Ep. 810: The Perfect Country and Western Song

Summary

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The MeatEater Podcast

Ep. 810: The Perfect Country and Western Song
Date: December 23, 2025
Host: Steven Rinella
Guests: Clay Cook, Clay Mills, Dan Reed, The Brothers Hunt

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Episode Overview

In this lively Nashville-recorded episode, Steven Rinella and a panel of prolific country music songwriters pull back the curtain on how hit songs come to life on Music Row. Their goal? To work together and give listeners an authentic, often hilarious, look at the behind-the-scenes process of writing a classic country tune. This time, the challenge: pen “The Perfect Country and Western Song”—but with a twist. The subject? The humble mule, specifically one named “Betty Bay,” and why mules deserve more love than horses.

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Key Discussion Points & Songwriting Process

Setting the Scene in Nashville

• 02:00–03:20: The crew gathers in a historic Music Row studio, trading playful banter about the deep roots of country music in Nashville.
• Steven sets the context: “I’m just trying to establish our credentials…we’re in the heart of the country music creation.” (03:12)
• The group jokes about which legends may have recorded in the room—“Dolly Parton’s been in this building…Tammy W’s been in this building. George Jones…allegedly.”
• Dan emphasizes: “This is the American South, and this is where music is made.” (03:33)

Music, Culture, and Regional Identity

• 03:36–04:12: Lighthearted debate on the importance of music in the South vs. the North.
  • Dan Reed: “Music is important to people in the South.” (03:38)
  • Steven Rinella counters: “Go tell the people in Motown about how special music is in the South.” (04:05)

What Nashville Songwriters Actually Do

• 04:31–06:15: Clay Cook and Clay Mills describe their daily routines as professional songwriters.
  • “We write three, four days a week right here on Music Row. Sometimes we write in this room.” —Clay Cook (04:53)
  • They explain the publisher system, co-writing sessions, and how artists’ schedules influence what songs get written.
  • The “hook” is everything—ideas are tossed around rapid-fire and the best rise to the top.

The Mule vs. Horse Debate

• 06:16–09:13: The episode’s songwriting focus emerges: a tongue-in-cheek promo for mules.
  • Steven pitches: “I was gonna pitch you guys…on an idea of a song that you could develop about how mules are better than horses.” (06:33)
  • Dan provides “bullet points” for mule superiority: “Mules are sure footed, like way more sure footed than a horse. They have more stamina, they live longer, and they have a long working life.” (09:09)

Brainstorming the Song

• 09:14–12:24: The writers use real-life mule stories and data as song fodder.
  • Dan shares his mule’s name, “Izzy,” and later “Betty Bay,” which instantly sparks creative hooks.
  • Clay Mills: “Maybe this is a story tune…like you’re on a mountain and a cat jumps…[but] your mule stays.” (09:13)
  • The group sketches out lyrical hooks, aiming for authenticity and broad appeal.

Crafting the Chorus and Lyrics

• 16:28–27:30: The team gets down to writing, word-by-word:
  • They debate whether to make the song upbeat or “fun, folky.”
  • Negotiating between “too technical” and “commercially cool”—e.g., how to describe a mule’s size so it resonates with a mainstream audience (20:04–20:49).
  • Clay Cook, riffing on “horsepower vs. mule power”: “Horsepowers for Hollywood, mules for the mountains.” (22:14)
  • The group polishes lines about carry-ability (“She’ll carry a hog or a white tail deer, she’s ready to go any day of the year.”) and playful nods to Arkansas.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Nashville Sound
  • Clay Mills: “I would venture to say you’re in the heart of the country music creation.” (03:14)
• Joking about the Mule Song’s Commercial Potential
  • Clay Mills: “We could sht on horses through this entire song, right? But I think the move is to pick one poignant moment to sht on a horse and then just keep it honoring.” (12:03)
• On Songwriter Etiquette
  • Clay Mills: “This is one of my favorite quotes I’ve ever heard in Nashville about that. Someone said…‘I don’t know that this is the crop, but it might be the fertilizer for it.’” (23:12)
• On Song Structure
  • Clay Cook: “Don’t bore us, get to the chorus.” (24:32)

The Songwriting in Action: “Betty Bay”

• 26:43–27:30: The highlight—a rough, in-the-moment performance of the chorus.
  • Clay Cook sings:

    “Mountain Cadillac, old Arkansas clay, Betty Bay, Betty Bay
    Finest mule God ever made
    She’s going on eight, stands 14-3, a thousand pounds of energy
    She’ll carry a hog or a whitetail deer,
    She’s ready to go any day, Betty Bay, Betty Bay
    She’s a mountain Cadillac, roll Arkansas clay, Betty Bay.”

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• 02:00 – Music Row & Nashville studio legacy
• 04:31 – What life as a Nashville songwriter is really like
• 06:16 – Deciding on a “mule song” and why
• 09:34 – Crafting a story-based country song (mules vs. horses)
• 16:28 – Building the chorus and fleshing out lyrics
• 20:04 – Debating lyrics and technical vs. commercial language
• 22:14 – “Horsepower vs. mule power”
• 26:43–27:30 – Live songwriting performance: “Betty Bay” chorus

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Episode Tone & Takeaways

• The episode is rich with casual camaraderie, inside jokes, and authentic details from the world of country songwriting.
• The songwriters generously share tricks of their trade—how they co-create, the lingo of Music Row, and how to nod to an audience’s lived experience.
• Ultimately, listeners not only get a lighthearted education on Music Row’s songwriting culture but also an off-the-cuff new country song celebrating underdog mules everywhere.

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For listeners and non-listeners alike, this episode of The MeatEater Podcast is a colorful, welcoming window into both country music’s creative process and the quirky, deep-rooted rivalry between mules and horses—delivered with genuine Nashville flair.

Transcript

[Steven Rinella]

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[Clay Cook]

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[Clay Mills]

For the small, the short and the tall. Peacemakers, risk takers for the optimists, pessimists for long distance love for introverts and extroverts. The thinkers and the doers for old friends and new Coca Cola for everyone. Pick up some Coca Cola at a store near you.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay, everyone, we're on day two of our Meat Eater Live Christmas tour. We're in Nashville. What does anybody think of when I think of Nashville? They think of music on Music Row. I'm here with the host of God's country podcast, Dan Reed. Isabel, the Brothers Hunt. And we're in a place where you guys make music.

[Clay Cook]

Yeah, literally we've made music in this room.

[Steven Rinella]

And we're on a street known for music making.

[Clay Mills]

I mean, arguably the most legendary music street in the country.

[Steven Rinella]

Music Row.

[Clay Cook]

We're kind of in between them. 16th and 17th is, is the legendary music row in Nashville. And they just run parallel to each other. One way this way on 16th, one way that way on 17.

[Steven Rinella]

So fair to say, hundreds of the songs, you know, have been touched. Thousands have been touched on this.

[Clay Mills]

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

[Steven Rinella]

And not only that, let's get down to brass tacks. The building, it's a music building.

[Clay Mills]

Indeed.

[Clay Cook]

A lot of history with it.

[Steven Rinella]

The room is a music room. I'm just trying to establish our credentials.

[Dan Reed]

Allegedly.

[Clay Mills]

No, this is a legit studio. I mean, this was a vocal booth. If you, if you were to pull this down, you'd see a big glass window where artists converse with producers on what to play.

[Steven Rinella]

What, like they have all those Le.

[Clay Mills]

We call them faders, knob jockeys. But knob jockey, I wouldn't use that loosely.

[Steven Rinella]

Dolly Parton's been in this building.

[Clay Cook]

Recorded.

[Steven Rinella]

Tammy W's been in this building. George Jones been in this building. Allegedly. Allegedly.

[Clay Cook]

Together, maybe.

[Steven Rinella]

Together, maybe.

[Clay Cook]

Maybe in this room.

[Clay Mills]

I'm not one to say hiding, so.

[Steven Rinella]

I'm just establishing our credentials that we're in a music room.

[Clay Mills]

Oh, baby, you're. I would venture to say you're in the. You're in the heart of the country music creation.

[Steven Rinella]

Yep.

[Dan Reed]

Steve, this is. This is why I've brought you here.

[Steven Rinella]

No, I brought you here.

[Dan Reed]

No, I brought you here because.

[Clay Mills]

I mean, arguably we brought.

[Dan Reed]

Because this is.

[Steven Rinella]

I brought you.

[Dan Reed]

This is the American south, and this is where music is made.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Dan Reed]

Steve has a beef with me because one time I said music is important to people in the South. That's all I said.

[Steven Rinella]

Like, it's not in the north was the implication.

[Clay Mills]

Right.

[Steven Rinella]

He's like, well, you don't understand. Music's very important to people in the South.

[Clay Mills]

It's kind of like fried fish. Well, fried fish is very important to people.

[Dan Reed]

What I was trying to say was.

[Clay Mills]

Is it as important to people in the north?

[Steven Rinella]

More important?

[Clay Mills]

Fried fish more important? No chance.

[Clay Cook]

Yeah, questionable.

[Steven Rinella]

It's more important. And I. I just brought up. I'm like, tell. Go tell the people in Motown about how special music is in the South.

[Dan Reed]

Well, I mean, I'm not saying it's the.

[Steven Rinella]

I don't want to burn our time up. These guys got a hard on. We have a song to write.

[Clay Mills]

My kids Christmas play. That's the only reason. Otherwise I'd stay all day.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay. That is important. I thought you had, like, big time country music stuff to attend to.

[Clay Mills]

Not today.

[Clay Cook]

Absolutely not.

[Clay Mills]

I wouldn't be wearing a college shirt if it wasn't for my kids Christmas play.

[Steven Rinella]

Here's what I want to do. I want to. I want to give people a glimpse, but into what you do for a living and what happens on this street. But I want. Can you guys touch on your sort of your day job, Right? Like your. Your career and what you do in music writing, what services you provide and how that world works very quickly.

[Clay Cook]

Yeah. We're launchpell songwriters, what we like to call them, and we. We write three, four days a week right here on Music Row. Sometimes we write in this room.

[Clay Mills]

Now we write three or four days a week. There was. Was a time we were running five days a week, sometimes doubles.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay.

[Clay Cook]

Yeah, but we've got. We've got publishers or Pluggers that we write for or signed to. I'm signed to 50 Egg Dan, signed to Sony, and they schedule out our rights way in advance. And so they schedule it. Yeah, we do too. We do a lot of that too now, but most of the time they do. And we'll look at. On Sunday, you'll look at your calendar for Monday and see that you're writing with X, this X rider and this X rider at Sony at 11 o'. Clock. And you roll up at 10:45, do a little chat and say, what's up? Catch up with everybody, head into the room at 11 and do a chatting for about 30 minutes again. And then you start scrolling through ideas and seeing what artist. If you've got buddies that's cutting a.

[Clay Mills]

Record, I don't know if you can see any secret. We're friends with Luke Combs. So a lot of times people will come in and sit down with us and go, hey, man, when's Luke cutting? We'll be like, oh, man, he's two years out. What is that off the table? Right. There's no sense in even trying.

[Steven Rinella]

So that's how you move beyond that.

[Clay Mills]

So if you're six months out and you go, oh, man, he's looking for a song about hunting, then this guy might go, that's crazy. I have this hook. Praying in a deer stand or whatever it is idea. And then we're trying.

[Steven Rinella]

Deer stand, dude, that's way better than what I got for you.

[Clay Mills]

Okay, we'll see.

[Clay Cook]

We can write that if you want to.

[Dan Reed]

That'd be praying in a mule saddle.

[Steven Rinella]

So why. Okay. What? So I brought Clay down?

[Clay Mills]

Yeah. Oh, you brought him?

[Steven Rinella]

I brought.

[Clay Mills]

Okay.

[Steven Rinella]

It's debatable to workshop because I wanted to see you guys and work. So the best I could come up with. I'm not a songwriter.

[Clay Mills]

Sure.

[Steven Rinella]

I was gonna pitch you guys. I was gonna be the guy that comes in, and I'm gonna pitch you on an idea of a song that you could develop about how mules are better than horses.

[Clay Mills]

Okay. Now, look, I'm got to be honest, I don't know a whole lot about mules.

[Dan Reed]

That's. That's why I'm here. I can give you the bullet points.

[Clay Mills]

Okay.

[Clay Cook]

And to be honest, we don't know a lot about horses either.

[Steven Rinella]

Well, this play, Lifetime, he needs a song to go with this because this is his lifetime battle anyways.

[Clay Mills]

Okay.

[Clay Cook]

So why.

[Clay Mills]

Maybe you're the artist and we are the song helping, which is what we.

[Steven Rinella]

Do, and I'm the producer.

[Clay Mills]

Well, I Need more like. Sure, more like produce bag. You play the part. Producer. You're the producer.

[Dan Reed]

So this is. This is like really high stakes for me. I need a song that carries.

[Clay Mills]

Okay, now I want to do it.

[Dan Reed]

That carries the data, the facts, but also the culture, the attitude.

[Clay Mills]

Okay.

[Dan Reed]

The fire and the bones of the overlooked mule people.

[Clay Mills]

You asked about passion, about this.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Clay Mills]

So you know about Columbia, Tennessee, right?

[Dan Reed]

Yeah.

[Clay Cook]

Yeah.

[Dan Reed]

That's where we'll sell Miltown. Yeah, we got everything down there.

[Clay Mills]

Town coffee.

[Dan Reed]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, it's pretty slick.

[Clay Cook]

I've never. I probably grand marshal it someday, dude.

[Clay Mills]

Well, easy. We can put you in for that.

[Dan Reed]

I mean, we can.

[Clay Cook]

You can put your mules in and there's a mule getting their guitars that way.

[Clay Mills]

I mean, I know they already lunch.

[Steven Rinella]

Pot their lunchtime, I think. I think be home by dinner time.

[Clay Mills]

Get back by two, man.

[Dan Reed]

The song, the song needs some like real specific data that a mule or horse person would be like, dang, he's right. But it also needs like some catchy hook that put that cable on. Okay, so, so here, here's. Here's the scoop. For every hundred horses, there's probably two mules in the country. Number one.

[Clay Cook]

It's a great starting line.

[Dan Reed]

Okay.

[Clay Mills]

Yeah. Can I have that?

[Steven Rinella]

You just could put that line in there.

[Dan Reed]

Well, well, it gets. It'll get way better than that.

[Clay Mills]

You know what I mean?

[Dan Reed]

Well, but it's got it. It's got to bring.

[Clay Cook]

This.

[Clay Mills]

Is it for every 100 horse.

[Dan Reed]

Let me give you the hot.

[Steven Rinella]

Okay, I know, I wasn't saying anything. There ain't but every 100 horses. There ain't but 2 mules.

[Clay Cook]

He's already 300 horses. There ain't but 2mules.

[Clay Mills]

Well, that.

[Dan Reed]

Now they're thinking we're dumb, though. I mean, we got like, it's got a.

[Clay Mills]

We need more than 45, like special.

[Dan Reed]

But a mule is a four wheel drive horse, okay? Like that's kind of a thing. Mules are sure footed, like way more sure footed than a horse. They have more stamina than a horse. They live longer than a horse. They have a long working life.

[Clay Mills]

I think what I need from you that would make for a great commercial country mule song is maybe, maybe this is a story tune. So I'm sure a specific meal, I'm sure in your lifetime you've had or maybe even a specific instance with a specific mule. Like you're on a mountain and a cat jumps and swipes it, but it doesn't kill it and the horse falls off the Side of the mountain. But your mule stays, and his name.

[Dan Reed]

Is Izzy's My good meal right now works.

[Clay Mills]

That's what I like that. What was the other one?

[Dan Reed]

Slow trap.

[Clay Mills]

So what we're gonna do now in lunch bell songwriting world is take the three options he just gave us and decide on which one is the hook. Your name. Now, one of them, May, meant more.

[Dan Reed]

To you than the other, but it doesn't matter. But Izzy, Betty Bay.

[Clay Mills]

I mean, that one's Betty Bay's great. Betty May's hot.

[Clay Cook]

And Betty Bay. So there's even like a.

[Clay Mills]

You say Bay.

[Dan Reed]

Betty Bay.

[Clay Cook]

And that's a laser color. That's a little song right there, too. Is like the.

[Dan Reed]

Betty Bay is also for sale.

[Clay Cook]

The. The.

[Clay Mills]

Say, this isn't Craigslist, dude. Geez. I don't think anybody.

[Clay Cook]

You might have somebody.

[Steven Rinella]

That's what this is really all about.

[Dan Reed]

Columbia getting your paycheck. Don't worry about this. Just write me a really great stock about Betty Bay.

[Clay Mills]

Okay, I like Betty Bay. What was the other one?

[Dan Reed]

Slow trap. Izzy. Betty Bay.

[Clay Cook]

And you said may is her color.

[Clay Mills]

No, bay. B A y.

[Dan Reed]

Bay. She's bay.

[Clay Cook]

I mean, bay meal.

[Dan Reed]

Yeah, she's bay colored. But I mean, like, the biggest thing that a mule would have would be its sure footedness and safety in rough country. Like, if you meet somebody with a mule, you're like, this dude's going in some rough country, right?

[Clay Mills]

This.

[Dan Reed]

This is a. This is a gritty American. But mules are stubborn. They're harder to deal with than a horse. They're harder to train than a horse. But if you get one trained, it's better than a horse.

[Steven Rinella]

Payoffs.

[Clay Mills]

Okay, so the next.

[Clay Cook]

I love that for a chorus. Like, hold on.

[Clay Mills]

We don't even know what.

[Clay Cook]

No, no. I'm just working in my brain, like, they might be that.

[Clay Mills]

What do you want this song to sound like? Well, I mean, should it be up tempo?

[Clay Cook]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Reed]

Like.

[Clay Mills]

Like, should it be like.

[Dan Reed]

Like, Like. Like a slow foot? Like, kind of. Kind of fun, bulky.

[Clay Mills]

We could start out with a chorus.

[Clay Cook]

That's what I'm thinking. Like, they might. They. Would you just say, they might be what? They might be this. They might be that. Well, they're.

[Dan Reed]

They're. They're sure footed. They're made for rough country.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, but no, you're saying they're pain in the ass to raise up, but it's worth it in the end.

[Clay Cook]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Reed]

What are the.

[Clay Cook]

What are the downfalls of them? They might be. Well, they're.

[Dan Reed]

They're harder to train. They're. They're. A bad mule is way worse than a bad horse. But a good mule.

[Clay Mills]

Okay, here, let me.

[Dan Reed]

Better than a good horse.

[Clay Mills]

We got to save our horse.

[Dan Reed]

I'm saying like they're outlaw. If you get an outlaw, you're in trouble.

[Clay Mills]

Nobody's gonna listen to this. Should we, should we save our horse References like for. Because here's the thing. We could on horses through this entire song, right?

[Steven Rinella]

No doubt.

[Clay Mills]

But I think the move. I think the move is to pick one poignant moment to shit on a horse and then just keep it honoring.

[Steven Rinella]

Clay's trying to go low and negative. Well, you guys are trying to go positive.

[Clay Mills]

Well, positive, up tempo.

[Clay Cook]

Supposed to make money.

[Clay Mills]

Yeah, we're trying to make it here.

[Steven Rinella]

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[Clay Mills]

Okay, it could.

[Dan Reed]

It could like start with like a trip to the mountains in rough country now, I mean, like a personal story would have come through. Would have been carrying a bear hide.

[Steven Rinella]

I love it.

[Clay Mills]

Give me two seconds.

[Clay Cook]

Betty B. Betty B. Of course.

[Clay Mills]

Finest mules ever made. Finest mu God ever forever.

[Dan Reed]

Hey, can we put a state in there?

[Clay Mills]

Sure, yeah, yeah, in a minute.

[Steven Rinella]

I've got one.

[Clay Cook]

What, what's the reference for the state?

[Dan Reed]

Well, just, I don't know, just like Tennessee Stud is really cool. I would love an Arkansas reference.

[Clay Mills]

Okay, what's but Arkansas? Arkansas what?

[Dan Reed]

Just. Just Arkansas Arkansas ass.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, yeah, swear words.

[Dan Reed]

Oh, well, but. But a dog. But it's not a donkey. Like, if somebody's trying to insult me. Hey, get your donkey out of the trailer. Yeah, don't call my mule a donkey.

[Clay Cook]

You know what I'm saying?

[Clay Mills]

So now you're the artist.

[Steven Rinella]

This session's over.

[Clay Mills]

I'm done with this guy. Yeah, this is where we text our publisher and be like, hey, send us a text that we got studio time at 2:30. Oh, man, sorry.

[Clay Cook]

I gotta go home.

[Clay Mills]

I think we're just gonna have enough time for the chorus.

[Clay Cook]

Betty. Baby, baby.

[Clay Mills]

Finest mute God ever made could do that. Betty Bay. What?

[Clay Cook]

Just write a different line for this.

[Clay Mills]

Oh, Clay. I mean, we could. Do you want to be in the song Arkansas Clay.

[Clay Cook]

Arkansas Clay.

[Clay Mills]

I love that.

[Clay Cook]

And then do Betty B.

[Dan Reed]

Something being for sale too in there.

[Clay Cook]

Finest, finest donkey God ever made. Oh, my bad. Finest mule God ever made. And you could do. And then do a story.

[Clay Mills]

All right, which one goes first Clay.

[Clay Cook]

Then God in the.

[Clay Mills]

What's. Okay, help us. Help us. Help us here. Something about that Arkansas Clay. Like the something to the mountain only dedicated to you. What's another word for vehicle? Blank. To the mountains of Arkansas Clay.

[Dan Reed]

I call them like they're a rod, a mountain Cadillac.

[Clay Cook]

Oh, Cadillac for Arkansas.

[Clay Mills]

Mountain Cadillac for Arkansas.

[Clay Cook]

Finest milk I've ever made.

[Clay Mills]

All right, there you go. There's your chorus. Dude, how tall?

[Steven Rinella]

It's all over now.

[Dan Reed]

But she's boring parts.

[Clay Mills]

She's the course.

[Dan Reed]

She's four. She's actually 14. Three is what they call.

[Clay Cook]

How old is she?

[Dan Reed]

She's seven going on eight. Seven going on eight.

[Clay Cook]

Seven years. Eight, but going on eight.

[Clay Mills]

I like here.

[Clay Cook]

First verse. How do you. She's going on 8 at. At 143 or she's going on a 14.

[Clay Mills]

3 something to something.

[Clay Cook]

That'S Spanish to somebody who don't. Yeah, I like technical.

[Steven Rinella]

It sounds dukes. It makes it sound like you guys know a lot about.

[Clay Mills]

I think we're leaving the. I think it's got to be Clay. Cool. I don't think it's commercial cool. Okay. I think we just gotta stay cool.

[Clay Cook]

She's going on a 14, 3. Dude.

[Steven Rinella]

Are you saying that would be a concern because you're just losing people?

[Clay Cook]

Well, yeah, in a commercial sense. Who's gonna know what. She's going on eight at 14, three. Nobody's gonna know what that means.

[Clay Mills]

None of our listeners know that. Yours guys do.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, yeah, no, I got you. But like, just a. But a commercial audience. It's too obscure.

[Clay Cook]

Or.

[Dan Reed]

Yeah.

[Clay Cook]

Or you do. But I think he's eight years old. Stands 14. Three. So everybody.

[Clay Mills]

That's a little clearer.

[Clay Cook]

Yeah, that's a little bit.

[Clay Mills]

But I don't think we help out. I think we make it cooler than claycool.

[Steven Rinella]

The clay cool.

[Dan Reed]

Well, she. She. She weighs a th.000 pounds.

[Clay Mills]

Weighs a thousand.

[Dan Reed]

She's. She's, you know, just a ball of energy.

[Clay Cook]

A ball of energy.

[Clay Mills]

You just wrote the first verse.

[Clay Cook]

Ready?

[Clay Mills]

Yeah.

[Clay Cook]

She. She going on a 14. 3,000 pound.

[Clay Mills]

Thousand pounds of energy.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, dude.

[Ad Voice]

Got it.

[Clay Cook]

Like so here.

[Steven Rinella]

I'm getting shivers.

[Clay Cook]

They like, okay, so we could do this in that second. Stands alive.

[Steven Rinella]

You guys did both versions. You left the stands off last time. But I didn't throw that in even for clay.

[Clay Mills]

Going on eight. Stands 14.

[Clay Cook]

£3,000. Thousand pounds of energy.

[Clay Mills]

Okay.

[Clay Cook]

They call it horsepower.

[Steven Rinella]

15G.

[Clay Cook]

They. Yeah, you can't have her 17G. They call it horsepower, but they should.

[Dan Reed]

Call it mule power.

[Clay Cook]

You know what I'm saying?

[Clay Mills]

Yeah.

[Dan Reed]

Horsepower's got all the hype, but mule power is really what we want. Or, you know, something like that.

[Clay Cook]

Energy. Horsepower. Horsepower's for.

[Clay Mills]

They say horsepower makes Hollywood mule power.

[Clay Cook]

Horsepower's for Ford.

[Clay Mills]

Horsepower's for Hollywood. Mules for the mountains. Mules for the.

[Clay Cook]

For life. For real life.

[Clay Mills]

Horsepower.

[Clay Cook]

Horsepower for Hollywood doesn't really. Yeah, I love that. Okay. She. She's going on eight. Stands 14. £3,000 of energy.

[Clay Mills]

We got it right here.

[Clay Cook]

Horse horsepower. No, no, I got it in my still trap. Horsepower for Hollywood.

[Clay Mills]

That's not.

[Steven Rinella]

You know, I mean, I'm no songwriter. Horsepowers for grease monkeys.

[Clay Cook]

Grease monkeys.

[Clay Mills]

We just gave you the national. No, the Nashville know is when somebody says a line that we don't like, you just look back and start playing again. Or go.

[Clay Cook]

That's interesting that way.

[Clay Mills]

Yeah. Oh, okay. Yeah.

[Steven Rinella]

But I liked it because I felt let down easy.

[Clay Mills]

Yeah, that's. That's what it's supposed to.

[Steven Rinella]

Because it, like, it leaves this idea that you're still mulling it.

[Clay Mills]

And here's the thing. This is one of my favorite quotes I've ever heard in Nashville about that. About the Nashville. No, A guy said something one time and we kind of Nashville noted. And he prefaced it by saying, look, I don't. I don't know that this is the line, but I don't know that this is the crop, but it might be the fertilizer for it. So, like smelling them stepping in there.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Clay Cook]

All right.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah, I do. I do appreciate that. Than just getting shut down.

[Dan Reed]

Yeah.

[Clay Mills]

Instead of going, that shit's terrible.

[Steven Rinella]

Yeah.

[Clay Cook]

So are we trying to keep. Are we trying to keep the.

[Clay Mills]

Keep it cool, man?

[Clay Cook]

Like. No, no, I know, but same like. Same cadence like. Or you do, or you do. Like horsepowers from something A. I'll take every day.

[Clay Mills]

14, £3,000 energy horsepower. Hollywood something. They were better meal power, but mule power. So that feels a little weird to me, man. I think we maybe hang like punt mule power and just try another direction.

[Steven Rinella]

Clay.

[Clay Mills]

Yeah, man.

[Dan Reed]

She's b.

[Clay Cook]

Just, you know, going on eight stands. 14, £3,000 energy.

[Dan Reed]

She'll now. She'll carry a hog, she'll carry a white tail deer.

[Steven Rinella]

Love it.

[Dan Reed]

She'll carry a hog or a white tail deer.

[Clay Cook]

Something. I don't know. Something. Find a clear now.

[Clay Mills]

I think this is it. I think this is the last line chorus.

[Clay Cook]

Yeah, absolutely. Don't bore us. That's another. Here's another trick. Don't Boris, get to the chorus.

[Clay Mills]

All right.

[Clay Cook]

Also we. What we just did. What we're doing right now is we're talking out a line. So, like. Yeah, you want songs to be conversational and so that's what a lot of songwriting is, is we sit there and go, she's. She's still caring.

[Clay Mills]

Portion is that.

[Steven Rinella]

I love that something times a year.

[Clay Mills]

There you go. She'll carry.

[Dan Reed]

How about we throw it to a nature reference? Like when the leaves turn orange in the.

[Clay Cook]

That time dare to fall.

[Clay Mills]

Well, it's got to be ear.

[Dan Reed]

Let's go.

[Clay Mills]

We've already set up ear.

[Clay Cook]

We're missing one line.

[Clay Mills]

We're missing one line.

[Clay Cook]

She'll carry. She'll carry a hog or a white tail deer.

[Clay Mills]

Or you can flip them. She'll carry a deer or w. Hog something in there over a log. They step over lungs or some.

[Dan Reed]

Well, they do, but that's a little. That's a little anti Climatic.

[Clay Mills]

Oh, sorry, sorry, sorry.

[Clay Cook]

I like. She'll carry a hog. This is.

[Clay Mills]

You know, more about the information than others. Great.

[Steven Rinella]

It's a week. It's a week.

[Clay Cook]

What about. She'll carry a hog or a whitetail.

[Steven Rinella]

Day sometime a year. So many times a year.

[Clay Cook]

Any day of the year.

[Dan Reed]

Any day of the year.

[Steven Rinella]

That sounds cheap.

[Clay Mills]

I love it. She's. She'll carry a hog or white till dear.

[Clay Cook]

She's ready to go. Any daily.

[Clay Mills]

Mountain.

[Clay Cook]

Mountain Cadillac for knocking off clay.

[Clay Mills]

She's got it right here. Oh, this guitar we need to lay down. Why don't you just handle this and I'll handle this.

[Clay Cook]

This is how it always goes.

[Clay Mills]

Yeah.

[Dan Reed]

Now, not to put my fingerprint on the verse with my name, but an Arkansas Clay Would it be like old Arkansas Clay?

[Ad Voice]

Sure, sure.

[Steven Rinella]

Oh, there you go.

[Clay Cook]

Sure.

[Clay Mills]

See, now we're just tightening the strands of this shoe.

[Steven Rinella]

Are you going to pick up your guitar and do it too?

[Clay Mills]

I could.

[Dan Reed]

I mean, what is.

[Steven Rinella]

I should like to see you get in there and me spot you.

[Clay Cook]

I don't even know how to do this. Damn.

[Clay Mills]

Do what? You don't do anything. She's doing it. Oh, okay, okay, okay. So one, two, starts with a chorus.

[Clay Cook]

Oh.

[Clay Mills]

Ready?

[Steven Rinella]

Start with a.

[Clay Cook]

Mountain Cadillac roll Arkansas play Betty Bay, Betty Bay. Finest puke I've ever made.

[Clay Mills]

Watch it.

[Clay Cook]

She's going on 8 stance 14, 3000 pounds of energy she'll carry a hog or a white tailed deer she's ready to go any baby Betty baby Betty baby She's a paddle cattle at roll arms Soft clay Betty babe.

[Steven Rinella]

There you go, ladies and gentlemen. That's how hits are made. Coming to you live from Music Row in Nashville, Tennessee. Stay tuned for that one on the FM dial.

[Clay Mills]

Boom boom.

[Steven Rinella]

Turn it off, Reva.

[Clay Mills]

That's it. Turn it off.

[Steven Rinella]

Rea.

[Clay Cook]

This is Julian Edelman from Dudes on Dudes with Gronk and Jewels. Sunday mornings I've got my game day ritual. Coffee, lucky socks and now new morning uncrustable sandwiches.

[Steven Rinella]

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[Clay Mills]

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[Clay Cook]

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[Steven Rinella]

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[Clay Cook]

Your new Sunday kickoff ritual starts here with new morning uncrustable sandwiches packed with 12 grams of protein.

[Steven Rinella]

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[Clay Mills]

Com.

[Steven Rinella]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.