The Megyn Kelly Show – AM Update 10/8/2025

Episode: SCOTUS Hears "Affirm Only" Therapy Arguments, AG Bondi Clashes with Dems over DOJ
Date: October 8, 2025
Host: Megyn Kelly (SiriusXM)

Episode Overview

This episode delivers an in-depth update on two major stories:

1. Supreme Court Arguments: The U.S. Supreme Court hears a challenge to Colorado's 2019 “conversion therapy” ban for minors, focusing on whether the law violates therapists' free speech rights by only permitting gender-affirming counseling while criminalizing alternative viewpoints.
2. Capitol Hill Showdown: Attorney General Pam Bondi testifies before the Senate Judiciary Committee, sparring with Democrats about law enforcement strategies, National Guard deployments in high-crime cities, the indictment of James Comey, and allegations of the DOJ targeting GOP lawmakers.

Supreme Court Hears Colorado’s “Affirm-Only” Therapy Ban

Background and Key Legal Questions

• In 2019, Colorado banned licensed therapists from “conversion therapy” for minors, defined broadly to include any counseling aiming to reduce same-sex attraction or to help a child accept their biological sex ([03:40]).
• The law permits “affirming” a child’s declared gender identity but prevents counseling aiming to align identity with biological sex.
• Colorado therapist Kaylee Chiles, represented by Alliance Defending Freedom (ADF), argues this is a viewpoint-based restriction and a First Amendment violation.

Core Discussion Points

Scope and Meaning of Conversion Therapy Ban

• Kristen Wagoner (ADF, President & CEO):

  • “Colorado's description of conversion therapy is very misleading and I think intentionally so. It includes just simple conversations that we know the science says people benefit from. Kids need to be heard ... that is actually labeled as conversion therapy in this law.” ([04:01])
  • “You can't lump things in that are different... Kaylee's counseling is simply listening and talking, as are a number of therapists out there trying to help these kids...” ([04:01])

• Megyn Kelly:

  • Points out the law is, “totally permissive under the law” for gender affirmation, but bans therapy helping children be “comfortable with their natural body.” ([04:48])

Allegations of Viewpoint Discrimination

• Kristen Wagoner:
  • “Colorado says it has the power to censor those conversations and say, you can't even talk about that unless you help them transition to the opposite sex. It's blatant viewpoint discrimination and violates the First Amendment.” ([04:59])

Risks to Children and Scientific Claims

• Kristen Wagoner:

  • “It is a one-way ratchet that is designed to push kids down a radical path... 90% of kids who are allowed to just go through puberty ... naturally grow comfortable with their bodies.”
  • “If... they are socially transitioned, 97% ... will become lifelong medical patients...” ([05:40])

• Megyn Kelly:

  • Cites international examples (UK, Sweden, Finland, Norway, Denmark) sharply curtailing gender-affirming treatments in minors, referencing the Cass Review from the UK, which criticized fast-tracking interventions without psychological assessment ([07:59]).

Supreme Court Oral Arguments – Highlights

• Justice Elena Kagan:

  • Highlights possible viewpoint discrimination: “[I]f one therapist is allowed to help a patient accept being gay, but another is barred from helping a patient change, that sure sounds like viewpoint discrimination.” ([06:27])

• Colorado Solicitor General’s Argument:

  • Asserts speech in medical contexts can be more regulated than ordinary speech ([06:27]).

• Justice Samuel Alito:

  • Challenges reliance on current “medical consensus,” noting historical examples of politicized medical dogma (e.g., eugenics, Down syndrome) ([07:06]–[07:56]).

• American College of Pediatricians Representative:

  • “We are calling on these medical organizations of the United States ... to follow the science and their European colleagues and immediately stop the promotion of social affirmation, puberty blockers, cross-sex hormones and surgeries for children and adolescents...” ([09:07])
  • “Their protocols are [not] consensus. We are speaking in a loud, unified voice.” ([09:52])

Predictions and Potential Impact

• Kristen Wagoner (ADF):
  • “I'm very optimistic about how the court will rule... it's likely going to be a vote that crosses potential ideological sides... The government has no business peering into the counseling room and censoring conversations.” ([10:01])
  • Expects the decision could come earlier if there’s broad agreement ([10:41]).
  • Notes that 20 states have similar laws; the decision could have nationwide implications ([10:54]).

AG Pam Bondi Clashes with Senate Democrats Over DOJ Conduct

Law and Order Initiatives

• Pam Bondi:
  • Touts DOJ and FBI partnerships in Washington, D.C., and Memphis:
    • “More than 3,800 arrests here in Washington ... 365 illegal guns [seized]. In Memphis ... more than 300 arrests ... 80 illegal guns in just a week.”
    • Credits FBI’s “Summer Heat” operation: “over 8,600 arrests from June to September” ([12:46]).

National Guard Deployments and Federal Overreach

• Megyn Kelly:

  • Highlights deployment of National Guard to support law enforcement, sometimes at Trump’s direction without local invitation (e.g., Portland, Chicago) ([13:49]).

• Pam Bondi (in exchange with Sen. Dick Durbin):

  • Declines to reveal White House consultation: “I am not going to discuss any internal conversations...” ([14:45])
  • Criticizes Democratic opposition:
    • “I wish you loved Chicago as much as you hate President Trump. And currently the National Guard are on the way to Chicago... Your city has a murder rate five times higher than New York’s...” ([14:59])

The Comey Indictment Debate

• Pam Bondi:

  • Declines to discuss whether White House directed Comey’s prosecution:
    • “I know you have said that you will not discuss discussions you’ve had with the president about Comey, is that correct... I’m not going to discuss any conversations.”
    • “James Comey is a pending case ... indicted by one of the most liberal grand juries in the country...” ([16:28]–[17:00])

• Megyn Kelly:

  • Points out perceived double standards in Democrats' concern over political retribution ([17:12]).
  • Notes Biden’s push for Trump’s indictment was publicly reported ([17:12]).
  • Comey’s arraignment set for later that day ([17:12]).

Accusations of DOJ Targeting GOP Senators

• Megyn Kelly:

  • Reports Jack Smith (Special Counsel) obtained GOP lawmakers' phone records as part of the Jan. 6 investigation: “...eight GOP senators and one House member...” ([17:12])

• Pam Bondi (responding to Sen. Blackburn):

  • “We don’t know what all they got. We don’t know who all they tracked. But to tap our phones ... and for them to use it in their investigations, how disgusting.” ([18:34])
  • “The weaponization against you and your colleagues should greatly concern all of us... There was a two-tier system of justice under the Biden administration... No one is above the law. And there is a one-tier system of justice in this Justice Department.” ([19:03])

Noteworthy Quotes and Moments

• Kristen Wagoner:

  • “It is a one-way ratchet... 90% of kids... naturally grow comfortable with their bodies, [but] socially transitioned, 97% will become lifelong medical patients...” ([05:40])
  • “The government has no business peering into the counseling room and censoring conversations.” ([10:01])

• Justice Elena Kagan (summarized by Kelly):

  • “[It] sure sounds like viewpoint discrimination.” ([06:27])

• Justice Samuel Alito:

  • Questions on politicized medical consensus:
    • “Was there a time when many medical professionals thought that certain people should not be permitted to procreate because they had low IQs?” ([07:30])

• Pam Bondi:

  • “I wish you loved Chicago as much as you hate President Trump.” ([14:59])
  • “[T]here is a one-tier system of justice in this Justice Department.” ([19:03])

Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |--------------|-------------------------------------------------------------| | 03:40 | Background on the Colorado therapy law and SCOTUS case | | 04:01 | Kristen Wagoner (ADF) on law's misleading definition | | 05:40 | Wagoner on psychological risks for minors | | 06:27 | Justice Kagan and Gorsuch: viewpoint discrimination | | 07:06-07:56 | Justice Alito: politicized medical consensus | | 09:07 | American College of Pediatricians: call to follow EU science| | 10:01 | Wagoner expresses optimism on SCOTUS outcome | | 10:54 | Nationwide potential impact of the Court's decision | | 12:46 | Pam Bondi on DOJ/FBI operations in high-crime cities | | 14:38 | Bondi/Durbin exchange on National Guard, Chicago crime | | 16:28-17:00 | Bondi grilled on Comey prosecution, denies WH interference | | 18:00-19:03 | DOJ phone records sweep; Bondi on “weaponization” |

Conclusion

This episode provides a detailed, opinionated look at legal and political flashpoints dividing America: the limits of free speech in therapy for minors, and intense partisanship around law enforcement and DOJ conduct. With direct courtroom and Capitol Hill accounts and a sharp critique of both “medical consensus” and Biden-era justice, Megyn Kelly gives listeners an informed, provocative recap of breaking national controversies.