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- [00:00]
Sponsor Voice
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- [02:10]
Dan Kennedy
Welcome to the Moth Podcast. I'm Dan Kennedy and this week we have just one story for you on the podcast. So if you have a shorter commute, this one's your episode. Andrew Forstoffel did a lot of listening over the course of a 4,000 mile trip from his home in Philadelphia to the West Coast. He told this story about part of that trip at a mainstage show we did in Boston this fall where the theme of the night was the Razor's Edge. It was a great night and I think you're going to love Andrew's story. Here's Andrew Forstoffel live in Boston.
- [02:50]
Andrew Forstoffel
When I graduated from college, finally, the first thing I wanted to do before anything else was slow down. I wanted to take some time and try to be with people in a way that just wasn't possible, moving as fast as I was in my normal life. So I wanted to slow down and really actually listen to people, listen to the stories of their lives and about what their lives had taught them. And I decided I was gonna take a journey. I was gonna set out and just do it, you know, I was gonna slow down, I was gonna walk and listen. And a friend said, I'll come with you if you want. And I said, no, I gotta do this alone. It's very American in some ways, you know, self made man. And so I said to my mom one day, I'm just gonna. I'm gonna walk and listen, and that's going to be my thing. Your new college grad, you can imagine the conversations she had to have with her friends. So what does Andrew do now? Well, he walks and he listens, too. So I did. I packed a backpack full of stuff, camping gear, a mandolin, audio recorder, and I just walked out her back door in Philadelphia and kept going down the highways of the east coast with this sign on my back that said Walking to Listen. And unbelievably, people were into it. Like, I was meeting people, and it was as if so many of them had been waiting just for someone to show up and say, hey, who are you? Tell me what you're all about. And I was staying in churches and gas stations and bars and general stores, and people were taking me into their homes and feeding me and giving me money and giving me their stories. You know, it was happening. And I was riding this wave of people all the way across America, walking the whole way through the winter, through the spring. And by the time I got out to the desert in Arizona, it was the middle of the summer and hot as hell. And I had never had to deal with conditions like that. And it freaked me out. You know, I'm from Pennsylvania, and I'm walking through the real desert, like this is for real, and it's. You know. And I was also about to cross into the Navajo reservation. And that frightened me a little bit, too, because it was a whole other nation unto itself, and I was an outsider. And I thought that maybe here and now the other shoe was finally going to drop. And so I crossed into the reservation, and sure enough, just a few hours in, a car pulls over on the side of the road and two Navajo men get out and they start walking toward me. And my defense mechanism on this journey was just a big dumb smile, just, hi, I'm Andrew. I'm walking to listen. See, do you have any stories or what? You know? So I give them this big smile and they smile back and they say, hey, you look thirsty out here. So we got you some water. Here you go. And we also got you this. And they gave me a big bag of Snickers bars. And they took me in to their home that night and we stayed up late. And I was listening to their stories too. And the next day they sent me on my way with a blessing. And I was just floating in this magical feeling of having my purpose validated, you know, I could listen here too. I could do this for them. And so I'm walking in that feeling when up ahead I see this guy carrying a backpack walking on the highway like me. And I'm like. I'm like, what the hell? And I get closer, and at this point, I'm not carrying my backpack anymore. I'm pushing it in a big souped up baby stroller. So I roll up alongside this guy and I look at him, and he's a young white dude like me walking through the Navajo Nation. And I'm like, there's two of us. And a part of me was like, dude, there can only be one. Like, this is my thing, man. Get out of here. What are you doing? And so I ask him, what are you doing here, man? And he goes, oh, I just got off the bus from Austin. And I could tell, actually his skin was blanched white like it hadn't seen the sun in months, you know, or years. And he had one gallon of water, half empty. And that told me all I needed to know. You don't walk through the desert with a half empty gallon of water. You can carry at least two. And he's wearing cargo shorts and a polo shirt. And so I say, cool, well, where are you going? He goes, the Hopi reservation up ahead. I said, okay. Why? He goes, oh, it's a long story, man. I said, okay, well, we are walking together apparently, and I am walking to listen, I swear to you. And I showed him my sign. It was a big neon yellow sign at this point that said walking to Listen. And he saw that, and I saw him open up a little bit and he said, huh. Well, basically, I'm delusional, okay? He goes, I don't normally tell people this because they think I'm crazy, but there's this Hopi prophecy, okay? And in it, it Says that a messiah is going to come, and the messiah is actually going to be a white man, and he's going to come lead the people and be like this great white brother. And I think it's me. I know. I know it must sound arrogant or egotistical, but I think it's me. And I'm walking with this guy, and I'm thinking, this is a first. I've listened to a lot of people in all these miles I've been walking. Never this. And I couldn't just drive away. We're just walking together. And at that point, I didn't want to. I wanted to understand where this kid was coming from. That's what the whole project was all about. I wanted to see him in the way that I had been seeing people all across America. The extraordinary in these ordinary folks. And so I said, can I show up to this, too? Can I say yes? You know? And of course. And so we're walking together, and he just starts to tell me about his life, his broken family and his divorced parents. And my parents divorced when I was 15, so I knew very well the pain of that. And we're connecting and it's happening, and I kind of just forgot about the whole messiah complex thing. Just enjoying his company, actually. And by the time we're getting to the outskirts of this town, he says, yeah, I just feel guilty all the time, though. I said, well, what do you mean? He goes, well, like, right now, I feel like I'm lying to you. Like, I might not have to, you know, enslave you or master you someday, maybe even send you to hell. And at that point, I realized that I did not, in fact, have a bottomless reservoir of patience and compassion. You know, I just couldn't do it anymore. I was like, what? I was freaked out that he might snap at some moment and be like, now is the time I'm gonna wrestle you down to hell, you know? Or I didn't want the Navajo people who might drive by thinking I was following him, like his disciple or something, you know? And I also couldn't bear his pain much more because I could feel it underneath his story. And I couldn't take it anymore. And so I said, hey, man, I'm walking alone. Actually, I started this thing out alone. It's important that I walk it alone. And so I'm gonna get going, but it's been great getting to know you. Thank you. And let's keep in touch. You know, we swapped email addresses, and he said, yeah, let's keep in touch. I Don't have many friends back home, so let's keep in touch. And before I could leave, he said, I just have one more question. Do you always wear that shirt? And I was wearing a red shirt that I always wore. I said, yeah, this is my walking shirt. I've got a spare if you need. He goes, no, no. It's just funny because in this prophecy, it says that the Messiah is going to be very conspicuous. And he pointed to my baby stroller with a big neon yellow sign like, okay. He goes, and it also says the Messiah is going to be coming from the east, like, you wearing red. Maybe it's you. Maybe this whole thing is a big joke on me. Maybe it's you. And at that point, I'm like, I gotta get the hell out of here as fast as possible, you know? And for me, that was about five miles an hour. And he's walking at about three miles an hour. And eventually I left him in the dust. It was a long and awkward goodbye, you know, it was, like, still there, just hold on, you know? And I walked maybe 25 miles that day. And he just slipped from my mind, you know? And the next day, I walked another 30 or so. And at the end of the day, the sun was setting and I was in this town just resting by the side of the road. And who walks up but this kid? And now he's sunburned and he's got cracked lips and he's carrying two gallons of water now instead of one. And he's dazed, and I can tell that he has touched the reality of his own tininess just by walking through this huge, unforgiving desert. And he's afraid now. I can see it. And he asked, hey, can I sit down with you for a little bit? I said, of course, man. Of course. And we sat there for about three hours, and he was doubting it all now. He said, I don't know if I'm the Messiah anymore. And if I'm not, maybe I should just kill myself. And he said, I don't miss anyone back home but you. You know what I do miss, man? It's gonna sound corny, but I miss my childhood. Everything was magical back then. And then he started crying. And I realized that the feeling that he was something great, that was the thing I was walking to listen for. And that was the thing that people were giving me. As I walked. I had strangers coming up to me all across America saying, I'm so proud of you. For you, and thank you and I love you. Even so, maybe what was crazy was the fact that this kid didn't have that. Maybe it was crazy that he didn't have a circle of people back home, a village, a culture, a country surrounding him and saying, yes, yes, you're waking up to your own greatness, my man. Yes, it's in you. It's true. You're not crazy. And you're not the only one. It's in me, too. It's in all of us. Maybe what was crazy was the fact that this kid slipped through the cracks and it was dark at this point. And I got up to leave. A family had offered to put me up that night. And so I got up and the kid said, hey, hey, whoa, wait. I don't want to impose, but I want to come with you. Can I come with you? And I said, no. And I left him behind. And as I did, I came face to face with the delusion I'd been walking with for over 3,000 miles now. The delusion that I could be the guy, the listening guy, the one, you know. It became so obviously clear in that moment that I would never be enough, obviously to show up to all the listening that needed to be done in America today. I couldn't even do it for this one kid. The burden and the privilege of listening to people in this way had to be shared among all of us. And until it was, there would continue to be people like this kid left to fend for themselves alone in the desert. It had to be all of us. It has to be all of us. Thank you.
- [16:23]
Dan Kennedy
Andrew Forstoffel is an author, speaker and peace activist. He's committed to the collective project of learning how to be human with love together. His book Walking to Listen, about his journey across America and his experiences, was recently released earlier this month. And you can find out more details about the book on our website, themoth.org that does it for this week and as usual, thanks for listening. And from all of us here at the Moth in New York, we hope you have a story worthy week.
- [16:54]
Sponsor Voice
Dan Kennedy is the author of the books Loser Goes First, Rock on and American Spirit. He's also a regular host and performer.
- [17:02]
Dan Kennedy
With the Moth Podcast, production by Timothy Lou Lee. The Moth podcast is presented by prx, the Public Radio Exchange, helping make public radio more public at prx. Org.