"They Said I Would Die Unless I Took It" Michael & The Miracle | Corley Spell

Summary

Podcast Summary: "They Said I Would Die Unless I Took It" – Michael & The Miracle | Corley Spell

The Michael Knowles Show – The Daily Wire
Date: March 8, 2026
Guest: Corley Spell

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Episode Overview

In this moving and in-depth conversation, Michael Knowles sits down with Corley Spell, entrepreneur (co-founder of Good Ranchers) and mother of four, to explore her extraordinary medical journey. Diagnosed with advanced melanoma during pregnancy and again years later, Corley walks listeners through the crisis and the faith-driven choices that led her to experience what she, her family, and Knowles consider a bona fide miracle: the complete disappearance of cancer without following conventional medical advice. Their discussion ranges over the intersection of faith and medical science, the power of hope versus optimism, the pressures from the medical system, and the meaning of miracles for believers and skeptics alike.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Corley's Diagnosis and Early Journey

• Initial Diagnosis (2020):
  • Corley discovers she has melanoma while newly pregnant with her fourth child; the diagnosis is shocking and life-altering ([03:58-04:57]).
  • Medical Pressure: The oncology team urges her to abort due to treatment risks during pregnancy, a suggestion she and her husband Ben flatly reject.

    "There they tried to pressure me into having an abortion multiple times...The best thing for you...is to abort this pregnancy." – Corley ([05:36-06:04])

  • Faith plays a crucial role in their resolve:

    "That's not happening. So what's Plan B?" – Ben's response ([06:05])

• Treatment Choices:
  • Corley undergoes surgery in the second trimester; a lymph node tests positive, confirming stage 3 ([08:07]).
  • She completes her pregnancy, gives birth to a healthy baby, and proceeds with follow-up scans and monitoring.

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2. The Second Diagnosis and Wrestling with Mortality

• Recurrence (2024):
  • Feels a new swollen lymph node near the original site; confirms a new, more advanced melanoma diagnosis (stage 3C) ([09:17]).
  • Emotional and Spiritual Response:
    • Refuses to dwell on statistics or prognosis, focusing instead on faith:

      "I didn't Google it. I just never ever went down that path..." ([10:07-10:30])

    • Distinction between optimism and true hope:

      "Optimism...can lead you...more quickly to despair...whereas what you're talking about is really hope." – Knowles ([12:16-12:34])

    • Corley's posture is full surrender to God, not denial:

      "It's not me...The Lord was my strength, is my strength. And that's how we walked through it." ([11:23])

• Treatment Dilemma:
  • She and Ben struggle between holistic, integrative, or full conventional treatment ([14:13]); decide on an integrative approach (ketogenic diet, holistic treatments, plus immunotherapy).

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3. Suffering, Faith, and Surrender

• Physical Decline:
  • Intense physical reactions to immunotherapy: high fevers, night sweats, inability to perform basic care for her children ([16:59-19:44]).
  • Moments of despair and surrender:

    "I went from, 'I'm not gonna die,' to, 'I feel like I'm dying'...even if He is calling me home, I'm just so thankful for everything He's already done." ([19:44-21:46])

  • On facing mortality:

    "I think that's when your roots really, really go down in your faith, because you have to look at it and say, I'm okay...fully surrendered with whatever you have for me, Lord." ([21:46])

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4. Miracle Unfolds: Refusing Chemotherapy

• Devastating Scan Results:
  • After immunotherapy, scans show the cancer has worsened; surgery is no longer an option. Chemo pills are her only proposed hope ([22:05-24:19]).
  • Corley experiences a strong spiritual conviction that the cancer is dead, received in prayer ([25:54-27:55]):

    "I just really feel like the Lord told me...that the cancer was dead." ([25:57])

  • Against medical advice, she refuses the chemotherapy pills:

    "I'm not taking the chemotherapy pills...I just know in my spirit, I don't need to." ([27:52])

  • Family members are at first resistant, but her faith holds:

    "All these people that I know love and trust, that want the best for me, but...God gave me the Word." ([28:17])

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5. Unexpected Healing Confirmed

• Rapid Recovery:
  • Corley's health improves on its own; follow-up ultrasounds and biopsies find the cancer shrunk or dead without chemo ([30:23-34:19]).
  • Medical staff attribute the improvement to the pills she did not take:

    "Everything's shrunk by over 50% already. The pills are working." – Doctors ([32:03-32:15])

  • The true revelation:

    "Dr. Amari, I did not take the chemotherapy pills." ([35:18])

  • Oncologist is speechless; Corley replies:

    "God told me that the cancer was dead." ([35:35])

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6. Reflections on Miracles, Suffering, and Faith

• Doctors’ Refusal to Acknowledge the Miracle:
  • The staff do not follow up or engage with the spiritual aspect ([37:37-38:26]).
  • Knowles observes:

    "It would seem to me that the rational, practical, logical, most grounded conclusion...is, well, God intervened." ([38:02])

• Meaning for Christians and Skeptics:
  • Corley:

    "I think we should believe for the earthly miracles while we're on earth...if the Bible were still being written right now, I want my story...to be one of faith, courageous faith." ([42:06-43:12])

  • Discussions on the spiritual discipline of hope, remaining open-handed to God’s will (accepting the outcome, regardless), and how suffering brings about refinement ([46:12]).
  • The importance of testimony:

    "It's how we overcome, the blood of the lamb and the word of our testimony." ([44:06])

• Facing Doubt and Maintaining Perspective:
  • Corley affirms intentional positivity:

    "I chose to speak life." ([51:57])

  • She is changed forever—more grateful, spiritually deeper, and attentive to the spiritual dimension ([52:25-54:07]):

    "I'm truly living in gratitude now...When I read the Word, it just feels different. It truly feels like manna, like my daily bread."

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Memorable Quotes

• "The best thing for you...is to abort this pregnancy." — Corley, quoting doctors ([06:04])
• "That's not happening. So what's Plan B?" — Ben Spell to doctors ([06:05])
• "I just decided in my spirit and my soul that I was going to believe God's word and just take him at his word and even if he called me home." — Corley ([13:09])
• "Here's the pill. This is your only option, or you will die...and you just have this distinct—and I have friends who have had distinct... voices where they're clear this isn't any other kind of voice other than God...and you say, I heard from the man himself." — Knowles ([29:02])
• "I just knew that it was truth and I wanted to stick to it. And so I didn't." — Corley ([28:39])
• "The beautiful part of it: through the suffering, no matter what the end is, we have eternity. We just don't lose." — Corley ([13:36])
• "You have today. Tomorrow is not guaranteed. So you can't get caught up in the what-ifs, right, because you have today and you have this very breath and you need to be thankful for it." — Corley ([22:05])
• "I was sick and then I was healed. That's all I know." — Corley ([48:57])

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Important Segment Timestamps

• Pressure to Abort & Initial Diagnosis: [03:58–07:11]
• Second Diagnosis & Future Uncertainty: [09:05–10:56]
• Choosing Hope over Despair: [12:16–13:43]
• Faith and Physical Suffering: [19:44–21:46]
• Spiritual Epiphany (God tells Corley cancer is dead): [25:54–27:55]
• Refusing Chemotherapy, Family Conflict: [27:52–30:23]
• Medical Confirmation of Healing: [32:03–37:37]
• Doctors’ Reaction and Acknowledgment of a Miracle: [35:18–38:26]
• Reflections on Believing in Miracles: [42:06–44:06]
• Corley's Post-Miracle Transformation: [52:25–54:07]

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Tone & Voice

The tone is open, deeply personal, and faith-filled. Corley speaks honestly about doubt, surrender, and trust; Knowles offers empathy, theological context, and occasional humor, especially around medical system frustrations and Christian paradoxes. Both maintain a warm and hopeful, yet unvarnished, perspective.

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Final Reflections

Corley Spell’s story is one of “faith with open hands”—her courageous trust in God led to a healing that defied medical expectation. The episode challenges listeners (believers and skeptics alike) to wrestle with the reality of miracles, the limitations of scientific materialism, and the role of faith—in suffering, healing, and everyday life. More than a recounting of a singular event, it is a testimony about the interplay between surrender and hope, and the enduring power of gratitude.

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Transcript

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[Corley Spell]

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[Knowles]

Sort of like, you know, the life raft. Yes, to the guy.

[Corley Spell]

Where were you, Lord? A week later, we go back into MD Anderson, and my oncologist walks in and she's reading her paper. She's reading the results. She's like, okay, good news. Everything was done. Every single piece of cancer that we took out was dead. She's like, the pills worked. And then I said, Dr. Amari, I did not take the chemotherapy pills. And at this point, she thinks I'm a crazy person.

[Knowles]

Do miracles still occur? I am so pleased to sit down with my friend Corley Spell for a conversation that I have been trying to have for, I think, six months now. Corlee, thank you for being here.

[Corley Spell]

Thank you for having me. It has been a while, but, you know, sometimes good things just take a while to get to. But here they are.

[Knowles]

That's true. And, you know, in God's providence, things come up, things change. And I guess that's a big topic of our conversation today. For those who don't know you, they might secretly know you, actually, because you are the first lady of American me. You are you are. You are the wife of Good Ranchers. Well, not the. You're the wife of your husband, but your husband started Good Ranchers, one of the all time great. Not only sponsors of this show, but one of the all time great American companies.

[Corley Spell]

Yes. So, so happy to be a sponsor for this show, first of all, but I never set out to be the meat lady, but here I am.

[Knowles]

It's a great distinction to have.

[Corley Spell]

It just comes with. Yeah. The life, for sure.

[Knowles]

So, look, I could sit here and talk about Good Ranchers beef. I'm no hyperbole at all. I could sit here and talk about it for like five hours. I know, but that's actually not what I want to talk about.

[Corley Spell]

No.

[Knowles]

Because I Forget this was 6 months ago or something. We were at some event, we were talking and I was hearing your story about a personal medical crisis. And it grabbed me because we hear so much today of the demonic, of the satanic, of the dark, of the occult, of all these. And we don't hear quite as much about grace and potentially even miracles. It even ties in with one of the bigger conversations we're having about food and health. You know, the Maha movement, President Trump coming in, Bobby Kennedy getting all the garbage out of food and pharmaceuticals. So there's distinctions to be had within natural science and then there's another level, which is supernatural science, maybe miracles.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

You had cancer. Now you don't.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

How did that happen?

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, so take it back to when I was. I was 30 years old. So this was back in 2020 when I was first diagnosed and I had just found out we were pregnant with our fourth baby at the time, very newly pregnant, six weeks pregnant. And I went in for a dermatologist appointment with my husband Ben, because he had a weir spot. Turns out he is fine, but it was actually me. They found a spot, we sent it in, and it came back as skin cancer, melanoma, which is very serious. I at the time knew nothing about cancer or skin cancer, let alone. And melanoma is the deadliest form of skin cancer. It accounts for over 75% of skin cancer death. So it's very serious. Of course I was shocked. I mean, I was pregnant and 30 years old, and to get a phone call that you have cancer, we're sending you to MD Anderson. I mean, it's just. It wrecks you. So from.

[Knowles]

Especially you have three kids at home already. You're pregnant with your fourth.

[Corley Spell]

All young. Yeah, we had, you know, three kids in three years with another one on the way. And you Know, having a business. I mean, our life was very, very busy in the best ways. But getting a diagnosis like that really just makes you pause and start looking at things differently.

[Knowles]

So you're in the doctor's office. You think you're going in because of your husband's issue. You find out you have a very serious form of cancer.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

How far pregnant are you at this point?

[Corley Spell]

I was six weeks pregnant.

[Knowles]

See, you're right at the beginning. What do you do?

[Corley Spell]

Well, then my dermatologist sent me to MD Anderson, and so we went and sat down with a team of oncologists because I was a special case because I was pregnant. And there they tried to pressure me into having an abortion multiple times. We can't do scans if you're pregnant. We can't do treatment if you're pregnant. The best thing for you and talking to Ben directly to get him to pressure me also is to abort this pregnancy.

[Knowles]

What does Ben say?

[Corley Spell]

Oh, he just laughed. He's like, well, that's not happening. So what's plan B? Give me plan B. But finally they understood where we were at and we weren't budging. And so then they finally began to have other conversations with us.

[Knowles]

You know, doctors do this.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

Where they'll tell you. I mean, even if you're going in for fertility treatments, first thing they try to push is ivf, which often entails abortion, usually entails some version of abortion, and they just push it on you. And if you dismiss it out of hand, they look at you like you have three heads. They often keep pushing it. When you go in when you're pregnant and you get your scan, and they say, okay, well, do you want to do the blood test? Do you want to find out if maybe there problems? Trisomy down syndrome? And when you say, well, it wouldn't make any difference, they look at you like you have three heads. There is an immense amount of pressure, and especially probably the most extreme form of pressure is if you're diagnosed with cancer, to say, you gotta kill your kid. Did you ever have everybody's weak? Did you ever have any fleeting second where you thought, well, maybe not at all. Not for a second.

[Corley Spell]

And I think that's why it's important to know where you're at before you have to be in a situation. Because I can see where if I wasn't so grounded in my faith and far along in that, maybe I would have. Maybe I would have been like, oh, my gosh, maybe I do need to be here for my other three kids. You know, maybe I am not putting their needs before mine right now. I mean, they try very, very hard to persuade you, but, no, we obviously didn't do that. I have four babies, and they're all healthy. And so from there, they said, okay, we'll just do surgery during your trimester. That's when the baby is safest, and then we'll go from there to see what stage you're at. And we prayed about it, and we felt peace with that, and so we did that. And surgery was fine. They just removed the skin around that, and it was all clear, except they did biopsy one lymph node that was nearby, and that tested positive for cancer.

[Knowles]

So now you're. It's right after the first trimester, they cut the cancer off your skin, and they say, oh, sorry, bad news. The cancer spread to your lymph nodes.

[Corley Spell]

Yes. Which puts me at stage. Stage three. But it was small enough that they were comfortable letting me go full term with the pregnancy. I mean, they were throwing out horrific scenarios leading up to this. So the fact that they were okay with me going full term, you know, was good. But still, lol. You know, I was going to do that regardless. So the baby came, she was healthy. And so after that, we just did watch and scans, and, I mean, I had a newborn and three toddlers. So I can look back and feel like maybe I put my head in the sand and pretended like it didn't happen, but in my heart, I just know that that chapter didn't feel closed yet because of the second diagnosis that I got back in January of 2024.

[Knowles]

So you're pregnant in 2020. You get the first diagnosis in 2020. So your kid is three years old?

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. No. No. Which kid?

[Knowles]

The youngest would be three years old by the time that you get the second diagnosis.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. Yeah. So all the scans were clear up until January of 2024. I felt a swollen lymph node next to the one that they had removed, and I was like, dang it, I know what this is. And so I went back to MD Anderson and did a biopsy, and sure enough, it's melanoma again. It's cancer. And it's in a different lymph node, obviously. And so that puts it at stage 3C. And so they sit me down and start having very serious conversations with me. This is advanced. Start going over all the horrible statistics.

[Knowles]

But what are the statistics? Do you remember?

[Corley Spell]

I mean, I just know melanoma in itself is very, very deadly. And the. The higher you get in staging the worse it is.

[Knowles]

Right.

[Corley Spell]

But honestly, I didn't allow myself to, like, I didn't Google it. I didn't look it up the how long I might have. Like, I just. I never, ever went down that path in my mind. I just. I didn't. I didn't accept it. I wasn't denying reality or truth, but I was aligning my heart and my spirit and my faith with God's truth.

[Knowles]

You know, I. I get it. I get what you're saying. Because I think I'm more inclined that way, probably more than the average person. I say, well, God's will be done, whether his active will or his passive will. God's providence is over everything. I'm just a man, though, and I don't think I could have resisted that temptation to Google. How long do I have? What are the odds? Grok, tell me.

[Corley Spell]

I just didn't. I just didn't want to go down that dark rabbit trail of thoughts because I think that's when the enemy starts tormenting you, is in your thoughts, when

[Knowles]

you start to have this servile fear.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. Like, what if.

[Knowles]

Anxiety.

[Corley Spell]

What if, like, what is that information gonna do for me? I was like, it's not going to serve me in any way.

[Knowles]

It's not going to extend your life by one hour. No. Right. That's a good point. That's a very good point.

[Corley Spell]

That's what the Bible, the word tells us. It doesn't add a day. You know, I'm not going to sit and worry. And because it was my second time, I just feel like the Lord prepared me for that moment. Because, I mean, I remember talking to families and, you know, our pastor, our family members, and our pastor at the time, and. And just saying, no, I'm going to be healed. Like, God's going to walk me through this. It's going to be fine. Just very positive. And Ben being like, you know, she's. Yes, she's so positive, but it is really hard. And I remember had to, like, come on. And usually he's the positive, optimistic one, but in that moment, he was looking to me saying, like, oh, my gosh, like, her faith is so strong right now. And I just. It's not me. Like, it was totally the Lord. Like, I just. I don't want any of this to be like, oh, she's so strong. It was. The Lord was my strength, is my strength. And that's how we walked through it. And then after that, it got really, really bad.

[Knowles]

It's an interesting distinction here between optimism and hope.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

Because the thing about optimism, which is just always being super positive and even denying harsh realities, the thing about optimism is it can lead you even more quickly to despair when things don't work out.

[Corley Spell]

Exactly.

[Knowles]

If you insist unrealistically, things are always gonna be roses. They're always gonna come up sunshine, and nothing I ever don't like is gonna happen. You can fall into despair when that doesn't happen. Whereas what you're talking about is really hope. That's really the theological virtue of, hey, I trust God, and as a practical matter, there's nothing I can do anyway. So it's kind of, in a way, your view of things. Some people will say that's idealistic or head in the clouds or something. But actually yours is the most practical view. You say, well, all I can do is trust God. Why wouldn't I just do that?

[Corley Spell]

I know. And I was like, well, what's the point of the cross? Like, what he accomplished on the cross, if I'm not gonna believe that by his stripes I'm healed. Like, I just. I just decided in my spirit and my soul that I was going to believe God's word and just take him at his word and even if he called me home. We don't lose as Christians. That's the beautiful part of it. Through the suffering, no matter what the end is, we have eternity. We just don't lose. And so I decided I was gonna walk through it with that mentality.

[Knowles]

I think there was an observation, I just came across it yesterday actually, of St. Thomas More, who met a grisly end because of King Henry viii. But he said, look, it's all up to God. And whatever happens, even if I don't really seem to like it at any given moment, whatever happens, I know that if God wills it, and even if God is permitting it, it is for the best. I just know that.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, exactly.

[Knowles]

So that's your attitude going into this. But you say that's when it got really bad.

[Corley Spell]

It got bad. So that was January. And then we had to make a decision. Are we going to go full holistic and alternative and, you know, not do any conventional medicine? Are we gonna do all conventional? And so we really had to pray about it. And that took a while, a few weeks to decide, which really upset my oncology team because I wasn't making a decision, like, right. You know, then in front of them, jumping into treatments. And so we decided that doing an integrative approach is what we wanted to do.

[Knowles]

So a little holistic, woo woo, hippie, dippy. A little no woo woo.

[Corley Spell]

No woo woo.

[Knowles]

I'm being slightly caricaturing here, but some of the, you know, not quite tea leaves, but that's. And then some of it being radiation or something like that.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. So I went to. I had a friend and she went to the Cancer center for Healing, which is in Irvine, California with Dr. Canaley. And she had great things to say about it. Cause I was fully prepared to go to Mexico. And this is juice, you know, this.

[Knowles]

She want roots or something. Right, right.

[Corley Spell]

And so I felt comfortable with California because my kids were so little. I didn't want to be out of the country for weeks at a time, you know, without them. And so we went there and I did a bunch of holistic treatments to boost my immune system. Went on a very strict ketogenic diet sponsored by good ranchers.

[Knowles]

Talk about a perk of the job. Yeah, you had a lot of good, high quality beef.

[Corley Spell]

I know I didn't have to worry about my meat, my protein source. Like, it was clean. Like it really was nice. And, you know, everyone at this center ended up wanting some of it too, which was sweet. But anyways. Yeah. And so I was there for about three weeks, came back home, felt just better than I had. And I don't remember the last time I felt that good. Just I had lost 30 pounds of baby weight. You know, everything inside, all of my blood tests and my scans, everything was just very, very good. And every good result I got back, I was just like tucking it away. Like, yes, more good news. More good news. And then when I went back to MD Anderson, the plan with them was to do two rounds of immunotherapy, which I don't know if you know much about immunotherap therapy, but. So it's not like chemo, where chemo's very harsh and kind of kills everything while it's killing the cancer. Hopefully. Immunotherapy is more of a systematic. Like, it wakes up your immune system to fight and it lasts for longer than chemo. And so we prayed about that as well and felt good about that option. So we were to do two doses of that and then surgery to remove the tumor. And so going for my first dose, this is in March of 24. Feeling great. It's IV Inter, whatever.

[Knowles]

Yeah.

[Corley Spell]

And we start that. And then about two weeks later, I started feeling really bad. I started running high fevers all around the clock. The night sweats were horrible. But I was like, it's fine. My immune system's waking up, it's fighting Like, I'm not scared of fevers. You know, we're going to be okay. And then it got even worse, though, and the spot. So the lymph node was in my groin, and it started out like the size of a marble, probably. I mean, it was like the size of a grapefruit. It was huge and inflamed and red, and I could barely walk.

[Knowles]

Are you saying that for rhetorical effect or. Literally, it was the size of the.

[Corley Spell]

Literally, it was this, like, in this region, it was this big. And so I'm like, lord, what is going on? You know, And I can say it now because it has a happy ending. But, I mean, in those weeks, just being a mom of young children and not being able to go upstairs to put them to bed and make their meals and take care of them, I mean, it was the hardest two weeks of my life.

[Knowles]

Okay, that's the part, you know, that's the part, I think, especially for young men, young unmarried men, they think, look, if I'm struck down gloriously in battle someday, so be it. You know, That's a fun. And then the minute you get married now you say, okay, well, different calculus. Maybe that elevates the worry a little bit.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

The minute you have your first kid through the roof and you think, well, truly, because you're not concerned about the injustice to you. You're not concerned about. Ultimately about pain for you, it's the grave injustice to the kids, especially if you have multiple kids. Especially if you have little kids, by the way. That's just my own thought as a father. And when you got little kids, the father's not the biggest deal.

[Corley Spell]

No.

[Knowles]

You know, actually, it's like 90% mama.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

So you have all of this running through your head. You have a grapefruit in your pelvis.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, it's horrible. It looks horrible. I feel horrible. So I go in. So the first dose, they said, wait four weeks, come back for the second dose. So I go in for the second one, and I'm just. I feel terrible. And I tell my oncologist, I'm like, what do people do? Like, if they feel this bad, do they do this second dose? Like, what are people doing? And she said, well, usually they opt out. I give them a steroid shot, which kind of takes you out of the immunotherapy. And, you know, we just go from there. And I was. I asked her, I was like, what do you think I should do? She said, I think you should do it. And I said, okay, maybe you should

[Knowles]

take the steroid and get out of here.

[Corley Spell]

No, no, no. Do the second.

[Knowles]

Do the second. Yes. Okay.

[Corley Spell]

And I said, okay, I'm not a quitter. Like, I'm very competitive. I said, I can do this. And so do. Stay there, do the second dose, go home. And. And then, like, a week later, I'm. I'm, like, bedridden. I had to go to the ER multiple times because we thought I was dying. Yeah. Can't walk, can't get out of bed. I couldn't even get set up to, like, brush my daughter's hair. It was so bad, just so sick. But in. In that moment, I remember because I had been just so strong, like, mentally and in my faith. But, like, in that moment, I remember telling my mom, I was like, even if he is calling me home, I'm just so thankful for everything he's already done. Like, my salvation, the cross, like, my family. Like, he's already done so much for me. Like, I'm not gonna hold this against him, you know? Like. Like, I feel like I fully surrendered in that moment. And I remember talking to my sister, and I was. And I asked her, I was like, what if this is. What if this is the end? And I think whenever you have to contemplate your mortality, like, your actual death, you know, when you get hit by a bus or something, you don't really think about it. But when you have to sit there through the sickness and think through it, I think that's when your roots really, really go down in your faith, because you have to look at it and say, I'm okay. I am fully surrendered with whatever you have for me, Lord. And I had to. And I had to do that. And actually, it was the peace. It was the peace that they talk about. Right. Like, that just surpasses all understanding. That's what was over my mind and my body in that time, because I was fully surrendered. I was like, take me home. Like, because I really went from, I'm not gonna die, I feel like I'm dying to. I kind of want to die because I'm in so much pain. It was bad.

[Knowles]

So in this moment, it's not just that you're contemplating what happens if I die? You are dying.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

You are, in the process.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

I've wondered this. I've had plenty of friends who've died. What's it like to be dying?

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. You know, looking back, I think before, I think I had a fear of death, which we shouldn't. Right. But I think I was just an immature believer at that point. And Now I look at it as I'm just getting closer to eternity. And so, yes, it's very sad. All the things you have to leave behind, that they still have to go. Right. They're in the waiting room at that point, right? Like you're there. They're the ones that have to wait it out, which is to dad. But I'm. We have today. Today is a gift. And I asked my sister, I was like, what if he's calling me home? And she just reminded me, she's like, whether you have cancer or not, you have today. Tomorrow is not guaranteed. So you can't get caught up in the wh. Ifs, right, because you have today and you have this very breath and you need to be thankful for it. And so I did. And then we went for follow up scans. And those were terrible. They showed that everything got worse. Just like what I was feeling and looking like on the scans. It said it. And my oncologist came in. I mean, Ben had to wheel me into MD Anderson in a wheelchair. I'm not walking at this point. And my oncologist comes in and she said, well, the cancer laughed at your treatment. It spread all over that lymph node basin. Surgery is not an option anymore. I'm just sitting there and I'm listening to it and I hear it, but for some reason, it just didn't feel like the truth. And Ben's hearing it and he's freaking out. He calls my mom. He's, you know, just taking it all in. And so I asked her, I was like, so what do you do now? What do you suggest? And she said, well, there's a chemotherapy pill that you can take. It's not curative, but it can hopefully shrink it so that we can still do surgery. I said, okay. And so went straight to the ER after that at MD Anderson to get on antibiotics and IVs, because, I mean, it was horrible. And they suspected infection because of my blood cell counts. And so on the way down there, I told Ben, I said, what was it like when God told you to start good Ranchers? Because that was our origin story. He was a worship pastor. We had no meat experience, no agriculture experience, but he just felt like the Lord kept repeatedly telling him, do this, do this, do this. And it was to start a meat company. And one day the Lord was like, no, you do it.

[Knowles]

You know, I actually didn't even know that story.

[Corley Spell]

You didn't know that?

[Knowles]

I actually didn't know that story.

[Corley Spell]

He just kept having this. We were watching a lot of Shark tank. And he just kept having this idea of a meat company and how if you did it with integrity and ethically, like, it could just be really, really great. He just kept it over and over again. And then one day he came out of the bathroom, and he was like, God, I think God just told me to start a meat company. And I'm like,

[Knowles]

sit down, honey.

[Corley Spell]

We just had our first baby. But honestly, I looked at him and said, if God told you to do it, I trust you. And that was back in 2016, 2017. 2018. And, you know, obviously, the Lord's gone before us and blessed that. But I just remember him, he was so shook after hearing that. Like, it was a different speaking experience than, you know, maybe what I had ever experienced through word, scripture, songs, whatever, how the Lord usually is communicating with me. And he said, well, I just knew in the moment that it was truth. He's like, it wasn't an audible, like, thunderous voice. The heavens didn't open. But I just knew it was truth in my heart and in my spirit.

[Knowles]

And there was no confusion about who it was that was talking to him.

[Corley Spell]

Yes, there was no confusion. He's like, I knew it wasn't my thought. Why. Why are you asking me this? We're in MD Anderson. They're telling me you're dying. You look like you're dying. Why are you asking me this? You know? And I said, well, I just really feel like the Lord told me. Sorry, like, two weeks ago, that the cancer was dead. And he was like, what? And I said, yeah, Like, I was. I was just laying there praying, and I just felt like this. It was like a thought, like, that was, like, downloaded into my. My mind that I knew wasn't from me, and I knew it was from the Lord. And he was like, it's dead. But everything still, like, I look dead. I'm like, are you sure you're not telling me I'm dead? You know, am I hearing this right? But I didn't share it because I just wanted to pray into it and just, you know, make sure that's what I really heard. And then to come here and have these scans and them giving me the death sentence, you know, I don't know what this means. And he said, well, I trust you. I trust God. We're going to believe God's report and not man's report. And that's exactly what I needed to hear. Because, like I said, the enemy, like, he attacks you in your mind, right? Like, just like in the freaking garden. Are you sure Did God really say that? Like, that was the same lie that he was attacking me with. And I just. I knew that he did, and so I held onto it. And so we're going home. We check out. I felt a little better after being in the er. They sent us home with the chemo pills, and we get home and I told Ben, I said, well, I'm not taking the chemotherapy pills. And he was like, wait, what? You know, like, what if the Lord's using this for the healing?

[Knowles]

Sort of like, you know, the life raft. Yes, to the guy.

[Corley Spell]

Where were you, Lord? Exactly. And I said, I just know in my spirit, I don't need to. I don't have to. And, like, one of the. Like, the number one side effect of that was more cancer. And I'm like, I don't need anything else added to this.

[Knowles]

It's like when they say on tv, they say, take this pill for your depression. Side effects include suicide. You're saying, well, that doesn't seem like a great cure for my depression.

[Corley Spell]

Exactly. That was what that was. And so he said, okay. And then, of course, like, my mom pushed back my sister. I mean, all these people that I know love and trust, that want the best for me, but they didn't have the Word. I had the Word. God gave me the Word. And so I just knew that it was truth and I wanted to stick to it. And so I didn't.

[Knowles]

This is next level because there's just going from. I'm going to trust in God and not go totally black pill doomer when the doctors give me the death sentence. Just that alone. I think the vast majority of people cannot do, including believing Christians, who just through the frailties of this world would have a great deal of trouble doing that. That's one level. This is. Here's the pill. This is your only option, or you will die. And you just have this distinct. And I have friends who have had distinct. Have heard distinct voices where they're clear. This isn't any other kind of voice other than God or the Blessed Mother in one case. And you say, I heard. I heard from the man himself. And so I am now going to. I don't want to say gamble my life, but I'm going to stake my life, my only medical option for survival, on what I believe is the word of God.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

And it worked.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. I mean, I'm here now. That was back in 24.

[Knowles]

How difficult was it to persuade. You don't need to tell tales out of school. How difficult was it to persuade your husband and family that this was the right idea.

[Corley Spell]

Honestly, Ben was on the same page as me. I think he was a little, you know, startled at first, maybe, but he totally got on board. And he's like, sure, yeah, let's do this. And then finally, my mom and my sister got on board eventually. I mean, it did take a couple of days, perhaps, or maybe they never got on board.

[Knowles]

A couple of years, maybe. Yeah.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. I don't. Maybe they never did. My mom probably didn't get on board, but. But then I just. I started feeling better. Every day, I started feeling better. The fevers went away. I remember the first day I was able to get out of bed to go to the living room to sit down and brush my daughter's hair. I just. Like, within a week, I was already feeling better. And so I'm like, okay, Lord, things are happening. Things are looking better. And so the plan was. MD Anderson's plan was to take that for four to six weeks and then do surgery. And so during those four to six weeks, I'm feeling better. I'm not telling them that I didn't take it because I knew they would

[Knowles]

commit you to an insane asylum. Yes.

[Corley Spell]

Or fire me as a patient or whatever. And so I just. We just kind of kept it to ourselves. But I have a wonderful nutritionist, and he is a strong man of God, and he specializes in oncology, and. And he told me. He said, hey, you need to ask for a rescan before surgery. I think what they were seeing on those scans was infection and not cancer, or at least some of it. And I said, okay. That aligns with what the Lord told me. You know, I'm not a doctor. I don't know what I'm looking at. Right. And so I asked him to understand, like, well, can I have a rescan before surgery? No, sorry. We don't want to expose you to that much radiation. I'm like, listen, lady.

[Knowles]

Yeah, okay, we're past that, I think.

[Corley Spell]

Yes. And so I pushed and pushed, and they finally agreed to an ultrasound of the groin area. And so we did that, and they were like, okay, everything's shrunk by over 50% already. The pills are working. And I'm like,

[Knowles]

sure. Did you tell them? No. So they man, you go. You say, hey, docs, I'm going to override your medical judgment. Give me a scan. They say, no, no, no, no, no. You push, you get it. And then they say, okay, well, the thing we prescribed that you also didn't listen to is clearly working. And even then, you keep Straight face,

[Corley Spell]

you say, I just knew that God was writing this really, really beautiful and funny story, you know, that it could only have been by the grace of God that it happened. And so they saw that. They said, okay, this is great. Let's do a biopsy of it to see what's going on at a cellular level before we do a rescan. I said, okay. So they bring me in, do four different samples from the tumor, directly from it. All of them are dead. And they are just baffled. They cannot believe it. And they're like, okay, well, this is awesome. We didn't know that the pills did that, that it killed the cancer.

[Knowles]

You know who to thunk it.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, it was just supposed to shrink it. And I'm like, okay, well, can I get a rescan now? And they said, okay. So the next day, they get me in for a rescan again. Everything is showing shrinkage. Everything's. All the lymph nodes are getting smaller, smaller, smaller. We can do surgery now. It won't be as nearly as invasive as it needed to be. All good things. They had a better plan for surgery, a better strategy. And so, I mean, I was just. I was just so full of faith going into that surgery, which was the next week. I mean, I remember looking at Ben, and I was like, I don't even need the results. Like, I just know that it's all dead. That, like, what he said is true. And Ben's like, okay, but we're still gonna get the results, right?

[Knowles]

That's great.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

And we're gonna.

[Corley Spell]

Yes. We need it on the paper. We need to, you know, be able to show people. And so we did surgery. It was successful. They removed about nine lymph nodes from this region, which is a lot.

[Knowles]

Can I. This is my ignorance. Nope. I thought we had, like, two. How many lymph nodes do we have?

[Corley Spell]

Okay, we have, I think, maybe like, a couple of hundred.

[Knowles]

Really? Oh, wow.

[Corley Spell]

200, maybe being the most. Again, I'm not a medical doctor, but from the little bit I looked at it. But you know what's funny? When I asked my oncologist, when we were lining out the surgery, she said, okay, we'll just remove a few lymph nodes. And so I asked her. I was like, well, how many do we have? Because I want to know what I'm getting into, right? If I want to do this or not. Like, millions. I said, wait, like, literally, like a million.

[Knowles]

I don't know.

[Corley Spell]

And she's like, well, no. Like, you know, maybe a couple of hundred. I'm like, that's different than millions.

[Knowles]

That's quite different by orders of magnitude.

[Corley Spell]

Yes. It was just very bizarre. Like, but even that. Like, just how they persuade you and try to coerce you to do things, to not really think through it. Like, it was just really millions.

[Knowles]

No, actually, four. Well, hold on. Those are. That's different.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, but lymphedema, which is like swelling from lymph fluid not moving through your lymphatic system from removal of lymph nodes, is definitely a serious issue that I knew was a gamble with the surgery. And so that was something I. I didn't want, and I prayed that wouldn't happen. And honestly, the fact that I don't have lymphedema, especially with how much we travel, is a miracle in itself, too. Anyway, so we do surgery. They remove the lymph nodes, go over the results with me. A week later, we go back into MD Anderson, and my oncologist walks in, and she's reading her paper. She's reading the results. She's like, okay, good news. Surgery was successful. The pills worked. Everything was dead. Every single piece of cancer that we took out was dead. And the lymph nodes that were removed, where there was that we thought was cancer, never had cancer in them at all. And I'm like, okay. She's like, the pills worked. And then I said, Dr. Amari, I did not take the chemotherapy pills. And she just, like, her jaw hit the floor. Well, I'm assuming she was wearing a mask, just so caught off guard. She's like, well, what do you mean you didn't take the pills? And I said, I didn't take the pills. God told me that the cancer was dead. And at this point, she thinks I'm a crazy person. And she's looking through it, and she's like, okay, what else did he say? Anything about radiation? And I'm like, who? God? And she's like, no, your surgeon who you just met with. I said, no. You did not tell me.

[Knowles]

Neither of them said no.

[Corley Spell]

No one brought that up. And she said, okay. And she's just totally caught off guard. And so I was like, well, okay, knowing what you know now and the results that we have now, what would you be telling me to do? Because originally she was saying I needed to take those pills for the next year. And I said, well, now what? And she said, well, I guess we just do watch and scans and we monitor you closely. I said, okay, so we are. That's what we're doing. And every single scan, June will be two years is clear.

[Knowles]

Surely the doctors followed up with this, said, well, hey, Corla, you got a pretty strange case here. No, they didn't follow up.

[Corley Spell]

No, I don't think that they wanted to know. I knew when I told her that she was mad at her son or mad at me or just mad at the situation because she was not. Right.

[Knowles]

Right. Yeah, of course. Of course.

[Corley Spell]

And so, yeah, to this day, well,

[Knowles]

it's a great embarrassment. It really doesn't have to be an embarrassment in the sense that what they did is not medical malpractice. They followed best practices and protocols available to them. It's just that it would seem to me that the rational, practical, logical, most grounded conclusion one would have to draw from your case is, well, God intervened.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, they won't admit it. They just. They just don't talk to me about it. And I know that I'm still there to witness to them and whoever else is in that building.

[Knowles]

But, yeah, there's a lot more to say. First, though, go to goodranchers.com use code KNOWLES K N O W L E S Do you know what food powers the entire Knowles family? Good Ranchers it is. Look, there are all these great features of Good ranchers. It's American meat. It's not injected with a bunch of weird stuff. It's not a sneaky foreign meat that comes in with low health standards. It supports American ranchers and local ranchers, and it does all this stuff. It's great. But for me, the first question is, how tasty is it? And the answer is, this is going to be some of the tastiest meat you've ever had in your life. I would be willing to wager you've never had tastier meat. The burgers are the best burgers you've ever had in your life. The strip is my favorite of the regular cuts. The ribeye is sweet. Little Elise's favorite. Kind of funny here, that's like more of a masculine cut. But anyway, she loves it. And now they have filet mignon. And the filet mignon is superb. It's just all good. And the seed oil free chicken nuggets, which my kids love, and the. And it's just an unbelievable company and it's extremely inexpensive. I would hate to be their accountant, would hate to be their cfo. Don't know how it works, but when you subscribe to anyboxygoodranchers.com, use my code knowlescannon wlas at checkout, you will get free meat for life and 25 bucks off your first order. Goodranchers.com, american meat delivered. It's funny because we do this often. I've had debates with friends of mine over this. Would you rather, especially in politics, would you rather win or would you rather be right, lose but be right, have your prediction proven right? And people split on this. Some people are fine being wrong if they win, and some people would rather lose and be right.

[Corley Spell]

Right.

[Knowles]

And it's hard to predict which. And obviously the latter part, I think comes from more than a little bit of pride.

[Corley Spell]

Yes.

[Knowles]

But with the doctors, what's so just delightful and beautiful about the whole story is they were wrong. They should be thrilled. They should be dancing like David for being wrong. And it reminds me of this line. I was talking about it with a friend recently. Chesterton has this idea that the mystic is actually the most practical guy. Cause he knows his eternal destiny. He recognizes that we're not just meat. It's not that the mystic is head in the clouds, it's that the mystic is more practical than the cynic than the materialist. And so I guess what I would have to ask the doctors, I'm sure what you would want to ask the doctors is, hey, given everything we know, how else do you explain it?

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, so I think so one, all of the follow ups have been virtual with them, which is fine. But for my two year, I do want to go in and have a face to face conversation with her. And just because two years is when the highest reoccurrence rate are. And so I think once we're out of the two years with her, then they'll be more open to having conversations with me like that. And I do want to ask her, hey, what do you think of this? You know, what's your conclusion?

[Knowles]

But what do you think of it broadly? It's hard obviously to take yourself out of it because you lived it. You're the character in this story that you also happen to be telling. How should Christians think about the miracles?

[Corley Spell]

I think we should believe for the earthly miracles while we're on earth. And I think that was my frame of mind is until he calls me home, I will believe that the healing that you accomplished on the cross for me by your stripes is for the earthly. And if it's not like, okay, like I'm okay with that too, but I want to have the faith for the miracles. You think of David, he was so strong in his faith, but he still had to run out to a giant with a rock. You know, like you still had to do, like you still had to walk it out. You know, it didn't just happen on its own. Like we play a part in it, which I think is so beautiful that God invites us to do that in the story of life. You still have to walk it out. And so if the Bible were still being written right now, I want my story, my life, to be one of faith, courageous faith.

[Knowles]

And it is being written not literally in the canon of the Bible, but it is like we know how the story ends. We know the time between the incarnation and the story ending. We know that we're in that time and some of that has not been written, but the end of the story is written. So obviously we're part of that story. There's this tension in the Bible between thou shalt not test the Lord your God, don't put your God to the test. But also miracles happen and you trust God. And if you have the faith of a mustard seed, you can move mountains and you could walk on water out to come on. You're not going to go under the water if you just believe in me. There's that tension there. Or even our Lord says, a wicked generation seeks a sign and a wonder. But also we're to scrutinize the signs. We're also to. As events happen in this world, including an event such as the one you've described, we interpret that, we derive meaning from that because it's obviously meaningful.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, for sure. And it's how we overcome the blood of the lamb and the word of our testimony. And so I know that the Lord gave me this testimony to share. And is it scary going on shows like this? Absolutely. Like, I, I am not a public speaker or whatever, but told quite an

[Knowles]

eloquent story just now.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, well, thank you. But I know that it's like I have to. I didn't just happen to have a really successful meat company that allows me to be in these circles, but it does. And I know it's because I'm supposed to share this with people because when I was in that seat, I needed to hear about the miracles. I needed to believe for the modern day miracles, you know, and so that's what I'm doing.

[Knowles]

Yeah, you think about, you know, the woman reaches out to the hem of Christ's garment, says, your faith has made you whole. And there's. I love that because it's her faith makes her whole. And also her faith is enacted in reaching out to touch this tangible thing as you describe, you know, these miracles for the earthly. Like it's not just miracles in the clouds. You know, it's that I think sometimes when we hear about these miracles throughout the ages, some of the great saints and, you know, some stories are legendary, but some. But plenty of them are, like, quite well attested to historically. And I don't know, I at least have this idea that the miracles are kind of this just glorious ethereal thing where truly, you know, light just floods the room and you just know you're in the midst of a miracle. Whereas, actually, I think a lot of miracles happen when a husband and a wife are sitting in an oncologist's office and they think that the world is crumbling around them. And there's some, you know, there's some dingy coffee cup in the corner, and there's some doctor who doesn't really know what's up, sitting there speaking, and it just feels really, really earthly and quotidian. And that could be the. That is. I mean, you know, our Lord is crucified and conquers death on a rotten little hill called Calvary.

[Corley Spell]

Yep. And I. I have to believe for the earthly miracles, like. And I want to pass it on to my children, too. I want them to know, wow, Mom. Mom went through a test, and no matter where it came from, she had bold faith. But I also had open hands. I wasn't just holding onto it, like, oh, it has to happen or it's not true. I. I was open hands, like, whatever your will is, I'm here for it. And I loved Habakkuk. I loved reading Habakkuk all through that year, because even his name means to wrestle and embrace. And so I felt like I was wrestling with God a lot. Like, are you gonna do it? Am I gonna die? What's gonna happen? But I also embraced it. I'm like, I'm here for this struggle. And I know that you are working all things for my good. And it's not my definition of good. It's your definition. And it's good for me to join in the suffering. It's good for me to suffer. I am becoming more Christlike through the suffering.

[Knowles]

You know, your story reminds me, especially when you say, I wasn't going to blame God for this. I was going to be grateful for everything he's given me when I was a kid. My mother died when I was a teenager, and I was an atheist, but I went to see this nice priest. My grandmother asked me to do it, and I liked the priest. So anyway, I go and he tells me it was nice to sit with him, and he Says, well, whatever you do, don't blame him. And he points to the crucifix on the wall. I remember thinking, like, are you serious, man? Are you serious? That's what you're telling me right now? I was polite about it. I was a polite teenager. But mostly. But I thought. And then I think, now, of course, this is all given to me. And I like to think that I would have had that reaction of like, well, I didn't make myself. You know, my whole life is a gift, and all these blessings I had are a gift. And it would be very difficult not to be angry at a sense of cosmic injustice. But you weren't.

[Corley Spell]

I mean, it rains on the righteous and the unrighteous, right? And that's what I go back to. It's like, whether I had cancer or not, I have today. Like, tomorrow's not promised. And I think that's another way that the enemy tries to torment us is just to go through. We'll look at all this. It's horrible here. It's so bad here. Like, he really allowed that to happen, huh? That's his fault, and it's just not true. He's a good father, and I knew that this was not from him. I didn't know. I didn't know. Honestly, I still don't know. Right. There's a lot we don't know, and we won't know until we get there. But was this an attack? Was this a testing of faith? I don't know.

[Knowles]

Right. All I know is it's not really yours too, though.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, I was sick and then I was healed. That's all I know.

[Knowles]

You know, people watching this. Who? Many people. I mean, it's pretty persuasive. Many people will take it for what it's worth. But there will be some people who say, no, couldn't have been. Maybe it was the keto diet, maybe it was the this, maybe it was the that. No, they'll look for any explanation other than, I think, well, like the way even for Christians, sometimes they'll believe stuff in antiquity, but they won't believe. Like, even there are Eucharistic miracles. I don't know if you've seen these have happened over the ages, for 2000 years, but including in recent years, where a consecrated host, the Holy Communion, will bleed. Doesn't happen a lot. You know, it's a rare thing. And they'll test the blood. It's like the same type of blood of a man from the Middle East. And there are people who will say, I don't buy it. I say, hold on. You believe a guy rose from the dead? You believe a guy turned water into wine? You believe. Let me go back further. You believe that all of this exists and the world is intelligible and you can make some sense of it and we can even communicate with each other, but a host can't bleed.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, yeah, I know. It's totally the enemy. And you know, I'm having those conversations with my kids right now, like, well, how do we know God exists, mom? Like, how do we know? And I'm like, look around you. Look at creation. And right now we, we talk a lot about our words and how powerful they are. And you know proverbs, life and life and death is in the power of your tongue. And so we are always telling them, speak life, speak life. But I mean, that was like hammered into my system in 24, because out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. And I, in my heart, I believed that I would be healed. And I spoke it. I never even said things like my cancer. I never gave it that title. I just never let that take root into my being. Not that I was. I wasn't dismissing what was true and what the report said, but in my spirit, I was choosing to align with God's word and what he said. And so now we're telling our kids, speak life, speak life. Because, I mean, I think that's faith. Sometimes in a scientific experiment, because they'll ask 65 year olds, how do you feel in a group of them, the ones that say, I'm all right, kind of got some aches and pains. My back kind of hurts in the mornings, whatever. Compared to the ones who say, I feel great, like I'm walk in, Very positive. They live much longer than the ones who are complaining. And I think that's faith. I think that's a power of our words in a sample. Right. Something that we could understand.

[Knowles]

Right.

[Corley Spell]

So, yeah, I just, I chose to speak life.

[Knowles]

Now you're almost two years out.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

How has your life changed? Not just look, I mean, you're alive. That's. That's good. You were headed in the other direction. But I mean, have you noticed any changes in the way you speak, in your demeanor, in your approach, how you wake up in the morning, how you go to bed at night? Or no, is it the same?

[Corley Spell]

I think that I am truly living in gratitude now. I think before I would like to think I had a thankful heart. I was very appreciative for my life and everything that's in my Life. But now I am truly, like, just walking in gratitude. Like every breath is a gift.

[Knowles]

Yeah.

[Corley Spell]

Every day with my children, as hard as homeschooling is, and I want to bang my head against the wall sometimes. Thank you, God. Thank you, God, that I am here with them in this house, and we're having these conversations, we're making these memories together. I'm just. I'm so thankful. And then as far as maybe, like, my faith, I feel like everything is different now. I feel. I don't know, when I read the

[Knowles]

Word,

[Corley Spell]

it just feels different. It truly feels like manna, like my daily bread. Whereas before, I don't know, it just shifted. It just really shifted for me. And it is.

[Knowles]

It shifted. When you say now the Word of God feels like your manna from heaven, you know, your daily bread, what do you mean by that shift?

[Corley Spell]

It's just at a deeper level, I feel like I am more my frame of mind. As CS Lewis said, we are souls, we have bodies. And I feel like that's where my frame of mind is. And, you know, we don't wrestle with flesh and blood. And so I feel like I'm discerning more which I ask for that. I pray for discernment. I pray for wisdom. And I'm. I feel like I'm seeing, like, the spiritual warfare more than I was before.

[Knowles]

Yeah.

[Corley Spell]

You know.

[Knowles]

Yeah. So this is something I've noticed if I'm, you know, I'm a mackerel snapping Papist. We have sacramental theology, and so I go to confession regular. Not as much as I should, but I go to confession. And after you've been absolved of your sins, we believe that you're in a state of grace. And if you commit venial sins, that weakens grace, but it doesn't sever it. And we believe the Eucharist actually forgives venial sins where it's not grave matter, intentionally done with full knowledge. But when you do a mortal sin, which happens, we believe that severs that grace. There's something that's really tough here. And so you go in and the priest cuts some demons off you, and then you go out. One thing I've noticed, very tangibly, is when all pistons are firing and I'm in a state of grace, and I feel the world makes more sense. Those little coincidences that you might not get, you see them, and it's very peaceful, actually. And when you're in a state where you're sinning a lot and maybe your life of grace is seriously damaged, the world doesn't make as much sense. And it's very scary, actually. And it's not really scary when you're in a right relationship of grace with God. It's been my personal experience and I

[Corley Spell]

think, yeah, no, I think that's great. And I didn't grow up fasting as a spiritual discipline, but that's something we started to do in 24 together and now it's a regular one that we practice. And I, I love it. I just feel like you, you just align more with the supernatural, with heaven and God, and like you take a step almost into the supernatural. You know, it's just the separation that it creates from the physical is just, I feel like we all need it. I mean, Jesus fasted 40 days before he started his public ministry. Like, how much more should I be doing that, you know?

[Knowles]

Yeah, this was, fasting was a regular practice of the church for a very long time. And even I remember when I first tried it, you know, as an adult, came back into the church And I was 23, 24, and I said, I'm not gonna eat food for a day. What, I'll die, I'll waste away. And you actually don't. Like, the human body is built to fast like every so often. And once you do it and you realize it's not impossible and then it actually becomes easy when you do it more. It is a very healthy reminder that we're not really even ultimately for this world. You know, we're not constrained by the appetites of this world.

[Corley Spell]

That's why I say like the daily bread, like that's when God's word, like even more so, becomes the bread of life for you, you know, so it's beautiful.

[Knowles]

How much did your kids know about all of this as it was going on?

[Corley Spell]

So at the time, my oldest was only five, almost six when it started. And so he's eight now. And only the past year have I shared with my two boys, the 8 and 7 year old, that it was cancer. What cancer is. My little, my girls are five and three. They don't know, right? And so they're starting, the boys are starting to understand it. I mean, they definitely knew I was sick. They saw it, but they didn't know what it was. And so now my 8 year old, I see as the wheels turning is like, wait, you had cancer? Wait, you like. Because he'll, he'll, he will hear me during these conversations as well, or at a speaking event and he'll hear me say that I almost died. He's like, Wait, Mommy, you almost died? Like, yes.

[Knowles]

Yeah.

[Corley Spell]

You know, and so it's just like those pillars, right, that you're building for your family, Those, like, altars in the wilderness that they will look to. They're starting to realize that.

[Knowles]

So what's next?

[Corley Spell]

I don't know.

[Knowles]

Who knows?

[Corley Spell]

I have no idea. I mean, I'm just taking it honestly a day at a time, and I'm just. I'm just praying that God would just steward. Help us, steward what he's given us and show us what's next. I mean, you know, good Ranchers is awesome, and that's growing. And, you know, the people we get to minister to, like, even in our offices, is just really sweet and beautiful. It's become its own community. But as far as me personally, I'm just gonna be homeschooling and just sharing my story with whoever wants to hear it. Whether it's, you know, someone sitting next to me at the park or, you know, an audience like this. Like, I just feel like I need to share it.

[Knowles]

Last question before I let you go.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah,

[Knowles]

I guess it's a question for a theologian, but you have some pretty direct experience of the. Why does God still perform miracles? What's the point?

[Corley Spell]

Well, I mean, miracles, signs and wonders. I mean, that was promised. That was in the Word. And so I think as Christians, when we don't believe, for them, we are limiting. We're limiting everything. You know, I think that's what the unbelievers look to, and it's what the believers look to. Both of them. It's good for both of us. It's how we overcome our testimony and the blood of the lamb. So it's almost like an equation. Like, it has to happen, right?

[Knowles]

Yeah, it's a great point that I hadn't really considered. The unbelievers and the believers both looked at me. And so you say, well, a miracle, it kind of makes sense for the unbelievers because it says, hey, this is really confounding your thinking. And what's funny, though, is, and this has happened to me, if you're not in belief and you're not in faith and then you see a miracle, you can say, it's the craziest thing. I saw a miracle. Ask any random agnostic atheist on the street, have you ever seen something that's, like, supernatural or miraculous? If they're being candid, they'll tell you, yes. They say, cool. What did you conclude from that? What did you do because of that? And they say, what? Oh, nothing. I Just put it out of my mind. So that happens. But then even I think for believers it's very important because it's. Some people say, oh, I don't like religion. You know, I like spirituality, but not religion. Or I like. I only want a personal relationship. And I love religion. Religion's great. Religion is a habit of virtue that inclines the will to God. Give God what he deserves. Religion's great. But all that said, there can be trappings of religion where it becomes rote or it becomes, I don't know, kind of boring or something. You think where you think that you have comprehended it. And because you know all the rules. And so for the believer, when God gives you a sign or a wonder or a miracle, I think it's maybe more important for the believer because it's a reminder, hey, buddy, this isn't just some system. I am the living God and I am in charge.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. And how dare we try to put that in a box.

[Knowles]

Yeah. You won't confine me. You won't comprehend me.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. The day that I feel like I've figured out all of it and I've arrived in my theology or whatever it is, Lord help me, I will look back to this miracle, though, you know, it's also for me because I'm going to go through things, you know, I'm 34, 35 years old. Like, I have a whole life ahead of me. And I know it's not going to be all sunshine and rainbows, but I will look back in this and say, if you led me through that, I know you'll do it again.

[Knowles]

Right. That's a marker even for you. It even gets me thinking on the story of St. Thomas Aquinas, who is probably the greatest theologian ever to live, and writes just like the Summa Theologiae, you know, among many other works. And he's caught up in this mystical experience toward the end of his life, and he comes back and he says, everything I've written is as so much straw. Which is not even to downplay. Like, it's still the greatest theology we have, but it's. But he's just like, you don't even know man. You don't even.

[Corley Spell]

Yes, truly. And one book that I did read when I was so sick was Imagine Heaven. Have you read that one?

[Knowles]

No.

[Corley Spell]

Oh, it's so good. He compiles dozens and dozens of near death experiences where they die for however many minutes, have a near death experience, go to heaven, and then come back and share their story, whether they're believers or not like any religion. And it was just so beautiful to just to go through that mental process, to go through that experience of like, just imagining it even more. You know, the Bible obviously gives us depictions, but just to have people who have visited and come back and just to hear their experience, it was just. It was transformative. Every Christian should read that book. It was so beautiful.

[Knowles]

Does people say when they have a near death experience, they. You know, they fear death less? You had a near, near death experience?

[Corley Spell]

Yeah.

[Knowles]

Wasn't a near death, but it was a near, near death experience? Yeah.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah, it was bad.

[Knowles]

Do you. Do you fear death less?

[Corley Spell]

Oh, yeah, for sure. But even. I mean, it's like the renewing of your mind every day. Because I'll find myself getting. I have scans next month. And here he goes. The enemy is trying. Well, what if it's gonna be bad? And I'm like, no. Like, that's why. It's like, take every thought captive to the obedience of Christ and like, that's. You have to do. Just, like, figure it out and then you're good for the rest of your life.

[Knowles]

It's a daily spiritual realm that is the experience of. You see a miracle and you put it out of mind. Or in your case, like, you are experienced, you were the object of a miracle. And then they say, time for your next scan. Get out of there. What are you doing?

[Corley Spell]

What are you talking about? It's just so natural to go back to the doubting and. Yeah, it's a practice. You gotta get your mind right.

[Knowles]

I didn't think it was possible for me to like good ranchers even more than I already do. And this is ev. This is somehow even adding to the lore. It's an amazing thing, Coralie. An unbelievable story. Very glad it's had a happy ending. Of course, I'm glad that we had a happy ending to our talk six months ago so that you could actually tell the story, which I think will be very, very inspiring and edifying for a lot of people.

[Corley Spell]

Yeah. Praying that.

[Knowles]

Good to see you.

[Corley Spell]

Thank you.