Matthew McConaughey and Dave Portnoy - Megyn Kelly's "Double Feature" of Fascinating Interviews

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Megyn Kelly Show

Episode: “Matthew McConaughey and Dave Portnoy – Megyn Kelly's ‘Double Feature’ of Fascinating Interviews”

Date: May 31, 2026
Host: Megyn Kelly
Guests: Matthew McConaughey, Dave Portnoy

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Overview

This double feature episode of The Megyn Kelly Show features two wide-ranging conversations: first, an introspective interview with Oscar-winner Matthew McConaughey about family, values, Hollywood, risk-taking, and his latest book Poems and Prayers; then, a lively, opinionated dialogue with Barstool Sports founder Dave Portnoy on political news, media candor, sports controversies, and, of course, viral celebrity drama. The episode is packed with personal stories, reflections on American culture, pointed takes on current events, and moments of both vulnerability and fun.

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Part 1: Interview with Matthew McConaughey

(Timestamps: [03:18] – [67:04])

1. Roots, Family, and Values

• Background: Raised in Texas, lives there by choice, values “common sense” culture and distance from Hollywood’s lifestyle ([16:25]-[17:36]).
• Influence of Father: Emotional discussion of his father’s sudden death at age 22 and its impact on his philosophy (“just keep living”), independence, and early career ([04:41]-[06:52]).
  • "Better quit acting like the things your dad taught you to do and be and start becoming the man that he taught you to be." — McConaughey ([06:32])
• Support for Acting: His father’s reaction to his switch from law school to film school: “Don’t half-ass it” ([07:00]-[08:16]).

2. Creativity, Writing, and Identity

• McConaughey as Writer: Early journals, poetry, and embracing the artist within. His new book, Poems and Prayers, is a collection of reflections from youth onward ([10:34]-[11:07]).
  • “It was a time I gave a damn. At 18, I still give a damn.” — McConaughey ([11:07])
• Balancing Logic & Art: Discussion of the intersection of his logical, grounded side and creative drive ([12:11]-[14:46]).

3. Choosing Texas Over Hollywood—Authenticity and Priorities

• Why Texas? Desire for family closeness, “real values”, and the ability to raise his kids away from Hollywood’s excess ([16:25]-[17:36]).
• Marriage & Parenthood: His wife Camila’s values, the surprise (and humility required) in realizing how much parenting is about DNA vs. nurture ([34:13]).
• Living as an “Outlier”: Willingness to walk away from massive success and the “rom-com lane” when Hollywood typecast him ([17:56]-[19:59]).

4. Taking Risks, Perseverance, and “Rebranding”

• Hollywood Hiatus: Walked away from romantic comedies, endured an 18-month industry freeze, turned down escalating paydays (“$8 million… $14.5 million… ultimately I said no” [17:56]-[19:59]), which forced Hollywood to take his dramatic ambitions seriously.
• Payoff: Led to roles in serious dramas like Dallas Buyers Club ([20:02]-[20:44]), which won him an Oscar and wide respect.
  • "I think that sent a little bit of an invisible message to Hollywood: Oh, McConaughey’s not bluffing."

5. The “Good Man” vs. the “Nice Guy”

• Personal Philosophy: McConaughey discusses rejecting “safe spaces”, seeking meaningful risk, and being a “good man” with ideals—sometimes at the expense of being a “nice guy” ([41:37]-[43:54]).
  • “There’s a difference between a good man and a nice guy. … That means you’re going to run into conflicts, … lead when you'd rather just sit back and watch."

6. Hollywood: State of Movies & Streaming

• Changing Landscape: Lamented the loss of cinematic “event” culture due to streaming, shrinking attention spans, and the abbreviation of storytelling ([25:33]-[29:23]).
  • Criticizes studios for “cutting the first acts” and modern movies feeling interchangeable.
• Positive Example: Praises True Detective for long-form character development ([27:31]-[28:11]).
• Industry Friendships: Talks about maintaining relationships with fellow actors—especially with Woody Harrelson, whom he considers his closest friend (“one of the last wild men”) ([46:22]-[47:07]).

7. Parenting, Nepotism, and Fame’s Double-Edged Sword

• Son’s Acting Debut: Opened the door for his son Levi to act, but made him earn the part ([30:37]-[33:01]).
• On Nepotism and Entitlement:
  • "Your last name is going to get you praise in places maybe you didn’t deserve it. It’s also going to get you slammed in places you don’t deserve it… Knives are going to come at you whether you deserve them or not. Fair has nothing to do with this."
• Parenting Style: Advocates for discipline and “traditional fatherhood,” but recognizes the need to evolve toward “big brother” as his kids mature ([36:09]).

8. Technology, Social Media, AI

• Kids & Socials: Shares experiences navigating his children’s use of social media, noting their own ambivalence about it ([53:56]).
• AI’s Impact: Skeptical yet engaged, warns about AI’s impact on acting, voice cloning, and legacy ([56:02]-[57:27]).

9. Perspective on College, Learning, and Society

• Learning for the Future: Discusses whether college prepares kids for the future or if “dreamers” will matter more in the age of AI ([57:42]-[59:16]).
  • Kelly: “I want them to go to college to have fun… hone your social skills, which is important. But … it’s not about learning or preparing for life unless you’re going to med school.”

10. Political Ambitions & Leadership

• Possible Future in Politics? Admits ongoing consideration about a gubernatorial run in Texas; approaches the idea philosophically and is wary of the personal and ethical compromises required ([62:49]-[65:30]).

11. Notable Quotes

• “Fair has nothing to do with this.” — McConaughey on life in the public eye ([33:37])
• “We all got good wolves and bad wolves in us. It’s our choice to which wolf we want to feed. I’m trying to do my best to feed the good wolf knowing that the bad wolf’s still hungry.” — McConaughey ([42:05])
• “The sin comes from an archery term… to miss the mark. That’s what the word 'sin' comes from: to miss the mark. We miss the mark all the time. And I don’t want to quit taking the chances to miss the mark. … I want to make—want to hit the mark—but don’t want to go out going, well, I never shot.” ([39:41])

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Part 2: Interview with Dave Portnoy

(Timestamps: [67:04] – [167:10])

1. Political News & Media Analysis

• Trump Administration Turnover:

  • Discussion of reported firing of Trump’s National Security Advisor Mike Waltz and deputy Alex Wong ([70:31]-[75:17]).
  • Portnoy doubts “signal gate” was main cause; Kelly speculates it could be due to Waltz’s perceived “neocon” foreign policy stance.

• Democratic Disconnect with “Regular Guys”:

  • Kelly and Portnoy lampoon Democratic messaging—especially Gov. Tim Walz’s claim he “codes” to “white guys watching football”—as ineffective and inauthentic ([76:03]-[77:00]).
    • "There was no part of him that connected to what a normal guy is talking about or interested in...most would probably be like, 'No, we're not.'" — Portnoy ([77:00])

• Kamala Harris Critique:

  • Both rip Harris's mannerisms, “lecturing moral superiority,” and what they see as the emptiness of her rhetoric ([82:36]-[85:45]).
    • “Only time it gets funny is when she lands her point and you realize there’s nothing there.” — Kelly ([85:39])

• Tulsi Gabbard Interview:

  • Kelly recaps her scoop-filled interview with Director of National Intelligence Gabbard, focusing on leaks, “signal gate,” and pressures against war with Iran ([87:30]-[91:36]).

2. COVID, Fauci, and Lockdowns

• Portnoy’s Stance: Against COVID lockdowns, pro-individual/business choice; describes raising $50 million for small businesses ([93:51]-[94:13]).
• Fauci Controversies: Portnoy expresses initial trust, but is open to Kelly’s and Gabbard’s assertion about potential criminal perjury and role in the pandemic’s origins.
  • Kelly: “He’s the supervillain that you don’t know is a supervillain until the end of the movie.” ([97:22])

3. Immigration & Due Process

• Migrant Crime & Deportations:

  • Focus on the controversy around deportation of alleged gang members, due process, and the dramatic tension between safety and fairness ([104:50]-[108:36]).
  • Stephen Miller’s statement on media hypocrisy and public safety: “If I offered any one of you a rent-free home with no taxes to pay in any of these gang neighborhoods…and I said your neighbors are MS-13 terrorists…, I couldn't pay you to live there.” ([115:02])

• Portnoy’s Position:

  • Sympathetic to “moral quandary” of removals, but emphasizes the need to “get it right”—while expressing zero sympathy for criminals, blaming Democrats for choosing the wrong icons ([113:15]-[114:19]).
  • “If you just pick the wrong guy once with no due process, nothing, that’s a major issue.” — Portnoy ([106:21])

4. Viral Sports, Pop Culture, and Celebrity Scandals

• Katy Perry/Space Flight Backlash:

  • Perry is “out of touch with reality” for complaining about internet backlash to her space tourism PR ([120:16]-[121:20]).

• Bill Belichick & Jordan Hudson Scandal:

  • Portnoy provides inside perspective on Belichick’s high-profile relationship with 24-year-old Jordan, her influence on his career and family tensions, the awkward CBS interview, and viral reactions ([128:38]-[139:10]).
  • “It’s just shocking. There’s 0% chance he wrote that. My guess would be Jordan wrote that.” — Portnoy, regarding Belichick’s PR statement ([138:15])

• NFL Draft: Shadour Sanders:

  • Portnoy analyzes why Deion Sanders’ son dropped in the draft (media “circus” deterrent for teams, not race), rebuts “collusion” and “racism” arguments ([143:47]-[147:21]).

• Tom Brady as Announcer:

  • “Bad. Awful. Not good.” — Portnoy bluntly rates Brady’s debut as an NFL commentator ([142:53]).

5. Meghan Markle’s Podcast Premiere: Mutual Loathing

• Megyn Kelly’s Rant:
  • “She is a malignant narcissist who cannot get enough of herself while she simultaneously plays the victim.” ([155:03])
• **Both mock the fawning introduction, the performative ‘no makeup’ look, and Markle’s claims of overwork ([154:40]-[160:07])._
  • “That would infuriate me… you can’t fail… you’re in the royal family.” — Portnoy ([159:56])
  • Both agree Markle’s podcast is “love to hate” content.

6. Building a Media Brand and Barstool’s Evolution

• Kelly asks for advice:
  • Portnoy describes Barstool’s band label strategy: sign many, hope a few hit, expect talent to leave as soon as they get big ([162:21]-[163:55]).
  • “The talent business stinks. … Once [talent] becomes big, they don’t need you anymore.”
• On Money & Fame:
  • Portnoy on not changing as a person despite wealth, still chasing the same passions (e.g., horse racing) ([164:59]-[165:52]).

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Memorable Moments/Quotes

• On Parenting:

  • “Your number one job is helping your kids become who they are, not who you want them to be. Shoot it into my veins.” — Kelly, quoting McConaughey ([33:37])

• On Hollywood Reality:

  • “Fair has nothing to do with this.” — McConaughey ([33:37])

• On Modern Politics:

  • “There's a shame that comes across of saying you aren't a frat...Being a white guy in this country who wants to have a good job, make money, go to college, do all those things. And that is a message that seemingly like you can't be both.” — Portnoy ([80:00])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Matthew McConaughey:

  • Losing his father, “just keep living”: [04:41]-[06:52]
  • Deciding on acting, father’s support: [07:00]-[09:08]
  • On writing, Poems and Prayers: [10:34]-[11:07]
  • Leaving Hollywood for Texas, parenting: [16:25]-[17:36], [34:13]
  • Hollywood “rebranding,” drama ambitions: [17:56]-[19:59]
  • Oscar win & career change: [20:44]
  • Longer-form storytelling, state of movies: [25:33]-[29:23]
  • Nepotism & fame’s dangers for kids: [30:37]-[33:01]
  • Risk, success, philosophy: [39:41]-[43:54]
  • Political future: [62:49]-[65:30]

• Dave Portnoy:

  • Trump admin shakeups (Walz/Wong): [70:31]-[75:17]
  • Dems and “everyday guys”: [76:03]-[77:00]
  • Kamala Harris, political critique: [82:36]-[85:45]
  • Fauci/COVID discussion: [93:51]-[98:45]
  • Migrant crime/deportations debate: [104:50]-[116:45]
  • Belichick interview analysis: [128:38]-[139:10]
  • NFL: Shadour Sanders draft saga: [143:47]-[147:21]
  • Meghan Markle podcast takedown: [153:36]-[162:17]
  • Media advice, Barstool business: [162:21]-[163:55]

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Tone & Style

• McConaughey: Warm, reflective, gently philosophical, candid.
• Portnoy: Irreverent, sharp, direct, unfiltered.
• Kelly: Forthright, probing, often playful, occasionally righteously indignant.

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For Listeners

This episode is an immersive, forthright tour through personal reinvention, American cultural dynamics, modern media, and the hypocrisies of power—punctuated by deeply honest anecdotes, moments of humility, and a lot of enjoyable, informed snark. Whether you’re seeking life philosophy, a peek behind Hollywood’s velvet curtain, or a dose of unvarnished news and sports banter, both halves deliver.

Transcript

[Megyn Kelly]

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[Dave Portnoy]

I'm Kiana and I leveled up my business with Shopify.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Once I figured out that Shopify was a thing, I never turned back. I can create a site with my eyes closed. Shopify thinks ahead of us, you know,

[Megyn Kelly]

and it thinks about the customer more than every day.

[Dave Portnoy]

I'm thinking about some other new business,

[Matthew McConaughey]

but Shopify is doing it to me

[Dave Portnoy]

because it's so easy to use.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's like, I can't stop.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I'm addicted. Start your free [e-mail] welcome to the

[Megyn Kelly]

Megyn Kelly show live on Sirius XM channel 111 every weekday at noon East. Hey, everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to the Megyn Kelly show and today's double feature mega episode. All right. Matthew McConaughey is one of the biggest stars in America, but he doesn't live in Hollywood. He lives in Texas, where he was raised. And there's a really good reason for that. It turns out some of the things that make us gravitate toward Matthew come from his down home nature in his refusal to succumb to the glitz and glam of the Hollywood weirdos. And in this interview, I think you'll come to like him even more than you probably are already do. And then there's the barstool sports founder Dave Portnoy, who's got some very sharp elbows and some very sharp takes and is always entertaining to listen to. So we have a fun pairing for you. I spoke with Dave in, in person together at SiriusXM. It was a great conversation. Enjoy both and I'll see you Monday.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I'm Todd. I'd never been on stage, never done acting before, any, any of that.

[Megyn Kelly]

Today on the Megyn Kelly show, from small town Texas to the bright lights of Hollywood, Matthew McConaughey burst onto the scene with a line that became legend.

[Matthew McConaughey]

All right, all right, all right.

[Megyn Kelly]

From breakout star to king of the romantic comedies.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You ever think about that night in the park? The nice guy roles and nothing wrong with that. I was so successful at them that any dramas I wanted to do, Hollywood was not offering me. Even if I took a huge pay cut, they're like, no, no, no, McConaughey, stay in your lane.

[Megyn Kelly]

At the height of all that fame, he walked away.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I was ready to do more dramas in life. I was read to stand up for things that I believed in, to stand against things I didn't. There was no parachute pull here. You might just written yourself a ticket

[Megyn Kelly]

out of Hollywood only to return to greater glory. And the Oscar goes to Matthew McConaughey.

[Matthew McConaughey]

That's when I started becoming more of

[Megyn Kelly]

a good man, redefining himself as one of the most compelling voices in film.

[Matthew McConaughey]

We all got good wolves and bad wolves in us. It's our choice to which wolf we want to feed. I'm trying to do my best to be the good wolf, knowing that the bad wolf's still hungry today.

[Megyn Kelly]

He's here to share the lessons from that, that incredible ride.

[Matthew McConaughey]

This is a rodeo if you want to get into this. I'm not saying you gotta have thick skin, but you got to know what's important to you. Knives are going to come at you whether you deserve them or not. Fair has nothing to do with this.

[Megyn Kelly]

Welcome to the Megyn Kelly show, everyone. I'm Megyn Kelly. We have a first time guest on the show today who you likely know very well or think you do. Matthew McConaughey is an American actor and an Academy award winning one at that. He's also a best selling author, he's a husband, he's a proud dad, and he's a deep thinker who is out with a new book in which he shares decades of reflections, poems and prayers is the name of it and it's out right now. Matthew McConaughey, welcome to the show.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Megyn Kelly, Good to be here.

[Megyn Kelly]

I love the book. I thought it was so thoughtful. It made me stop, reflect and be more thoughtful about everything from fear, faith to my own life philosophy in terms of getting after it or downshifting into a lower gear. And I didn't realize how much I had in common with you, Hollywood man, because you're really more of a Texas man who's been through a fair amount. Let me kick it off on sort of a somber note. One thing we have in common is we both lost our dads at very young ages. You, by my calculations, were 22. I was 15. They went suddenly thanks to heart attacks. And in both of our cases, it changed, of course, our lives, but also our life choices and our life philosophies. Can, can you kick it off there like the you before you lost your dad and the you after?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. So I don't know about you, but I at that time, I mean, I didn't think my dad could die, you know, I mean, I knew practically he had to one Day, but I thought he was the Abominable Snowman. And what. I didn't, I didn't. There wasn't. There wasn't any lead up to it. There's no fair warning. There was no like, oh, it's time's coming. It just happened and happened the way he said it was going to happen. Said, boys, when I go, I'm going to be making love to your mother. And it was a risky Monday morning at 6am and that's what happened. And that's how he moved on from a heart attack. It. I remember the call and I remember my knees dropping out for money from my mother. And she said, your dad moved on this morning. And yeah, it was the very unbelievable. I didn't think it was possible. And then dealing with that, you know, going back to the wake with the brothers and the. And, and my mom and hearing stories where you find out that, oh, the message maybe was a little different than the messenger, which I was quickly able to forgive because I understood that to just be reality. But the loss. Just keep living. My phrase came from that because I remember when I went back to work six days later, I was on the set of Days Confused, my very first film, and I was talking with the director, Richard Linklater, at magic hour sundown. We were walking around this football stadium. I was like, you know, he's physically no longer here, but spiritually, I, I think I can keep calling him. I can. I can talk to him whenever I want. I can pick up the phone. Got to keep him a spirit alive. And that's where just keep living came from. Added on top of that, look, I was scared because he left. My crutch was gone. He was to me, what was above the law, above government, above religion. Boy, if I was in a pinch and really need someone to have my back, that was gonna be my dad. And now that crutch is gone, now that that parachute's gone. And so I quickly was like, okay, boy, talking to myself. Better quit acting like the things your dad taught you to do and be and start becoming the man that he taught you to be. And that's been a process that I got kick started in right then, very hardcore, but have tried to maintain throughout my life.

[Megyn Kelly]

Did he want you going into acting? You just started. You weren't like the big star yet. Although Dazed and Confused was a. Was a hit, but did he want you to do it?

[Matthew McConaughey]

This was, this was before, and I want to say this, there's a very graceful thing in hindsight about his death. He Was alive for the first five days of me shooting. Days confused. He didn't come to the set or anything, but he was alive for me to start his final son. To start something that wouldn't be just a fad, that wouldn't just be a hobby. Start something that became a career. I've always seen some grace in that. But the call that I had with him two years prior to that while I was headed towards law school at University of Texas, and it was a Tuesday night, I planned it. I said, I'm going to call him at Tuesday night at 7:30pm you know, it won't be Monday because there's too much stress about getting back to work. It'll be Tuesday end of the day. He'll be on the couch having a beer with Mom. It'll be a great time to tell him that I want to go to film school instead of law school. I made that call, 7:36pm and he answered. He said, what's up, monkey man? I said, hey, Pop, got something I want to share with you. He said, what's that? I said, I don't want to go to law school anymore. I want to go to film school. And there's a long pause and I was like, oh, here it comes. He's about to go, you want a what? And he didn't. He said, are you sure that's what you want to do? I said, yes, sir. Another long pause. He said, well, don't half ass it. So he gave me more than license. He gave me rocket fuel to go do it.

[Megyn Kelly]

Did he have any reason at that point to believe in you? Had you been the big star on the high school stage?

[Matthew McConaughey]

No, I'd never been on stage. I'd never done acting before any of that. I think what he heard, though, is something I think we all want to hear from our kids is a time when they're asking us or telling us. I wasn't really asking them, I was going to do it right? And I think he heard that in my voice, the way I said, yes, sir. I didn't stutter, I didn't blink, I didn't whisper. I was. He heard the security in my voice that I had gone through to make this decision. And hearing that from me was, I think, where he was like, okay, my son's asking, but he's not really asking. And I think we all want to hear that from our children at some time after we give them guidelines. But if they're going to break out of those guidelines to go their own way, don't come a bluffing, if you're going to do it, do it. And he heard that, and that's where he came up with telling me, don't have assets.

[Megyn Kelly]

But where did you get the confidence for that? Because there are millions of kids out there right now who would love to be a Hollywood star. They're from Texas. They have no connections to the industry. It's a pipe dream. It's not. Odds are overwhelmingly against you. So how did you think? Yeah, why not me?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, so I started off. I wasn't courageous or confident to say I wanted to be in front of the camera yet. But I was at that time courageous enough to say I want to go into the film, the storytelling business. So I went to film school, study behind the camera. All right. And I had been writing short stories at that time. And I had a buddy of film school who said, these are really good short stories. You might be able to want to turn these into moving pictures. It wasn't until a year later that I was in the right bar at the right time and got cast in days, confused and got in front of the camera and three lines turned to three weeks work. All right, all right.

[Megyn Kelly]

Right.

[Matthew McConaughey]

All right. And I'm getting paid $320 a day, and people are telling me I'm good at it. Will you please come back tomorrow and do it again? And I was like, hell, yeah, I'll come back again. Is this even legal? I'm having so much fun and you're telling me I'm good at this? I can make a living doing this. That's where I got the confidence and then continued on. And look, Megan, I didn't go to Hollywood and have the. The long story of having to wait the tables for so long. I actually went to Hollywood, and the first two auditions I went on actually got the job. It was angels in the outfield and boys on the side. So I had some dry spells later on in my career, but, boy, when I first got out there, I knocked out the first two auditions. You got them.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, I'm not surprised to hear that you were a writer, because when I read Poems and prayers, it was obvious. And the thing that's special about the book is that it's a collection of poems and prayers from back when you were a teenager, when you were like 18. And I wonder. I have been an avid journal keeper for most of my life, but when I occasionally pull out the ones from that period, it's awful. It's very.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I know what you mean.

[Megyn Kelly]

And now you had the Courage to put it down in paper and publish it. So how does that feel reading back on the earlier ones?

[Matthew McConaughey]

So I went back and saw the early ones and look, you know, even in writing Green Lights part of that was going back and looking 35 years of my journal and I looked at some of that stuff and I was like, oh good gosh, the shame, the guilt going on. Are you kidding me? Look at the arrogant little prick you are. Who do you think you are? But then after a while I started to chuckle at those things and that's why I added this point, that poem in this book, which isn't a bad poem, but it's a very self serious poem of an 18 year old boy asking some big existential questions when you would think he would just be having a great fun time, summer and under the sunshine. And I added it because it was a time I gave a damn. At 18 I still give a damn. I'm still working on trying to be a better man. I'm still questioning what's going on in the world. I'm still, you know, pointing out stuff that I think is mendacious and not fair in the world and I'm asking those questions and I still do. So to see that I was doing that at 18, I'll mind you, you could tell I had a thesaurus near. I used some words in there that I'm like, you don't know what that meant and I still don't know what that word meant, but give it a shot. I had a thesaurus near me, you know.

[Megyn Kelly]

But when I read the early writings I think this is obviously an artist, like this is an artistic person. It should be no surprise that this person did not wind up in law school and instead wound in the arts really telling stories and bringing characters to life. So it's a fun. It's kind of funny to me to think of you going to law school, but you talk in the book, you write in the book about your previous maybe current commitment to logic and reason and how much that has appealed to you for your first 55 years. But now you're kind of in a different phase so it does make some sense. It's just not that common to see both the strong logic and reasoning thread coupled with the artistic and creative ability and, and Jones.

[Matthew McConaughey]

So when I was in kindergarten I was standing on the street corner outside the school and the, the, the head principal came out and I was, I was sitting there looking up at the sky, at this cloud And I said, Mr. Mayor, is that cloud as big as the world. And he goes, yes, Matthew, it is. So in my whatever kindergarten, how old I was five year old. Mine, six year old mom was like, well, if I can see the edges of that cloud and it's as big as the world. And I know that that road trip we took from Texas to Pensacola took whatever, 15 hours and it was just that long on a map, if I can see the edge of that cloud, that cloud must be so far up in the sky that it's not even worth dreaming about. So I'm going to put my head down. Forget Air Force, I'm Army. That was when it went through my head. I was like, you got to deal with what's right in front of you because what's out there is too far away. So for 15 years I just put my head down and dealt, didn't dream. You know, at 16 years old, I take my first flight, commercial flight, and in 10 seconds I'm in the middle of that cloud. I'm like, either this cloud goes a billion miles an hour or that cloud is not as big as the world is, like Mr. Mayor told me it was. Well, so I then come to learn, oh, clouds aren't that big. They're not that far away. And all of a sudden I was like, oh, well. So what's over the horizon is actually worth considering. What's out there that you don't see right in front of you is worth dreaming about. But still, the fact that I've always dealt and looked to logic, you know, us doers, I've always been a doer. And us doers, we climb mountains. Well, we're good climbers, but because we got our head down, we don't always climb the right mountains. Those dreamers look up and are always kind of measuring in the landscape, which doesn't make us very good climbers, but we pick the right mountains so doers can help dreamers, you know, climb more mountains. And dreamers can help doers climb the right ones. And. But I didn't start dreaming until I moved to Longview, until I was about 16 years old.

[Megyn Kelly]

So something. You've made some good choices with that combination. Because I look at you and you seem to me very much like an outlier. You. We talked about, you know, the writing ability, which not everybody in Hollywood has. A lot of people just want to be on camera. A lot of people just want to be a star in my industry too. Poems and Prayers is the name of the book for those listening. So you've got writing ability. You move out to California, you Get cast in the first two things that you apply for, you try out for audition. You become a star pretty quickly. And then unlike virtually everybody who follows that path with success, you leave Hollywood, you go back to your native Texas, you choose to raise your children there. You get married. You're in a long term marriage, like your marriage works, which is rare in your industry. By the way, you're not the first McConaughey I've interviewed. Your lovely wife came on my show when I was at NBC.

[Matthew McConaughey]

There we go.

[Megyn Kelly]

And so all of these things suggest you're of a different mold and model than the average person out there, that you have to me a different value set. And I think that's embodied in your book. Because what I see in here is you love America, you're a man of faith, but like most of us who are people of faith, you struggle with it. What does it mean? How far can it take me? How humble, you know, how can I humble myself in order for it to really mean something to me? You love your children. You prioritize them over your job and realize they're both important, but one is clearly the winner. So I wonder whether that's all the job of the parents and Texas and whether you think all of this would have happened for you if you hadn't pulled up out of Hollywood and, and gone back home.

[Matthew McConaughey]

So the main reason I came back, one of the main reasons I came back home is, is, is I did go out there to Hollywood long enough. I want to get myself established, you know?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yep.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Enough, enough credentials to say, oh, you can't just rock my boat and I'm gone, you know, and also enough credentials where, you know, if they want me to, they know where to find me. And if they want me, I will plan my route out to Hollywood and line up meetings for two weeks and just go knock them all out, you know, along, along the way. It was also, my mom's here, my brothers are here. As soon as Camilla and I decided to have children, I wanted them to be raised here near my home and around their family. I wanted them to be raised with the, maybe what you could say is a little more common sense values that I feel is around here where a mile feels like a mile and 60 minutes feels like an hour. It's a, it was a natural coming home for me. It was also at that time I was doing romantic comedies and I was the rom com guy and I love doing them and I hope to do more later on.

[Megyn Kelly]

Wedding planner with JLo, how to lose a guy in 10 days with Kate Hudson.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Hi, I'm Benjamin Berry.

[Megyn Kelly]

Andy Anderson.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Oh, you are already falling in love with me.

[Megyn Kelly]

Sarah Jessica Parker in one there to launch. Yeah, I had a nice time. I did too. Good night.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Good night. I was rolling in the rom coms, successful, enjoying the heck out of them. At the same time, I was so successful at them that any dramas I wanted to do, Hollywood was not offering me. Even if I took a huge pay cut, they're like, no, no, McConaughey, stay in your lane. Like, okay, well, if I can't do what I want to do, I'm going to quit doing what I'm doing. So moved back down here, dropped out. You didn't see me in any rom coms. You didn't see me shirtless on a beach. You didn't know where I was. And I knew it was going to be a bit of a desert I was walking into because I was like, I might have just wrote my one way ticket out of Hollywood and Camilla and I prayed on it, pride on it, and said, I'm going to do it and I stick to the decision. And she goes, you know, this might last a long time. You don't know. There's no parachute to pull her. You might just written yourself a ticket out of Hollywood. I was like, yep, but it's non negotiable. This is what I'm going to do. Well, months went by and nothing. Six months go by, nothing. A year goes by. I talked to my age, he goes, matthew, I haven't even heard your name. You know, luckily at this time, Camilla's pregnant and I and we've got our first child coming on, which really anchored me to have a little significance, you know, at a time when I was feeling very wobbly without anything, any work to do. 18 months go by and I remember this. The script comes in, there's romantic comedy, $8 million offer. I said, no, thank you. $10 million offer, I said, no, thank you.$12 million offer, I said, no,. $14.5 million offer. I said, let me read that again and let me tell you the $8 million offer. But it was better, it was more well written. I could see this working for me, you know, but ultimately I said no. And I think that sent a little bit of an invisible message to Hollywood. Oh, McConaughey is not bluffing. He's onto something here. He's actually playing offense and affirmatively where he is. And cut to four months later. All of a sudden, I get the calls for the dramas that I want to do. And I just attacked him. So that was a step out of Hollywood where I needed to rebrand and unbrand, really, before I rebranded.

[Megyn Kelly]

And then when did Dallas buyers club come?

[Matthew McConaughey]

2013. So that's about four years, three years, I think, into that, into that run after the two year hiatus. 30 day. I'm sorry, This is 30 day. Let me give you a little news flash. Ain't nothing out there. And kill ron woodruff in 30 days,

[Megyn Kelly]

Which led to Academy gold. Was that before and after for you or like, was that actually a game changer or. No, because you'd already rejiggered and relaunched.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, look, it was a game changer in that. Hey there, is my peers saying, we deem your performance the most excellent male lead performance of the year. That meant a lot to me. Sure as hell did. It wasn't something that I've ever been out to prove or anything, but to get that from my peers in the craft and a lot of them who I respect, that, that felt. That felt really good. Now, one of the things that's funny about winning an Academy award is that things you say afterwards, especially immediately afterwards, the things that used to be in small print are now in bold print. Even if you're repeating something you said 10 years ago, all of a sudden it's in bold print and they're like, wow, that's original. I go, man, I've been saying that for 15 years now it's in bold print. But it did open up. It opened up a lot of opportunities for me that I've tried to, you know, take advantage of as responsibly as I could.

[Megyn Kelly]

Hey, but here's a good question for you. When Robert Downey Jr. Won, I think it was best supporting actor this past, like, year ago. I think, if memory serves, I'm not as into it all, but I loved his opening line, which was, I'd like to thank my unhappy childhood, which is like, yeah, so good. And probably true for a lot of actors, right? Like, that's where you get all the stuff that you can draw on, the stuff that you could put into a book, like poems and prayers. But is it true for you?

[Matthew McConaughey]

No. No, it's not. And you know, I had a time where right after I called my dad and said I was going to film school and he said, don't half ass it. I get into film school, I'm a frat guy. I wear jeans and press my shirts and they're tucked in and I go see blockbuster films on the weekend. I got into film school on my GPA because I had a 3.82 GPA. I didn't have a piece of art. So I get into film school and everyone's in there wearing black and they're gothic and no one's got a tan. Here I am, I got a tan frat guy jeans, you know, And I'm questioning, wait a minute, do I need to be this sort of Hamlessian, you know, problems in life to be an artist, you know? And I remember we have Mondays where you'd come back to the class, you talked about what you saw that weekend, and I'd always come back, hey, man, I just saw Die Hard, you know, and they'd come back and go, I saw the Eisenstein thing at the Independent, you know, Anyway, every time I'd bring up the blockbuster, like I saw Die Hard, they'd all go, all that? That's corporate, man. It's not. And I'm going, oh, man, I'm getting hammered here. Maybe I'm not an artist. And then one day I came in. One day, I come in and I say the blockbuster it was. And actually the one I said, this day was Die Hard. And they go, oh, man, that's bullshit. And I said, hang on a second, hang on just a second. I go, did y' all see it? And they go, well, no, no. I mean, we're just saying. And I was like, oh, bullshit. No, you can't just say because it was popular, it came from a big studio, and it played in a blockbuster that it's. That it's crap. I enjoyed it. And that's when I went, I'm gonna keep my shirt tucked in. I'm gonna keep my hell yeah frat house. I'm rolling.

[Megyn Kelly]

If I want to go spend the weekend watching Sharknado, why should they be allowed to stop me?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Come on.

[Megyn Kelly]

It takes all different kinds of tastes to keep the movie industry going.

[Dave Portnoy]

You didn't start a business just to keep the lights on.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You're here to sell more today than yesterday.

[Dave Portnoy]

You're here to win. Lucky for you, Shopify built the best of converting checkout on the planet. Like the just one tapping ridiculously fast,

[Matthew McConaughey]

acting sky high, sales stacking, champion of checkouts. That's the good stuff right there. So if your business is in it

[Dave Portnoy]

to win it, win with Shopify.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Start your free trial [e-mail].

[Dave Portnoy]

win.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's my first day of work and I need to make a big impression

[Dave Portnoy]

from executive producer Mindy Kaling.

[Megyn Kelly]

This is our sexual harassment training. Hands off your coworkers.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Now sign this saying that I trained

[Megyn Kelly]

you or you're fired. Yes, ma'. Am. Work relationships are too messy.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I just met the woman of my dreams.

[Dave Portnoy]

You gotta chill out and not come on too strong.

[Matthew McConaughey]

That goes against my entire personality, but I'll try.

[Dave Portnoy]

Watch the new Hulu original series not suitable for work, premiering June 2 on Hulu and Hulu on Disney for bundle subscribers Terms apply.

[Megyn Kelly]

What do you think of that? Because there's been. I'll take. I just gave my. My own complaint on it. And you saw the New York Times movie critic resigned two years ago saying, I can't. I can't with just like the non stop action hero movies. Like, I miss plots, I miss drama. I miss like real crescendos and decrescendos and plots that expose human frailty. Like what happened to those movies. And you and I grew up at exactly the same time. I know you know what he's talking about and what I'm talking about. Can we get back to that? I've heard Matt Damon do a riff on this suggesting the way the studio system set up now. No. What do you think?

[Matthew McConaughey]

So here's what I've noticed happening as we're going into streaming. Like, I've got this. I've got a film coming out, the Lost Bus.

[Megyn Kelly]

Is there anybody that can go and pick these kids up?

[Matthew McConaughey]

It is a film built for the big theater, for the big screen. We have a two week run, limited screens in la, New York and London before we stream straight to Apple plus, that's where it's going. And I feel like the streamers want to go. Let's forget even the two week theatrical release. Let's just go straight to streaming. Now the problem with that is that you've seen it, everyone sees it. You go on one of these streamers and you see this catalog of films. I don't know about you, but I'm like, when did they make that? It's one of my favorite actors. When did they. I didn't even see it. Didn't even hear about it. So everything's kind of dropped down to a low common denominator in a library. So there's no exclusivity that you get of a precious. Oh, it's come out in the theater. Oh, if we want to see that actor or actress or director, we have to go out on Friday night when it opens and see it. It doesn't have that as much and I hope we can maintain that. What's also happening is in this abbreviated attention span capacity that we talk about, that people have, what studios are first cutting is the first acts of films. Now, the first act is where you set up the world for the viewer. That tells you, you may know where this story goes, but you've never been there with me. So it's going to be specific. I'm going to set you up with an original show. The conflict that starts in Act 2, which is usually on page 38, now is on page 11. It's like, start it, meet you, hi, know what you do. Bam. Conflict. Let's get on with it. No one wants to wait around, or the studios don't believe they want to wait around for an interesting first act. It's what was so pleasurable about doing true detective up your ass, Cole.

[Megyn Kelly]

Why don't you do your own fucking

[Matthew McConaughey]

legwork, you rat fuck. Say it again with me.

[Dave Portnoy]

Hey,

[Matthew McConaughey]

it was an eight part series for three and a half hours. I get a first act, which is an actor's dream, because that's where I get to go. Here's how you could go on this journey with me that you've never been in or this relationship that I have with Marty Hart. And I hope we don't keep abbreviating getting to know characters and relationships that are specific and original, because if we do, everything's just gonna feel like somewhat the same movie.

[Megyn Kelly]

I can relate to this. Believe it or not. Just going from cable news to podcasting, it's much the same in that, only like the reverse. Right? Because the cable news, you got to get up and down on it quickly and move on. There's no chance to establish the character's background or fall in love with them or what have you just got to get, you know, what's the news, in and out. Whereas in podcasting you can build the story, you can help the audience get to know this character before you zero in on really why they're here.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yep. Yeah. I mean, you'd know this. You just said it. I mean, and I didn't learn this for 10 years from doing press for a film or a book. You know, you're going on. I remember the first time I went on like Leno, you know, you get four minutes up there and I want to go, well, you know, the thing you're already zap. This is not the format for the long term. So you learn, you pick your spots about what's my message, what's my window, how do I hit it? But for people that are interested in stories, I wanna, I don't ever want to lose the Longer format. And will there be a rebellion back to people going, I don't want a short snippet. No, I, I, I want the longer format. I want to take the time. They can hear it on audio now. They can drive and listen to it or watch.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. They're consuming information differently, which I think will lead to a desire for more meaningful conversations. I just think it's, that's why these other models are, they have limited shelf lives and no offense to these superhero action movies because they, there's definitely an audience for those. But longer form storytelling is still an art form that many of us thirst for and would absolutely consume with, you know, a lot of dollars. Now in the Lost bus, it's, you have an interesting situation because you have your son, your son Levi is starring in it. 17 years old. And I've actually. So I'm kind of drafting behind you on the childhood front because my kids are almost your kids ages, they're 15, 14 and 12. And now that they're getting to be like real humans, you know, like we're, they're on the cusp of adulthood. I've asked myself this question about nepotism. The nepo baby. And you know, when you're the mother of a kid who's, you know, through no fault of their own is born to you and you might be a public figure, it's hard to call it that, you know, as opposed to like, well, if my kid wanted my help getting into my industry, I'd probably give him an open door and then let him take it. And you were recently in this position. Can you tell us what happened?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. And that nepotism questions are really good one, because I don't want my kids to ever feel entitled. At the same time, do I believe with people in my own life outside of my family that if you want to know where the arrow is going, look at where it was shot from. So there's real practicality to that. My son, as I pitch films that I'm into my family all the time, my son comes to me and he, I knew that there was a role as a young boy to play my son. He says, how old is that kid? I said, he actually he's about 13, 14, which was Levi's age at the time. And he goes, can I read for it? And I was like, kind of just straight faced him and walked off. I wanted to see how much he wanted it, if it was just a whim or when he comes up four more times over the next week, can I read for it? Can I read for it. Can I read for it? I said, okay, you want to read for it? Let me tell you what this acting thing's about. This is not just a little, hey, hey, what if. Hey, I'm going to teach you something about this. You got to revere this craft, and you got to work at it. So let's work on this character. Right?

[Dave Portnoy]

Right now.

[Matthew McConaughey]

We'll get a read. We did. I put it on camera. I saw on camera. I was like, oh, he's got presence. He can hold a frame. He's being honest in front of the camera. That's good instincts. Okay. I sent it to the casting director and I said, francine, I think this may be good enough for callback. What do you think? And she wrote back, said, I think it's good enough to send to the director. And I said, oh, okay. Will you do me a favor? Will you pull his last name off? Because I just don't want it if it preceding, you know, anyone's opinion to help or to help or any. She goes, yes, right.

[Megyn Kelly]

You don't want to send the message. I'm phoning in a favor here.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Hey, you know, kind of, hey, it's playing my son. Did he do me a favor? I would not make that call, and I'm not going to make that call again. Open the door. But once you get in the door, son, daughter, you go handle. But I did open the door. I had access to get his read to the cast director. Well, the director sees it and says, that's the kid. She goes, well, that happens to be Matthew's son. He goes, even better. So he got the role, which makes. I'm very proud of. And he did it on his own merit, in his own talent.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, but now let me ask you about part two. Part two. So then he. So he stars in it. It's about to launch. And now I think at this point in the process, I haven't yet gotten there. And none of my kids have said they want to go to media. I'm just saying, like, I would help them. I think I'd be living in. In Terror of bad reviews of nasty Internet trolls. It's one thing when they come for us, who cares? We're used to it. But come for my kid, I mean, that's the kind of thing I might toss and turn over at night.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I have not toss and turned. And maybe that's because I said, get ready for it. It's going to happen anyway. I said. I said, your last name is going to get you praise in Places maybe you didn't deserve it. It's also going to get you slammed in places you don't deserve it. So this is a rodeo if you want to get into this. I'm not saying you got a thick skin, but you got to know what's important to you and you got to be ready to hit. Knives are going to come at you whether you deserve them or not. Fair has nothing to do with this. So if you love doing the craft enough and you're good at it, you stick your, put your head down and do that. And the rest of that you've got to have thick skin about because that's going to happen.

[Megyn Kelly]

Fair has nothing to do with this. That's a great life lesson. In the book you write in poems and prayers, you write, I wrote it down. Your number one job is helping your kids become who they are, not who you want them to be. Shoot it into my veins. It's exactly right. So many people don't get it, Matthew. They think the kids are a do over. And you've come to the same realization that Doug and I have, which is that DNA thing has a lot to do with how they show up and we just kind of fool ourselves that we're the big maestros about where it's going.

[Matthew McConaughey]

But that was the biggest surprise to me about having children. I thought it was 9010 environment, culture to DNA. And all of a sudden I was like, oh, it's closer to the opposite, right?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, totally. But that's, I mean, I would imagine especially in Hollywood, that's not a lesson everybody understands, you know, because it's a very hard charging ground on me to dump on Hollywood non stop though I'll be honest, my audience can't stand Hollywood, but it's a very hard charging group of people that have made it in a very competitive industry. Like they've made it at the top, so they've got to be somewhat cutthroat. But then you have a kid and everybody out there is probably facing a similar challenge, which is how do I maintain my kids competitive drive notwithstanding the fact that they've been born into a life of luxury and privilege, etc. Right. And like, I don't know, I think too many parents would default to I'll make him a killer as opposed to I will sit back and figure out, like let him figure out whether he wants to be a killer.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, you know how it is. I mean it's, it's, there's a lot of parents and you probably know them as well, that for my money, I think become or want to be friends with their children when they need to be parents to them. And that friend to their children is sometimes a bit of that do over. Hey, maybe you can pick up where I left off and become a better version of me, which is that's not what a child's acting, asking for early on, you know, do overs. I think that kids want us to be a parent to them early.

[Megyn Kelly]

Are you a more traditional dad? I mean, I know you're married to a Brazilian woman and I have a lot of Brazilian friends. I know they tend to like a more traditional man. And you're from Texas, so I kind of feel like you'd be more of a trad dad.

[Matthew McConaughey]

But look, I'm more. I go, I call it, and this is not a political term, but I call it conservative. Very liberal. Late. I want my kids to know how to block and tackle, know your manners and graces and arithmetic and respect before we're going to go fly our freak flag and say whatever. So I think art emulates life. I want them to learn who they are and who they are not in life before they're going off into imaginations. Now, you can create whoever it is you want to be, but let's have a foundation that we understand about how we act and how we treat ourselves and each other before we go off into, you know, la la, land of dreams and creation again. How I grew up, learned to deal before I learned to dream. That's how that's sort of my look at it. I believe in consequences. I believe in discipline. I also believe that sometimes, as I'm learning right now, I did not know, Megan, that I always thought you went from father to later on a friend. And I did not know that there's a bridge in the middle there called big brother. As a father, and I'm able to be a big brother, especially now that my kids are teens and I can kind of put my hand on their back and maybe not judge him as quickly and go, I know what you're talking about. Let me tell you this story about when I was in high school. The other great thing about teenage kids is I don't have to edit my good stories as much to them anymore.

[Megyn Kelly]

Now, which period of your life are the best stories from?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Oh, I mean, I've got some starting back from when I was 8. I think the best stories were probably. Oh, man. Every decade had a great story. I would say I could pick them out all over the place. There's things. There's things I look back at that, that I, that I did when I was younger, that makes me happy to be here and alive. So. But there's been some great stories which I cataloged along the way and mostly in Green Lights and somewhat in Poems and Prayers. I think there's been some pretty good stories along the way.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, you don't seem risk averse. Both you've outlined it, leaving Hollywood and saying I'm just going to do it differently, that was a huge risk. But your life philosophy does not, as reflected in poems and prayers, does not seem to favor safe spaces. It seems to favor, take the big risks and don't, don't die in your bed saying, I never got hurt.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Right. Well, that's a constant thing to measure, isn't it? Because especially after getting successful, having a family, things that I've built that I want to maintain that I'm not going to be foolish with. All right, at the same time, I don't want to get complacent and safe and go, okay, this is it. Everyone just huddle up, put your, you know, keep everything else out. I still want to take risk. And that's also, you know, something that I know. Women, I'm sure they do too, but men go through in middle age. You're at the bottom of the horseshoe. Like, are we taking the risk anymore? How do we still take a chance with the take the right kind of risk? And I still want to take the right kind of risk, but I don't want to be foolish with what I built because some of the stuff I built is non negotiably going to be on my table and in my life until I leave this one. You know, I have that passage in Poems and Prayers. I'm curious, you know, if, if, if, if, if is God happier if we take eight major risks in life and pull off seven of them? Or is he happy when we take a hundred risk and pull off eight? You know, it's like a little bit of that you don't want you coming back money. You know what I mean? Right. I think he's saying if you did take enough risk, if you did, it would maybe, maybe that's the sin. You know what I mean?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And if you didn't, you know, the sin comes from an archery term, to miss the mark. That's what the word sin comes from, to miss the mark. We miss the mark all the time. And I don't want to quit taking the chances to miss the mark. I want to make, want to hit the mark, but don't Want to go out going, well, I never shot.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's even harder when you've reached your level of success because now you do have a lot to lose. So, you know, to keep challenging yourself, to keep making yourself go out there and take the big risks, it gets even scarier. Right. It's one thing when you're up and coming, it's like, what the hell? Or even when you're on the middle of the ladder. But when you're at the top of the ladder with all the things a lot of people would say, I'm gonna stay. I'm gonna hold.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, I'll hold. I'll hold.

[Megyn Kelly]

You don't feel that way?

[Matthew McConaughey]

I hope not. Look, I've been told by many people that are close to me that my biggest asset is that I take risk. I also think that that's what I need to take more of, that I don't take enough. So as it is, what does that look like now?

[Megyn Kelly]

What could that look like for Matthew McConaughey at 55?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Put my cards on the table of who I am in this big movie that I'm living. That was action, was called the Day I Was Born. And cuts called the Day I'm Leaving this Life. The documentary that I'm living, that we're all living, putting it on and going. And it's what I'm doing a bit of now. And I still have a ways to go. I'm creating characters that I believe in and want to play in my own life. And saying, what are you doing live? What's happening? The cameras rolling. It's been rolling since the day you're born. What do you. Why do you have to go off to do someone else that something else. Someone that something else wrote in is directing and is put it in cinematographer and then editing. Get rid of those filters. What's. What am I doing live. Who am I live in life? That's what I'm pressing myself on for the. Mainly for the last six years, more so than any time. And I hope I'll continue to press on myself to do that.

[Megyn Kelly]

That. Okay. That leads me to one of my favorite pieces in the book, which is on page 77. It's good man. And you write as follows. There's a difference between a good man and a nice guy. A good man stands for certain ideals, and when those beliefs are contested, a good man is not a nice guy. No, I love that. Can you talk about how you came to that realization?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. So, you know, I. Part of it. I think the best example would Be around that time, I was doing nothing but the rom coms. You know, those were, those are nice guy roles. They worked, I enjoyed them. I was getting paid well, they were easy to do. They felt like a Saturday the nice guy rolls. And nothing wrong with that. But I was ready to do more dramas in life. I was ready to stand up for things that I believed in, to stand against things I didn't in life. And I wanted to also find roles that I could do that in. That's when I started becoming more of a good man. And that does. That means you're going to run into conflicts. That means you're going to have to go against the masses at certain times. That means you're gonna have to lead when you'd rather just sit back and watch. Sometimes that means you're gonna have to run towards crisis instead of away from it. Sometimes that means you're not going to be proper. That means you're going to receive the, the blades in the back. And it's okay if it's easier too. I know for me when my faith is stronger because I can schleft those things off, because I'm going, no, no, no. I'm playing an immortal game here. Stay. That's the game I'm playing. Don't worry about the mortal game. Worry about the immortal game. So to have the courage to do that and what you stand for and don't stand for, and I always like to say this to people that are, as we're finding ourselves, especially young people, it's harder to say, oh, who am I and what do I want to do? It's easier to go, well, let's define who I'm not and what I don't want to do and eliminate those people, places and things and habits that we have in our life that are not paying us back. Get rid of those and by sheer mathematics, you'll have more things in front of us that do feed us. And hey, we all got good wolves and bad wolves in us. It's our choice to which wolf we want to feed. I'm trying to do my best to feed the good wolf, knowing that the bad wolf's still hungry.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, speaking of the wolves, the Wolf of Wall Street. How fun was that role? I've got to ask this amazing role,

[Dave Portnoy]

Mr. Hannah, what can I bring for you on this glorious afternoon?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, actor, here's the game plan. You're gonna bring us two absolute martinis. You know how I like them. Straight up. And then precisely seven and one half minutes after that, you're gonna bring us two more, then two more after that every five minutes until one of us passes the fuck out. Excellent strategy, sir. I'm good with water for now, though. Thank you. It's his first day on Wall Street. Give him time. First time to work with Scorsese, first time to work with Leonardo. I'm getting called in for a day's work. I'm a little nervous. I get there, really. But this character. Oh, yeah, I always, I still get nervous no matter what I'm doing. I get nervous every single day at work. Just the right amount. I want, I want. I don't want to lose the butterflies yet. And I go in and one of the things I do, not only on that show, but on all shows, is before I'll do a scene, I'll. I'll start banging my chest and find some sort of tune and I'll hum it out and everything. And it's to relax myself. I'll do it before interviews sometimes relax stuff get out of my head, find the rhythm and then come into the scene. Well, I was doing that before the scene with Leonardo and Wolf of Wall street, but then soon as we action, I'd stop and we do the scene. We do the scene four times. Got it. Funny. Perfect. Let's move on. Marty says, let's move on. It was Leonardo's idea. Leonardo raises hand, he goes, hang on a second. He goes, what's that thing you're doing before every take? And I told him what I just told you to relax and get my V down, everything. He goes, what if you did that in, in the scene? I was like, great. And the next take is the one you see in the movie.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, no way. Oh, that's amaz. That's amazing. Well, that's a great thing about you. You truly do have range. I mean, like, it's not, it's not every guy who can do both the how to lose a guy in 10 days, that scene in Wolf of Wall Street, Dallas Buyers Club, and True Detective. Right? And speaking of True Detective, I gotta ask, who is your best friend in Hollywood and why is it Woody Harrelson?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Woody has been a great friend of mine for a long time. I mean, any seems like a great guy. I get, I get younger. Anybody who spent time with Woody, he's one of the last wild men. A perpetual eight year old has no context of time. And I mean, he can frustrate the heck out of you, but if he may show up three days late, he may show up barefoot three days late to your wedding. But you can't get mad at him because if you showed up a week late for his wedding, he don't care. So, so what do you always like to say? Hey, even if you're going to the Oscars, it's probably best to bring your bathing suit.

[Megyn Kelly]

I can't imagine, like, the cast of characters that has been in and out of your life. I wondered though, like, thinking about. Yes. Who do you hang out with? His friends? Anybody in Hollywood? Like, are you friends with the Hollywood people or no, you're friends with the Texas people?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, I'm friends. I've got some. I've made some very good friends in Hollywood, I mean, but also some friends that I'm still friends with. People that I was friends with in college. I've made. I'm still friends with. My buddy Cole Hauser was just in town. He and I met on Days Confused. He's having a great time now, career wise with his role as Rip and Yellowstone. We're developing a project together. I still talk to Rory Cochran, who I met on Days Confused. And these are all friends of mine who are actors that I met in 1992. I've also met.

[Megyn Kelly]

Was also in Good Will Hunting, which is like, yeah, crazy that that was him.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, yeah. Young Cole Kenny, this red with the short red fro. So I made friends along the way and met some wonderful people in the. In Hollywood as well. That.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. But here's. Here's where I wanted to take it. Is there anyone in Hollywood who you really admire, like, whose values you admire? I'm sure you admire. Admire the work of many people, but, like, is there somebody who's living in a way that you think, yeah, that's. Hashtag goals right there.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, I always looked up to the way Paul Newman led his life as a talented actor on screen. Married to Joanne all that time, the only marriage throughout the way, he was able to be completely in the spotlight but also live his own life. I always admired that.

[Megyn Kelly]

And like you also then gave a bunch of time and money to charity. Like, didn't just rest on his laurels. Okay. Gave over a hundred million dollars to charity thanks to.

[Matthew McConaughey]

How about that? And made that. That was a part of his. His, his life that was on his proverbial desk every Monday morning in his life. He made that a part of his life and that was his choice. You know, people always go, yeah, but you've succeeded. You have the responsibility. I don't. I don't. I think that's an easy place to go. Don't go to responsibility. If you got the chance, you have the choice and the ability. But choices give us a lot more ownership than saying, oh, it's his responsibility. I ought to do it. But he did. He did. So I've looked up to his life. You know, I learned something, though, from some people, and I won't say their names. They were elder men in the business. And this is when we first had Camilla and I first had children. And I said to them, they had children. And I said to them, hey, you know, you go on the road, you go on set for three months, five months, whatever, do you. Do you take your family and your kids with you? And they said this version of this, look, it's either their friends or their dad. And all of them that I talked to said they chose to let their kids stay back and have their lives in their schools and have be with their friends and not come to work with that. And all of them said, if I could do it again, I'd have made them come with and choose to be with dad. And so when Camilla and I had kids before she pulled the goalie, she said, if we're going to do this, one condition. You go, we go. And so it's been a real privilege for me as a father and a husband and the head of the family that anytime I go to work, the family comes with. And that's been a major sacrifice for Camilla, but one that she would openly say reaps more rewards than it does deficits. Yeah, and it is getting harder now, and you're seeing this with your kids getting older. It's getting harder because they're older. They have social sort of circles and rhythms and teams. They're apart, and I don't know what I'm going to do the next time. You know, this last one, I just did what I could to get it to shoot in my hometown of Austin because I didn't want to take them away.

[Megyn Kelly]

More of the kids, more of the kids need to go into the next

[Matthew McConaughey]

movie, pass more the kids and shoot more down the road. You're more than just one thing. You're the boss.

[Megyn Kelly]

Hey, Google, what time is my meeting with Tim today? The athlete that class wrecks me. The ringleader.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And we're good and always their mom.

[Megyn Kelly]

Everyone in the all new Mazda CX5 more to move every side of you. Learn more@mazda USA.com Google is a trademark of Google LLC. Sequences shortened and simulated. It's my first day of work and I need to make a big impression

[Dave Portnoy]

from executive producer Mindy Kaling.

[Megyn Kelly]

This is our sexual harassment training. Hands off your co workers.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Now sign this saying that I trained you or you're fired.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, ma'. Am. Work relationships are too messy.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I just met the woman of my dreams. You gotta chill out and not come on too strong. That goes against my entire personality, but I'll try.

[Dave Portnoy]

Watch the new Hulu original series not suitable for work, premiering June 2 on Hulu and Hulu on Disney for bundle subscribers. Terms apply.

[Megyn Kelly]

The other thing is, as they get more into the teenage years, the friends do become more important. And I was told by a very smart guy, do not. Do not, Dr. Leonard Sacks. Do not bring kids. Friends on family vacations. The family vacations, the family outings are for you. For you five, not for you five plus their three friends. If you bring the friend, your kid's gonna be talking to the friend at dinner and at breakfast and at lunch, and, like, that's your time. It's, like, to buy. But now, as they get older and the friends. But I'm gonna. I'm gonna hold to it, and I. You should hold to it, too. Like, that's the time for bonding.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Working on it. We had this. We had this last night. Look, it was first day of NFL football Sunday, and Austin fc, our local soccer team that I'm part owner and was playing. It was getting close to time, go to bed and then wanted to eat dinner. And it was like, oh, let's keep the game on. And we said, no, let's turn that off. As soon as we turned it off, you could tell that wasn't like anyone was missing out that much. But all of a sudden, we had an hour and a half where it was just us, the five of us. And we caught up on everyone on the last week, and everyone started swapping stories about this week and boys and girls in school, and it wouldn't happen unless we turn that tube off.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yep, we had a blackout on Saturday here, where we live. It was like a weird storm that came through. It was like a monsoon that just came and parked over our neighborhood. And it was great because, well, what happened was all the power went out, and I said, oh, my God, wait a minute. We got a generator. We're good. And the generator kicked in. I was like, this is amazing. What a luxury. And then the generator died. That's this one job. It's your one. Yeah, but I mean, like, it's like being an actor. Like, you're the understudy on a Broadway show, and the star's out. This is your big chance. And you're like, I can't do it. That's what happened to my generator. Anyway, we sat, we wound up playing a Trivial Pursuit with the kids. It was so fun, you know, it's like you don't, you don't do that that often anymore. It was like such a good time.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You know what I hear? Have you heard this? I don't know what you do with your kids in social media and we don't. We've allowed Levi when he turned 15 to dabble on the grams and such. And the other kids? Not yet, but all their friends have it, the tick tocks and Instagrams, everything. But I've talked to them and their friends and I've said, so if you could choose, if socials were just not available to anyone, or it is as it is now, what would you choose? Every kid, even the ones that have the tick tock, say like, oh, if, if I have to be on it. But if it wasn't available, oh, I'd take that. Yep, very interesting. They're all saying, I mean, I have to, I feel like I have to be on it to stay socially current. But if it was an option for it not to be available, oh, please.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, look how we grew up. Look, I mean, like, look how we were in the 70s and the 80s. We didn't have any of that. Like, you ran around, your parents didn't know where you were, you spent your day with your friends, you had to come home when the streetlight went on. That was it. You didn't have to worry about. And bullying was like the old fashioned style. If it didn't happen while you're in school, it wasn't gonna happen. They couldn't get you at all hours of the day, you know, like on a little device that's in your pocket. It's very complicated for these kids, but I do think they get more sophisticated earlier and they're gonna need these skills at some point to navigate the future that's coming. You know, like AI and everything's online. It's like we're a bunch of dinosaurs, our generation.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I know I'm trying to navigate not being a dinosaur, but still holding on to the traditional things that will never go out of style, you know.

[Megyn Kelly]

But I'm thinking about like values, right? You're writing about values. And I don't think those are going

[Matthew McConaughey]

to go out of style, you know, I hope they don't. And I think we need to fight for them because I think they stand the test of time, of any weather and Then when I hear these AI sort of atheists say that, oh, AI doesn't need to be what's best for humanity. It's just the next link in evolution, and we'll create machines and a digital God that'll make us extinct. And that'll be great. I'm like, I'm not ready to go there yet either. No, sir. No, please.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, I mean, it's got to be scary as an actor. You know, Justine Bateman has come on the show talking about how dangerous it is to the whole acting industry that these roles. I mean, and even your voice could be repeated exactly by A.I. you know, I could be like, and Matthew McConaughey is the new voice of the Megyn Kelly Show. Here's Megan. And you'd have nothing to do with it, and it would be lawful.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yep. You know, I've been one of the earlier ones to trademark and patent my voice and likeness on a federal level, and we'll see where that holds up if and when it needs to. But it is. It is. It is something that is scary because we're not that far from someone being in India tonight and saying, well, I want Megyn Kelly and Matthew McConaughey here, and I want Megan from 2014. I want Matthew from Days Confused. And I wanted to be here at the party. And we're going to hologram them in right here. And they're. We're hosting it. We're not that far away from that. There's some wonderful things that you can do with it with speaking. I'm doing it with the. With the newsletter. Speaking, trading it in different languages, where I. My voice is sharing. It's my voice reading in Spanish and Portuguese and French, you know, that's very cool. So there's wonderful things to be done with it, but it is. We'll see. Yeah, we're gonna. We're gonna see if we can go on.

[Megyn Kelly]

I think you and I will see directly. I think we might have. We'll probably transition over to the other world with our dads.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You think we're on the other side of it?

[Megyn Kelly]

I do. I think so. I think it's me, our kids problems. So, like, we have to worry about it a little. But I think they're smart enough to handle it. I want to get to this.

[Matthew McConaughey]

What do you think?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, you go.

[Matthew McConaughey]

What do you think? If you. Your children forgetting what they're in, what they like right now. But if they were going to college, what degree do you think in a university do you think would prepare them for what's going to be most necessary in the job market later?

[Megyn Kelly]

No, nothing. There isn't one. There's nothing. I mean, really, frankly, they don't need to go to college. I want them to go to college to have fun. It's an additional four years where you can mature a little and have a good time and hone your social skills, which is important. But in my view, it's not about learning or preparing for life unless you're going to med school, where you actually do have to learn a few things. I just don't think that's what it's for. So I just say get a classic, you know, liberal arts education. Like all the sciences that are exploited like that, I feel like those are in serious danger thanks to AI. Like, math and science are being quickly taken over by the computers. So. Yeah. So I almost feel like the dreamers are becoming more and more important. So don't do anything to kill your spirit. Don't. Don't overwhelm yourself with, like, too much dogma from anybody in particular and keep your hope alive. That's what you're going to need on the back end of those four years. But I think you can learn whatever you want to learn in college on the Internet. You can learn it from this conversation, from podcasts, whatever. So I don't know. I just don't think it's about that. I think it's about, like, maintaining your integrity. Learn how to be a good person. Don't be just an SAT score. Learn the skills that'll make you an actual leader who can make good decisions in tough situations no matter what they are. As opposed to, like, this formula or that. That's. That's how I look at it.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You might be right. I like. I like your point of view on it.

[Megyn Kelly]

And also who. Who the hell knows where it's going to go, so. So why waste too much time thinking about it? All right, now listen, I got to read this one. This is you on page 44 of Poems and Prayers, the latest book by Matthew McConaughey, which everybody should read. It's actually make a great present. In particular, I think this would be a very nice gift for somebody around Christmas time. You can buy it now. You can buy a couple copies. Here it is. Covet nothing but your superior self. Seek transformation over transaction, individuality over conformity. Recognize your inadequacies. Then make one step at a time in the right direction and endure. It will be harder than you think because your long road has no arrival until you die. I love this so much covet nothing but your superior self is exactly. I mean, you could read nothing other than that line on page 44 and you would be a better person if you could just remind yourself of that every morning. I always say this. This is actually from Dr. Phil, but it's a great saying. The only difference between you and someone you envy is you settled for less. So when you covet, when you feel envy, when you look at somebody's life and you say, ugh, I want it or I begrudge them for having it, it's exactly the wrong focus. It's a tell to you to focus back on what is it about me I'm unhappy with and how can I change it? That's exactly what you're saying there. Do you like. I don't. How do you teach that? Can you teach that?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, so, so much of our consumerism and all those social feeds that our kids are inundated with are all about comparison and not living up to and coveting something that someone else has because they're telling you it's the right way or more popular or what? I don't know. I think to teach that there's. It's all marked everyone's marketing all this stuff. Marketing's just. Can you read through and ask yourself, what do I really want? What do I. Who am I not to have a foundation again? I don't know if you can teach anyone out of it now, but can you have someone deal? Have you. Can you help children deal with the foundation of who they are so they're not getting schooled so they can use that tool and these tools to do the schooling plate?

[Megyn Kelly]

That's why you take the family with you, right?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Play. Play your game in that business. Don't, don't, don't, don't. Don't let that game become your business because then you're just going to get dizzy and it changes so quickly and you look back and all your friends you thought you had and everything you thought you could rely on is poof. It was fairy dust. So if you can sit there and go, okay, because I don't want to say don't ever go on social media. Oh, don't go on. AI no. You need to check this out. We got to educate ourselves here. But let's read through the BS here and see that the algorithm selling something to make some of this okay at your Be at your expense. Know that it's a game. Just know that to tell my. Try to. We try to tell our children that and so just to be aware that, no, that's not real. That's. That's commerce. There's an algorithm selling that and putting in front of you what it. What it thinks you want because of your traffic and your history of where you've already been. Just understand that that's happening. That's part of the game. You want to play it. Just be aware that that's the rules.

[Megyn Kelly]

Mm. So you have a good handle on these problems and societal ills. I can hear it. And the U of July of 2024 considered doing something about it in the form of possibly running for Texas governor. Didn't happen. Your team did not want me to get into politics, but I just wanted to finish with, who exactly did you vote for in the 2024 presidential election? And why? No, just kidding. Just kidding. But is politics potentially still part of your future, your story?

[Matthew McConaughey]

I don't know. Could be. It's something. Look, I've the last six years, been studying different categories of where I could be most useful. What leadership roles am I equipped for? Look, it's inherently not my language. I'm more of a poet philosopher, and I'm dealing with values here, which I believe and belief, which I believe are true progress above the political sphere of left and right battling. That's the space that I'm in. Now. I am aware that the issues matter, that politics and legislation all matters. So I have not canceled it out, but I've given it and still continue to give it some real consideration to measure myself. That's the right place where I can be the most useful. But I'm not going to bend my back to force myself in it. I will get in deep enough where if I'm in it, I'll look up and I won't be able to help it. It'll be. It'll. I'll just be there. I will be pulled in. But, you know, it's a very conscientious headspace to ask yourself. And I think it's something important. If we all ask it, what if I was the least leader of a state of a nation of war? It's a great question to ask ourselves because you. You call yourself on some of your. You go, what decision would I make? What are my own beliefs? And where do they transfer to what I would believe for the masses? Now, we all know in politics, they're not all doing what they believe, but they're doing. And I would not want to go be in anything where I would need to betray myself. And there's a lot of betrayal that comes with inherently in politics. And I work hard enough to try and get a good night's sleep trying to win the fair games and fair fights, which are already hard to win. And so for right now, I got my three kids, want to get them out of the house as healthy as possible and hopefully as much individuals as they are possible. And then when that opens up after me being on site, father that I am and try to be, I will be open to considering what my next avenues are.

[Megyn Kelly]

I love it. I've said about President Trump, you know, he's under a lot of pressure when it comes to his foreign policy decisions, in particular from different factions. And I've said repeatedly on the air on something like that, whether you're going to add to a war and the weaponry of it, whether you're going to start a war, whether you're going to push to, you know, end one, start one. He has to come to his own decision like that. Right. That is playing with people's lives. And he knows that whoever the president is, they deserve a wide berth in coming to their own decision about what to do. Because it's easy for you or me or anybody else sitting in their armchair to say this is how it should be. We're not actually going to be responsible for ending lives like the president in those calls.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Massively in those calls. Craig from wrong. Those are the President's sole calls. 4:00am by yourself in solitude calls, are they not?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, that's scary. Like that's the highest order. You better have your spiritual ducks in a row. And what may help you is this book, poems and prayers by Matthew McConaughey, which will rejigger your headspace around your life, what matters in it and what your daily approach to it should be. As you say, playing this long game that starring in your own movie that starred for a couple of us about 55 years ago. Not quite. I'm not quite there. Almost. I'm right behind you. It's been a pleasure. I wish you all the best with this, with the Lost Bus, the movie with your son and with all of it.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Thank you, Megyn Kelly. I sure enjoyed it.

[Megyn Kelly]

So good, so good, so good.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Everything you want for summer is at

[Megyn Kelly]

Nordstrom Rack stores now and up to 60% off.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Stock up and save on the brands

[Megyn Kelly]

you love like Vince, Sam, Edelman, Frame and Free People. Join the NordicLub to unlock exclusive discounts.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Shop new arrivals first and more.

[Megyn Kelly]

Plus, buy online and pick up at

[Matthew McConaughey]

your favorite Rack store for free. Great brands, great prices.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's why you rack it's my first day of work and I need to

[Dave Portnoy]

make a big impression from executive producer Mindy Kaling.

[Megyn Kelly]

This is our sexual harassment training. Hands off your co workers.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Now sign this saying that I trained

[Megyn Kelly]

you or you're fired. Yes, ma'. Am. Work relationships are too messy.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I just met the woman of my dreams.

[Dave Portnoy]

You gotta chill out and not come on too strong.

[Matthew McConaughey]

That goes against my entire personality, but I'll try.

[Dave Portnoy]

Watch the new Hulu original series not suitable for work, premiering June 2 on Hulu and Hulu on Disney for bundle subscribers. Terms apply.

[Megyn Kelly]

Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to the Megyn Kelly Show. Just back now from Washington D.C. literally just an hour ago, got back where I interviewed Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard late yesterday. You can find that interview on YouTube.comMeganKelly and our podcast feeds right now. They posted this morning and there's a lot to unpack from that interview. She made a ton of news. Plus there are reports today, broken initially by our pal and now part of the MK Podcast Media network, Mark Halperin, that National Security Advisor Mike Walz is out, that he's being forced out of the Trump administration. We will break it down for you, but today I am here live in New York City at the Sirius XM hq, the worldwide hq, where we have an incredible show for you with Barstool Sports founder Dave Portnoy. Cannot wait to spend two hours with Dave. We've got to talk about Bill belichick and his 24 year old hostage taker. I mean, girlfriend. But most important of all, and even Dave hasn't seen this yet, we have the latest trailer for our own worldwide premiere tomorrow of our new film Blonde, not to be confused with Blue Origin, Blonde Origin. It debuts tomorrow right here on the Megyn Kelly Show. Here's our latest trailer.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Liftoff. When zero gravity resulted in zero clue.

[Dave Portnoy]

Have you been?

[Megyn Kelly]

Have you been?

[Dave Portnoy]

Three women were brave enough to answer the call tomorrow. Special coverage of the launch of Blonde

[Megyn Kelly]

Origin tomorrow on the Megan Kelly Show. How far will we go for a troll tomorrow? Don't call it a ride. Are going to get to all this now with Dave Portnoy. Very far is how is the answer.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, very far.

[Megyn Kelly]

Clearly very far to. To the moon and back. Some might say where was that?

[Dave Portnoy]

And like obviously zero gravity chamber of some sort.

[Megyn Kelly]

You'll have to tune in tomorrow. I can't talk to you unless you've been.

[Dave Portnoy]

Have you been to where? The moon?

[Megyn Kelly]

Just to the special places I've been.

[Dave Portnoy]

No, I haven't been there. I haven't been any of those.

[Megyn Kelly]

Then we can't discuss it. I'm going to have to go back to Gail.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Fine.

[Megyn Kelly]

She's the only one who understands me.

[Dave Portnoy]

Okay. Fair.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. There's so much happening right now. Let's talk with about Mike Walsh because while the average audience member might not think Dave Portnoy is the perfect person to discuss this news with, they are wrong because you actually called for his ouster.

[Dave Portnoy]

I said somebody had to go. Yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. After the signal gate controversy broke.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, signal gate was crazy to me. Still crazy to me. Then there was follow up that there was more to single gate gate with Hesketh.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Right.

[Dave Portnoy]

Hex.

[Megyn Kelly]

Hexeth.

[Dave Portnoy]

Right. With like telling his wife and somebody what is it someone else.

[Megyn Kelly]

His personal lawyer and reportedly many others.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So I mean to me that's nuts. The single stuff is nuts. I don't know if that's why he's getting pushed out. Seems pretty late like in the game and like single gate to me sort of passed.

[Megyn Kelly]

But is that the point that didn't

[Dave Portnoy]

draw as much attention? No, I don't think that's how true. Well, I never know how Trump thinks

[Megyn Kelly]

because here's the thing, he doesn't like giving the media a scalp. Right.

[Dave Portnoy]

Like credit for anything.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

But it also depends on how you look at his mind frame which I don't know anybody else will it also if he did it almost instantly it could be viewed as aha. We have, we have accountability here and there was a mistake made and I rectified it instantly. So do you think. I don't know. Do you think it is.

[Megyn Kelly]

That doesn't sound like Trump.

[Dave Portnoy]

Do you think it's directly then single gate?

[Megyn Kelly]

I don't know. I, I think it's probably and this is complete speculation, I do not have any inside on this but I think it's probably he's too Neo Connie and the, the strong strain within MAGA right now is the more they call them the restrainers.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

The ones who are not hawks. They don't want us rushing into war with Iran. We had a long talk with Tucker Carlson about this the other day. Not involving Mike Walz, but Mike Walz has got a long history in the Congress which made him some people's darling and some people's foil on this front. He was always more Neo Connie and he's got a very important post and there was a report in the New York Times about a month ago saying Tulsi JD, Pete Hegseth and Susie Wiles Chief of staff for Trump stopped him from getting on board that train as it was pummeling toward war with Iran on behalf of or in connection with Israel. So who was on the other side? Who were the administration officials saying, let's do this. What Netanyahu wants, like, back them in bombing Iran or give them the bombs or we'll do the bombs. The realistic truth was we were going to have to participate very meaningfully in that bombing campaign. We would have been at war with Iran. So it would have been an enormous thing to do. And I do wonder whether that played some role.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So like 99% of that, to be frank, it went right over my head. Like, I may have, like, been glazed over. The thing I know about single gate. Yeah. Like, I didn't even know. Like, I knew he was. But the signal gate's the one that caught my attention again. I think it's a delayed response. So I. Your scenario of what you just laid out could make more sense. I'm probably the wrong guy to be like, yeah, all right, that's it.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's possible.

[Dave Portnoy]

The signal gate to me was just, you can't. You can't have people do. Using signal and basically sending, you know, war plans to reporters or their wife or any of that. So to me, that was a fireable offense.

[Megyn Kelly]

So the signal gate, it may have played a role. We don't know. I mean, here's what Mark Halperin said.

[Dave Portnoy]

When did this happen, by the way?

[Megyn Kelly]

Just now. It's happening right now.

[Dave Portnoy]

Like, as I came in here.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, you didn't miss it. So Mark Halperin is part of our new MK Media Network, which I'd love to ask you about because you run a very successful media network. And he had his first show on Tuesday and his second show is today. He also does a show on YouTube called Two Way, and he broke this news earlier today. Here's some of it with some more context, I believe.

[Dave Portnoy]

Sat 7 Three different peoples have confirmed that the plan now by the White House is to remove the national Security Advisor, Mike Waltz, who was on Fox News this morning just not that long ago, and his deputy Alex Wong, and much of the member current staff team at the National Security Council because of unhappiness throughout the national security establishment of how they're doing. This was around before Signal Gate. It was widely reported that Signal Gate

[Matthew McConaughey]

ironically may have saved Waltz's job.

[Dave Portnoy]

As I understand it from my sources, a general belief that it's not being run efficiently in an organized way. It may happen as early as Today, it may not happen ever, because it's Donald Trump, but the plan is for

[Matthew McConaughey]

it to happen soon. Maybe. Maybe this weekend.

[Megyn Kelly]

So it's very interesting. He's saying they wanted to dump him before signal gate, but Trump didn't dump him after that because he didn't want to look like he was being reactive to the NASA.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, he'd be reactive. I feel like if he's not, who knows? I mean, I could see this still not happening. I feel like I see reports of things happening that never does, and then they'll jump on and be like, shame on you media for reporting this. So who knows? I looked. I just looked at X. It's the number one thing. Yeah. Shocking, I guess, but I'll believe it when I see it. Tim Waltz, number one thing.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, we're definitely getting.

[Dave Portnoy]

Mike Waltz has left the chat.

[Megyn Kelly]

Is. Is he your. Is he your man speaker? Who? Tim Walls?

[Dave Portnoy]

Do I. No, he is not.

[Matthew McConaughey]

He's.

[Megyn Kelly]

What do you mean?

[Dave Portnoy]

What do you mean, my man speaker?

[Megyn Kelly]

You know how he said he came out yesterday and said he was the man that Kamala selected to speak to guys like you white men?

[Dave Portnoy]

That's crazy. I didn't see that. But no, he, He. He failed miserably in that, in that realm.

[Megyn Kelly]

You didn't connect with him in that way.

[Dave Portnoy]

Nobody connected with him. Nobody did.

[Megyn Kelly]

Here's what he said. Let's watch it, though. We'll go from Mike. I believe he's still talking to Tim Walls here. Let's watch.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I was on the ticket, I would

[Dave Portnoy]

argue, because we did a lot of

[Matthew McConaughey]

amazing progressive things in Minnesota to improve people's lives.

[Dave Portnoy]

But I also was on the ticket,

[Matthew McConaughey]

quite honestly, you know, because I, I could code talk to white guys watching football, fixing their truck, doing that.

[Dave Portnoy]

That I could put them at ease. I was the permission structure to say,

[Matthew McConaughey]

look, you can do this and vote for this, and. And you look across those swing states, with the exception of Minnesota, we didn't get enough of those votes.

[Megyn Kelly]

But you could be giving them permission on TV every day. You could have been messaging that way. And that isn't necessarily how it shook out.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, yes, but I also said, I understand.

[Dave Portnoy]

Understand myself.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I, I said, I think I'll give you pretty good stuff, but I'll also give you 10% problematic. And so somebody's got to make the

[Dave Portnoy]

decision here to handle some of this

[Matthew McConaughey]

stuff and to make it in. Those are just decisions that were made.

[Dave Portnoy]

Oh, that's delusional. I mean, that's wildly delusional. I even thought that I Mean, I knew he had the, the football thing, but he doesn't speak to a normal guy, he doesn't act like a normal guy. His mannerisms weren't like everyday guy. There was no part of him that connected to what a normal guy is talking about or interested in. And by the way, normal guys can see through that pretty quickly when you're

[Megyn Kelly]

trying to play the normal guy.

[Dave Portnoy]

I mean I, I remember hearing that he was like a football coach, but even that was a strange coach. The, the story behind it. So it didn't really work out. And that, that anybody by the way with a brain could have screened him for five seconds, been like, this is the guy that would, I don't know who they have in the party by the way, that would have done that, but you could have screened him and anybody could have said that right away. But that is one of the problem with the Democrats.

[Megyn Kelly]

They're going to like the buttigieg of the world to say is this a man that regular American men can relate to? And he's like, yes, that's our guy.

[Dave Portnoy]

I'm trying to think who on the Democratic side I would be like, yeah, that's the guy that resonates.

[Megyn Kelly]

I mean there's gotta be something. You could run it by a man like James Carville. He's got the ability to say, yeah, that's not going to resonate with middle America.

[Dave Portnoy]

The old Massachusetts Governor Baker, he was, he was a pretty normal guy, normally went to the ncaa. But I would say he, he was a normal speak to guy.

[Megyn Kelly]

So you don't think the jazz hands is like.

[Dave Portnoy]

Jazz hands is not the thing. I mean he had a lot of things go. He was one of the worst candidates. The whole ticket was bad. Yeah, that's why they lost. But yeah, that, that is. And that's not even a political thing. That's just if you, if you asked, if you just pulled a group of guys out of a bar and we're like, is this, are you going to be friends with that guy? Most would probably be like, no, we're not. So. And that is again has nothing to do with politics. It, the vibe he gave off.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. Well, on top of all that, what does it say about the Democratic Party that they thought the guy who would speak to white guys in America is the guy who mandated tampons in boys rooms throughout Minnesota?

[Dave Portnoy]

They're off. The Democratic Party is, is lost. So I don't know. It's interesting because I never, I didn't even know that they were trying to speak to People like, I guess me or our crowd, if you want to say that's like who Trump spoke with. I didn't even know they were attempting to do that during the election. That didn't seem like something they were interested in. So I didn't know he. That was why he was brought on to do that.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, don't remember. He put on the camo hat and he did some video where he was gaming and apparently he stunk at it. But he went out with a gun and was going to go hunting and it was very obvious to all second amendment people he was not familiar with a gun. He couldn't load it.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, I remember the one when I thought it was Kamala. They asked her what kind of gun she had and she didn't answer correctly. But that's very Politics 101. That's. I mean, all the way back the mayor of Boston was kind of like Sammy Sousa and all the wrong names.

[Megyn Kelly]

Even I know that one.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, they pretend to play a character that they're not, which I don't know who gives them that intel. I think people would much more respect if you don't pretend to be something you are not.

[Megyn Kelly]

All right, but. But that's politics. So let's say they come to Dave Portnoy next time around and they are like, how do we reach regular guys and convince them to vote Dem?

[Dave Portnoy]

I mean you, you can't demonize them. I would say like they're. And they've been doing it for a long time. But if you're saying men. And when people are asking me that, I think they generally are talking like white middle class people working in financial districts. There's a shame that that comes across of saying you aren't a frat. And by the way, not all frats are good. But wanting to make money, want to have a good job, wanting to spend money, be rich, all that stuff is not necessarily bad. I think that has been a message that comes like, yeah, we should be kind of ashamed of being a white guy. That doesn't. That I don't think what they fail to understand that doesn't discount that a white guy like me or any can care about a lot of the issues that Democrats care about. But I'm also not really going to apologize for being like a white guy in this country who wants to have a good job, make money, go to college, do all those things. And that is a message that seemingly like you can't be both. They've never like, I mean, Biden all the way through it Felt like a lot of the issues that get blamed and problems. America is always like, our fault.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

And we don't want.

[Megyn Kelly]

Remember, even when the black vote wasn't going as strongly for Kamala as the Dems wanted, and Barack Obama showed up at that polling, that campaign office and was like, you're a bunch of sexists.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, right.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well. And they've said it, the deplorables. And yeah, like, you know, there, if you vote for Trump, there's, you're a Nazi and things like that. I don't know if that's exact. But things.

[Megyn Kelly]

No, that's literally what's been said on people like Don.

[Dave Portnoy]

And then it's like, well, you know, that's. You're talking about more than half the country. It's clearly. Then you should move if you truly believe that. And that's the messaging that we've gotten from them. And somebody like me, who I'm always in a weird box because I don't consider myself political, but I'm talking about more and more. Like, I could easily take out the candidates. I grew up in a Democratic household. My father, I've said a million times, hates Trump. I am somebody who you would think would vote Democrat. But as I got older, especially, like running business and doing stuff, they just kept pushing me, pushing me, pushing me to the point. This election, it wasn't like I wasn't wavering who I was going to vote for. I was voting for Trump. And even I would still revote for Trump, no questions asked. That's how much I hated the other ticket.

[Megyn Kelly]

You may not want to see this, but Kamala Harris is also back in the news. And you tell me whether we dodged a bullet with this woman where she took to the stage last night at this group that's pushing to get more females involved in Democrat politics running for office. And here's how she sounded.

[Dave Portnoy]

I heard about this.

[Megyn Kelly]

Watch it. In fact, please allow me friends to digress for a moment. Okay. It's kind of dark in here, but I messed with show of hands. Who saw that video from a couple of weeks ago, the one of the elephants at the San Diego Zoo during the. The earthquake. Google it if you've not seen it.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, yeah, this is.

[Matthew McConaughey]

So that scene has been on my mind.

[Megyn Kelly]

Everybody's asking me what you've been thinking about these days. Well,

[Matthew McConaughey]

yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

So in the video for those who here those elephants were. And as soon as they felt the earth shaking beneath their feet, they got in a circle and stood next to each other to protect the most Vulnerable.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Think about it.

[Megyn Kelly]

What a powerful metaphor. The lesson is don't. Don't scatter. The instinct has. Has to be to immediately find and connect with each other and to know that the circle will be strong. Oh, my God.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, yeah, that was a lot more of her campaign speak in which he's saying a whole lot of. Lot of something but really not saying anything. And also the moral superiority which even in that comes through is another. Like the way they lecture and they're. I don't like politicians in general. Like, I think probably if you had 100 politicians a room, maybe like two are like truly in it for the right reasons. But the moral superiority, when. When, like what they did in the election, which. The way they all lied about Biden, his mental health for. For years and then they waited. So there's no. Like, she would never win and. Well, she's never won election, but she would never win a fair primary with the Dem. That to me was their biggest mistake because who knows who could have come out of that?

[Matthew McConaughey]

But it.

[Dave Portnoy]

Lecturing people like they're. They're angels. Like they're perfect. They know. They know better than anybody, like, what's best for you. And that we're stupid because we see what the Democratic Party does and that's. It's just such a turnoff. And say whatever you want about Trump and people may say other. I. I feel like he's him and like, even with these tariffs and stuff. Like, he campaigned on tariffs.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, he was.

[Dave Portnoy]

So then to be like, what are you doing with these tariffs? And I'm like that because I'm in the stock markets, like, I want my stocks to go up. But it's like he said he was gonna do it at least. So they're just. If you did authentic and took the Democrats and the Republicans. To me, it's not even close. And that's part of how I end up voting Republican.

[Megyn Kelly]

She's so annoying in her mannerisms, with her little hands in tight. And the. She starts giggling at her own thought. What she's saying is not even purportedly funny. There's nothing at all funny. There's no joke coming. She's just giggling at her own little aside.

[Dave Portnoy]

She's not a great public speaker.

[Megyn Kelly]

Only time it gets funny is when she lands her point and you realize there's nothing there.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

And she's built it up like this huge profundity only to let us down once again.

[Dave Portnoy]

I don't even know what she's doing. What she. Is she running for what? The governor Of California.

[Megyn Kelly]

We don't know. She's weighing either that or another presidential.

[Dave Portnoy]

That's crazy. They'd never do that. I don't. Well, I'd never say never.

[Megyn Kelly]

I've been a very good person this year. It's possible Lord. The Lord will give this to me.

[Dave Portnoy]

Maybe. Maybe. Well, there's aoc. Aren't they saying her?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. I just think that, like, the party still loves her.

[Dave Portnoy]

They have no chance to win if she wins.

[Megyn Kelly]

I completely agree, but there are some people out there. Oh, my gosh. I don't know if I'm gonna be able to find it, but there are people out there talking about her right now, like, behind the scenes, off record. They don't wanna put their name to it, about how, you know, she's really formidable. Like, the party really needs to hear. They have a hankering to hear from her. Hold on a second. I have. Here.

[Dave Portnoy]

They use hankerin.

[Megyn Kelly]

No, they say here. It is clamoring. There is a clamoring for her voice right now. Said a former Harris senior advisor. Meanwhile, I'm like, is he named Pug Klemhoff? Like, don't. This is clearly, like, her husband or somebody very close to her. And they say because they were granted anonymity to speak candidly. Candidly, meaning really falsely quote. No one can better prosecute the case while inspiring a call to action than the former vice president.

[Dave Portnoy]

I mean, we already. We already went down that road. Are they just saying she didn't have enough time or something? And you can't get over the fact she knew that Biden wasn't fit to be president, just lied about it. I mean, you can't get.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I don't know.

[Dave Portnoy]

It would be crazy. But they're already nuts to me. We're already who they put forward.

[Megyn Kelly]

We're already in crazy town.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, do it again would be insane. I mean, that's the exact opposite of what we were just discussing. Like, how do they get, you know, the typical male vote? I mean, that's the opposite. That's not going to do it.

[Megyn Kelly]

So I mentioned the top that I sat down with Tulsi Gabbard last night, and we had a bunch of discussions that were really interesting. I thought. And

[Dave Portnoy]

it's quite the move going from

[Megyn Kelly]

her to me and then Blonde Origin. I mean, it's been that kind of a week, Dave. But here's one thing I want to pick up on that. We started the show off with, like, this push to get us into another war with Iran by these forces behind the scenes. And I'M not blaming that on Mike Wallace. That was just speculation on my point, that maybe some perceive him as on that side. But she did speak to. Because she's anti all that. That's one of the reasons Trump chose her. And I was asking her, like, do you feel it? Do you feel like people pushing you towards, you know, all. All things military, all things war? And here's what she said in sought to. There was a New York Times article within the past month saying you, he, J.D. vance and his chief of staff, Susie Wiles, were all together in urging him to not go too far on our actions against Iran. And President Trump did not do it. He did not give Netanyahu the answer he wanted. I know you're not going to get into the specifics of what you advise the president, but can you, can you explain your view of the dangers of barreling toward a potential conflict with Iran? Yeah, the, the New York Times article was a result of an unfortunate, unauthorized and illegal leak of a very private conversation between the President and his advisors. I won't get into the details, but it was a very robust discussion that really speaks to President Trump's care and thoughtfulness as he makes his decisions. Do you feel the push, Tulsi, the push of this, like, strong neocon strain that's still within the Republican Party and probably in this agent, these agencies that's much more hawkish on an issue including war in the Middle east, which we've just done for 20 years. Yeah, of course, the pressure's there. The leaks have to end. If the President can't have the confidence that he can sit in a room with his closest advisors without it leaking to the public, then that that is something that really undermines his being best served. So she's talking about Dave, how they sat there, she basically confirming in a private meeting with just the president, with those officials I name, with the Vice president, with the Director of National Intelligence, with the Secretary of Defense and his Chief of staff. And what she's saying, without being explicit about it, is then she believes none of them leaked, but then they have to talk to their staffs about what happened and what needs to happen. And at that top, top level, someone's leaking to the New York Times. And in saying, how are they supposed to function like this?

[Dave Portnoy]

You gotta start planting fake stories.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, right.

[Dave Portnoy]

You gotta do that and weed it out. I mean, that would drive me insane anyway. That would drive anybody, regardless of, of whether it's the President. United States, obviously, different table stakes, but any CEO, any leader, you can't have that.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, I like that idea.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, you got to do that.

[Megyn Kelly]

They do that in some. Like, what. What movie did they do that in? Where they plant, like, a face, a fake piece of gossip and see who bites.

[Dave Portnoy]

Narrow it down.

[Megyn Kelly]

Right.

[Dave Portnoy]

You would narrow it down.

[Megyn Kelly]

Something juicy that they go with.

[Dave Portnoy]

Just do it one with each of those departments, if that's where they think it came from.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. I hope they're watching. I'm going to make sure they see this.

[Dave Portnoy]

Got to do it.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's a very good idea.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

Because it's happening to Tulsi, it's happening to Trump, it's obviously happening to Hegsack Death, where, like, bit by bit, they're undermining the whole administration with these leaks. And like.

[Dave Portnoy]

Or maybe he's just sending it on his Signal chat.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, right, right.

[Dave Portnoy]

That also opens it. She said back and be like, well, you guys are idiots and you're. You're texting reporters by accident.

[Megyn Kelly]

She also told me that the Biden administration used Signal, and she said, without naming them, she said some of the very exact officials who are dumping on us for being on a Signal chat. She was one of the ones use Signal, and she has proof of it.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, that's the most unsurprising like, comment ever. I mean, they could have sent it to that same reporter in the Atlantic and he wouldn't have said anything.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's right.

[Dave Portnoy]

But you very much don't want to send it to somebody, you know, openly hates your guts.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

So.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, then you're gonna have to live with.

[Dave Portnoy]

You're telling me it's. They're. They're being hypocrites. That's not surprising to me at all.

[Megyn Kelly]

Not surprising at all. Here she is, a little bit more on these leaks coming. Me, too. Here's sat there. You've referred three people now to DOJ for criminal prosecution. Do you think they will be prosecuted? That's the goal. That's the goal. The only way we think about accountability is by doing the work of conducting these investigations. The Department of Justice and the FBI obviously have different tools that they can use in order to find the truth and. And to seek out that evidence so that we can actually prosecute these crimes. Do the people know they've been referred? Like, do they still work? In some cases, they know. In other cases, they are likely not aware. I mean, that's kind of badass, frankly, because what she's doing is she's not telling everybody that she, like, I know it was you, Fredo. She's letting Fredo just continue.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. Try to scare him.

[Megyn Kelly]

And then the next call they get is gonna be from somebody saying, the DOJ is here or the FBI is here to arrest you. They did it differently over at the Department of Defense, where Pete or his team, his investigators, investigated these leaks and then fired three guys who immediately went to the media, including yours truly, to say we're not the leakers.

[Dave Portnoy]

Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

None has been arrested. We don't know whether they will be arrested. They all deny they did it. I have to say, as between the two, this is probably the better course, because it's like they're not twisting in the wind as leakers who can speak out about it. They're in cuffs by the time we learn their names.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. I mean, it can't be obvious. Obviously, it's a major crime at that level to be leaking information. It's also the last thing they should be worrying, like, they're running the government. That's the thing to be worrying about. Internal leaks. Seems like there should be a better use of time. But you can't ignore it.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's the thing. It's so undermining. All right, one other point on Tulsi. Where were you on, like, the COVID lockdowns and the overreach by Fauci and all that stuff?

[Dave Portnoy]

So I was very much on the side of, you gotta let small businesses decide whether they want to stay open or not. Like, we're all kind of adults here, and if you want to be open. So I hated the lockdowns. We started a gigantic, like, fund for companies that were shut down. We raised, like, $50 million.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's right. We covered that, actually.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So we were very much trying to help small businesses who were basically going out of business through no fault of their own.

[Megyn Kelly]

What do you think of Fauci?

[Matthew McConaughey]

He.

[Dave Portnoy]

I mean, you. I. I see all the stuff that says he's a criminal, he should go to jail. He hit it. I haven't delved enough. I mean, I. My knee jerk reaction on the guy when I see him is I actually find him to be believable when he, like, he's speaking on camera. But you see all this stuff. So I wouldn't convict him without any hard evidence. You may be like, well, I have hard evidence, but I think the whole lockdown thing was handled horribly.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, I asked her about it. This is one of the first things we covered, and I think it was probably the biggest piece of news to come out of the interview. Well, let's watch the exchange, and then I'll Fill in the blanks. Here it is. We already know that EcoHealth alliance was partnering with this Wuhan lab to create, to do gain of function research. That's right. We just have never been able to have somebody say, and it was that exact experiment that led to this Covid bug. But have we gotten there? What's the new thing that you're digging in on? We are working on that with Jay Bhattacharya. I mean, that would be extraordinary because. Because just so the audience knows if that's true, if it was Peter Daszak's research with the Wuhan so called Bat lady that caused this pandemic, then we did fund it. Then Anthony Fauci helped fund the pandemic. Things that he denied over and over and over to Senator Rand Paul's questioning. That's right. Under oath. Under oath. Exactly. So it is. Is it any wonder that he sought a preemptive pardon for anything during a certain period of time by President Biden before he left office? That's the Director of National Intelligence clearly intimating that they're about to tie Anthony Fauci and this group EcoHealth alliance that he funded to the actual COVID virus.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. Which is insane. So then what is. It's a giant cover up there or. Yeah. So that's. That's crazy. That's.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's huge. That's a link we've never been able to close. We've been able to close. We funded EcoHealth Alliance. They partnered with the Wuhan lab. They did gain of function research on bat coronaviruses, but we've never been able to make the leap to. And it resulted in this coronavirus. And that's what she says she's intimating is about to come.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. It's crazy if that's, if that's true.

[Megyn Kelly]

He lied under oath repeatedly.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

And he needed that pardon.

[Dave Portnoy]

I mean, everybody got pardoned pretty much by Biden. Right. Like for the most part.

[Megyn Kelly]

But I mean, the fact that the guy running this huge piece of NIH was perjuring himself. Allegedly. We'll find out to the point where it wasn't just a courtesy pardon to prevent harassment. Like he actually may have committed felonies here.

[Matthew McConaughey]

It is huge.

[Dave Portnoy]

Like my. Yeah, it's crazy. Again, I was very anti lockdowns. I didn't like Fauci. I criticized Fauci. I maybe my gut, gut reaction whenever I see the guy isn't. He doesn't scream arch criminal to me, but maybe I'll be wrong. Like, does he give you those vibes 100. He does.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Dave Portnoy]

So he's a super villain to you?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes.

[Dave Portnoy]

Like he's the supervillain that you don't know is a supervillain until the end of the movie.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. I mean, in the middle of the movie, it became obvious, but yes, I, I hate him. With the passion of 10,000 sons, I. I think he's completed all this.

[Dave Portnoy]

He didn't intend. You're not saying he intentionally launched Covid. You're saying.

[Megyn Kelly]

No, I don't think he wants. And no one's suggesting that the intel community. No one's saying that.

[Dave Portnoy]

And then it happens. And then he's like, oh, crap, I gotta do this giant. And he's happens to be the, like the guy who's publicly speaking about it. So it's basically two different things. He launched it, created it. I shouldn't say launch created inadvertently, but he's also the guy who's going to be in charge of. Of controlling it. And then you got this. He's basically running interference to keep himself from being the guy the entire time.

[Megyn Kelly]

Bingo.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, it's. It's. It literally the sci Fi movie.

[Megyn Kelly]

And at the same time, we know from his internal emails that the House Republicans got at the time. Well, a couple years after the. The COVID mania, that he was actively working to smear doctors who were coming out saying, this thing looks like it came from a lab.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

We've never seen this particular virus before in nature. This looks lab made. And he was all over the, like, tamp that down. Get that out there. That's fringe. That's. He made sure that narrative couldn't live.

[Matthew McConaughey]

It would.

[Dave Portnoy]

It's. It's an insane full. Full. And maybe I'm just naive and thinking

[Megyn Kelly]

like, you still trust the officials.

[Dave Portnoy]

I, I don't trust a lot of officials. He just comes across as like a grandpa to me.

[Megyn Kelly]

You've got to spend some time with my husband, Doug, because I am terrible at judging character. I'm always like, see, I feel like I'm pretty good and my husband's really good and he's always on to people before I am. But even I saw it with Fauci.

[Dave Portnoy]

Was he onto.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. Yes. He knew he was bad. I don't know. I think some people just have a knack for this. I. I'm usually like, they're good. What do you mean?

[Dave Portnoy]

I mean, Trump didn't know.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. No, he was under Trump. Yeah. For the. For the beginning.

[Matthew McConaughey]

For the actual peak of getting along.

[Dave Portnoy]

Like, he's. He's doing A great job.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yep. I know that was one of Trump's failures. I mean, a lot of Republicans blame him for a vaccine that wound up hurting a lot of people, too. And Trump, Trump stands by the vaccine, but it's got some problems, there's no question.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, I didn't know that people blamed him for that. I mean, that the vaccine was a way to theoretically open up the country. They wouldn't open it up without that.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, that's what people who don't live in places like New York don't get is like, I lived in New York and this is going down, and it's like, you couldn't go anywhere.

[Dave Portnoy]

No, no. That's when I moved to Miami. Like, I. During the COVID I was in New York, moved to Miami. I basically stayed there.

[Megyn Kelly]

You were like a hostage in your own apartment if you didn't get the damn vaccine. Well, I regret it, though. I wish I had gotten one of the fake cards. That was such the obvious solution. I'm like a two. A goody two shoes. I don't know why I didn't do it.

[Dave Portnoy]

I was fake card city.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, well, you just did it yourself. Or like.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, I, I. Luckily I work at a media company. I. I still don't know. That's how afraid I am the one. I'm like, I never had it. But yeah, I just said, we have graphics team. So we just got a copy of the actual card and made fakes.

[Megyn Kelly]

You know, my doctor said to me at the time, I'm like, what do you want? Should I be worried about these MRNA vaccines? And he goes, would you take the MRNA vaccine if it could prevent pancreatic cancer? Because that's a future. Which was a. Don't be worried.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

And so I was like, oh, yeah, I trust my doctor, you know, So I did it, and I regret doing it.

[Dave Portnoy]

I wasn't so much worried. It's just like, I don't want to do it. I'll get the card. I was worried there was rumors at one point that they were going to start scanning the barcodes, in which case

[Megyn Kelly]

you would have been caught.

[Dave Portnoy]

Fake would have no longer worked. But, yeah, I was traveling and working in a lot of places you could put. But no one looked at it closely. It's like, very easy.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. On the subject of the Kamala Harris Soundbite, where she said, we've got to be like the elephants to protect the most. The most vulnerable.

[Dave Portnoy]

Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

The most vulnerable. The. The larger context of her remarks are about illegal immigration and what's being done right now to deport these alleged gang members. What's so insane is they are not the most vulnerable. We are the most vulnerable. In particular women and children who tend to be the victims of these gang members. People like Lake and Riley down in Georgia, like Jocelyn Ngaro, 12 year old down in Texas. We've seen the names in the media. Those are the most vulnerable. That's what Trump is trying to do to protect the innocent Americans that are the prey of these people who are being deported. And I did ask Tulsi about the screening that's being done because the Democrats would have you believe it's willy nilly right? It's like you've got brown skin and the wrong tattoo, you're out. And she explained that they are identifying these trenda, Aragua and Ms.13 and even Sinaloa cartel members, largely with the help of the DEA, which is up to its neck in gang information 501. They know who these guys are. They track them, they monitor them. All it needed was for somebody to call them up and say, say who are they? Right, and where are they? And figure out which ones are foreign, they're not all foreign, and which ones are American. And on top of that, they have lengthy FBI investigations of these people. So I thought that was interesting too, that it's, it is not just like, gee, you're brown, you're out. But there was news about their most famous poster boy, Abrego Garcia. Kilmar Abrego Garcia yesterday, you know, the one who Chris Van Holland had margaritas with. It turns out this guy, we knew that he had been accused of beating his wife, by his wife. Well, the. A second report came out of the same. More beatings in which she saw a protective order, not just as previously reported in 2021, but earlier in August of 2020, she moved for a protective order. Back then, the details reveal a fight they had with this woman, his wife, alleging that he took her phone, demanded her car keys before flying into a rage. She went upstairs to cook breakfast for the kids, but he shut off the stove, locked the children in their bedroom. They were crying. She got her phone from the car, called 91 1. He locked her out of the house. He smashed her phone. She checked the boxes for acts of abuse, including kicking, slapping, shoving. Mental injury of a child detaining against one's will. She could hear the babies crying as he locked them in. And he was after her. Me and my kids are afraid now. He kicked me, he pushed me, he slapped me in the face, he threatened me. I Have photos of all the bruises left in my body. Police came, he acted violent with them, broke my phone in front of them. I have a recording. He told my ex mother in law that even if he kills me, no one can do anything to him. In March of 2020, we now find out. She said he pushed me against the wall. He broke a phone, a TV and damaged the walls. November of 19th, he grabbed me by the hair in the car. December of 19, he grabbed me by the hair in the car. He dragged me out of the car, leaving me in the street. And then she rescinded the motion for the protective order as virtually all domestic violence y abuse victims do. And on top of that there's another document from 2018 where her ex. So this is Abrego Garcia's wife Now, but in 2018 his girlfriend Y she had an ex husband. His name is Edwin Treo Ramos. He's currently incarcerated in Maryland. So this is all a very nice crowd. But he at the time sought an emergency court hearing to get custody of his children with this woman saying she tried to kill herself. She left the kids with an 11 year old to take care of them. And I'm afraid of my kids lives being in danger because quote, she is dating a gang member who was at that time. We understand Abraco Garcia. So this is the poster boy, the most vulnerable. Kamala Harris might say, yeah, so in

[Dave Portnoy]

this case in particular, to me, in a weird way crystallizes some of like what I go through with like the politics because I actually get to a degree the Democrat now, not him. This is where I go on this. Like for the Democrats and the guy from Maryland to fly down and meet with him and then make this guy the poster child, which I think most intelligent people can be like, this is a bad guy. He's not a citizen. I have no problem. I want him out. That is what we want out of this country. It doesn't matter the color of your skin if you're not an American citizen and you have this, this rap in this track record and you've been deported. Yeah, like he had an order of removal.

[Megyn Kelly]

They just said just not to El Salvador now.

[Dave Portnoy]

So I agree with all that. So it it to me, when I saw the, the Maryland guy going to say, I'm like why? Why is this guy the guy you're going to take a stand for and fight for? Because we don't like he's a bad guy. But at the same time I can all that research, I can understand it. Even with something like this if you hit a thou, you gotta hit. You get about a thousand if you're gonna pick somebody and deport them. And if you just pick the wrong guy once with no due process, nothing. That's a major issue. Like you append somebody, I don't even care. You say they're an illegal but they're like a great person and they're actually contributing to me just picking them up, getting rid of them that I'd have a problem with that. So.

[Megyn Kelly]

But you want them to have a

[Dave Portnoy]

hearing something due process. So where is that the fact like they're. I'm not sympathizing with Democrats or the guy from Maryland because you're using the poster child of what Trump ran on and we want him out and he got a hearing.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, he got a hearing when we deported him the first time.

[Dave Portnoy]

But when you're doing it mass after you just can't ever make a mistake. So I understand that logic a little bit, just not with this guy.

[Megyn Kelly]

No, you're reflecting the view of most Americans according to the latest polls where they are in favor of Trump's plan. But they do want to see some

[Matthew McConaughey]

duplicates and it's hard.

[Dave Portnoy]

And how do you do that with so many people and without. So not one of the things about politics, it's not always the easiest thing to come up with like an answer because you got to run a country and it's backed up. So what would happen? But I do it. The Democrats constantly like okay, this is an issue. I sort of the logic behind it. But, but you're not being sincere when this is your poster child because take out politics, there's nobody. You see this story a lot. All right, you can do this. You can go meet with him. Do you want him to be your next door neighbor? Like do you want him to be your next door neighbor or do you want him out of the country? If that was it, you're either living next door or he's deported everybody.

[Megyn Kelly]

Do you want him on the trail when your 18 year old daughter goes for a run by herself?

[Dave Portnoy]

Exactly. And that is not that that's based on his rap sheet, nothing more in the gang stuff. So that's where they lose me because it's the, the find me a way to make sure we can get 100%. But that guy is 100% based on the, on, on the, the rap sheet and why this is where they put their flag in the, in the mud

[Megyn Kelly]

when the only dispute about this guy is the fact that he technically wasn't supposed to be deported to El Salvador, but he was ruled deportable.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

The only reason he wasn't deported is because we were lame. We didn't have the resources and we didn't do it. Which is the truth, because for 20 million illegals, the only controversial piece about this guy is that his order of removal said just not to El Salvador because he's claiming he'll get killed by gangs there. That's it. That's what they've thrown their lot behind. I do want to get to the larger issue, though. You're. You're right over the target. How Americans are struggling with. Well, what, what is required, because we know there was no due process when they came into the country for us.

[Dave Portnoy]

Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

When it comes to our rights to be safe and not have to. To put them on the public dole and pay for their lives and their health care and all this. However, here's the thing. They don't get the same due process as an American citizen would before we took away their liberty in any way, whether it's for trying to deport them for some reason or putting them through the criminal justice system. And what appears to be true in the immigration context, what is true is it's a much lower level of, quote, due process that they're entitled to. To. And what most people don't know, including Terry Moran, who is one of the lead anchors over at abc, and I'm going to show you the soundbite of him and Trump, is that in many cases, no due process is okay. None. It's under this thing called expedited removal.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

Which all presidents have used. Trump expanded expedited removal, and you don't get any hearing under it. It was used even under Biden to say at the border, okay, if there's, if you show up, we can just turn you around. We don't have to give a hearing.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

And the only reason, the only way you get a hearing is if you say, no, no, no, I'm an asylum seeker.

[Dave Portnoy]

Right.

[Megyn Kelly]

And that's true under Trump, too. But let me just show you Terry Moran, because who clearly has waded in to legal matters that he is not qualified to speak on because he tried understanding what I just explained to be the law. Watch him try to pin down Trump and Trump. I'm telling you, Trump is a clever mofo. Just when you think he's, like, focused on, like, the UFC and like his polls, he knows the nuances even of laws like this. Watch where he dodges on this attempt to pin him down. He knows about Expedited removal. He knows about the lower standard on due process, and he doesn't allow Terry Moran 1 inch. It's SOT 9.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Do you acknowledge that under our law, every single person who gets deported gets a hearing first to make their case? Well, are we talking about people that are citizens of our country or not? No. You aren't deporting citizens at this point. Well, let me ask you, did they get hearings when Biden allowed 21 million? Because I think the number is 20 million people to flow into our country. Did we give them a hearing when they came in? Well, the law requires that every single person who. Who is going to be deported gets a hearing first. Well, you acknowledge that. I'll have to ask the lawyers about that. All I can say is this. If you're going to have 21 million people and if we have to get a lot of them out, the law is 21 million. The law is the law on your side. The law doesn't say anything about trials.

[Dave Portnoy]

No, not trials.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Hearings. I said these people came in. They're not citizens. They came in illegally. They came into our country illegally. We have to get them out. There's a legal process for that. I can't be sure. And we follow the legal process. I can't have a trial, a major trial. Every person that came in illegally, we have thousands of murderers that came in. We have to get them out, and we have to get them out fast. Really bad guys. But in our country, even bad guys get due process. Right? If people come into our country illegally, there's a different standard. These are illegal. They came in illegally, but they get due process. Well, they get a process where we have to get them out.

[Megyn Kelly]

Trump was right with every word.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

Terry Moran was in the wrong. I don't know whether he's a lawyer or not. I am. I practiced law for 10 years and covered the Supreme Court for three. It is not true that everybody gets a hearing. It is not the law. Just Google, go ahead and don't take my word. Google expedited removal.

[Dave Portnoy]

To me, it's not even necessarily a legal issue. It becomes a little bit, for me, a human issue in the sense of, I get it, they came in the country illegally, but that's our fault. That's our fault to a degree, for not having the right setup. And if I'm having a horrible life somewhere else and I know I can get into this country, and it's like, well, the guys before me, they were wrong. Like, they set this up and you didn't get in Fairly and you've been living a very productive life here and you've made the most of it to upend it and send And I'm not saying that's what we're going through. That just goes back to my you better be right like and I'm not saying that's the legal like Trump may have every legal argument to be like sorry you're gone but reversing time to be like well you shouldn't have gotten in here and even though you came for the right reasons, the American dream and all this stuff, now you're gone because the last guy shouldn't. That's where I get so you just gotta be right get rid like and I don't know how to do it because he's right. The trials, the time, all of it. And it's just a moral issue that I wrestle with a little bit.

[Megyn Kelly]

I hear you. I'm definitely further to the right than you are on it. But I totally get your point. I'll also say that this is another reason why Trump is using the Alien Enemies act. Because under the Alien Enemies act, the amount of due process one would get before being ejected is down to its most minuscule level. And even the Supreme Court intimated that the first time it looked at this saying some level of due process they clearly understand it's not going to be as robust as the ACLU wants it to be.

[Dave Portnoy]

And even full circle to the original the guy, the gang guy who got El Salvador hearing how I feel you just heard and you're like well I'm more right than you are. The way they've treated that guy has once again pushed me. Right. It's like that's who I want out of the country. And if you're going to fight that well, I like you're losing somebody who theoretically get is more maybe center almost leftish. But I want those people out of the country. So for the Democrats to again make a circus and just political this what are you doing going to meet with this guy? Like yeah, that's what drives me crazy.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yet you didn't go and meet with the family of Rachel Morin who was killed in your state and they're not staying by a different illegal yeah, you didn't Here is Stephen Miller took to the White House House podium yesterday and spoke about the Jocelyn Nungari case which I met with a 12 year old girl in Texas and just ripped it Watch.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Most of your papers never covered her story. When it happened to the extent that you covered it at all it was Because President Trump forced you to cover it by highlighting it repeatedly over and over again. He had to shame you into covering it. And each and every one of you that sides over and over again with these Ms. 13 terrorists, to the extent that you have the financial means to do so, you all choose to live in condos or homes or houses as

[Dave Portnoy]

far away from these kinds of gang

[Matthew McConaughey]

bangers as you possibly can. If I offered any one of you a rent free home with no taxes to pay in any of these gang neighborhoods, and I said your neighbors are Ms. 13 terrorists or Mexican mafia or Sinaloa cartel or Train de Aragua, I couldn't pay you to live there. But yet you, with your neighbor coverage, are trying to force innocent Americans to have these people as their neighbors and

[Dave Portnoy]

that one day their daughter may be

[Matthew McConaughey]

abducted from their home and raped and murdered. So you're not going to get an ounce of sympathy from this administration or President Trump for the terrorists who've invaded our homes and our country.

[Megyn Kelly]

He's so good.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, I mean, it's a fair point.

[Megyn Kelly]

Does that soften you at all? I'm so with him on that. No.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, that, that goes back to when I said if you said they're your neighbor, there's a lot, there's a lot of hypocritical. It's easy when you're sitting in your white ivory tower to say, you know, your idealistic world of way you want the world to exist, but when the rubber meets the road, they would probably privately say a lot of different things or do different things.

[Megyn Kelly]

Rachel Moran's mom was talking about how she went for a jog on a trail that they always walked together. It wasn't like some risky trail. It wasn't the dark of night, it was during the day. They'd done it a thousand times together as a family. It's like our way of life is actively being changed, corrupted, actually ruined. Her mom's life is changed forever. Right. By these people. And so it's like, I have to tell you, I have like zero empathy. And I'm sorry that the ones who came, even though it was illegal and didn't hurt anybody, but like actually tried to like, blend in and get jobs have got to go too, but they do. I think they all have got to go.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Go.

[Megyn Kelly]

And then if they go, Trump has said if you go now, you could come back in, but if you dis, if you stay and then we find out that you overstayed, you're never coming back into the country. And then, and then you're in serious trouble. Okay, I gotta take a quick break. Be right back. Dave's with us for the whole show. It's my first day of work and I need to make a big impression

[Dave Portnoy]

from executive producer Mindy Kaling.

[Megyn Kelly]

This is our sexual harassment training. Hands off your co workers.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Now sign this saying that I trained

[Megyn Kelly]

you or you're fired. Yes, ma'. Am. Work relationships are too messy.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I just met the woman of my dreams. You gotta chill out and not come on too strong. That goes against my entire personality, but I'll try.

[Dave Portnoy]

Watch the new Hulu original series not suitable for work. Premiering June 2nd on Hulu and Hulu on Disney plus for bundle subscribers. Terms apply.

[Matthew McConaughey]

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[Dave Portnoy]

Have you been?

[Megyn Kelly]

Have you been?

[Dave Portnoy]

Three women were brave enough to answer the call. Tomorrow. Special coverage of the launch of Blonde

[Megyn Kelly]

Origin tomorrow on the Megyn Kelly Show. How far will we go for a troll tomorrow? Don't forget, tomorrow's the big day where we will show you the world premiere of our film. Now that we've been with special guest stars who you will know very well and will thoroughly enjoy. Welcome back to the Megyn Kelly show, everyone. Here with me today, Dave Portnoy, president and founder of Barstool Sports, otherwise known as El Presidente, Katy Perry, among others, receiving major backlash not for taking the flight, but for how they behaved afterward, like they actually were Alan Shepard and Neil Armstrong. And so she's come out to say she's feeling battered and bruised by the backlash via Variety, that the Internet is a dumping ground for unhinged and unhealed people. But she has resolved, Dave, to keep looking to the light because she doesn't want to be further damaged by these unhealed people.

[Dave Portnoy]

She's right. The Internet is filled with unhinged lunatics. But when you do this little outer space mission, that can happen. And I'm not gonna, like, lose my sleep worrying about Katy Perry's feelings. But she is right. It's filled with unhinged lunatics.

[Megyn Kelly]

It is. But those are not the ones who are attacking her.

[Dave Portnoy]

No. I'm sure she's getting at all sides. And I'm not can like, what are

[Matthew McConaughey]

you gonna do to me?

[Megyn Kelly]

It's just so. It's just right on brand to go up there and act like you're Alan Shepard. And then when people are like, would you calm down? You took a vanity flight to outer space thanks to Jeff Bezos.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

That costs a million dollars a seat. And stop saying Gayle King. Have you been. Literally, no one's been. It costs a million dollars. Shut up. And then when people have that reaction to you to act like, I will not be bruised by you broken people. I will go toward the. Just stop talking. Just.

[Dave Portnoy]

Somebody like that is so out of touch with, like, reality because they've been a star and big. I. I feel like if you get a celebrity like that, what one or two is gonna have any ground in any reality? They're living in, like, a fantasy world, so nothing is real. I'm actually surprised the Internet can actually get to them. I didn't know. What are they on X Checking, like, comments. That surprised me a little.

[Megyn Kelly]

Almost certainly.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So that. That is a little surprising. But. But, yeah, you get to a level of coddled superstar status where you just lose track of reality. You go to outer space.

[Megyn Kelly]

We have some news on Meghan Markle, which we'll get to in just a bit.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I want to do some exciting.

[Megyn Kelly]

But before we leave, hard news, because, yeah, Katy Perry's hard news. But I forgot to mention this thing about Pete Hegseth. So there's been a lot of speculation that he's gonna go. Mike Walsh, for those just joining us, is reportedly out as National Security Advisor, along with his top deputy, Alex Wong, a man who's been at underneath him there since he was sworn in, and some others, too. You heard Mark Halpern reporting that it's going to be a lot of the staff that there's reportedly disarray over there. We don't know what the full story is, but we will. So the speculation about whether Pete Hegseth is going to be forced out as Secretary of Defense. And I wanted to say this so I love Mark Halpern, and he's been doing great in his new podcast. But he reported yesterday on Hegseth, and there was a bit of information in there involving yours truly, and I want to speak to it. So watch this.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Pete Hegseth, okay?

[Dave Portnoy]

The story is about him. There's still some ambiguity about the facts,

[Matthew McConaughey]

but people in MAGA pretend there's not a problem.

[Dave Portnoy]

And he's done a very good job

[Matthew McConaughey]

of playing by the rules that the

[Dave Portnoy]

president expects of being aggressive. What I can report here today is that his, his standing in the administration is not as solid as some people believe. And as the President and the White House press secretary have tried to signal, there are people at the senior most

[Matthew McConaughey]

levels of this administration, not counting the

[Dave Portnoy]

President necessarily, but the senior most levels

[Matthew McConaughey]

under him, who believe that the next

[Dave Portnoy]

time Pete Hegseth makes a mistake or

[Matthew McConaughey]

is exposed to have made a mistake, he needs to go.

[Dave Portnoy]

And there are already plans underway to figure that out.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Now, what are the public clues to that? Because MAGA has been pretty supportive of Pete Hegseth.

[Dave Portnoy]

Two people who are part of the very strong outside support group of the

[Matthew McConaughey]

President, Tucker Carlson and Megyn Kelly here

[Dave Portnoy]

at the Megyn Kelly Network. They've both now done interviews with the, the, the, the advisors who were forced out of their Pentagon jobs and who

[Matthew McConaughey]

both have said things about Pete Hegseth

[Dave Portnoy]

that are not fully supportive.

[Matthew McConaughey]

They like him, they're close to him, them, but they both have made it

[Dave Portnoy]

clear that they see real problems in his governance and his stewardship at the Pentagon.

[Matthew McConaughey]

That's a clue.

[Dave Portnoy]

And I keep being pointed to that clue by folks to say if two

[Matthew McConaughey]

allies of the president and two people

[Dave Portnoy]

very close to Pete Hegseth, Megan and Tucker are doing these interviews, something is afoot.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, fair enough. I understand why people are making that calculation.

[Dave Portnoy]

Are you in that category? You're very public strong. Are you like.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, I'm a friend of Pete's and I supported his nomination and, and that what they were trying to do to him and Trump's. Yeah, Trump too, totally. But I just want to say in my case, I can't speak for Tucker, but that's not true. Like, I in no way put on Colin Carroll, one of the fired, accused leakers. He denies being one completely. In an effort to undermine Pete or get rid of Pete or. Because my Amaga connections or sensitivities are telling me Pete's teetering and I'm trying to push him over the edge. Totally not the case at all. I'm just a news person and they actually Came to me and asked me if they could come on. Originally, it was all three of them, and then two of them got tapped on the shoulder by their lawyers, which I understand, but Colin was like, I'm doing it, so, fine, great. I mean, I'll interview Pete. I'll interview the guy Pete fired. I'll interview pretty much anybody want to put in front of me, unless I have a personal loathing for them. So just to make it clear that no one should be reading anything into what I know or what I want based on the fact that I have

[Dave Portnoy]

a pretty big 180. Just post publicly, like last week, weren't they, like, it's all. There's no. All the rumors are false. And he's in great standing.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, well. And even Trump, in that Terry Moran interview, he spoke to it. Well, you tell me what you think of how he answered the question on Pete. You've got it, Deb. We'll watch it here.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You said the other day that you had a talk with the secretary.

[Dave Portnoy]

Did you take him to the woodshed?

[Matthew McConaughey]

I had a talk with him, and whatever I said, I probably wouldn't be inclined to tell you, but we had a good talk. He's a talented guy. He's young, he's smart, highly educated, and I think he's going to be a very good defense. Hopefully a great defense secretary, but he'll be a very good defense secretary. You have 100% confidence in. I don't have 100% confidence in anything. Okay.

[Megyn Kelly]

Anything.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Do I have 100%? It's a stupid question. Look, it's a pretty important position. No, no, no. You don't have 100%. Only a liar would say, I have 100% confidence. I don't have 100% confidence that we're going to finish this interview.

[Dave Portnoy]

That, that, that to me was, by the way, that's why, like, people like Trump, the way he answered that. But he definitely took him to the woodshed. He definitely took him to a shed and probably said, if you embarrass me or the administration on a major level one more time, you're gone. I don't want that. I think he likes them and does not want to get rid of them, but he's clear, like, you're out of your. Strike two has happened. I think that would be the vibe of the conversation.

[Megyn Kelly]

I think that's fair. Yeah, that's fair.

[Dave Portnoy]

And that's a fair way, by the way, to. To talk to somebody. Like, if you. I've had to fire people at barstool. Who? I like it. But if you're just dumb and you keep screwing up, I'm not going to lose sleep over your incompetence. As much as I want to keep. Keep you. I'm not saying that's Pete, but I'm saying as a leader, at some point, it doesn't matter your personal feelings. If you keep screwing up, you gotta go.

[Megyn Kelly]

What will get you fired at Barstool,

[Dave Portnoy]

you really have to try. You really have to be super, super dumb. Very few things. Like, we recently teetered. There was a big news story. Like there was a vicious rumor of old miss like coed slept with. With her. Her boyfriend's dad. Went crazy viral. Crazy viral. We had an idiot who talked about it as though it was fact. I knew it wasn't fact right away. I actually thought we were keeping it off. But we posted it for seven minutes. Gets us in all sorts of trouble. This kid's a shut out. Nikki smokes. No redeemable value really to us. But I do like him. And he, like, tries hard. He's just dumb. That almost got him fired.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, my God. He Was he working for you and you're talking about him like this?

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, that's the truth.

[Megyn Kelly]

This is somebody who you stay. Who you kept.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, he works for us.

[Megyn Kelly]

You know, it's good to be benevolent on a big mistake, though, because if you can be.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

He'll never do something like that again.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, unless you're so stupid that you can't prevent it despite your best. Like, we're not hiring the Secretary of Defense. These are.

[Megyn Kelly]

We're.

[Dave Portnoy]

We're Barstool Sports. We're blogging, talking sports. So sometimes, you know, intelligence isn't necessarily the top requirement for us.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay.

[Dave Portnoy]

It's being entertaining.

[Megyn Kelly]

I got it. Fair. Fair enough. Well, it's a world that's very foreign to me. Very foreign to me. So you're going to have to walk me through our next two segments here. Okay, we got to talk about Bill Belichick.

[Dave Portnoy]

You ripped him.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, I. I mean, I thought it was elder abuse. I like, honestly, what I saw there was Dr. Jill had. Dr. Jill vibes, this overly aggressive younger partner who's in this. Like, apparently he looked infirm to me. The way he was answering those questions like, man, who's being taken advantage of. And all I could think was his family needs to do an intervention and get this woman off of his back. But can you set the stage for us on like, what. What's happening with this guy?

[Dave Portnoy]

I'll start by saying I am A die hard New England Patriots fan.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

You're from Boston, Die hard. I love Bill Belichick. He's like, my guy has brought so many championships. I know him personally. He lives on Nantucket. I live on Nantucket. I've met Jordan. So it's a very awkward thing to see. I also watch that show CBS Sunday Morning with the interview. It's like my feelgood show. I just like it. I like nature, there's some politics, whatever, but for the most part, that is a Drink your coffee, eat your bagel, feel good show. So I was not expecting this interview. I was squirming. I don't know what to expect. I don't know what to think about. Certainly was awkward. I've heard people say, you know, is she taking advantage of him? Well, he's taking advantage of her. He's sleeping with a very attractive young girl, 50 years younger. I don't know why she's so involved. Like, I really don't. I've met her. She's nice enough. It. She's running the whole show. I've known that a couple months ago.

[Megyn Kelly]

How so?

[Dave Portnoy]

Like she every, every piece of Bill Belichick business goes through her. Like she is basically let. She would act like if that was maybe not in a romantic relationship. And that's his PR manager or like an agent. Yeah. Nobody's blinking at that. Like that happens, I'm sure a lot with celebrity. We're not going to talk about it now. You combine it with Bill Belichick who's gruff with the media and generally always handles himself. It's just a very awkward situation. The age gap is huge, clearly. But she runs the show. There's rumors. Hard Knocks for HBO was supposed to do North Carolina. She shut that down. The state.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's where he's the coach now.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, he's the coach there. So it's just, it's such a juxtaposition of a guy who seemingly had no media savvy but was always just straight forward, no time for the media. Now having his life run by a 25 year old. It certainly is eye opening for a guy like me. I also know I'm gonna run into probably them in Nantucket and I'll be carrying my watermelon out of stop and Shop. And I don't want it to be an awkward conversation.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Playing it all on me.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. But it went super viral. I mean, it's all anybody's talking about.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's all.

[Dave Portnoy]

And because it's just such a departure from how a sports fan Patriot fan. Everybody thought of Bill Belichick.

[Megyn Kelly]

So explain that to me because we watched I come into this, like out of left field. I don't, I know who he is. Of course. Even I know who Bill Belichick, greatest

[Dave Portnoy]

coach of all time.

[Megyn Kelly]

But I don't follow his, you know, I didn't, I didn't know about the girlfriend and all that. To me, he looked out of it, like he seemed confused. But I've never ever seen him give an interview.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, I've seen a lot of people. Yeah, he's wearing a holy sweatshirt. That's what he does. Like, that's, that, that is his look.

[Megyn Kelly]

Does he talk like that? Like, does he look confused?

[Dave Portnoy]

Generally, he, he generally, if he doesn't want to answer a question, he grumbles and he says, I'm not gonna answer that. He's famous for not answering questions. He's never media savvy. Him going on a book tour, which is what he was doing, seems like the last thing he would ever do in a million years. If she wasn't there, I would anticipate him just being like, I'm not gonna answer it. He's is, he's rarely conducting interviews that he has no interest and he just doesn't care for the media or what they think. The thing that he said that was the most accurate is probably like, I don't care what people think about me. And clearly he doesn't. But I've never seen him defer to anybody like that.

[Matthew McConaughey]

That is so shocking.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, like if someone else is speaking for him, that never happens. He speaks for himself loudly through his actions, clearly, and is always like, like a general in, in the commander of the room, really. So to see him basically give what appears to be control of his life to her is shocking. Any.

[Megyn Kelly]

Most of the audience has probably seen the clip by now, but just in case they haven't, let's play it for them. Let's play the one where she interrupts. This is Bill Belichick on CBS this Morning with anchor Tony dool and his 24 year old girlfriend who's 49 years younger than he is interrupting the interview. Watch.

[Dave Portnoy]

The other change For Belichick is 24 year old Jordan Hudson, his creative muse. As he writes in his book, Jordan was a constant presence during our interview.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You have Jordan right over there.

[Dave Portnoy]

Everybody in the world seems to be following this relationship. They've got an opinion about your private life.

[Matthew McConaughey]

It's got nothing to do with them, but they're investing in it. How do you deal with that?

[Dave Portnoy]

Never been too worried about what everybody else thinks.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Just try to do what I feel like is best for me and, and what's right.

[Dave Portnoy]

How did you guys meet? That's the truth.

[Megyn Kelly]

Not talking about this.

[Matthew McConaughey]

No, no.

[Dave Portnoy]

It's a topic neither one of them is comfortable commenting on.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay, so now she said he's how did you meet? And she interjects not commenting about this. And there are reports that she actually interjected multiple times. CBS only chose to show the one just to give the audience a true sense of how this thing.

[Dave Portnoy]

And it's about the book. And to CBS's defense, that quote that she is the muse is in the book.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's in the book. Yeah, exactly. So now this fight started unfolding online. This is via the Daily Mail involving Belichick's daughter in law. She's married to his son and her name is Jennifer. She's married to his son Steve Belichick. That some people were defending. Jordan, the girlfriend, for example, somebody posted, oh, former New England Patriots star Julian Edelman saw that. You know him.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yep.

[Megyn Kelly]

Stuck up for her saying she was merely acting how any PR person would. Comedian Nikki Glaser also defended Hudson saying 100% she's acting as his publicist. Publicists do this during interviews. People are out for blood. And first of all, I'll tell you what Jennifer, the daughter in law said, but I have done countless interviews. Countless. I've both given as the subject of them and done, conducted literally has this. Never. I've never seen this happen. Never. The PR people will come to you before the interview and they will beg you not to cover or ask after

[Dave Portnoy]

for it to be cut.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, exactly. That's their job. As a journalist and Tony Dokapoel is a journalist, you would say thank you for your input. That's it. You would never make a promise ever. It's literally considered unethical to say I won't ask about that. You know, at most I've ever heard somebody say is we can't make you any promises but you know, we're not that interested in that subject. Like a wink in a nut. But never, never has a PR person ever interviewed, interjected into, into an interview,

[Dave Portnoy]

people asking, no, if someone doesn't want to talk about it, we generally, because people generally want to talk about what you are asking not to talk about. So we won't do it. It's strange. I don't agree with that. It was different rules.

[Megyn Kelly]

If it's like a host, you know, I mean, if you're sitting to somebody who doesn't consider themselves a journalist. Very different. And by the way, this is how talk shows get away with it all the time. I've been asked to go on a bunch of talk shows, including Tamron Halls, like, five years ago, and her executive producer said, we'll give you all the questions in advance. I'm like, I'm not doing that. I felt like I don't want that.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, right.

[Megyn Kelly]

So she got away with it because they consider that a talk show. But she's not, not, I guess calling herself a journalist anymore at least wasn't for that show. Okay, so then Jennifer Belichick's daughter, I'm dying to hear this, weighs in and says, publicists act in a professional matter and do not storm on storm offset, delaying an interview.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, so I know them, too. This is like. And that probably tells you everything you need to know about how the family. And that's natural. There's a story that came out in the New York Post, I think yesterday that, that she accumulated like $10 million of real estate very quickly. So I'm sure the family, based on that quote, is a little like, what is going on here? And it's just this is a guy that is not a pushover. He has built his reputation on being like a gruff kind of guy who needs everything particular and detail oriented. It's just very strange to see he's

[Megyn Kelly]

the guy Tim Walsh was trying to convince us he was.

[Matthew McConaughey]

No.

[Megyn Kelly]

Jazz hands.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. Football. Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

Even he was the guy, man. Yeah. He was trying to, I think, be more like a gronk guy, but who knows?

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, there's more. So he. You know about this because I saw you commented on it. So Bill Belichick posted a statement on the unc University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill is where he coaches. Right? Chapel Hill. And he. He wrote as follows. I agreed to speak with CBS Sunday MORNING to promote my new book, the Art of Winning. Prior to the interview, I clearly communicated with my publicist. So he's not even saying he told Tony Dokapoel or the CBS publicist. I clearly communicated with my publicist at Simon and Schuster that any promotional interviews I participated in would agree to focus solely on the contents of the book. Unfortunately, that expectation was not honored. During the interview. I was surprised when unrelated topics were introduced. And I repeatedly expressed to the reporter Tony Dokapo, and the producers that I preferred to keep the conversation centered on the book. After this occurred several times, Jordan, with whom I share both the personal and professional relationship, stepped in to reiterate that point and help refocus the discussion. She was not deflecting any specific question or topic. I'm sorry, Bill. But she was. But was simply doing her job to ensure the interview stayed on track. Some of the clips made it appear as though we were avoiding the question of how we met. But we've been open about the fact that Jordan and I met on a flight to Palm beach in 2021. And goes on for them saying these are just selectedly selectively edited clips suggested a false narrative that Jordan was attempting to control the conversation, which is simply not true.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, I'm like white knuckle in the table. In my years following Bill Belichick, I would say my knowledge of him. There's roughly 0% chance he wrote that he just, he just doesn't care generally what anyone thinks about him. So to go write that, that, that. My guess would be Jordan wrote that the fact it is North Carolina website is insane.

[Megyn Kelly]

Right?

[Dave Portnoy]

It's just insane. It's shocking. Again, it's. I'm speaking to all Patriot fans, Boston people. This guy, like, if you could have predicted this, people would say you're living in a bizarro world. It's just so strange in this long email. Crazy. The public statement crazy. But I, I'm not even sure he knows that was written.

[Megyn Kelly]

Right?

[Dave Portnoy]

Like, he may not. He. He may not. I really don't know.

[Megyn Kelly]

So the Daily Mail had a comprehensive piece and they cited the New York Post as reporting even before this past weekend's interview, Belichick's friends shaking their heads about his relationship with Jordan. Quote, they're talking to him about her, but very gently because they know how deep in it he is. She saw an opening and she took it. An insider added of how she has inserted herself into every aspect of his life and career. Consensus among people around Belichick, another source said, is that this relationship is alarming and Hudson is a runaway train. However, they include one person defending them, saying when it comes to the situation in it is just a moment in time. He and Jordan are fine. Nobody should be concerned at this point. But then they also say multiple reports say UNC is growing uneasy with her involvement in everything.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So there's adage in sports. Winning cures everything. If North Carolina wins, people are going to forget this.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

And North Carolina will be happy and look the other way. If North Carolina has a bad season, it's going to get very rocky. It is not, I don't think, normal for a relatively new relationship with this age gap with the a of someone coming in Running his entire life. And like CBS and Hard Knocks supposedly got canceled because of her. It's. It's just shocking. It's just shocking. There's all being fought in headlines and rumors and back and forth. And by the way, to Jordan's credit, she's. If you want to say credit, she's not taking a step backwards. Like every time a story comes out, she's pushing forwards like she is. She is not a tame flower. She is not running from this at all.

[Megyn Kelly]

She's running from how they met. That seems clear. And in my opinion, they did not, quote, meet on a plane.

[Dave Portnoy]

See, I think they did because I

[Megyn Kelly]

think they laid eyes on each other in person for the first time on a plane. But she's so defensive about it. There's something more to the story. I don't know what it was. Was it only fans? Was it some setup by a. I don't think so.

[Dave Portnoy]

They're telling the truth. I just think she's in control in her mind. She's. Like we said, we're not talking about that. We're not talking about it because from the second I met them, the story has been told the same to me.

[Megyn Kelly]

Me.

[Dave Portnoy]

She posted how they met a long time ago. I know that's a front.

[Megyn Kelly]

If they met through.

[Dave Portnoy]

So she's Fauci to you. She's a criminal. She's like a criminal mastermind.

[Megyn Kelly]

No, I mean, listen, the same way I viewed Anna Nicole Smith, like everyone understands what the deal here is. He's an older guy with money and power, which some women find if not attractive, worthy of being with. They can upgrade their lifestyle. They're going to travel the world and the old guy gets some young beautiful woman on his arm and probably a lot of hot sex he otherwise wouldn't be having.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. I mean, could he not, could he not just get hookers if he didn't want. I don't know. I mean, Anna Nicole, I don't remember that guy was like on his desk,

[Megyn Kelly]

he was like 200 years old.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. He couldn't even get up. Like Belichick is still outside of this seems to be normally functioning.

[Megyn Kelly]

I have a new 24 year old girl wants a 74 year old man. I mean, that's not what you're attracted to. To me, it's not obvious attempt to be with power and money. It's like, look, a lot of women do that.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. Maybe she's legitimately attracted to it. I don't know. The whole thing. The whole thing is.

[Megyn Kelly]

Makes you uncomfortable.

[Dave Portnoy]

It's Just, I, I, it's stunning. It, it's stunning.

[Megyn Kelly]

Before we leave the topic of the Patriots, I remember asking you about this the first time you came out. You were on one other time, a long time before. I think we only had audio at the time. Do you hate or love Tom Brady?

[Dave Portnoy]

Lady love.

[Megyn Kelly]

Love. Okay.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So I may have spoken with you when he went to the Bucks.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay.

[Dave Portnoy]

I was mad at him.

[Megyn Kelly]

Maybe that's what happened.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. But he's the greatest of all time.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. There's no question in your mind?

[Dave Portnoy]

No question.

[Megyn Kelly]

He's number one.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

And how is he doing as a sports commentator?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Bad.

[Dave Portnoy]

Awful. Not good.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh. Why?

[Dave Portnoy]

He just thinks at it. I mean, not everybody. He's the greatest quarterback. Not everybody is born to be a great announcer. I just, I don't find him to be good at announcing football. Now he's brand new. It's his first year, they gave him a gigantic contract. But he certainly didn't come out of the gates like a natural.

[Megyn Kelly]

Didn't he have all sorts of training?

[Dave Portnoy]

I'm sure he did for the amount they paid. But again, maybe anybody can eventually become a good announcer. I don't know. It's not the easiest thing to do, but he just didn't come out of the gates. He's almost, to me too elevated. He's so great, like the way he talks. But no, I didn't think he, he, he did not come out all guns firing. And again, it, it's his first year doing it, so maybe there should be some leeway. But they paid him a ton of money.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

I like, I mean, a ton.

[Megyn Kelly]

Almost $400 million.

[Dave Portnoy]

Crazy.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. It's a big time deal. Okay. Shadour Sanders.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

So this is Deion Sanders son.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yep.

[Megyn Kelly]

Deion Sanders. Such a big football star. Even I know that name.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yep.

[Megyn Kelly]

Who did Deon play for?

[Dave Portnoy]

He and the pros. He played for the Falcons, Cowboys and 49ers.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. Okay. And he is the one. I've quoted Deion Sanders before because he had some great quote which was something to the effect of if you look good, you play good. If you play good, they pay good.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yep.

[Megyn Kelly]

Which I love. That's very clever and cute. But his son, who was many expected to go like, well, you tell me where in the draft where. What were the, what was the expectation?

[Dave Portnoy]

I think earlier in the season, a lot of people were saying, early first round, top 10 pick. And then as I got close to the draft, it started sliding and you heard maybe end of the first round, second round is probably what people thought

[Megyn Kelly]

going, he's a big college qb.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yes.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay. And then the draft comes and walk us through how that unfolded. Because he was like the story that night.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yes. So the draft comes. First round comes and goes. He's not drafted. Not totally shocking. Mel Kiper, who is the draft guy expert, he's ranting and raving. He should go. And then round two comes nothing. Round three comes nothing. And so he slid, I believe into the fourth round.

[Megyn Kelly]

How many rounds are there?

[Dave Portnoy]

There's, I think six. Six or seven. Six or seven.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Oh.

[Megyn Kelly]

So now he's down in the bottom.

[Dave Portnoy]

Shocking. Shocking. And players who. Quarterbacks going, who I think anybody would say, well, Shador is better than him. Not drafted. And it became the story and it kind of took on a life of its own with people all over the Internet chiming in. Why isn't he getting drafted? For various reasons, that was a story. So I love Dion. He used to work for a barstool. He's one of my favorite guys I've ever met. There were innuendos. It's race, it's this, it's that. It to me, it was none of it.

[Megyn Kelly]

It.

[Dave Portnoy]

It was Shador Sanders and the Sanders are one of the great publicity machines of all time. Like Deion's heavily involved. Dion saying, hey, I played in the NFL. We're picking what team we're going to. To. He's going to be the starter. He's this, that. So there's a lot that comes, including, you could say, a circus. When you draft your door, you're putting a tent on the thing. For NFL teams, there's nothing they hate more than distractions. They're like the most. Everyone's focused. We don't need distractions. Having said that, if they think a guy can help them win, you could be a murderer and they draft you.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's happened.

[Dave Portnoy]

Literally, that's all they care about. But in evaluating, there's a fine line between is this guy the guy? And can we win with Shador? And he is he the franchise? If teams thought that, they would have picked him instantly. None of the other stuff would have mattered. But he was kind of in a weird area where a lot of teams like this isn't. He's not going to be a 10 year star. He's not Tom Brady. And if he's not that, do we want him fighting for a backup job? Do we want microphones in his face? Because that's a circus. The last thing you want.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Want.

[Dave Portnoy]

That's what I believe happened. So if you didn't think he was the starter in a top five pick. Do you want him in your locker room creating a circus environment? And he kind of got caught in the middle and that's when he dropped all the way to Cleveland. Now if you're Cleveland or any team, dropping them fourth, fifth, drafting a fourth, fifth round, you're like, you know what?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Enough.

[Dave Portnoy]

We're getting microphones. He's not who we think he is. You just cut him. It's not the end of the world. Because you didn't waste the top draft back pick. If you take them early and it doesn't work, you're stuck with them really, because you can't waste a draft pick. So I think that's what happened. All the other innuendo around it is garbage.

[Megyn Kelly]

Why. Why is President Trump involved? What's he tweeted? Somebody should take him or what happened there?

[Dave Portnoy]

Friends with Dion, I mean. Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

During the draft he tweeted.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, well, he. When he was slipping Trump. I mean, Trump loves talking football. He owned a football team. He likes jumping in in these discussions. I think sometimes Trump just can't handle, like having X in front of him. He's like, how are they not? He's like a fan and he's president though, so. But I don't think he thought anything. He's like, oh, I'm friends with Dion and I'm gonna, I'm gonna say he should be drafted.

[Megyn Kelly]

Is it inappropriate?

[Dave Portnoy]

I like it.

[Megyn Kelly]

Like, do people think he was putting inappropriate pressure on teams as the president?

[Dave Portnoy]

No, I kind of like it. It's. It depends what he's doing. But that's, that's, that's Trump. I mean, I love.

[Megyn Kelly]

Tries to make a controversy out of everything Trump does. Okay, but back to this because. So Stephen A. Smith was on the show not long ago and he posted something that I know you disagreed with, but explain it to me. So he posted, someone just texted me this message and they're absolutely correct. Quote, this is a bad look for the NFL. This feels like Kaepernick level collusion. All the hard work the NFL League office puts into eradicate these kinds of perceptions, only to turn around and watch as the owners look like they're colluding, messing up everything. What has been done to Shador will outshine everything else in this draft. We'll never believe this is just about talent evaluation again. And it. That does seem to be a reference to race.

[Dave Portnoy]

I mean, I don't know why you'd bring in Kaepernick and what they're Trying to. To me, I don't know why he didn't put the word racism. That's what it sounded like, racism. That's why I responded. That's an insane take to me that just. The owners and the NFL are. Are arguably the most competitive group of, like, billionaire successful people. They don't like each other. They want to win.

[Megyn Kelly]

They would never collude.

[Dave Portnoy]

They never collude.

[Megyn Kelly]

If you.

[Dave Portnoy]

If they thought Shador could get them a Super bowl, they would do whatever. So to me, that just an absolutely insane take. It's just when you're drafting guys, not just strictly talent, you're looking at all the things that are surrounding who is

[Megyn Kelly]

the first draft pick this year.

[Dave Portnoy]

It was Cam Ward as a black quarterback.

[Megyn Kelly]

Okay.

[Dave Portnoy]

So it's like.

[Megyn Kelly]

I mean, and then I read that in the last three drafts, including this year. Yeah. A black quarterback went number one overall.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So it's not. It has nothing to do with race.

[Megyn Kelly]

Who thinks the NFL is racist?

[Dave Portnoy]

What's that?

[Megyn Kelly]

Who thinks the NFL when he says

[Dave Portnoy]

the Kaepernick stuff, he's going back to take in knee. And there were some teams taking a knee, some not. I mean, Jerry Jones came out, so he's going back to that. And by the way, there is similarity to me in the Kaepernick situation in which teams just viewed Kaepernick and said he's not good enough to have a circus fall.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. Like, this is a distraction.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

If.

[Megyn Kelly]

So do you think Deion ultimately hurt his son by being such a big personality who they thought they were going to have to deal with more than they wanted to in strictly.

[Dave Portnoy]

In where he got drafted? Like, would he have been drafted quicker if Deon. If it was Dion Jones, who was his dad? Absolutely. If you ask Dion and you ask Shador, Are you glad Dion's there? 100.

[Megyn Kelly]

He probably wouldn't be getting drafted at all.

[Dave Portnoy]

It's a huge media, like, I mean, he's partying. He's getting millions of dollars in endorsements and all this stuff. So it's a package deal. But if you're just saying what teams have dropped. Drafted him without. I mean, Dion before the draft is like, don't draft my kid if I don't like you, because I'm not gonna let him sign with you.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, wow.

[Dave Portnoy]

Winning's not the first one did that. The Mannings did that.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Oh, really?

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. That Eli Manning they said to. I believe is the Colts. Like, if you draft him, he's not coming. And they didn't draft them, so they bullied their.

[Megyn Kelly]

Them go to the Colts. Did. No one went to the Colts. One went to Denver.

[Dave Portnoy]

It was. Eli went to the Giants instead of the Colts. The Colts had the first pick.

[Megyn Kelly]

Did a Manning play for Denver?

[Dave Portnoy]

Yes. At the end of his career when he had no. He had no army. You were right. He no A. Manning played for the Colts. Peyton played his entire.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, there we go.

[Dave Portnoy]

Okay, you were right.

[Megyn Kelly]

So I was.

[Dave Portnoy]

Was it the Colts?

[Megyn Kelly]

Colts. I don't know.

[Dave Portnoy]

Whoever. I forget now that you say it, because Peyton played for the Colts. Wherever Eli. Whoever had the first pick. Maybe it was San Diego.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, wait, they're telling me Peyton played for the Colts.

[Dave Portnoy]

Peyton eight for the Colts. Somebody had the first pick when Eli came out and Archie Manning, who played in the league, did what Dion essentially did without as much pomp and circumstance that if you draft him, he's not going. And they didn't draft them. And John Elway's done it, so it's not Deion's. Just. Just was much more loud. In this era of endorsements and stuff, it's the circus. And if you don't think he's great, I probably won't want him on my team either, because I don't want that to be the focus of what everyone's talking about.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, now we'll see. Right now.

[Dave Portnoy]

Now the rubber will meet the road. I think he's gonna be great. So we'll see.

[Megyn Kelly]

Are the Browns any good? My friend, die hard Browns fan. He's always complaining about how bad they are.

[Dave Portnoy]

Worst franchise arguably in sports.

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, gosh. So he's not going to be happy about this.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, who knows?

[Megyn Kelly]

Maybe he's the future.

[Dave Portnoy]

But they have the weirdest QB room. I'm getting deep. But they have. They have DeShawn Watson, the guy who had like 9,000 illegal massages.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Oh. Oh.

[Dave Portnoy]

They paid him a ton of money. They drafted another quarterback before. They have a wild QB room. Wild Gary Cleveland.

[Megyn Kelly]

I don't. That's fascinating. That's more for your next appearance.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

QB room with multiple massages. Okay. Very different from our job. Stand by. More with Dave right after this. It's my first day of work, and I need to make a big impression

[Dave Portnoy]

from executive producer Mindy Kaling.

[Megyn Kelly]

This is our sexual harassment training. Hands off your co workers.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Now sign this saying that I trained you or you're fired.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes, ma'. Am. Work relationships are too messy.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I just met the woman of my dreams. You gotta chill out and not come on too strong. That goes against my entire personality.

[Dave Portnoy]

But I'll Try Watch the new Hulu original series not suitable for work. Premiering June 2nd on Hulu and Hulu on Disney for bundle subscribers.

[Megyn Kelly]

Terms apply On Deck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, Ondeck's loans up to $400,000 help make it happen fast. Rated A by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five star Trustpilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in [e-mail] depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by Ondeck or Celtic Bank. Ondeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans an amount subject to lender approval. Now we've covered ground that's more in my wheelhouse. And we've covered ground that's more in Dave's wheelhouse. And we finish on a note of solidarity that we both have strong feelings on. And that is Meghan Markle.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

So she has done the world premiere episode of actually being on someone else's podcast. And the someone else is the is. Her name is Jamie Kern Lima. Now, I have actually interviewed this person, but I didn't realize I had interviewed this person because she found a founded I T Cosmetics, which I remember interviewing her at NBC. I think it's the same lady. I could be wrong. She looks a little different. But anyway, she was a news anchor and she realized that you have a need for like cosmetics that are a little bit thicker because of the Kleeg lights and all that. And her brand became a billion dollar brand and she sold it to L' Oreal for 1.2 billion in 2016.

[Dave Portnoy]

All for News anchor makeup. Yeah, no one offered me makeup at all here.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's good stuff. Stuff we sold you down the river. So she now has a podcast and is also apparently friends with Megan. And in the world premiere of podcast, Megan, Duchess of Sussex, she pulled out all the stops. Here is the intro of the episode. Look at this.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Megan, Duchess of Sussex, in her first ever podcast interview. It's happening.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's not about the grandeur of a gesture. It's about I see you, I'm nurturing you, and I see you so deeply. And I love being able to see your growth of all things. It's making me emotional.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I have full body chills right now.

[Megyn Kelly]

For them to be able to look back and go, oh my gosh, she's loved us so much. She's an American member of the British royal family, an entrepreneur, author, actor, founder

[Matthew McConaughey]

of the lifestyle brand. As ever, that Just sold out of

[Megyn Kelly]

stock completely in the first hour of

[Matthew McConaughey]

its recent launch into the world. She's also a mom to her two beautiful kids, Prince Archie and Princess Lilibet,

[Megyn Kelly]

and wife to husband Prince Harry Harry, Duke of Sussex. Oh my God.

[Dave Portnoy]

Why don't you like her?

[Megyn Kelly]

I just threw up a little in my mouth. Let me count the ways. There's nothing I like about her.

[Dave Portnoy]

Do you know her?

[Megyn Kelly]

No. But she is a malignant narcissist who cannot get enough of herself while she simultaneously plays the victim. My castle is too small. The Queen is mean to me. They won't let me call myself her Royal Highness anymore. But I'm gonna put it all over my stationary and on the gifts that I give to my friends while she never stops whining. And at the same time I'm getting all worked up she that business. I'm. I'm a founder. I'm over it. She's not important. She married for money. It's very clear. She bagged the elephant. She was thrilled. She became a quote princess.

[Dave Portnoy]

Well, you can.

[Megyn Kelly]

It was planned from the beginning. She denied being interested in the royal family, which she totally was. I know someone who knows the ex husband who said she had a vision board with Prince Harry on it it before they met. Yes. And she wants to.

[Dave Portnoy]

It's impressive. You got to admit. That is impressive.

[Megyn Kelly]

She nailed it. Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

Because a lot of people probably did that.

[Megyn Kelly]

It was like shooting fish in a barrel with all that self help talk he had. He was no match for her.

[Dave Portnoy]

So I as we unpack like an onion. Some of the things I'm interested in. I actually like the royal family. I think it's cool.

[Megyn Kelly]

So that's another thing. She killed the queen.

[Dave Portnoy]

She did kill the queen.

[Megyn Kelly]

My opinion.

[Dave Portnoy]

I don't. I agree with you. I can't have someone marry into the royal family and be like woe is me of all these attention or whatever you're getting from being. It's no, no kidding. It's the royal family.

[Megyn Kelly]

I can't believe I'm not getting paid.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. All this stuff. And then didn't they renounce their royalty? But they still want the royalty. So it is hypocritical to get into that situation then want nothing to do with it. But you do want anything to do with it. I don't have as strong of feelings as you do for her. I don't care for her. I wouldn't put her in a hate category of mine. I don't like her. I didn't see that interview. But yeah. I. I'm a royals guy, so I like the royal. I think it's kind of cool. The history, the pageantry, and just come in and kind of blow it up and then cry. It's like, whoa, Whoa.

[Megyn Kelly]

And she's a bully. I mean, the reports were uniformly from inside the castle that all the young women in particular who work for her quit in tears. She so wore them down and was so nasty. Then when she started her own company, similar reports coming out from Montecito about how knowing can work for her. She's a nightmare behind the scenes and not toward the betterment of her staff just because she's an insecure person who takes it out on other people.

[Dave Portnoy]

What was up with the no makeup? That had to be an intentional.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's another thing. Maureen was saying this on her. Maureen Callahan has a new podcast for part of our network and with the makeup lady. Yeah. And exactly right. And it's bullshit. So, first of all, she had the hair blown out. It was perfect. I do not believe that she was makeup free there. She didn't have eye makeup on, which is a different thing. But that's her being relatable, Dave. She's relatable.

[Dave Portnoy]

Intentional relatable.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. Yeah. So here she is talking about the joy.

[Dave Portnoy]

Is she on, like, your top 10 hate list?

[Megyn Kelly]

Oh, yeah, she's top five. The joy of working hard. I'm sure she's really toiling away. Take a listen. But to the world, it's just, what has she been doing? Does she work as opposed to. Oh, my gosh, I work so hard, and I appreciate what hard work looks like. I like working hard, and I'm still working hard. Right. The moment that everything sells out, it doesn't mean that we're done. Yeah. It means we're working on replenishment. And what are the next SKUs and what's the next tranche of products and what's the timing on that? And writing the newsletters and writing the social media captions and making sure that all that feels in line and what's the cadence of it and what's the photography that we want to do and what do I want to wear for those shoots? While also editing all the time coded notes for season two of Megan and then being in edits for the podcast and making with a smile and being a mom and a wife and a friend. Oh, yeah, those are all jobs. I mean, I love being that busy, but I do think it's really interesting when people have no sense of what goes into the thing. Yeah. And then when the thing seems.

[Dave Portnoy]

It's like between two ferns, almost the

[Megyn Kelly]

way she's hosting it, the thing's not done right. The finish line was really the starting line. Okay, we get it. Yes, go.

[Dave Portnoy]

That, that, that would infuriate me. Like as someone who's trying to start a business, struggling because like you can't fail. Like you're, you're. If you're selling. I don't know what she's selling. Candles. I don't know what she's selling.

[Megyn Kelly]

Jam.

[Dave Portnoy]

Jam. Like you're. You're in the royal family. So to this head start that you have and then complain about working hard. It's like you're in the royal family. So to complain about. Oh, the business. You don't have to. If you don't want to show, show up. If you don't want to do the schedule, you don't have to do anything you don't want to do. Right. You're living in a fan. Literally, like a fantasy tale of.

[Matthew McConaughey]

But I.

[Dave Portnoy]

The other. The host.

[Megyn Kelly]

What's happening with her?

[Dave Portnoy]

If you actually didn't. If people didn't know who was who. I think people be focusing on the host.

[Matthew McConaughey]

The weird expression. Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

It was between two ferns.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

So, yeah. I don't know. I don't hate her as much as you, but it's really.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's like a love to hate situation. I don't have actual hatred for her. I have that for very few people. It's a small list, but she's not on it. But I just can't stand her. I just think she's such a phony. I love to make fun of her because she continues to give me so much material.

[Dave Portnoy]

She comes across as a phony in that. Both of them.

[Megyn Kelly]

I've got to show you one more on that. Okay, look, this is a short one. SOT 29. Look at this ridiculousness. Your close friends and family, so many of them call you M and Harry. H. Yes.

[Matthew McConaughey]

How did that start?

[Megyn Kelly]

And tell me about the. That probably at the beginning of us dating when everything was in code.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Code. Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

Right. People didn't know we were dating for.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, she's.

[Megyn Kelly]

Talk about memory lane. So long ago. I mean, it'll be our seven year wedding anniversary soon. I couldn't say tell anyone who I was dating. And he was keeping. So I think we were just on a letter basis. Yeah. And then it stuck. It's stuck. It stuck. It was their code, their super stealthy code. M and H. Like. Like when I called Doug Bug. It's Ridiculous. That's like choosing your alias as a famous person. And it's John Smith.

[Dave Portnoy]

Like, will that podcast have like crazy numbers? Because she's on it. Like, does she move the needle like that?

[Megyn Kelly]

I have no idea. But if. If it does, it's going to be at least 2/3 hate listeners. Like.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, I mean, I. But I actually, again, I think it'll be overshadowed by the interviewer who is looks like on Outer Outer Space.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. And so bizarre with a weird blush

[Dave Portnoy]

and the makeup to no makeup.

[Megyn Kelly]

So, speaking of podcast success, do you have any advice for me? You. You've grown. This.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yours is killing it, right?

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, I only have two in the MK podcast network so far.

[Dave Portnoy]

Oh, you're. You're talking adding.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah, adding like a network. Like, you know, you have a network at Bar stool.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So do you. Well, are you focused on news?

[Megyn Kelly]

Yes. News, culture, you know, everything related to news.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, I don't know.

[Megyn Kelly]

It's not sports.

[Dave Portnoy]

So we've always just looked for different things like that, that try to find something talented people and find things that I haven't seen necessarily before. So like call her daddy. Which I'm surprised. I don't see the big signs around here.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah. You found that she went on to become extreme family.

[Dave Portnoy]

And I hadn't seen anything like that. Like, it wasn't my cup of tea, but it was like, oh, this is different. We've been very successful for that. But it. It's trying to get out of, I guess, a network sense. It's like. And I'm sure it would be similar with you. If I see something and it catches me for more than a minute or two, it's like, I'm interested in this. That's a good start. We've certainly been wrong a lot. It's a band label for us. Kind of like a band label. Sign a bunch of little bands, hopefully one or two hit. And that kind of is the model model.

[Megyn Kelly]

And how. How long do you wait until you, you know, cut bait or declare them

[Dave Portnoy]

as we sign them for contracts. So it's generally like two to three years. So like a band label. And not different from band label. Once they become successful, they're very difficult to deal with.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

Like, then they want the money. They see what's going on. And so the talent business stinks.

[Megyn Kelly]

Yeah.

[Dave Portnoy]

Because once the talent becomes big, they don't need you anymore. And they may be under contract, but it.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You gotta.

[Dave Portnoy]

They generally, if they. If we can't resign them, they leave. And we built a lot of very rich Superstars in this digital age, from Alex Cooper, Pat McAfee. A lot of people make a lot of money. And then we just got to refill the pipeline and find the next. And it never ends. And that sucks.

[Megyn Kelly]

I feel like, you know, I, I have good people, I have faith in them. We have a good relationship. But famous last words. I, I take your point. So, I mean, the, your company now is huge, right? I mean, you, I read that in like 2002 you were filing for bankruptcy and now you're talking about the Trump tariffs costing you like $20 million. That's just what was, what it cost you.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

So you're obviously hugely successful.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah, we've done well. That bankruptcy thing, by the way, was a New York Times hit piece I did, but it was like my dad told me in college and I hate the New York Times. Anyhow, that wasn't a business thing. So. Yeah, that we sold barstool in 2016, 15 of it for about 12 million was evaluation. Then we sold it again for 600 million was the valuation. And then I got it back for a dollar. So now I have the whole thing again.

[Megyn Kelly]

That was so crazy.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah. So it's been a wild ride.

[Megyn Kelly]

So what, like, now you have all this money, do you live differently? Are you different?

[Dave Portnoy]

I don't think I'm different. I certainly live differently. Things that I've always been interested in, like horse racing. Kentucky Derbies this weekend. I love horses.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Love.

[Dave Portnoy]

So I would go to the track growing up.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Up.

[Dave Portnoy]

And now instead of being, you know, in, in the bleacher section or with the riff raff betting two bucks, I can afford to own the horses. So things like that have changed, but it's still my core interest. I don't think I've changed. I, I guess you, I mean, a positive thing about Barstool, a lot of the people who started with me are still there. So, you know, I, I, that's your ride or dies. Yeah, ride or dies. Or we just treat our employees like, well, and I don't think anybody would ever say about me. They may be like, he's a jerk or he's blunt, but nobody would be like, he's dishonest. I'm pretty straight in all my dealings with people and that's helped get us, I mean, we've been around now over 20 years, so that's helped.

[Megyn Kelly]

Well, I, I find it entertaining. I go over there, not really for sports, but when commentary comes into the news world, political. I love it.

[Dave Portnoy]

I love how frankly, you go viral. I mean, I saw. I try not to, because whatever you get in politics, people, and both the right and left, if I like, I criticized Trump the other day because. Because his line about the stock market is not his stock. It is like you have affected the stock market because of tariffs. End of story. It's.

[Matthew McConaughey]

It.

[Dave Portnoy]

You can't say. It's not like, you can't blame that on Biden. It's yours. You're. You're. By the tariffs. That's yours. And if I say that, suddenly all the people like me on the right hate me. They're like, oh, yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

But it's like how you actually feel, which is. That's. That's the name of this game.

[Dave Portnoy]

Right?

[Megyn Kelly]

That's for sure.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Sure.

[Megyn Kelly]

By the way, my team tells me that this YouTube show for this Jamie lady, this squeaky voiced makeup lady, is. They're at 251,000 views after three days, which is terrible.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

Absolutely terrible.

[Matthew McConaughey]

For.

[Megyn Kelly]

For having the Duchess.

[Matthew McConaughey]

For having the Duchess.

[Megyn Kelly]

That's.

[Dave Portnoy]

I thought you're gonna say like 250 million.

[Megyn Kelly]

No.

[Dave Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Megyn Kelly]

Or like at least 2.5 million. I like, no one has any interest in.

[Dave Portnoy]

I didn't even know what happened.

[Megyn Kelly]

Hearing her talk about how hard her life is or how hard she's working or her secret code for H and M. Whomever could they mean?

[Dave Portnoy]

Who's going to crack a spoof like an SNL spoof?

[Megyn Kelly]

Dave Portnoy, great to have you. Thanks for being here. Yeah. Hope to see you again. Thanks for listening to the Megyn Kelly Show. No bs, no agenda, and no fear. When you're craving something extra delicious, extra saucy, and extra extra. There's Applebee's all you can eat.

[Matthew McConaughey]

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[Megyn Kelly]

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