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- [00:00]
Sponsor Voice
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- [02:22]
Starlee Kine
Feature called Cover Pages.
- [02:24]
Sponsor Voice
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- [02:45]
Dan Kennedy
Welcome to the Moth Podcast. I'm Dan Kennedy. This week on the podcast we have a story from Writer and radio producer Starlee Kine might be one of the best stories you're gonna hear about waiting in a line. Or if you're from New York, I think you're supposed to say waiting online. Which is something I never snapped to that in 17 years of living here. I still say waiting in line. So at any rate, this is a story from a 2011 mainstage show that we did here in New York City. Here's Starley.
- [03:30]
Starlee Kine
Hi, I'm Starly. I am writing a book about the self help industry, which means I have to go to a lot of different kind of self help retreats. They all have their own kind of philosophy and often they contradict the philosophy that I just told the one before. But a strange thing happened where I realized there's this one exercise that a lot of different retreats like to do. And it's really basic. You stand and you look at another person in the eyes in silence. And at first it's really embarrassing. You always smirk and you roll your eyes because the thing about eye contact is it's unbearable in small doses. That's why when someone looks at you on the subway, it's the worst thing in the world. But if you actually stick it out, it becomes this really amazing thing where you kind of sink into the other person's eyes and you feel really calm and you feel this sense of confusion that you don't really ever feel otherwise. And I've always been very impressed by this exercise. And so last year I heard about this performance that MoMA was doing and there was this performance artist named Marina Abramovic. I hope I'm saying her name correctly. She's Yugoslavian. And she has this whole career where she's kind of, she puts herself into all of her pieces. And my favorite one that she did before was she and her ex boyfriend walked like he started from the east and she started from the west along the Great Wall of China. And they walked along the Great Wall of China separately until they met in the middle and then broke up and never saw each other again. And I just think it's the greatest. Like if I could see a rom com about that, I would be so happy. And so I just, I love her. And she. So for the, at the MoMA last year, what she did was she just, it was really simple. She sat in a chair and anyone could come and stare into her eyes for as long as they wanted. And it was up for three months. And the minute I heard about it, I was like, I have to go see It. It turned out that all my other eye staring was practice for this one big stare. Like I was Rocky and she was like Apollo Creed or Mr. T or Dolph Lundgren. And I had to go do it. But I kept putting it off because it was really popular. And I heard you had to wait in line or get there early, and I didn't want to do that. And then I actually thought it ended, but it turned out there was an extension. There was like a one special Monday where you could still do it. And I was like, I guess I have to go then. And I was told that in order to see it at that point, it was the very, very last day. So I actually had to show up the night before at 3 in the morning to MOMA and camp out. And I brought like a pillow and a book. And I thought I'd shown all this initiative and I'd done the right thing, but there was. When I got there, there were 50 people already on the sidewalk who had shown more initiative. And those 50 people were what you call groupies. And I'd never been a groupie before. Like, I've never quite had the confidence to be, like, objectified and disrespected by lead singers. And so I felt like it was like a whole new world. And I sat down, and at the very front of the line were the popular girls. There were these four girls who had the night before at 5pm Sat down on the sidewalk, and they were wearing, like, these adorable dresses, and they all had bangs of different lanes that were super flattering. Like, they'd all figured out the right kind of flattering bang on their head shape. And they were like, knitting and, like on a blanket, and they looked so adorable. And then 50 people down the line was me, and I was wedged between this very angry girl who was like a Marina Abramovic junkie. And she kept just saying, have you sat? Have you sat before? How many times have you sat? And that's all she would say. And she would just talk about it like this drug and then this. And then the other side of me, right in front of me with this man named L'Orange, which is his public access name. He's a public access TV star. And he was like every man who'd ever tried to talk politics with me in a park. And he just had all these flowing mew moos, and he's like red pants on. And he kept trying to tell me about the wonders of public access. And I'd be like, dude, the Internet exists. It just happened. We can't talk about this. And sometimes there'd be people because it was three in the morning, so there'd be people who were getting out of clubs or wandering down the street. And they would sometimes stop and talk to us about, like, ask us what we were in line for. And Lauren's would be like, we are waiting to pierce the wall of the fifth dimension. And I would roll my eyes and I'd be like, we were waiting to sit across from a woman and stare at her. And then he would roll his eyes at me, which was so annoying. And that was what sucked because I really felt like I cared about this show. And I really thought I understood what Marina was trying to do, but it was getting ruined by these other people who also thought they knew what she was trying to do. And it was like I was standing in this line waiting to stare meaningfully into a perfect stranger's eyes while surrounded by a bunch of other perfect strangers who were also trying to do that. And I could not have felt less connected to any of them. And then I think what didn't help matters was that there was like this weird sense of competition and greed pulsing through the line because we couldn't all sit. Like, everyone was kind of crunching the numbers, you know, and we kind of realized early on, like Moma had said, that there'd be a 15 minute time limit to sit at this point because it was so popular. And we realized in the back of the line that we would not be able to sit unless the other people didn't use up their 15 minutes. So then a petition started to circulate from the back of the line toward the front. And as it got closer and closer to the front, it was like, it might as well have been like the cargo hold or the lower class and the Titanic asking the first class if they wouldn't mind giving up the lifeboats because there was just no way it was going to happen. And I don't even think deposit popular girls ever saw the petition. I think the rest of the line was like, we'll just spare them from this humiliation of having to look at this thing. And when it finally came back to us at the end, it was like all covered in hummus and there was like three signatures on it. There was just like, no way. And then like finally, like it started to get light outside and everyone changed their outfits. Like they went from their like outside sitting outfit to putting on their inside sitting outfits. And like the popular girls took off their adorable dresses and put on new adorable dresses. And I hadn't. No one, any of this was gonna happen. So I was just like, wearing the same thing. And I had like, you know, like, sidewalk stains on my face. And it just was awful. And then the museum opened, and we were let in like half an hour early, like at 9:30 in the morning. And the special curator came out and thanked us for coming and said, you know, we really appreciate you all are here, but you're not gonna all get in. And then he kind of was like, 30 of you get to sit. And then it was just like, what? Already? It's over? But then a guard took pity on us and he said 50 of us could come in. And I was made that cut. And so then I was like, rushed through to the next level, which was. I'd gone from waiting to wait to now I was waiting to sit. Like, I was in a whole different line inside. And so we just got taken into this ground floor room. Marina was in the center, sitting on her chair. And it was just space. Like, it was just like this giant square and guards surrounding her. And she was wearing this white flowing dress. And then we sat down. And the popular girls were the first ones. And so the first popular girl, she was like the tallest and she was clearly the leader. And she walked out to the square and like, lifted her adorable dress above her head and was just naked. Just naked. And like, I guess it was some sort of statement to show Marina that she was a fellow popular girl. And then the guards then rushed her and dragged her off sobbing, and she was like, clawing in the air. And the other girls were like, oops, we didn't know that was gonna happen. And all the people in the line, like, applauded, but I refused to applaud because I didn't want to be associated with my fellow line sitters. And then I don't know if the other popular girls were like, planning on taking off their dresses, but they kept their dresses on. They just like, very, you know, like, one by one, everyone began to just go and sit. Everyone cried. And then after 15 minutes, they would leave. And then it was just tremendous amount of waiting, you know, like, I was sandwiched between my people. The junkie was just like, muttering about sitting the whole time. La Ronde was giving out, like, public massages constantly, which I hate public massages, and I hate that. If you're a person who hates public massages, that is like a sane, normal person, you get judged because they act as though you're like, all uptight and stuff. When clearly I was the only one who was normal there. And the place was really popular. It was this huge. It was the last day, so it was filling up with people. People were coming in. It seemed like all of New York was on its way to come there. I was texting my friends, trying to tell them where I was in line. It was weird, too, because you couldn't. It's kind of strange because she was there in front of me, you know? And it was kind of like this weird thing where I was so close to my goal, but I couldn't actually see into her eyes. Like, the whole point was, like, staring at her. And it was kind of like if you look at a 3D thing, like, you can't look at 3D from the side. You have to look at it front. And so I would try to, like, jockey and try to look covertly into her eyes. But it was, like, really impossible and really frustrating. And then MoMA made this announcement that said the time limit was going to go down from 15 minutes to 8 minutes. And that kind of changed everything. And I started texting all my friends and saying, oh, my God, the time limit has changed. And my friends were, like, literally doing algorithms in their houses and sending me the information and saying my odds were really good. And suddenly it had changed. And it was really a weird experience because I'm very pessimistic by nature. I have never outgrown my Morrissey phase. I think I will forever relate to Ducky and Pretty in Pink. I think Garfield kind of has a point about Mondays. Like, I don't like. I don't like. I just like, he does not. It's not in my nature to think things are going to work out. And so then it was like this weird thing where my friends were like, I think you're going to make it. And I could feel this weird flame of hope kind of flickering. And I couldn't tell my brain about the flame of hope because then it would just, like, catch on until I had to kind of hide it. And then as, like, the people began to drop off in front of me, I was like, maybe not only am I gonna be able to sit, but I might be the very last person to sit. And that felt so fair because I'd had to, like, endure all the junky talk and all the massages, and I'd been there for 14 hours, and it felt so right, like, I deserved to be the very last person. So it was like this other flicker of hope that I couldn't tell the flicker of hope about or my brain and you know how, like, when they say, like, the elephant in, like, the giant performance art silent moma room, like, if you think about it, you can't stop. And so I just didn't know what to do. And then people were just, like, falling, falling. And the whole room was so full of people by that point. And then it got down to, like, the last five and the last four and last three. And then it was just me and La Ronge left, and we were standing there queuing up, and he went to take his place, and I went to follow him. And suddenly a guard's arm just shot down right in front of me and just, like, separated me from Laurent, which I would have been very grateful. No other 14 hours, but this was not the time for that to happen. And I just, like, looked at his arm, and it just represented all of my, like, dashed disappointments in life and everything I ever wanted that I didn't get. And it was just, like, all represented in this random guard's arm. And I just said, but I have to stare at her. I have to. And Lauren looked over the barrier of the arm and said, but you can stare at someone else. And I just lost it. Like, I turned around, I pushed. The junkie was on the floor moaning at that point. I pushed past her, and I had to fight through this wall, this sea of people. And one of them, Lauren Hutton, was there for some reason. And I will forever. She's kind of always guilty in my eyes for my downfall now forever. She looked amazing, incredible. But I'm really glad she didn't fix that gap in her teeth. But still, I hold her accountable. And I pushed past all of them. And then I was cast out of this thing that I had cared about. And then I was alone in MoMA. Like, I could have taken a Jackson Pollock and nobody would have noticed. Like, everyone was watching this show. And so I just, like, wandered to the cafeteria and ordered a coffee. And then it was like, if it had been a cartoon, it would have been, like, the steam from the coffee would have, like, intertwined with all, like, the comforting knowledge that I'd been right and that I will never get what I want. And it would have, like, wrapped around me like a blanket. And I just sat there kind of basking in that. And then, as much as I hate La Ronge, I have to say that he did. I hate that he said it, but I do feel like there is a whole world of meaningful eye contact that I have still to look forward to. I just. I'm never going to have it with him.
- [16:03]
Dan Kennedy
Starley Kine I love that line in her story where she says, when I got there, I found there were 50 people who already showed more initiative than me. Which that sentence right there pretty much just describes life as I see it. Really. Actually, Starlie Kine is a radio producer and writer. She's a regular on public radio's this American Life and the CBC's Wiretap in Canada. Her writing has appeared in numerous publications including Wired and the New York Times Magazine. The Moth is returning to Dublin on April 9th. Presented by the Fulbright Ireland and the US Embassy, Dublin. For tickets and details of all of our upcoming tour stops, just Visit the.
- [16:43]
Sponsor Voice
Site themoth.org Dan Kennedy is author of the books Loser Goes First Rock on and American Spirit.
- [16:51]
Starlee Kine
He's a regular host and performer with.
- [16:52]
Sponsor Voice
The Moth when he's not on Twitter.
- [16:55]
Dan Kennedy
Moth events are recorded by Argo Studios in New York City, supervised by Paul Ruest. Podcast audio production by Whitney Jones. The Moth Podcast and the Radio Hour are presented by prx, the Public Radio Exchange, helping make public radio more public@prx.org thanks to all of you for listening. We hope you have a story worthy week.