Podcast Summary: "Where The Schools Went, Episode Two: The Battle for Carver"

The MeidasTouch Podcast | August 20, 2025
Host: Ravi Gupta (with interviews and contributions from Carver alumni, community members, and education leaders)
Episode Theme: The story of George Washington Carver High School in New Orleans as a battleground for community, legacy, and the vision for the city's future after Hurricane Katrina.

Episode Overview

This episode delves into the dramatic, nuanced transformation of George Washington Carver High School in New Orleans, tracing its evolution from a proud community anchor to a flashpoint in national debates over educational reform and community self-determination. Through personal stories, historic context, and firsthand interviews, the episode examines what makes a school truly great: academic achievement, tradition, ritual, safety, and the right to self-govern—especially when resources are scarce and a city is in crisis.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Historical Foundation of Carver (00:28 – 07:27)

• New Orleans’ Demographic Shifts:
  In the 1940s, New Orleans experienced a surge in its Black population, but investment in infrastructure lagged severely.
  "By the end of the 1950s, the city had added just two [high schools for Black students]." (02:32)

• Birth of Carver & ‘Desire’ Neighborhood:
  The city’s largest Black housing project, named Desire, and its companion school, Carver, were created on marginalized land—“an educational Soweto” in the words of historian Walter Stern.
  Oscar Brown: "They grew up family of 12 in a one or two bedroom because that's all they was able to afford. And now they had their own rooms and it was affordable." (03:57)

• Community Pillar vs. Institutional Neglect:
  Despite deep pride, Carver and Desire suffered from neglect and underinvestment, setting the stage for later struggles.

2. Carver Before and After Hurricane Katrina (07:27 – 09:54)

• Devastation of Katrina:
  The ninth ward, including Carver and Desire, was decimated by flooding and hazardous chemicals. Carl Washington: "It wiped out the lower nine...It was devastating to that area." (07:08)

• Community Activism for Carver’s Restoration:
  Alumni, parents, and residents fought fiercely to defend Carver’s legacy and ensure its reopening. Carl Washington: "Ain't nowhere in the world we were going to allow someone from somewhere else to come dictate to the community...that Carver was going to be closed for good." (09:33)

3. The Emergence of ‘No Excuses’ Charter Reform: Tsai Academy (09:54 – 14:24)

• Rise of Tsai Academy and Collegiate Academies:
  A new charter operator (led by Ben Markovitz) adopted a tough, data-driven, highly structured model aimed solely at college prep.
  Markovitz: "Our goal of getting all our students ready for college success." (12:42)

• Results & Controversy:
  Tsai boasted impressive graduation rates and high test scores. Critics, however, pointed to high suspensions, teacher demographics (mostly young, white, outsiders), and lack of cultural relevance.

• National Spotlight and Local Friction:
  Oprah awarded Tsai a $1 million grant, and the network was hailed nationally as a model despite its shallow local roots.

4. The ‘Battle’ for Carver’s Charter: Community vs. Reformers (15:39 – 21:08)

• Struggle Over Who Runs Carver:
  Multiple charter applications were submitted—by both outsiders (Collegiate Academies) and Carver alumni/community groups.
  Alumni applications were repeatedly rejected, deepening community resentment. Carl Washington: "Everybody wants to be a charter operator...they all was on the charter hustle." (17:13)

• Outsider vs. Insider Dynamics:
  Collegiate was ultimately approved despite fierce opposition—symbolizing a wider fight over autonomy and historical respect. Chris Meyer (RSD): "The community really wanted to run it themselves...they didn't have any particular education background." (17:48)

• Rejection and Outcry:
  Oscar Brown: "Biggest thing is outsiders coming in...there's always been this political dark cloud over the city of New Orleans." (18:37)

5. Implementation & Culture Clashes (21:35 – 27:35)

• Rollout Confusion and Identity Crisis:
  Carver was split into multiple programs, with Collegiate’s campus in trailers behind the original school. Rituals, culture, and identity—central to alumni—were initially sidelined in favor of test readiness.

• Symbolic Tensions—School Colors and Traditions:
  Changing the school colors almost became a flashpoint.
  Oscar Brown: "The green and orange were sacred...when people see those colors, they tend to know that you're from Carver." (23:51)

• Discipline and Student Uprising:
  By 2013, harsh discipline led to student protests and walkouts.
  Student: "I'm tired of school rules and walking on lines. You get suspended for coughing, you get suspended for sneezing out loud." (27:13)

• Community Outcry and Representation:
  Activists criticized the lack of local, Black leadership and called out the perceived takeover by outsiders.
  Elizabeth Robeson: "All these white people are coming into the city through Teach for America...it was just a taking, a mass taking, of public money." (29:52)

6. Transformation & Synthesis (31:19 – 38:32)

• Post-Protest Reflection and Collaboration:
  Jerrell Bryant (school leader) described learning to collaborate with community critics and alumni.
  Jerrell: "I didn't doubt that they wanted the school to be great." (33:40)

• Policy Shifts:
  Suspension rates were slashed; restorative practices, athletics, marching band, and cultural rituals were revitalized.
  Ben Markovitz: "That's just not what we want to do. It's not what we want to be." (34:04)

• Staff Evolution:
  School staff became more diverse, locally rooted, and stable, including many alumni and long-term community members. Jerrell: "Culture improved when we had great people who were clear on the targets...and we have benefited from Black excellence." (37:43)

7. The New Carver: Identity, Pride, Continuity (38:32 – end)

• Symbolic and Real Progress:
  Athletics, spirit gear, college banners, and trophies stand alongside academic data—a visible synthesis of old and new.

• Enduring Team Culture:
  Practices like staff “morning circles” and innovative teaching remain, but now feel warmer and more inclusive.

• Stakeholder Voices:
  Principal Victor Jones, alumni like Nell Lewis and Eric French, and local leaders articulate a sense of rooted, transformative pride—emphasizing both academic results and community legacy.

  • Victor Jones: "To work at a school where teachers...bring their kids to learn at that school. That is rare." (40:19)
  • Nell Lewis: "Yes, we had sports championships, but the number of scholars that are enrolling in college and actually finishing is really amazing." (42:57)
  • Eric French: "It was like a dream come true to even go on this interview...now I'm going into year eight here, and just how I imagined it." (45:49)

• Lessons Citywide:
  Other charters (like KIPP) embraced true collaboration with neighborhood stakeholders, learning from Carver’s struggles.
  Rhonda Khalifi Alouise (KIPP CEO): "You don't know everything, you should connect with the people who actually have been here for many, many years." (46:52)

Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• Community vs. Control:
  "Ain't nowhere in the world we were going to allow someone from somewhere else to come dictate to the community...that Carver was going to be closed for good."—Carl Washington (09:33)

• Insider/Outsider Line:
  "There are going to be some other arbiters here."—Jerrell Bryant, about learning from alumni (24:42)

• Critique of Early Charter Moves:
  "All these white people are coming into the city through Teach for America...taking mass public money."—Elizabeth Robeson (29:52)

• Reflecting on Change:
  "Culture improved when we had great people who were clear on the targets...and we have benefited from black excellence."—Jerrell Bryant (37:43)

• A Promise Kept, A Legacy Renewed:
  "A new generation of Carver staff, many of them alumni, have stepped into the story not just to teach, but to mentor, coach, and inspire."—Ravi Gupta (46:12)

Key Timestamps for Important Segments

• Carver & Desire neighborhood history: 03:40 – 07:27
• Katrina and its aftermath: 07:27 – 09:54
• Rise of Tsai Academy & charter reform: 09:54 – 14:24
• Community fights for Carver’s future: 15:39 – 21:08
• Rollout and identity conflicts: 21:35 – 23:44
• Discipline policies and walkout: 26:29 – 28:38
• Student, staff, and alumni perspectives: 31:19 – 38:32
• Transformation and current status: 38:32 – end

Conclusion

“The Battle for Carver” is a rich, intimate portrait of how a community school in post-Katrina New Orleans became a proxy for broader political and cultural fights: academic urgency versus tradition, local voice versus outside reform. Ultimately, it’s a hopeful story—one where hard-won synthesis is possible and where the path to an equitable, excellent education runs through deep collaboration, humility, and honoring local legacy. Carver’s journey is both cautionary tale and roadmap for cities nationwide grappling with similar questions.

For listeners who want to explore further, the episode encourages subscribing to the full "Where the Schools Went" series, available wherever you get your podcasts.