Transcript

Michael Knowles (0:00)

A new study out of the UK shows that queer identity is in free fall among young people. For reaction, we turn now to the official Michael Nol show. Gen Z correspondent.

Congressman August Pfluger (0:12)

I'm not gay no more.

Michael Knowles (0:15)

Really surprising turn of events for the libs who believed the relentless lavender propaganda of the last decade about men becoming women and gender affirmation and non binary identities. They're really surprised by this. But it's an even more surprising turn of events for skittish conservatives who seem to have forgotten the essential consolation of conservative political philosophy, which is that on a long enough timescale, reality eventually reasserts itself every time. I'm Michael Knowles.

Ben Shapiro (0:49)

This is the Michael Knowles Show.

Michael Knowles (1:09)

Welcome back to the show. You know the government's shutdown?

Ben Shapiro (1:13)

Did you.

Michael Knowles (1:13)

Do you remember that? I know they shut the government down. The Democrats, Chuck Schumer, they shut it down and then we all just kind of forgot. And now Schumer's saying it could be the longest government shutdown ever. Well, now it might be impacting our military. So we will have Congressman August Pflueger on the show coming up. Do not go anywhere. We will get the update, especially as it pertains to the military. First, though, I wanna tell you about Chevron.

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Michael Knowles (2:08)

This study is just a delight. This is out of the University of Buckingham. Eric Kaufman is the author. Here's the executive summary. We got all sorts of charts and graphs and numbers, but here's the executive summary. After surging in the 2000 teens and twenties, trans and queer identities are in decline among young Americans. For a while there, they were just skyrocketing. Every time you open the news, it was 5%, 10%, 25%, 30% of Gen Z identifies as LGBTQ. And now after that massive surge, you know, it went from one in four, maybe more, to one in three, maybe me. It now it seems to be declining. The transgender share among university students peaked in 2023 and has almost halved since, from nearly 7% to under 4%. Some of us have been suggesting that maybe the transgender identity is a social contagion, and it's not. Some deeply Rooted, essential or biological aspect of identity. You know, the libs have always said, no, no, no. The reason that the number of trans identifying students keeps increasing is because people now feel liber to come out of the closet and express their true selves. And some of us have said, I'm kind of skeptical of that. I think it's just like a lot of people never even thought that this was a thing and then they're introduced.

Summary

The Michael Knowles Show – Ep. 1836: “BREAKING: Gen Z De-Gays Itself”

Date: October 15, 2025

Overview

In this episode, Michael Knowles discusses a new study showing declines in LGBTQ identification among Gen Z, analyzes the cultural and ideological implications of this trend, and explores related topics in politics, medicine, and ethics. The conversation features guests including Congressman August Pfluger and Cheryl Hines, commentary on the government shutdown’s effect on the military, in-depth critique of assisted suicide policies in Canada and Virginia, and a reflection on faith, freedom, and cultural trends. Knowles delivers his signature blend of conservative analysis, humor, and literary references, aiming to expose what he sees as the enduring truths beneath shifting social fads.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Decline of Queer and Trans Identification in Gen Z ([00:00]–[12:09])

Main Findings:

UK Study by Eric Kaufman (University of Buckingham): Reports a significant decline in young people identifying as transgender, queer, or otherwise non-heterosexual after years of rapid growth.
The percentage of university students identifying as trans peaked in 2023 (nearly 7%) and has dropped to under 4%. Share of students identifying as not heterosexual fell by around 10 points.
The decrease primarily affects the “Q” (queer, non-binary), with gay and lesbian identification remaining relatively flat.
The study found no strong link between the decline and reduced social media use, religious revival, or rightward political shift.

Cultural Analysis:

Knowles suggests past surges reflected a “social contagion” rather than innate trends, referencing the tendency for people to imitate social norms and identity categories.
He posits that the more abstract, less sensual categories (non-binary, queer) fade first, as they are less rooted in physical reality and more in ideological abstraction.
Improved mental health among young people connects with the decline: “If you’re a guy who thinks you’re a chick, you have mental issues by definition.” ([06:18] Michael Knowles)

Notable Exchange:

Knowles: “On a long enough timescale, reality eventually reasserts itself every time.” ([00:32])
Ben Shapiro (frequent sidekick and voice throughout): “People are straight again.” ([07:27])

Philosophical Reference:

Knowles invokes Rudyard Kipling’s “The Gods of the Copybook Headings” to frame the resurgence of common truths over fashionable ideologies.
- “And the gods of the copybook headings limped up to explain it once more.” ([11:31] Michael Knowles)

2. Science, Expertise, and Public Policy: Cheryl Hines vs. The View ([13:30]–[19:45])

Segment Summary:

Cheryl Hines, wife of Robert F. Kennedy Jr., appears on “The View” and points out the dangers of harmful substances (arsenic, lead) in baby formula, highlighting the need for regulatory oversight.
Joy Behar and other hosts downplay RFK Jr.'s credentials, noting he's “not a doctor,” trying to dismiss his advocacy against Big Pharma.
Hines rebuts, pointing out most Secretaries of Health and Human Services have not been doctors. She demands equal concern for public health regardless of political affiliation.

Key Quotes:

Cheryl Hines: “One of Obama’s secretaries of HHS was an economist.” ([18:33])
Joy Behar is momentarily stumped, leading to an abrupt commercial cut: “Wait, wait, wait, wait... We gotta cut this off.” ([19:00])

Knowles' Take:

Uses the exchange to highlight how “the Left really doesn’t know what to say” when confronted with scientific facts that contradict their tribal narratives.
Argues that the right has a legitimate tradition of scientific achievement, referencing Catholic scientists (Mendel, Copernicus).

3. Medical Ethics: Organ Transplants from Assisted Suicide Victims in Canada ([19:47]–[25:03])

Critical Issue:

Knowles reviews a story from Canada where a man received a heart from a donor who died via MAID (Medical Assistance in Dying, i.e., euthanasia).
Raises profound ethical concerns about the slippery slope of assisted suicide leading to the exploitation and commodification of vulnerable people.

Key Points:

References the Hippocratic Oath: “First, do no harm. Assisted suicide harms, just immediately harms because it kills people.” ([20:26] Ben Shapiro)
Warns of a progression from targeted euthanasia for the terminally ill to broader application, including people with depression, eating disorders, even teenagers and the mentally handicapped.
The commodification of organs from those assisted in dying—“we’re already harvesting the suicide’s organs”—is seen as a chilling outcome of dehumanized, individualist ethics.

Quotes:

Knowles: “If we seek to eliminate suffering, ultimately we’re going to eliminate human life.” ([21:19])
“Suicide is bad and we shouldn’t encourage it and we definitely shouldn’t be profiting from it.” ([23:53])

4. Government Shutdown and Military Readiness: Interview with Rep. August Pfluger ([26:35]–[34:34])

Context:

Ongoing U.S. government shutdown impacting federal employees and threatening military pay.
Rep. Pfluger claims Democrats are responsible, with Senate Democrats blocking funding bills.

Concerns Raised:

Shutdown hurts military readiness and morale, with many soldiers’ families living on the edge.
Administration is borrowing from other accounts to pay the troops temporarily, but this is not sustainable.

Notable Quotes:

Pfluger: “A lot of our troops are on food stamps, and they’re worried about that... So absolutely, it hurts mission readiness, it hurts our focus, and it hurts our national security.” ([27:53])
“We’re not going to hold us hostage like this and laugh at the American people and say, look, we just... did this political stunt and now we get something out of it. No.” ([32:03])

Political Analysis:

Knowles points out the disconnect between Democrats’ rhetoric (“the people are on our side”) and the reality of electoral defeat and public opinion.

5. Assisted Suicide and Democratic Party Moderation ([36:02]–[40:45])

Spanberger’s Position:

Rep. Abigail Spanberger, running for governor in Virginia, supports “right to die with dignity” legislation and opposes allowing religious-based objections among healthcare providers.

Knowles’ Critique:

Argues this approach is extreme even among moderates, painting the current Democratic Party as far left compared to previous decades.
Criticizes Spanberger’s statement: “I do not believe that people should have the option to allow their own personal beliefs to dictate the type of medical care that they are providing their patients.” ([37:10])

Quote & Takeaway:

Knowles: “This woman is a sick person... She wants to kill like everybody. And this is the moderate.” ([39:03–39:52])

6. Reflections on Freedom, Religion, and Cultural Recovery ([40:50]–[46:57])

Charlie Kirk Presidential Medal of Freedom:

Trump awards the late Charlie Kirk the Presidential Medal of Freedom, with an engraved cross—a first in history.
Erica Kirk, his widow, speaks, showing “a moment of levity and strength” that Knowles admires as a testament to faith under grief.

On Freedom:

Knowles reasserts a conservative, Christian view of freedom as grounded in discipline, truth, and Christ: “Perfect freedom is found in Christ. Christ says the truth will set you free.” ([44:13])
Contrasts this with the “shallow, negative view of liberty” that dominated late 20th-century culture.

Memorable Moment:

On Erica Kirk’s joke about Charlie praying for enemies, Trump laughs, and Knowles notes the humility in Trump’s recognition of Kirk’s virtue. ([41:44])

Closing Thought:

Cites Washington Post piece on people fearing dying alone, predicting a return to communal values after a wave of atomized individualism.

Notable Quotes & Timestamps

"On a long enough timescale, reality eventually reasserts itself every time." — Michael Knowles ([00:32])
“If you’re a guy who thinks you’re a chick, you have mental issues by definition.” — Michael Knowles ([06:18])
“The gods of the copybook headings limped up to explain it once more.” — Michael Knowles quoting Kipling ([11:31])
“People are straight again.” — Ben Shapiro ([07:27])
“The fact that troops are on food stamps is a national disgrace, frankly.” — Ben Shapiro ([29:02])
“If we seek to eliminate suffering, ultimately we’re going to eliminate human life.” — Michael Knowles ([21:19])
“This woman is a sick person... She wants to kill like everybody. And this is the moderate.” — Michael Knowles on Abigail Spanberger ([39:03–39:52])

Key Timestamps

[00:00–12:09]: Decline in Gen Z LGBTQ identification and philosophical implications
[13:30–19:45]: Cheryl Hines vs. The View on science, public health, and medical credentialism
[19:47–25:03]: Organ transplants from assisted suicide patients; critique of Canadian policy
[26:35–34:34]: Government shutdown, military pay, and interview with Rep. Pfluger
[36:02–40:45]: Assisted suicide, Democratic politics, and the problem with radical moderation
[40:50–46:57]: Charlie Kirk tribute, faith and freedom, societal return to foundational values

Tone & Style

Michael Knowles maintains a confident, combative, and sometimes tongue-in-cheek conservative tone, weaving in historical and literary references while making pointed critiques of left-liberal ideologies, scientific credentialism, and shifting political norms. The episode alternates between earnest polemic, sardonic humor, and moments of genuine pathos, especially in its discussion of faith and loss.

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Ep. 1836 - BREAKING: Gen Z De-Gays Itself