The MeatEater Podcast — Ep. 816: New Year's Resolutions, Mutant Turkeys, and Goodbye (Sort Of) Cal | MeatEater Radio Live!
Date: January 2, 2026
Host: Brody Henderson
Co-Hosts: Corey Calkins, Ryan “Cal” Callahan, Phil (Podcast Engineer)
Special Guest: Dr. Phil Lavretsky
Overview
This episode is part New Year’s hangout, part sendoff for long-time contributor Cal (Ryan Callahan) as he takes a new role running Backcountry Hunters and Anglers, and part deep-dive into the wild genetics of North America’s turkeys. Host Brody Henderson and the crew blend typical banter with insightful discussion on hunting, conservation, family, and citizen science. Special guest Dr. Phil Lavretsky shares fascinating findings (and mysteries) from his turkey DNA research, addressing the rise of “mutant” color-phased turkeys and what their genetics mean for hunters and wildlife managers alike. The team rounds out the show with heartfelt year-in-review reflections, listener questions, and a look toward new resolutions in 2026.
Key Segments & Insights
1. New Year’s Check-in & Current Hunting Goals
[00:59-08:00]
- Hosts share holiday plans and what’s happening at MeatEater HQ.
- Discussion of late-season hunting: deer, pheasants, ducks, elk.
- Freezer management: balancing last season’s meat with hopes for new hunts.
- Corey on managing game bag storage and running low on elk meat. Cal plans to grind sausage and get after turkeys with his son.
Notable Quote:
“I do like in my chest freezer, I do a game bag storage... That’s what I have left of my elk from last year — just a little bit of front shoulder and some neck meat for slow cooking.” — Corey Calkins [04:16]
2. Interview: Dr. Phil Lavretsky & The Truth About Mutant Turkeys
[08:25–42:45]
Turkey Domestication and Subspecies
[09:28–15:50]
- Dr. Lavretsky explains turkey origin: Turkeys are uniquely North American; domestication happened thousands of years ago, not in Europe.
- Domestication likely started with the Gould’s and Miriam’s turkeys, not Easterns.
- Review of the five North American subspecies (Eastern, Osceola, Rio Grande, Miriam’s, Gould’s).
Quote:
“Turkeys are a North American species...They were one of the successful domestication events by our ancestors that made it over the land bridge thousands of years ago.” — Dr. Phil Lavretsky [10:15]
Genetic Mutations & Hybridization
[15:45–26:00]
- Dr. Lavretsky discusses three main drivers for “mutant” turkey appearances:
- Genetic mutations (albinism, melanism, etc.).
- Hybridization between wild subspecies due to natural or agency-driven range overlap.
- Domestic ancestry— wild birds interbreeding with feral/domestic turkeys, or “heritage” breeds (hybrid wild/domestic types).
- Human manipulation: Heritage breeds are being created and sometimes released for the sake of hunting.
Quote:
“Heritage is essentially people taking a domestic bird, breeding it with a wild, creating something, and then calling it some heritage...like dog breeds.” — Dr. Phil Lavretsky [18:23]
- Survival of domestic turkeys in the wild is rare but can occur, especially with more “heritage” blood.
Critical Point:
- It’s NOT always possible to tell if a strange-colored turkey is wild, domestic-influenced, or a mere hybrid—DNA is often required.
How Common Are "Mutant" Color Turkeys?
[26:01–31:16]
- There are both wild turkeys with color mutations and heritage/domestic-origin birds with wild plumage.
- Plumage mutations can come from both wild and domestic sources; preliminary data suggests multiple genetic pathways to white/barred coloration.
- Hybrid ranges have muddied the line between subspecies in the West (the so-called “American Turkey” could become the norm).
Quote:
“Turkeys are incredibly much more complicated than ducks… the genetics is incredibly complex.” — Dr. Phil Lavretsky [22:19]
Impact of Inbreeding and Conservation Implications
[31:17–34:44]
- Both heritage/domestic birds and many wild populations are increasingly inbred.
- Introducing domestic/heritage birds to wild flocks may worsen inbreeding, threatening population health and resilience—parallels with ducks and even mammals.
- Fragmented habitat and lack of genetic exchange exacerbate these risks.
Key Insight:
“If you breed highly inbred heritage birds with wild turkeys, instead of decreasing inbreeding, you actually artificially jump the inbreeding … in the population.” — Dr. Phil Lavretsky [33:00]
Citizen Science: How to Get Involved
[39:51-42:15]
- Hunters can sign up to submit turkey and duck samples at wildturkeyDNA.com and duckdna.com.
- Field kits (vial for tissue sample collection) help the lab build a better map of wild genetics and mutation rates.
3. Memorable Quotes & Fun Banter
- “You could really bum out some turkey hunters … their goal is to get each [subspecies] and then they find out… ‘oh man…’” — Brody Henderson [26:04]
- “Turkey slam — the only way to get it is genetically vetted!” — Dr. Phil Lavretsky [26:20]
- On field ID: “Most of us, including myself, would be like, ‘Sweet, I got a turkey,’ and not even notice.” — Dr. Phil Lavretsky [30:12]
- “That’s what hunters bring to the table for the greater good.” — Corey Calkins [43:05]
4. Year-in-Review: Favorite Hunts
[44:07-56:39]
- Each host recounts favorite trips/hunts from the past year, emphasizing the experience, persistence, and the fun of being outdoors, often with family.
- Ryan Callahan: Finally tags a huge Montana black bear after years of trying; special whitetail hunt with son.
- Corey: Advocates for simply trying new public land spots (“my secret to success is just trying” [48:14]); celebrates a random, memorable double on wild pheasants in overlooked habitat.
- Brody: Colorado late-season mule deer—the exhilaration of the rut and succeeding after a full day’s effort.
Quote:
“My secret to success is just trying... Once you pull the band-aid off of ‘I gotta go to the place I know,’ a whole new world opens up to you.” — Corey Calkins [48:14]
5. Listener Q&A: Hunters’ Ethics & Dilemmas
[56:54–60:07]
- Question from a listener struggling with a “friend” whose hunting ethics are fundamentally at odds (road hunting, head shots, cheating spouse, etc.).
- Panel gives tough love: Don’t compromise your ethics or enable illegal behavior, even if it risks social tension.
Quote:
“You’re talking about a guy who’s hunting illegally and unethically, not to mention being a cheating scumbag… just gotta cut ties.” — Brody Henderson [59:05]
6. Farewell (Sort Of): Cal’s New Chapter with BHA
[60:34–73:37]
- “Cal,” a beloved MeatEater team member, is now CEO of Backcountry Hunters and Anglers (BHA); will still appear occasionally, but with new priorities.
- Reflects on what BHA needs and his vision: Advocating for “rank and file” outdoors people, not just wealthy donors.
- Calls out political threats to public land (specifically naming Senator Mike Lee) and the importance of vigilance and coalition-building to defend access.
- Emphasizes America’s unique public land system wasn’t an accident—citizens demanded it, and conservation is an ongoing fight.
Key Quotes:
“My dream is to have the end user of public land represented. A lot of conservation speaks only to big donors, but we’re here for the rank and file.” — Cal [63:24]
“There is nothing that we have and enjoy right now that is not here because we didn’t demand it.” — Cal [71:43]
7. New Year's Resolutions & Closing Reflections
[73:43-79:00]
- Ryan: Wants more time hunting with his son, especially now that he’s eight.
- Corey: “Day by day. Baby steps.” Respect for the old T-shirt fit as a weight loss barometer.
- Brody: Training for a marathon (target 3:30 in September) and keeping the hunting experience fun and about community, not antler scores.
- Overarching theme: hunting for love of the experience, protecting the future, not just trophies.
Quote:
“Focusing on fun, the experience, the people, the places… I want hunting to be like it was when I was a kid and everything was special and fun.” — Brody Henderson [77:07]
Other Memorable Moments
- Brody’s mild panic after thinking he lost a buck, only to find it lying dead ten feet away ([56:04]).
- Playful banter about someone possibly singing the Dude Wipes jingle—Phil (engineer) denies it, but promises to keep up with his reading (of fantasy genre, of course) as his New Year’s resolution ([80:28]).
- Cal muses, “I want to put myself out of a job as soon as possible… get everybody on board, then I can go back to swinging a hammer.” [78:08]
Timestamps for Important Segments
- [08:25] – Turkey biology and domestication: Dr. Phil Lavretsky
- [15:45] – Causes of weird turkey colorations
- [22:01] – Is your “mutant” turkey wild or not?
- [31:16] – Conservation risks: inbreeding and domestic introgression
- [39:51] – How hunters can help: wildturkeyDNA.com, duckDNA.com
- [44:07] – Hosts’ favorite hunt stories of 2025
- [56:54] – Listener letter: Hunting ethics dilemma
- [60:34] – Cal’s BHA promotion and public lands talk
- [73:43] – New Year’s resolutions roundtable
Conclusion
This episode offers both classic MeatEater banter and some deep conservation science, blending turkey genetics, hunting ethics, and heartfelt New Year’s reflections with the bittersweet sendoff of a pivotal team member. Listeners will walk away with:
- Practical field knowledge about wild turkeys and how to spot/understand color mutations
- Moral clarity about resisting peer pressure to hunt unethically
- Renewed appreciation for the challenges and joys of hunting, family, and public land advocacy
- A call to participate in citizen science and to protect the future of America’s outdoor heritage.
To participate in wild turkey or duck genetic studies:
Wild Turkey DNA Project
Duck DNA Project
Happy New Year and happy hunting from The MeatEater Podcast Team!