Dems Try to Smear Trump with Epstein Emails, and Culture Shift Right, with Batya Ungar-Sargon and Barry Morgenstein | Ep. 1192

Summary

---

The Megyn Kelly Show

Episode 1192 – Nov 12, 2025
Title: Dems Try to Smear Trump with Epstein Emails, and Culture Shift Right, with Batya Ungar-Sargon and Barry Morgenstein

---

Episode Overview

This episode centers on the political fallout from the recent release of Jeffrey Epstein emails, with Democrats attempting to implicate former President Trump. Megyn Kelly is joined by Batya Ungar-Sargon (NewsNation host) and later photographer Barry Morgenstein. The discussion explores the media framing around the Epstein documents, the credibility of key figures involved, the current shift in American cultural and political sentiment, GOP immigration policy, the culture war over women’s spaces, and ends with an interview about “Rock and Soul,” a new book of music photography.

---

Key Topics and Discussion Points

1. Epstein Email Document Dump: Weaponizing Scandals (03:02–31:48)

A. Dems Target Trump with Epstein Emails (03:02–11:00)

• Context: House Oversight Committee subpoenaed 33,000+ Epstein-related documents; Dems focus on three emails involving Trump.
• Key Email: From Epstein to Ghislaine Maxwell (04/02/2011):
  “I want you to realize that that dog that hasn’t barked is Trump...”
  The victim’s name was redacted by Democrats, allegedly to suggest Trump had been accused.
• Redaction Controversy:
  • GOP claims the “victim” is Virginia Giuffre, who publicly denied Trump wrongdoing.
  • Batya (08:27):

    “They knew if they left her name in, this would be totally dismissed because she has been revealed to be a serial fabricator... to see the Democrats racing to take the word of an actual pedophile... just so they can smear Donald Trump, it’s just so gross.”

B. The Giuffre Credibility Issue (10:23–16:41)

• Megyn details Giuffre’s public statements and contradictory claims, especially her debunked Dershowitz allegations.
• Quote (12:46):

  “That is what was behind the Giuffre accusation that ruined Allen’s [Dershowitz] life. People still think he was an Epstein sex trafficker. It’s a lie.”

• Cites her posthumous memoir and co-author, both stating Trump was never implicated.

C. Dangers of Unfiltered Document Releases (16:41–20:00)

• Batya voices concern about innocent people being “destroyed” by public opinion, citing Dershowitz as a permanent victim of false allegations.
• Megyn’s stance:

  “If you’re going to do it, you’re going to have to release the victims’ names... these guys have the right to confront their accuser.” (18:26)

D. The Other Two Emails: Wolf's PR Advice & Ambiguous Allegations (20:00–28:06)

• 2nd Email (Michael Wolf–Epstein, Dec 2015):
  Wolf suggests letting Trump “hang himself” over questions about his ties to Epstein. Megyn:

  “My conclusion from this is Michael Wolf is gross... trying to get leverage.”

• 3rd Email (Epstein–Wolf, Jan 2019):
  Mentions Trump asking Epstein to resign from Mar-a-Lago, and a cryptic line:
  “Of course he knew about the girls as he asked Ghislaine to stop.”
  • Both Megyn and Batya see nothing incriminating; Megyn:

    “This is ambiguous... if I were a Democrat, I’d be blowing this up and asking... what it means.” (24:00)

  • Batya:

    “It suggests that Trump... knew that Jeffrey Epstein liked them young and didn’t approve of it. So I don’t see how this is incriminating at all.” (24:07)

E. Republicans Lose Interest, Dems Overreach (28:06–31:48)

• Discussion shifts to why the Republican base no longer obsesses over Epstein: the Dems “weaponized” the story.
• Megyn:

  “It changed from like a genuine search for truth... into just a political weapon.” (27:07)

• Batya:

  “There was obvious money grubbing… grown women talking about themselves like they were children... That’s really off-putting.” (28:14)

---

2. Culture War: Gender, Women’s Spaces, and Trans Activism (53:00–68:05)

A. Tish Hyman vs. Scott Wiener – The Locker Room Showdown (56:54–61:21)

• Tish Hyman, black lesbian kicked out of Gold’s Gym for confronting a trans-identifying male in the women’s locker room, confronts California progressive politician Scott Wiener at a campaign event.
• Stand-out moment:
  • Tish questions Wiener:
    “Are you going to protect women? Not trans women, women, women... I was assaulted by men.” (57:42)
  • Wiener responds:
    “We want everyone to be safe... trans women are women.”
• Tish insists:
  “We cannot be raped in bathrooms by men who want to say they're women. They're not women. They're not women.” (59:06)

B. The Intersectionality Shield and ‘Truth Bomb’ (61:21–65:21)

• Batya:

  “A large part of why she was able to do that is because she was a black lesbian who likes his housing proposals... If a white man had stood up and said the same thing, he would have been booed out of the room. There’s something about that that’s really un-American.” (61:21)

  • Both agree: National mood is rapidly shifting against trans activism in women’s spaces; Megyn credits the bravery of such women for shifting the debate.

C. The Realignment is Here (65:21–68:06)

• Cites the “80/20” dynamic: overwhelming public opposition to transwomen in women’s sports and spaces.
• Megyn notes Jennifer Sey’s brand and the symbolism of cold, hard biological truth:

  “What’s real is there is only XX and XY. There is no such thing as making an X, Y, and XX.” (65:21)

---

3. Immigration and Economic Populism: H1B Visas, Chinese Students, and Tech Bros (37:06–50:06)

A. Trump’s Laura Ingraham Interview: Out-of-step with MAGA? (37:06–41:12)

• Trump defends foreign student enrollment and H1B visas, arguing U.S. higher ed would fold otherwise—sparks criticism from Ingraham and panel.
• Batya:

  “Zero [foreign students]... Every one of those spots should go to a black kid or a kid from Appalachia. It’s such chutzpah to be giving the greatest privilege in American education to our enemies.” (39:14)

  • Sees Trump’s stance as transactional with Xi Jinping.

B. H1B Labor and Its Effects (41:12–48:42)

• Batya:

  “The H1B visa holders who come in here, they are not specialized. They have no talent... they are willing to work for $50,000 a year... It’s such a slap in the face to the American worker. Train them. Train everyone.” (42:43)

• Megyn:

  “If they actually have special skills we can’t get here, you’d imagine they would get the top of the pay scale, not the bottom.” (48:19)

C. The Broader Impact (48:42–50:06)

• Batya points to the high percentage of foreign-born residents (16%) as a driver of wage stagnation and inability for younger Americans to afford homes, food, and essentials—argues for a working-class-focused immigration policy.

---

4. Media, Information Ecosystems, and Narrative Control (72:18–77:57)

A. CNN’s Abby Phillip and Joy Reid: Echo Chambers (72:18–77:57)

• Abby Phillip claims her job is “debunking” conservative conspiracies for CNN viewers.
• Megyn:

  “Abby Phillip is a liar. What she did in that clip with Joy Reid is lie from start to finish to paint herself as something better than what she is.” (77:57)

• Batya (defensively but critically):

  “What we are is looking at the same clip and to the left, this is the worst thing they’ve ever heard, and to the right, finally somebody represented exactly how we feel... That is actually very healthy.” (75:40)

---

5. Political Process Debate: The Filibuster & Court Packing (80:46–86:28)

A. Should the Filibuster Go? Carville’s Warning (80:46–84:22)

• James Carville predicts Dems will pack the Supreme Court and make radical changes if GOP ends minority protections in the Senate.
• Batya:

  “Don’t get rid of the filibuster... It’s an extremely important check on the power. And also, it gives more gravitas to the Senate...” (81:55)

• Both agree: Eliminating the filibuster would eventually backfire on the right.

---

6. Featured Interview: Barry Morgenstein, “Rock and Soul” (91:08–103:38)

A. Backstage Tales & Rock Legends

• Megyn introduces Barry as her longtime headshot photographer ("no one does it better"); highlights the new coffee table book “Rock and Soul.”
• Barry recounts stories from photographing Paul McCartney ("pretty starstruck," 93:00), assisting Elton John on stage, and being invited to sit by Tina Turner in her limo (“come sit next to me, baby”—95:00).
• A lighter side: Tommy Lee offering Jack Daniel’s at 9AM; Ace Frehley (KISS) being difficult.

B. Cancel Culture & Personal Politics (100:13–103:38)

• Barry describes getting “canceled” in his photography business due to his conservative, pro-Trump beliefs:

  “I get canceled… when they find out that I’m a conservative, pro-Trump guy, MAGA, whatever you want to call it, hell yeah, I get canceled.” (100:13)

• Megyn urges listeners to support Barry’s work, both for its quality and as pushback against leftist bias in arts media.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Batya Ungar-Sargon (on Epstein-giuffre redaction):

  “If this is all they could find in there on Donald Trump and Epstein, Trump is in a really good place.” (08:27)

• Megyn Kelly (on media framing):

  “We know virtually everything about the man’s sex life, unfortunately. And we would know if he had a penchant for the super young girls at this point.” (29:19)

• Tish Hyman (at Wiener event):

  “We cannot be raped in the bathrooms by men that want to say they're women. They're not women.” (59:06)

• Batya Ungar-Sargon (on legal immigration):

  “People ask me a lot, what is the correct number of immigrants into America right now?... It’s somewhere close to zero.” (44:11)

• James Carville (on court packing):

  “They are going to recommend 13 [justices] and a Democratic Senate and House... That’s going to happen, people. That’s going to happen to you.” (80:46)

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Epstein Email Discussion Kickoff: 03:02
• Giuffre Evidence and Redactions: 08:27, 10:23, 12:46
• Dangers of Document Dumps: 16:41
• Other Epstein Emails: 20:00
• Wolf’s PR Advice: 22:00
• Epstein–Trump Fallout: 24:07
• GOP–Dems Culture Shift on Epstein: 28:06
• Hyman–Wiener Exchange: 56:54–61:21
• Immigration/Visas Segment: 37:06–50:06
• Abby Phillip Media Critique: 72:18–77:57
• Filibuster & Court: Carville: 80:46
• Barry Morgenstein Interview: 91:08–103:38

---

Tone and Language

• Megyn Kelly: Direct, sarcastic, and unapologetically critical—especially of Democrats, mainstream media, and the “trans extremism” currently shaping U.S. culture.
• Batya Ungar-Sargon: Analytical, policy-oriented, sometimes ironic or skeptical, but aligned with Kelly in most critiques.
• Tish Hyman: Passionate, confrontational, and unequivocal on the women’s locker room controversy.

---

Summary Prepared For:
Listeners wanting a rich, structured recap of the episode’s key content, analysis, and tone—without extraneous ads, intros, or non-content chatter.

Transcript

[Megyn Kelly]

Our state has changed a lot in the last 140 years. We know because Multicare has been here guided by a single making our communities healthier. That comes from making courageous decisions, partnering with local communities to grow programs and services, and expanding healthcare access to those who need it most. Together, we're building a healthier future. Learn more@ multicare.org.

[Laura Ingraham]

The holidays mean more travel, more shopping, more time online and.

[Megyn Kelly]

More personal info in more places that.

[Laura Ingraham]

Could expose you more to identity theft.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

But LifeLock monitors millions of data points per second.

[Laura Ingraham]

If your identity is stolen, our US based restoration specialists will fix it, guaranteed your money back. Don't face drained accounts, fraudulent loans or financial losses alone. Get more holiday fun and less holiday worry with Lifelock. Save up to 40% your first year.

[Megyn Kelly]

Visit lifelock.com Specialoffer terms apply. Welcome to the Megyn Kelly show live on Sirius XM channel 111 every weekday at noon East. Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to the Megyn Kelly Show. A big day of news. The Democrats are releasing more Jeffrey Epstein documents trying to tie the disgraced former financier to President Trump, but there are already signs it's not going to work. We'll tell you exactly what's in the emails. Plus, the woman kicked out of Gold's Gym for confronting a man pretending to be a woman in the women's locker room is now making her case to a far left disgusting, gross, horrific politician named Scott Wiener in San Francisco. That's going about as you would expect it to, but it's on tape and we'll show it to you. Joining me now to react to all of this is Batya Angar Sargan. She's host of Batya over on News Nation. Now, I've been talking a lot about Riverbend Ranch lately because I love their steaks. Riverbend Ranch has taken Black Angus beef to a whole new level. For the last 35 years, Riverbend Ranch has been creating a very elite Angus herd by using ultrasound to select genetically superior cattle with a focus on flavor and tenderness. When you buy from Riverbend Ranch, you are not only supporting the 64 Cowboys and Cowgirls and their families who work on the ranch, but you're also supporting over 260 other US ranches and the hundreds of American families who work on them. It is born in the USA, raised in the USA and processed in the USA. It is aged to perfection for 21 days and shipped directly from the ranch to your home. This is not your average Black Angus beef, so order from Riverbendranch.com use the promo code Megan for 20 bucks off your first order and let me know what you think. Riverbendranch.com, promo code. Megan Batya, great to see you.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Thanks so much for having me. Megan, it is such an honor to be here with you.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, I love when you come on. Okay, so there's a lot finally to get to because it's been kind of a slow news time, but it's not today. The Epstein documents have been subpoenaed by the House Oversight Committee. And this is a basically kind of a middle finger to, you know, Trump and Pam Bondi, who didn't want anything more released. But there was enough Republican and Democrat pushback that they did issue subpoenas on the Epstein estate and on the DOJ as well. But most of the documents that we're talking about today have come from the Epstein estate, some 33,000 of them. And the Democrats are now salivating over the latest releases. And I'll read what they say, but my overall take on this Bhatia is why didn't Trump just release these? Just release them. Just release them. Right. Like now he's in the position of being like singled out as the only one allegedly, as opposed to one of a slew of names. The Democrats of course, are going to make a ton of hay over it and I don't know that there's any there, there whatsoever. But I can I concede that they sound bad, they don't sound good. If I were a Democrat, I could easily make some hay with these, which they will. They won't be doing fair and balanced reporting on these over on Ms. Or cnn, et cetera. Right. So it's like to me, this is a self inflicted wound by the Trump administration and it was unnecessary. Um, okay, so here's where things stand. There are three emails that are getting a lot of attention. Hold on. The teeniest tiny little, little font. It's a very small font. Look at it. Look at the report. Has nice big font up here and then the teeny tiny font. Like honestly, even when I was 20, I'm not sure I could have read that without my readers. Okay, here we go. There's one. This one's from Ghislaine Maxwell. Sorry, from Jeffrey Epstein to Ghislaine Maxwell, his right hand woman and sometimes affair partner dated Saturday, April 2, 2011. And he writes to her, I want you to realize that that dog that hasn't barked is Trump. Insert name a victim that's been redacted. That'll come back in our discussion. So just victim spent hours at my house with him. He has never once been mentioned, police chief, et cetera. I'm 75% there now. I don't know what I'm 75% there means, other than possibly he's 75% ready to tell authorities about Trump or something. But this is before Trump was running for office. He was just a businessman and celebrity apprentice host back then, an apprentice host. And this is post Jeffrey Epstein's sweetheart deal, you know, that he cut with the Trump administration a couple years later. And, but the trouble had ARISEN Back in 2008, 2009, originally. So I'm just trying to get my facts, like, straight of when the actual deal was cut under the Trump administration, Alex Acosta. But the trouble started back in 2008 and 2009 when he first got arrested. So there's been like a sequence of events. In any event, this is him saying that allegedly this is the dog that won't hunt, that some victims spent hours at Epstein's house with Trump and, and Trump has never once been mentioned by anyone, including the police chief. That's one. I guess we can just start there. The fact that the word victim is redacted is quite telling Batya. And what we're seeing from House Republicans who are responding to the Democrats immediate attempt to try to play this up is the following. House Oversight Committee tweets out the following, or at least the gop, why did Democrats cover up the name of the alleged victim when the estate, Jeffrey Epstein's estate, which produced this document, did not redact it in the redacted documents provided to the committee. So this is a Democrat redaction, not an Epstein estate redaction. And they wrote it's because this victim, Virginia Giuffre, they out publicly said she never witnessed wrongdoing by President Trump. Democrats are trying to create a fake narrative to slander President Trump. Shame on them. Just for context, Julie K. Brown, the Miami Herald reporter who's broken tons of stories about Epstein, says the three emails were written during critical times in Epstein's life. We'll get to the other two, but as for this one in 2011, she says it was written when the FBI was beginning to suspect that the crimes Epstein committed in Florida in the early 2000s went beyond those he committed in, in Palm Beach. So that's where it stands now because he, he, they were sniffing around him in 2008, I believe he signed that sweetheart deal in 2009. And then it all came back again in like 2015, leading into 16. Trying to remember when it was he was first added as having done much, much more. But. And in any event, the. The Original trouble was 0809 and she's pointing out he's cut this deal in Palm beach. And The FBI by 2011 was starting to suspect that those crimes were just the tip of the iceberg. So what do you make of the redaction of the alleged victim from this very, very damning email, Bhatia?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

It's so hilarious to me because they knew if they left her name and this would be totally dismissed because she has been revealed to be a serial fabricator who had to literally recant her testimony against Alan Dershowitz. She's made up so many things. Her book was initially supposed to be a novel because so much of it was just absolute fabrications. Unfortunately, she took her own life. It's very sad, obviously very troubled. But the idea that this is somehow like a smoking gun for Trump, I think is so utterly ridiculous. To see the Democrats rather racing to take the word of an actual pedophile, Jeffrey Epstein, just so they can smear Donald Trump. It's just so gross. It's like when they went to the trough of Michael Cohen and elevated him as some sort of truth teller because they thought it would hurt Donald Trump. I just think if this is all they could find in there on Donald Trump and Epstein, Trump is in a really good place. We know that he kicked Epstein out of Mar A Lago because he thought he was a creep. So the idea that it's somehow some smoking gun, you know, that he thought he was a creep, I think is so totally ridiculous. The replacement of her name with the word victim tells you everything you need to know. So much of this story is just classic Me too. Overreach. There was that ridiculous press conference where they had woman after woman after woman come up and say, I was a Jeffrey Epstein victim. Half of them, Megan, met Jeffrey Epstein after they were already adults. The idea that they are the victims of pedophilia, it's just everyone should read Michael Tracy's reporting on this. He's just been absolutely, absolutely great. Just, just holding their feet to the fire. And it's just so funny to see the right running with what is a classic MeToo overreach story because they thought the Democrats were sort of holding back on them. It turns out they are. Now, that redaction tells you everything you need to know.

[Megyn Kelly]

The Virginia Giuffre thing is amazing that the fact that they redacted that is just incredible to me. First of all, she outed herself as an Epstein victim. Like, you don't have to protect the identity of a victim when she's outed herself as a victim. Like, and they know this rule because I hate to bring her up, but let's just take Gretchen Carlson, who claims she was a victim of Roger Ailes's, and CNN and the Democrats, they had her testify before Congress. They didn't say, oh, witnessed in shadow, because she outed herself as an alleged victim. And Virginia Giuffre has been, before she died, all over the news. She wrote a memoir. Like, she gave tons of interviews. Why would they redact her name if. If that is in fact the name, as the GOP members of the House Oversight Committee are saying, given the fact that she'd already been outed. So this is ridiculous, and it does suggest there was an ulterior motive. Here's the thing about Virginia Giuffre, and I've said this every time her name has come up since we launched this show in 2020. In 2020. I had on Alan Dershowitz right after we launched. He's a longtime friend, and I saw him come under fire by Virginia Duffrey, and I knew it was a lie. Batya. I've known him a long time. And when you hear a denial that you know is true, it sounds very different from a denial that you think is not true. Just by case in point, we did a thing, a report Yesterday morning on a.m. update about those two baseball players who were accused of throwing balls instead of strikes in certain innings to let people bet on the pitch. And the mlb, to its credit, saw that certain betting would go up in a certain inning on this one closer and this one starter for this team. And they conducted an investigation to see if there was some funny business going on. And sure enough, they concluded there was. They brought in. They referred it to law enforcement. Now, these two guys have been charged. Their denials are both like, he is innocent. He would never do anything to undermine his chances in a game. That is not what a truth teller sounds like. A truth teller says, I never threw a pitch in coordination with any bet anywhere. I always threw my best pitch and the appropriate one for the moment, and never reaped any or sought any reward. Therefore, that. Okay, the denials that Alan Dershowitz issued to Virginia Giuffre sounded like this. I never slept with her ever, anywhere. I never slept with any woman other than my wife ever, anywhere. And there will never be a recording or any proof whatsoever that I did because I didn't. I am factually innocent of the charges against me, and I demand that she come forward with proof that I was where she says I was on these dates when she didn't. He produced his own date books showing he couldn't have been in the places she was alleging. And here is how the Virginia Giuffre allegation. Keep in mind we're talking about this because now it appears she's being used by the Democrats as Trump's alleged accuser. That this is. This is how Virginia Dufrey decided to ruin Alan Dershowitz's life. The first email between Giuffre and a journalist named Sharon Churcher happened in May of 2011. Okay. Right around the time this email between Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell happened, by the way. And this journalist was trying to help Virginia Giuffre sell a book that she was writing then about her experiences with Epstein. Giuffre writes the following email to Sharon Churcher. Hi, Sharon, we're drawing up a contract through her agent right now and getting busy to meet my deadline. I don't know who's her agent is. And getting busy to meet my deadline. Just wondering if you have information on you from when you and I were doing interviews about the J E story. I wanted to put the names of some of the assholes, I mean, oops, I mean to say pedos that Jeffrey Epstein sent me to. With everything going on, my brain feels like mush and it would be a great deal of help. Churchill responded, don't forget Alan Dershowitz. We all suspect Alan is a pedo. And though no proof of that, you probably met him when he was hanging out with J E. That is what was behind the Jiuffrey accusation that ruined Allen's life. People still think he was an Epstein sex trafficker. It's a lie. And while I don't doubt Virginia Giuffre that she fell within the crosshairs of Jeffrey Epstein and was used and abused by him because he was a serial user and abuser. I don't believe one word she said about Alan Dershowitz. And she lied repeatedly about the age she was when she had encounters with the Epstein connections and so on. That's all been caught like ages. She would know that were she was off by several years, that would have made the difference between whether she was a minor or an adult and so on. And that's the woman who now the Democrats want to use as, I guess, their smoking gun against Trump. And here's just one more piece. Okay, one more thing about Giuffre. She published a posthumous memoir, she killed herself. She took her die by suicide last year. And she was working on a memoir at the time and she had a co writer who was ghostwriting it for her, Amy Wallace. And here is what her posthumous memoir titled Nobody's Girl says about Trump, writes about Trump. She describes meeting Trump once at Mar a Lago where her father worked, but does not accuse Trump of wrongdoing. Trump, quote, could not have been friendlier, Giuffre said, adding that he offered to help her find babysitting work. Then the co author, Amy Wallace, who finished the book off, was asked whether Giuffre ever accused Trump of wrongdoing. During their private conversations, Wallace answered, quote, she, Virginia never talked about him in any sense that he was involved in any of this. End quote. Then she goes on to say, quote, as far as she knew, and again, she was there for two plus years, meaning Virginia. But as far as she, Virginia, knew, Trump was not involved in the ring of trafficking that Epstein was working. That is why the Democrats redacted the name Virginia Giuffre from this alleged smoking gun email.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

100%. And all of this is why I am against the release of the full Epstein files. I understand the arguments for it. Don't give the Democrats the power to make these ridiculous redactions. But at the same time, Megan, as you point out, Alan Dershowitz did not recover from that fully. There are still people out there who think he is a pedophile, despite the fact that she was forced by a court to recant that. And so how many other names are in there of people who are completely innocent, but whose lives will be destroyed when this tranche of documents, some of them written by Epstein himself, a serial pedophile, a terrible person whose word should not be trusted or worth anything when that gets out there. I just feel that in the court of public opinion, there are people who will be judged and will never be able to defend themselves, despite being totally innocent, kind of in the way that Trump is now being smeared. Now we can say, look, this is all like obvious nonsense. He obviously didn't do anything. There's no evidence there. But there will always be people who believe that he did do something because of all of this. Just like there are still people who watch the mainstream media. Just yesterday, Megan, someone said to me, well, he did say, fine people on both sides about neo Nazis. Oh, Lord, it's 2025. And they still believe that this is like a mainstream person, a person who actually is in the political world who, honest to God was not lying to me. Honest to God still believes that. And I just feel that it is unfair to people to do that to them because they will not recover. Just like Alan Dershowitz, his reputation never fully recovered.

[Megyn Kelly]

If you're going to do it, you're going to have to release the victims names. I've said this before, this is utter bullshit. But speaking of Gretchen Carlson, when the Fox News investigation went down around Roger Ailes, I remember asking, is he going to know the names of the people who came forward? And my lawyer said to me, yes, he's. He has the right to know, to defend himself. And I said, that's fair, you know, And I was totally like, I didn't want to blow up my relationship with him. I got sucked into that whole thing. But, but I understood fully he had the right to defend himself and that all of us were going to have our names on the line if in fact we came forward. That is part of the deal. What it's like they, it's all, it's kind of bizarre. I understand protecting children. I totally understand protecting the identities of children. But like, honestly, the, even just the whole wide net that prevents sexual assault accusers from being named is strange to me. I'm sorry. I definitely don't want them re victimized. I, I've talked to countless numbers of women who are in this boat, but these guys have the right to confront their accuser. And in today's day and age where we do trial by media, they have the right to have the name out there so people can assess a person's credibility. It's just a question of basic fairness. Let's keep going on the two other emails. Let me get my. Let's go back to little tiny, little Lilliputian font.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I'll just say very quickly, Meghan, Some of the victims, according to Michael Tracy's reporting, don't want their names out there because they settled for millions of dollars. Okay, Right. So there's another piece of this as well. Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

All right. The Jeffrey Epstein money train was no question and allure to many women who may or may not have been caught up in his disgusting behavior. I mean, we'll never know. But there was a period there where they were doling out money like it was candy to any woman who came forward and could prove that she had some relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. That doesn't mean they were all victims. Okay, so here's another one. This is December 16, 2015, I think that says so wait we'll start with no. Yeah. December 15th. Tuesday, December 15th, at 8:00pm and this is from Michael Wolf, the author. He wrote to Epstein. This is when Trump was running for the nomination in December 15th of December 15th of 2015. He writes, I hear CNN planning to ask Trump tonight about his relationship with you, either on air or in scrum afterward. And then Epstein responds a couple hours later, if we were able to craft an answer for him, what do you think it should be? And then Michael Wolf responds to him on 1216 the next day. I think you should let him hang himself. If he says he hasn't been on the plane or to the house, then that gives you a valuable PR and political currency. You can hang him in a way that potentially generates a positive benefit for you. Or, or if it really looks like he could win, you could save him generating a debt. Of course, it is possible that when asked, he'll say, jeffrey is a great guy and has gotten a raw deal and is a victim of political correctness, which is to be outlawed in a Trump regime. Okay, so what does that mean? It really. What my conclusion from this is, Michael Wolf is gross. We knew that yesterday. We'll know it tomorrow. And by the way, we'll know it especially tomorrow. And that's all I'm gonna say. We have a bit of a tease for, for what's coming up on this show. Making good on a promise I made to the audience long ago on Epstein. But in any event, here he is giving PR advice. I mean, whatever, he's not a good guy. I'm sure Jeffrey Epstein needed PR advice by this point in his life, and I'm sure somebody was going to provide it to him. But that's what Wolf was doing, trying to get leverage over the possible next President of the United States. It all came to nothing. But this has got Trump's critics salivating. And then I'll just read you the. The last one, which is the most recent exchange. This is now from 2019, which is when Epstein got arrested. This is from Epstein to Michael Wolf, January 31, 2019. Victim redacted. Mar A Lago. Redact, redact, redact. I don't know what's in there. It doesn't say victim, so he's saying something else, comma, or period. No idea what was redacted. Then he, then he writes, trump said he asked me to resign. Never a member ever. So he's trying to say, Trump wanted me to resign from Mar A Lago, but I was never a member of Mar? A Lago of Course, he knew about the girls as he asked Ghislaine to stop. Now, that's the most incriminating thing that's in any of these emails, but we have no idea what it means. Of course he knew about the girls. He asked Ghislaine to stop. Stop. What is this? Trump found out that Epstein liked him young, something Trump has said himself on camera, and he went to Ghislaine to say, whatever you're doing, stop. Because that doesn't make Trump look bad. Though it may be inconsistent with Trump's denials of knowing you know, much at all about what Epstein was doing. I don't know. I haven't poured through Trump's specifics on that, but this is ambiguous. However, this is kind of what made me say, wouldn't it be better for Trump if he just said, release it all? I'm not worried about any of this. Rather than letting it come out piecemeal, they discovered it from the Epstein estate and Trump had clearly directed Bondi not to produce anything. Like, if I were a Democrat, to be honest, Bhatia, I'd be blowing this up and asking over and over again what it means.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

It's so interesting because to me, that sounds exactly like something we already knew, which is, it's been reported that the reason he asked Epstein to stop coming to Mar A Lago was because he would hit on the daughters of the members. Like that. That was, like, out there reported. So I don't see how this is incriminating at all. It suggests that Trump, like you said, knew that Jeffrey Epstein liked them young and didn't approve of it. So we don't know when Jeffrey was talking about in that moment. So I don't really see this. And honestly, I think Trump's instincts are so spot on about this because to me, it seems like all of the energy around the Jeffrey Epstein files is really coming from Democrats who hate Trump and hate Trump voters, and then people who are in the content business for whom, before Trump was elected, this was a really big topic. This generated a lot of interest from people. But now that Trump is the president, if you look at public opinion polling of Republicans, they're just not that interested in this. And I think Trump just feels like he can ride this out and why feed it? Because it's only his enemies making hay out of it. And the mainstream media just does not have that same power that it used to have. Meghan, you have all that power now to set the agenda. So I think that's kind of maybe how he's Seeing it.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yep. I mean that, I understand that, that rationale. Just for the record, Trump has said he stopped speaking to Epstein because Epstein stole workers from Mar A Lago's spa. Now, that is what happened with Virginia Giuffre. Virginia was a worker in the Mar A Lago spa and Jeffrey Epstein did steal her to go work for him. So Trump is saying that's why he's not leaning into the. He was sniffing around young girls. And so I told him he had to leave Mar A Lago story. There's another story that he broke up with Epstein because they were Buzz. There's no question. They were very close for more than 10 years, which is what makes me believe Trump was on the Epstein plane and at Epstein's house, of course, they were very good friends. But there's another story that Epstein took Trump to go see a property with him that Epstein was thinking of buying out of bankruptcy and he wanted Trump to advise him on the property. And instead of advising him, Trump bought it. He bought it out from under Epstein. So I don't know why they broke up. But, you know, we're having to relive all of this nonsense because the whole. There's a number of reasons why, because Trump and several Trump accolades or acolytes have made a very big deal out of Jeffrey Epstein. I mean, I don't think you can absolve Trump of that at all. Bhatia. It's like Dan Bongino and Cash Patel were the two top Epstein, you know, theory pushers. I don't call it a conspiracy theory because I actually, they might have very well been onto something, you know, that there was a cover up of Epstein. And then that's why it was so shocking when Trump got into power and then said, what story? What are you talking about? This is a nothing burger. Trump had not been out in front on it as the people he hired to run like the FBI. You know, it's not like they put them in charge of hhs, you know, like the FBI. So that's, that's how Republicans got into this because it was buried under Biden. They didn't understand why we didn't get any answers. And then they thought when Trump took over, we would. And instead Trump did what Biden had done, which was, there's no there there. I'm not, not releasing anything on this. And some Republicans are still burned by it. You know, MTG spoke with her last week. She's still out there saying, I demand answers on this. I want to see all the files. A couple of other Republicans are with her, like Massie and some others. And. But you're right, the reason that Republicans have lost interest for the most part in this is because the Democrats took it as their own, as, like, they do with everything went too far. It changed from like a genuine search for truth, which I think Republicans really wanted, into just a political weapon to try to bring Trump down, which is what they do with everything. And Republicans are fucking over that game.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, definitely. And I think that that press conference, was it two months ago, three months ago, where you had.

[Megyn Kelly]

With the alleged victims?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah. And Thomas Massie with this parade of. It was just, it just, it was so sordid and, you know, the promise of salacious details and then the women saying, actually, we're gonna make our own list. You know, like the whole thing was. So where's that? Exactly. And it just seemed like, you know, there was a lot, like, obvious, obvious money grubbing, obvious, you know, coming together of the two sides, because both sides see themselves as Trump's political opponents and enemies. The politicization, the money aspect of it, these women who were grown ups when they met Jeffrey Epstein, talking about themselves like they were children at the time, to me, that's really off putting. It's kind of a slap in the face to the actual victims. The Virginia Giuffre aspect, where there was just lie upon lie upon lie. Like the idea that this is kind of something that's gonna bring Trump down with his own base, with the other side, I just find it to be all so sorted.

[Megyn Kelly]

Moreover, you know, Jeffrey Epstein, there are countless, countless numbers of women, young women who were brought into his houses and to his island and paid for, quote, a massage with a happy ending, for lack of a better term. I mean, countless numbers of women. And he did like them young. And there were several young women who he did this to who were minors, who were underage. There's just no question about that. That is a true fact about Jeffrey Epstein, but that is not a true fact about Donald Trump. And if Donald Trump allegedly liked the barely legal type, we would know, Batya. We would know. We, we know virtually everything about the man's sex life, unfortunately. And we would know if he had a penchant for the super young girls at this point. Like he ran the Miss Universe contest. Like, yes, we heard a story about him possibly going backstage into the dressing room at least once. Not great, not particularly shocking given how Trump was when he was younger. But we have not seen some slew of young women come forward to Say me too, on Donald Trump molesting them or having paid for sex with them when they were barely legal or otherwise. It just hasn't happened. Yeah.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

In fact, at that same press conference, the lawyer for one of the, For a group of the women actually said Jeffrey Epstein would prey upon women when they were underage. True and disgusting and horrible. And then the lawyer said, and when they came of age and he was no longer interested in them, he would then pass them on. So there was no pedophilia ring. There was a pedophile who did unspeakable things to vulnerable girls. And then they would age out of Jeffrey Epstein's pedophilic interests, at which point he would then start to pass them around to his friends. Meaning that there were not actual crimes committed by anybody beyond, there's no pedophile ring. There's a pedophile and then a bunch of friends who were getting massages at that point from women who were no longer underage. This is from the lawyer at that press conference. So I think that that kind of dispels a lot of the, like, salaciousness of the story. People are like, where is the justice for the victims? The justice is one of the person, the people who did unspeakable things to them died in prison and the other one is still in prison. So, like, they got their justice. And the whole Ring idea, I think, has been wildly blown out of proportion for this.

[Megyn Kelly]

I know about Ring, but there are definitely a couple of very well connected people who have not been brought to justice. I'm not going to repeat the names here, but one of them is a very, very successful business owner. No, it's. I'm not, I'm just, I don't want to get sued. But one of them is a hugely successful business owner who seems to be a bit of a pervert and his name is all over the papers. His connections to Epstein are very, very well known. They were connected financially, they were connected as friends. And like, I want to know more about him. There's plenty who I want to know more about who have been publicly linked to Epstein and seem to have dodged responsibility. That's my own take on it. It's not that I'm not referring to secret names only. I know, I'm talking about names that are in the paper. But again, like, without hardcore proof, you shouldn't say their names because you don't know whether they're true. But yeah, I mean, people know the names. We've heard them many, many times. Anyway, I do think there are Some who are so well connected or did such a good job of hiding their tracks that they'll never be facing real charges. As for Epstein, I've said this before, but just as a reminder, I do know somebody very, very close to this case who is in a position to know virtually everything. Not everything, but virtually everything. And this person has told me from the start, years and years ago, that Jeffrey Epstein, in this person's view, was not a pedophile. This is this person's view who was there for a lot of this, but that he was into the barely legal type. Like he liked 15 year old girls. And I realize this is disgusting. I'm definitely not trying to make an excuse for this. I'm just giving you facts that he wasn't into like 8 year olds, but he liked the very young teen types that could pass for even younger than they were, but would look legal to a passerby. And that is what I believed and that was what I reliably was told for many years. And it wasn't until we heard from Pam Bondi that they had tens of thousands of videos of alleged, forgive me, they used to call it kitty porn. Now they call it child sexual abuse material on his computer that for the first time I thought, oh no, he was an actual pedophile. I mean, only a pedophile gets off on young children abuse videos. She's never clarified it. I don't know whether it's true. I have to be honest. I don't really trust Pam Bondi's word on the Epstein matters anymore or anything else. Yeah, so I don't know what's true about him, but we have yet to see anybody come forward and say I was a, like a, I was under 10, I was under 14 when I first came within his purview. I look, it's. You can say that's a distinction without a difference. I think there is a difference. There's a difference between a 15 year old and a 5 year old. You know, it's just whatever, it's sick because every time we start talking about Epstein, it makes your skin crawl. You write it. The whole thing is just disgusting.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Totally.

[Megyn Kelly]

Anyway, well, what do you think? Does this stay in the news around Trump? Cause I'll give you a couple of reactions here you got Alex Berenson, who's a straight shooter, great reporter, writing. So at real Donald Trump, quote, knew about the girls quoting Epstein, and at Michael Wolf is an even bigger scumbag than any of us knew and we all knew. He writes that he was an Enormous scumbag. Trump cannot bluster his way out of this. He better accept that whatever is in the files is coming out good, he writes. And then there's more. Mike Sternovich on X, who's a great follow, writes, trump broke everyone's heart with this line about, oh, sorry, that's a different one. That's different. That's different criticism on Trump on his H1B visas, which we'll get to, confused my two stories. But there was more on Trump, just some pushback on whether this is his own fault. So I don't know, does this go away in a day or is this with us for a while?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Well, honestly, I have to say, it's funny you brought up the H1B visas. Like, it's not necessarily terrible for Trump for the next 24 hours to be an Epstein news cycle, because the news cycle was really bad this morning before this broke. He had this disastrous interview with Laura Ingraham in which he really, really went against what MAGA wants on the Chinese students in universities and then the H1B visas. There's the affordability crisis, which he's not doing a great job of responding, responding to and showing empathy for. So, you know, it's. In my view, you know, the news cycle was actually a lot worse for him before this broke because he knows how to get through a Jeffrey Epstein news cycle.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, can you imagine if it shifts now? If Pam Bondi's like, I'm gonna release it all, I changed my mind.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Exactly. Doesn't have to worry about the midterms for 48 hours. Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's like, this is a very good point. Like is maybe Trump told the House Oversight Committee to just release it. Do it. Go do me a solid, too, and redact the name Virginia Giuffre. That'll give him a lot to chew on. Okay, let's keep going. Let's do H1BS and the Ingram interview, because she did make a lot of news with him. So you mentioned the Chinese students. Take a look at this. You've said as many as 600,000 Chinese students could come to the United States. Why, sir, is that a pro MAGA position when so many American kids want to go to school and there are places not for them, and these universities are getting rich off Chinese money.

[Laura Ingraham]

Never said about China, but we do have a lot of people coming in from China. We always have China and other countries. We also have a massive system of colleges and universities. And if we were to cut that in half, which perhaps makes some people happy, you would have Half the colleges in the United States go out of business.

[Barry Morgenstein]

So what?

[Laura Ingraham]

Well, I think that's a big deal. But you would have, as you know, historically black colleges and universities would all be out of business, that you would have a system of colleges and universities.

[Megyn Kelly]

So we're dependent on China to keep our university system going.

[Laura Ingraham]

But I think it's good to have. I actually think it's good to have outside countries. Look, I want to be able to get along with the world. And it's not that I want them, but I view it as a business. You don't want to cut half of the people, half of the students from all over the world that are coming into our country, destroy our entire university and college system. I don't want to do that.

[Megyn Kelly]

I wouldn't lose any.

[Laura Ingraham]

And don't forget, MAGA was my idea. MAGA was nobody else's idea. I know what MAGA wants better than anybody else.

[Megyn Kelly]

That is so Trump.

[Barry Morgenstein]

He.

[Megyn Kelly]

He said that to me, too. After my interview with him in 23. He said, Maga's not going to like that interview. And then I actually said back to him, maga will feel about it however you tell them to. You know, it's like if you telegraph you had a good interview, they'll like it. If you say it sucked, they'll go a different way. But that he clearly does believe that, like, MAGA will do whatever he says.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I think there are two areas where he is vulnerable to his own base, and it's because their love and attachment to him is based on these two things. It's the fighting of China and the American elites that support them, like our university system. And then the immigration front, and he does not have a lot of wiggle room there. It's funny. Mark Halperin, who's in your network, on the Megyn Kelly network, he asked me once on one of his shows, what's the correct number of Chinese or foreign students we should have in American universities? And my answer was zero.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, zero. I'm with you, Bhatia for president.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Zero. Every one of those spots should go to a black kid or a kid from Appalachia. It is such an absolute chutzpah to be giving the greatest privilege in American education to our enemies and not going and recruiting that talent here at home. And it's the exact same thing with the H1B visas. Donald Trump was not elected because he tweets mean things. He was elected to put Americans first. And that is what it looks like. It says, you know what? If you're A university that, by the way, is spouting anti American rhetoric day in and day out, teaching young people both on the right and the left to hate America and hate the values this nation was founded on. And you're only able to stay in business because of Chinese Communist Party apparatchiks flooding our system. Go out of business. This would be so great for America. All of those billions of dollars that the taxpayer gives to higher ed will give it to vocational training. Let's start building training centers in AI in the south and in the Midwest, and let's give Americans a fair shot at the American dream. That is why Donald Trump was elected. And so to see him now, honestly, I think this is actually about tariffs. I think that he realized in the fight with Xi Jinping that this was a huge bargaining chip for Xi, that Xi would actually back down on the economic fight if Trump would promise him those 600,000 spots for these CCP future apparatus.

[Megyn Kelly]

Ratchet.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

It's extremely. It's infuriating. But I think in Trump's mind, I don't think he's betraying America. I think in his mind, he made a calculation that his tariff program falls or rises with whether he can get a deal with China. This is extremely important for reshoring manufacturing, and if this is what Xi wants, he's willing to give it to him. But I do think that clips like that just make the base feel like, this is not what I voted for.

[Megyn Kelly]

Mm, definitely not. All right. The H1B visas, which are typically given. I mean, they're. The vast majority of them are given to people from India, and they come and they work in tech for the most part, which is why people like Elon Musk very much support them. Elon says he came on an H1B visa initially and that it helped him. But a couple of examples of how those visas are typically given. Software engineers, IT specialists, scientists, researchers, accountants, architects, engineers, medical professionals, and so on, have to be, like, specialized. That's generally how you get one. You have, like, special skills. That's what they say. Then you can get an H1 visa, H1B visa to come over to the United States and work here. And there is a real debate between especially the techies and the Trumpies on whether these are good. So Laura asked him about the H1B visas. Here's how that went.

[Laura Ingraham]

There's never going to be a country like what we have right now. And does that mean Republicans have to talk about it?

[Megyn Kelly]

And does that mean the H1B visa thing will not be a Big priority for your administration because if you want to raise wages for American workers, you can't flood the country with, with tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of foreign workers.

[Laura Ingraham]

Also do have to bring in talent when. No, you don't. No, you don't.

[Megyn Kelly]

We don't have talented people.

[Laura Ingraham]

No, you don't have. You don't have certain talents. And you have to. People have to learn. You can't take people off an unemployment, like an unemployment line and say, I'm going to put you into a factory. We're going to make missiles.

[Megyn Kelly]

Does he have a point or how.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Do you see it just so, so bad. This is exactly what Elon Musk and Vivek Ramaswamy were saying at that big blow up over Christmas where they were saying, I'm sorry, we just don't have the talent here. It's such a slap in the face to the American worker. Train them. Train everyone. The H1B visa holders who come in here, they are not specialized. They have no talent. You know what their talent is, Megan? They're willing to work for $50,000 a year. Exactly. They have driven down the wages in stem, which means that our brightest kids are not going into stem because what are you going to do? Like graduate after four years with student loans and take a job where you're making 50k? You're not going to do that. So you're out. We're actually driving our brilliant Americans out of state stem because we're importing Indians to do those jobs. It is so atrocious and terrible and it is such a betrayal of the American worker. And this is a fight we absolutely have to have right now because Trump has done an amazing job of attracting. I think the number at this point is about $15 trillion in manufacturing here and everything around that. So much of that is going to be AI training and AI work. And we need to insist that every one of those jobs goes to an American. You know, again, like, people ask me a lot, what is the correct number of immigrants into America right now? And my answer is kind of the same, Megan. It's somewhere close to zero. Like, it might not be zero. There maybe is another Elon Musk out there who really wants to come here. But right now we're just bringing in, you know, bargain basement programmers when those could be middle class jobs for American workers, Americans who are struggling right now. There's why are so many people on food stamps? Why is health care so expensive? I mean, these are the questions we have to be having. And the affordability question is totally, totally inseparable from this question of immigration. The fact that we have so many immigrants in this country is a huge reason why Americans make so little and are struggling with basics like food. If you think about it, Megan, every illegal immigrant in America is either working, meaning they're driving down the wages in that industry, or they're living off the government, meaning the American taxpayer is subsidizing them. There's no in between. Right. They're not being funded by somebody in their home country to live here in America. Both of those options are utterly, utterly unacceptable, which is why in every single poll, the vast majority of Americans, 56%.

[Tish Hyman]

Okay.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

A solid majority, supports deporting every single illegal immigrant. And it seems now like what the Trump administration is saying is, okay, we're going to counteract the deportation program with expanding the legal immigrants program. Kristi Noem this morning said that there.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, I have that. Hold on, I'll play it. Kristi Noem went on FOX and Friends this morning and said this. What is the administration's position on these visas? Now? We're going to keep using our visa programs. We're just going to make sure that they have integrity, that we're actually doing the vetting of the individuals who come into this country, that they want to be here for the right reasons, that they're not supporters of terrorists and organizations that hate America. And that's what I think is so remarkable, is under the Trump administration, we've sped up our process and added integrity to the visa programs, to green cards, to all of that. But also more people are becoming naturalized under this administration than ever before. More people are becoming citizens because we're not just streamlining and building some processes back into our immigration policies. We're also making sure that these individuals that are coming into our country and get that privilege, that they actually are here for the right reasons. That was in defense of H1B visas, saying, you know, we're coming, but we're getting the best. We're not getting people who hate America anymore. And then that's the second point about more becoming naturalized. I was like, she thinks she's on cnn. That is definitely not what the Fox viewers want to hear.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

It's funny because, you know, Trump won because he cobbled together an unbelievably diverse coalition. He brought in record numbers of Jewish Americans and black Americans and Hispanic Americans into the Republican Party and also these sort of tech bro oligarchs. And the thing that the tech bro oligarchs want is access to cheap labor because of course they want.

[Megyn Kelly]

They want these visas.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Exactly. They want these visas. They want a limit. Elon Musk said, this is the hill I will die on. You can go f yourself in the face if you're. This is literally what he tweeted. If you're going to fight me on this. Now, people like that who are very, very, very wealthy and want this like limitless stream of low wage labor, their problem is very similar, symbolic. They really don't like seeing people like Mahmoud Khalil, a person who got the greatest privilege on earth an American green card, and used it to attack America and to support Hamas and support terrorism. They don't like that. Of course, I obviously don't like that either. But that is not the number one problem we're facing with mass immigration. The number one problem we're facing is that people who are not our neighbors are being subsidized by our poor neighbors. Taxpayer dollars to live here, to live in homes so that there's a housing crisis, to work in their industries and drive down the wages and to basically immiserate the working class, they're being forced to pay for their competition, their replacements in the labor force.

[Megyn Kelly]

So it's not like one here or there. It'd be one thing. They really were bringing specialized people. But it's like hundreds of these visas for like one tech company, all from India, all low wage. If they're so special, why aren't they getting higher wage?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

Like if they actually have special skills that we can't get here, you would imagine they would get the top of the pay scale, not the bottom.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, it's like about 500,000 of them over. I don't, I don't remember the exact period of time, but already when you're talking about 500,000 people, it's not specialized. Right. It's an entire wage sector. It's an entire sector of the economy. So you have illegals competing with working class people. You now have the H1BS competing with what would have been middle class jobs. Of course, $50,000 a year now is not a middle class job anymore. Right. So you're just dragging everybody down with this. So back in the 70s, which was the high watermark for working class wages, where they could afford the American dream on a single income, buy a home, et cetera. The kind of ideal that we look back to, the percentage of Americans living on American soil, people living on American soil who were not born here was 4%, was a historic low. Today, Megan, it's 15 or 16%. It's never been this high in American history. That is why young people can't afford to buy homes. That is why people can't afford health care. That is why 42 million people are on food stamps because they cannot command the wages that would give them a middle class standard of living because they are competing with 16% of the people here who were not born in the United States. That's the number one problem for the working class and that should be the number one issue for Republicans going forward.

[Megyn Kelly]

Wow. Here is the Mike Cernovich tweet. Trump broke everyone's heart with this line about the American workforce and H1BS suggesting we don't have workers who can do it. Then there's Anthony Sabatini. He's a vocal pro. Trump, Lake county commissioner in Florida, who wrote this is insane. We're going to lose the midterms so badly. We've never seen an administration crash and burn in its first year so badly for no reason other than to appease donors and special interests. I think that overstates it by far. He's, he's not crashing and burning so badly. But this was a, this was a misstep this morning that, those clips from Laura, they're not going to help. But you know, look, Trump, as you point out, has his reasons and he's playing like a master game when it, when it comes to like his policy, balancing, as you point out, the foreign policy with the domestic and is asking us to trust him. That's eroding even among his base with comments like that. Stand by, more to come after this break. You know all those fad diets, half of Americans do it. And if you do it enough, you could be at risk of diabetes, liver damage, heart attack and stroke. Weight cycling is when you lose 10 or more pounds, but then you put the pounds back plus a couple more. That puts tremendous strain on your organs and leads to serious health issues. Bottom line, most people need help to stop weight cycling. And this is why I want to tell you about non prescription Lean. Created by doctors, Lean is an oral supplement, not a GLP1 injectable. It uses studied ingredients which Lean says target weight loss in three powerful ways. Maintaining healthy blood sugar, helping control appetite and cravings and burning fat by converting it to energy. And burning fat helps keep the weight off. If you want to lose meaningful weight at a healthy pace and keep it off, consider adding lean to your diet and exercise lifestyle. Get 20% off when you enter [e-mail]. that's [e-mail] Our state has changed a lot in the last 140 years. We know because Multicare has been here guided by a single making our communities healthier. That comes from making courageous decisions, partnering with local communities to grow programs and services, and expanding healthcare access to those who need it most. Together, we're building a healthier future. Learn [e-mail].

[Laura Ingraham]

So you've got your streaming subscriptions sorted, but every now and then.

[Megyn Kelly]

Live TV FOMO hits hard Good news with passes by Sling get instant access to live TV when you want it.

[Laura Ingraham]

Big football game tonight?

[Megyn Kelly]

Grab a day pass baseball series? Try a week pass show or movie marathon.

[Tish Hyman]

You guessed it.

[Megyn Kelly]

Weekend pass Introducing passes.

[Laura Ingraham]

Get the live TV you love for the day, week or weekend starting at 499.

[Megyn Kelly]

Sling lets you do that offer applies to Orange Day Pass restrictions apply. All right, let's go. Isn't it great to be together? It's so great to see you. You're not alone. It's only the liberal media and the haters who want you to think that we're in the majority right now. Don't miss your last chance to be part of the Megyn Kelly Live Tour. Next stops Bakersfield, Anaheim and the grand finale in Glendale, Arizona featuring special guest America Kirk. So go get your tickets right now before they sell out. MeganKelly.com presented by Y Refi and Sirius XM. I wanted to tell you, while I have your attention, that the Megyn Kelly Wrap up show launched this week. It airs right after our show airs. So it begins at 2pm Eastern on the Megyn Kelly Channel 111 on Sirius XM and it is hosted by none other than Emily Jashinsky. Who doesn't want to talk to Emily. She's hilarious, she's brilliant, she's relevant, she's young, she's really interesting and you can talk to her directly. Give your thoughts on today's episode or anything else on your mind by calling in the numbers you can 83344 Megan just remember that it's spelled M E G Y N because my mom couldn't spell 83344 M E G Y N which is 833-446-3496. You can call at any time. If you want to get on the on the line, you can just get on and put it on hold so that you're one of the first. And call in and let Emily know what you think of her. The news, the show. She's happy to talk with you. So that's coming up next live on SiriusXM channel 111. Back with me now, Bhatja Unger Sargan. She's host of Batya on News Nation. All right, so there is a hero in the news. She's been amazing, this gal, and she is not effing around. Her name is Tish Hyman and she is an out lesbian. She is a black woman. She lives in California and she is the one who got kicked out of Gold's Gym, her gym, last week because she objected to a very problematic male pretending to be a woman in her locker room. Gold's handled it all the wrong way. Unfortunately for all of us, they handled it because California state law requires any establishment to allow someone to use the locker room or bathroom that aligns with their gender identity. So Gold's was not above board in the way they dealt with this. But unfortunately for Gold's and every other business in California, they really don't have a lot of choice. They have to let these losers hang out in female spaces. Great job, Californians. Great job. Anyway, Tish is just amazing and she is now a woman on a mission. She's a total ball buster. I'm in love with this gal. She's just so fierce. So she decides to show up to the first public campaign interview given by the disgusting, horrific, awful Scott Weiner. Don't vote for him. I'm begging you. I'm begging you. If you are in California and in Nancy Pelosi's district where he's running for her soon to be vacant seat, please vote for anyone other than Scott Wiener. He is the worst politician in America. He is my number one most loathed politician. There's no one who's done more to trans children than this man. No one. I'm telling you, he's very strange. He's very creepy. There's something about this guy that really creeps me out. And she Tish showed up at his event and decided to ask some questions. We've butted a bunch of the exchanges together. Let's watch them. Here they are.

[Tish Hyman]

As a lesbian woman who was attacked in a woman's locker room at Gold's Gym this week by a self identifying trans woman with a documented history of domestic violence? I'm deeply concerned about women's safety in a female only spaces. What would you say to women who are seeking assurance that their safety will be protected from men who by California law can self ID as women in women only spaces? Sir, please tell me.

[Laura Ingraham]

Yeah, so we want, I mean everyone to be safe. And we also know that you Know, we have trans. Trans people, both men and women, who are men and women. And so, you know, we. So if you're a. Trans women are women.

[Tish Hyman]

And I'm telling you as a woman first and foremost that this is dangerous and we need your help because you're in the office, you're going to go into publicity spot. I want to support you. I have millions of people behind me watching this right now. And we want to know, are you going to protect women? Not trans women, women, women. Trans women are different things. Women, women. Listen, we need to protect women's safety. I was assaulted. No, they are not. They are men. I was assaulted by men.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

He had.

[Megyn Kelly]

He broke his license.

[Tish Hyman]

So Brad, she needed reconstructive surgery. I'm a lesbian. I'm not transphobic. And I'm black. So if there's another black woman in here who wants to tell me how they feel, please join in. But all of you are not. And I don't know who you are, what you are, but I'm a lesbian and I'm telling you right now, men are harassing women in the locker room.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Let's let him.

[Megyn Kelly]

Let him answer the question.

[Tish Hyman]

I'm just telling you since I want.

[Megyn Kelly]

To woo, woo, woo.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

No, just let's.

[Megyn Kelly]

Let's.

[Tish Hyman]

Now I'm done. And by the way, I respect what you have done. I just want to let you know.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

That.

[Laura Ingraham]

I appreciate your point of view. I'm so sorry that you were.

[Tish Hyman]

Multiple times.

[Laura Ingraham]

I appreciate you talking about it. I think we need to protect the safety of all women. And obviously that's incredibly important. I also know that trans women are also brutalized in this country. So women and cisgender women are brutalized in this country. And we have to protect the safety of all women.

[Tish Hyman]

We have to protect women. We cannot be raped in the bathrooms by men that want to say they're women. They're not women. They're not women. I'm leaving. It's okay, but I'm not going to take it. I am leaving because you know what? You guys are not protecting women. You're doing a lot. The bills that you're passing for the law, I read a lot of them.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

They're great.

[Tish Hyman]

But this things with the chance, it's not right.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Thank you very much.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's like having a view into what's happening on Saturn. I don't understand this community. It's San Francisco. I get it. But how are these LGBs not realizing that the TQs are bizarre, are not part of the same universe, are undermining their youth. They're trying to convert little gay boys into girls because they otherize homosexuality as something that's so disgusting, they have to erase it by turning a gay boy into a female. They're the enemy. And Scott Wiener is the enemy. He's never seen a child who he wouldn't trans. If the kid expresses a modicum of gender confusion, that's clear to me from reading this guy's bills and seeing the way he's behaved in California. He's disgusting. And she goes out there to confront him. And at every turn, Batya, you know, we want everyone to be safe. Everyone. Not. Not with. That's not the issue. We want everyone to be safe. We have trans men and women who are men and women. That's. And then he doubles down. Trans women are women. He says to her, no, they're not. There are men pretending to be us, which he knows but won't admit. Then he goes on. She says, are you going to protect women? He said. And then the crowd starts booing. She said, they're different. The crowd starts booing, booing. And once again, women are not the same as trans women. She says. And he rejects that, saying we have to protect the safety of everyone, and then highlights the fact that trans women are brutalized in this country. That's the issue. It's what's happening to the trans women, not the real women who actually are being attacked, harassed, and in some cases, sexually assaulted by these perverted men pretending to be us in order, in many cases, to gain access to us in vulnerable spaces.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

This clip was so therapeutic to watch because it played out exactly as you would have wanted it to, right? At every step, she just spoke the truth. And everybody around her trying to gaslight her the way they've tried to gaslight the nation, was totally silenced by just the starkness of the truth that she was speaking. She took on that whole room and silenced them for booing her. But Meghan, I also found it very sad, and I'll tell you why. A large part of why she was able to do that is because she was a black lesbian who likes his housing proposals. So what she was basically saying is, I am from an actually marginalized community that you white Boomer progressives recognize that I am oppressed and marginalized. So when I tell you that these trans men are attacking me in the bathroom, you have to listen. And they were forced into submission because of her status as being this, like, double minority. And on the one hand, she's obviously right, but on the other hand, Meghan there's something wrong in our nation, that if a white man had stood up and said the same thing, he would have been booed out of the room. Right? Like, nobody would have been able to accept the truth of what he was saying. And I think that there's something about that that's really un American. It's sort of like anathema to who we are, to where the left will only accept these truths. Not that anybody there really accepted it, but they felt embarrassed to contradict what she was saying because, as you could tell in that room, the whole room was white except for her and a black woman.

[Megyn Kelly]

Shut up.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

They did shut up. And when she left, she said to the black woman, don't let them use our race to transition people, to transition children. She said something along those lines. I do think that the nation was once really sort of enthralled to this view that you can't speak out against the transitioning of children, trans people in women's bathrooms and women's sports. But now, Meghan, I think it's very obvious that this is an 8020 issue and that the nation is where this woman, Tish, is at and not where this wiener is. And I have to say, Megan, a lot of that is because of you, because you really have been such a strong but also intelligent voice on this and doing exactly the thing I'm describing, which is saying, like, it is radicalizing to tell people not to trust what they see with their own eyes. You cannot tell a nation. They have to pretend. You cannot tell a nation that they have to force their daughters into this. And I have to say I had a very similar reaction when the Olympics came out and finally said, no, we're not going to have trans people in women's sports anymore. My first reaction was relief, and my second was horror and shame that we forced girls, young girls, to fight that fight for us as a civilization to be at the forefront of that fight until finally they won. That we forced people like Riley Gaines, you know, girls, children in girls locker rooms to be the face of that fight. Not you, Meghan, because you always had their back. But that a whole, you know, half the country was sort of like, no, actually, like the trans women are the women. Right. And I'm glad that it's won. It seems to me kind of like the gay marriage fight, it's won. It's over. We won. Right? Like, the right side of those two issues. One, like, the country is very pro gay and, like, really not into this trans extremism. But I do Feel that this is gonna be a kind of enduring stain that for so long young girls had to fight this fight by themselves.

[Megyn Kelly]

Totally agree with every word. It's been so upsetting. The IOC definitely floating a trial balloon at least this week, suggesting it's going to restore sanity. It's not official yet, but it looks good that they're going to stop this as opposed to leaving it up to individual sports like boxing, which did such a good job of protecting actual women at the last Olympics. But you're right. Think of all the carnage left in the wake. And I think it's very interesting that Tish, as she was standing up there, was wearing an XX XXY sweatshirt. That's Jennifer say's brand. S ey Jennifer Say, former chief, one of the top chief executives at Levi's who got pushed out because she stood up against the COVID insanity and objected in this same district. I think she was in San Francisco to the lockdowns that affected children, saying, this is very damaging for children and children are not the problem. We should not be locking schools down and keeping the kids out of school. And for that, she lost her whole career. She was a lifelong, very successful, very storied gymnast who participated in the Olympics and all sorts of World cup games or World Games. And she's made this her mission to try to protect young girls, too. And I love seeing her in Tish's. In Tish in Jennifer's sweatshirt, standing up there saying, what's real. What's real is there is only XX and xy. There is no such thing as making an X, Y and xx. And everyone knows it. Scott Weiner. I don't. I have to look into it because I just heard that he was running. He's been a California state representative for a long time. I. There's no way a Republican can win in that district. But there's got to be a more reasonable Democrat. There's got to be an LGB who's going to look out for the LGB's and reject the TQ insanity. And I might, for the first time in my life, actually make a big donation to such a person, if they exist. Who's going to fight Scott Weiner? I'll donate to a Democrat because that seats going to a Democrat. Anybody who will defeat Scott Weiner, I'm telling you, this is the number one most dangerous lawmaker when it comes to this issue. The number one. We've been following him for years. We can do no worse than Scott Wiener. He must be defeated at the ballot box. He must Be. Here's Kerry and Britt, Carrie and Britt, Carrie Prajan and Britt Mayer, who helped open my eyes on the trans issue. They were much more radicalized on it than I was when I first launched this show. And they helped me, among many other women who helped me, who helped open my eyes so profoundly. There's a long list of women to whom I'm very grateful. And they were two of the first. And they have been. They live in California. They've been following this guy around. Normally, I'm not a big fan of, like, I've got you on my videotape in your private time, and I'm going to harass you, but I'm sorry. This guy is downright dangerous to our children. He's downright dangerous, given these policies. And this is. We pulled it up just for old time's sake. This was back in 2023, in SOP 14B.

[Laura Ingraham]

Are you.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Are you or not?

[Megyn Kelly]

How are you look like you are.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Wait.

[Megyn Kelly]

You are a force to be reckoned with in California. You have had such an impact on.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

The state, like your bill in the Most recent with 107, making it a sanctuary state.

[Megyn Kelly]

And we're doing an investigation right now.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

On the origins with the Katie Institutes. Like, have you go into that McKinsey Institute in Indiana. You're not familiar with it?

[Megyn Kelly]

Like the whole trans movement and all that based on pedophilia and child abuse? Are you not familiar with it? You need to understand what you're supporting.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

The reason why so many of your bills that you propose are based out of the theories that were popularized.

[Megyn Kelly]

Do you have a statement or do you just ignore constituents? Okay, I know that was hard to hear. I had the advantage of being able to turn up the volume in my ear. But I urge you to go back and listen to it and turn up the volume, because it's these two undercover next to him in a club trying to get up in his face about his agenda. They opened it by making him think that they were fans. He started listening and then they dropped, you know, the truth bombs on him about his latest proposed legislation about transing children and what it would do, and then asked him about the Kinsey Institute and started to go back into the history of those who started pushing the whole trans movement on us to begin with, which includes some very sick, sick people. He was a coward, like all the people pushing this stuff are. He ran away and now he's running so far away that he's running for office at a. At a higher level. Batya and I'm sorry, Like, I don't want anything bad to happen to Scott Weiner, to be clear. But I want this guy to get defeated at the ballot box. I. This cannot be a San Francisco San Franciscans, you're famous for gay and lesbian rights. He wants to take your gay little boys and make them girls because he and others like him seem to think there's something fundamentally wrong with homosexuality. That that cannot be your representative. It cannot. It has to stop. You have to defeat him. And by the way, to, to fill Nancy Pelosi shoes like she was. Say what you will about Pelosi, she's definitely pro LGB rights and would like. This is just insane. So I applaud Tish for showing up in the lion's den and having her say it's the whole thing is deeply disturbing, Batya. Deeply. All right, let me move on though. You mentioned in the first hour at the top of the show people who are still so clueless about the news that they think Trump actually said there are very fine people on both sides about white supremacists at the Charlottesville. Whatever it was. Unite the white. I don't remember what it's called. Unite the right. Unite the white right. Whatever it was, rally. It's a lie. He didn't say that. He was talking about people who don't like to see the statues torn down. And it's been dubbed a lie even by Snopes, the left wing so called fact checker. But still they push it. Obama pushed it at the, at the Democratic National Convention. He pushed it like it's. It's a lie that's been peddled by many. And the left loves this lie, so they choose to believe it. Or they're just too ignorant of the truth to believe it, to not believe it. Whatever. Enter Abby Phillips, who comments not on this, but on this information vacuum she perceives as existing only on the right. It's the right that has siloed news, whereas the left and everybody else actually understands what's going on in the world. Now this is somebody who hosts a show on CNN that has absolutely no ratings. You and I and our moms just got more ratings watching the show and doing the show than she has on her CNN show. But it gets clipped and circulated on X. I won't make you say anything negative about it, cuz I know you do her the favor of going on there, but she doesn't deserve you. So she decides to go over to Joy Reid's new show. I guess she's got a show now on some sort of podcast. Good luck with that. And has this description of her own job in that CNN chair. Take a listen to Sat 17.

[Tish Hyman]

Conservatives are living in a completely different information world than liberals. And breaking that down needs to be done. Because when you don't ever even hear the facts, it's hard to even know that you're wrong.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, you're so good to us a lot.

[Tish Hyman]

I mean, half my job sometimes is knowing what the latest conspiracy is so that if it comes up, I'm ready to address it. Because it happens a lot where people don't even know that what they're saying or what they've seen and believe is not true. And so that happens a lot. And I don't come away from that saying, what's the point of this? People are just saying false things. I think that one time that that person brings up something that is debunked and false, and I debunk it at the table might be the very first time that someone out there has heard an alternative point of view.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, just play sat 20. Okay, just play sat 20. Here we go.

[Tish Hyman]

How do we jump to the conclusion that Joe Biden didn't know who he pardoned?

[Megyn Kelly]

Because when Donald Taffer wrote a book.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

About how out of it that was.

[Megyn Kelly]

Everybody here acknowledges that there have been thousands upon thousands of people, ordinary people, who have taken to social media to celebrate this. Yes or no?

[Tish Hyman]

I don't know about that idea that this was a weaponized celebration. These were all these different prosecutions and all these different jurisdictions were not all directed from one place. There's absolutely no evidence of that. I've never seen it and I've never heard anybody actually.

[Megyn Kelly]

Joe Biden by Biden administrations didn't politicize the doj.

[Tish Hyman]

Okay.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Who I'm so waiting to see the.

[Tish Hyman]

Proof of Joe Biden enriching himself.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, so those are just a number of examples she has totally wrong. She's seen no proof that Joe Biden directed any of the weapons weaponization against Trump. Why don't you go to April 2022 and the new York Times in which they publish his very public demand that Merrick Garland indict Trump, that he wanted him prosecuted? How did that wind up in the New York Times? Oh, gee, I'm left to wonder. Could it possibly have been that Joe Biden wanted it in the New York fucking Times because his private behind the scenes pressured Americarland was not doing the trick? Yes, that's exactly what happened. She, I guess, missed that even though her colleague Anderson Cooper reported On it at length. She also reported that the. The videos of Joe Biden falling down were deep fakes. She fell for that. Saying they don't show the full context. Right, because if anything, they were too kind to Joe Biden and didn't show him actually dribbling into his pudding. But you ran cover for him. Abby Phillip. And then she has the name nerve to go say this, this stuff about, about debunking conspiracy theories. That's her job to Joy Reid. Joy Reid. Listen to Joy Reid in SOT 18 after Donald Trump was shot in the head. We still don't know for sure whether Donald Trump was hit by a bullet. We knew almost nothing. Why? Well, that second part is true. That, that, that second part is true. She knows nothing. She knows absolutely nothing. I'm sorry, but I can't take this bullshit. Abby Phillip actually spins herself as the one who sets. Sets situations straight, sets lies straight, puts the truth to the lie that in itself is a lie. Her record is long. It speaks for itself. I guess I am going to put you in the awkward position of having to comment on it.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Well, I am very grateful to her for having me on. I think all the people who are kind of on the MAGA side who go on the show feel exactly what Abby was saying she feels, which is a great responsibility to inform the CNN audience of all of the things they think are true that are not true. I can't think of a single thing I could point to right now. Or I could say, like, here is like, you know, a big debunked lie that the right has subscribed to whole hog. There's a lot of debate happening, as you know, Meghan on the right about all of the big issues. There's no real, like, consensus about any. Anything in this moment, which I think is great. There's a big, healthy debate happening around all the issues. When she's saying she needs to debunk, what she means is she's not talking about facts, she's talking about opinions that she thinks are not legitimate. And I can tell you, as somebody who does that show, the interruptions are wildly, wildly disproportionate. If you're on the right than if you're on the left. The challenge is how to make. Each time you go, you're like, okay, I gotta make my point even faster and faster so I can get something out before I get interrupted. But again, look, at least they have conservatives on the show, right? Even though Abby's obviously on one side of the issue, they are exposing the Audience to Scott Jennings I think is one of the most brilliant conservative voices out there. And he really makes that show. So he's out there. There are people listening. I'm 100% certain that there are CNN viewers who voted for Trump because of Scott Jennings. So overall I think the clips do go viral on both sides. Oh, here's another interesting thing. I will often notice that the same clip that I'm sharing from that show, like here I made this point really well, exactly the way that I wanted to is the same clip that all the leftist people who clip it are sharing to show. Like look how stupid this person is. That I think is really interesting because people say we're in different media bubbles, but it's actually not true. What we are is looking at the same clip and to the left this is like the worst thing they've ever heard. And to the right it's like finally somebody represented exactly how we feel about this in a way that jives with how I feel about it. And I think that that is actually very healthy because we are in that moment looking at least at the same piece of information.

[Megyn Kelly]

I appreciate that. But Abby Phillip is a liar. What she did in that clip with Joy Reid is lie from start to finish to paint herself as something better than what she is. She's a self aggrandizer but she is just as biased and full of bullshit as the rest of them over at CNN and msnbc. And that's why her show is failing. Getting a couple of viral clips is not that helpful to cnn. They need actual ratings. She's not the answer. She can't get them because she's not only utterly biased, she's entirely boring. She's an utter bore. She cannot anchor a show. That's why she has to have 10 people on a panel because they quickly realized she was too boring to actually drive the news. I'm sorry Abby, if no one's told you that, but that's why they gave 10 people on your panel because they realized as soon as you took the seat you were too boring to solo. That's the truth. I'm going to tell it to you. I was in cable news for a really long time. I know of what I speak. Sorry about you, but that's my take. But you were nice. So she can, she can remember that the next time she wants to book you. Even though you'd be much better never going on that show again. Okay, I have to get to this. Speaking of lunatic Democrats, there's a debate happening right now on the Right. I'm gonna bring, gonna get to the Democrats in a second about whether we should eliminate the filibuster in the Senate. Trump really wants the Republicans to do it. John Thune, Senate Majority Leader, is saying we do not have the votes for that and it would be a massive watershed moment in American politics. We've had the filibuster since the 1800s. It didn't come about really in earnest until the early 1900s, but we've had it for over 100 years as a very important tool for minority rights in the Senate, which is the body where you really are supposed to deliberate. Things are supposed to go slower. They're not supposed to be, you know, snapjacked. Right. In response to the constituents desires. That's the House where you have to face the constituents for reelection every two years. That's how the founders designed it. So taking away minority rights and making it easier to pass legislation would not be totally consistent with how the founders vision it. Trump's argument is nothing gets passed. Now, we've gotten so obstinate and obstructionist that nothing can get passed even with a 53 person majority in the Senate. So drastic change is warranted. And with all due respect, this wasn't in the founding setup of the Union, it's not in the Constitution. And it can be done away with just as easily as it was brought into existence. And the Republicans should do it or the Dems will do it. When they get in control and we won't have passed any of our legislation, then they'll pass all of theirs. So I understand it's actually a very interesting argument and we'll see. But right now they say there's not the votes. Enter James Carville, who said all the quiet parts out loud. And I don't think this is particularly helpful to Democrats, but it may also give the Republicans a bit of pause before they do this. You tell me how you see it. Here's SOT32.

[Laura Ingraham]

I'm going to tell you what's going to happen. A Democrat is going to be elected in 2028. You know that, I know that. He's going to be a Democratic House, going to be a Democratic Senator. The Democratic President is going to announce a special transition advisory committee on the reform of the Supreme Court. And they're going to recommend that the number of Supreme Court justices go from 9 to 13. That's going to happen, people. That's going to happen to you. They're going to win. They're going to do some blue ribbon panel of distinguished jurists. And they are going to recommend 13 and a Democratic Senate and House. They're going to pass it and the Democratic President is going to sign it because they have to do an intervention so we can have a Supreme Court that the American people trust again. So just keep that in the back of your mind. And I would bet a lot of money that that's what's going to happen. A lot.

[Megyn Kelly]

Thoughts?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, I mean, don't get rid of the filibuster. I had Senator Tim, she on my show and I asked him if he supports it. He said he didn't. I mean, it's like you said, Megan, it's an extremely important check on the power. And also it gives more gravitas to the Senate, as you pointed out, and it protects minority rights. And what I hate to see is the right turning into the left. So the left under Obama just got drunk on power. They had political power and they had the cultural power and they convinced themselves that they were never going to have to compete again. And as a result, they indulged their worst tendencies and called everybody on the other side a Nazi and became extremely far left and radical because they thought that all of the fights for power were over. And obviously Trump first stole the political power from them and now it's pretty clear he's stolen the cultural power from them. You know, the right is now the cool side and the left is like lame and cringe and old and whatever.

[Megyn Kelly]

First time ever?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, first time ever. And I just hate to see the right making this same mistakes. Allowing the most radical fringe online element to act as a stand in for what young people want or becoming drunk on the idea of their success and thinking the Democrats will never be competitive again. They will be. That's how this country works. That's how the founders intended it to work. And so you do have to. You know, I saw Vice President Vance saying we should never not do something because the Democrats are gonna do it, they're gonna do it anyway. You do have to keep your side of the aisle clean. I do believe that the reason President Trump won was because he had the moral high ground. He grabbed that moderate, good hearted center where most Americans live. That is the sweet spot. I feel a little bit like the Lorax right now. I come to you as a of sort swing voter who loves Donald Trump and loves maga. You know, like this is, this is where elections are won in that sweet spot in the middle. And so I think it's really important not to look at the mistakes the left made and be like the mistake wasn't just the trans issue, it's that they allowed the fringe to define the entire party. And I think we have to really keep that in mind if you, if you want to stay competitive and you want power.

[Megyn Kelly]

The I think it was Rich Lowry who said the other night, the left is the one that is constantly swinging for large pieces of federal legislation to take over control of our lives. The right, that's not the right thing. The right generally wants states to be in control of lawmaking and they want it to be as little and as non intrusive as possible. So if we give this power to the Senate by eliminating minority rights, we are the ones who are going to suffer way more, way more than the Democrats. And was also making the point. Ben Shapiro spoke to this too. And Rich too. But like that President Trump, he hasn't even submitted like a bunch of huge bills that he can't get votes on. There's been a couple, like keeping men out of Women's sports, that's one. But there haven't been like a ton that haven't been able to get through because of the Democrats obstructionism. There's been some, but like, it's not like my whole agenda has been stymied because of the damn filibuster. But the Democrats would go in there and good God, I mean like James Carville saying, before we know it, they're going to be pushing for court changes, they're going to be pushing for state number of states changes. And this is assuming they have control of all three branches, which they will again someday. Don't kid yourself. This is the glory days right now for maga. But it's not going to last. It just never does. Never does. And honestly it could, it could last no longer than 2027. The way things are going, if we get an election in 2028 that looks anything like last two, two Tuesdays ago. So in any event, I'm against it. I think right now I feel against it very much so. And I haven't heard anything that is so tempting to me that I would change that position. So anyway, you heard it right, right from Carville. That's what they'll do when they get power. And you know, I understand the argument is they'll do that whether we do it or not. But why would we make it easier for them? Why would we take away at least the PR battle that's on our side where we run around telling the voters these guys are fucking radical, look what they just did. All these things without the Filibuster without protecting minority rights. The country's against it. You can make that argument if you stay honorable. But if you get down into the gutter before them, all bets are off. All right, Batya, it's wonderful seeing you. When can they see the Bachelor show?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

It airs on Saturdays at 4pm and 11pm on News Nation and then we put clips on YouTube and the whole show goes on YouTube Sunday night or Monday morning.

[Megyn Kelly]

Awesome. I love it. I expect a five night per week expansion soon. Great to see you.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Thank you, Megan. God bless you. Thank you so much.

[Megyn Kelly]

You too, my friend. All right, coming up, a fun segment with someone who's had an incredible career and is a dear friend of yours truly as well. I'll explain. If you've ever googled yourself, you know how many results contain your personal info. It's a horror show and it's also not by chance. Your info is available. Name, address, phone number, financial info, your income, legal and health history. It can all be on there. And it can also be sold and shared publicly without your consent. There are real risks here, including financial scams, identity theft, unfair targeting by insurance companies, and general safety risks. But I want to tell you about Incogni. Incogni helps you take control of your online privacy. You sign up, you allow them to act on your behalf and they demand that data brokers delete your personal info. Now they've introduced something huge. Custom data removals with their unlimited plan. Incogni's privacy team will get your info taken down from any specific site. Right now you can get 60 off an annual plan by heading to incogni.com megan and using code Megan at checkout. It's risk free with their 30 day money back guarantee. Take your personal data back with Incogni. Get 60 off an annual plan at Incogni I N C o g n I.com megan code megan@ checkout. Let's be honest. America can still be a dangerous place and you cannot afford to wait for help. Sure, you could use a firearm, but in today's America, defending yourself with deadly force could have legal consequences. According to FBI data, 99.9% of all altercations do not require lethal force. And that's exactly why so many are turning to Burna. Burna is proudly American Hand assembled in Fort Wayne, Indiana. These less lethal self defense launchers are trusted by hundreds of government agencies, law enforcement departments, and also private security companies. Over 600,000 burner pistols have been sold, mostly to private citizens who refuse to be victims. Burner launchers fire rock hard kinetic rounds and also if you choose this route, powerful tear gas and pepper projectiles. See, I like those because you don't have to hit the perpetrator. If, if you're just shooting with the the tear gas and the pepper, you have to just get it near him and he gets incapacitated. These things are capable of stopping a threat from up to 60ft away. No background checks, no waiting periods and Burna can ship straight to your door. Take responsibility. Protect your future. Visit byrna.com right now. That's B Y R N A dot com or just visit your local sportsman's warehouse burna.com or your local sportsman's warehouse. Visit now and be prepared to defend America is built on hard work and powered by American energy. Chevron has spent $44 billion with local businesses across all 50 states since 2022, fueling infrastructure and communities, all while strengthening local economies. Last year, Chevron increased U.S. production nearly 20%, powering communities and businesses from the heartlands to the coasts. We're helping to fuel America's energy advantage, building a brighter future right here at home. Visit chevron.comamera to discover more. We are going on the road. Join me live Megyn Kelly live 10 stops across the the country. Join me for no BS, no agenda and no fear Live. I'll be joined by Tucker Carlson, Ben Shapiro, Glenn Beck, Adam Perola, Charlie Sheen, Piers Morgan, Donald Trump Jr. Eric Trump and Erica Kirk. Send a message that we will not be silenced. It's Megyn Kelly Live, presented by y Refi and SiriusXM. Go to MeganKelly.com to get your tickets. Now you can stream stream the Megyn Kelly show on SiriusXM at home or anywhere you are. No car required. I do it all the time. I love the Sirius XM app. It has ad free music coverage of every major sport, comedy talk, podcast and more. Subscribe now. Get your first three months for free.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Go to SiriusXM.com MKShow to subscribe and get three months free. That's SiriusXM.com MKShow and and get three months free. Offer details apply.

[Megyn Kelly]

Next, we're joined by an extremely talented photographer and personal friend of yours truly, Barry Morgenstein. Barry is a famed portrait photographer. His portfolio of work showcases some of the world's biggest stars, from Michael Jackson to Whitney Houston, Donald Trump and more. He's out with a new book. It's called Rock and Portraits by Barry Morgenstein. In it, he shares his not so traditional training in photography and how he was front row Capturing major moments of music history and his most incredible work. Barry, welcome to the show.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Hey, thank you so much for having me. Really an honor.

[Megyn Kelly]

My pleasure. All right, now, I want everybody to know that in addition to Barry's amazing portraits of all these super famous people, he's done my headshots since I was a young cub reporter at Fox News. And if you're ever going through New York and you need headshots, look up Barry Morgenstein, because nobody does it better. Ladies, I'm telling you, I don't know how he does it. It's not retouching. He uses this magic disc underneath you, his magic gold disc, and you go. You lose 15 years off of your face. It's wonderful. You're very talented, Barry. It's wonderful.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Thank you.

[Megyn Kelly]

Knowing you, that means a lot.

[Barry Morgenstein]

I appreciate it. Sure.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. All right. You come out with this book, and it's so. First of all, I wanted to say it's absolutely beautiful and it's cool looking. It's like I'm holding it up now for the audience to see rock and soul. It's got some of the greats on the front. It's got pictures of the best and biggest names in music throughout, large, beautiful, glossy photographs. Listen, if he can make me look good, you can imagine what he can do for, like, amazing people like Debbie Harry. So there isn't a name that's not in here in the music industry. So I guess I need to start with, like, which is which. Which are the ones that are most memorable to you? Because it's like Bono, Dylan, you know, the Rolling Stones. They're all in, right?

[Barry Morgenstein]

Yeah. It's hard to pick, but I would say McCartney is one. Growing up a big Beatles fan, that's how I got into music in the first place. So McCartney. And seeing him backstage at Madison Square Garden was pretty exciting. Yeah. I was kind of like. He came walking in the room, and after idolizing for many years, all I could do is look him in the face and just kind of say, holy blank. That's all I can muster up. I was, like, kind of so pretty starstruck. So it was pretty cool.

[Megyn Kelly]

And, yeah, Fox News, who told me when we were young at Fox together that he. He weeped. He was. He wept at a Beatles concert, like, uncontrollably. And I told him, james, never repeat that story publicly or you'll never get laid again.

[Barry Morgenstein]

I think he told me the same story.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. So who else? Like, talk to us about some of your most memorable encounters with these guys.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Yeah, I'VE had some great, some funny stories. Elton John stands out. I was Elton's official photographer for two Madison Square Garden concerts in New York City. As we all know, Madison Square Garden. I was his official photographer. No other photographers in the photo pit. It was just me. I was hired by his management company. I grown up going to Madison Square Garden, seeing concerts there. So it was kind of surreal. Funny story in the book, if you have time, I can tell you that is. Basically, I'm standing all the way at the other end of the stage, the left part of the stage. Elton comes to the edge of his stage. A fan comes leaning in to hand him a big bouquet of balloons. He can't quite reach them, so he looks down at me and kind of gives me the nod, like, buddy, give me a hand here. I can't reach these. And another stupid move on my part. Starstruck. I just stand there dumbfounded, like I'm in Madison Square Garden. Elton John's talking to me, and I'm standing there, and he's kind of giving me the exaggerated head nudge, like, get over here, buddy. And I snap out of it, run over, hand the balloons out, John. So. And I wish somebody had a photo of that to this day, but it was a pretty cool story. Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

Now, how did you wind up in Tina Turner's limousine?

[Barry Morgenstein]

I was hired by Capitol Records, I think, at the time. And I was just following her around. She was doing radio interviews and I was covering it, taking pictures of her with the executives. And another funny story. These are my three favorite Me acting like an idiot. Starstruck story. So I'm across from her in the limousine. She's sitting next to her manager. Her manager had to get off somewhere at a stop. He gets out of the car. Tina Turner looks at me, pats her seat next to her and says, come sit next to me, baby. Come sit next to me. And again, what do I do? I freeze. I'm like, yeah, this is the beginning of my career, you know, so, you know, so. So, you know, I grew up, I. I watched Tina Turn or give me Shelter, the film with Mick Jagger, you know, it's Tina Turner. The famous legs right in front of me. So. So I kind of. Again, I said, what do I do? I snap out of it. So, okay. And I sit next to her.

[Megyn Kelly]

So that's fine.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Luckily, I got a little cooler as time went along.

[Megyn Kelly]

There's a great story in the book about going to shoot Mick Jagger. I think it was, you were going to shoot Mick Jagger. And I don't or maybe it was. No, it was Tommy Lee. It was Tommy Lee and let's just say he was classic Tommy Lee. Can you give us a window into that encounter?

[Barry Morgenstein]

Yeah. So I had to shoot Tommy Lee and Vince Neil, the singer of Motley Crue, was nine o' clock in the morning up at Electra Records Studio. Just had to snap some shots while they were being interviewed. Tommy Lee is sitting there with a big bottle of Jack Daniels and nine o' clock in the morning offers me, hey, you want some Jack Daniels? I'm like, no, I'm good. It was a little early for me the time. Jack Daniels was my drink. But not nine o' clock in the morning, so. But he looks at me like I'm crazy. What's wrong with this guy? He doesn't want Jack Daniels. So. Yeah, that's good.

[Megyn Kelly]

He was a good host.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Yeah, he was. He was. It was not a club at night.

[Megyn Kelly]

But to be honest, it actually does kind of reflect well on him because so many of these guys would pay absolutely no attention to the photog and they might. Might treat you like you were a peon. You were nothing. And the fact that he offered you some hospitality and thought like, you might enjoy some Jack Daniels does speak well of him.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Exactly, exactly. And I've been lucky. Most of the people I met over my career have been just really cool, laid back and nice people. Even the superstars like McCartney, Elton John, just nice people. It was just really great to see.

[Megyn Kelly]

Has there been anyone who's a jerk and you remember?

[Barry Morgenstein]

Yes, and I remember. But should I say his name? He's in the book.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, yes.

[Barry Morgenstein]

I wasn't. I mean, I feel bad because we just lost him. I mean, Ace freely wasn't so nice. He's freely kissed. He was kind, I shouldn't say, but he was not so friendly and he was quite. And the thing that got me was he was questioning my lighting, which you don't do. So he's questioning my life.

[Megyn Kelly]

Honestly. You put yourself in Barry's good hands and then you just smile or do what he tells you. Like he's got it exactly, exactly the angles. He will make you look great no matter who you are. And with these guys, they're so cool. One of my favorite pictures in the book is between. It's. It's of Bon Jovi and it's them at the Burn arena in New Jersey. It says, let's see. Yeah, New York City or the Brendan Byrne Arena, New Jersey. There it's full hair band, rocker Bon Jovi, and then on the next pager page is Bon Jovi with Dee Snider. And I don't even love Jon Bon Jovi anymore because he's gotten political and he's annoying. But I still have a fond. Yeah, I still have a soft spot in my heart for that version of Bon Jovi, which was just classic 80s hair band.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Right. Well, funny story with that is I'm not a big Bon Jovi fan, just musically. And I'm not a big 80s hair band. I'm a classic rock guy, blues guy. So Bon Jovi almost didn't make it into my book. My wife Shelly said, you got to put Bon Jovi. I'm like, oh, I don't like his music, though. He's like pop rock. And she kept pushing me. We had a dear friend, a close friend of Shelley who passed away about a few years ago, and she was a big Bon Jovi fan. So I said, you know what? We're gonna put it in for Melissa. So he's in the book.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. I appreciate Melissa getting you to do that, even in the way she did it, because a lot of us gals love that band. I mean, I'm Totally Team Sambora, 100% Team Sambora, who is one of the greatest songwriters ever. But when you pulled it together, how did you decide what was gonna make the cut and what wasn't? Because I know you have endless streams of these.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Well, so back when I shot, I used to shoot slides. You know, before digital slides, black and white, negative. So I had thousands of images to go through. I had to scan them. It was thousands of dollars, days and weeks. Well, actually, I should say months of work just picking out. I got an old light box. I didn't have my light box anymore, so I bought a new light box. My little loop started picking through photos, and we narrowed down. I think it's 136 pages and might have to do a volume two. Cause I left out some great shots that I, you know, I'm thinking of now that. Oh, why didn't I put that in?

[Megyn Kelly]

Ah. Now, you and I, we met together for years doing headshots and so on. But we don't usually talk politics when we're together. However, I saw you at CPAC the last time I was there. So I have a pretty good idea of what your politics are. So I'm just wondering whether your politics have played any role in your efforts to promote your book.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Oh, yes. And same goes along with my headshot business, too. I've been. I've been Canceled. I've been people who won't use me because when they find out that I'm a conservative, pro Trump guy, maga, whatever you want to call it, hell yeah, I get canceled. I had a Best of New Jersey was going to interview me for my book and just a local New Jersey website where I live. Two hours before I'm supposed to drive to their studio, I get a call from or an email, this long email saying, you know, our staff has done a deep dive on you and we don't think you'd be a good fit. You're a little too controversial, you know. And you know, I wrote back the guy and I and I basically said, hey, I had no plans, no intention of discussing politics. I was coming to discuss my rock and roll book. I said I'm allowed to have my opinions. And if you don't like the fact that I speak out, pro military, pro veterans, anti hamas, that bothers you? Anti men and women's girls bathrooms, if these things bother you, then I guess I don't belong in your show. But yes, it does happen. I get canceled.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's amazing. Cancel culture comes for us all eventually on the right and that's why we have to stick together. Honestly, that's why. That's one of the many reasons why people need to buy Rock and Soul by Barry Morgenstein. Holding up again. It's a beautiful book. I actually think this could do one of two things. Well, one of many things, but I'm just going to name how I am going to use this. This is going to be my gift for and they listen to the show, so surprise. My girlfriends always come for like a Christmas luncheon every year and they're all getting a copy of this, so set several aside for me. I also think this would be a great hostess gift. It's right now it's 69 bucks but it's going for 59 today on Amazon so you can get 10 off, which is very reasonable price for this big beautiful book. And it's so user friendly, it's effortless for people. So it'd make a great coffee table book for Christmas, for Hanukkah, for any holiday that's coming up that you want to celebrate. Nobody ever gets each other like a nice pretty book that's always something that maybe your decorator would get for you. But like people, if they get and get a book, they get somebody like a mystery or something or a biography. This is a great sort of beautiful option for people that will bring people a lot of joy because you're seeing all these great musicians who you grew up loving and listening to. And it's something lovely for people to just thumb through while they're sitting on the couch having a convo or having a drink with their spouse.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Yes. And actually. And if they want to signed copy, then they go to my website too, which is barrymorgenstein.com so you have the choice.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. And Morganstein spelled with S-T E I N dot com. So we have, we want to support Barry for a number of reasons. Please. Because I need him to stay in business for me personally. But also because it's a beautiful book and, and like, it's really rare to find a fair and balanced photographer who doesn't recoil when the entire Fox News staff walks through the door needing a headshot. And I. You're to be credited for that. And we should support you when you're coming out with something like this. Especially because you will not be booked on Morning Joe. You will not be booked on Good Morning America. You will not be booked even though this would be a great excuse for them to run great pictures and great clips that they all know everybody would enjoy. But they won't do it for reasons discussed. All right, so people go support Barry. Rock and soul. Great name. It's back out now. Can they just get it on Amazon too?

[Barry Morgenstein]

Amazon? Yes. That's without the autograph, but yes on Amazon.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. Yeah. But if you want autograph, go to barrymorgenstein.com. thank you, my friend. Good luck with it.

[Barry Morgenstein]

Thank you. I really appreciate it. Thank you.

[Megyn Kelly]

The pleasure's mine. It's great. Great. I genuinely love it. You're going to love it. I'm not doing this just because Barry's a friend. I really believe in the book and, and trust me, you'll love it, too. Back tomorrow with somebody else who you adore. Maureen Callahan in studio. Full show. See you then. Thanks for listening to the Megyn Kelly show. No bs, no agenda and no fear.

[Laura Ingraham]

Bob Evans. Creamy Mac and cheese and buttery mashed potatoes are made for those holiday moments you just can't plan for. Like when the neighbors burnt their holiday meat meal and you invited them over. Or that time when everyone's flights home were canceled and they stayed an extra two days. So when there is no plan, say hello to plan B. O B. When you bring out the Bob, you can take comfort this holiday season knowing you'll always have something delicious on the table, no matter what the holidays bring. When you need comfort, bring out the Bob available now in your refrigerated section.