer was a reminder of like what the shakes can really feel like.

[Cal]

Yeah, yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

You said sometimes it happens, Cal.

[Cal]

Oh, for. I think all the time. It. It happens. If you allow. Allow it to happen.

[Spencer Newhall]

It's kind of fun though, when it happens. It is for sure, like healthy.

[Cal]

Well, it's a drug, right? It's adrenaline. And I. Yeah, I had this amazing, very brutal hunt with just like glimpses of deer in a hard spot and then found this pocket of deer. And they're like four bucks. I think they were like somewhere in like the eight to a dozen deer total. It was like all the deer on this mountain were in this one little crevice. And lo and behold, there's this three point mule deer buck in there that is like one of the heaviest deer I have ever seen to this day. Just like all bronzed up mountain buck big around as. As my wrist and his antlers. Yeah. And the deer start filtering through this little pocket. There's all these openings. And everybody's like coming out and stopping in this opening and coming out and stopping in this opening and coming out and stopping in this opening. And he comes right up to the edge of the opening. And I'm like totally set up, rock solid, very close. And I, I mean I. I'm not going to sugarcoat it. I shot the opening. I was like, here he comes. Bang. And I'm like, oh my God.

[Spencer Newhall]

And he got away.

[Cal]

Yeah. And you know, mentally, like, you know, like they don't know exactly where it's coming from. They heard a big loud noise, big smack in front of them. I had time to shoot this buck again. And I was so. I was beating myself up so hard. Immediately as he was going over the crest of the ridge, which was only like a 200 yard shot at that point. I was on him. I was solid. It was a moving shot. But it was like that going away thing and I just knew I could kill him. And I said, you don't deserve this. And I didn't pull the trigger. I was so pissed at myself.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, Steve, Buck fever. When's the last time you felt it?

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, can I tell you something? I want to tell you something funny first because this pertains to what I'm going to say. My wife likes to hike up the M hill.

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay.

[Steven Rinella]

And she took our little boy up there last week. I think it was last week. Anyways, he was talking about how he always feels so good when he hikes up the hill. And she said, your body is releasing endorphins from the exercise. And he said, and he want to know what endorphins are? And he said, well, if they're good, why would it release them?

[Spencer Newhall]

Got you there.

[Steven Rinella]

So I, I, I have a, A, like a pet theory about this, that I feel that there is a finite amount of whatever it is that gives you buck fever.

[Spencer Newhall]

Have you. You've exhausted it?

[Steven Rinella]

No. Okay.

[Sean Conrad]

No.

[Steven Rinella]

But I've used a lot of it up. And I think that people are born with varying degrees of it. Some people are born with an enormous well.

[Phil]

Right.

[Steven Rinella]

That they just can't use. I have just, personally, I felt over the years that, like, whatever gland it is that, like, makes a thing is getting old.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah.

[Cal]

Or it's running out, and there's that finite.

[Steven Rinella]

It just doesn't do it. It doesn't, like, squirt as much out as it did when I was young.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's kind of.

[Steven Rinella]

It still gives a little squirt.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

But I, I feel like in a decade, at this going rate, oh, man, it'll be. It'll be squirted out.

[Spencer Newhall]

I don't like that you told us.

[Steven Rinella]

That that's just a pet theory. I don't know. I just feel like it's like, like the, the surge.

[Steve Powell]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Doesn't work as good as it once did.

[Cal]

You know, a buddy of mine, and, like, he's in the super adventurous, very dangerous whitewater kayaking community doing first descents and crazy stuff. And there's, you know, it's not a huge community, but there's. There's plenty of folks, and there's a lot of folks that get in the water, and they, they practice their role just to kind of, like, loosen up and get in the mental space. And he's like, won't catch me doing that. That's the stupidest thing in the world.

[Steven Rinella]

Why?

[Cal]

Because he firmly believes that you have a finite amount of rolls, and he's like, why would you waste one when you don't need it?

[Steven Rinella]

Yep.

[Spencer Newhall]

Steve's been guiding some of his kids to deer lately. Do they, do they get buck fever real bad?

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. My daughter has a peculiar kind of. Of buck fever and hanging out with kids. I feel like it's like. I feel like it's more calm. I, I notice very small sample set. I think it's more common in girls than boys. She likes to explore, verbally explore, whatever. She likes to spend a lot of time on what could go wrong, and likes to cover off her part of her process. Is covering off on what could go wrong and how to prevent it. This is not a thing that is on my boy's minds.

[Spencer Newhall]

Oh.

[Steven Rinella]

That is very far outside of their heads.

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay.

[Steven Rinella]

Like, kicking around. What could go wrong? How can we prevent it? They are not. That's not on their mind.

[Spencer Newhall]

Are they already thinking about the opposite? Like, them holding the antlers.

[Steven Rinella]

They don't. I don't know that they think that much. I don't know they think that much. My daughter's.

[Spencer Newhall]

I just got less.

[Steven Rinella]

What if we get. What if we. What if it falls over but we can't find it? What if we hit it in the leg? What if we miss? Like, she wants to cover it all off. And it's a form of. And it's a little bit. It's a. It's a little buck fevery. Yeah. You know, it's a little buck fevery.

[Spencer Newhall]

It's fun, though.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Even. Even if it's like, the stakes feel lower and you're shooting a dough or something. Just like the. The moments of knowing it's going to happen and thinking, like, everything is going to change after I pull the trigger. That's. That's very exciting to experience.

[Cal]

Yeah. Archery elk. I did a great job of just, like, blocking off the endorphin situation because I would just get in this mindset of, like, broadside elk meat in the freezer. Then I can go mule deer hunt. And I'm like, it's going to be a lot of work. It's going to suck. You're stupid for doing this. And just beat down any feelings of, like, excitement and adrenaline and.

[Sean Conrad]

Whoa.

[Cal]

And then I would let that come in afterwards and be like, wow, that was really neat. But now, you stupid idiot, you have to pack this thing out.

[Spencer Newhall]

I get advanced buck fever to the point where I will sleep worse the night before if I know that, like, it's gonna be a good hunt tomorrow. I just. I love that. That little bit of stress that, like, when the sun comes up, it's going to be good.

[Cal]

Yeah. I have. Yeah. There's a lot of anxiety in. In hunting for me as far as, like, oh, God, how many trucks are going to be at the trailhead? Sure did. I told you guys before, like, where I lived in Idaho, I lived, like, on the main artery for a huge drainage. And unless you were part of the maybe hundred people that lived upstream of me, you had to drive past my place. And no matter how tired, wet, cold, whatever I got in what terrible condition I had put myself in the night before, If I heard a vehicle go up that road at 4am There was like. There was no sleep.

[Steven Rinella]

They were going to where you're going.

[Cal]

Oh, yeah, Yeah. I was just gonna kill his.

[Spencer Newhall]

His deer, his elk.

[Steven Rinella]

I've noticed that, man. I know you probably want to move on, but.

[Steve Powell]

No, no.

[Steven Rinella]

I've developed this problem where no matter what who I see, I could be doing the most esoteric, weirdest thing in the weirdest thing in the world. If I see another car, I have in my head that they're doing what I'm doing. Meaning if we're like mushroom hunting and I see a car pull over. Son of a mushroom hunt. You know, be like, is he though? Yeah. Or like anything. If. If we're. If we're setting beaver traps, I see a truck. Son of a. Is beaver trap. I'm like, oh, no, he's just a dude walking his dog.

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

But my head immediately puts it that we have the same motivation.

[Spencer Newhall]

Sure. Makes you want it real bad.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. And then. And all. And realistically, in all the years I've hunted morels outside of hunting in Burns, because Burns everybody knows about. In all the years I've hunt, hunted Morales, I have one time been hunting morels and actually encountered a morale hunter one time in my entire life.

[Spencer Newhall]

Do you verbalize that fear to your kids when you guys are out looking for mushrooms? Like, oh, these evil people who just pulled over though?

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, no, I do. I just. Because I'm trying to train them to be paranoid about Morales, you know, last weekend.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's good.

[Cal]

My buddy's kid is chomping at the bit to go on a big hike for mule deer. And I was like, great, I'm your guy. Let's go clear it with his dad. And I'm like, hey, there's. We're driving down to this spot that he wants to go to. I'm like, hey, there's a 70% chance that there's gonna be another truck at this trailhead. If that's the case, do you wanna go check out this other spot or this other spot? Like, you gotta be thinking about that. And he's like, yeah, I think there's gonna be somebody there too, but let's go check it out. So we drive in there, and sure enough, there's one truck at this trailhead, and there's quite a bit of country there. But I was like, I don't really wanna go.

[Spencer Newhall]

Mm.

[Cal]

I'm like, but it's up to you. I wasn't even carrying a gun. And he's like, No, I think we should still go. I was like, okay. I was a little uncomfortable with it, but I'm like, you know, this is your hunt. I'm just in support. And we go hiking in there and not too far in there. Come around the corner, and I glass up this guy. And we had just talked about how we were gonna hike. Cause I'm like, now you gotta account for this other truck. We don't know where they are. The wind's going like this. But this is really hard. This isn't as hard. Chances are this person went up the not hard way. So maybe we should go up the hard way. Stuff like that. And I glass over, and this dude's dressing out deer. And I'm like. I'm like, well, perfect. And then I start looking, and I'm like, oh, that's a bighorn sheep.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. Oh, that was the guy. Yeah. Oh, no kidding.

[Steve Powell]

Yeah.

[Cal]

So I was like. And that's what I was like. Oh, my gosh. I felt so bad about being next to another truck. I feel so much better now. Congratulations. Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Wasn't doing what you.

[Spencer Newhall]

You were not looking for sheep that day?

[Cal]

No. No.

[Spencer Newhall]

Someone in the chat is suggesting that we take beta blockers to get rid of.

[Steven Rinella]

I've heard of that.

[Spencer Newhall]

I don't want them.

[Phil]

I don't know.

[Sean Conrad]

I don't.

[Steven Rinella]

I'm not always looking for. I'm usually looking for reasons to not take drugs. Yep.

[Spencer Newhall]

Different points in our lives.

[Cal]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Give me more of it.

[Cal]

Yeah. That's how Phil turns in those killer performances. Beta blockers.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah.

[Cal]

Well, the whole theater thing, it's all about your uppers and down.

[Phil]

They are. They are. I've never partaken, partook, but they. They are a thing. Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Maybe I'm betraying a confidence, but. Our first live tour, Chester took some because he wasn't loving how he.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, yeah. Because he'd get up there.

[Phil]

I was.

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Like.

[Spencer Newhall]

Like two shows into the tour, he just got some beta blockers, and that was what he wrote. Those the rest of the tour.

[Cal]

God, Rock and roll.

[Steven Rinella]

I mean, if they were like. Let's say you're. If they were so instant, you know what? It'd be like you'd tie off with some surgical tubing and have, like, a needle and shit. And then you look, and here comes Buck down the trail. If you could just be like, mainline it. And just like, instant beta block. But what are you supposed to do every day? Pop one at, like, 3pm Just on opener?

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

You know, I mean.

[Cal]

Oh, my God. It's just part of my process.

[Steven Rinella]

IV bag hanging next to you in a tree.

[Cal]

Yeah. You'd have your shut off valve, your ozone machine, your, your IV drip.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's right.

[Steven Rinella]

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[Spencer Newhall]

All right, we're going to move on with the show. Do our first interview. Joining us on the line now is Sean Conrad. Him and his twin brother adam have caught 14 world record fish. Sean, welcome to the show.

[Steven Rinella]

How is that possible?

[Spencer Newhall]

We're going to find out.

[Cal]

How's it going?

[Spencer Newhall]

Sean, you currently hold the world record for rainbow trout and burbit. Now I want to hear both those fishing stories. But first let's start with the burbit world record you set on March 27, 2010. Take us back to that day.

[Sean Conrad]

Well, it actually started two months beforehand where actually guy caught and released that same fish and didn't realize it was world record. So once Adam and I saw that he had weighted just under 25 pounds, I think he thought the world record was 28. So obviously my brother and I, every weekend I lived in Alberta, I would travel to Saskatchewan every weekend I could until we caught that fish.

[Steven Rinella]

You guys were targeting it like you're targeting a specific fish.

[Sean Conrad]

Yes, because it had like certain marks on it. It was in a certain area. We had probably caught over a hundred burbot in about a month and a half and then slept in my truck on the 26th and woke up at 8 in the morning and went back fishing and caught him at 10 o' clock in the morning.

[Steven Rinella]

Wow.

[Spencer Newhall]

What, what secrets can you tell us about catching that fish as far as bait you were using, areas you were targeting, stuff like that.

[Sean Conrad]

We usually target them in like drop offs and, and holes but we use bait on bottom, Cisco's herring, smelts, whatever you have at the time. And you literally just bait and wait for those fish. And we tried, you know, we would try like four or five different areas and we actually caught that fish in an area that we Never really started bourbon fishing then and now. That's one of our favorite spots.

[Steven Rinella]

Do you set. Are you setting tip ups or rod and.

[Sean Conrad]

Well, this was actually open water in flowing water in a river in March.

[Steven Rinella]

I see. Okay.

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Sean, do you get any kind of buck fever when you're reeling in one of these giant fish that may or may not be the next world record?

[Sean Conrad]

I remember hooking that fish, and I had thrown my rod out, and I was eating a sandwich when you catch a fish, and my rod just kept bouncing like in the current. And I'm like, why is it bouncing? Why is it not stopping? And that fish must have ate it on the drop or when it just got there. And then I knew when I was really. And I saw. Got me pretty nervous. I knew I had the world record on and got it in the net and I just had a big sigh of relief. And actually, the guy that had caught that fish two months ago was on shore and he asked me how it wasn't like, well, we got. We got the fish we were after. And he's like, no way.

[Cal]

That is amazing.

[Steven Rinella]

Are you bank fishing or fishing in a boat?

[Sean Conrad]

This was. This picture was taken on a bank, but we were in a boat.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah.

[Cal]

Okay.

[Steven Rinella]

That's what's confusing.

[Spencer Newhall]

We are looking at a picture of that world record bourbon right now. Now, I noticed that all of your burbot records are from March. What is it about that month that makes burbot fishing so good?

[Sean Conrad]

March is when they start to spawn. They're at their fattest with the eggs. If you can get those fish before they spawn out, they're the heaviest they'll ever be. And they start congregating in March. In certain areas, you'll get 90% of the fish in like a 5% area of the lake. And then you could just target and catch quite a bit more. And you just keep weed throughing them until you get your big one. Wow.

[Steven Rinella]

Do you guys eat bourbon?

[Sean Conrad]

Yes. Delicious. The five to ten pounders are our favorite.

[Steven Rinella]

Got it.

[Sean Conrad]

You just get. You don't get as much meat as you would off a walleye, but you get the back straps, tail meat. If they're big enough, you can take the belly meat. So they're delicious.

[Cal]

Yeah, that belly meat's pretty fantastic. You fry that stuff?

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah. Cut it in strips, kind of like calamari. It's. It's firm and it. You could cook it any way you like. It's delicious.

[Cal]

Heck, yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Do you get any by catch when you're targeting these giant Bourbon.

[Sean Conrad]

Yes. Walleye, whitefish and rainbows. Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Can I ask you, I got a Burbit question for you. I'd love to just ask a question.

[Spencer Newhall]

Go for it.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Why he's here.

[Steven Rinella]

My birthday is on February 13th.

[Sean Conrad]

Yes.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay. So we go to we for a few years on my birthday we would go set tip ups through the ice for bourbon. One year on my birthday we go out. I can't remember. We catch 24 bourbon. A big group of people. We catch 24 bourbon. Yeah. Next year, 2-13-0. The next year, 2-13-0. Fishing the same stuff. What is your take on that? This is a big reservoir.

[Sean Conrad]

So usually Burbot will spawn in different areas of the lake. And every year is a bit different. And actually some years it's actually tough for us to target them in, in March because they're all, they all moved.

[Steven Rinella]

So they're all somewhere and not where you are.

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah, you gotta find them. And that's Adam and I. We guide and we have to be on fish and we have to consistently move. We notice if we fish a spot one day, the next day it's not good. So we have to consistently move. So I feel like in your situation.

[Steven Rinella]

We were fishing for last year's fish, man.

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah. And that's the same thing. And you're, you're always fishing the same numbers where Adam and I were. Always learning, always moving.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, good advice.

[Sean Conrad]

I feel like that's what happened.

[Spencer Newhall]

You also have the world record rainbow trout that you caught on September 5, 2009. Tell us about that.

[Sean Conrad]

Catch the wrong picture. I lived in that's a big brown from obed, but.

[Cal]

Giant laker.

[Steven Rinella]

Come on, Phil, get the right damn fish up there, man. They weren't labeled. He's got his head thinking about are.

[Cal]

You just trying to make friends with this guy?

[Steven Rinella]

We are wrong fish.

[Spencer Newhall]

We're gushing over other big fish pictures that Sean has. Phil is going to go back to picture two and that will be the record. There it is. Go ahead, Sean, tell us about that fish.

[Sean Conrad]

I just quit work Friday. I took my daughter, I believe she was 2 or 3 and drove to my parents house in Saskatoon. Got her to sleep around 8:30 and then I took off around 9. We fish at, at dark for these rainbows. Met my brother and we fished. We caught, you know, we were trolling. We caught a big like 8 pound walleye. We had caught like an 8 pound rainbow before that. And then noon or midnight came. Then we caught, I hooked this big fish and I knew it was big because the Big ones, they just, they start rolling behind the boat and then you just can't move them. So you just hold the, hold the line tight and yeah, like netted it. We're just like, well, we better weigh this thing because we are filling our biggest net up with this fish. Wow.

[Spencer Newhall]

The world record burbit you knew was in those waters. Did you know the next world record rainbow was swimming there as well?

[Sean Conrad]

No. We were guiding hard. In 2009, right before we caught this fish, we stopped guiding. We had caught that year, I think three other or four other 40 pound rainbow.

[Cal]

Was that real?

[Sean Conrad]

That was the year of the Giants, 2009. And then we just went out after guiding this man, we were done and just, yeah, we knew there was giants that year. So we just fished hard and yeah, broke my brother's world record.

[Spencer Newhall]

Now, now 10 of these world records have been line class world record. Explain what that means to folks who aren't familiar with the International Game Fish association record keeping.

[Sean Conrad]

So IGFA has different world records. The first world record Adam and I broke, we had caught a 33 pound rainbow on 12 pound. I believe it was 12 pound test. And we knew that there were different world records. So if you caught a fish that was, you know, let's say 30 pounds on six pound test, you could look up to see if that is the heaviest fish of that species on a certain line. So. And then you can register. But I believe you have to be a member to do that. Just to see what they have for weights in line. And so there's different types of world records. There's line classes and then there's all tackles. So our first one was a 33 pound line class world record. Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Do you have any all tackle records?

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah, that's the rainbow and the bourbon.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, those are all tackles he has.

[Spencer Newhall]

Both of those are like the biggest.

[Sean Conrad]

In the world ever recorded.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh man. Are there any other dudes, where do you sit in terms of in freshwater at least? Like are there a lot of dudes that have a handful, like, you know, I mean, is it like the kind of thing where there's certain guys that are filling that slot again and again?

[Sean Conrad]

Adam and I, our goal was to get every line class world record rainbow. So we would specifically school our lines. I think it was called P line. We would buy P line.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Sean Conrad]

And we would buy like 12 pound and we would just spool that rod and reel. 12 pound P line. Because then when you do catch a line class world record, you got to send your line in for break. Testing. And if it breaks higher, then you're bumped into a different category.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, Like, I feel like Maxim is that way.

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah. So we have to buy spec, and we have to buy a specific weigh scale, and then we have to get the fish weighed properly. If it was a world record, take it in and get certified with a biologist and stuff. So there's a. There's a bit to it.

[Steven Rinella]

God, you guys make me feel like I've wasted my life.

[Cal]

Dude, you and your brother putting the pro. Unprofessional right there, man. Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

You and your brother have broken each other's records. When that happens, are you happy for each other, or is it really competitive for you, too?

[Sean Conrad]

No, we love to bump questions off each other and techniques, and we're always learning. If we go to a lake and we get skunked, why did we get skunked? What did we do wrong? How should we change our techniques? What should we do different? What areas are, like, time of day? It's just like deer hunting. When is that buck coming out? You know, is it coming out in the morning or evening? And where is it? You got it. You got to learn and technique. So fishing is what Adam and I do. We bump stuff off each other, and then we learn. So we're always. We're not competitive when it comes to that.

[Cal]

But you do call your brother and be like, hey, you know that walleye you were really proud of? It's not so big anymore. Right. Stuff like that.

[Sean Conrad]

I. I think when I caught the burbit, I was. Adam was a little bit jealous because, you know, I had caught the rainbow, and now I caught the burbit, and then I caught a great big brown trout after that. And he was like, why are you catching all the big fish? I'm like, well, I don't. I don't mind.

[Steven Rinella]

Are you married?

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Sean Conrad]

No, I'm not.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay.

[Sean Conrad]

No, my brother is.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah. What was going to be your response if you said yes?

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, just if his wife.

[Cal]

Are you talking trophy class of wife?

[Steven Rinella]

No, no, no, no. Like, if his wife. If she. If she. If she sees a big burbit, does she know enough to. To. To know she's looking at a big bourbon? Meaning if we. We come home and show, you know, we'll be. We'll come home and show my wife stuff. And she's like, if you say so. It looks a lot like the other ones. I don't know. It's a lot like the other ones you guys brought home.

[Spencer Newhall]

Sean, all of your world record rainbows and Burbot have come from Lake Diefenbacher in Saskatchewan. What is it about that water that allows it to produce such big fish?

[Sean Conrad]

For one, it's a damned reservoir loaded with ciscos. It's just they have so many ciscos in the lake, so it's got good forage.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay.

[Sean Conrad]

We catch. We caught a 40 inch burbot guiding last year in the. Up in the lake. And when I say the lake, we're actually targeting a lot of these world records down below the dam where these ciscos come through the dam and they get chopped up. So these fish are just chowing down and they're getting huge.

[Steven Rinella]

Is that, is that true? I've read that before. But is that true that fish coming through those turbines are actually chopped up? They're not just shoved through it?

[Sean Conrad]

Yes, it depends what turbine and where it is. But the ones we're seeing are getting chopped up, you know, and then they.

[Steven Rinella]

Just sink down and then just coming out like chum.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Sean Conrad]

You know, and then just these fish just get so big they get to world record size.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Give some advice to listeners who want to target really, really big rainbows and burbits.

[Sean Conrad]

Like you do your research. Honestly, it's honestly the same as deer hunting. You have to know what lake produces big fish. Adam and I, we would see an article of a big fish being caught.

[Cal]

We.

[Sean Conrad]

It was Montana, I think a 30, 33 pound rainbow was caught there.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, right. Yeah, down there.

[Sean Conrad]

And Adam and I went and we caught a 33 inch rainbow. Like our first time. It was like almost near 20 pounds, you know. So certain systems produce big fish. So do your research and then figure out your techniques and learn. Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Do you have a white whale? Is there a world record that you're pursuing right now?

[Sean Conrad]

I was targeting the actual. Another world record bourbon. I was trying to break it and I had caught. I was doing on video and I caught a 22 pounder two years ago. It was three pounds under. My world record bourbon. This was actually an Alberta lake that was producing some giant burbot. So as for targeting world record, I think it's the brown trout. Because right now Adam and I are actually targeting a world record brown trout. And they're tough, but we see some brown trout that are rising that are in that 30 plus to 40 pound range.

[Cal]

Unreal.

[Spencer Newhall]

When you break that record, you come back on this show and tell us that story.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Sean Conrad]

Steve Brown Trout now.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah.

[Cal]

Sean, you want to know my claim to fame up in that country?

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah, tell me.

[Cal]

I got offered a bartending Job there in Riverhurst one year.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh yeah, yeah.

[Sean Conrad]

That's where we died out of around there.

[Spencer Newhall]

They kind of offer those jobs to everyone though.

[Cal]

Not every Yankee who comes through the door gets a bartender job in Saskatchewan.

[Steven Rinella]

But yeah, Kel brags about getting. Brags about getting offered bartending jobs.

[Cal]

Hey, I was a hit with the locals. We used to go up there and, and hunt ducks every year. Got, got some friends that live in town and had a place to crash. It was everything you needed when you had little bird dogs to run with. So.

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Can I ask one last question? All right. Let's just say a fell is just looking out, you know, just to catch filet sized bourbon.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Through the ice. Do you like, Are you laying like. Let me tell you what we do and you tell me where I'm wrong. We run tip ups with braid down to a floral leader, a small treble in cut bait, land on the bottom. Where do you not like? What do you not like?

[Sean Conrad]

That's perfect. And then fish into the night. And then your second line, you would be hitting bottom, pounding bottom with some kind of a glow. Glow tube with bait. Okay.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Sean Conrad]

And lay it on bottom. Now find your depth too. Put your tip up in, I would say 15 to 20ft.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay.

[Sean Conrad]

And maybe set up your shack in about 25ft in February. And then also if you're not catching, then go deeper, go up, do to 20, 35ft to 40ft. Those burbot will be all over the place.

[Cal]

So interesting.

[Sean Conrad]

And then.

[Cal]

And you like the tubes, huh?

[Sean Conrad]

Off the lake? Yeah. So go ahead.

[Cal]

Sorry. You like the tubes, huh?

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah. Tube jigs work? Yeah, absolutely. We love tubes. But also, you know, we'll use heavier, heavier jigs with heavier heads, maybe that glow. And then you put, put your bait on there and you really want to hit bottom hard. You want that thunk, you know, and just consistently do that. And it's kind of like, just like bringing them in, making noise down there on the bottom. It just seems to work.

[Ryan Callahan]

Cool. Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Sean, last thing. Tell folks about the guiding service that you and your brother own.

[Sean Conrad]

We're fishing geeks here. We guide Lake Diefenbaker. We've been guiding full time since 2018, part time, since 2008. So. And this is our job. Just take, take people out fishing and hopefully catch them the fish of their dreams.

[Spencer Newhall]

You guys have quite the resume to convince folks to fish.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh yeah, man. Thanks for coming on. Appreciate the information.

[Spencer Newhall]

Thanks for joining us. Good luck with your world record brown trout.

[Sean Conrad]

We'll try.

[Cal]

That's Amazing.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah. To be clear, he has caught the biggest rainbow and the biggest burbit in the world. Those are two of his 14 records. The other 12 are the line class records we talked about.

[Steven Rinella]

To be frank with you, I. I respect that burbit one, but more.

[Sean Conrad]

Oh.

[Spencer Newhall]

Oh, yeah. Well, that thing was so cool.

[Steven Rinella]

That looked like something you drug out of a cave in the ocean, man.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right, let's take a break for some listener feedback. Phil, what's the chat have to say?

[Phil]

Yeah, let's see here. Well, back we were talking about Randall taking time off and Corinne as well. Nick is asking, do meat eater employees need to take PTO to go hunt or is that just a perk of the job?

[Steven Rinella]

I have no idea.

[Cal]

Well, yes, Bill, what do you do when you.

[Spencer Newhall]

When you hunting PTO or.

[Phil]

No, of course, I'm a company man. I let my manager know and she in turn lets her manager know. And you know, it's recorded the eyes across the T's.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, let's take a little pto.

[Phil]

Oh, yeah, but that was to go to Portland just to hang out. I didn't do any hunting.

[Steven Rinella]

No, I just noticed you had a little PTO thing on your email there. Oh, that was cute.

[Cal]

Paying attention.

[Spencer Newhall]

We do some stuff like a normal office. We block off our calendars, we write emails, tell folks we're going to be out of the office hunting. So yeah, it happens.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, can you take that leopard shark one?

[Phil]

That was going to be my next one. Here he goes. From Will. Question for the crew. I just got back from diving in California. Saw a bunch of leopard sharks. I read that they are good eating. Have any of you harvested shark with a spear? Is it good eating?

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, spear, no. Rod and reel, yes. And man, you got to trim them sharks. Anything you got to trim the fat off, you got to trim the, you know, the. The purple. Hell, I'm trying to say bloodline type, bloodline stuff. There's a layer that sits between the meat and the skin. If you trim it up, it's good. If you don't trim it up, you are in for a bad meal. He spilled bunch wrong.

[Cal]

But I've had a lot of shark, fresh shark that I think is fantastic eating. But yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, you got to trim it. You got to trim it as bad as you got to trim a flathead catfish or is good, whatever. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, this is as essential.

[Spencer Newhall]

What else you got, Phil?

[Phil]

This is from Leland. Howdy. Is there any idea of doing a meat eater history book on the French Cour du Bois or the Voyageurs. I don't know if you've looked into that for that French stuff, for your history, Steve, at all. Does that pique your interest?

[Steven Rinella]

I think that we will maybe. I think that we will get to that with our American history series. Yes. Great. Even though it's Canadian history. So that's what makes it a little bit tricky. That's what makes a little bit tricky. In every one of the series, we talk about what's going on north of the border, and we. We throw to those guys in both the mountain men and the hide hunters, but never dove in. But when I was a little boy growing up in Michigan, you would study those guys. They would teach you that stuff in Michigan history.

[Cal]

Oh, yeah, this is.

[Phil]

Oh, this is another one from Will. I have found that when I am on long hikes or hunts, I almost always get a song stuck in my head. Usually ramble on by Zeppelin. How do you guys pass the time mentally on long hikes? What's running through the noodle?

[Spencer Newhall]

We talked about this briefly yesterday. Randall said that he just. He really hates himself. So when he spends time alone, you know, he just sits there thinking about the things he doesn't like about Randall. So that's what I'm answering for Randall there.

[Steven Rinella]

I think about what I do like about Randall. Oh, that's how I pass my time.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, that's what I'll think about this week.

[Cal]

I. I think songs are great. I definitely do some singing to myself and by proxy, whoever's around me. I packed out a full mule deer, boned out mule deer up a very, very steep slope and just found like, I was never, ever gonna get to the top of the ridge if I stopped. Because stopping can kind of become an addiction where you're like, well, I'm get up to here and stop. I'm gonna get up to here and stop. And so I made up, like, a very, oh, theatrical song. One man play Phil, of getting the buck to the top of the mountain.

[Spencer Newhall]

Oh, did you perform this?

[Cal]

It was basically like, how do you get a buck to the top of a mountain? And then you can kind of. Any other verse you come up with. Okay, don't stop.

[Spencer Newhall]

I'm going to use that.

[Cal]

Yeah, yeah.

[Phil]

This is from Mogul.

[Steven Rinella]

Mogul.

[Phil]

I also, I saw your message earlier about sending us your address for those cookbooks you won last week. Don't worry, Mogur. We will get you your cookbooks. I'll make sure that somebody saw that email. But your question is for Cal. How much Will your new CEO role at BHA affect your appearances on the shows? I hope you still drop in from time to time.

[Cal]

Yeah, I mean, that's the plan. I. Obviously this is like a huge challenge and it's new and I have a giant learning curve, so time is going to be a factor. But no one, no intent to drop off the face of the. The world, the meat eater world over here. And I'll still be weekly host on the, the podcast too.

[Steven Rinella]

So I, I would like to. I'll touch on that because I would like to be able to be Cal's. You know, I would like to be able to be a great place for Cal to come tell folks what. What he's doing in his new role and what his priorities are in his new role. So invitation stands. So if he doesn't come out, it's not my fault.

[Spencer Newhall]

Phil, let's do one more clear.

[Phil]

This is from Friday Arrows. Phil, when will we get an animated version of your Dungeons and Dragons episode? Wow, that's a great question. That would be a dream. I don't know if Steve, your, your, your American history guy will also work on the D and D episode that I did, but I love someone who can capture just the look of bewilderment on Cal's face at every turn. Or maybe Brody decapitating the cat with a sword. That would be fun.

[Spencer Newhall]

So Steve has to decide.

[Cal]

Well, Snort's in there, so that'd be great.

[Phil]

Steve, I don't think you're aware that I guest hosted trivia, and instead of playing a game of trivia, I played a game of Dungeons and Dragons with the crew.

[Steven Rinella]

I've heard about that, but I don't know what that means, though.

[Spencer Newhall]

Explain it to you?

[Phil]

You can watch it at some point, or don't you know? It's up to you.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right, our next segment.

[Steven Rinella]

Did it perform well?

[Spencer Newhall]

It did pretty well. It crushed on YouTube, like, our best trivia of the year, I think.

[Steven Rinella]

Congratulations.

[Phil]

It was fun.

[Steven Rinella]

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[Steven Rinella]

You'Re in the backcountry, don't forget your own backcountry. Keep it pristine and confidently clean by bringing along wet extra large dude wipes. I'm I'm glad to be doing dude wipe ads because I buy dude wipes anyways. I've been a long time dude wipe. I'm a dude wipe dude all the time. Just like your truck gets muddy out in the wild soaking your butt. You never clean your vehicle with dry paper towels so why would you clean your butt with dry toilet paper? Wetter cleans better so ditch the itch and switch from TP to wet extra large dude wipes. Love them. Like going on a ten day moose hunt. I just bring a pack along. Not only that, so they're extra large. Okay, if you're a little baby you get little baby wipes. If you're a man you get extra large dude wipes. And when you're out in nature it's going to inevitably call. So make sure you bring along wet dude wipes and three adventure sizes like day hike single wipes, 18 pack weekend wipers or you know for long trips, you got a 48 count pack. And it's not just that. Like, when you're out camping, just sleeping in a sleeping bag, let's say you're gone for 10 days, whatever. I use them just to clean up at night, like, you know, scrub the old pit, scrub your arms if it's all dusty. Just kind of get your neck and everything cleaned up. I love having them with me. Dude Wipes. It is the best clean Pants down. They're available at Amazon. That's where I usually order mine from. Zon Amazon. But you get them at Walmart nationwide. Fantastic product. Proud to be doing ads for these boys at Dude Wipes.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right, our next segment is brought to you by case knives. Handcrafting high quality knives since 1889. Check them [e-mail]. all right, this is the Price is Right.

[Steven Rinella]

Here it comes from Bozeman, Montana.

[Phil]

Meat eater radio's most exciting 10 minutes. It's the Price is Right.

[Cal]

Steven Runella, come on down.

[Ryan Callahan]

Hey.

[Spencer Newhall]

His first time on the show.

[Phil]

Ryan Callahan, come on down. You're the next two contestants on Meteor radios.

[Cal]

The Price Is Right.

[Spencer Newhall]

Here we go.

[Cal]

Now.

[Phil]

Here's your host, Spencer Newhall.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right.

[Sean Conrad]

Wow, that was great.

[Spencer Newhall]

Thank you.

[Steve Powell]

Phil.

[Steven Rinella]

Did you watch that documentary about that show?

[Phil]

No, I didn't even know there was one.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yes, I did.

[Steven Rinella]

Well, the guys that gamed it.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yes. But by gaming it, they just, like, knew the answers.

[Steven Rinella]

No, they. They gamed it by, like, like a sort of memorization experts who got into sort of. Who got into these, like, catalogs of MSRP pricing.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

And were able to commit thousands and thousands and thousands of prices to.

[Cal]

Yeah. Because there's like, some trends in there, too.

[Phil]

And.

[Cal]

Yeah, that. That was. But yeah, I think the, the beef was like, you guys are ruining the show. By being too good.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

By memorizing it all.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Point being, they get in there that they. When all the people are waiting in line to come in, this kind of surprised me. They have these sort of profilers.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

That go outside and just hang around the line. And they're just watching how people interact. Conversations. They kind of get some interactions going and they're just in their head going like, he'd be good.

[Spencer Newhall]

Sure.

[Steven Rinella]

He wouldn't be good. He'd be good. He wouldn't be good. And they knew how to get selected.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

They would. They would dress.

[Cal]

That's right.

[Steven Rinella]

In a certain way to be noticed, but not noticed in the wrong way. And they would, like, they knew who they were looking for. To engage with.

[Spencer Newhall]

But then I think they had to like they knew those people. So they had to, those people had to start bringing guests who they hoped would get picked. And then the, the like real brains of the operation was in the audience somewhere giving clues by coughing.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, you're right.

[Spencer Newhall]

And, and you know you're right. Like, oh yeah, he would be like.

[Steven Rinella]

Because you know that's. The audience can YELL Yes, a dollar 29. Yeah, well he would look and there's this guy going $29.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're talking about picking those people out of the documentary.

[Cal]

Famous. He became famous in the audience. And so people would be like, let's see what Bill has to say.

[Spencer Newhall]

You hope you're playing on a day when Bill is there.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. What's the documentary called, Bill?

[Phil]

Well, I told you I haven't seen it.

[Spencer Newhall]

There was some real sad part of that documentary though where Bob Barker just looked older.

[Phil]

It's called Earth Perfect Bid. The contestant who knew too much.

[Cal]

Yeah, I think we all know it because it was featured on Delta, Delta Airlines. So that's.

[Spencer Newhall]

You were talking about picking people out of the line. A very proud, vain moment for me was my wife and I were in New York City. We went to a taping of Stephen Colbert in 2018. And when you're coming in, they just like have ushers that seat you somewhere and, and if you're, you know, the attractive couple, they'll put you up front. And so they pulled us from the back and put us at the front.

[Steven Rinella]

Because you're so good looking.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah. So we could be seen in the audience and like people would feel like.

[Steven Rinella]

They'Re watching the right show.

[Spencer Newhall]

Exactly.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

We're just like setting the mood for the show.

[Steven Rinella]

If that attractive man likes to show, then I must be on to the good right thing.

[Cal]

Yeah, Cool. Kids club.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right, Cal, Steve, grab your whiteboards. This game is real simple. Phil is going to tell you about a product from the meat eater universe. And you need to guess its price. The player with the closest answer without going over will be declared the winner. If both players go over, then you'll both be told to try again.

[Steven Rinella]

I'm never gonna win this.

[Spencer Newhall]

And the chat should play along as well because whoever has the closest answer to the correct answer will get a shout out from Phil. Alright, there are three products up for bid today. Phil, get us started.

[Phil]

Well, our first item up for bid today is the hunter's specialties. Butt out two.

[Steven Rinella]

I know that tool.

[Phil]

Now we know you're probably saying to yourself, but self The Butt out one was perfect. What could they possibly improve on? Well, the betout 2 has an extra 2 inches of handle that creates the patented butt stop to give you better grip and control of the tool. It's never been easier to remove the anal canal of a whitetail, antelope, bear or hog. And Hunter specialty says it's made out of sturdy plastic that can withstand repeated use. So you can hand this heirloom down to the next generation of deer gutters.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's what Steve is planning to do.

[Steven Rinella]

I can show you a thing or two where you don't need that thing.

[Spencer Newhall]

Now on Amazon, it has 4.7 stars from over 4,000 reviews. Phil is showing us pictures of the Budout 2 right there. And here is the butt out one. You can see where they change the design to give you that special butt stop with a little extra plastic.

[Steven Rinella]

Can you show me the butt stop again?

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay, this is Butt out one that you're looking at. And we'll get it Butt out two in a second.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, I got it. Yeah, sure.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's a big improvement for Butt out two.

[Steven Rinella]

And we're trying to figure out what that Butt Out 2 is gonna run you.

[Spencer Newhall]

What does that cost? And if you go over, you're just out of the game. Almost both of you go over. So Steven Cow will come up their price. Now I can't even fathom what they'll do for Butt out three. What, what could they possibly come up with next?

[Steven Rinella]

A real sharp knife.

[Cal]

I like how on the description it's like, here's these animals it could work with. And it's like. Or anything with an anus.

[Spencer Newhall]

It does say any big game sized animal. Yeah. Which is, which is pretty vague. Now this, this is the price from Hunter specialties you got.

[Steven Rinella]

You can't do that because all kinds of dudes are putting down what they think it is.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, they're playing along as well. Yeah, it's just we trust that you're honest and.

[Steven Rinella]

Well, I already wrote mine down.

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay.

[Steve Powell]

Yep.

[Spencer Newhall]

Cal, you go ahead and reveal your answers. We have Cal saying 22.99 and Steve says $12. The correct answer is lower than both of those. So we're both going to try again. Come up with a new price. It is less than $12. Steve's guess was 12. We know it's less than that. Both of you come up with the new answer and try.

[Phil]

That's stupid.

[Steven Rinella]

Why not just have it be who's closest?

[Spencer Newhall]

We're playing the prices, right? You gotta argue with the prices.

[Steven Rinella]

Well, Just cause someone does something dumb doesn't mean YouTube.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right, we have Steve who now says $11 and Cal says 6.99. The correct answer is $11.99. Steve was only a penny off with his first guess. But these rules, Steve. So you were. You were one.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, but I don't. I wouldn't pay any attention to what they do.

[Cal]

I. I will tell you though, Steve. Steve deserves a little accolades here. That's the first. I think that is the first price is right answer I've been wrong on.

[Spencer Newhall]

Cal is dominant at this game. Steve, just so you know, you're going up against, you know, the Michael Jordan of meat eaters. Price.

[Steven Rinella]

I had a conversation. Cal was. Or not Cal. Clay was shaming me about this.

[Spencer Newhall]

About what?

[Steven Rinella]

Clay was shaming me about not knowing the eggs had gone up in price. I'm like, I don't. If I go to buy eggs, I'm just going to get the eggs. Jimmy. I don't go like, am I going to buy eggs or not? Like, when I wake up and I say to my little boy, what do you want for breakfast? Eggs. I'm just going to buy eggs. So I don't go and see. It's just not going to matter. I'm still going to buy the.

[Phil]

Topic on the. During the last game before that. Oh, it was okay.

[Steven Rinella]

This is before that.

[Spencer Newhall]

So 11.99. That is from Hunter Specialty's website.

[Steven Rinella]

So if I needed this butt remover, you're just gonna probably be like, I'm just gonna get the butt remover.

[Spencer Newhall]

It is on sale at Shields right now for 7.99.

[Phil]

Wow.

[Spencer Newhall]

So if you're in the market for a butt out too, check out Shields.

[Phil]

Yeah, and we have a handful of people. Guess right on the money.

[Cal]

They're online.

[Steven Rinella]

They're online.

[Phil]

We've run into that problem before, Steve. I've called people out and they've been very defensive about how guilty people always are.

[Spencer Newhall]

Nate, JH and gone fishing. Duncan.

[Steve Powell]

Maybe.

[Phil]

Maybe a few more too, but those.

[Spencer Newhall]

Are the ones I saw suspicious. All right, Phil, what do we got next?

[Phil]

Oh, great question. Our next item up for bid is your very own colony of taxidermy beetles.

[Sean Conrad]

Wow.

[Cal]

Sick.

[Phil]

This dermisted beetle super kit from Skull Taxidermy comes with over 2000 bugs that are shipped right to your front door. They guarantee a mix of adults, larvae and pupae pupa that will have you cleaning skulls and jet last three to four weeks. The super kit also includes plenty of bedding for laying eggs, as well as two pages of instructions on how to care for your beetles.

[Spencer Newhall]

Thank you, Phil. Now, to be clear, you're paying for the super beetle kit plus shipping from Deer Lodge, Montana. These are going to come.

[Steven Rinella]

Whose idea was it to include this?

[Spencer Newhall]

Me.

[Steven Rinella]

These are all great idea. Hey, I saw a question about skunk spraying. Can you hang on to that one for later?

[Phil]

Yeah, I've got it bookmarked.

[Spencer Newhall]

So what?

[Steven Rinella]

That was a great. That was a great. That was a great call.

[Spencer Newhall]

Thank you.

[Steven Rinella]

I have no idea.

[Cal]

I have no. No clue.

[Spencer Newhall]

You're getting 2,000 bugs, and they guarantee a mix of adults, larva and pupa.

[Cal]

Wow.

[Spencer Newhall]

In that 2000 bug mix.

[Steven Rinella]

That's a great question.

[Spencer Newhall]

In three to four weeks, you're gonna be cleaning your first skull.

[Steven Rinella]

I have no idea.

[Spencer Newhall]

And this is a flat shipping rate. It's just convenient that it's coming from Deer Lodge. But their website says it's called the same if you're shipping to Georgia.

[Steven Rinella]

I don't like all these guys writing numbers down on that thing.

[Spencer Newhall]

You've already locked in your answer.

[Steven Rinella]

I know. I just wish they'd just keep it to themselves.

[Spencer Newhall]

Cal, are you ready? Reveal your answers. Cal says it's 41. Steve says it's $120.

[Cal]

That's a spread.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, it is.

[Spencer Newhall]

Is $246.50. So Steve was the closest, and he was only halfway there.

[Cal]

See?

[Steven Rinella]

How do you put a price on that?

[Spencer Newhall]

I mean, these folks did well.

[Steven Rinella]

I know they did. But picture, like, what he's got to have going on to be able to have that. You know what I'm saying? It's a lot. That's what I'm saying. I could never guess because, like, the amount of headache. And that might just be a side hustle, like the prop, you know they're cleaning.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's right.

[Steven Rinella]

And they got excess. And I don't know, it's probably name your price because there's probably not much competition.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's $230 for the Beatles and 16.50 for shipping. And good.

[Sean Conrad]

That's a great.

[Phil]

We have Friday, Friday Arrows guess 2:30 in the chat.

[Spencer Newhall]

Well done. Friday, ARR. Steve has now officially won the game. But we'll see if you can get the Clean Sweep. We've got a third product, so we'll see if you can get the Clean Sweep. And make Cal run around the building naked, as is tradition. Bill, what's the third item?

[Cal]

Lucky employees.

[Phil]

Our final item up for bid today is a signed photo of Steven Rinella. This 8 by 10 photo of a handsome Young Steven is for sale on ebay right now.

[Cal]

Do you not remember that?

[Steven Rinella]

I do, but how's he have that?

[Phil]

He's standing up a stump, staring off into the distance.

[Steven Rinella]

Magazine, Men's journal or something. It's probably Cal's bow with his transbow in hand. That's not mine. It's Cal's BO.

[Spencer Newhall]

I had no idea that was good.

[Steven Rinella]

Obviously, Steve's actually my signature.

[Phil]

Well, let's see here. The seller guarantees it's the real deal because the signature has been verified by Beckett Authentication Services.

[Steven Rinella]

I would have verified just smudges.

[Spencer Newhall]

Does that look like your signature?

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Cal]

Who would have that picture?

[Spencer Newhall]

Someone on ebay.

[Steven Rinella]

Why do you gotta have this?

[Spencer Newhall]

We put Steve in a real pickle here, making him guess what his autograph is.

[Steven Rinella]

I don't.

[Cal]

They found. They brought out Dude. Come on, kids. Medium black T shirts for this shoot. And I was like. Without his belly button getting exposed. It was brutal.

[Spencer Newhall]

And standing on a stump, that's. That's a nice little touch. When was this photo taken?

[Phil]

We got a lot of jokers in the chat, guessing stuff like. Like five cents. One dollar.

[Steven Rinella]

That's what I wrote down.

[Cal]

If somebody put it on ebay.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's right. This is for sale on ebay right now. So if you'd like the price when we reveal.

[Steven Rinella]

I think that was the weekend Cal's dog passed away.

[Cal]

No, no, no. This wasn't. The big fish was. Your oldest boy was just a baby. I mean, he was under five.

[Steven Rinella]

That's not the same time.

[Cal]

No.

[Spencer Newhall]

How many years ago was this?

[Steven Rinella]

I have.

[Phil]

No.

[Cal]

Long time ago. But I was. I was entertaining Steve's kid by letting him shoot arrows up into the sky. I'd hold on to the bow.

[Spencer Newhall]

Oh.

[Cal]

And he'd crank that thing back and let it go. And we'd watch that every morning.

[Spencer Newhall]

Very safe activity. When I picked this item, I had no idea that was.

[Steven Rinella]

Did you buy that?

[Spencer Newhall]

No, I have not bought it.

[Steven Rinella]

Dude, listen.

[Spencer Newhall]

I bet by time this episode's over, that thing's off ebay. Someone's purchased it.

[Steven Rinella]

I'll send you one.

[Cal]

I did.

[Spencer Newhall]

Do you have a price? Go ahead and reveal your answers. Cal says $50. Steve says $1. The correct answer is $85. 85. That could be yours. It's free shipping or best offer. It says.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh.

[Spencer Newhall]

So if you're in the market for.

[Cal]

Steve, I love you, Steve.

[Spencer Newhall]

Maybe try to low ball them before you pay for.

[Phil]

We had a couple people get it right on the money, but Garrett got in pretty quickly, and he guessed $84.99. So I think he's being truthful. But then we had Big Doe pipe in and says $85, I just bought it.

[Spencer Newhall]

Oh, well done, Big Doe. I'm gonna verify that. I'm gonna go look on ebay and see if that's still for sale.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, if you bought it, I'll send him another one.

[Spencer Newhall]

This seller has all kinds of autographed photos up for sale. I found some comparisons if you're interested, Steve. So the first one here, if you've got $65 to spend, you can buy a signed picture of Playboy bunny, Sierra Price.

[Steven Rinella]

Why is it blurred out?

[Spencer Newhall]

Well, because it's kind of scandalous. It's a Playboy bunny whose photo you're buying.

[Cal]

Nobody's asking whether or not the signature is real. I noticed.

[Spencer Newhall]

Uh huh. So that's, that's if you got $65. If you got $85, you can buy a signed picture of Kane Hodder, who of course played Jason Voorhees from the Friday the 13th movie. So that's the same price as Steve's signature. Now if you got real deep pockets, you're looking to spend $115, you can buy an autographed photo of rock and roll hall of famer Don McLean, who wrote the world's greatest song, American Pie. So $20 more than your autograph. Steve. Don McLean.

[Steve Powell]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

What is the objective here?

[Cal]

Just to put you in your class.

[Spencer Newhall]

We're just having fun, that's all.

[Cal]

This is where you rank your celebrity.

[Spencer Newhall]

Is between Playboy and Don McLean.

[Phil]

That's a pretty good place.

[Steven Rinella]

Someone's like, how famous? I'll tell you exactly how.

[Spencer Newhall]

Let's go to ebay.

[Cal]

You ever heard of Don McLean?

[Steven Rinella]

I'm not quite the guy that wrote American Pie, but. But I do trump some Playboy bunnies.

[Spencer Newhall]

That's right.

[Cal]

That's amazing.

[Spencer Newhall]

So Steve wins anyway. He got his two points. Well done, Steve. All right, let's do our final interview of the day. Joining us on the line last is is Steve Powell, the co owner of North American Diving Dogs. Steve, welcome to the show.

[Steve Powell]

How we doing guys?

[Spencer Newhall]

Good, how are you? For folks who aren't familiar, what is dock diving?

[Steve Powell]

Dock diving is as simple as it's a dog running down a 40 foot dock and jumping into a pool.

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay. And no weird rules. Are there any weird rules or is it just simple where they throw the bumper and the dog jumps as far as they can?

[Steve Powell]

It's pretty much that simple.

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay.

[Steve Powell]

Got a dog that loves to chase a toy and loves water it's that easy.

[Phil]

Hey, Steve, really quick. Can we get you a little bit closer to your computer, please?

[Steve Powell]

Yeah.

[Phil]

Thank you so much.

[Steve Powell]

Well, I'll just move in.

[Spencer Newhall]

There we go. Steve, walk us through what the best breeds are for dock diving.

[Steve Powell]

Well, you guys are hunters, so obviously one would be any kind of retriever. Your labs, your short hairs, things like that, wire hair, pointers. Then you have your sport dogs, your Malinois. You got whippets. Pretty much any dog of any size. They just need to be driving.

[Spencer Newhall]

And describe us like the perfect dock diving dog in terms of personality, age, sex. What is dock diving?

[Steve Powell]

If you have a dog that is psychotic and you don't want any part of dealing with it, most of the time, that's probably your best bet because they'll just do whatever you want them to do, and they'll give 1000%.

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay, good to know. Is there a dock diving goat, the greatest of all time when it comes to jumping a long ways in water?

[Steve Powell]

There absolutely is. She lives in Washington. Dog's name is Sounders. It's a whippet. Holds the world record at 36ft, 11 inches.

[Cal]

Whoa.

[Spencer Newhall]

What makes Sounders so good?

[Steve Powell]

Sounders is fast, Sounders is athletic, and he just wants that toy.

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay. How did this become so popular and go from being an obscure sport to being on espn?

[Steve Powell]

So the things I've heard is that somebody was out with their dog, it was jumping off the dock at the lake, and somebody thought, you know, I can probably get a group of people together, and we can try to make that happen and make a company out of it with competition. You know how people are. They wanted, my dog can beat your dog. You guys hunt. My buck is bigger than your buck. My fish is bigger. Right. So it's just a way to make. Make it more competitive.

[Cal]

Huh?

[Spencer Newhall]

Okay. Cal, how would Snort perform at these competitions?

[Cal]

Not well. She's a little bit too much of a thinker. The. The cutest story I have about this, though, is I went to a Ducks unlimited banquet here in. In Bozeman. Met this little old lady who told me the reason she was there. She's not a hunter. Her dogs and dock jumping competitions. I was like, well, how'd that happen? And she's like, my husband just passed away. He had this black lab that was totally his dog. Doesn't like me at all, doesn't pay attention to me, doesn't listen to me. And I was riddled with guilt about getting rid of the dog. And there was a dock jumping competition that had, like, open enrollment Some. And so she just did it. And now her and the dog travel all over doing the competitions. And they love each other.

[Spencer Newhall]

Perfect.

[Cal]

It's amazing.

[Spencer Newhall]

Steve, do hunting dogs ever show up at your competitions?

[Steve Powell]

Oh, yeah, lots of times. We have tons of hunting dogs that they come and they're just, I mean, it's their thing, right? They either they do hunting trials, they duck hunt, they pheasant hunt, they like to chase a bumper. And the biggest thing is that the guys will bring it or their wives like in the story just told. They just want to do something with the dog and they're like, oh, my dog loves water. So there's numerous.

[Phil]

Yes.

[Spencer Newhall]

And if Cal wants to get into dock diving, what should he do?

[Steve Powell]

So North American diving dogs, we have close to 90 facilities across the US and in Canada we have eight mobile docks that set up at AKC shows. And we put on and do try its, which is a thing. Otherwise, facilities are a good place to learn and to train. And then they also have events.

[Spencer Newhall]

And how do people watch your competitions?

[Steve Powell]

So when we're doing events at shows or at facilities, I would say probably 95% of the time, public's welcome and there's no charge. We also, we are teamed up with AKC and akctv. We, we get usually two events a year that they film and then those can be seen on ESPN or ESPN2.

[Spencer Newhall]

Good stuff. Very entertaining.

[Steven Rinella]

I got a question about, a quick question about the cognitive ability of dogs. We used to have a Labrador that loved. She would jump off the end of the dock like that. And it was one of the problems if you were out swimming, she would then swim over and scratch you to all hell thinking she was somehow going to climb on you. Somehow. But like I think I thought about, let's say you had a dock and you do that all the time. And then one night the lake freezes. It would be very interesting. Do you follow me? It'll be very interesting to, to see if, to test or see if the dog like how the dog comprehends that. Do you know what I mean?

[Steve Powell]

Well, one, I pray the dog wouldn't get hurt if it did do it. But the other thing is you're calling out like a lake in a pond is that there is a difference to the dogs. If you've got a dog that jumps at the lake, a thousand percent has zero issues with it. It'll do it all day long. You bring them to clear water, which we have in the pools, and it'll throw, it'll throw them off.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, is that Right. They got, like, a certain environment they like. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Steve Powell]

I had a gentleman that came to my facility, and he had a hunting title dog, and he was like, this is gonna be no problem. And he expected his dog was just gonna go in. He spent 25 minutes with his dog just sitting on the platform, just going, what? What are you expecting from me? It had no idea.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. Do you ever find that there's dogs that like it so much that they do it in the absence of the toy?

[Steve Powell]

Absolutely. We have actually a few dogs that. Yeah, they'll bring them up on the dock and those go, go. The dog just jumps.

[Steven Rinella]

Like, no effect. They're not even fetching. They're just jumping.

[Steve Powell]

Or the worst part is they open the gate to let them on the dock and the dog runs and jumps in. Luckily, we have called the practice so they can take a practice jump, and when they see that happening, they're like, practice? Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Really? Well, that's funny.

[Spencer Newhall]

Steve. Cali, got anything else?

[Steven Rinella]

No, that's it.

[Cal]

Oh, that's great.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right, thank you for joining us, Steve, and thanks for entertaining us. Those wet dogs.

[Steve Powell]

Not a problem, guys. Thank you for having me.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right, that brings us to the end of this week's show. Phil, let's do some final feedback from the chat.

[Cal]

Sure.

[Phil]

Steve, you wanted to talk about this question from Evan. Will a skunk spray when shot with a bow or rifle?

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Spencer Newhall]

Well.

[Phil]

Right.

[Steven Rinella]

And trapping. And like, the guys use injectors now, like damage control guys. They use these, like, long hole, these long poles, and they have an injector. They can inject it. So it doesn't spray. But the thing. It used to be that if you.

[Cal]

If you could jab stick.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. If you could hit it in the heart with a.22, it have about a 50 chance of spraying. But then I calculated that you got about a 50 chance of hitting it in the heart. So a 25% chance, but yeah, man, they'll cut loose.

[Phil]

Lance showed up late. Did Spencer cover his hunt? Yes. Lance, go ahead and rewind about an hour, and you'll hear all about it. We had one. This is kind of related to buck fever. And I'm.

[Cal]

Oh, here we go.

[Phil]

This is from William. Any advice with target panic? I've never had a problem with whitetail or hogs with my bow, but started hunting public land muleys in New Mexico and can't seem to calm myself after drawing on them.

[Spencer Newhall]

Hmm.

[Cal]

Yeah. I mean, you're hunting a bigger, cooler animal, so I get it. Don't believe in Target panic at all. Don't listen to those people. Don't be around those people. If that causes a divorce or something like that, that. That's better for you in the long run.

[Steven Rinella]

You know, Kenyon has that. I'm sure a lot of guys do, but Canyon has Mark Canyon has this little mantra he goes through like a three step mantra, but you have to practice hard on it. Like, I've toyed with it, but he's got like a boom, boom, boom every time he shoots an arrow. Boom. Yeah, boom, boom. Like a mental checklist. I think if you could actually get that to be wrote, I feel that that would be. And I don't do it.

[Spencer Newhall]

Sure.

[Steven Rinella]

But when he explained it to me, I'm like, that seems like a good idea, though. I haven't tried it, but it feels like a great idea to me.

[Spencer Newhall]

I think a lot of guys as like beyond just the mental thing will switch their style of release. So if you. Whatever kind of style you're shooting right now, if you just cannot beat target panic, try a different one. And really, that'll do it for you?

[Sean Conrad]

Yeah.

[Cal]

If target panic were to exist, okay. But it doesn't. So yeah, it is like, it's. It's like a cult of people who are like, they feed off of each other. So get away from those people. Get in front of a big target and practice your. Your shot. And I do this with. With my recurve or longbow. Now if I'm having a hard time hitting the spot on the target that I want to hit, I'll walk up to 10 yards and practice shooting with my eyes closed, where all I'm doing is concentrating on the release of that arrow. And as long as my arrow isn't hitting in a totally funky way, I know that everything's good with the bow and it's just me. And it's just a practice thing. Don't get sucked down the rabbit hole. Don't believe it, Bill.

[Spencer Newhall]

Let's do a couple more.

[Phil]

Cool. This is from Spencer Flip. For the people who are getting their Christmas gifts early and responsibly. Any new holiday gift ideas on the Meat E website or First Light. You guys have any sort of like.

[Steven Rinella]

Stocking stuffer dude effed up old trucks, man.

[Phil]

Yeah, the new calendar.

[Spencer Newhall]

It's an easy, easy stocking stuffer for you.

[Steven Rinella]

You got to roll it up.

[Cal]

I mean, there's put it in the stock. There's so much good. There's like fun stuff and there's very practical stuff. It's a great stop on the on.

[Spencer Newhall]

The list, everybody could use a first light base layer. Doesn't matter like what that'll fit stock.

[Steven Rinella]

But he didn't say stocking. Why are we talking about stockings?

[Spencer Newhall]

I'm not sorry I got off on the stockings.

[Phil]

The stocking stuffer was me doing some editorial.

[Steven Rinella]

Nice thing about the calendar, I don't mean to oversell this, but if you roll it up, put it in the stocking, it's then going to expand and actually firm up.

[Spencer Newhall]

Oh wow.

[Steven Rinella]

And make a nice firm cylinder.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah. What a sales that you then put.

[Steven Rinella]

All kinds of other stuff into.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Phil]

Kind of like a shell, like a mid layer for your stocking.

[Spencer Newhall]

Next week is. No, we're two weeks away from Black Friday. Spencer flip. So hold out on your holiday shopping until then. Maybe.

[Phil]

We got Logan asking about. He loves eating northern pike. He's asking for the best way to cook or pickle them. If you guys have any. Go to's pickling them.

[Spencer Newhall]

You're gonna get rid of all those nasty Y bones in there. So that's it is the thing if.

[Steven Rinella]

You get a pike now and then. It is the thing to do with pike in my view. It's so good and just takes all the hassle.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yes.

[Steven Rinella]

I also like to chunk. Like just flay it, leave the pin bones in, cube it up and food process it into. I mean for lack of a better word, I guess you could call it a moose, you could call it a paste and then make fish cakes and you don't know the bones are there.

[Cal]

Yeah, yeah. Old Garrett Smith's dad, he runs it through the grinder a couple of times until he has. Has a paste.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

You could pack it like a snowball. Like.

[Cal]

Yes. And you can just do fried. Fried balls.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. Put good stuff to eat in there, breadcrumb, egg. Put all that good stuff to eat in there, season it and then when you then make a little patty or a little ball, roll that and panko. And if you do the panko, then fry it very gently. It's got a crispy outside, a smooth, soft Middle East. It's very, very tasty.

[Spencer Newhall]

Pickling or fish cakes, you're not going to have to worry about all those Y bones. Let's do one more, Phil.

[Phil]

Sure. We've had multiple questions about this. It's a hot, hot commodity. What's the hat that Cal is wearing called again from Caleb?

[Steven Rinella]

Cal's hat.

[Spencer Newhall]

Stocking stuff.

[Cal]

First light, stormy, chromer.

[Phil]

That's right.

[Steven Rinella]

Put that in your stocking.

[Cal]

Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

Great.

[Cal]

Great lid. Once the weather turns cold, it's not on all the timer. Tell you that.

[Spencer Newhall]

All right.

[Steven Rinella]

You know what's funny? Can I tell you something real quick? My little. My little boy, we were going to name him something different.

[Spencer Newhall]

Can you tell us?

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah. We were going to name him my wife's maiden name, Finch. So we, before he was born, we ordered him up his stocking. Oh. But then we changed our minds.

[Spencer Newhall]

Wow, what a little Easter egg.

[Steven Rinella]

And so his stocking still doesn't have his name on it.

[Spencer Newhall]

Does it say Finch? Oh, I like that.

[Steven Rinella]

Our dog's even got one with its name on it. It's got the right name, but his stocking is not his name. It's so, so funny, dude. He's 10 years old. Same stocking.

[Spencer Newhall]

It's good. Soon as we stop recording here, I'm driving to Nebraska going deer hunting.

[Cal]

No way.

[Spencer Newhall]

Next week.

[Cal]

Holy cats, man.

[Steven Rinella]

How long you going hunting for?

[Spencer Newhall]

Well, as soon as I tag out in Nebraska, their season opens on Saturday. I am shooting up to South Dakota. I have a deer tag there as well.

[Cal]

So is this a. A draw tag?

[Steven Rinella]

Rich guy over here.

[Spencer Newhall]

Yeah, real rich for certain parts of the state. I had to draw to get a mule deer tag. Yes. Yeah.

[Cal]

Is that what you have?

[Spencer Newhall]

I have a mule deer tag.

[Cal]

Cool.

[Spencer Newhall]

And then in South Dakota, I have an indie deer tag, which I also had to draw. So.

[Steven Rinella]

Must be nice.

[Spencer Newhall]

I'm out of here for the next. Must be nice. It's gonna be swimming in buck fever.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Cal]

Yeah. Well, after killing that big Montana mule deer, I'm ready. I hope you don't get anything.

[Spencer Newhall]

No, no, I'm kidding. All right, we'll see you guys back here next week, same time and place by now.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay, only 10 more presents to wrap.

[Cal]

You're almost at the finish line. But first, there, the last one.

[Spencer Newhall]

Enjoy a Coca Cola for a pause that refreshes.

[Steven Rinella]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. As winter approaches, make sure you set aside some time for self care. Now through December 2nd. Get great savings on personal care essentials when you shop in store or online. Buy two participating self care items and save $3. Shop for items like Tresemme Shampoo, Dove Shampoo, Dove Men's Care Body Wash, Dove Body Wash, and Axe Shower gel. And save $3 when you buy two or more items. Offer ends December 2nd. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details. This is Jacob Goldstein from what's yous Problem?

[Cal]

When you buy business software from lots.

[Sean Conrad]

Of vendors, the costs add up and.

[Steven Rinella]

It gets complicated and confusing. Odoo solves this.

[Sean Conrad]

It's a single company that sells a suite of enterprise apps that handles everything.

[Steven Rinella]

From accounting to inventory to sales. Odoo is all connected on a single.

[Sean Conrad]

Platform in a simple and affordable way.

[Steven Rinella]

You can save money without missing out on the features you need. Check out Odoo at o d o o dot com. That's o d o o dot com. This is an iHeart podcast.