← The Messy Parts
The Messy Parts
Ana Gasteyer: SNL, Wine, Fame, and Staying Funny | The Messy Parts Podcast #6
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- [00:00]
Ana Gasteyer
I give myself one really sad night with a giant bottle of white wine and a half a Xanax and I sleep really, really well, where I'm like, just petty and fucking small. And I look up who else's projects got picked up and I stomp my feet and whatever. And then the next day I wake up and I realize that I have other ideas and a really killer family and an amazing career that everybody wishes that they had. Lots of people wish that they had. And start over, Just do something different. Whatever it all this is the thing, it's so corny, but it does sort of all work out the way it's supposed to and usually you don't know why. And again, I sound like I'm like a bumper sticker, but, you know, it's Marty short, like, famously has this pie that he keeps in his head, which is like one third work, one third family, one third friends, and that all three have to be in balance at all times.
- [00:56]
Mariam Banakaram
Hi, I'm Mariam Banakaram, host of the Messy Parts podcast. Today we're going to have on Ana Gasteyer. Actress, singer, comedian. You know her from snl, but you also know her from her Broadway roles, from Elphaba and Wicked to the sitcom Suburgatory. Ana has incredible range. She is relentless and she's incredibly talented. She has many nuggets to impart, including don't compare yourself. And also, don't wait for permission. Just go for it. You're gonna wanna hear this conversation.
- [01:27]
Ana Gasteyer
You know a lot.
- [01:28]
Mariam Banakaram
Well, I now know even more.
- [01:30]
Ana Gasteyer
Amazing.
- [01:30]
Mariam Banakaram
So we met after your SNL days.
- [01:33]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah.
- [01:34]
Mariam Banakaram
You grew up playing the violin and sort of having this very classically trained.
- [01:39]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, sorta. I mean, yes, I did. I played violin and I played and I was a classical singer. I grew up in a very kind of traditional music family, I guess would be the thing. They loved Broadway, though. Like, we listened to Broadway a lot. We listened to. We had a lot of, like, soundtracks and things like that as well, but we didn't like. It wasn't something that I thought I would do. Exactly.
- [01:59]
Mariam Banakaram
I read that you chose Northwestern because they really wanted you to have the ba.
- [02:04]
Ana Gasteyer
I chose Northwestern because I was the only school I got into. I understand.
- [02:09]
Mariam Banakaram
I got into bartered off the wait list. So, you know, we talked about that.
- [02:12]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. Which really, really beefs up your gratitude, by the way, over the years. I know. Yeah. So I wanted to go. What I really wanted to was go to theater school. So I played violin and then I kind of bargained out. I was good at Violin. But it was a very. It's a very lonely enterprise, classical music. It's just hours and hours and hours by yourself. I knew pretty early on that I could sing and so I bargained out for voice lessons. And then I wanted to go to like. I really just wanted to go get a theater degree. I wanted to go.
- [02:41]
Mariam Banakaram
Did you do theater and.
- [02:42]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, I did tons and tons of theater. I was like the star of all of school. Yeah, right. In middle school and high school and like did theater camps and did. I did programs and stuff. I mean, it wasn't like jazz hands or anything like that, but I liked it and I knew I was good at it. And so I wanted to do like Juilliard or North Carolina School for the Arts. But my parents were insistent that I get a BA And Northwestern had a five year program where you could get a music degree and a liberal arts degree that I applied for. But really I auditioned very well at that school. So that's how I got in.
- [03:16]
Mariam Banakaram
And they wanted you to have a BA because they wanted you to have something to fall back on.
- [03:20]
Ana Gasteyer
Yes, this is the way parents think.
- [03:23]
Mariam Banakaram
Turns out they do think that way.
- [03:24]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, they do. All of them, including me, by the way. And I have artistic children. We have children of our own.
- [03:29]
Mariam Banakaram
We have children of our own and we think that way.
- [03:32]
Ana Gasteyer
Well, actually, you want to know something? It's not even really about falling back on it, I will argue, because I am a huge believer in the four year educational experience. I wish everybody could have it and I don't even care if they study the thing that they are going to be. I think we have way too much focus on kind of a rarefied, you know, ascent towards excellence and having to study one thing. It's really just for me, the things I really got out of college were exposure to all kinds of different points of view. I went to school in a different region than I grew up in. I met all different kind of kids that I knew. I mean, you know, again, the east coast bubble is really tiny. And I think the collective of like going to school in the Midwest, like I didn't even know that fraternities existed before I went to college. I thought it was like something from the 50s, but so that's why I went to Northwestern was like, I got into the voice department and I went for one year as a voice major. And I absolutely, I hated being a classical music student. I was bored out of my mind and a bad music student, I might add. They had theater or they had classical music and there Were like showbiz kids, Midwestern kids. Don't fuck around at all about musical theater. They all like, they're deep, really good. They all work at Six Flags over the summer, and really good tap dancers and all that kind of dinner theater. They all had their equity cards, so it was a little bit overwhelming that way. But I just got to dance around in a lot of that. And I ended up having a very bizarre, confusing resume building. I worked with Mary Zimmerman, the performance art level phenom of the theater, who was getting her PhD at Northwestern, and did all these incredible shows. And then I did. I did a ton of improv comedy. And I joined the improv comedy group there. Cause it was Chicago. It's like the birthplace of improv comedy. So I met the comedy people. I was like, this is the thing I'm gonna do. And I learned how to write.
- [05:21]
Mariam Banakaram
Why did you know comedy was for you?
- [05:24]
Ana Gasteyer
I didn't really. I just met those people. I knew I didn't. Everyone I went to high school with was funny. So I didn't really think that I had a unique talent. But when I auditioned for the improv show, which I just auditioned for, because everybody did, like, all the fun theater people were auditioning. So I auditioned and I knew. I suddenly realized, oh, I think I'm pretty good at this. And these people are like, tribally, my people.
- [05:46]
Mariam Banakaram
What does that mean? What does your people mean?
- [05:48]
Ana Gasteyer
It's hard to explain. It's just like a weird mutant second skin. When you meet people that think like you, you know, you're just like. I had no idea that this was something that I had in common with other people. The way their brains work, what they think is funny, the way they want to write, what they want to do. It's just that moment that you find. And again, by the way, I don't even think you have one set of people. I have lots of them. I also have musical theater people that I also feel the same way about now that I do so many Broadway shows. Like, I just think there's different. You have a kinship with a certain kind of person, a person who thinks the way you do, the person that finds things funny, that makes things up. And I will say the sort of unifying principle of those people that I met at Northwestern. And by the way, you know, some of them weren't even in the improv scene, now that I think about it, they were makers. They were all makers and doers. They were all motivated to not sit around waiting to get cast in something. They were very. And that's been like, the guiding principle of my entire career.
- [06:43]
Mariam Banakaram
And then. Were they all funny?
- [06:45]
Ana Gasteyer
Very, very funny. And learning early on, it was. You know, we went to college at the same time, so it was the late 80s. It was like I wasn't gonna be cast at that point. I was. We have a joke, like, in my family, I was ethnic in the 80s. Like, I. Cause I had curly hair. You know, I just. I didn't look like, you know, the traditional. Yeah. I mean, if you were a brunette, you look like Demi Moore. But otherwise it was like Courtney Thorne Smith. You know, that was sort of the option.
- [07:12]
Mariam Banakaram
So, yes, we were the 90210, over.
- [07:15]
Ana Gasteyer
The hills, whatever that was. Yeah. I just didn't fit any of those little boxes, so I just started writing for myself. And that's what that group predominantly did.
- [07:23]
Mariam Banakaram
Did that make you feel like an outsider?
- [07:25]
Ana Gasteyer
I mean, I always have been an outsider, even growing up the way that I did. Like, characterizing it as, like, oh, I went to Sidwell, this little bubble. I lived in the wrong neighborhood. I lived near the Capitol in D.C. which in the 70s and 80s was like a very kind of. It was gentrifying, but it was pretty rough around the edges in some parts of it. And, like, we didn't have the subway. There wasn't subway access. I took the bus an hour and a half to school. So I definitely. My dad. We were not nearly as wealthy as the people that I went to school with. I mean, I figured out later I was like, oh, well, you know, my parents could still send me to private school. I mean, it was a different time in the 70s, and you could maybe do that. But I was definitely an outsider. I was. I was. And I went to a public school, public elementary school. There were seven white kids in the whole elementary school. So I was an outsider in elementary school. And then I was sort of an outsider in the fancy uptown school. And then I was an outsider as an east coaster in a Midwest setting. And I was an outsider as a comedian in musical theater. And I was an outsider. You know, I've always. I mean, I don't. I don't spend a lot of time worrying about it. I think it actually just means you have a different and more interesting perspective.
- [08:28]
Mariam Banakaram
I actually think it fuels you.
- [08:30]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. And I think it. I think it makes it irrelevant in a weird way. You're just like, okay, well, these are my sets of circumstances. And the more I meet people, the more I realize. I mean, it's cr. You know, you meet. Everybody has that from a Different angle, no matter where they are.
- [08:44]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, so you're. You're there, you find your people. I kind of love that. And then you move to la.
- [08:49]
Ana Gasteyer
I just, like, fell around California for two years. I went up to San Francisco for part of that and then moved back down. And then I just started, as many people do, around 24. I just started to buckle down. And that's when I started classes at the Groundlings. And I got cast in a tour show. I got cast in the first it's so Funny. Jeffrey Sellers, the big Broadway producer, produced Hamilton. It was his first show that he produced. We would do staged productions, like exact episodes of the Brady Bunch. It was called the Real Life Brady Bunch and it toured across the country. It was like this huge success. We played, like every college across the entire country. It was incredible.
- [09:32]
Mariam Banakaram
Oh, my nose. Marsha Brady.
- [09:35]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, that was one of them. Oh, my nose. And Jan. Jan. I can't remember all of them now, but anyway, yeah, so when I first.
- [09:44]
Mariam Banakaram
Moved to the States, I watched a lot of Brady Bears.
- [09:46]
Ana Gasteyer
So did I. I found it so comforting. And again, I'd never been to California, so I didn't know anyone who had a house like that. I actually think about it all the time. I think about how our generation had all of these kind of touch points that made a ton of things seem common knowledge.
- [10:02]
Mariam Banakaram
Because there was only three channels.
- [10:03]
Ana Gasteyer
There were only three channels, exactly.
- [10:05]
Mariam Banakaram
So you do the Groundlings. How long do you do that for?
- [10:08]
Ana Gasteyer
I did that for two stints and then I got put into the main company and then I got snl, like, almost immediately. I mean.
- [10:14]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, I'm sorry. So let's go back to that. What do you mean? Like, you make that sound so easy.
- [10:19]
Ana Gasteyer
It wasn't easy, but it was how it went.
- [10:22]
Mariam Banakaram
Did they find you? Did you have to audition?
- [10:23]
Ana Gasteyer
So the way that that went down is that, frankly, Will Ferrell was. So in 95, they did a total cast rehaul and turnover. I don't know if you remember that, but SNL was like Saturday Night Dead and all that crap. As it does, it cycles in and out of favorability, and it was definitely at its low point. So they did sort of a complete overhaul in 95, and then they sort of did a couple of tweaks in 96 where they added. They just did a. They just held auditions for. They wanted maybe a black guy and maybe another woman. They weren't. You know, they were just kind of like, how could we even out this cast? And so Will Ferrell. Actually, I didn't know him very well, but I'd done like a few like, improv sets with him and stuff at the Groundlings. And he just. We liked one another and he suggested like four or five of us that were in the company at the time. And so we sent tapes in and they flew me. It's really crazy. I think I'm not 100% sure of this because I was in such a blackout for the cause. They flew us. You know, you fly back to. It was weird. We were tested in 8H. I was in LA at the time.
- [11:31]
Mariam Banakaram
Studio 8H, in 30 rack.
- [11:33]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. So it's really odd because if you live in la, you're used to like driving, parking at a movie studio, like going in, doing your audition, leaving. Like, I kind of had that system down. But then to go into, you know, you know. Do you remember, like when you first got to New York? I mean, even coming here as a kid, I had an aunt here growing up. It wasn't like my first time in New York, but it may as well have been because that sort of. Sometimes I'm so sad that I don't feel this way anymore. Like the. Just the intensity of the vertical experience where you're like looking up and the beehive of life. And they put everybody those days who came in for SNL at the Paramount Hotel. Oh, yeah. Which was like the most 90s in the elevators, like super dark. It was like a disco hotel. Yeah. Just terrible. And the rooms were super, super dark. So small.
- [12:21]
Mariam Banakaram
They were also really small.
- [12:22]
Ana Gasteyer
Postage stamp, like. Yeah. New York City at its best. So I auditioned and the big thing. Yeah, it was totally mind blowing. I mean, it was, it was.
- [12:33]
Mariam Banakaram
I don't know what an audition looks like. What is that? Like, you show up and they give you.
- [12:36]
Ana Gasteyer
An SNL audition is a really different audition than an audition. Usually an audition, you're just going in and you know the words and you've learned the. But for an SNL audition, you know, they've done a lot of documentaries and stuff on it, especially this year because of the 50th. But it's like a little one person show. Like, you basically, you have to write it yourself. I did.
- [12:56]
Mariam Banakaram
Yeah, you did.
- [12:56]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. But I did like my. You know, I had characters and stuff that I did at snl. So I mean at the ground, like. So I kind of like worked it. You. You put together like a little one person show. It's like five minutes. They give you some rough guidelines. You know, I imagine it changes every now and again, but it's pretty consistent. And you just.
- [13:14]
Mariam Banakaram
Were you terrified?
- [13:15]
Ana Gasteyer
Yes, terrified. Terrified.
- [13:18]
Mariam Banakaram
And when it ended, did you think you got the gig?
- [13:20]
Ana Gasteyer
No. This has only happened a few times in my life. I can't always pull this out. I wish that I could live by this philosophy, but this is the philosophy to live by.
- [13:34]
Mariam Banakaram
I'm ready for it.
- [13:35]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, you kind of live this way, so you probably don't need this pep talk. But I do tell young performers all the time, there have been a few auditions in my life where I've left everything on the table, where the win was not whether I got the job. It was whether or not I did what I could have done. And most of the time that I've done that I've gotten the job, coincidentally. But so I knew that I had not. I knew that I did not want to leave anything to chance, that I didn't want to walk out and say, like, I wish I'd prepared more, or I wish, you know, whatever. And I knew that Will somehow got word to me. They famously don't laugh in SNL auditions. It's kind of a dick move. But they totally.
- [14:18]
Mariam Banakaram
Because the energy of the audience would actually help.
- [14:20]
Ana Gasteyer
Well, and also, like, if you're a comedian, the actual cadence of the rhythm of it in your head is a really specific way, if it's material that you're accustomed to. But partially, I think it's like some kind of litmus test that they established years and years ago. But also, it was like, three guys. You know, it was just a whole different. When I look back at myself, I'm like, I can't even believe I did that. But Charlie, who, you know, my husband, we knew about this, so he would.
- [14:43]
Mariam Banakaram
Were you dating at the time?
- [14:44]
Ana Gasteyer
We were engaged. That was actually the bigger drama.
- [14:47]
Mariam Banakaram
Charlie, who you went to high school with.
- [14:48]
Ana Gasteyer
Yes, but we didn't start going out in high school until later. We were engaged. So the bigger drama was SNL came knocking, and I was like, you know, in the last six weeks before my wedding, so I was in like, a real, like, oh, my God, what am I gonna do if I get this? And, you know, are my WASPy in laws gonna kill me if I have to pull out of the wedding day? And, you know, just all that stuff. Cause I didn't know, like, if the timing was gonna work out or anything. It did it all. But anyway, he just sat and pretended. He just sat like Mount Rushmore and stared at me. And I practiced. I just would run my audition, like, relentlessly without reaction. So I knew what it sounded like, without reaction, over and over and over again so that I was comfortable doing it, like, with nothing.
- [15:35]
Mariam Banakaram
So you put it all on the table and you leave and you're not sure.
- [15:39]
Ana Gasteyer
I confess that I don't really remember the timeline. Then I waited forever. Then. That's the part I don't really remember. But I will say this. I left the audition. I knew that I'd done everything I could, and that was all I needed to do. Somebody was on the elevator, and they're like, hey, I just saw your audition. That was great. And I don't know, I just knew that it was good. I knew that I hadn't just, by my standards, chunked anything. Like, I knew that I'd. Like, everything had seemed to work. And I think I got, like, a couple chuckles. Like, I just. Like, I just let it go. Like, I. Yeah, I let it go. Okay. And so this is why I say it's like a teachable moment. Because, like, for example, with Wicked, I did the same thing, which was another major milestone career moment for me, because after I left snl, I was determined to work on Broadway, which is easier said than done.
- [16:28]
Mariam Banakaram
And we have to unpack that, because it's not a natural transition.
- [16:32]
Ana Gasteyer
No, not at all. And every. All of them are worlds that are very hard to break into and require. Yeah.
- [16:37]
Mariam Banakaram
You're like, oh, I'm amazing at comedy.
- [16:39]
Ana Gasteyer
Guess what?
- [16:40]
Mariam Banakaram
I'm gonna go do a very difficult, you know, vocal thing on Broadway. You know, the.
- [16:45]
Ana Gasteyer
Actually harder in some ways, because people get very. It's really hard to work on Broadway, and they work their asses off and make $5 and understandably, are very annoyed when television people show up and want to do it, too.
- [16:57]
Mariam Banakaram
Especially comedians.
- [16:58]
Ana Gasteyer
Especially comedians. I don't know. But, I mean, it turned out fine. But it was. It was. I knew that I had, like, again, it's an impossible role, and I had to sing as well as I possibly could. And when I did that one, I did not get cast. It was to replace Idina Menzel.
- [17:15]
Mariam Banakaram
So you auditioned to be the second Elphaba.
- [17:18]
Ana Gasteyer
So, yes, famously, they called me in to be for the final workshop with Adina and this girl, Julia Murney. All of everybody ended up being an Elphaba down the line. But it was my last season of snl, and I was pregnant with Frances, and so I didn't go. And then they brought me in when Adina was leaving, and I made that final callback. And then, like, two months later, they called, and they're like, hey, we're going to Start a Chicago company. We want you to start the Chicago company. So again, like, you don't always. This is the part of my little like, pep talk. Like you don't know where it's going to play out or how. But it was such a perfect scenario because number one, because it was an original company, we had like a full rehearsal process. We had, you know, the original director, we had the original choreographer. Like everything kind of existed in a very. Wasn't just like getting plugged into a Broadway show, which is usually how it happens. And you have two weeks and you're just like vomited into the existing show, which is a nightmare.
- [18:17]
Mariam Banakaram
But I want to go back because what you're describing, which, you know, amazing. You've had incredible success. I got to come to Chicago and actually see you perform and as Elphaba, which was incredible. But there are all these moments that are actually quite difficult along this journey. You're getting married and you're having this incredible career defining moment. Right then you're pregnant. You're like on the last season of snl. I mean, these are difficult things to juggle.
- [18:44]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, right.
- [18:45]
Mariam Banakaram
And you've picked a career where, I mean, arguably difficult to manage. Yeah, all those things because you're sort of at the mercy of the show.
- [18:53]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, I would not have. I mean, I certainly didn't know that at the time I picked it. Do you know? Yeah, I mean, I would. Yeah, it's really itinerant performing for a living. It's not for the faint of heart.
- [19:07]
Mariam Banakaram
Did you. What made you decide to leave snl?
- [19:11]
Ana Gasteyer
I was done. I'd run, you know, I'd run its course. It was six years. I, Charlie, my husband got his MBA in the middle. He was. We were ready to start a family. I was 35 at the time. Those contracts were five year contracts and I'd stayed an extra year. And I think I was just like, yeah, this is a good number. I've produced a lot of material. You know, the show is tumultuous and has its ups and downs and it's exhausting emotionally at times. And I was like, I don't wanna have a baby and sort of be buffeted around the sea of work anxiety. No one had ever had a baby there. And there are not a lot of roadmaps for how people do it. And let's be completely frank. Like no one makes it easy. Even now. There's no, there's no child care. There's no, like you. You and I, among our many, you know, shared experiences, like the feel like, 80% of what you do with other working women once you have babies is like, run around wondering how to do it all.
- [20:05]
Mariam Banakaram
You know, I say that, you know, I rely on strangers, like, oh, my God, you're going to pick up my child.
- [20:10]
Ana Gasteyer
I don't know.
- [20:10]
Mariam Banakaram
You okay?
- [20:11]
Ana Gasteyer
Totally. Or like, you know, just the panicky. Like, just throw money at. Just throw money at it. You know, just the amount of, like. I wish it were easier for people. I wish that there was a system in place that would help not. Not penalize people.
- [20:23]
Mariam Banakaram
There is no such thing as balance. And there's no such thing as balance.
- [20:26]
Ana Gasteyer
I wish that I felt that there's no such thing as balance. That's true. Yeah. And that. And that's where I speak very, you know, again, when I speak to students. And I. I never want to be like an old. Like, you don't want to go into show business, you know? Cause I. I hate those people. I. I hate show business is so fun. I love it. I love the people. Like I said, it started with this idea of tribe. Like, doing a Broadway show is like, my children say, like, you are so happy when you were doing this. You're nicer. And even though I'm like, exhausted, you.
- [20:55]
Mariam Banakaram
Know, but you get a family every show. You get a family.
- [20:58]
Ana Gasteyer
You get a family. You get your sort of yayas. You get to sing every day, which literally, statistically is shown to make people are happier who sing every day. And I think there is a thing, if you are born with the ability to sing and you have musicianship in your. Whatever God given or whatever you want to call it, doing it with other people who also have that. There's just an incredible sort of vibrational kinship that happens that's really exciting to people. But. But it is a. It's a grind. It is a miserable grind of a job. I've missed out on some things, you know, and I've missed some.
- [21:32]
Mariam Banakaram
Like, I didn't have family close by who could just come take care of my children. It would have been nice.
- [21:35]
Ana Gasteyer
And I've missed, like, weddings and bar mitzvahs and things that matter. I mean, my best friend from elementary school, like, childhood, practically. My sister, like, grew up next door. I missed. She's divorced. She doesn't, you know, she's. I'm still sad I missed her wedding. Oh, no.
- [21:50]
Mariam Banakaram
I had those moments.
- [21:51]
Ana Gasteyer
I'm like, I can't believe I wasn't there. You know, it's crazy. And it was to make like a commercial parody for Fake Gatorade for Saturday Night Live, you know what you do? I remember, but I didn't know how to ask. Also, I didn't know how to say, like, this is a really important thing. And I feel like. I think I. I do think this was gendered. I do think that I had to say, like, well, I mean, I guess it's all SNL people, but, you know, the sense of, like, opportunity there. Like, I just didn't know how to say I'm not available until next Monday because I have a personal family obligation. I just didn't know.
- [22:22]
Mariam Banakaram
It's funny, I didn't know how to say that either. I remember I was getting an award, and I actually got a job at NBC. And so I had to accept the award, like, a month into the job, and my boss wanted me in Chicago for something, and I said to the awardees, I'm sorry, can somebody else come and accept the award on my behalf? I mean, now looking back, I'm so mortified I did that, but I didn't feel like I had.
- [22:42]
Ana Gasteyer
I know. I get it.
- [22:43]
Mariam Banakaram
Permission to say a month in, like, you know what? I can't come to Chicago that day.
- [22:48]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. But.
- [22:50]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, I want to go back for one second. So you're on the show for six years. You clearly care about Tribe and community. I actually know this about you just because you're that person. And I remember reading that you said working on snl, it was not like a safe space. Right. It wasn't like a hug fest.
- [23:09]
Ana Gasteyer
Right.
- [23:09]
Mariam Banakaram
You were like, clearly there's this sense of, like, amazing talent, but also sort of a zero sum game.
- [23:15]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah.
- [23:16]
Mariam Banakaram
What kept you there for so long? And was that hard?
- [23:25]
Ana Gasteyer
Well, I don't even know how to answer that. It's like, I wouldn't have. There's nothing comparable. It's like, at the time, it was very hard. Definitely. Weirdly, in comparable community now. I mean, people have survived it. That's the interesting thing. When you come to the other side of it, you're like, could work with any one of those people and fast. That's the other thing. The shorthand is incredible. Dratch and I are writing a musical right now. Just, like, the speed with which we.
- [23:59]
Mariam Banakaram
Well, you sort of lived through fire together with Rachel in some ways.
- [24:02]
Ana Gasteyer
But all SNL people also have, like, it's back to that brain thing. Like, there's a way that we can solve a problem quickly. The flow that people that comedians get into when they're writing collaboratively together is like, no other high that I probably have in my life. That is a thrilling, deeply addictive proposition and just beyond fun.
- [24:28]
Mariam Banakaram
So fun.
- [24:28]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. I mean, so, yes, it is miserable and it's hard and it's a time pressure and it's in the public eye and everybody's got a comment on how different you look when they meet you in real life. And, you know, all that stuff. I didn't enjoy that part of it. I don't really love the fame part of things. It's not very fun for me. But the creative part was incredibly intoxicating. I mean, always there's, you know, the hardest I've laughed. I mean, even just doing the 50th again, like, and you always think, oh, did I make that up? And nope, there's just this, like, there's a secondhand, deep, profound joy. And leaving it is always hard, you know, and I left. There's times I wish that I'd stayed. I mean, when I see, like, how long Maya was able to stay with Maya Rudolph was able to stay after she had babies and how that worked for her and she worked that for herself really well. But again, I'm not a person who can even ask a day off for a wedding, so how would I possibly have. I just know about myself that I wouldn't have been good at that, you know, especially because I was the first one. And I felt like all eyes were on how I was going to pull it off. And so at that point I was just like, I think I'm going to step out. I've gotten what I need out of this and figure out the rest. But it was a little lonely, you know, to do that 100%. I didn't really, like, know any other moms like me as a result, with my first.
- [25:42]
Mariam Banakaram
So that's being the first means.
- [25:44]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, it was a little lonely, it seems.
- [25:46]
Mariam Banakaram
And I don't know, you can correct me that now post snl, there's definitely like a female support group that you guys have formed.
- [25:54]
Ana Gasteyer
Definitely, yeah.
- [25:55]
Mariam Banakaram
How did that happen?
- [25:56]
Ana Gasteyer
At the 40th is when it started so about 10 years ago there. And actually, really there were like, it sort of followed history because there was Betty White hosted and a bunch of us came back for the Mother's Day episode, which was Betty White, she was the oldest host at the time. And. And it was just really nice. Like we were reconnecting as almost all of us were mothers at that point. I think Rachel was pregnant with Eli and just kind of a different perspective. Not just, you know, hotshot late night comedy girls, but people with more dimensional approaches to Life and womanhood and whatever. And so we. Yeah, we just started spending time together, and then we started having these, like, dinners and reunions and then these milestone birthdays that we celebrate together. And so.
- [26:47]
Mariam Banakaram
That's amazing.
- [26:47]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, it's really nice. It's really nice to have, like I said earlier, I mean, just collaboratively, too. Like, you know, we help each other out a lot. There's not that many of us on the planet. It's a very weird thing to have gone through as a human being and then add to that as a, you know, throw gender into that. You know, we were greatly outnumbered. And I think it's just. And we're all super. We share an incredible work ethic and great sense of humor and perspective. So it's. Yeah, there's a lot of wisdom, I think, that we share with one another. I mean.
- [27:21]
Mariam Banakaram
And now projects.
- [27:21]
Ana Gasteyer
Not to be all, like, corny about it. Yeah, some projects. And all of us collaborate. Like, if you're. You know, we're all called upon to host and, you know, we all do. You get sort of. We share a certain present at a thing and, hey, I need jokes for this. And is this. Does this work? And, you know, I love that. Yeah, it's nice. It's really nice.
- [27:40]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, so you leave and you. Did you know you were going to try Wicked? I mean, did you know as you were transitioning out because you began to do.
- [27:48]
Ana Gasteyer
I did. I knew. So at the time. Again, remember, I left Saturday Night Live in 2002, which seems late, but really was historically not. Still not. It was pre 30 rock. It was pre Parks and Rec again. There were. I was auditioning early on to be like, Adam Carolla's wife in Adam Carolla's sitcom. And I was like, you know what? I don't want to be Adam Carolla's wife on Adam Carolla's sitcom. And my manager was a big, big comedy manager at the time. And he was like, you're not going to work in film. Women don't work in film. There's no comedy parts for women in film. And he wasn't wrong. I mean, it was like Seth Rogen's the beginning of the bromance explosion that's still happening. And there just weren't, like, a lot of looks around. And so I went in one week to see Wonderful Town and Wicked, actually, and there was on Broadway, and I can sing. And I was like, oh, well, obviously I can work on Broadway and I can stay in New York and craft my own.
- [28:50]
Mariam Banakaram
That's an amazing transition. Cause, you know, once you get locked into people seeing you one way, getting them to see you in different ways, not so easy.
- [28:57]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. And it wasn't like I did, like, comedy roles. I went right into, like, Elphaba, which was kind of weird, but. Yeah. So I did five Broadway shows and a bunch of those kind of things, and then I start working on television again, so Suburgatory.
- [29:14]
Mariam Banakaram
Right. And so you started actually, like, working regularly, not just like, you know, coming on one episode.
- [29:20]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah.
- [29:21]
Mariam Banakaram
What was that like?
- [29:22]
Ana Gasteyer
Well, those are those sweet jobs. I had a couple of series in a row where I was like part of a big cast, working a few days a week, you know, where you're not the lead and you can. One was in Toronto. It was so easy. I could be home every weekend. Then, you know, one was Suburgatory, was in la, but it was fine. Like, I worked, you know, whatever, two, three days a week at the most and not every week. So that was great. It was just, you know, easy for me. That was like, TV's so easy after you've done theater for whatever, a million years. Like, there's so much free food, there's literally like miracles. They pay for lunch, you know, have services, literally. And yeah, I like working. I really like doing ensemble television. It's really fun.
- [30:05]
Mariam Banakaram
It comes back to the collective.
- [30:07]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. I like being a part of a community. I love. Yeah, for sure. There's just something really goofy and fun and easy about it, and it's kind of that SNL thing. I love the read through table. I love comedy writers, you know, all of that. There's not that there's not enough of it happening. I hope that the heyday is not completely over, but it feels.
- [30:24]
Mariam Banakaram
We all hope the heyday's done.
- [30:25]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, I know, I know.
- [30:27]
Mariam Banakaram
I don't think stories will go away.
- [30:30]
Ana Gasteyer
No, I hope not.
- [30:32]
Mariam Banakaram
No, I don't think so. I mean, they've lasted this long.
- [30:33]
Ana Gasteyer
I feel like comedies, though, are on. I'm like, where are the comedies? Where's the.
- [30:36]
Mariam Banakaram
We could all use more.
- [30:37]
Ana Gasteyer
We could use a little more, like I Love Lucy. I just want, like, big, dumb comedies, you know, with wigs.
- [30:42]
Mariam Banakaram
Yes. And less stress.
- [30:44]
Ana Gasteyer
I'd like less stress. Yeah.
- [30:45]
Mariam Banakaram
I find myself not being able to watch stressful shows.
- [30:48]
Ana Gasteyer
No, I know. Same.
- [30:49]
Mariam Banakaram
So that's why I like some comedies.
- [30:50]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah.
- [30:50]
Mariam Banakaram
That's actually why I love hacks. I'm like, just make me.
- [30:52]
Ana Gasteyer
Oh, my God, the best. Love hacks. Exactly.
- [30:54]
Mariam Banakaram
I think the other thing that really strikes me is that you have incredible range.
- [30:57]
Ana Gasteyer
Right.
- [30:57]
Mariam Banakaram
So you Do a jazz record. I mean, you're willing to just completely go left, right, center. What is it about you that does that?
- [31:05]
Ana Gasteyer
I like making things. I like you do too. I mean, look where we are. But, you know, I don't. I'm not very good at sitting around. And I love the feeling. And, you know, for. For all of Saturday night live for 20 years, I was producing and writing, but I wasn't getting credited for that. And that's one regret. If I could go back again. Trailblazing loneliness. Stupid, stupid. I should have worked harder to produce shows off the gate, but I didn't. But that's all I've really been doing. I mean, my records, my. My one woman shows, my cause. I tour with the Christmas records. And again, singing is.
- [31:37]
Mariam Banakaram
I've loved seeing you at Joe's Pub.
- [31:39]
Ana Gasteyer
It's really fun. Yeah. And having a Christmas album means that you. Or holiday album, it means that you. You have sort of a thing you do every holiday. And we have, like, regulars now, and we always sell out, you know, within the first couple of days. It's really fun. So.
- [31:53]
Mariam Banakaram
Because we are both women who've juggled. What is that like? Like, what advice would you have for young women who are coming up? I mean, not, not. Not the kind of advice that says, don't do this, because guess what? If you love what you do, you're gonna go do it. What useful tips should we give them?
- [32:10]
Ana Gasteyer
I mean, I think your first thing you said is the right. Is not. Not do it. Because what's gonna feed you? And if you're not gonna have time enough in your day to have, you're gonna be busy no matter what you do. So you may as well have it be something that you love, right? For your 15 minutes with your children. They say you're a lot nicer when you're doing musical theater.
- [32:27]
Mariam Banakaram
I definitely am. You know, I'm nicer when I come home. If I have a job I like.
- [32:31]
Ana Gasteyer
That's exactly right. So find something about it, you know, it doesn't have to be whatever those years ago I did that, Myers Briggs or whatever, you know, to try to determine what kind of jobs. And again, what does that mean? Do you like having a community? Do you like working remotely? Do you. Do you get your energy from other people? Do you get your energy, you know, from ideating by yourself? Like, those are good things to know about yourself, I think, out of the gate.
- [32:56]
Mariam Banakaram
You know, one thing I've noticed, because I was just on a panel and a woman came up to me and said she wanted to be more of a writer. Not theater writer, film writer. She just wanted to write more, and she wanted to know how to transition into a writing job. And I was like, why don't you just start a substack? I mean, I just think there's so many more opportunities for this generation. Like, in our era, you had to get into sitcom, you had to get into shows. Now people get famous from doing tiktoks or substacks.
- [33:24]
Ana Gasteyer
Don't you have to tell yourself, though? I mean, we both have daughters, right? We both have daughters with ambitions. And probably the thing I carp at her the most is like, who are you waiting for to tell you that you're allowed to do this? You have to go do it. You just. There's no.
- [33:39]
Mariam Banakaram
And does she.
- [33:40]
Ana Gasteyer
I think every. I think she's getting there. I think I had to. There was a day at which I had to say to someone at a party, and these are all, like, the tricks, right? I mean, acting is the funniest thing, because most of the time you're not doing it. It's what you want to do. So when someone at a party says, what do you do for a living? So quick for you to be like, I'm a temp, you know, or whatever the thing is. But actually, just stating the truth, I'm an actress. You know, I want to work as an actress. I'm developing a show for myself right now. When I learned that trick, when people were like, what are you working on right now? Because that's all anyone ever asks a performer. And you're like, well, I'm writing this and I have this idea, and I have this. You actually have all of that agency. And when you can kind of state it to somebody, you know, I love running. I train for marathons. It's probably my happy thing that I do, or whatever the thing is, you.
- [34:30]
Mariam Banakaram
Know, so it's about believing yourself and also being willing to say it out loud with confidence.
- [34:36]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah. You have to be the first advocate, the very first one. Not waiting for someone outside you to tell you what you're good at or what you are allowed to do. It's really like the thing your aspiration is, your identity. It's the thing that you want to be that gets you out of bed every morning. Yeah.
- [34:53]
Mariam Banakaram
But I'm willing to embarrass myself, like, okay, I'm going to do a podcast. And if it doesn't work out like it does, I mean, it doesn't mean I'm not terrified or that I have no fear. Right. But I'm willing to go for it and put myself out there. I mean, I was not a cool kid, and I seem to not have been too worried about that.
- [35:09]
Ana Gasteyer
That's a great one.
- [35:10]
Mariam Banakaram
Yeah, but, I mean, it was a lucky accident.
- [35:13]
Ana Gasteyer
Yeah, but it's a lucky accident to know that it doesn't matter. At the end of the day, who cares? Literally, who cares?
- [35:19]
Mariam Banakaram
But that's a hard thing to impart to somebody.
- [35:22]
Ana Gasteyer
Absolutely, it is. But that's where you're like, whatever, play the tape. How bad did it go? You know, I have done some really embarrassing bad jobs. Humiliating. I have been really badly excoriated online. I will say this. This is another one I've been thinking about, because I just had my birthday and I don't know, I was just getting pensive, and it's really hard in the world of the Internet and Instagram and everything else. Stop comparing yourself to other people.
- [35:50]
Mariam Banakaram
Oh, my God, that's a tough one.
- [35:51]
Ana Gasteyer
If I could go back and talk to myself at 25, it's so fucking irrelevant what anyone else is doing. It has nothing to do with my path. Nothing. But it's so easy to look this way and look this way, and it's. Especially in acting. You're like, there's literally nothing that you could control except for what you can do yourself, how well you prepared for that audition, how hard you tried, how hard you put your hat into the ring. I mean, I've just had a couple of. Two of my most favorite things I've ever pitched. I've just pitched, and I thought, oh, my God, these are definitely gonna sell. And they didn't. And, like, the speed with which. Because the market sucks right now and whatever. Like. And I couldn't have predicted that. I mean, I've had an incredible year. I was, like, all over the 50th, I thought, you know, literally, the people who called me and were like, we have to be in business with you.
- [36:39]
Mariam Banakaram
Yeah.
- [36:39]
Ana Gasteyer
Wicked's 20th all of it and still my. But nope, it's. The market sucks. Like, people aren't buying things. What can you do? Like, it doesn't mean I'm a bad person or the idea is a bad.
- [36:46]
Mariam Banakaram
Person, but when you have that rejection, how do you pick yourself back up?
- [36:50]
Ana Gasteyer
I give myself one really sad night with a giant bottle of white wine and a half a Xanax, and I sleep really, really well, where I'm, like, just petty and fucking small, and I look up who else's projects got picked up, and I stomp my Feet and whatever. And then the next day I wake up and I realize that I have other ideas and a really killer family and an amazing career that everybody wishes that they had. Lots of people wish that they had. And start over. Just do something different. Whatever. This is the thing. It's so corny, but it does sort of all work out the way it's supposed to, and usually you don't know why. And again, I sound like I'm like a bumper sticker, but, you know, it's Marty short, like, famously has this. This. This pie that he keeps in his head, which is like, one third work, one third family, one third friends, and that all three have to be in balance at all times. Like, that that's. He can start to sense it. So I was on my, you know, a great series for NBC I was super proud of called American Auto. I finally was, like, number one on the call sheet. I thought it was really well written. I was not embarrassed by it, which is the first mark. And then I was actually proud of it, and I thought it was really good, and I thought it was saying something and comedically, really strong. It was during COVID the strike happened. There were just too many things for any comedy to endure. And we got canceled. And I thought, oh, my God, I was super bummed for two, three days. And then my mom got sick, and I had to move my parents out. And I had four solid months of moving my parents out of their place in Albuquerque to, like, a community where they now live. And I helped them do that. And I tried. I was. And it never would have happened if my television show had gone. Had gone. I mean, I was like. I went, you know, to, like, arrange caregivers and stuff, and then, like, ended up staying for five weeks and helping them downsize. And I'll never get that. It was an incredible thing to be there for my parents and to be connected to them in their 80s, you know, so.
- [38:44]
Mariam Banakaram
Because we're the sandwich generation, because I had a similar thing, and I had to move my mom, and I was like, if I was at my regular job, there's just no way I would be able to come to all these appointments with her.
- [38:54]
Ana Gasteyer
Well, think about it. Exactly.
- [38:56]
Mariam Banakaram
I mean, because there's a lot of them.
- [38:57]
Ana Gasteyer
There are a lot of them, and you. And. And. And they're like. They're scared, and they're overwhelmed by the system, and, you know, you want to be available to them, so. And you would want someone. You want your kids to do that for you. Like, I loved that I could Model that for my kids. Like, that they, you know, saw me being engaged with my parents in a. In a different way and all that. I got closer to my brother. I mean, so many amazing things happened as a result of it.
- [39:19]
Mariam Banakaram
You know, sometimes those moments, I mean, when I left Hyatt, I remember taking time off, and one of the things I will never get back is that I got to spend the summer with my grandmother in California. And when would I ever get that back? But, I mean, by the way, it was terrifying. There were moments people called me and told me I was crazy to take time off.
- [39:36]
Ana Gasteyer
Right.
- [39:37]
Mariam Banakaram
All those things are true, but you sort of find your way.
- [39:39]
Ana Gasteyer
And again, I'm lucky. Like, I'm not. That's, you know, whatever. I've. I've. I'm at a point in my career where I don't have to be panicky about the job, paying the bills and things like that. It's much more like a creative sense of failure, which is a different kind of a sense of failure than, like.
- [39:56]
Mariam Banakaram
What does that mean?
- [39:57]
Ana Gasteyer
Meaning, like, if something isn't working out, it's not like I'm panicking because I have my mortgage to pay. You know, that's a different kind of anxiety, I realize.
- [40:05]
Mariam Banakaram
Which I've had, too, so.
- [40:06]
Ana Gasteyer
Which I've also had. Yeah, too. But that's why I say, like, there's things to be grateful for. And, you know, look, my son is going into his senior year, and again, if my two projects had gone, I probably wouldn't have been able to be available for this process. And, you know, so all those things happen.
- [40:20]
Mariam Banakaram
So this notion of, like, it all happens for a reason, it's actually kind of a nice way to look at it.
- [40:25]
Ana Gasteyer
It is. I mean, I know people roll their.
- [40:27]
Mariam Banakaram
Eyes, but I know I roll my eyes, but I sort of find comfort in it as well.
- [40:32]
Ana Gasteyer
I think the other way of looking at it is you're not just one thing. Like, as much as we say, oh, it's so hard to juggle, well, so this thing isn't taking the priority that it thought it was, which means you have the energy and the focus now to put other things to give your attention to something meaningful in your life, like your marriage or your mom, you know, like your children, things that yourself. I don't know, go write your novel. You know, Go write your novel. And I often feel that it happens. You know, I turn around and I'm like, you know what I think I'm gonna do? I think I'm gonna start a Christmas album. I Mean, that's actually the perfect example. I should go back to this. So I was on this show that filmed up in Toronto. It was on tbs, which was having a little bit of a comedy heyday. And it was really fun. And it was like, I've been in so many series now that have gone to season three, and, like, something's happened. And in the old days, you'd be like, if it goes to season three, you're gonna, like, be shitting in silk, you know, as my husband likes to say, like, it's gonna, like, you're gonna have your series for 16 years, you know, in your brain. So this show went to season three, and they convened the entire writers room. They wrote the entire season. We were two weeks into pre production. I was getting ready to go to Toronto, like, where am I gonna stay? And our series was canceled two weeks before we began. But because we'd already. The clock had already begun to run, we got paid. So they did the math and they were like, it'll save us enough money just to cancel the series and pay everybody off for their, whatever, 13 episodes of television than it will be to actually go make the episodes. I was so bummed. And then I looked right at the paid sabbatical. Literally. I was like, well, I have money. I have time to get other jobs, so I'm gonna go make a Christmas record. And my very supportive husband was like, I'd always want to make a holiday record. I wanted to produce it myself. And I was like, can we earmark half of this and go make a record? And he was like, yeah, absolutely. You're gonna get jobs anyway, so go do it. So that's what we did. That's what I did.
- [42:35]
Mariam Banakaram
So I'm gonna go to Rapid Fire questions.
- [42:38]
Ana Gasteyer
Great. I love it.
- [42:38]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, hold on. I need my glasses. Cause that's where I'm at.
- [42:41]
Ana Gasteyer
Cheaters.
- [42:42]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, this would be fun. Karaoke or Walk on song. Which would you pick? And what's the song?
- [42:49]
Ana Gasteyer
Oh, God. I always. I hate karaoke because I'm a real singer. So I.
- [42:59]
Mariam Banakaram
Hey, Walk on song.
- [43:00]
Ana Gasteyer
I Am Woman, Hear Me Roar by Helen Reddy.
- [43:03]
Mariam Banakaram
Mine is Girl on Fire, so. Okay, that made you laugh.
- [43:08]
Ana Gasteyer
Okay.
- [43:09]
Mariam Banakaram
They actually used it once, and I thought it was fitting.
- [43:11]
Ana Gasteyer
It's up in the club by 50 cent. I don't know. I don't have one.
- [43:14]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, what's a food you'd bring to a potluck?
- [43:19]
Ana Gasteyer
I always bring the same thing to a potluck. I always bring that watermelon feta salad.
- [43:23]
Mariam Banakaram
That's very Iranian.
- [43:25]
Ana Gasteyer
I know. I love Iranian food. And also my grandmother, my grandparents were Greek and Romanian and basically that's a Greek Romanian salad too.
- [43:32]
Mariam Banakaram
That's why you were an ethnic actress.
- [43:33]
Ana Gasteyer
That's why.
- [43:34]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, an alternative career that you would have chosen if it wasn't in entertainment.
- [43:39]
Ana Gasteyer
I love food, so I probably would have worked in hospitality or food somehow. I would have worked with kids. I love kids and I might have been. I might have wanted to work in. I probably would have worked with kids. I probably would have taught.
- [43:51]
Mariam Banakaram
What are you reading, listening or watching? And you can just pick.
- [43:54]
Ana Gasteyer
I'm reading Girl on Girl. It's a very enraging assessment of how our generation was taught to hate other women. But it's culturally very interesting about the 90s and 2000s media and sort of the birth of. I've only read two chapters, but it is really satisfying. Basically how porn kind of infiltrated the mainstream in the early chapter. She's like, how do we go from Riot Girls to Spice Girls in a five year period? And sort of what the conversation about women and women in the media was. That's really good.
- [44:28]
Mariam Banakaram
Okay, one piece of advice.
- [44:31]
Ana Gasteyer
Just order the first thing on the menu. You're there to hang out with your friends.
- [44:34]
Mariam Banakaram
Oh, that's a good one. What about snl? Do you have one favorite messy moment?
- [44:38]
Ana Gasteyer
I mean, the entire thing is a mess. It's insane. It's absolutely. It has its own algorithm, its own, you know, chaos theory. It's just mayhem. It's utter mayhem.
- [44:52]
Mariam Banakaram
Kind of like the magic of it is the mayhem.
- [44:55]
Ana Gasteyer
Do you think that's true? It does happen. I don't know how. I don't know how they do it. I don't know how that many people do it. And don't. I can't believe nobody's like injured or. Yeah, that was fun.
- [45:10]
Mariam Banakaram
Well, thank you so much. Honestly, that was amazing.
- [45:14]
Ana Gasteyer
Yay.