← The Money Mondays
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- [00:00]
A
Foreign. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to a special edition of the Money Mondays podcast. We cover three core topics. How to make money, how to invest money. How to give it away to charity. As you guys know, this podcast is designed to be under 40 minutes, around 34 to 38 minutes for your listening pleasure. Because the average workout is 45 minutes, the average commute to work is 45 minutes. So we'll keep this episode short and sweet for you because we have what's called a 93% listen through rate. We stay top 50 podcasts in the world because of our listen through rate. Helps us on the charts and you help us on the charts liking commenting, subscribing and sharing as we dive in. You gotta keep in mind when you're listening to these podcasts, it's not just for you. You might hear from someone that can help someone that's your friend, family or follower from your past, present or future. This episode might help you. Six months from now, two years from now, you might be sitting there thinking, I should forward this episode to my friend because of the important person that's on this episode. So without further ado, Courtney Reum, give us a quick two minute bio so we get straight to the money.
- [01:04]
B
Two minute bio. Let's see. Chicago, born and raised. Moved to New York when I was 18. I'm now a reformed Goldman Sachs investment banker. Originally cut my chops working on consumer acquisitions. Things like Procter and Gamble. Gillette's merger helped take under Arm Republic was around all these brands and people that were really contagious I'm sure we can get into. And it made me think if they can do it, I don't know if I can. So let's find out. So now almost 20 years ago left that with my younger brother Carter has been my business partner for 20 years. We have been starting things since in the form of everything from a venture capital firm to a bunch of our own things as entrepreneurs. And now we kind of have a little, little hybrid investor entrepreneur. We have a family office and then a venture firm called M13.
- [01:51]
A
So M13 gets emails coming in, people pitching. They see you in an elevator, they're pitching in the elevator. Every way someone's trying to pitch you what are the first few things. So you immediately say no. Like this is not something I want to invest into.
- [02:06]
B
Well, I mean from a thesis point of view, like everyone else, we're doing a lot of AI at the moment. So I think part of it's that, you know, we've changed our thesis a lot for M13 meaning we did a lot of consumer then we were around for the direct to consumer boom. Then that became consumer technology. Now it kind of became general technology of which some has a consumer facing angle. So I think a big part of it is actually just staying on your thesis but I think it's, I think it's that and then you know when you meet people I'm I'm impressed how many people are not succinct and don't get to the point and then other people where you're just like there's something about him or her where I'm going to listen more or they feel like they're galvanizing something and that at least piques my interest. Doesn't get a check but it's keeps the door open.
- [02:48]
A
Yeah. What are things that you're like you know what I actually want to go deeper on this and here talk to my team like I actually like this. Are there certain words or certain concepts or certain things that make you want to invest in something or someone?
- [03:02]
B
I think as it relates to the person I'm now a believer the days of you know, the Travis at Uber all breakthrough walls. Like you know, what is it Move fast and break things mindset. I don't know if that's totally gone but I think now I really look for we all have pattern recognition but also bias where it's this person reminds me of me. Oh I bet they'd be great. Oh I bet they could build a 10 million dollar company. I think it's important to go this person might be really different from me but I see all the traits they have that that could lead to a really successful company. So I on the person side I love the soft things that are harder to test for. You know you start to kind of see how they deal with a little adversity, a little grit. Those are the things that I think are missing with most founders. Right. Because as you know it's very very can look like up into the right but it's more like a zigzaggy line. And so I love the founders who say here's what I'm good at but here's what I'm not good at and therefore here's what I'm building, here's what I'm hiring, who's I'm surrounded. It's it's like being a president at least in theory you can't do everything so you have to hire great people in your cabinet and lieutenants and all that. And I think I look for that in the people and then in the idea. You know so much. I'd say today though, I almost look for things like when someone starts telling me they're an AI company, but I'm like, you're not only not an AI company, you're a company that's not even a data company. You have some data that you may or may not know how to use. Like that. That kind of is the immediate turn off when everyone just says, oh, dot AI. And I'm like, but you're not a company. Right.
- [04:26]
A
So there's a lot of companies that are raising at different stages. Some of them are raising a seed round when they're first getting their idea going. Some are raising their Series A, like, you know, between 1 and $10 million range. And then some of them are Series B, like I want 10 to $50 million, CD, etc. Did you evolve over time of what companies you wanted to invest into? And what would you say you land now that what stage do you like of a company?
- [04:48]
B
Yeah. Well, the great news is that I actually think I kind of have something for everyone these days. Meaning if I like the person and where the company is at, I can probably find a place for it. Meaning as we were talking off camera because I haven't seen each other in a second. I'm newly married, right. So my wife and I, I'd love to circle back to like we're just kind of starting to do some investing together, right. And so she likes to do very early checks things. She's focused on women's health and beauty. So something to go there for our family office, really we have total flexibility and we've written, you know, small mid eight figure checks to, you know, seven figure checks. And we have a lot of flexibility where we go there and then for M13 there, it's pretty much bigger seed in Series A. So the good news is I would always Show Sign the M13 first if there'd be a conflict. If they're like it's too early or other people agree it's not a fit right now. Sometimes I write a personal check into something and then we can track it for M13. And then every now and then it's good when some of my partners aren't on board with what I'm doing to just go, you know what, I'm just going to put a flyer in this just so we can talk about later. There's one of these new newish fantasy sports betting apps we decided not to do as a firm. I put in 100k personally and it's marked at 19x in three years. And we're like, yeah, we could have used that one on the, on the table there portfolio.
- [06:10]
A
So for the founders that are listening, that are out there, how do they approach a VC firm? How do they get the attention? Because you get bombarded by hundreds of options throughout the year. Especially as you guys and your firm have gotten more and more famous and done more and more deals. Your name's on the radar, right? So people go to M13 and they're applying, how do you filter through? Like what can make them stand out so that a VC firm will listen to them?
- [06:31]
B
I think it's harder and harder because as you know, like the, the cost of ideas is, is really cheap, the execution is dear. And like I said, I literally just yesterday was, this isn't even meant to sound like a brag but was like going to our IT firm going, I need you to keep tightening the spam filters because it used to be I'd maybe get like 50 cold outreaches today. Now it's like easily over 100. And so it's like a day. I mean, oh my God. So it's like to just even look at that and say, oh, this is spam. Market a spam or delete it. I mean it just takes so much time. It's hard to have an assistant do because occasionally there's something in there, it looks like spam and it's not diamond the rough. And then you never know. You know when someone's like, I have it friend who has. Do you want to get the introduction? In my head, I'm thinking, heck no. But you never know and occasionally it does happen. So you kind of have to stay open minded. So I think that's a long way of saying, I will be honest. It is pretty hard to just as they say, it's not hard to get someone's email these days. I can tell you. Tim Cook's email, sure. It's hard to get Tim Cook to reply. He's never replied to me. Right. So I think you have to. And we, I'm sure like most people, as sad as it is, it is very hard to expect someone I don't know from a background, I don't know, maybe with an idea, I don't know, to hit my inbox and me to just take a look at that. That would be a tough use of time. So really trying to find either some mutual touch point or a unique way to get in touch. I mean this is, this is kind of an analog Example, but like back in the day as emails taking off, I remember this guy who's a real well known entrepreneur and he was trying to land sales accounts and he would send FedEx to everyone to get their attention. Why? His theory. And again, this is like 2000, so bear with me. But he's like, if I was sending you a FedEx, then it was still novel enough. It was something where chances are a lot of people's assistants didn't open it. Or even if Even it was 50 50, a much better shot that the, that the boss opens his own FedEx because it was new. And he was like, I would just keep sending someone to FedEx every week till they replied. And they're like, okay, I got it, I'll, I'll take a meeting. And he's like, oh, no problem. I was just kind of warming up. And I do think I like to call it pleasantly persistent. I think everyone has to find their way to be pleasantly persistent. And you know, if you want it badly enough and you really think it's the right fit. But it's also, you know, too many people kind of shoot their shot with like, I'm like, and so what? Like trying to, I don't know either. Connect it back to the value prop the win, win. Why this fits with our firm's thesis, why I'd make a great angel investor. Sometimes people lack that and it's not always obvious at first glance. It might be obvious to them, but I'm just meeting them and hearing about it for the first time. So it's, it's all those little nuances.
- [09:03]
A
So on the personal side, there's also huge amount of options, real estate, stock market, cryptocurrency, cash flowing business. How do you decide for yourself what else to consider investing into?
- [09:16]
B
Yeah, it's, it's a really interesting time for you to ask me that question because my, my brother and I have been business partners for almost 20 years. We have obviously started the same things, invested in the same thing. So it was kind of easy to keep our money pooled. Now we're starting to change a little in that I just got married, he's been married for about four years. He has a couple kids. So maybe our needs change, maybe our, you know, kind of monthly, yearly nuts change. So I think we're in the process of exploring that meaning. I don't know. Our late father used to always be like diversification for the sake of diversification. Isn't, isn't, isn't good. You know, that's how you end up in stuff you don't know and whatever else. And I think there's truth to that, but there's also like anything risk appetite, right? And so for the last almost 20 years, starting when my brother and I had very little money compared to now, we had a very much a barbell approach. We were in tons of illiquid private things. Different companies we started, different things we invested. And then there was like what I would call just enough money sitting aside for the rainy day where if it all disappeared, that 90%, the 10% would give us enough to rebuild. And that was great. And I'll. I'll say, over the last 12 years, my brother and I's personal IRR return has averaged 44% annually. And let me tell you, like, if you knew where we started and where we're at now, the power of compounding is a very powerful thing. 44% over 12 years has changed the trajectory of my life by like many, many zeros. And I think it's important though, to also right at this moment you're asking me is I'm realizing that the risks I took, which I'm glad I did, and thankfully on the whole, they paid off, are not the same risks I want to take. Because the risks I had to take to get here are not the same risks I want to take to preserve capital and still grow it, of course, but just not take the risk, whatever it is, to have a 44% IRR. I'd be very happy with something in the. This is where my brother and I are divergent. He's probably pretty maverick and he still wants maybe not 44%, but he wants 20s. I was like, you look how many few things have net 20twentieth percent IRR. It's like, I'd be happy with like low teens somewhat set in. Forget it. So I think I'm in the process of going, we should have hedges against this or that or have some. We have very little. That's like monthly income, cash generated. You could teach me a lot about real estate. Other than personal properties I own, which have kind of stacked up. We have no other real estate as an investment. So I think we're in the process of doing that as we get more liquidity.
- [11:42]
A
We all grew up thinking it's rude to talk about money. You talk about it so bluntly, which is my whole passion, which is the whole reason I do this podcast, is be able to have real life discussions where it's not rude. We need to talk about what happens if my friend borrows 400 bucks and doesn't pay me back. How do you tell your kid what to do? What if your 17 year old wants to lease a car or should they rent a car, buy a car? Like, we think it's rude to ask about salaries. Why is it rude? Ask about salary? What if you don't tell your kid who's 22 years old that you should get paid 60 grand? They get paid 45. Now they're on the hamster wheel for an extra six years until they get to 60 when they should actually got that from the beginning, like, we got to have these discussions. Was that something that happened in the household? Like, when did you feel like, okay, we can have a blunt discussion about money?
- [12:24]
B
Yeah, I think my parents, especially my father, who I reference, he was really good about, as you said, like, I think we're roughly the same. Maybe no one's teaching financial literacy. Right? So he wasn't trying to teach me financial literacy in the sense that, like I, you know, went to Columbia and Harvard and you do case studies and balance sheets, but just going, those are the things that they can teach you at an mba. What they don't even teach you is like, how much of my disposable income should go to rent. I mean, now people are talking about that, but when I was a kid, I mean, even when I was in my first apartment, no one talked about it. So I think my parents taught us enough to have an idea. But they were a little bit of that generation where I would have no clue how much we did or didn't have growing up. I would know that, like, oh, our house is a little bigger, a little smaller than Johnny's. I would know we can afford to go to a nice dinner once a week, but just kind of understand that directionally. Yeah, I think so much has changed. Right. We live in even parenting styles. I don't think you can live in. My parents were kind of really loving, but in that benevolent dictator sort of way. I don't think you can be as much of an authoritarian now. I think you just have to be very open with your kids. So this is just one of those. But I think to answer your question directly, the person who said to me, it really stuck with me is we have some businesses with Tony Robbins, including a longevity startup called Lifeforce. And so obviously, as he would say, proximity is power. And when I'm around some of his stuff, he just said it quite simply. My goal was always to help people live their best lives and whatever else you, you ascribe to Tony. But then he Wrote a bunch of books on, you know, taking control of your financial future because it was great that I helped you do your dream job or do this or leave this or change this habit. Now if I don't help you think about how to manage your money, it could all be for not. And that, that really resonated.
- [14:03]
A
So as you grow through your journey, you've watched the evolution of things that are now we're in the AI world. How important is it for people to add AI into their life whether it's their business or their personal life?
- [14:17]
B
I think it's really important because ironically I invest in tech as a profession, but in my personal life I can be a bit of a luddite in the sense that I'm a little bit risk averse to the, to the change. I have an iPhone 13, it works just fine. I need to about change it because nobody, no Uber drivers have the right adapter. So it's stuff like that where I'm like but my phone works just fine for what I do. I think AI is different. I think it's that not everyone has to be like this super embracing of it. But I mean even personally already the fact that Chat GPT is running commercials just for the tab of Chat GPT Health tells you how powerful they think this could be. So if you need a more selfish reason that I doubt there is one. But I don't think you have to be like understanding how LLMs work at a deep level. But I think if you don't play with these things a little start to train, watch the little power of it. It'll just, you'll just feel like you woke up one day and you live in a world you don't even recognize because it's so incremental. But incremental every day that adds up to just a tidal wave behind this little, this little wave.
- [15:22]
A
Let's talk about the charity side of the podcast. Why do you think it's important for brands to consider to have a charity component to their brand for their employees, customers, clients, vendors, etc. To see.
- [15:34]
B
Yeah, I mean I think the days of they're not taking political stands or what you stand for or what what your give back is. I think you know, people demand more from their brands and there's all the legacy examples of cool companies like a Patagonia who is the first to show you here is actually how your sheep started out and where we did this, the supply chain. So I'm, I'm very much into that side of things. So I love that Kind of, you know, supply chain transparency and different things like that. But I think, you know, you know how it is just kind of culture 101, like a job is not enough for most people anymore. When you see unemployment rates, not even here, but you go to places like China and it can be as high as like 20%. It's because they're just not engaged. They want more than just a paycheck and to work, you know, that, that is it. 996, nine to nine, six days a week. You can't do that unless you're connected and you want, you want your product or your brand or you believe in what you're doing. So I think first it's always the internal bringing along people who are mission driven. I'm a big triple bottom line guy, right. Do well by doing good or people planet profits, whatever colloquialism you want to use. I just think it's so important because it, it doesn't matter. It's like working out. It doesn't matter whether you're doing it for like vanity reasons or just general health. It all goes toward the greater good. And chances are if you connect it genuinely, your product or company will do better and you'll have better culture and you'll have more evangelism among your customers. So it's it, it helps everything.
- [17:04]
A
Would you like to have children?
- [17:06]
B
I do. I'm sure my wife will listen to this because she knows I was coming over. So that is on the roadmap in the not too distant future. Start working on 2026.
- [17:14]
A
So there's only one question that's a repeat question on every single episode out of hundreds of episodes. I've actually never gotten the same answer. Once gotten the same math, but never the same answer. You build M3.13 Ventures, you invest in things privately, you and your wife invest in things, and all of a sudden billions and billions and billions of dollars happen. But hopefully with the new age of technology and AI, you last another 100 years due to the medical field. But at some point, unfortunately, Courtney passed away. What percentage of those billions of future dollars do you leave to those future children?
- [17:50]
B
I think percentage is a little hard because that depends on my number, right? I think I usually have thought about in terms of like absolute. But then again, absolute could change because who knows if the value of the dollar, money, or any stock changes. I think, I think directionally. If this is too vague, you can call me on it. I'll be more specific. I want to give them just enough that they should be Able to do whatever they want and pursue their passions and dreams and not so much that any of it's a free ride. And I think it is such a fine line. And we were talking with one of your previous guests about YPO and organizations like that that I've been in for 17 years. One of the most talked about topics is how do I raise good kids that are not spoiled but also don't struggle too much. Right. And I think I would do it just like how I was raised. I was not. We were not wealthy by like LA Miami standards at all. I was better off than most of my friends. And my parents just did a really good job of instilling value. Meaning it's not like they didn't get me something for fun, but a lot of times they'd be like, if I can get you those shoes and that'll make you play better or feel better, or this trainer or something that actually enhances your life. Always found money for that, which is amazing. A lot of what I just called the gluttonous things, they weren't about and least now I'm not about because I do think there's something to be said for just that. That feeling of like, like I'm, I'm so big on value, right? My wife will tell you we, we flew business class here coming yesterday because JetBlue did this new libed seat. We flew to Palm beach on JetBlue. I'd say in the US I fly business about 10% of the time. No judgment for someone else who does. But it doesn't bring me some crazy amount of joy or some dopamine hit. And in general, I mean, come on, like, if I'm flying from Miami to Atlanta, what could possibly happen, right? I mean, at the best, they give me warm food, probably not even warm food. The seat's marginally better. All I'm going to do is open my laptop and work. Why would I do it? I don't ascribe any value to it. So I think I've always been one of those people where on For Better and Worse, I could spend a big amount of money, not blink twice. And then I will argue with someone over $12. And people are, what do you. It's 12. I'm like, it's the point, you know, that wasn't $12. And I think that's mostly a good quality, but it can be a bad one. So I think I just want my, my kids to really understand the value of it, whatever the it ends up being.
- [20:11]
A
So as you go into 2026 and there's this multitude of companies, options, investments. And you just recently got married. Has it changed your perception of what you want to invest into or is the general thesis been the same?
- [20:25]
B
I think the general thesis has been a little bit the same in that as I said, I want to start diversifying my portfolio, but I don't plan to become a real estate expert tomorrow. I don't think from what I know it's rocket science to figure it out. But rather than me pretending like I've learned real estate, I will ask our team and our family office guys to start to partner with people who we really expect respect in the real estate area, dip our toe in, learn it and go from there. Having said that, I think there are areas I know really well, consumer and tech, that I'll keep doing personally and through M13. But I think the, the interesting part is since I have started doing some investing with my wife, she has really good instincts. She actually has an insane amount of like TikTok deal flow or she has a podcast called Hot Smart Rich that's blown up. So she actually sees really great deals really early. So the question when I'm say to her now is she's like, this looks good. I'm like, it does, but, but what's it doing? Like, do you think this can be 100x return or do you think, you know, this can be a really risk protected 3x return? Like no one doesn't want 3x. If you feel like there's a lot less risk. Yeah, of course by nature of it it shouldn't be, but maybe you see something that makes you feel like the whole key is the asymmetric risk reward and then occasionally do other things where you're like, I don't know about this but I love the founder, they have some interesting other things and I think it will kind of help build my platform in the space. Right. So I always, I've been saying we're like, is this like a company you really believe in? Is this kind of a.org check? Is this somewhere in between? So I think you just really have to know what categories you're putting in and not have too many of the like relationship checks slip in or oh, this could be good and there could be some partnership down the line. Right? Yeah.
- [22:04]
A
All right. Where can people find you find the social find if they want to apply to get investment?
- [22:09]
B
Yeah. Um, I apparently as I said, based on emails and everything else, it's really easy to find me online. There is only one Courtney Ream So if you can spell it, you can find me. It's just my name@instagram, courtneyream. Same on LinkedIn. And my email for m13 is just courtney13conot.com. That's so passive.
- [22:27]
A
All right, guys, as I mentioned before we started this podcast, it might not just be for you, but this might be, bam. Five months from now, you're sitting in a meeting, you're like, oh, my friend has a tech company that wants to apply. Or my friend's building something, just wants to learn and listen to Courtney. Or go find him on social. Go find his wife and check out her cool new podcast. Like you're going to find things that are not just for you. It could be people from your past, present and future. Again. We grew up thinking it's rude to talk about money. We need episodes like this. We can have blunt, clear cut discussions. I'm going to try to bring Courtney back here later on this year. Come find him to get him back on the podcast. I want to talk to him more because I have so many questions. I've been watching his career for years and it's been very exciting to see as he's evolved and the companies that he invests into and some of the exits that have happened. And so I have a lot more questions for him. Check them out on social media. Check out these companies. And I appreciate you guys. See you guys next Monday here at Themoney Mondays. Com.