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The Millionaire Real Estate Agent | The MREA Podcast
102. Run the Play: Win in Any Market With James Shaw
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- [00:00]
James Shaw
Foreign.
- [00:06]
Jason Abrams
Welcome back to another episode of the Millionaire Real Estate Agent podcast. I'm Jason Abrams and this is the place where we lift the curtain on the world of real estate like never before. Every week I sit down with visionaries, pirates and mavericks. We're here to document, demonstrate, and most importantly, demystify their game changing models and systems. What secrets propel them to the top and how are they living their dreams? This is about passion. It's about strategy. But above all, it's about real, tangible success. So buckle up and let's dive in. This is the Millionaire Real Estate Agent podcast. Hey, gang, welcome. We have one for you today that is going to take your breath away. Friends, when I look up at all the dashboard of real estate, here's what I can tell you. We are in a shift. No doubt about it. You're doing less transactions that you did historically over the last 10 years, interest rates are higher than they have been. There's less real estate selling, there's more deals that are falling out. And generally it is harder to find listings and buyers. The shift becomes the hunt for the motivated. So when markets change. You need a play. I'm going to say it, it's going to rhyme. But friends, run the play and win the day. What's the play you run? We are about to interview a gentleman who has set his entire career around understanding that play at the deepest levels. Friends, he has 125,000 real estate agents that join him in his Facebook community called Pivot. Shift ahead. I am talking about none other than James Shaw. He has dedicated his life to making sure real estate agents know what play to run when the market shifts. We are going to be studying and unpacking the book shift with none other than James Shaw. Sit back and buckle up. This is James Shaw. James, how are you, sir?
- [02:19]
James Shaw
I'm great, Jason. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it. Happy to be back.
- [02:22]
Jason Abrams
Oh, an honor to have you. By the way, you are in rare air, my friend. You and Gary Keller and Mel Robbins are the only people we've had on the show.
- [02:30]
James Shaw
That's ridiculous. Well, I brought the quality of that down rapidly. But thank you for the invite and I'm honored to be in the same sentence as those two.
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Jason Abrams
The honor is all ours. So, my friend, let's recant. How did you find your way into the greatest industry in the world?
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James Shaw
Well, I got fired from my job as a TV news producer and fortunately, I had someone that was a friend of our family who said, you should come sell houses. So I went and sold houses. Her What I didn't realize, Jason, was she was like an elite agent. She's doing 400 homes a year. She's still the number one agent in her market for 50 straight years.
- [03:04]
Jason Abrams
That's incredible. When was that?
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James Shaw
That was in 2004.
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Jason Abrams
So you found your way into the production side of the news business.
- [03:14]
James Shaw
Yes.
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Jason Abrams
What did you learn there that you brought into your career in real estate?
- [03:18]
James Shaw
Well, you know what, it's funny because it's come full circle now because now what I went to school for and what I did when I got out of school is what I do every really. But now I get to do it in this industry that I am really passionate about. But, you know, I think the news business and you have TV experience, it's about, you know, understanding a flow but then being able to adapt on the fly. I mean, I don't know, it was all that stuff, but yeah. So I started in the business with this agent who was great. I joined Keller Williams a year later because I moved. And she had a lake house next door to a KW agent. And what was cool about that was that agent was the number one agent in all of KW back in 2006. So we're in Gary's mastermind. And I just got really lucky Jason to hang out with the best people, but they were all living millionaire real estate agent and Gary's models and all of the stuff. And that was my intro in before I got into market center leadership, which is where I continued to be passionate about Gary's books.
- [04:11]
Jason Abrams
When you read the Millionaire Real Estate and by the way, friends, if you're new to the show, the Millionaire Real Estate Agent was a book written by Gary Keller, J. Papasan and nay rest in peace Dave Jenks. And it's the namesake for our show. And I ask everyone who brings it up, which is pretty much everyone we talk talk to, what was it about it when you read it, James, that connected with you?
- [04:31]
James Shaw
All of the answers from it. This is my original. So if you're watching this on the video podcast, like, this is my original book I got 20 something years ago when I joined KW and it's falling apart like, and it's all highlighted. This is like a manual. And what I found as a team leader. I spent eight years as a team leader and a bunch of time as a maps coach. Is that when agent had a question about what should I do about this in my business? How would this work? The answer was here was in mrea. I didn't have to have all the answers. I just knew where to find them in the book. And so that's what I look at it. It's a working playbook, it's a manual, it's completely relevant today. I teach from it all the time. It's the answers, by the way, I.
- [05:09]
Jason Abrams
Couldn'T agree with you more, which kind of leads into an incredible connection here. You actually kind of went off on a mission because after that book, everything is happening great in the real estate industry. And then 08 and 09 happens. And if you're young enough to not know what I mean, I feel old. But the wheels fell off the proverbial real estate wagon.
- [05:29]
James Shaw
They did.
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Jason Abrams
And to answer the needs of that moment, Gary and Jay and Dave picked up the pen, went back into the lab with a pen and a pad and wrote the book Shift. This must have had a profound impact on you because you've now built an incredible thriving community around these concepts.
- [05:48]
James Shaw
Jason I became a team leader in January of 2009. That's before the book came out. And we had 110 agents in our office then. And in 60 days it dropped to 89 people. And you know, this is not the job of a team leader, is to shrink the market center as quickly as possible. That is not the job. But the market had changed so quickly, Jason, that agents just were not able. Some of them were just not in production at a level that they could stay in. So they weren't leaving to go somewhere else. They were getting out of the industry. And we didn't really have much other than back then. We had a class called Camp 443 and we had MREA and those things, but we didn't have Shift, so. So Shift and Bold both came out that fall while I was a team leader. And this is my original copy of Shift that I got in 2009 that I taught from. I read it on a plane on a way to Austin where we did a mega camp basically around this. And then every week in team meeting, I would teach from it. And the reason why I'm so passionate about this book is because I saw how Gary and Dave and Jay taught about in here. I saw how it impacted our people. You know, we finished that year in Cary, North Carolina with 89 agents. We had gone from 110 to 89. We finished with 89, give or take. I don't know the exact numbers off the top of the head, but in the neighborhood of that. But we had the best fourth quarter that Market center had ever had up to that point in its history because we were Applying what we're learning in here and bold. And those two things on top of each other had a massive impact. So that's why I just taught it right. I was a team leader during the Great Recession when this stuff really mattered. My eight years was all during a very challenging time. I got out of the job as a team leader right before the market took off. My timing was perfect, but the truth is it impacted our people. You know what else it did, though? Because I taught from it all the time. We grew our market center. So when I left Cary, we had like 130something people. We had dropped to 89, but built it back up. I had an opportunity in tampa, went from 168 to 301. Why? Because we were teaching MREA and shift over and over.
- [07:54]
Jason Abrams
I love that, by the way, because in every quote unquote shifting market. And you'd say the market is always shifting, but no matter what, someone is gonna have their best year and a bunch of people are gonna launch what's going to be incredible careers.
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James Shaw
Yes.
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Jason Abrams
We were on stage at megacamp two weeks ago, and Gary, we started with this concept and I asked him, I said, so why did you write the book? And he said he had received an email from one of the agents that he had been coaching. And the agent said, hey, man, someone turned out the lights in our market. What's the play? And there was two things that I found instructive about that. Number one, it wasn't an email saying, someone turned out the lights and I'm quitting. Want to wish you all the best. It was someone who had decided to be an immovable object in the industry, asking for the play of the moment. And number two, that email ultimately becomes the manuscript that this book turns into. In that email, he lays out these tactics. So, friends, you know what time it is? We are about to unpack a model. Now we document the models. You don't have to take the notes. I'm taking the notes. So if you're bombing down the highway in your new McLaren, have no fear, I am here. If you don't get them, they come out as a PDF every Thursday. You need to go to MrEanotes.com that's MrEanotes.com and sign up. James, tell me exactly how to thrive in a shifting market.
- [09:20]
James Shaw
Well, I think the first thing we have to remember, and this is from my experience as a team leader, and then what we do now inside of the Pivot Shift Ahead Facebook group, is that the market is irrelevant to the individual agent the state of the market means absolutely nothing to an individual. Gary says toward the end, it's 200 and something. I'll see if I can pull it up. But he says toward the end of the book that we can make easy times harder than they need to be. Here it is, page 271. He says hard times aren't easy, hence the name. But you know what? Easy times aren't easy either. Life's a continuous challenge. People say hard times aren't easy and easy times aren't hard. I'm not sure it's true or it serves you well to look at that way. I believe it's fairer to say that no matter your circumstances, listen, things can be easy or hard depending on you. You'll decide you can either make easy times harder than they need to be or you can make hard times as easy as they can be. You don't get to decide what the market will do, but you definitely get to decide what you will do. And that's why I always say that the state of the markets are relevant to the individual agent. There will be, I don't know what, 4ish million transactions this year. 8 million sides. Like, for the person listening to this, what's Your goal? Like 36? Is it 48? Is it 200? Is it 600?
- [10:38]
Jason Abrams
This audience, it's 3,000. We know this audience.
- [10:41]
James Shaw
My guess would be if you logged into your multiple listing service and looked at all of the closings that took place today, it would be more than what you hope to sell this year. And if it's not, then just look at it over two days or three days or four days. There's enough happening in your market for you to succeed now. Jason, it's harder. There's no doubt about that, that it's more difficult. We know that it takes more appointments to get the same number of listings. It takes more listings to sell one right now. A couple years ago, it was a one for one. Now, depending on where you are, it could be two, three, or four to one. I'm not discounting the fact that it does require more effort. It requires you to be a little bit more purposeful. It requires you to be a little more on target. But it doesn't mean you can't win. So Gary says shift page 25. That growth comes from clarity, priorities, and focused action. Jason and I think in a market like this, we have to get super clear on what our goal is and know what we want to accomplish. We've got to get super clear on the Priorities that are required for us to be able to reach that goal. And then we've got to be very purposeful in our action. The challenge that we had was in 22 and 23, 21, those, like right post, you know, into the pandemic years, you just turned around and ran into business like it was everywhere. And so you didn't have to be super clear or have really great priorities or take purposeful action. But what happens is when the market changes, and it has in many places, I mean, just south of me, it's a buyer's market. Prices are down, you know, 10% year over year. Like, it's really rough. Well, what happens when that happens in your market is that all the things you weren't doing well become exposed. There's a section in SHIFT where Gary and Jay and Dave say that in good times we succeed not only because of what we do right, but also in spite of what we do wrong. So let's figure out what we're doing wrong. Let's get clear about the goals, figure out what the priorities are. You know, what is it going to take to get to that goal and then get very purposeful in our activities. And if we do that, Jason, we'll be just fine.
- [12:46]
Jason Abrams
Okay, I love that. Walk me through exactly how to do it. When you say it, I feel so empowered and I'm like, oh, my gosh, I get it. But tomorrow morning I gotta wake up and I actually have to get clear and then take action. Walk me through. What should I do?
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James Shaw
Well, I think this business is hard, and if we don't have a goal that has some sort of meaning or purpose behind it, it becomes a lot harder. So our friend Gene Rivers teaches this concept of figuring out your lid. And Gene's a legend inside of Keller Williams, Right? A multi market center owner has a great team, Is KWU Master faculty, teaches business planning clinic. He's great. And he says, if you can go figure out your lid, then you will be fine. Everything will fall into place. L stands for lifestyle. So you figure out what does your lifestyle cost in a year? And Jason, just write it all down. Go figure it out. Do you go to Starbucks every day? You can go to Starbucks every day. That's fine if you can afford it. Goes. If you can't afford it, then you have to stop. But like, what's your lifestyle cost? My kid is in competitive dance. 14 hours of dance a week, right? So with three conventions and costumes and the whole deal, like, that's fine if we can afford to do that. Then she can do that. And I don't want to tell her no. So there's all these different things. What is your lifestyle? Like, where do you go on vacation? Where do you sit on the plane when you fly there? Like, all those things. Figure that out. Lifestyle.
- [14:05]
Jason Abrams
Now, James, I got to ask. I'm figuring out my lifestyle as it is today, and that's the lifestyle I want to continue. Because I met with an agent the other day who I said, what's your budget? And this person said, it's about $15,000 a month for their life. I said, great. I then looked at their financials, credit cards, bank statements, and I said, you haven't spent less than 40,000amonth in the last nine months. And you know what the kid said to me? He said, I know, but you asked me what my budget was. It's 15. There's a big difference between what you're actually budgeting and what you're spending.
- [14:39]
James Shaw
You should figure it out. And the best way to do it is to do exactly what you just said. Print out your credit card statements and bank statements for the last three months and go line by line and take a look. But I'd figure it out. I'd figure out, what's your lifestyle cost. Next is investing. That's the I. What are you doing to save for retirement? You know, sef, ira? Are you buying investment properties? What is your investing goal this year? Figure that out. D stands for debt. Now, your largest debt obligation every year are your taxes. So budget for those so that you don't get messed up by that, as so many people in our industry have. And then what is your other debt that you have? Do you have a mortgage? Do you have car payments? Do you have student loans you're paying off? Do you have credit card debt? But you go and you figure out this lid number, and what that will effectively tell you is here's how much money you need to personally make before you've paid your taxes. And what I love about this idea is then you take that and you go put it in the economic model from the millionaire real estate agent and just dump it in there, let it do the rest. And you'll come down to the bottom, and the bottom will say, you need this many listings and this many buyers, and you need to go on this many appointments. And then, Jason, you have to ask the question, am I willing to do that? Like, once you've figured out your lid and you punch this all in and you put in the numbers, and then you put it in the economic model and you get out your abacus and you do all the math. And then at the bottom it says that you need to go on six listing appointments a month and get six buyer age agreements a month. And you're going, ooh, I don't think I can do 12 appointments a month. Well, then you have to go change something. Either you go in and change the lid or you're going to have to change, you know, the activities that you're willing to take. But I'd get clarity around what it is this business does for you. Because you and I have both met people. I say, what's your goal? And they want to go, I want to sell 52 homes. I go, cool. How'd you come up with that? Well, I did 36 last year. Three a month. So I figure I can basically do like one a week now. And I'm like, there's no way that's not going to happen because it's not based in anything. So go base it in something. Now, once it's based in something, you have clarity around it. Well then you can ask if you're committed to it. And if you're committed to whatever that is, then you'll get consistent in the activities required to reach it. This is this three part piece. Get clarity around the goal and what it means to you and what it does for you and how it makes your life better. And then ask, am I committed to the activities required to be able to reach that goal? Is it a goal I'm committed to and am I committed to the activities I have to do to get there? And then next is the easiest part, which is just get consistent in those activities.
- [17:17]
Jason Abrams
I want to stay to number two. What does committed mean to you when you say that word?
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James Shaw
I think you have to ask a. Now that I have clarity around this goal, I just need to make sure. Is it really my goal? I've met people, you've met people. I've done it too. Where, you know, this happened to me recently. I was out running one day and it was a really good run. I really enjoyed it. And I'm like, you know what? I'm going to do a marathon again. Now, I've run six marathons in my life, but I haven't run any marathons in like, I don't know, eight years, nine years. But all of a sudden I had one good four mile run one day I'm like, I'm ready for a marathon. And then the next day I'm like, I don't want to do a Marathon. Training for a marathon totally sucks. I have no desire to do that ever again. Like, I'm not committed to that at all. But there are some people, like, there'd be another time in my life where I would have gotten home and signed up for some marathon, spent $300 on it when I wasn't really committed. And I think we do things in the moment where we think we have this epiphany of clarity that all of a sudden, just something has fallen out of the sky for you, and you have this moment of clarity and that if you pause, maybe you don't. So I'd ask you to get really clear. What's this business do for you? What do you hope to accomplish through it? What is it you want to do for others through it? What do you hope to do for yourself? What do you want to set up in the future? Get clarity around that. Ask yourself if you're committed, then figure out the steps, which is putting it in the millionaire real estate agent economic model, and ask, am I committed to these steps? You know, in order for me to go on six listing appointments a month, I'm going to have to do these four or five things very consistently. Am I willing to do those? Okay, I am. Good. Go do them.
- [18:59]
Jason Abrams
Okay. Talk to me about that. Because as soon as I go through this exercise, I'm now going to have my LID number, and I'm going to have the number of transactions that I need to do or at least documents I need to get signed in the hope of doing a transaction.
- [19:10]
James Shaw
That's right.
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Jason Abrams
Whether it's a buyer's agreement or a listing agreement.
- [19:13]
James Shaw
Right.
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Jason Abrams
Talk to me about lead gen, because that's always going to be the next step.
- [19:17]
James Shaw
Yeah.
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Jason Abrams
In a shifting market. And what are you seeing right now? Because you interview hundreds of agents every year, what can you teach me about lead Gen?
- [19:25]
James Shaw
Okay, this is one of my favorite things that Gary, Dave, and Jay teach us in shift. It starts on page 54. It runs through page 57 if y' all are taking notes. Although Jason's going to send you the PDF every Thursday. My favorite Thursday email. But page 54 to 57 is where they go through and say, you got to figure out what's working and what's not working and focus on what's working. And to summarize those handful of pages, if you just go back and take a look at your closings over the last year or so and get super focused on where it came from, you know, is this a past client? Was this from my newsletter? Was this from door knocking in my neighborhood. Whatever open houses, whatever strategies you're using, get really clear about where that business came from. Then rank them and not by which ones you like the most, but which ones bring you the most business, the most leads. And then double down on those three or four or five strategies that work. You know, you guys have done the research. That said, we really only need about four strategies to be able to succeed. The one that's a non negotiable is the database. So you're going to have to look at how you're really communicating with your database. But then there's a list. You put the same list in all the books of what all your different legion options are. So go figure out what's already working and double down on that. But I think the mistake people make in a shift is they go, oh my gosh, my business is slipping. Things aren't going so great. I need to add a strategy. And I go, do not add a strategy. Because first of all what you'll do is you'll end up adding a strategy that someone else taught you at mega camp or family reunion and you heard how great it was for them. And so now all of a sudden you want to go do it, but you don't like it. Like, you don't really want to knock on doors, but here you are out printing flyers and knocking on doors. And you can do that for a month, but you can't do it forever because you don't like it. So we don't add a strategy. We double down on the strategies that are already working. Oh, so you're doing an open house a week. Do two, do one Wednesday night and one Saturday afternoon. Like just double down on the stuff that works. That's my favorite thing from Gary in here. But one more, Jason, and that is if you go to page 72. Because the thing we talked about was you got to be consistent. Sometimes we confuse consistency with being the same thing every day. Consistency isn't every day. I made 20 contacts. Consistency is, did you make contacts? Was it five today? 20 the next day, 15 the day after that? But if we're in a flow of consistency, that's what I'm looking for. But we can't be consistently silent in our lead generation. We've got to do something. And so I love this section. Gary says, at the risk of being blatantly obvious, I feel compelled to point out that in order for you to truly be a successful lead generator, you must actually do lead generation. And you have to do it a lot. You can't do it one day here and one day there, an hour here and an hour there. And here's the key, Jason. This is where people got confused. He says an inconsistent approach can get you leads, but it won't give you anywhere near the number of leads that you'll need when a market shifts. Okay, so we were inconsistent in 21 and 22 and 23, and we still hit great sales numbers because the market was, you know, two and a half times or whatever. One and a half times what it is right now. So we hit great numbers, but all of a sudden, the market changes. And Gary tells us right here, it will not get you the same number of leads. He keeps going. He says you have to subscribe to one simple belief. That dealing with business never takes precedence over finding business. Never. That you've got to do your one thing first. Gary and Jay wrote a whole book on that. Your one thing first. And this is one of my favorite things I've ever learned from Gary. I have this, an image of this saved on my computer that I use from time to time. And it's where Gary talks about that on his desk. I don't know if he still has it. Jason, you go in and take a look. But on his desk, it's still there.
- [23:20]
Jason Abrams
I know what you're gonna say.
- [23:22]
James Shaw
The sign that says, until my number one priority is done, everything else is a distraction. Is it still on his desk? Jason?
- [23:28]
Jason Abrams
Not only is it on his desk, but he's redecorating his office. So he's moved into a temporary space. And I want you to know the first thing that he moved was the gold sort of frame that holds this sheet of paper. It's like, think about, like, for music notes. And that sheet of paper. And then they moved everything else.
- [23:47]
James Shaw
I want this posted on the socials. People have got to see this sign on the socials. And this is what I love about Gary. I have been mentored by this man for almost half of my life. And what I love about him is how purposeful he is on his message all the time. And he's narrowed it down that he's only going to do the most important things. He's leading us by example, and we've got to do them, too. And the most important thing in your business right now is pumping it full of leads. You've got to have a deep pipeline full of leads, and you cannot do that if you are inconsistent.
- [24:19]
Jason Abrams
I love that. Okay, so I lean into getting my lid. I then figure out my deals. I Then ramp up, as he says on page 72, my lead generation. And now I have leads coming in, which brings me into conversion and the importance of converting because deals are fewer and further between. How do you think about that?
- [24:40]
James Shaw
Well, I think that first of all, remembering that you have to have more now, period. So you're going to have to pump it full. I was talking to a coach the other day who told me that their research says it's about 150 contacts to a closing. And a couple of years ago it was only about 100. So we've got to pump it full. When you look at the model that's in Shift about conversion, they went through and took what used to be a three piece model and made it a four piece model. But the original three was capture, connect and then close to an appointment. Well, it's not that simple in a market like this. What we've added, and I'll give you the page number, Jason, once I get to it, but what we've added is cultivate page 104 of SHIFT. Cultivate. And Gary says it right here in the book. Most agents struggle with cultivation. If they connect but can't immediately close for an appointment, they usually let the lead slip. They just don't get back to people. And then all of a sudden they're really disappointed because they heard that those people listed their house or bought a house with some other agent or usually he says they don't even hear about it. The business just slides to somebody else. So what Gary tells us is we've got to get very purposeful in our follow up. All right, so here's how we do it. The book teaches 33 touch. We've taught 36 touch. I don't care how many touches it is, it doesn't really matter to me. Okay? You can do 36 really weak touches and have no conversion whatsoever. And you could do four really quality touches and have great conversion. Whatever you think it is, it's not enough. So here's what I usually teach is figure out what is your hundred touch play to your database every year. And here's why I think we have to touch them 100 times. Because, Jason, would you agree with me that a majority of the people in your database do not have a real estate need or a referral this year. They're living in their house, they're living their life and they're fine. Would you agree with that?
- [26:29]
Jason Abrams
We know the number. We know about 6% of all the people in your database will based on 88 million single family homes and 350 million people.
- [26:38]
James Shaw
So, yes, it goes right in line with what I've taught. I've taught a 95.5split on this. 95% of the people in your database have no need. 5% of them do. So I think the way we cultivate is that we're not actually just looking to cultivate the leads in our pipeline. We're looking to cultivate everybody we know, because at some point they're going to move from the 95 to the 5 they're going to move from. I don't need you to. I do need you. And the question is, will you be the person they think of? So I think the way we do that is through some sort of 100 touch ish program that is adding value and is consistently staying in touch. See, we've got to be consistent. That's what a 100 touch program does. But you also have to be valuable in those touches because consistency without value is annoying.
- [27:23]
Jason Abrams
Wow.
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James Shaw
Do you get the text messages of like, hi, this is so and so, and I help people from NARV with health insurance.
- [27:29]
Jason Abrams
I am inundated with people trying to sell me health insurance, my friend. Inundated.
- [27:33]
James Shaw
Yeah, it's annoying. There's no value to it whatsoever. So. So they're consistent and it works at some level with them or they wouldn't do it. But they're consistent. But it's really annoying. Well, we don't want to be annoying. We want to be valuable. So figure out, how can I communicate a hundred times a year and what could I communicate that would be of value? Inviting them to an event, telling them what's going on with home prices in their neighborhood. All the things that you always teach. Right? But we also have to remember that we cannot over communicate with this group, which is why I use the 100 number, because it's like, oh my gosh, 100. I don't really care what the number is, but I use a big number just to get you thinking because you can't over communicate, but you can under communicate. So remember, if consistency without value is annoying, value without consistency is anonymous. Like, they just won't think of you. I just got it in the mail this week. I got the Tampa Bay Buccaneers football calendar magnet from my local real estate agent. And that's valuable. I put it on my fridge. I don't even actually like the bucks, but that's fine. I put it on my fridge to pay attention because it's the local team and we'll see what's going on. Now the Good news for this agent is that's not the only thing she does right. She's in a regular flow with me and it's great. If she only sent that. And then, you know, at baseball season she sent me the Tampa Bay Rays schedule and then she sent me a calendar magnet to put on my fridge in January and that's all she did. The likelihood I would remember her if I'm sitting at the office and my coworker says I need to sell my house is pretty low. She's sending me high value stuff, but the consistency isn't there. So she's anonymous to me. So I think if we want to build up a follow up plan, we gotta recognize it's gotta be regular, consistent communication, which you've done all sorts of stuff on this podcast about, about how to be in the flow with your people so there's lots of options for you.
- [29:24]
Jason Abrams
I love that. Consistency with no value is annoying, but value without consistency is anonymous. It's brilliant, my friend. Okay, so now I got conversion happening for me and hopefully this results in me taking some listings.
- [29:39]
James Shaw
That's right.
- [29:40]
Jason Abrams
But now I look up and I got a challenge because I used to list homes and no matter what I priced them at, they were selling with an average days on market of 11 seconds. But James, the world has changed. How do I think about pricing?
- [29:54]
James Shaw
Well, back a couple of years ago, the entire pricing conversation was sure, well said. That was it. That's what we did. And agents haven't adapted, many of them haven't because you're seeing longer days on market. So I talked to Aaron Simons and Emily Baker about this, who are maps coaches and teachers. A whole thing on listings.
- [30:13]
Jason Abrams
Man. I had the opportunity to audit their course that they teach. They are brilliant and that elite course is powerful. If you're within the sound of my voice. Take that thing.
- [30:23]
James Shaw
Yes, 100% take it. It's great stuff. And what I learned from them was this four steps that you're looking for right now that I think that what you have to do is set this expectation on the front end of the conversation. Nikki Ubaldini once told me, she's a great mentor of mine, said you can't meet an expectation that hasn't been set. So we've got to set the expectation on the front that. Mr. And Mrs. Seller, when we go on the market, here's the things we're looking for. We want three plus showings every week. If we don't get three plus showings our first week out, that's a problem. The second thing we want is people coming back for second showings. We don't have that, we have a problem. The third thing we want is. Is we want positive feedback. And by the way, if we're not getting feedback that's negative, if they had something nice to say, they would tell us. When they don't have something nice today, they're just polite and they don't tell us. And then the fourth thing we're looking for is offers or talk of offers. Now, again, this is from Aaron and Emily. And what you could do is tell your sellers on the front end, we need these four things. We're going to know in a week whether or not we're priced appropriately. And then here's the next thing I would think about is really trying to get them to price it right. And what I hear all the time from agents in pivot, this is when you go into pivot, shift ahead. This is one of the things that people argue about the most is pricing right. And I am an advocate of price it a little bit below where you think the market's going. We want to look 90 days out and price a little bit below that. And I get a lot of pushback from that. And there'll be people listening to this who disagree with me. And the reason people say is because, well, we want to price actually a little bit above, so there's room for the seller to negotiate. And I go, that makes perfect sense. In fact, I think most sellers do want to negotiate. And so what I would do is go in and ask my seller, Mr. Mrs. Seller, do you want room to negotiate when it comes to selling your home? And the answer, Jason, most of them are going to give is, yeah, because they expect to do that. And so then my answer would be, great. Which way you want to negotiate down or do you want to negotiate up?
- [32:26]
Jason Abrams
Wow.
- [32:27]
James Shaw
Which direction do you want to negotiate? Because if we can price it ahead of the market and maybe just a little bit below, I'm not promising you that we could get multiple offers, but we could. And now all of a sudden, we're negotiating up. But if we price it too high, we're waiting for that one person that really likes it, that might want to buy it. And now we're negotiating down. Which would you rather do?
- [32:49]
Jason Abrams
That is so good, man. That is so good. James, I want to put a bow on this thing if you don't. And I want to ask you any final thoughts, because you've walked us through the whole process. And we started at 30,000ft. We came down. And we went from figuring out my number to generating my leads, to converting my people, to pricing my homes. Put a bow on this for me.
- [33:12]
James Shaw
It's something early in the book that they say, which is that success is never about the chosen few. It's about the few who choose. It's in one of the first few pages, you have a decision to make, and you can decide whether or not you're willing to participate and show up in a way that's going to allow you to win or sit and wait. But if you're going to sit and wait, you're going to wait, like, a long time. This is something I taught in Pivot Shift Ahead the other day. We can give you all the systems and all the tools and all the strategies. The book that we just talked about is not new. Came out in 2009. Mrea. Not new. But all these strategies still work. We can teach you this. They can listen to every episode of this podcast, download every set of PDF notes, all that stuff. We can give you all of that, but we cannot motivate you. No, the motivation piece is up to you. And the thing about it is that you have to remember motivation is a result, not a reason. It comes after, not before. And so you may look at it and go, this market is so hard. I don't know if I want to do all this. Well, you don't. You would much rather have 2021 where it was fast and easy, but this is the market you've been given now. And if you choose to show up and do what you're supposed to do, here's what I'll tell you. True opportunity will show up for you because opportunity shows up in transition. Jay Pabstand taught me that a long time ago. And that's what we're in right now, is transition. But you gotta be willing to do the work.
- [34:39]
Jason Abrams
One of my favorite pages of the book, and it's the same with the mrea. It's a page no one reads, which is the dedication page. And what he says is, this book is dedicated to sales professionals everywhere who are committed not just to having a great day, month, or year, but to a great real estate career. To those who understand that the foundational skills demanded during the most difficult times will sustain their careers through all times. And you just said it, my friend.
- [35:08]
James Shaw
Well, the basics are never outdated. It's another line in the book. Go do the basic things and you'll be just fine.
- [35:13]
Jason Abrams
James, the people want more, and you're the voice in my head because I Start many of my days in your Facebook community. How can the people find you? What have you built? Talk to us.
- [35:22]
James Shaw
I so appreciate that. Thank you for being part of it. Yeah. Pivot Shift Ahead community has nearly 125,000 people in it. You can find it on Facebook. Just type in Pivot Shift Ahead. We have now, for five and a half years, every weekday, done a free morning Mastermind call where we basically study Gary's books. It's been the same call every day for five and a half years. So if you want to be on that, if you go to jamesdshaw.com and click join our free daily call, the link will show up. And Jason, due to demand, we're now taking that morning call and flipping it that day and uploading it to all the podcast platforms on the planet. So people who can't get up at 8 o' clock Eastern Time and it's too early for them can listen to it on their way in. We've just started doing that so you can find the Pivot Shift Ahead Mastermind call on just about every podcast platform that's out there. There.
- [36:09]
Jason Abrams
I love it. Friends, go listen. I'm telling you, it's two thumbs up, Abram style. It's incredible content. James, thank you for everything you do for real estate agents everywhere. The entire industry is in your debt, my friend.
- [36:20]
James Shaw
Oh, thanks, Jason.
- [36:23]
Jason Abrams
It's so good. He is so good. By the way, the book is that good if you've read the mrea, but you haven't read the book Shift. Friends, I implore you. I'm down on bended knee asking you to go read that book, because that's the playbook. The market shifts. You don't have any control of that. I don't have any control of that. But what I can control are the way that I think about it, the actions that I take. That's the key. And what he said around each of these major topics, because when you think about them, you only have a handful. How many deals do I need to do? How am I going to get them? How do I price them so the deals happen? How do I make sure that I convert such that it actually closes? But if you don't have a plan for that, you're just a cork on the water, friends. You're just hoping that it's all going to work out. Hope is not a strategy. Hope is something you do when you don't know the answer. But in this case, we do. What he said about if you don't give value and you're Consistent. It's annoying, but when you do give value and you're not consistent, it's anonymous. I think that's absolute genius. His concept around lid and figuring out your number, simply brilliant. It's not a complicated play, but it's a play that we all need to run. Here's where I want you to ask yourself. When you wake up every day, are you running the play that works when times were good, or are you running the play that you need right now to win no matter what the times are? That's the only question. And if you're honest and you say, you know I'm somewhere in the middle, which is probably where you're gonna be, then you need the book shift. And you should read it like it was written yesterday and it's the hottest new book. You know the thing about new books, friends? You know the person in your life who's read every single book on leadership, but they can't lead themself out of a paper bag, let alone anybody else? I know those people, and I'm not knocking them. I get it. But to ignore the books that have been written, that have been proven to be built on universal truth, only to go read whatever's new and fangled in the moment is to ignore the best truths that have been written. You see, if you wake up and pretend that no one's come before you, then you're forced to learn every business and life lesson on your own. I think that's stupid. Go read the book shift because the lesson has already been learned and the class has already been taught. Go forth and do likewise. There it is. That wraps another episode. Friends, I don't know what you're taking out of this. I really don't. I'll tell you what I want you to be taking out of it, which is these are the people that are having tremendously big lives. And the reason it's happening is because they're setting up the models and systems to do just that. Gary Keller told me that leadership is teaching people how to think, so that they do the things that they need to do when they need to do them, so that ultimately they get the things they want when they want to have them. And that's what I want for you. You're all leaders, but it begins with leading ourselves. If you're enjoying this podcast, I want you to click the subscribe button anywhere that you get your podcasts. We want to be the voice in your head every single week. And every week, we're dropping new content. We also send out a newsletter at the conclusion of every show to make sure that you get the highest points in the models and systems that were discussed. So if you want to sign up, I need your name and your email address. Head over to themillionaire agent podcast.com millionaire agent podcast.com enter your name and your email address and every week that newsletter will be in your box. Friends, you just went on a journey. I hope that what happens between now and the next time we meet is absolutely wonderful for you. Thanks for listening. I'll see you next week.
- [40:14]
James Shaw
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