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- [00:07]
A
It's like clockwork. Every March, countless parents, children and teachers across Australia grip their foreheads, wondering about how their Naplan scores measure up. But now a new study of our country's national standardized scholastic test has revealed an unsettling trend. I'm Samantha Sellingra Morris, and you're listening to the Morning Edition from the Age and the Sydney Morning Herald. Today, Education Porter, Nicole Preel on the educational segregation that is thriving in Australia and what it will take to fix it. It's May 20th. Nicole, welcome to the podcast.
- [00:51]
B
Thank you so much for having me.
- [00:53]
A
Okay, before we get stuck into your story, can you just explain for us what Naplan is and why it was introduced? And full disclosure, I say this as a parent of three children who have been through this, and I still only have a vague idea of what its purpose is. So we need you, Nicole.
- [01:09]
B
No, that's fair enough. I think there are a lot of parents who don't fully understand what Naplan is either. So Naplan is an annual national test for years 3, 5, 7 and 9. That test numeracy and literacy. So spelling, grammar, a whole range of different things in relation to that. And the aim of it is to help identify students who need extra support, evaluate if schools teaching programs are working, and then also help governments and education departments allocate resources.
- [01:35]
A
And it's not without controversy. Right. Like, there's, there's parents who love it, there's parents who hate it. Can you just tell us in a nutshell, why has it faced so much criticism over the years before we get into this incredible study?
- [01:46]
B
Yeah, sure. I mean, I think it's faced a range of criticism for a range of reasons. There's parents who are aware that, you know, their children are really stressed before a Naplan test, even though they needn't be. You're not supposed to study for Naplan. It's supposed to just be kind of where you are at the moment. And even so, I mean, some parents get tutoring for their children for Naplan tests, which is definitely not something you're supposed to do. It's also, you know, face some criticism because the Naplan results are sometimes hyped up by media outlets. Outlets of schools often say, you know, this is we get great Naplan results. You know, sometimes we can spotlight low performers as well. And, you know, Acara, which is the body that kind of oversees Naplan, they've tried to crack down on some of those Naplan comparisons. I mean, there's also been research that questions whether Naplan results are influencing how Schools are teaching as well, in not in the right ways, I guess.
- [02:42]
A
Right. Okay. And perhaps they're gearing their teaching to doing really well on the Naplan tests as opposed to sort of teaching children to think critically or whatnot.
- [02:51]
B
Yeah, Yep, that's right.
- [02:52]
A
Okay, so there's been this study, though, that you've just written about into whether Naplan has actually worked. Now we're going to get to the results. But just first off, how was the research done? And why do you think we should sit up and take notice of these findings?
- [03:05]
B
Victoria University's Mitchell Institute conducted the research and they analyzed 17 years of NAPLAN data. Now, this Naplan data is publicly available, so they haven't gone scrounging for it. And so what the researchers did was they transformed Naplan schools into equivalent years of learning, and they compared it against parental occupation and education.
- [03:30]
A
Okay, well, let's get to the findings. What had been the most significant findings from this study?
- [03:37]
B
So the most significant finding is that essentially disadvantaged students are worse off today than when Naplan was introduced in 2008. And, you know, the gap between rich and poor students in Australia is growing. And the studies essentially found that there are enduring and persistent learning gaps which have become more and more entrenched.
- [03:58]
A
And you gave a really good example in your feature on this study about how this actually plays out with, say, an average student in year three with regards to that comparison as to whether they've got essentially a better educated parent or a wealthier parent and compared to that child who does not have that parent with secondary education or wealth. So tell us about how this plays out.
- [04:21]
B
Yeah, sure. So they found, as an example, they found an average student in year three who had one parent with a bachelor's degree or higher was two years and three months ahead of an average student whose parents had not completed school. By year nine, that gap had actually grown to four years and three months. So that's a huge, huge gap in learning. The only exception was year nine in numeracy, where the gap shrunk by a few months based on parent education.
- [04:48]
A
Okay, so obviously that does not sound good, but how are we comparing with other countries?
- [04:52]
B
It's hard to compare, but Mitchell Institute's Andres Molino, who actually did this study, he's doing more research which is yet to be published, and he's found that among 50 OECD member and partner countries, Australia's actually experienced the largest increase in school socioeconomic segregation over the past 20 years. So it's not great. Not a great picture.
- [05:16]
A
Yeah, it's not what I sort of expected to be hearing, I've got to be honest with you. Now there is one piece of good news which the Federal Education Minister, Jason Clare, was sort of keen to point out. So tell us what that is, Jason.
- [05:29]
B
Claire said that the average 8 year old is now reading a year ahead of where they were 20 years ago. But the bad news was that gap between the reading skills of 8 year olds from wealthy families and those from poorer families had doubled.
- [05:42]
C
One in 10 children today are below what we used to call the minimum standard for literacy and numeracy. But it's one in three children from poor families and most of those children never catch up.
- [05:57]
B
And he's essentially said that this is something that we're working on.
- [06:00]
C
I don't want us to be a country where your chances depend on who your mum or dad are or where you live or where you went to school or the colour of your skin. It's what we do here in education that more than anything else has the potential to change that. I'm not naive. None of this is easy or quick. If it was, it would be done by now. But I am determined.
- [06:29]
B
This is essentially one of the reasons why the Better Fairer schools agreement is so important
- [06:36]
A
after the break.
- [06:37]
B
In a country that is progressive, that takes equity seriously in any every single state and territory, to see that that has not materialized in closing the gap for students in different backgrounds and that those gaps are widening, it's very problematic.
- [06:59]
A
And so that gap, I mean that's, that's huge, right? This gap between the reading skills of 8 year olds from wealthy families and those from poorer families had doubled. Like you say, that doesn't sound good. So what are the possible reasons for this widening gap?
- [07:14]
B
So Andres Molina said the issue was system wide and structural. He said that there's been increased competition between schools, growing private school sector in Ecuador, funding and selective enrollment practices which had contributed to a more segregated school system, which means essentially some schools have a higher proportion of students who face disadvantage than other schools. And you know, Melina, he said, you know, in a country that is progressive, that takes equity seriously in every single state and territory, to see that that has not materialized in closing the gap for students in different backgrounds and that those gaps are widening, it's very problematic.
- [07:55]
A
And I guess I just wanted to ask you your impression on sort of digesting these findings. Like were you shocked by this widening gap between children from the haves and children from the have nots? Because I was, I was surprised. I was surprised. This is Perhaps a finding that. And maybe this is ignorant, but that, you know, that I would have expected to see coming out of the United States or, you know, somewhere where there is perhaps less focus on equality than in Australia, where we think of ourselves as being perhaps a little bit more in touch with this need for equality in education. And in other regards, you know, regardless of what your financial situation is, I
- [08:30]
B
think that the gap is surprising that it hasn't decreased over time at all, considering where, you know, there are a lot of different measures being put in place. But I think the thing that, that. That kind of really sung out to me from Melina's study was that there's nothing that's kind of a national approach. And, you know, these are not easy issues to fix. We're talking about disadvantage in a sense of, you know, young people who have unsecure housing or people who are facing really huge financial troubles in their families or homes. You know, people. This could be people who, you know, like I spoke with a Lovely woman, Mary McManus, who has a terminal illness and she has three children and is a single parent. These are really complex issues. And so it's not a one solution fix all. It's a broad, structural, systematic kind of solution that we need to look at, which is not an easy one, which, you know, I think Melina highlighted for sure.
- [09:28]
A
And so what are experts and teachers saying about what needs to change to close or shorten this gap between the haves and have nots?
- [09:35]
B
So the report recommends a more explicit policy focus on funding schools operating in areas with concentrated disadvantage. And I think that that's a really nationalised, systematic approach. They also recommend targeted intervention at early learning services. So that's really picking up kind of, you know, if you've got a young person who maybe is neurodiverse or is having sensory difficulties or, you know, if there's kind of speech impediments, getting to those. Those issues really early on can really help their performance in school and their integration in school. Another thing they recommend is full service schools, and that's something that I went into in my article as well. Full service schools really target schools that maybe have a higher level of disadvantage. And the idea is that they have a range of different services on site or very easily accessible so that parents, families, students can get access to kind of health, social and wellbeing supports, you know, a range of things that may be hard to get. They may face barriers in accessing some of those support services and can really help in having a better school experience, better Ability to really participate.
- [10:53]
A
And I hadn't actually heard of that term, full service schools before that you've just described. So A, do we have them in Australia yet? Or B, is there a scope for us having more like, is there, is there much appetite? Do you think that this is something that will be supported perhaps by the government in future or future governments?
- [11:10]
B
Yeah. So there, there are a few similar models in Australia. In Victoria there, there's a group called Our place. They have nine sites which are kind of linked in with 11 different schools and they do everything that I mentioned before. They have maybe Barry street might, might be involved. They may have kind of early daycare facilities or different supports easily accessible for parents. I spoke with a family who was at Northern Bay, Peter 12 College, which is in Corio. They are linked in with Our Place and they said that having that extra support so easily accessible, you know, was life changing for their children. It really meant that their, their family could really be integrated in the school in a, in a really strong way. It's something that's already established in the U.S. so California invested about $5.75 billion to expand full service schools and disadvantaged communities there. And there was a review of 300 community schools in New York which is kind of similar to a full service school. And they found really strong outcomes which, you know, not just in their, their results, but you know, a drop in absenteeism and suspensions and.
- [12:25]
A
Yeah, interesting. Okay. And I guess especially because the, the leader of this study that you keep mentioning that he thinks that we need a national approach. Obviously this is something that, well, in his view it seems like can only be fixed with some seriously holistic, massive measures. But where I guess does this leave Naplan? Like if we've seen this massive widening of gap between disadvantaged and advantaged students, like should Naplan just be scrapped? Has it, has it perhaps not worked or just outlived its use?
- [12:55]
B
I think Naplan does play an important role in Victoria. The introduction of explicit teaching and synthetic phonics has actually shown a real improvement in disadvantaged cohorts. And I think that that will, that will, we will see more of those results in coming years potentially. But I think it shows that we need a more focused attention on disadvantaged students when it comes to interventions. And you know that those interventions probably need to be holistic. There's some debate over like, can we afford to intervent, integrate all these services into schools. Well, at the moment, you know, some of the research shows that it doesn't actually cost that much to do. You know, there's an initial spend. But then once, once this is integrated, it's pretty low cost and the outcomes are way better than, you know, putting, putting that, that funding there is potentially way better as preventative than the alternative. So I think, you know, when you think about it, if a student goes to school on the day of an upland test, but they are facing housing insecurity or family issues, if there's family violence, you know, it's going to be pretty hard for them to perform at their best. So, yeah, I think that's kind of what this study shows.
- [14:07]
A
Well, thank you so much, Nicole, for your time.
- [14:11]
B
Thank you so much for having me. Foreign.
- [14:25]
A
Government has spent more than $1 billion of taxpayer money compensating universities for students who never attended under an offset scheme that saw some institutions receive $100 million each. In tourism hotspots across the nation, the number of Airbnbs and other short term accommodations hit record highs by the end of 2024, driving up rents for longer term tenants. And new research suggests that young women are being put off motherhood after seeing their own mothers burn out after caring for parents and children while working full time. You can read more@the age.com or smh.com Today's episode was produced by Chi Wong. Our executive producer is Tammy Mills, and our podcasts are overseen by Lisa Muxworthy and Tom McKendrick. If you like our show, follow the Morning Edition and leave a review for us on Apple or Spotify. Thanks for listening.