Glenn Greenwald and Emily Jashinsky - "Megyn Kelly Live" from San Antonio, on No Team Jerseys, Israel, and the Left's Obsession with Race | Ep. 1180

Summary

The Megyn Kelly Show – Live in San Antonio

Episode 1180: Glenn Greenwald and Emily Jashinsky on No Team Jerseys, Israel, and the Left's Obsession with Race
Date: October 27, 2025
Host: Megyn Kelly
Guests: Glenn Greenwald, Emily Jashinsky

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Overview

In this special live episode from San Antonio, Megyn Kelly hosts a dynamic conversation with journalists Glenn Greenwald and Emily Jashinsky. The night is shaped by themes of media mistrust, ideological infighting on the right, the American relationship with Israel, race and identity on the left, and the importance of honest dialogue across differences. The event opens with audience Q&A, continues with in-depth interviews, and develops into a broad, searching roundtable about the current state of politics and culture.

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Key Topics and Highlights

1. Courage, Community, and the Role of “News Consumers”

• Opening Message (05:00–09:00):
  • Kelly commends attendees for their courage in the current climate, highlighting the necessity for conservatives and “Team Sanity” to keep showing up and speaking out.
  • She urges informed listeners to spread truth and involvement within their communities, especially given increasing social and political hostility.
  • Quote:
    • "Courage has been in short supply these days. Not on the right wing, but we need to find our voices more than ever." – Megyn Kelly (07:50)
    • "News consumers are the answer to our problems … your neighbors ... will rely on you." – Megyn Kelly (09:25)

2. Audience Q&A: DOJ, Prosecutions, Foreign Aid, Israel

• About Pam Bondi and the DOJ (10:50–12:45):
  • Kelly revisits her criticisms of Bondi’s handling of the Epstein situation but currently commends her fearlessness, noting “the more the left hates somebody, the more it's a tell that we should like them."
• Prosecution of Political Targets (11:51–12:58):
  • Acknowledges that retribution plays a role in current prosecutions but asserts there are legitimate grounds and advises those "changing the rules" should expect them to be applied in turn.
• US Foreign Aid and Alliances (13:00–14:57):
  • Questions arise about endless foreign support, the division on the right over Israel and Ukraine, and how America avoids being manipulated: “America's not the world's mommy.” (13:00)
  • Kelly: “I think Trump's probably going to ramp up a little support for Ukraine… it's a method to bring it to a close. I don't think Trump desires a forever war.” (14:00)
  • On Israel: US support has led to some right-wing division, especially as “we're getting a little close to the sun... But thank God, that seems to be coming to a close now.”
• On Foreign Manipulation (14:57–15:23):
  • “We're the world's superpower, so they're going to try to manipulate us. But we have a strong leader, so we don't have to worry about it.” – Kelly

3. Immigration and Assimilation (16:08–17:53)

• A legal immigrant couple expresses concern about anti-immigrant sentiment. Kelly differentiates between a hard line on illegal immigration policy and cultural reality:
  • “Americans are the most tolerant, accepting, loving people in the world. … I haven't seen a hint of American citizens treating immigrants badly.” (17:09)

4. The Israel Debate and Right-Wing Identity (17:53–20:04)

• Navigating the Conservative Divide over Israel:
  • Kelly identifies as a “pro-Israel Zionist” but laments the stifling of criticism (“then you’re an anti-Semite!”) and says Americans resent rhetorical overreach.
  • She encourages young conservatives: “Don’t completely abandon the cause.”

5. Style and Ad Hominem in Public Argument

• Why Resort to Personal Attacks? (20:04–21:15):
  • Kelly: “It depends on the person … I happen to believe that conservatism makes you gorgeous. I don't know what it is. It's like a fountain of youth.” (20:14)

6. Advice to the Young: Find Your Voice

• Building Courage (“Practice at every opportunity” 21:18–22:51):
  • “Never hide your true viewpoint … start in the little moments of your life … Do it daily if you can … Don’t back down from what you feel. Not even one iota. Not even if you’re wrong.” – Megyn Kelly

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Special Guest Interviews

Emily Jashinsky: No Team Jerseys, Heterodoxy, and Cultural Drift

Background and Upbringing (33:47–38:34)

• Grew up in Wisconsin, not overtly political; parents from different backgrounds, union and HR.
• Describes herself as a “normal conservative” – faith and Christianity central to her worldview but open to challenges, especially post-Trump era.

Importance of Cross-Ideological Friendship and Dialogue (38:34–41:31)

• Sharing a show with leftist Ryan Grim taught her about dissolving labels and humanizing “the other.”
• “Labels ... all dissolve when you’re forced to be in close proximity with someone having challenging conversations.” – Emily Jashinsky (39:22)
• Kelly and Jashinsky agree that honest dialogue requires proximity and a willingness to see humanity across divides.

The Perils of Issue-based Extremism (43:27–45:04)

• Discusses the desperation that drives voters to the extremes, referencing New York politics.
• Notes how Trump’s economic policies, especially tariffs, are no longer taboo, and legacy Republican opposition is waning.

Israel, Government Lies, and the Media’s Role (46:19–49:53)

• Jashinsky's view on Israel was altered after covering the killing of journalist Shireen Abu Akleh; she criticizes US politicians uncritically parroting Israeli government lines.
• Both she and Kelly stress that criticism of Israel is not tantamount to anti-Semitism; echo frustration with speech policing.

Media Misinformation, White House Renovations, and Legacy Press (51:29–56:02)

• They lampoon legacy media's hyperventilation over Trump’s White House renovations, exposing historical omissions and double standards.
• “If it weren’t for people like you in independent media, people wouldn't know these facts.” – Kelly

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Glenn Greenwald: Journalism, Surveillance, and Media Betrayal

The Value of Adversarial Journalism (59:52–65:49)

• Greenwald recalls how he admired Kelly for her adversarial interviews on Fox, counter to the perception of partisan hackery.
• He and Kelly agree that journalism's first allegiance is to truth and power-scrutiny, not party loyalty.
• “It’s always dangerous for human beings to have lots of power and lots of money with no pushback, no scrutiny, no journalistic examination.” – Greenwald (65:32)

Origins: From Law to Snowden and Beyond (68:39–73:29)

• Greenwald shares his post-9/11 journey from constitutional law toward journalism, motivated by government infringements on rights.
• Describes how reporting on NSA surveillance with Edward Snowden changed US understanding of surveillance and democracy.

Leaving The Intercept: The Hunter Biden Story (77:08–80:51)

• Greenwald left The Intercept, which he co-founded, when his own editors refused to let him publish the verified Hunter Biden laptop story.
• “I had to quit my own organization because ... editors want to manipulate the outcome of our politics ... why would I stay?” – Greenwald (80:17)
• Both he and Kelly assert that current media disinformation comes from prioritizing political goals above journalistic truth.

Joe Biden’s Mental State and Media Complicity (81:16–84:09)

• Kelly and Greenwald harshly critique the media for covering up Biden’s cognitive decline, arguing that Americans were denied the truth, which had real policy consequences.
• “He was incapable of making those decisions ... the bigger question is who’s running the government?” – Greenwald (84:41)

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Roundtable: The Left’s Obsession with Race, Media Decline, and Political Dehumanization

Karine Jean-Pierre’s Identity Politics (89:34–96:37)

• Kelly and co-hosts ridicule Karine Jean-Pierre’s book tour, in which she foregrounds her identity as a black queer woman to the exclusion of substantive accomplishment.
• Greenwald and Jashinsky deride the Democratic Party’s transactional approach to identity and affirmative action-style appointments.
• “Was it. I love that. In her mind, the repayment for the treatment that American blacks have received is Kamala Harris. This is like, we deserve Kamala Harris. You owe us Kamala Harris.” – Jashinsky (93:55)
• Kelly: “We are done obsessing over skin color ... The fever [on racial fixation] is broken.” (95:54)

Rachel Maddow, Elitism, and the Bubble (98:36–103:09)

• Segment on elitism of left-leaning media personalities—Maddow’s condescension, snobbery, and detachment from average Americans.
• Greenwald: “People understand when they're being condescended to ... the Democratic Party ... now look[s] down upon ... most of the country feels condescended to and patronized and can just like spewed contempt at by liberal elites.” (99:02)
• On declining relevance: cable news’ shrinking influence; Maddow’s influence now minimal.

Media Disinformation, Audience Superiority, and “Attractiveness” (103:09–105:11)

• Tongue-in-cheek riffing on “conservative attractiveness,” the effects of Trump Derangement Syndrome, and politicized uglification of left-leaning public figures.

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On Political Violence and the Aftermath of Charlie’s Assassination (105:16–114:18)

• Depravity and Leftist Political Violence:
  • Kelly and Greenwald argue that the current climate is marked by escalating leftist violence, “a new paradigm” since the assassination of conservative pundit Charlie.
• The Dangers of Dehumanization:
  • Greenwald cautions against seeing all leftists as evil; notes “every political faction produces violence,” but laments a new leftist belief that “the world is better off when conservatives die.” (108:06)
• Spiritual and Communal Disconnection:
  • Glenn links rising violence and nihilism to loss of spirituality and community; calls for a re-engagement with religious and local institutions.

On Hope and Reaching the Disaffected (114:18–116:48)

• Kelly affirms that not all on the left are unreachable, and that ongoing outreach (as practiced by Charlie Kirk) remains vital.
• Jashinsky: “People are really gettable because they are starving for moral clarity. And if you can provide that, people's discontent can be channeled very productively.” (116:35)

Final Words: The Power of Speaking Truth

• Kelly relates a story of a progressive, closeted listener whose child struggles with gender issues. This listener quietly values the uncomfortable truths spoken on her show.
• “Stick to what's real ... you are helping people.” – Megyn Kelly (116:48)
• She encourages the audience to “sit in the front row of your life. Be the person who says something.”

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Notable Quotes (with Timestamps)

• “Courage has been in short supply these days.” – Megyn Kelly (07:50)
• “For me, journalism is way higher for a journalist than partisan affiliation.” – Glenn Greenwald (61:18)
• "Labels ... all dissolve when you’re forced to be in close proximity with someone having challenging conversations." – Emily Jashinsky (39:22)
• "People understand when they're being condescended to ... most of the country feels condescended to and patronized by liberal elites." – Glenn Greenwald (99:02)
• "The fever [on racial fixation] is broken. That stuff's not going to work anymore." – Megyn Kelly (95:54)
• “Every political faction produces violence … but the predominant sentiment among a lot of people on the left [today] is that the world is better off when conservatives die.” – Glenn Greenwald (108:06)
• "People are really gettable because they are starving for moral clarity … if you can provide that, people's discontent can be channeled very productively." – Emily Jashinsky (116:35)
• "Sit in the front row of your life. Be the person who says something." – Megyn Kelly (116:48)

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Major Segments & Timestamps

• Opening, Kelly’s Welcome, On Courage: 03:00–10:00
• Q&A on DOJ, Foreign Aid, Israel: 10:50–22:51
• Emily Jashinsky Segment: 32:16–56:02
• Glenn Greenwald Segment: 58:51–84:09
• Roundtable: Identity Politics, Media Critique, Political Violence: 89:34–116:48
• Final Words, Closing: 116:48–end

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Tone and Style

The session is lively, combative, and self-aware, with a blend of humor, directness, cultural critique, and moments of earnest concern. Kelly’s signature “no BS, no agenda, no fear” posture rules the night, while Greenwald’s and Jashinsky’s participation gives the evening its range – from robust disagreement to shared warnings about tribalism and the decay of bona fide journalism.

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Takeaways

1. Civic involvement and courage are critical amid intensifying ideological divides.
2. Media mistrust is justified, but the public must demand better and embrace heterodox, adversarial journalism.
3. Honest disagreement, not “team jerseys”, is necessary for a healthy public life.
4. Race and gender fixations on the left are losing persuasive power – Americans want substance, not identity politics.
5. Political violence has become a pressing concern; the answer is outreach, spirituality, and rebuilding community bonds.
6. Speaking uncomfortable truths and being willing to “say the thing” can have unseen but powerful effects.

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Transcript

[Megyn Kelly]

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[Glenn Greenwald]

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[Emily Jaszynski]

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[Glenn Greenwald]

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[Megyn Kelly]

You, you can hire top rated pros, see price estimates and read reviews all on the app. Download today. Welcome to the Megyn Kelly show live on Sirius XM channel 111 every weekday at noon East. Thank you so much for showing up tonight, you guys. Please sit. Wow, what a great crowd and a beautiful, beautiful setting. I have to say it's been 30 years since I've been to San Antonio. I came as a young lawyer back in the day. We had a retreat here and we went, we wrangled cattle. That was fun. Doug was like, like, with a lasso you had like. I was like, no. But I did a lot of this. Felt like a real cowgirl. So it's great to be back. And I said to my team, we gotta go see the Riverwalk. We did that today. What a beautiful city. So glad it brought us together. You know, I was saying this last night and it's true that I spend most of my time, like at my house and in my studio. You know, I don't do a lot of red carpet events and things like that. It's just not my thing. And in my real life, even though I have this very outward facing job, I'm a little bit more introverted than you would think, listening to the show, watching the highlight reel there. So every once in a while, God will sort of tap you on the shoulder and say, I have something for you. And you feel the inspiration to go out, to go out into this world and do something. And that's really why I did this tour. I got the tap from God telling me it was time to go out. And I didn't know why. Like, what is it he thinks I need? Let's go and find out. And eventually, like, the signs will become clear and you'll figure it out. And, and honestly, like this, this happens throughout your life. Like, we went down to the Bahamas on vacation with our kids not long ago, and I'm in this swimming pool at the hotel and a Nice woman's talking to me. We're chit chatting, and I've got my young guy, Thatcher, he's 12 with me, and we're making small talk with this woman. And in the middle of it, she's kind of looking at me and you know, we're in the pool, I'm in my bathing suit, whatever, it's, I don't look like this. And she goes, has anyone ever told you that you look exactly like Megyn Kelly except much better looking? And my son Thatcher goes, that's literally impossible. So you never know how to take those messages, right? Like, is that a compliment or is that not a compliment? Unclear. But you parents out there know that your kids keep you humble, right? And sometimes God will deliver that to you too. When Thatcher wasn't even born yet, but when I, I was pregnant with him and my two, my old, my older two were, were watching me grow and watching what was happening. And you could see the stomach expanding. And my, our eldest, who's now 16, he kind of put his hand on my stomach at one point and he goes, wow. And I said, it's getting bigger, right? And he goes, yeah, and your bottom's getting bigger too. Okay, I don't feel like I needed that one, actually, to be perfectly honest. Anyway, I'm very grateful to you for showing up just as I showed up as well. I think maybe you got the tap on the shoulder too. Because right now, right now, showing up is not actually all that easy for conservatives. Not that everybody here is conservative. I know we have mixed ideologies. But people who lean right now and are on Team Sanity right now are literally under attack. And it's gone from like, us getting attacked in our K12 education and in our colleges and at our workplace and online if we say anything that's right leaning to like, literally getting attacked. You know, whether it's as an ice agent out there trying to do your job, or it's somebody who shows up at the wrong no Kings protest, or it's somebody who goes onto a college campus and just tries to say what he thinks about the world. So I appreciate the fact that you guys got up off your couches, you bought tickets for this thing, you waited in line, you went through the mags, and you came and showed up for this event. I really think it speaks to your courage, and courage has been in short supply these days. Not on the right wing, but we need to find our voices more than ever. Right. I think right now, the solution, the only possible solution to what we're Seeing in the wake of Charlie and just the ramping up of political rhetoric and violent rhetoric from the left. Hi, Jay Jones. Looking at you, is that all of us who are on Team Sanity need to say all the things as much as humanly possible so that they can't shout us down, they can't stop us. You know, I mean, we talked at length about whether we should still do the tour. We announced it on a Monday, and then Charlie was killed that Wednesday. And we had serious talks about, should we do this right? Should we keep going? And my husband Doug felt very strongly one way. He's on board now. But I said, honey, I've got. I've got to do it. And. And then we had to talk about whether you guys would come. Like, will people feel comfortable? Will they. Will they feel unsafe? And can I tell you, after we came out and said, we are doing this, we're going to keep rolling the ticket sales, I was amazed, truly. Like, the courage, the bravery, like, the strength that takes for you guys. I'm a public figure, so I'm used to putting myself in front of. But, like, that was an extraordinary thing. And you guys actually do need that strength and that courage because let me tell you something. News consumers are the answer to our problems. It really, like, most people do not take in news the way you do if you're here, like, they got stuff going on, they don't want to get involved. They find it depressing. Whatever. It takes a certain mental constitution to be able to have a hefty news diet and to stay on top of what's happening in this country. You have to have a pretty still stomach and spine. And it takes effort. It takes. It takes effort to figure out what's real, what's true, and all of that. And so I feel like your neighbors, your communities are going to rely on you. You actually have to be the ones who go out there and say, there's a local school board vote. You got to go. Come on. I know you don't want to do it, but you have to. We have to save our children. Like, there's a local race, There's a whatever, the statehouse race. All these things actually really matter. If you don't pay attention, you wind up with Jasmine Crockett. Poor Texas. It's very sad. It's very sad. So you guys got to be the ones to lead the way because you are super informed. And it's not that your neighbors who aren't following news are uninformed, but they don't know it. The way you know it. And they don't understand the media bias the way you do. Anybody who watches our show or listens to our show understands media bias. Most conservatives do. We've hated the media for a very long time. It's something we wear like a badge of honor. Yes, it's to our credit. You see, those polls are only like 27% of the people out there still trust the media. Not one is conservative. It's all leftists who are like what the media tells it. Cnn, it's news in any event. So what? So you have the same responsibility that I have. I've got to deliver it. And you've got to deliver it too. You got to reach out to the neighbors and make sure that they take all this great information you've gotten and do something useful with it. Buy Gold and get Free Silver that's right. For every $5,000 purchased from Birch Gold Group this month in advance of Veterans Day, send you a free patriotic silver round that commemorates the Gadsden and American flags. Look, gold is up over 40% since the beginning of this year and Birch Gold can help you own it by converting an existing IRA or 401k into a tax sheltered IRA in physical gold. Plus they'll send you free silver honoring our veterans on qualifying purchases. And if you are current or former military, Birch Gold has a special offer just for you. They are waiving custodial fees for the first year on investments of any amount. And with an A plus rating from the Better Business Bureau and tens of thousands of happy customers, consider diversifying your savings into Gold. Text MK to the number 989898 for a free info kit and to claim your eligibility for free Silver with qualifying purchase before the end of the month. Again, text MK to the number 989898 message and data rates may apply. We are going on the road. Megyn Kelly Live 10 stops across the country. Join me for no BS, no agenda and no Fear Live. I'll be joined by Tucker Carlson, Ben Shapiro, Glenn Beck, Adam Barloff, Charlie Sheen, Piers Morgan, Donald Trump Jr. Eric Trump and Erica Kirk. And I cannot wait to see all of you. Please go. And please if you can sign up for the VIP meet and greet so that you can meet me in person and the guest as well. I would just love to hear from you guys on what's on your mind, what you like about the show, what you would like to change and and just for us to connect in what's been a difficult time to send a message that we will not be silenced. It's Megyn Kelly live, presented by why refi and Sirius XM. Go to MeganKelly.com to get your tickets now. Okay. With that, we're gonna take a couple of Q and A from you guys. We're gonna switch the order of things up, and I'll be on the receiving end of the questions for a little bit before we get started. And you are going to be so thrilled with tonight's. You know who they are, right? You know who's coming. Emily Jijinski and Glenn Greenwald, two smarter, more dynamic people you could not ask for. I'm thrilled to bring them to you. So let's just, let's cue it up and we'll just get as many questions in as we can in a few minutes. Hi. Hi, Megan. Thank you so much. My question is actually about the DOJ and Pam Bondi, our current attorney general. Do you think that she's doing a good job? And also what do you think the DOJ should be focusing on that they aren't right now? Thank you for that. I was very harsh on Pam Bondi after the Epstein situation, and I do not think that was handled well. Okay. So. And I stand by that it wasn't handled well. Why it wasn't handled well, we still don't know. It certainly seemed to be President Trump's wish that Pam Bondi handle it the way it was handled. So query how much of it you can put on her. But that didn't, she didn't need to go on Fox News and do all those titillating, wait until you see the files and then come out with, oh, there's nothing, you know, so that was bad. But I have to say, she's been doing a very good job since then. I mean, she's taken on some really bold things. She's very loyal to the president, but she's pretty fearless, you know, I mean, she's been going after like these people who are attacking our ICE agents and Homeland Security. She's got her hands full with some of these cases against, it's not her, but it's DOJ against, say, for example, John Bolton and Letitia James. That, that all of that is, it takes guts. So I think Pam Bondi, actually, I'm more open minded to her than I was over the summer when the Epstein thing was botched. And I think we should give her some grace because the more the left hates somebody, the more it's a tell that we should like them and they really hate her. So. Hi, Megan.

[Glenn Greenwald]

What, what I'm so proud of our current administration. But what do we all need to do to make sure that they follow.

[Megyn Kelly]

Through with the prosecution of these crooks.

[Glenn Greenwald]

That they've currently indicted?

[Megyn Kelly]

And it just doesn't fade away.

[Glenn Greenwald]

It happens. We want to see them in jail.

[Megyn Kelly]

Thank you. Yes, I think they will see it through. I think President Trump is determined. This poor Lindsey Halligan is getting just completely smeared by the Media. The new U.S. attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia. I think she's great. She's very courageous. She's got monster balls, and you need that if you're gonna work for Trump. You're gonna start indicting his enemies. And look, let's face it, people are like, I think it's retribution. I think it might be retribution. Of course it's retribution. That's obvious. But unlike what they did to Trump, there actually are grounds to do it. No one promised them a free pass for life. They're the ones who changed the rules. They're the ones who said, you can go after your political enemies. We can both play that game. You better be squeaky clean if you're gonna make those the new rules, and they're not. So I'm fine with what they're doing. And I love this Lindsey Halligan. Go ahead.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Hey, Megan.

[Megyn Kelly]

Hi.

[Glenn Greenwald]

So, as you know, there's a big split on the right right now between, you know, the pro Israel crowd, the anti Israel crowd and all that. I'm not asking you to pick a side in that discussion, but it goes to the point about just foreign aid in general and who we build allyships with and stuff like that. We've given two. Oh, Joe Biden gave $200 billion to Ukraine since the start of the war. And overall, we just send money left, right, and center all throughout the world. And how do we build allyships without, like, being taken advantage of? Like, America's not the world's mommy, and we're having an issue with Canada right now.

[Megyn Kelly]

I got it. I think. I think it's a great question, first of all. And I think you're putting your finger on the pulse of what a lot of Republicans are feeling, right? Like, what about us? Like, how much we don't have a bottomless pocket for Ukraine? There are a lot of American cities that are. That are hurting right now. And I think, you know, President Trump is feeling it. I think the Republican Party getting loud on it has helped. I know JD Vance is hearing us. The big guy has got his own strong feelings on foreign policy, and he's Coming to those in good faith. And I think, you know, Trump, he had to learn firsthand on how to deal with Putin. Right. He wanted to be friendly with him. He thought he could get it settled quickly. He's realizing that Putin is not an honest actor. Now, I think Trump's probably going to ramp up a little support for Ukraine and we're not going to like it, but I think it's, it's a method to bring it to a close. I don't think Trump has any desire to have a forever, forever war there that we're supporting. And I think on the Israel front, look, they took the lead on virtually everything. The thing about Israel that I think is dividing the Republican Party is that we're so supportive of them. We're getting a little close to the sun, like on the Iran bombing and so on. So, like some faction of the Republican Party that's just had it with the wars, you know, obviously we came to that decision honestly over the past 20 years. They're feeling like our friend is getting us a little too close to the fire. But thank God, that seems to be coming to a close now. So.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, and just wanted to follow up on that real quick. I don't know if you followed the thing with Canada the past couple days, but they were taking out like $75 million worth of ads, kind of like propagating like anti tariff messaging and stuff like that. And then it kind of ties in with like, APAC as well. Two sides of the same coin where, like, overall, how does America avoid, like, it's the focal point of the world, how does it avoid being the merry go round where people are, like, playing manipulative games?

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, we don't. We're the world's superpower, so they're going to do that to us. They're going to try to manipulate us. But we have a strong leader, so we don't have to worry about it. Right. I mean, like, good luck trying to play hardball with Donald Trump. It doesn't tend to go well. Thank you. Hello, Megan.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I thank you for being who you are. You're amazing.

[Megyn Kelly]

Thank you for being this woman after.

[Emily Jaszynski]

50, like we are, and outspoken and amazing and beautiful.

[Megyn Kelly]

You are an example. Part of the we do not care club. Right, Princess Melanie? We simply do not care. Go ahead. So I am a legal immigrant, Very proud legal immigrant.

[Emily Jaszynski]

My husband and I decided to move.

[Megyn Kelly]

To the US after I'm 50, so it's a huge shift.

[Emily Jaszynski]

But we praise the United States. We moved here because we thought for.

[Megyn Kelly]

Our kids it would be the best path.

[Emily Jaszynski]

So we gave up an amazing life in Brazil. I have to talk to Glenn about it.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, yeah, you do. So anyway, we gave up that life.

[Emily Jaszynski]

To come here and start a new.

[Megyn Kelly]

Life and a new chapter. So my question is, since everything that is happening and we are very much siding with the government and everything that is happening to the illegal immigrants, because.

[Emily Jaszynski]

We understand first of all the origin of these people.

[Megyn Kelly]

What's your question?

[Emily Jaszynski]

I'm sorry about that.

[Megyn Kelly]

No problem. I'm seeing the line behind you. I just want to make sure we get as many people up as we can. I'm just worried about our positioning as.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Immigrants here, how Americans are going to look at us, because somehow there might be prejudice.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, I don't think you have to worry about that at all. I think Americans are the most tolerant, accepting, loving people in the world. Even with the illegals? Even with the illegals. Americans aren't being cruel to them or treating them as, you know, bad people. But it's like, if you're an illegal who's here and you've committed an additional crime, you're out and there's zero empathy. And if you're an illegal who's here and you haven't committed an additional crime, you're probably also out as, like, a policy matter. But whether Trump can actually effectuate that in the next four years, that's more up to question. But I haven't seen, like, a hint of American citizens treating immigrants badly. That is just not a us thing. Hi.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Hi. How are you? Great, thank you. Where should young conservatives stand on modern day Israel with, you know, certain sources like Tucker Carlson saying that there could potentially be, you know, bad things going on there and other conservatives saying that we have the biblical duty to protect them?

[Megyn Kelly]

It's a good question. So I'm going to disappoint you because I don't have the answer to it. But I'll tell you my own approach. I'm very pro Israel and I'm a Zionist. I do believe they have the right to exist. And I think they're an extraordinary democracy in the middle of a very rough neighborhood, which has got very different values than we do the neighbors around Israel, whereas they share a lot of our values. But in the beginning of this conflict, we were told repeatedly, you can criticize the Israeli government, just don't be anti Semitic. Don't support, you know, harassing college students here in America because they're Jewish. Don't, don't harass kids trying to cross across, go across the quad because they have, you know, the Yamakan. Yes, I agree with all that. But then when this thing went on for two years and some of us started to say, like, you know, going on a long time, taken out Hezbollah, you've devastated Hamas, you've taken out the Houthis, you've taken out the Iranian nuclear program. Kind of seems like it's time now. It's time. You're an anti Semite. What? And I think Americans really resented that. And I think there's too many people who are like, sort of pro Israel as like a lobbyist or a spokesperson or very active on X that don't reflect well on regular American pro Israelites or Jews, what have you. And you always have to remind yourself that sometimes the loudest advocates are really not the best representatives of the actual cause. I think Israel and we are very close friends for very good reasons. They actually don't ask that much of us. They take the lead on most of these conflicts and we're there in a more of a supportive role, like just in case they need us, as we saw with Iran. And I think they're a super important ally of ours. And I hope people, even if you're feeling angry with where things are with Israel now, don't completely abandon the cause. Hi, Megan. Hi. I respect you tremendously and I listen to you for cogent and thoughtful arguments. What I'm confused about is why you've.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Begun to resort to personal attacks like calling people fat and ugly.

[Megyn Kelly]

Why resort to ad hominem? Depends on the person. Yeah.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Why resort to ad hominem attacks when you're so pretty?

[Megyn Kelly]

It's like a mean girl. Why are you resorting to that when you have cogent arguments? Because I want them to come over to the other side. And the number one thing they need to do to get out of their ugliness is drop their Trump derangement syndrome. Their lives will be better and they'll be happier. Sorry. But it's true. I don't think it's any accident that the number of people we see out at the no Kings protest are homely people. I don't. I don't think there's any accident. I look out here and I see all beautiful people. I happen to believe that conservatism makes you gorgeous. I don't know what it is. It's like a fountain of youth. It just makes you. I mean, you get asked out more, you start having more action, you get better job opportunities. People are selling conservatism all wrong. Hi. Okay. Hi, Mrs. Kelly, get it.

[Emily Jaszynski]

My question is, what advice would you.

[Megyn Kelly]

Give to my generation about finding your voice in standing firm in what we.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Believe while growing up in such a divided and hostile world?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Practice.

[Megyn Kelly]

Practice at every opportunity. Never, never say no to an opportunity to get up in front of people and say how you really feel. Never hide your true viewpoint because you think the professor's not going to like it or a potential employer is not going to like it. You don't have to go into a job interview and start talking about how you feel on abortion. But if this issue comes up at the water cooler or you're asked by a professor to write a certain thing that you don't agree with, or you're in class and everyone feels a certain way, stand up for what you believe in. Big, courageous decisions, they don't happen in a vacuum. You make tiny little courageous decisions that make sure when you get to the big moment where you have to make a big one, you've exercised that muscle. But you will not make the big, courageous decision if you didn't exercise it. So you have to start in the little moments of your life. Those are all the building blocks to who you're going to be. And when it comes to articulating your ideals, do it as often as humanly possible. Do it looking into your iPhone if you have to, if you don't have an audience, but do it. Do it daily if you can. Talk about it with your friends, talk about it with your teachers, talk about it with everybody you can where it's an appropriate setting. And don't back down from what you feel. Not even one iota. Not even if you're wrong. It's great to be wrong. You'll be proven wrong, and then tomorrow you'll be less wrong than you were the day before. So don't be afraid of that. Right. Take risks. Put yourself out there and just keep practicing. Keep practicing. Hi.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Hi, Megan. My name is Jacob. This one's going to be a little rough.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I have two Naval Academy grad children. I have one Air Force Academy grad children.

[Megyn Kelly]

Awesome. Thank you for your family service.

[Glenn Greenwald]

My youngest, she starts pilot school at the end of next month, so.

[Megyn Kelly]

Wow.

[Glenn Greenwald]

We've been very blessed. Now, on September 8th, Donald Trump on his Truth Social, he posted a video about how dangerous flu shots are and tetanus shots are. And the ingredient is called thermecerol. It's got lead in it. Mercury.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yep. Thimerosal.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yes. And RFK Jr. He's also aware of it and having my children along with the other 2.1 million people that are serving in our military right now, how is it that they do not have informed consent for vaccinations regarding the flu shot? I wrote my congressman, Tony Gonzalez here in Texas. Okay. Completely ignored. I know you're close with Peter Hegseth. I have the letter in my hand that I gave Tony Gonzalez. Would you please give this to Peter Hegseth?

[Megyn Kelly]

Absolutely. Please give it to that good man holding the microphone. I will make sure he gets it. We love you. Thank you. I'm going to.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I'm going to give you two, three copies.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Okay, good.

[Megyn Kelly]

Right on. Because I'm with you on the informed consent. If we've learned nothing from the COVID vaccine, we've learned we need that. Thank you. Right on. And good luck to your daughter. Yeah, go ahead. We got time for like maybe two more.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Okay. Hi, Megan.

[Megyn Kelly]

I'm so excited to have you here.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I listen to you every morning at 5am on my way to the gym.

[Megyn Kelly]

Thank you very much.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I really appreciate your perspective, your no BS perspective that you provide. So I'm curious, what's your strategy for.

[Megyn Kelly]

Maintaining credibility in an era of media mistrust? And how does being named one of.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Times 100 most influential people shape your.

[Megyn Kelly]

Sense of responsibility in that effort? Oh, well, I guess I'll take them in reverse order. Not at all. And my approach to, you know, the news and facts and my credibility are. It's. They're everything like it. I think if there's one thing I'm known for, it's being hyper factual. Like I do believe people understand facts are first with me and then we can talk about my opinions and your opinions and other people's opinions. But I consider it a cardinal sin to get the facts wrong on my newscast. Either my actual show or my morning show. Now, the AM update. It's a true cardinal sin to get the facts wrong because I respect you too much. And I also think that I was talking about you guys being news consumers and how that does require some sharp elbows. It's not just. You're not just any news consumers. But if I may, you've tuned into this show, which means you don't just want the sweet nothings whispered in your ears. You would go someplace else if that's what you wanted. You must be in the market for true hard facts and some opinion too. And that's. So that's what I feel I owe you. And how do I do it? With a lot of help. It takes a lot of effort in today's day and Age to cut through all the BS and all the spin and figure out what is real. Every single story is so hard to figure out what is real. And I know you must feel that as news consumers. I feel it as a news producer and reporter. But it's doable. It's doable. And so I think in today's day and age, you need to find a provider, a news provider or two or three, and put your trust in them to go through. You have a busy life. You guys have things that you need to do. You don't need to do news 24 7. We're doing that for you. But make sure you choose well, because if you don't choose well, you walk around thinking, Russia, Russia, Russia is real. The Steele dossier is absolutely horrible. And that no one's ever renovated the White House before. Right. So be careful. Thank you. Yeah, we'll do one more. Sorry to the people standing in the line. Yeah. Love you.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Hi, Megan.

[Megyn Kelly]

My name is Millie, and recently I.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Received an injury from a male competing in my sport. It was. It was a coach at my high.

[Megyn Kelly]

School, and I received a minor concussion.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I got hit in the head.

[Megyn Kelly]

And I was wondering how I can.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Help keep my voice strong about wanting.

[Megyn Kelly]

To protect my rights as a young female athlete. Oh, I'm so sorry that happened to you. That's horrifying. Thank you for standing up and asking the question. So, first of all, you have the advantage. It is a big advantage of living in Texas. God bless Texas. Look at all these people. They'll all have your back. Like, if this is your community, you're already ahead of the game because they'll. They're going to have your back. These guys are not going to tolerate this. That. But you, you have an opportunity to sit in the front row of your life. And in terms you might understand down here, take the bull by the horns and. And you handle it, you know, I mean, I'll give you this example. So we have three kids, as I mentioned, and of course, I could go in and I could fight every battle for them. Doug, my husband, could go in and fight all the battles for them. But it's much more useful if we tell them, good luck with it, you know, and we don't even give them advice. Just like, what do you think? How are you going to do it? Then? If they ask us, what would you think about this? Well, we'll give them the advice, but they have to fight the battle because we're not going to be with them forever. Soon they're going to leave the house. They're going to go to college. They need the skills. It's not. It's fine to have me as their mom, but I'm not going to go with them to college. I've tried, but they've told me they don't want me. So you should take this opportunity, which is a big challenge, to start developing yourself. It's a gift that you've been given. So how will you handle it? How will you go to your principal and say, here is why I. I object to this? Will you go to the coach and say, here is why I am not going to play when you are out there anymore and see it as an opportunity for growth for you. Right. Because they don't come along that. That often. And. And truly, the. The difference between somebody who is sort of ordinary and someone who is extraordinary is they've had the gift of something really tough coming their way, and they've handled it. You don't have to handle it perfectly. You don't have to be the picture of grace. You might fall, you might misstep. All that's fine. That's all great ingredients into the cake, but you must handle it. You. You, no one else. And you'll have to figure out how. And if it's. If it's the wrong way, that's great. The next time something comes your way, you're going to handle it better. And if it's the right way, then great, you've solved this problem. But there's literally no downside. Even if you get blowback, even if somebody calls you names, that's all great stuff. You're going to use all of it. Anything bad that happens to you is actually positive as long as you use it. So something bad has happened to you, and now you have a huge opportunity to grow. You can. I mean, you can hit womanhood basically in about a week if you handle this in a strong way. It doesn't have to be the right way, just a strong way and to where you think about yourself in 30 years and you say, will I be proud of what I did? That should be your guidepost. Good luck. And if they don't do the right thing, call me and I'll publicly humiliate them. All right, let's get this party started. Thank you all for your questions. All right, so the way we're gonna do this is we're gonna bring out Emily in a minute, and we're gonna talk to Emily, and then we're gonna bring out Glenn. After that, we're gonna talk to Glenn and then we're gonna have them both sit together for a little while and have a little coffee talk, the three of us. So I want to tell you about Emily Jaszynski. So Emily is like, to me, about 17 years old. She's so young. She's extraordinarily talented. Right. She's great. So I first found Emily myself. She had been working for the Washington examiner, and she had been with yaf, a conservative group for young people. But I first discovered her when she was working at the Federalist. You know, Molly Hemingway, she was working at the Federalist, and she was their culture editor. And she had such different and unique takes on everything. And I love culture commentators. I do a little bit of it myself, but I'm much more into listening to other great people do it, like Maureen Callahan. And Emily is one of those people, but she's so young. It's like she has so many great insights for somebody. So anyway. But she's always got a different way into the story. She is never predictable, which is one of the reasons why I absolutely adore her. And so we've thankfully been able to fold her more and more into the Megyn Kelly show and to our MK Media Network. Now she hosts After Party with Emily Jasinsky, which is killing it, by the way. She's crushing it. You could download that pod. Yeah. And she's in full flourish. And I, like, I can only sort of imagine of where Emily Jashinsky is going to be in 20 years. I think she's going to be the queen of all media. So you will see her tonight while she's just the princess, but well on her way. Take a look at this sizzle reel and then we'll bring her out.

[Emily Jaszynski]

This is a Real Housewives level drama. Fannie Willis is, like, on tape talking about how she was going to crack down on corruption and nobody would be sleeping with other people in the Danny's office. Andrew Cuomo shouldn't be able to show his face in polite society without upholding, apologizing, groveling, and saying what you did wrong.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I like it all.

[Emily Jaszynski]

He's not trying to pretend the guy actually really loves McDonald's. Any other politician would be fearfully sticking to their script.

[Megyn Kelly]

The rapid response choir.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I don't want to sound racist, but I sometimes really hate white people.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Megan.

[Emily Jaszynski]

So ineffective. And it's why they ended up losing the culture, which was unthinkable for the right ten years ago.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. Emily Jasinski. Let's give it up for Emily. Yeah. Hey, girl.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I like that. You brought me out on stage with me being racist, racist against white people.

[Megyn Kelly]

Here I am setting the stage. I'm sure our friends in Texas will understand. In fact, we should start as an acknowledgement to Karine Jean Pierre by stating that we are white and we are women. Yeah.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Heterosexual. Don't forget that.

[Megyn Kelly]

Hetero. Yeah. Totally straight and cis.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yes. Yeah, that's the one I always forget.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, the cis, it's easy to forget. Yeah. I hope we forget it forever. Yeah.

[Emily Jaszynski]

We're on the cusp.

[Megyn Kelly]

So I actually didn't know in preparing for this, I did not know that you were a Midwestern girl, which explains so much about you. Right. People from Texas make sense and people from the Midwest make sense. People from the Northeast, where I am from, do not make sense.

[Emily Jaszynski]

You guys are bad.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, it's a miracle. I grew up in upstate New York, which is not the same as New York upstate. We're sensible people.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

So tell me about your family. Was it very conservative?

[Emily Jaszynski]

I mean, not super political even? My parents are both great and they're both from Wisconsin, so just grew up. Oh, amazing. Yeah, I just grew up about an hour west of Milwaukee, so my mom worked in Milwaukee. My mom is super, like the most amazing person you could imagine. Her career, I mean, this woman worked like 70 hour weeks traveling to China and Germany. And my dad's a civil engineer. He worked for the state in the same job basically for 40 years. And they, they're retired now. I have a younger brother, he lives in dc. So did you always think you were.

[Megyn Kelly]

Going to get into news, Megan?

[Emily Jaszynski]

Actually, no. I loved when I graduated high school I wanted to be a stand up comedian. It's so embarrassing, but when I loved TV and so this is where for me it's especially special to even know you because I don't know if I've told you this story before. I feel like I have said it once before, but I'm obsessed with TV and media, especially news. So I watched a ton of news growing up because there's something just sort of very romantic about it to me. Me, I don't know why, but it, it just is. And I would. I had a summer job one year.

[Megyn Kelly]

She's talking about Chuck Todd.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yeah, it's Sleepy Eyes. That's my favorite Trump nickname of all time.

[Megyn Kelly]

Sleepy Eyes.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Sleepy Eyes. Because it's so specific and it's something you didn't know was accurate until he said it.

[Megyn Kelly]

Like so many of Trump's nicknames, you're.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Like, oh, but I would watch your show during my Lunch break and. And I just have these memories of sitting on the floor and watching and just. I loved you specifically. So it's very, very special.

[Megyn Kelly]

I feel like we were meant to be together. Apparently. I too, like, I actually did not think I was gonna go into news. I thought I was gonna practice law for the rest of my life. But, you know, in 10th grade, I took an aptitude test. One of those things that tells you, like, what you should do. And you know what? It said I should become a political journalist.

[Emily Jaszynski]

You're kidding.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. You believe that? At age 14 or 15, it said you should be a political journalist. I wound up becoming a lawyer. And then when I was thinking about, well, what else could I do? This seemed like an obvious choice, but I had forgotten all about that.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Did you remember it when you decided to go into news?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. I did do like a two day internship for the Albany Times Union when I was. I'm from Albany, New York. And it was very cool. I followed around this reporter and I listened to him make his calls and it was like, yeah, seemed like very hard nosed, you know, shoe leather reporter. And it was great because when, by the time I finally got my job at Fox, which was not my first job in news, in my second job, but I was roomed with, roomed office mates with Major Garrett. You guys know Major Garrett, right? Remember him? So CBS now, but he truly was shoe leather reporter who was like, he loves when I tell the story. But when I first walked into our office, I knocked over a huge pile of Maxim magazines. Then I kind of bumped into a file cabinet in his desk and there was a big bottle of bourbon in there. I'm like, I'm home.

[Emily Jaszynski]

That's a newsroom.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yep.

[Megyn Kelly]

So I love it too.

[Emily Jaszynski]

There's something romantic about it.

[Megyn Kelly]

But you, you're, you know, I know that this word gets overused, but you are heterodox. So you came from a family that might lean, right, a bit, like a little.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Well, no. So this is actually really interesting. At least from my perspective, it's interesting. I don't need to bore everyone with the details, but my, my dad is a union guy because he works for the state of Wisconsin. And my mom is in. I'm sorry, Mom, I'm exposing you here. But she is in human resources, so she's a very. I know I said she was a great person earlier, but she's obviously a very bad person. So, you know, they had their own. My dad was raised Catholic. My mom is sort of evangelical. And so I got that Clash. They didn't talk about politics all the time, but when they did, you know, when I was a senior in high school, it was Scott Walker's Act 10 protests. My teachers were like, leaving the classroom and calling out sick.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, I remember that.

[Emily Jaszynski]

But my parents were sort of on different sides of that.

[Megyn Kelly]

YAF is. That's Scott Walker's Organization for Young People, Young Americans Foundation. And it's. So that's why I just assumed you were conservative. I mean.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

You don't track conservative now. You track like, I never know where you're going to land on an issue which I like.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Interesting. Yeah. So I still. I mean, for me, the most important thing is just being a Christian, and I feel like everything else follows from that. And so it's, you know, I identify. Like, people always ask, what kind of conservative are you? Libertarian, moderate, whatever. I just feel like I'm normal conservative. But the Trump era has been. It's tested, I think, my politics in all kinds of different ways.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, all of us.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

But you will surprise. Like, that's kind of the theme of our evening because you and Glenn, like, there's so much on which we overlap, but then there's a whole other, you know, realm where we don't overlap. And. But I like that about you. I mean, I love that. And people, like, people who are really, really pro Israel will say, like, why do you have Glenn on? I'm like, because I fucking love him.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yeah, man.

[Megyn Kelly]

Why wouldn't I have Glenn on? Yeah. You know, we've gotten to this place where now even within the conservative circles, people are like, no, you can't platform that person because they have views that I object to, or they've. They've said things I object to. It's like, no, I don't. I don't care about views some people may find objectionable. Now, if you've lost your ever loving mind, I'm probably not going to have you on the show because I want my audience not to be misled, led, but different views from my own, of course. So what do you. What are you. How are you looking at what's happening right now on the right?

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yeah, I mean, so the. I had this experience when I was probably 26 or something of starting to host a show with someone who's a Democratic socialist, basically, Ryan Grim. And Ryan is a wonderful human being. And I learned from that, the labels. Because people would apply labels to Ryan, even things that I would have thought of Ryan before I knew him. And they just all dissolve when you're forced to be in close proximity with someone having challenging conversations, and you see how they are as a dad and a husband. And you realize it's so easy to jump to labels because politics is so personal. And I mean, the Israel stuff obviously looms over so much of what we talk about on the right now, which I find it to get very boring, to be honest. But it's just the labels that I was told to apply to people who thought one way, I just saw up close and personal that they weren't right. And for me, I think it's just amazing that I'm forced to challenge myself all the time to talk to the guests that Ryan wants to bring on or Crystal Ball wants to bring on.

[Megyn Kelly]

And I love Crystal Ball. She's a leftist. She's kind of a democratic socialist a little bit. But she's totally brilliant and very cool and a beautiful person inside now. But it is. It does require you to spend time with people who are of that ilk to realize. Right. Okay. We disagree ardently, but I have love for this person.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

And we need that now more than ever. I know, right.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I know. And that's like it just people. This is. I think we're seeing this happen a lot right now is that someone gets categorized as bad because you believe their politics will lead to something bad, which is totally fair. It doesn't make the person bad for coming to a different side on that question. They had a different background experience. And I think they're so wrong. And I think their wrongness, like Zoram Mamdani, I think his wrongness is going to lead to a lot of misery in New York City.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I don't think my friends who feel like the status quo in New York City has immiserated them are wrong to be like, hey, maybe I want to give this guy a chance. I don't think it makes him a bad person. Yeah, I think it makes them wrong, but not wrong as people. Not wrong morally.

[Megyn Kelly]

They'll be living under Sharia law soon. I got to say that the Zoram Dami does scare me. He scares me. It's not even the socialism, which does scare me too, but like the fact that he. He went down and embraced that imam. Did you see the story? He loves this imam in Manhattan. This guy literally testified for the defense when the blind sheikh was tried for bombing the World Trade Center. The first time he testified for the.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Defense, wasn't he a character witness?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, for the blind Sheikh. And he said a lot of terror loving things. This imam, who Zorahamdami is embracing and called a pillar of our community, like last week. It's not like all three years ago, some random rope line where he had a picture. See, that guy scares me. He's very focused on Palestine. He's very focused on Muslim. What mosque did you, did you visit? Did you see that in the New York debate? That was his test for Andrew. What mosque? Did you know? No mosque. That's, that's why Andrew Cuomo is so weak. He should have said, I didn't visit any mosque. This is a Judeo Christian country. This is a Judeo Christian city. Muslims make up 9%. And I didn't visit their mosque, and I don't need to visit their mosque.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Maybe the worst candidate in the history of bad candidates is Andrew Post Covid. They were like, yeah, let's do it, let's do it. Let's put our money behind that guy.

[Megyn Kelly]

I'm interested. Like, can you shout out if you care about the New York mayoral race?

[Glenn Greenwald]

You do.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. So I never know whether people, you know, obviously we live in the area. My family and I live in the area, so we care. But I think I'd care even if I lived in San Francisco, because New York is our crown jewel. I mean, it's an amazing, amazing American city, and I think it's the greatest city in the world, bar none. And we're about to hand it over to a lunatic who doesn't know what he's doing. That's our only saving grace is that he doesn't know what he's doing doing. So maybe he'll just be so incompetent. But I, I am also interested in how we got here. Like, how did, how did New Yorkers who are not fools get so desperate that they would consider this guy?

[Emily Jaszynski]

That is such an interesting question. And even just for asking it, you know, if you don't ask it the right way or whatever, people pile on. And it makes it so hard to get. First of all, it makes it hard for both parties to see the good candidates because they don't want anybody who, like, Marjorie Taylor Greene is a really good example of someone who, I think, growing up in Wisconsin, Marjorie Taylor Greene, I know she's from Georgia, but that is a person that, you know, and the political system is trying to make it impossible for her to exist as a normal non political robot. She is like the top small dollar fundraising Republican in Congress, and they are trying to make it impossible because she just colors outside the lines. And coloring outside the lines sometimes means having uncomfortable conversations. Like what on earth happened that Democrats in New York looked at Andrew Cuomo and said, this guy, he's been around a long time. We are going with the 33 year old Democratic Socialist.

[Megyn Kelly]

Right.

[Emily Jaszynski]

That's a huge problem. And now if he wins the race, which he probably will.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Again, the level of desperation that has to be behind people going with that. Unbelievable.

[Megyn Kelly]

I know the economic problems are not getting addressed on the right or the left. People are still suffering. This is actually a big threat to Trump come the midterms. Right. Because he's still not scoring well in the polls on people's economic issues. And while he's doing everything he can, I mean, Trump would say his tariff plan is actually to help on the economic issues. He gets so much guff over it, but so far I feel like it's actually going pretty well.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I'm a tariff person, so.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, but that's another thing on which he. People were not open minded. They were knee jerk criticism of Trump and so far he's brought in quite a bit of revenue on it. And it's helped us like get Mexico to crack down on its Fentanyl labs. It's helped us with Canada. I don't know. I'm very open minded on the terrorists, but it's another thing you're not allowed to touch. No.

[Emily Jaszynski]

You can't talk about. No. And before Trump came along, nobody would ever suggest like a tariff anywhere near what some of his tariffs have been. Oh, hell no.

[Megyn Kelly]

Republican?

[Glenn Greenwald]

No.

[Emily Jaszynski]

No.

[Megyn Kelly]

Republic.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yeah, exactly. It was like Bernie, basically. But what he's doing, I don't know how the tariff war is going to end, but I do know that he has scared the hell out of all of these countries who were getting a much better deal than we were and now realize supply chains are going to shift. They have to adjust because the US Isn't going back. I mean, Biden kept a significant part of Trump, Trump 1.0 tariffs because that is where the country has. I mean, it's clearly where the country has to go. So I don't know what happens with the tariffs at the end of the day, but the idea that we couldn't talk about this.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, insane. What do you think of the question one of the audience members asked about where we should stand on Israel? Come on, Megan, it's fine. I know you've got different views on this, but that's fine. I think people want to hear that. They want to hear the differences.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Well, no, no, I think it's, I mean, so I've, I have a one particular Story that started to change the way that I thought about Israel. As someone who grew up again, I grew up like Missouri Synod Lutherans, you may be lcms, but very like low church evangelical culture. And so left behind books, the Rapture, all of that fun stuff, and never questioned it that much. Never questioned that sort of dispensationalist reading of scripture. And the story of a Christian American journalist named Shereen Abu Akla, who was killed in, I think it was the west bank. And she was. This was like 2021. That story really piqued my interest. You know, I used to have a rule with Ryan that for. I shouldn't say this, but I'm going to. For every one story we covered about Israel, I would make him cover a story about trans athletes.

[Megyn Kelly]

Did we win him over on that issue?

[Emily Jaszynski]

I don't know. Actually. That's a good question. We don't talk about it that much because after October 7th, it was so. We did so much Israel coverage. And when she was killed, I started asking some people I really trusted on the right because I had to cover the story. What's going on here? This seems weird. It looks like she was targeted. What's happening?

[Megyn Kelly]

And.

[Emily Jaszynski]

And what I heard made a lot of sense to me, which is, the IDF has no reason to do this. Why would the IDF do this? And I saw the Biden administration basically taking the Israeli government's propaganda and regurgitating it. And I really didn't like being lied to about a American, about a Christian, and about a journalist's death. And eventually the IDF came out and said, you know, this is. This was our mistake. But it took weeks, and they pretty clearly knew it right away. I mean, it's almost impossible to imagine they didn't know it right away. You can actually see the bullet pattern behind the tree that she was shot in front of. And after that, it just sort of. The. The paradigm shifted for me as to how I evaluated these stories. And I still think, you know, it's. You know this better than anyone right now. You just said we're pro Israel. I too, and pro Israel. And you can. Even saying that isn't enough sometimes. So I think people underestimate the degree to which just that in and of itself has created skepticism because people really don't like our government regurgitating foreign propaganda and then being told you can't question it.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, no, that. I mean, let's think. Look at how much we rip on our own government. We rip on our own government all the time. We'd rip on it, whether Trump's in there. It certainly ripped on it a lot when Biden was in there. You can rip on our government and we do all the time. Israel's certainly fair game. Oh, yeah, they're not even our government. Why can't we rip on Israel? We absolutely can rip on Israel. Ripping on Israel is a fine thing to do. Doesn't mean, in my view, you don't go so far as to say, I'm an anti Zionist and they can't exist. Like, that's crazy town. But I really strongly reject the attempts to stifle the criticism against them because they spent a long time trying to tell us, you can criticize Israel at the beginning of this war, just don't be anti Semitic. Okay, got it. And then as soon as many of us started to get more critical of Israel, it was, you're an anti Semite. Well, no, we're not going to play that game.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Oh my gosh. And the, the Israeli media is more critical of Israel than sometimes the American media is like, it's incredible. Like, following the Israeli media after October 7th has been very eye opening as well, because their conversations are actually much more like big picture and broad and include a more diverse array of.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, I mean, look, it's not like our media has figured out the perfect formula either.

[Emily Jaszynski]

No, that's for sure.

[Megyn Kelly]

And speaking of that, I want to ask you about the. What's happening at the White House and the Renault. Ooh, the media has lost its ever loving mind. I actually, I have my notes here because I wanted to read exactly what they're saying. Okay. Maria Shriver, you know her, she's Kennedy. Breaks my heart and infuriates me. The addition of a ballroom. Why is she so worked up? Hillary Rodham Clinton. It's not his house, it's our house and he's destroying it. And what does she do? She starts selling hats with that on it to make money off of the White House. Yet again. Such a grifter. The bulwark, which exists only to bring down Trump. As soon as a Democrat gets in there, the addition must be raised. R A Z E D must be completely demolished and any sign of Trump's ballroom must be gotten rid of. The media doesn't talk about all the Reno that has been done by so many other presidents in the past and by Obama's nearly $400 million Renault. Which is less than what Trump is doing or the fact that we didn't have an adequate space for like, dignitaries to gather and have a celebration inside the White House. And then I'll give you one more. Gretchen Carlson, who I used to work with at Fox, she gets out there and she was like, I was there when they signed the sexual harassment whatever in the East Room. And now it's been demolished.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Indelible in the history of this.

[Megyn Kelly]

The East Room is part of the main White House. Like when you walk in the front door, the northern entry, it's one of those rooms where they still hold ceremonies all the time. Not to be confused with the East Wing, which only has a couple of offices supposedly supposed to be used by the First Lady. They are two entirely different things, but these are the people who are supposed to be our media betters, educating us about how bad Trump is and why it's terrible what he's doing.

[Emily Jaszynski]

The New York Times had an amazing story on this where they tried to cite examples of the history that the East Wing means to the country. All of the history that's taken place in the East Wing, which was built, I think, in 1902 under Teddy Roosevelt. So it's, I mean, people in general, I think, think the White House is much older than it is. It's a lot of. It is pretty new. But the Times story telling you this is true. The three examples they cite. First, they say the East Wing where Bill Clinton used to meet with Dick Morris without his staff knowing.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, the White. The White House's latest additions to its website, you're saying, no, no, no.

[Emily Jaszynski]

This is actually, that is incredible, too. The New York Times really was like, God rest the East Wing. This is where Bill Clinton used to meet with Dick Morris without his staff noting. Their second example is that this is where Dick Cheney was, was rushed away on 9 11. And their third example is it's where Donald Trump was taken during 2020 protests. It's like these are the three examples you could come up with of the reverent, sacred East Wing history. Dick fucking Morris.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Are you kidding me?

[Megyn Kelly]

I believe it's dickmorris.com.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

Dickmores.com yes, yes, yes, yes. Wait, so that actually reminds me. This is also on my notes, which I laughed at because the White House added something to its website today because they wanted to underscore the, the historic nature of the White House. And here it is. Hold on, you've got to hear this. So they put up a major events timeline on the White House website, and it now includes sections detailing all the renovations over the decades and Also the following 1998, Bill Clinton's affair with intern Monica Lewinsky.

[Emily Jaszynski]

It'S on WhiteHouse.gov you can look it up.

[Megyn Kelly]

President Bill Clinton's affair with intern Monica Lewinsky was exposed leading to White House perjury investigation. The Oval Office trysts fueled impeachment for obstruction. 2012, Obama hosting members of the Muslim Brotherhood. 2023, Hunter Biden losing his cocaine in the White House.

[Emily Jaszynski]

So good.

[Megyn Kelly]

There's nobody, there's nobody better at trolling than the tribe. Trump, White House, nobody. And you want to talk history, let's talk history. We love the historic nature of the White House.

[Emily Jaszynski]

You missed the best entry on the timeline, which is the trans day of visibility.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Did you see that one? Yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

That training showing off his boobs on the front of the White House lawn.

[Emily Jaszynski]

And they put that on whitehouse.gov as part of the tour of historical moments.

[Megyn Kelly]

Can never be disturbed.

[Emily Jaszynski]

No.

[Megyn Kelly]

But honestly, this all goes back to the media and how if it weren't for people like you in independent media, people wouldn't know these facts. The media is not telling you any of that stuff about the prior renovations of the White House or how this is actually not a big deal and how Obama spent a lot more on his Reno than Trump did on his for something that no one really cared about. And it is thanks to independent media that you already know a lot of this. You came in knowing a lot of this. And so it's the antidote, you know, that the media has driven people crazy. I think it's had a big role in radicalizing the left and causing this tendency towards political violence. And the antidote, yes, is what we're doing here tonight and what you guys are doing by listening to these shows and what we're doing in independent media to counteract all the lies.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I couldn't agree with that more. It's the experience. Let's just take this East Wing example of somebody googling to try and figure out whether Donald Trump is actually destroying sacred American history. They Google, they read a New York Times story, they look on NBC.com or whatever and they come away thinking, okay, so this is really serious. And then they decide, but these are fairly left. Let me just go and see what other people are saying. And now these things are completely opposed to one another. Like these two point are completely opposed to one another. And so just like for the good of the country, like that experience, we have all had it, we probably all have it like once a week. It is so hard to vote to make decisions about your own life. I mean, during COVID to make decisions about your personal health, about your kids. About schools. How are people supposed to share any truth anymore? Like you? You can't do it. So it's desperately needed.

[Megyn Kelly]

All right, we are going to pause it here with Emily. We're going to bring out Glenn, and then Emily's coming on back on the back end. Thank you so much, my friend. Love you. All right, Emily Jaczewski, everybody. So let me tell you something about Glenn Greenwald, okay? I met Glenn years ago, but before we actually met each other, Glenn had been saying nice things, things about me in the media, even though I was at Fox News and he was at the Guardian. Now, it's never happened before or since that somebody at the Guardian would say something nice about a Fox News person. So he kind of came to my attention, and I apparently came to his. And from that moment forward, a beautiful friendship was born. I wound up having him on my show, and when I got into independent media, he was the first guest on my show. And he's been on my show more than any other guest. Glenn Greenwald, a leftist former Guardian reporter who happens to be a Pulitzer Prize winner and an Oscar winner. Did you know that Glenn Greenwald has an Oscar? He'll tell us what he won an Oscar for. But he is one of the ballsiest, most fearless, most honest, most principled reporter you will ever have the privilege of meeting. It's time for Medicare annual enrollment again. The mailers, the robocalls, the texts blowing up your phone. It can be a circus and overwhelming. But this is one Medicare message you do need to hear. Medicare plans can change every year. And even if you like your current plan, your costs could go up or you could lose coverage for things you depend on. This is why I want to tell you about Chapter. Chapter compares every plan nationwide to make sure you are on a plan that best fits your needs. On average, they save people 1100 bucks a year. I get it. Nobody wants to deal with Medicare. But in under 20 minutes, Chapter can review your options. If your plan is already the best for 2026, great, you're done. If not, they will help you switch before rising costs hit your wallet. No gimmicks, no pushy sales, just straight talk from people who know Medicare inside and out. Call Chapter today at 27 Medicare. That's 27 Medicare to talk to a trusted advisor today. Busy work weeks can leave you feeling drained. Prolon's five day fasting mimicking diet rejuvenates you at the cellular level, lets you enjoy real food, and does not require an injection. Developed at USC's Longevity Institute, Prolon supports biological age reduction, metabolism, skin health and fat loss when combined with proper exercise and nutrition. Get 15% off plus a $40 bonus gift when you subscribe at prolonlife.com PandoraProMo Take a look at Glenn Greenwald's show here.

[Glenn Greenwald]

There's no wonder that the country hates the media, no longer trusts it. These people in the media are held in complete contempt. It just has a stench of like cover up in a way that's very dangerous and deceitful. To lie to the public for so many years about the person who has the nuclear codes and what their mental state is.

[Megyn Kelly]

There is not a thing that comes to mind.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I, I don't know. I never thought about that before. I'll get back to you right now. Nothing's coming to mind. That is stunning. This is real contempt and hatred in a marriage.

[Megyn Kelly]

The way you're chewing makes me want.

[Glenn Greenwald]

To smack you upside. The only time I ever see clips of a shava is when you force me to see them.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's why you're the Megan Kelly show Godfather.

[Glenn Greenwald]

The Godfather of the Megyn Kelly show. Exactly.

[Megyn Kelly]

The Godfather himself, Glenn Grewall Everybod. Hi. This is the first time we've ever met. Can you believe that?

[Glenn Greenwald]

Bizarre.

[Megyn Kelly]

Today is the first time we talked.

[Glenn Greenwald]

About that on your. The last time I was on your show. Because in this world you can not meet someone physically and know them so well. We were talking about we're very good friends. It was bizarre. How do we have a very good friendship and never have met before? So we've rectified that now.

[Megyn Kelly]

So it is funny though, how it began, right? Like has it ever happened before or since? A Guardian reporter saying something nice about a Fox News reporter. But in that moment, a beautiful friendship was born. We just didn't know it yet.

[Glenn Greenwald]

We didn't. It took a few years for us to allow the walls to erode. But no, I remember it was very kind of serendipitous. I was watching Fox and in that era I didn't do that much. I was constantly on MSNBC and cnn and you had your Fox show and I remember you started interviewing Republican senators and it was adversarial, even a little mean, but very professional, but mean. And for me, as someone who was always on MSNBC where Democratic senators are treated like high priests, like the paragons of virtue, never asked a hard question. I said, wait a minute. I kept hearing on Fox that it's this deeply partisan network that only feeds people what they want to hear. And yet here's a 9 o' clock PM host prime time with big ratings. He's beloved by conservatives pounding Republican politicians with hard questions the way she's supposed to as a journalist. And yeah, I remember Politico called me when they were doing a profile on you and said, hey, you've been praising Megyn Kelly. That's really weird. You're on the left. She's a conservative. And I said, you know, for me, journalism is way higher for a journalist than partisan affiliation. And she does the sort of thing that I think we need more of and respect. And I remember people on the left were horrified. How can you praise Megyn Kelly? She's a Nazi. I was like, what? Megyn Kelly, she's a Nazi.

[Megyn Kelly]

I was a Nazi before. It was cool.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Exactly. You were. You were.

[Megyn Kelly]

You were.

[Glenn Greenwald]

But, yeah, that's what, you know, I think that's one of the things we share. That, again, took a while for us to realize.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's exactly right. So the first thing I remember you. You reached out to me on, or you said something publicly on, was an exchange I had with then Vice President Dick Cheney. And actually, we have the sound bite. I don't know. Let's see if this works. We haven't played a site yet at one of these. Let's see. This is the moment. Been so wrong about so much at the expense of so many. But time and time again, history has proven that you got it wrong as well. In Iraq, sir, you said there was no doubt Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. You said we would be greeted as liberators. You said the Iraq insurgency was in the last throes back in 2005. And you said that after our intervention, extremists were. Would have to, quote, rethink their strategy of jihad. Now, with almost a trillion dollars spent there, with 4,500American lives lost there. What do you say to those who say you were so wrong about so much at the expense of so many?

[Glenn Greenwald]

No, I just fundamentally disagree. Reagan, Meghan. They. You've got to go back and look at the track record. We inherited a situation where there was no doubt in anybody's mind.

[Megyn Kelly]

All right, you get the hint. You see how it goes. But if you. If you heard it, called me Reagan. So he got rattled. And let me tell you something, I was a little scared to ask that question too, because Dick Cheney is scary.

[Glenn Greenwald]

He's scary. He has all. Remember Halliburton and yeah, he was called Darth Cheney.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Which is a very appropriate nickname. But they were. They were rattled. You saw them there Because I don't think people that, by the way, this is called journalism, and this is. I think it's so important. You know, you were talking before about how unpopular media is, and it is. Our profession is held in extremely low esteem, deservedly so. In fact, I think 27% is too high. I mean, it's barely above, you know, like syphilis and Congress. And it's deserved.

[Megyn Kelly]

Below cockroaches. Below.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, exactly. And I.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's.

[Glenn Greenwald]

But I think it's so important to realize that when you hate the media, and you know you should, because there's. Are so dishonest and deceitful and destructive, journalism remains really important. We need journalism. It's not that we're against journalism. It's. We're against people who pretend to be journalists but who would never do anything like that. And I think that's such an important value to affirm.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's what's so galling to me is it's like now I'm in sort of a different business. I'm still a journalist, but now I'm doing a lot more commentary too. And I. I have nothing but disdain for the people who won't do that. It's not that hard. You don't want to do it. You're kind of hitting your own side, you know that. I mean, I'm on Fox News. I'm well aware of how, like, Roger Ailes at the time feels about Dick Cheney and. But you have to force yourself to because you have, you know, integrity. It's the job that you signed up to do, and you just never see it. It's not to toot my own horn, but I'm just saying, you don't watch MSNBC and ever see them give their side any sort of guff, and we've really suffered as a result because, like, in my lane, I don't have access to people on the left. Leftist politicians won't come on my show. They would never subject themselves to. To that kind of tough questioning. And, and the left that does have access won't do it.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, you know, I was. It was funny. I was talking to Emily before, before he came on, and we were both talking about how. And I was describing to her, trying to describe to her my worldview. You know, people are always trying to discover, is he on the left, is he on the right? And I think people have hard time knowing your ideology with precision either. And for me, you know, I decided to become a journalist, not a politician. I'm not a party operative. I could have been that I'm not a spokesperson for a politician. I could have been that, too, as you could do. I decided to become a journalist, and for me, that entails obligations. And I think the primary view, worldview that I have being journalist is that it's always dangerous for human beings to have lots of power and lots of money with no pushback, no scrutiny, no journalistic examination. And so whoever has the most powerful, that's what I'm going to be adversarial to. Not because I dislike them, not because I hate them, not because I want to destroy the reputation, but because our society needs people with power to be accountable, to have to answer hard questions, no matter who it is.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's very hard to do, I have to say, because it's like, I'm so relieved that Trump got elected that, like, I'm completely rooting for him. But you have to be honest about, you know, his pitfalls, too. And so the way I've handled that on our show is I'll bring on somebody like you who will be very critical of, you know, Kilmar, Abrego, Garcia and how that was handled, for example. And I want the audience to hear your point of view, you know, and I can easily defend Trump on it, as I have with you, but I want them to know this actually is controversial, and there's a very robust set of criticisms of Trump here, and let the audience hear them. But that, too, is. It's just so rare. Like, I. If you want to hear an actual debate that's substantive between smart people on any place, on cable news or broadcast, you. You can't.

[Glenn Greenwald]

First of all, the format doesn't permit it. You know, you have to speak for eight minutes in between commercial breaks. Nobody can have a real debate. People have to speak in cliches. I mean, it's very difficult with that little time. Independent media allows a lot more time. I think we argued about that or about, you know, the student protesters for 20 minutes. I mean, argued in a very, you know, civil sense. And we were able to, you know, immediately after move on to something where we agreed on and not have it affect our friendship in any way. And I think that is what we're missing. But the only reason that works is because, you know, I think I have credibility to do it. I'm somebody who defended Donald Trump when I was very much associated with the lab. New Russiagate was bullshit from the start, just journalistically false. I thought it was a dangerous scandal. And I went around, you know, saying that everywhere. I mean, I was virtually Tucker's co host. I was on that show so much, you know. Yes. And you're like, wait a minute, what's going on here? Tucker Glengarrell. But you know, and I've defended him on his views on Ukraine. So I think when I'm criticizing him, people understand it's not coming from a place of partisanship or reflexive, you know, desire to attack Trump. It's just. And I think this debate inside the Maga movement, inside the right about Ukraine, about Israel, these things are really healthy. You don't want a mindlessly unified population behind a leader. You want people saying, wait a minute, you campaign on this. I supported you on that. When is this going to happen? And I think the, the conservative movement has done that as well as anybody. You know, wait, where are the Epstein files? Why is this war still going on? You know, and that is really healthy and important.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's exactly right. And I think Republicans are very good at infighting. I mean, they're excellent infighting. Much better than the left, which left sticks together, I have to say. It's like it's they, they get their people in line. That Nancy Pelosi, she rules with an iron 200-year-old fist. There's something to be admired there with.

[Glenn Greenwald]

A very healthy stock portfolio. Always increases as she stays in.

[Megyn Kelly]

How they've called the stocks. Almost like an NBA basketball player at a poker table.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Oh, very timely.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, so tell us a little bit about your background because you have a very interesting background, Glenn, you like, you tell us how you got into this line of work. Because it started with a blog.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, I mean I was, you know, a lawyer litigating constitutional cases in, in New York. I wasn't really that interested politically. In the 90s it seemed a little bit low stakes. You know, the Cold war was over. Like the election in 1996 was Bill Clinton versus Bob Dole. I'm not saying it's unimportant, but who gets excited about that? And you know, the big scandal was the Mono Kalinsky scandal. It just, I wasn't, I didn't feel, find it nourishing. And I focused a lot on the Constitution, which I revered and still do. But then after 9 11, you know, I was living in New York. I was on, in Manhattan on 9 11. And it was, you know, had all the same emotions everybody else, rage and sadness and thirst for vengeance. And then very quickly I began to believe that this was being exploited by people who had pre existing agendas to do things like introduce the Patriot act and warrantless Spying on Americans and arresting Americans on.

[Megyn Kelly]

How did you see that? Like, what was it in your recent past that led you? Just your love of the Constitution? Because a lot of us saw that and then were quick to defend it because we were scared.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Right? And I, like I said, I understood that. I shared those emotions. I'm human. I was in New York, you know, I remember walking around for a week and smelling the debris in. In the World Trade center and seeing on the lamppost, you know, these desperate families putting up pictures of their loved ones saying, missing, please call if you. And they knew. You know, obviously everybody knew that they were deceased. It was horrific. So I shared those emotions. It wasn't like those were alien to me. But at the same time, I also did believe, and I still do in this, all the things we're taught to believe as Americans. What makes our country great? It's not that we have this land mass. It's not that, you know, we have a pretty flag. It's that the founders of our country designed this brilliant system designed to avoid the pitfalls of tyranny and authoritarianism that they had just fought an extremely dangerous war against the most powerful empire on the planet to liberate themselves from. They were eager not to replicate it. And I studied these texts, like the Constitution, the Federalist Papers, and these debates, and I believed in them. And so when I saw our government spying on people without warrants and empowering detention with no due process of American citizens on American soil, these were the kind of things I was taught to expect. Never going to happen in the United States. And yes, I understood people were afraid, but I also knew that authoritarianism resides where people, where governments and people in power can put the population in fear and then tell them, acquiesce to everything we demand, because that's the only way you're going to stay safe. And if you dissent at all or you question us, you're going to be endangered and so is your family. It's a very dangerous but powerful form of propaganda.

[Megyn Kelly]

It worked like a charm.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Perfectly.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, like a charm. So you start this blog and you start writing about these issues, and let's just go through the time, because it was 2013. Was that, that. Was that the day Snowden?

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah. So the day I started my blog was late 2005, and I got kind of lucky. It was about three weeks, the new York Times broke this big story that they didn't actually even want to publish, but one of the reporters was going to break in the book. So they published it and then Won a Pulitzer and patted themselves on the back for their courage. But it was about how right after 9 11, the US government authorized the NSA to spy on Americans without warrants. And that became an issue that I wrote about constantly. And I was able to build a very big audience that way just because it was a perfect confluence of my interest and passion and expertise as an institutional lawyer. And, you know, that became sort of what my specialty was, was critiquing US Foreign policy. I was very critical of Busch, Cheney foreign policy, many of the ones that you brought up there. And then Obama got into office, campaigning to undo all them, but instead extending many of them, strengthening and expanding, expanding many of them. And I started criticizing Obama on the same grounds that I was criticizing Bush and Cheney when they were doing the same things and a bunch of liberals were saying, we're attacking me. I was like, wait, four seconds ago you also thought these things were bad. But now it transformed at the hands of this benevolent, kind, you know, intellect Barack Obama. You know, I started having. Getting disillusioned. And at the time, one of my readers was Edward Snowden, and he was working inside the CIA and the NSA and became convinced that there was a lot going on Inside the U.S. government about how these agencies were violating their core mission, which was never to turn their machinery inward on the American people. It was supposed to be directed at our adversaries and our enemies. Right. And there were several war on terror whistleblowers who, you know, said, I worked at the CIA, worked at the nsa. I was always told, this is what we're never going to do because will destroy the fabric of our country. And Edward Snowden was inside the NSA and saw that they were converting the Internet, which is supposed to be this tool of liberation and democratization and empowerment of individuals, into the most repressive and omnipotent system of coercion and surveillance ever in human history. And he contacted journalists in late 2012. He contacted me and then my colleague Laura Poitras, who directed Citizen 4, that. That won the Oscar, she did a film on.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's. Yeah, that's the film for which he won an Oscar.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah. Hong Kong. We flew to Hong Kong and met him. And the minute we got there, she, Who's a brilliant filmmaker, she had been nominated for Academy Awards before she turned the camera on and started filming my work with Snowden. And it became, you know, a documentary that was filmed in real time, not with talking heads talking retroactively. And that, you know, story, I think, changed the way a lot of people Thought not just about privacy and surveillance, but about democracy. You know, how do we have these unaccountable agencies off in the dark, making some of the most consequential decisions ever with no. No one even in Congress knew, let alone the population. And how do we have democracy if you have this deep state that operates with no accountability?

[Megyn Kelly]

How did the Pulitzer Prize change your life?

[Glenn Greenwald]

To be honest, you know, I. Oh, that's neat.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's nice.

[Glenn Greenwald]

That's nice. Thank you.

[Megyn Kelly]

I need you to win one. It's even tougher to win a Nobel Prize.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I was very divided because it's given to you by the media, and I hated the media. And I was like, wait a minute. Why are they bestowing me with awards? But I actually heard and was very happy about the fact that there was a big internal war because they didn't want to give that to me, but kind of had to. So that made me feel better about getting this, like, shameful, dirty award. Yeah. And it's just something. Something nobody can ever take away from. You know, it's very difficult for journalists to try and deny. You know, they. I know they do this to you, too. Oh, you're not really a journalist.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Glenn Greenwald]

And I'm like, look over here. You know, every journalism award that exists is on the shelf. And I just. That's the only real thing it does for me is. Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

So there was a time when you were out of the country and you couldn't come back.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Well, the Obama administration got very threatening, you know, about this Snowden reporting. They. I don't know if you remember, but when the president of Bolivia, Evo Morales, went to Russia where Snowden was. But they only went for a state meeting, you know, just like a standard state meeting between heads of sovereign countries. The US Just had, like, an inkling that maybe his presidential plane was picking up Snowden to bring him back to Bolivia, and they downed the plane forcibly. This was. I remember I went to the Russian consulate. I need a Russian visa. I was going to Russia to see Snowden, and these Russian came. Russians came out, and they were like, look, I know why your government hates Snowden. We can. We wouldn't allow, you know, leaking of our secret information, too. But downing the plane of a president, even just the Russians, that they were like, I don't understand that.

[Megyn Kelly]

You're kind of in a glass house there.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, they were. But, I mean, it was really, you know, it's a really a step too far. And they, you know, James Clapper and some Republican senators and Democratic members of Congress started openly talking about not just prosecuting Snowden, but also the journalists who worked with him, namely myself and Laura. And, you know, we would call up the just department, our lawyers wouldn't say, is it safe for them to come back? And they would say, we can't guarantee that safety. So Laura was in Germany working on Citizen 4 and the rest of the stories. She wouldn't leave Germany and I couldn't leave Brazil because the US Government was being very menacing. And we only came back once the Pulitzers happened and we figured the US Government doesn't want the black eye publicity, putting in prison two people who just won the Pulitzers for reporting.

[Megyn Kelly]

Wow. It's incredible. So flash forward then. Now, that's 2013. Seven years later, you've left the Guardian, you started your own outlet called the Intercept. Is your concoction, your creation, your vision, and you're making it happen. You're publishing news the way you want it done, and there comes a clash that leads to you leaving the very journalistic organization you founded because they wouldn't let you report honestly on Hunter Biden and Joe Biden.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, I mean, it was. The reason why it was so amazing was when we started the Intercept, and it was myself and Laura Poitras, another investigative journalist, Jeremy Scahill, all of whom had done battle with the deep state and done reporting of that kind. The idea was we want to start a completely nonpartisan media outlet that is adversarial to people in power, especially to the agencies that don't get nearly enough journalistic attention and scrutiny. I think a lot of corporate media outlets were very captive to these agencies, subservient to them, and they exercise great power. And so the idea was, we're going to start a media outlet that has no ideology or partisan affiliation. And it worked for a while. And then Donald Trump came in 2016, and we did a lot of reporting on the emails that were released from Hillary Clinton through WikiLeaks because it revealed a lot of incriminating information about this very powerful politician who was the front runner for the 2016 election. And I think our editors, who are all kind of liberals, I let you know we hired editors. I wanted to do the journalism, not sit in HR meetings and budget meetings. I wanted to journalism. They were all liberals in Brooklyn, but they figured, I'll let them go, you know, reporting on Hillary, she's going to win anyway. And then Trump won. And all their friends said, what is wrong with you? You helped Trump when you did negative reporting on Hillary. And I remember the Night of the election, you know, we had these, like, virtual newsrooms where everyone gathered and someone said, our coverage, everybody was crying. People were crying. These were journalists crying. I mean, like sad tears. And somebody came and said our coverage was very misogynistic and we need to publicly apologize.

[Megyn Kelly]

Wow.

[Glenn Greenwald]

And I was like, go work for the Democratic Party. We're not apologizing for anything. This is our job, job. You know, this is our role. And then in 2020, I knew the Hunter Biden laptop documents were authentic from the beginning because I had a lot of experience working on big archives. You know, the Snowden archive, WikiLeaks had a big reporting in Brazil that involved a large archive.

[Megyn Kelly]

And also the pictures made it pretty clear the ev.

[Glenn Greenwald]

The way you journalists authenticate archives. Yes, the pictures were pretty authentic and pretty good proof. But, you know, the archive has email written to five people. And you go to one of the people on the email chain and you say, show me in your phone this email that you got in real time. And they show it to you, and it matches word for word what's in the archive. That's how journalists authenticate. So I knew for sure these dot this arc and I wanted to report on it. I wanted to get the documents, write about it, because Joe Biden was a major presidential candidate. And my editors, when they realized that I was working on it, came and said, according to the FBI, this is Russian disinformation. And remember, this was a news outlet founded to be adversarial to these security state agencies. And they were telling me, according to the FBI, so that's gospel. The Biden FBI, this is Russian disinformation. I said, it's so obvious these materials are real. But I knew they said, there's no way we can allow you to publish this because the material isn't verified. The government claims it's. It's fake. And I didn't start a media outlet to be told what I can and can't report. And I knew they their motives were not journalistic, but politico political. And I left.

[Megyn Kelly]

You left your own organization?

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, I had to quit my own organization because if I can't report on major political candidates because editors want to manipulate the outcome of our politics in one way or another, why would I stay? I can't do what I want to do. Much is my job. And that became a reflection of the media writ large. They were. So they renounced completely their journalistic function. Would have said or done anything to get Donald Trump defeated. That's what Russiagate was And then that's what the lie about the Hunter Biden laptop was. They were petrified about what it showed about Joe Biden, so they were willing to lie about it. These are journalists.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. And. And they're still lying about it to this day.

[Glenn Greenwald]

To this day. They don't admit that. They can't admit it because they were all so invested in it.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, it's like watching, you know, first Kamala, now Karine Jean Pierre on these book tours and these. The dishonest media letting them get away with. You know, I only saw him for a brief time. I barely saw him on the plane or to the way to the debate. So I didn't know he wasn't feeling well that night. Like, every word of that is a lie.

[Glenn Greenwald]

She was the White House press secretary.

[Megyn Kelly]

You were in the White House with him daily for years. You knew he was infirm. You covered it up. It wasn't about the plane ride over to the debate, but these same journalists were in on the whole thing. So they have to give her a pass.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I'm sure you remember. And this was. You know, there's so many different events that made me realize the depth of depravity and just deceit within our profession. And we watched Joe Biden on these videos even before that debate night in France and then having to be got off the stage by Obama. And I remember to this day the Washington Post, the New York Times published stories saying the American right or conservatives are using. And they invented this new term. It was cheap fakes.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Where it was supposed to be defined as the video is real, but the context is somehow distorted.

[Megyn Kelly]

Right.

[Glenn Greenwald]

And one of the things they said that about was the night when Obama led Obama, Biden off the stage because he was complete. He didn't know where he was.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. You could remember that video right there at that fundraiser. And Biden was kind of wandering and Obama, like, grabbed him by the hand, like, put his hand around his back and kind of shepherd him.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Those vacant eyes that he always had, like, where am I?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Glenn Greenwald]

And you know, the whole media said, oh, you're lying. That's not. He was totally present. All the Democrats said he was president. And it turns out George Clooney, of course, after the election is over, admitted that when he wrote that New York Times op ed calling for Biden to withdraw from the race, it was because on that night, even before that thing happened, he saw that there was no more Joe Biden. That it was. There was just, you know, kept it to himself until everybody who saw it Liars.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. George Clooney is a dishonest hack who's like a pretend wannabe journalist who's not even really very good at acting, never mind a journalist at journalism anymore. But you know, exactly, they, they kept the secret amongst themselves until it was outed by Joe Biden himself. And I have to tell you, I've been thinking about the Joe Biden mental infirmity lately because I think so much of what we're dealing with right now as a country is directly linked to that. I mean, I am very much in favor of like the full fledged investigation into exactly how it went down. Because Joe Biden, he was a leftist, of course, but he wasn't one of these far, far leftists. He was always a little bit more moderate. He had been close to a blue dog.

[Glenn Greenwald]

The real left hated Joe Biden.

[Megyn Kelly]

They hated Joe Biden. Exactly right. But he was tough on crime. He wasn't pro an open border, very pro Israel. Wasn't woke.

[Glenn Greenwald]

No woke. Very pro corporation left hated Joe Biden.

[Megyn Kelly]

So the behavior that Joe Biden brought into office from day one was anomalous to the man that we had come to know as a legislator, you know, as a U.S. senator. And I, I firmly believe the reason we have now an extra 11 million illegals is because of his mental infirmity. Someone in that White House had an agenda that did not match his and that's who made those decisions. We still don't know the answer to that.

[Glenn Greenwald]

It's the, it's, you know, you look at so many media lies, Russia gate under Biden laptop, all the lies about COVID But to me, this is by far the biggest scandal because you have somebody who is in charge of the nuclear codes, someone who can start wars or end wars, somebody who makes decisions that affect the lives of hundreds of millions of Americans, billions of people on the planet, the world economy, and he was incapable of making those decisions. And I remember saying in real time, all the time, yes, it's a political scandal that people are lying about Joe Biden's mental state. But the bigger question is who's running the government?

[Megyn Kelly]

Who is insurance?

[Glenn Greenwald]

Who's making these very consequential decisions?

[Megyn Kelly]

And I say person after person taking the fifth in the context of this negotiation, this investigation in them, like including his own personal doctor. It's very sketchy. And I truly think, like, we need answers on that because look at, look at the number of people who have died as a result of those illegals coming across the border that he just welcomed in for no Apparent discernible reason other than it's humane. That's what he said. And encouraging. You know, you mentioned legal immigration. Like, okay, technically legal immigration. Immigration from Haiti to the tune of tens of thousands who are let in. Like, it's not like the Joe Biden who we knew and someone who made that decision other than him. I'm convinced of it. And that's why the media is so guilty. The original sin, as Jake Tapper put it in the name of his book. The media was in on it. They are complicit, they are equally to blame. And they're still, still misleading to this day. All right, stand by because now that we're getting into the media, we got to talk about what was in Karine Jean Pierre's book. I've got to read you the latest. Matt Taibi outed it. He read it so we don't have to. And for this, I'm going to have Emily rejoin us because I know she wants in on this. Emily Jasinski, get on back here. Let's be honest. America can still be a dangerous place and you cannot afford to wait for help if you need it. Sure, you could use a firearm, but in today's America, defending yourself with deadly force could have legal consequences. According to FBI data, 99.9% of all altercations do not require lethal force. And that's exactly why many are turning to Burna. Burna is proudly American. Hand assembled in Fort Wayne, Indiana, these less lethal self defense launchers are trusted by hundreds of government agencies, law enforcement departments and private security companies. Over 600,000 Burna pistols have been sold, most to private citizens who refuse to be victims. Burna launchers fire rock hard kinetic rounds and also powerful tear gas and pepper projectiles capable of stopping a threat from up to 60ft away. No background checks, no waiting periods and burner can ship straight to your door. Take responsibility, protect your future. Visit Burna.com right now or your local sportsman's warehouse. That's by r n a.com or your local sportsman's warehouse. Visit now and be prepared to defend. Every October, we honor the strength and resilience of women and families affected by breast cancer. But cancer touches all of us in some way. And more people today are seeking options beyond the standard approach. That's why I want to tell you about what all Family Pharmacy is doing this month. They are helping patients gain access to trusted, affordable, affordable medicines like Ivermectin and Mebendazole. These treatments that are sometimes used off label are currently being researched in Florida for their potential to support cancer treatment and prevention. For those looking for an alternative or addition to their current care, it's always important to consult with a doctor and all family pharmacy makes that simple. They work with like minded physicians across the country who review every order and provide prescriptions when appropriate. In honor of Breast Cancer Awareness Month they are offering 40% off Mebendazole when you order this month with the code PINK40. Visit allfamilypharmacy.com allfamilypharmacy.com Megan to learn more. And remember to use code PINK40 by October 31st to save on busy work weeks can leave you feeling drained. Prolon's five day fasting mimicking diet rejuvenates you at the cellular level, lets you enjoy real food and does not require an injection. Developed at USC's Longevity Institute, Prolon supports biological age reduction, metabolism, skin health and fat loss when combined with proper exercise and nutrition. Get 15% off plus a $40 bonus gift when you subscribe at prolonlife.com PandoraProromo Rendezvous we are going on the road. Join me live Megyn Kelly Live 10 stops across the country. Join me for no BS, no agenda and no fear Live. I'll be joined by Tucker Carlson, Ben Shapiro, Glenn Beck, Adam Perola, Charlie Sheen, Piers Morgan, Donald Trump Jr. Eric Trump and Erica Kirk. Send a message that we will not be silenced. It's Megyn Kelly Live presented by why refi and SiriusXM. Go to MeganKelly.com to get your tickets now. You can stream the Megyn Kelly show on Sirius XM at home or anywhere you are. No car required. I do it all the time. I love the SiriusXM app. It has ad free music coverage of every major sport, comedy talk, podcast and more. Subscribe now. Get your first three months for free.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Go to SiriusXM.com MK show to subscribe and get three months free. That's SiriusXM.com MKShow and get three months free offer details applied.

[Megyn Kelly]

You guys are not going to believe what is in this book, okay?

[Emily Jaszynski]

Hi Glenn.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Hello, Emily.

[Megyn Kelly]

All right, the gang's all here. So Karine Jean Pierre, you know, not, not content to just let Kamala look like the dumbest one in the administration writes her own book or someone wrote her book. And you know, we've been talking on the show about how literally to every promotional appearance she makes, what is she telling people?

[Glenn Greenwald]

I'm black.

[Megyn Kelly]

I am black and queer. Queer too. Don't forget my queerness. And in fact, we have that queued Up. Just for those of you who have missed it, here's a little tasting. This is just a promo tour. This is not like going back in the archives. This is like, literally in the last seven days. Watch. As a black woman, as a person who's also lgbtq, as. As a black woman. As a black woman. I am a black woman. I am a queer woman. I am an immigrant being a black woman. As a black woman myself, that is.

[Emily Jaszynski]

The thing that I understood as a.

[Megyn Kelly]

Black woman is that I meant a lot to people because of the communities that I represented and whether it was women of color, black women, queer community, LGBTQ community, immigrant, and as a black woman.

[Emily Jaszynski]

And I have my queerness, too. It's like talking to Glenn.

[Megyn Kelly]

She's got her queerness. Glenn also has his queerness. He never talks about it. Fine.

[Glenn Greenwald]

You know her race, by the way. Karine Jumpier race. Yeah, she never talks about it. I know she's very shy about it.

[Megyn Kelly]

She doesn't like attention call to it.

[Emily Jaszynski]

She's Italian.

[Megyn Kelly]

You're not going to believe this. Okay, this is the good. The great Matt Taibi exposes this a few pages later. After this other part, Jean Pierre described her feelings after Trump won reelection, saying she wasn't surprised at all because America was too racist and sexist to elect Kamala Harris. Finally, these are quotes. About 1am I tumbled into bed. When I woke up, it was over. Harris had lost. I received calls from friends who are distraught or numb with disbelief, but I wasn't surprised by the outcome. The truth was, I never really believed Harris could win. Well, I mean, none of us did, but she had different reasons. But I. I wasn't surprised. Okay. I never believed she could win. I'd been in the body of a black woman all my life. She's changing it. Not. I'm not just black. I'd been in the body of a black woman. Which sounds a little dirty. I like that. Sounds a little naughty, doesn't it? Sounds like something a husband would say. She doesn't have a husband because of her queerness. I stood at the podium in the White House briefing room, traveled in my chocolate skin through rural areas, and all my experiences of blistering stares and racist assumptions left me unable to see this country electing a president who looked like me. Black women are tired. We're tired of being used and overlooked and taken for granted. That we will take on the extra tasks at work without pay, assume the lion's share of labor in our communities without fanfare, and do it all without complaint. Indeed, we are leaders in our cities and households, matriarchs who fight for rights and policies that benefit the whole of society. In 2024, the nation could have finally begun to repay what it owes us. What? And benefited itself by giving the top leadership role to Harris, who could bring the talents embodied by so many black women to the nation's highest office. That's. That's her latest. That's basically it. In a sum of substance, her chocolate skin. And she's been in the body of a black woman forever. And the reason Kamala lost is because we did not want to be in her black chocolate body. I don't know. This is lunacy. We knew she was dumb, but did we know she was this far gone? Truly.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Go ahead.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Was it. I love that. In her mind, the repayment for the treatment that American blacks have received is Kamala Harris. This is like, we deserve Kamala Harris. You owe us Kamala Harris.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, no. Some debt.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I remember Trump, during the campaign, went to speak at the association of Black Journalists, and they brought up the historic occasion of Kamala's candidacy as a black woman. And Trump said, what? Kamala's black. I didn't know she was black.

[Megyn Kelly]

Remember that?

[Glenn Greenwald]

And this was supposed to be super offensive. Like, we were all supposed to be horrified, even though everybody had the same thought. And then what happened was CNN the next day, went to, like, a barber shop in Philadelphia, which is like this white liberal media stereotype of where you go to talk to real black people.

[Emily Jaszynski]

We call that terrorist country.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, yeah. And they walk in and there's like, eight black guys sitting, you know, on chairs in the barbershop, like, working class guys. And the reporter comes in, he's white, and he says, hey, Donald Trump yesterday said he doesn't think Kamala is black. Do you think Kamala's black? Of course. Expecting to be out there, and they were like, not. And this is the kind of idiotic politics that Democrats think the country is thinking about, that we relate to each other this way with these divisive categories everybody has to immediately declare themselves in. And this is such a degraded and primitive way of thinking about humanity and how we relate to one another and the things we care about and have in common. But they. And also, isn't this the same country that elected Barack Obama twice and, like, made this idiot. The White House press secretary, Technically, is.

[Megyn Kelly]

Blue black, our vice president?

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah. I mean, anything. You can make the opposite argument that the people inside the black women's bodies are actually benefiting by virtue of that rather than being impeded. But it's just, I think people are just so tired of being told that we have to judge each other with constant reference.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's exactly right. She, she didn't get the memo. Right. The fever broke with Trump's reelection, and she didn't get the memo that we're done doing that. Like we are done obsessing over skin color. Whether we're black or white, we're brown, whatever does it, people, we're done. We're done. The fevers are broken. That stuff's not going to work anymore. But it seems to be what she's saying is the reason she left the Democrat Party. She's mad, allegedly, that they were too mean to Joe Biden. But she also is. The whole book is full of grievance about how the Democrats aren't good to black women. So she's leaving, but she's not going to. She doesn't recommend voting for any party other than Democrats, but she's going to stand outside as an independent just to shame them for how they treat black women. But still totally vote Democrat. Which sounds right, exactly at the intellect level that I would expect from Karine Jean Pierre as a strategy.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I mean, I will say something controversial, but truly, if you look at the people that the Biden administrated, elevated, Biden administration elevated to check the identity boxes, from Kanji Brown Jackson to Kamala Harris to Karine Jean Pierre, this is why people have problems with affirmative action. It's because you actually, when you're elevating people purely on the basis of identity, and I say that as a CIS hetero white woman. Meghan, what's this hetero? It's bad. I mean, it produces bad results. It's a disaster. And it's sadly what people now have to look back as the legacy of the Biden.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, the other problem we have is that, you know, they're obsessed with, like, their academic pedigree over on the left. We've seen that, right? It's like, I mean, speaking of affirmative action and pedigree, Michelle Obama went to Princeton, okay? Sheila Jackson Lee, she went to Harvard. Joy Reid went to Harvard. I mean, don't laugh, Glenn. Need I say more? Joy Reid? And then there's, then there's another class of leftists that went to these schools and probably actually got in on their own merit. But they are so elitist and such snobs in their coverage. And that brings me to Rachel Maddow. So she, I mean, we could spend all night talking about what Anita Snob. She Is. But just this week she was talking about the White House and the renovations. Okay, you can say a lot about the renovations and I've already read to you some of what people are saying, but listen to this one, okay? Trump is literally destroying the people's house. He's literally physically tearing down the White House. And now here's my favorite part. This is right on brand for her. He took up parts of the White House lawn to put up huge flagpoles so he could fly novelty size American flags to make it look like it's an RV dealership.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Hell yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's Rachel Maddow. Like, oh, who would be caught dead at an RV dealership? And she speaks for everyone. There isn't a person consuming her show, which she does once a week for which she makes $30 million a year still, that had any reaction to that other than, yeah, ew, gross, an rv. And that's half the problem. Right.

[Glenn Greenwald]

But also like what made it so gross in her mind was that there are so many American flags there too. Like only like really tacky, low brow people would fly American flags. And this is the thing, like you may, you people, the ordinary people like who just go about their lives like you were saying, most people are really busy. When I was a lawyer, I barely paid attention to politics. Only when I had full time to kind of look at everything I said. But you don't have to know every detail. But people understand when they're being condescended to. People understand when they're being insulted, when they're being judged. And the Democratic Party, which did used to have a lot of worker class, working class representation, they were very close with unions. That, that was the, the kind of ethos of the Democratic Party in the middle of the 20th century became very subconsciously and very con. Explicitly the party of corporations, the party of Ivy League schools. And, and as a result they now look down upon, you know, people in car dealerships and you know, most of the country feels condescended to and patronized and can just like spewed contempt at by liberal elites. And they're getting back what they deserve. They, they have created that.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. Let me ask you a question because you used to go on MSNBC all the time.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I was on Rachel Maddow show all the time. I, you know, had a personal friendship with her.

[Megyn Kelly]

Has she lost her relevance?

[Glenn Greenwald]

Well, let's remember, I just think this is so important is that first of all, cable news in general as a medium is, is dying.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Glenn Greenwald]

The number of people who watch cable news, Fox still pulls in several million people. They tend to be an older demographic. But MSNBC and CNN, I mean they're, they're irrelevant. You have mid sized YouTube shows with bigger audiences than they do. And not only that, but you can imagine the only people who watch MSN are already drooling, rabid Democratic party partisans. So even the people they're attracting, they're not convincing of anything. She went on every night and perpetrated a gigantic hoax. She was, she was ratified to steal dossier. She thought Putin had a pee pee tape about Trump that he was using to blackmail Trump. She was all in on all the bullshit about Russiagate, like the whole hoax, the whole fraud. She went on a news network ostensibly every night and lied and got rewarded for it. You know, she said people who question the origin of the lab leak, but it came from a lab are racist. Like the whole litany of lies that people made them hate the media. She was kind of the avatar of, and you're right, she got a reward for it, which was a 30 million dollar contract for lying incessantly for partisan reasons. As low as you get for a journalist.

[Megyn Kelly]

And honestly, I think it's possible to make a lot of money and still be in touch with regular people. But she's not on the list of people who are. I think she's just gotten so detached from reality, from how real people live, how what real people care about. She's ensconced in this liberal bubble and she's relegated herself down to this one hour a week, which I think is good because there's not really a standard bearer over there at MSNBC now who they all revere and look up to. And you know, it'll be interesting to see whether they can even cultivate that now because they're starting to realize that they're relevant. Lane is digital. They're starting to try to cultivate their own. Joe Rogan. The irony, of course, he was of the left, he was a Bernie bro. And now they're desperate to create their own sort of presence in the digital lane. But I for one, I applaud her downfall. And she did it to herself. She sacrificed her credibility. You know, it was lies because she never owned it. She didn't ever come out and say I was wrong. Let me tell you the truth about Russia Gate. She was actively lying and she was caught.

[Emily Jaszynski]

And she still insists that the conspiracy theory she proffered for years is real. I mean she is. And actually even worse than all of that, she stole Glenn's haircut, she did.

[Glenn Greenwald]

I'm thinking about suing her. My lawyers have a very good case.

[Megyn Kelly]

I mean, not for nothing. And the questions, I mean, she's another person who really could stand to be more attractive. I would appreciate if she would try harder to make herself more attractive.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Do you know, though, there's a photo of her. A yearbook or.

[Emily Jaszynski]

A yearbook.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. She was blonde.

[Glenn Greenwald]

She was beautiful. Like she was a very. She has deliberately uglified herself.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Glenn Greenwald]

And there's this thing in liberal culture where it's almost like the objective is to not be attractive.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. They're nailing attractive ones.

[Glenn Greenwald]

There are still a few. Very few. But some a few, they purposely like, make themselves dowdier.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Glenn Greenwald]

And dirtier. It's like an ethos.

[Megyn Kelly]

Let me ask you something. If you, if you wanted to go, just say, you know, just hypothetically on Halloween, as somebody who was at a no Kings protest, a certain image comes to mind. You'd have to get like the size 10x shirt. You'd have to get like a blue wig, maybe a nose ring. Right. It's like there's certain, like a uniform. And all I can think of is the one woman who came to the Trump White House recently on the antifa hearings. And forgive me, I can't remember her name, but she talked about, talked about how she suffered from severe tds, Trump derangement syndrome, and how somehow she managed to get herself out of it. And she talked about how her life got better. She said, dare I say I even got more attractive. And there's some truth to that because when you're consumed by hatred, because that's what TDS is, it's like a crazed hatred, of course you're going to become less attractive. You're angry all the time. You're not. Like, if you infusing positivity, you're not warm. When you see people on the street, you take this all on as your own personal battle. You know, you've got to fight evil mad men in the White House. Like, at my worst of hating whatever president, I never let it consume me personally because remaining attractive was too important to me.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I mean, counterpoint. Rosie o' Donnell. Never looked better. Never looked better.

[Megyn Kelly]

The cold sore. Oh, you know about her cold sore, right. She now says she got herpes from Trump. That the stress of hating Donald Trump somehow gave her a herpes outbreak. I don't think tracks. Not sure, does it? That's actually how you get it.

[Emily Jaszynski]

I have a tip for your Halloween costume.

[Megyn Kelly]

Let me know.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Oxygen tank walker. I think that nails the no Kings.

[Megyn Kelly]

Look Yes, I think this is going to be very common. You know, we mentioned it last night and I think it is on my mind. You know, very well. Sadly, we're going to get some disgusting costumes around Charlie's murder. Right. Like, we're already seeing that. At the no Kings rally, you saw some people. There was a man who had like fake blood on his face and like a fake neck wound and the freedom shirt.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

I mean, what kind of depraved person.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Right?

[Megyn Kelly]

And like, it's good to laugh, it's wonderful to be together and be doing this. But like, we actually are suffering from a really serious problem right now in this country and it's coming from the left. No matter what they want to say that it's both sides. It's not both sides. It's leftist violence and people who come out and speak at these events. It's a new paradigm. You know, I'm talking about that with security in the same way that Columbine created a new paradigm where like a new method of killing people was put on display and put in people's heads and changed, sadly the way kids go to school now, the Charlie assassination has done that too for public speakers and in particular for people on the right. And it's not just people. You know, I know you're not of the right, but like people like us who are in the right wing ecosphere or that are in the independent ecosystem ecosphere, unfortunately, it's for everybody. You know, everybody has to worry. Like three people at that Trump rally got shot, one died. So it's not just, it's. It's also civilians, it's not just people.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah. If I can just like give us what I think is a little insight into this, which is, I mean, first of all, one of the main reasons I came here, people might know I live very far away. I live in Brazil now. There's a lot of travel is precisely because I do think, and I know you had talked about after Charlie's death, like being a little concerned and I know any of us who do work that's polarizing, that's political, that produces anger, has to think about that. Wait a minute. Are we now a country where, you know, we had assassinations in the, in the 60s, but not very much political violence since? Are we now back to being a country or even worse, being a country where even just you don't have political power, you just have opinions that people dislike, that you can be easily killed, that it's not actually surprising anymore when that something like that happens and I think the only solution is to say we're not going to give in to that fear. We're going to come and be in as many places as possible. And I know that's why you did your tour.

[Megyn Kelly]

We're going to flood the field.

[Glenn Greenwald]

But I do think, look, the thing is, every political faction produces violence. And we talked about this like in the 90s, there were abortion murder, doctor murders of abortion doctors. People tried to blame Bill O'Reilly because he was pointing out abortion doctors, including one who was killed. I do think we have to be careful not to say a certain ideology inspires that, but it is nonetheless true. And this is something that came from the Trump era, is that on the left, people started insisting and then believing that not only Donald Trump, but all of his followers are fascists and white supremacists and racists and Nazis. And along with that, there was an accompanying discourse that said it's good to kill Nazis, by which they now mean conservatives. And, you know, if some left wing figure dies, you'll be able to find a few scattered people on the right, you know, making fun of it or celebrating it. But this was way more than that. This is, you know, now the predominant sentiment among a lot of people on the left that the world is better off when conservatives die or people who like Trump die or Trump himself dies, even if they're being slaughtered in the most horrific way. A 31 year old man, a husband, a wife, father of two young children, they look at that and there's no humanity there, there's no soul. They've been feeding on this discourse of hatred so intensively and consistently. Social media pours it into their head that it is scary to watch so many people, such a major part of a political movement, be so dehumanized that they deny people's humanity. Down that road lies very dark things.

[Megyn Kelly]

I mean, so what do we do about that? Truly, like, if, if you gave me a magic wand and say you can, you can just remake the country with this magic wand, the first thing I'd have everybody do is go to church, get them all back to church, get religion back into the public square in the way it was when this country was founded. But they're so lost. They don't, they don't believe in a higher power. They only believe in themselves, like the power of their own id, which is a very damaging, dangerous place to be. So I don't know how to reach them. You know, the right tends to be more religious, tends to be more of a group of faith, especially the modern day right versus the modern day left. How do we reach these people who are not only, let's say, born into families that are all about like transing my 3 year old because he's had made some errant comment, but tdsing them and getting them to cheer the possibility of a presidential Trump death. A President Trump death. But then they send him to schools with the likes of Lucy Martinez, Big Chungus, as Jesse called her last night, who's like the one who is pretending with the, you know, at the no Kings rally, like celebrating Charlie's death. So the whole thing is this indoctrination faction that, that the Factory, that's, that's meant to radicalize them. How do we reach them? How. How do we. Are we supposed to stop that?

[Emily Jaszynski]

I think one of the most powerful things, and it's, it's a hard question, but I think one of the most powerful things is just people who, who aren't of that ilk, who haven't lost their minds yet, going into places. We were talking about this backstage gun going into places where people have lost their minds and showing the contrast between what it looks like to be an. And Charlie was very good at this. What it looks like to be an absolutely insane person who is not coping well with reality. And then juxtapose that with someone like Charlie, who is a man of faith, who is normal, who is happy, who actually approached a lot of those conversations joyfully and with compassion. And that to me is really, really, really powerful, at least in my experience like that. Just, just going into those spaces so people can see light and dark. That's amazing. I mean, that's very powerful.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. I, I have to say, I also think something that we've been talking about, we talk about all the time when you guys come on the show, you talk about in your own shows, and we're talking about it tonight. I have to say, I do blame in, in large part the media, right?

[Emily Jaszynski]

Absolutely.

[Megyn Kelly]

I, I really think they have unclean hands when it comes even to Charlie's death. Because what did you hear from all those no Kings protesters over the weekend? You heard Charlie was terrible. He said terrible things. He was a racist. He was a Nazi. We heard that from so many of those little clips that we played on our show and elsewhere. Where'd they get that idea from? Not from listening to Charlie. They got that idea from the media, which tried to paint him with that brush. And so I almost feel like the part of a huge part of the antidote to this madness is what we're doing now. It has to be a long game that we're not going to solve that overnight. Even though Arlene is so powerful and we're taking down the mainstream bit by bit easily with Ms. And cnn, but they're still there. But until they are destroyed, until they're destroyed as networks of propaganda and misinformation and our lane of truth telling and of individuals, right. Like you can go, you can get a Jesse Kelly whose show is called I'm Right, you know, or you, he's a moderate man. Yeah, but you. Or you can get somebody who's more moderate. You can get somebody who's of the left but has got more heterodox views like you or of the right, but more heterodox views for righty. And I'm sort of all over the place, but you can get that in this lane. You can get real facts. That's the only antidote to where like the, the, the disinformers are gone. Of course, I do not mean dead, I mean off the air and no longer able to spin these lies about our people. Right. Like our words will stand for themselves. They'll be, they'll speak for themselves. The clips will speak for themselves. There won't be this act of manipulation and attempt to stir up hate around us all the time with very vulnerable unwell people.

[Glenn Greenwald]

Yeah, but I think that's the key is this last part. I mean, I do think, and this may sound naive, but I don't think it is that Americans are fundamentally decent. I don't think people go off on this psychotic like dehumanized path on their own. And I think one of the things that has happened is, and we see this in disia all throughout our society. You know, suicide rates are way up, addiction is way up, alcoholism, depression, you know, mental health problems. And I think it's because of this spiritual disconnect. People don't have spirituality in their lives. They don't have connection, they don't have community. All the things that used to make America connected, you know, churches, religion, union halls, gatherings in small towns, these things are largely gone. We live in this very digitalized age. Covid exacerbated it greatly, isolated people even more. And in that, you know, without spirituality emerges nihilism. And nihilism is very easily exploited. You know, you don't have to. You. We always have disagreed with each other vehemently. That's America. You know, that person has terrible ideas, but we still see them as human beings. That's what's being lost. And it's a deliberate campaign to encourage people to lose their humanity. And I think there's a lot of deep seated problems in our, in our country that enables that kind of thing to fester. And I think it's important that we think about that as well.

[Megyn Kelly]

I do think, because I've heard this said of the right, I've said it as well, you know, to your point. We had a guy like that and they killed him. You know, we had a guy who went into the spots and into the spaces and said the things and was reasonable and talked to the other side and showed the example of what faith can do for you, how it can save you, how it can, how God never rejects any of his children and still believes in all of us and they killed him. But just because Charlie was murdered does not mean all of the left wants to murder us. And it doesn't mean that they're not reachable. And I, I, I feel like we owe it to Charlie to recognize, recognize that the youth in particular who are very misguided right now, very lost and in some cases dangerous are gettable. That was his fundamental belief, that the right had ceded the fight for their hearts and minds and that that was a mistake. And so he went in there to fight to, to win them. And I, I think we have to do the same. We have to not say they're all crazy, they all want to kill us. No, they're gettable, they're winnable and we have to continue reaching out to them and not demonize all of them with the same broad brush as the one we use on the Lucy Martinez's of the world.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yeah, I mean one of the things that Charlie tapped into, and Ben Shapiro does this too, is this moral relativism has left young people starving. And they know that they're hungry. Like they know, know that they're starving, they know they're looking for something and that can be directed in some really bad ways and some really good ways. And they live, they've exported so much of their lives onto the Internet thanks to some really bad people who actually encouraged us to reshape our society by exporting our lives onto the Internet. And the incentives there are towards rage, the incentives there are towards like categorizing people in one direction or the other. And you get stuck, sucked into part of this like computer program and our politics get sucked into it too. And the more you just get off the Internet and talk to normal people, the more that you realize it's okay to not categorize someone who has really what you think are really bad ideas. But just talk to them, talk to them about baseball, talk about something else. And it sounds so cheesy.

[Megyn Kelly]

Non politics.

[Emily Jaszynski]

Yeah, it sounds so cheesy. But like people are really ghetto because they are starving for moral clarity. And if you can provide that, people's discontent can be channeled very productively.

[Megyn Kelly]

I just want to end with this story because I told it on the show one day, but a lot of people haven't heard this. You speaking up for what you believe in. You saying the things that we've been saying tonight and that we talk about on the show and these truths that are hard truths, but we all believe them, right? Like a man can't become a woman. Like we are not. We refuse to be boiled down to our skin color. Like we have way more in common than we do. That separates us despite whatever our melanin is. To take a couple for an example, you just saying those things, being honest about those things. Like the young woman who came up like, yes, say what's real. Like stand up for yourself even though they're trying to make you play or face off against a male will make a difference. And even though you might not always hear about it, you might not always know, you might feel like you're, you know, screaming into the wind. You might feel like this is causing you hatred, like people are coming to loathe you or think terrible things about you. You can think all that, but you know, our minds tell us these negative stories. Remember this. I got an extraordinary message from someone who has not given me permission to say where he works, but it is at a very anti Trump organization. And this person gave me a very heartfelt, multiple paragraph message about his child who was saying that they are trans and how this person of the left secretly has been listening to my show and to our guests saying what is real and what's really going on with these children and how this issue ought to be handled and what is possible and what's not possible and what's happened in the medical community with the capture and so on and so forth and has been saying to themselves, oh my God, I'm on the wrong side. This woman and the people who come on her show are fighting for my kid and I can't because I'm with this organization that's on the other side. I need to pay my bills and continue getting this check. But I can see and I can hear that these people who my organization demonizes for a living are in the right and are going to save my kid. And think of how. How brave it was for this person to say that to me. Right. And I wrote them back a very long note, too. But it was a reminder that even if you don't get snaps, you don't get pats on the back. Some people are going to say nasty things about you on the Internet. Whatever. You are helping people if you stick to what's real, to what's true, whether it's your family, your the. The truth freedoms, or your faith. Right. Because there is such a thing as the silent majority. And what the studies show is that if the one person in the room will stand up, raise his hand, or raise her hand and say what's real, so many other people in the room feel the same. They're so glad you said the thing. So as I said to the one woman, sit in the front row of your life, be the person who says something. The fact that you're here shows me you can and will do it. And God bless you all for that. Thank you so much for having us. San Antonio, we love you. We hope to see you again soon. God bless you. Thank you, Emily. Thank you, Glenn. Thanks for listening to the Megyn Kelly Show. No bs, no agenda and no fear.