← The Nerve with Maureen Callahan
The Nerve with Maureen Callahan
Jen Aniston's BIG Move, Former Prince Andrew's Grim Fate, and More Kennedy Family Fiction
01:25:14
Maureen Callahan is joined by celebrity reporter Rob Shuter to catch up on the latest details behind the scenes at The Today Show, including the possible return of Savannah Guthrie in the coming weeks and what this means for Hoda Kotb, and how the Royal family is secretly hoping that former Prince Andrew goes to jail. They also dish on Blake Lively getting the cold shoulder at New York Fashion Week, Jennifer Aniston touring a $25M Upper East Side apartment with hypnotist and butterfly-hunting boyfriend Jim Curtis, and how Courteney Cox was spotted having dinner with former co-star and married friend Greg Kinnear, before the pair retired to Cox's NYC pad for a cozy snowstorm sleepover. Then Maureen reads a Troublemaker email that had scathing details about Carolyn Bessette's hyperfocus on landing JFK Jr. and delivers another reality check takedown of the latest episodes of Ryan Murphy's "Love Story." Rob Shuter: https://robshuter.substack.com/ BUBS Naturals: Live Better Longer wit...
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- [00:00]
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Maureen Callahan
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Maureen Callahan
US states at all major retailers near you with no ID, prescription or age requirement needed. Together we got this. Follow Plan B on insta at Plan B. One step to learn more Use as directed. Hello and welcome to the Nerve at Night. I am your host Maureen Callahan coming to you once again from the Situation Room. Forgive the audio, we should be back to normal settings and studio by Friday's Nerve, at least according to Nerve hq. So we'll take it up with them if that doesn't come to fruition. In the meantime, rather, Teddy is busy training his new recruit so we are making the best use of our possible time. We've got a ton to get into today. First, none other than Rob Shooter, celebrity reporter extraordinaire. With contacts still deep in Buckingham palace, we have got major new insights from Rob on a what's going on over at the Today show, Rob has an exclusive about what Savannah is going to do next and what Hoda Kotb is likely going to need to do if she would like to survive. We have got what Buckingham palace is hoping becomes of Prince Andrew. Will it be enough to save King Charles's position as the ruling monarch? We've got Blake Lively at New York Fashion Week and getting the cold shoulder from a one time bff. What's going on with Blake, Ryan and their future. And we've got two really juicy items regarding two of America's favorite friends. Courtney Cox creating some trouble for herself and Jennifer Aniston also likely getting herself deeper and deeper into financial trouble with her celebrity hypnotist con man. Just my opinion, boyfriend. It is going to be dishy beyond and even you mo bros who may be welders out there snowplowing for the rest of us think you'll appreciate it. We really do. Then we've got amazing troublemaker feedback. And then we are going into the latest two episodes of Ryan Murphy's love story, John F. Kennedy Jr. And Carolyn Bassett. And I've got not only the real version of the fake story that Ryan Murphy is peddling, but just my opinion. But I'm beginning to read extracts from Michael Burgin's the Other man and I will tell you why. But the book is here with me and this is going to be our companion text along with some other stuff as we go through the Ryan Murphy extravaganza. We have got so much to discuss together. So are you ready? Are you ready? Let's go. As we get older, our bodies naturally produce less collagen and that impacts everything from joints and recovery to hair, skin and nails. The good news is that there is a product that can help. Bubs Naturals Collagen peptides. Taking Bubs daily can help with stiffness, a better recovery after workouts, and healthier skin. Plus, it's easy to use. Just mix it into your morning coffee. It dissolves instantly with no taste or grit. But what really sets Bubs apart is how clean it is. No sugars, no fillers. It's third party tested and sustainably sourced. You'll also love that the brand gives back, donating 10% of profits to charity in honor of Navy SEAL Glenn Bubb Dougherty. It is a product that actually stands for something live better, longer. For a limited time only, Nerve listeners are getting 20% off at Bub's Naturals by using Code Nerve at checkout. Just head to Bubsnaturals.com and use code Nerve. Then you're all set. After you purchase, they're going to ask you, where did you hear about us? Please tell them you're a troublemaker and that the Nerve sent you. Joining us now at the Nerve, the one and only Rob Shooter, celebrity reporter extraordinaire. If you are not already a subscriber to his naughty but nice substack, what are you doing with your life? Go over there and subscribe and remember to pre order a copy of Rob's forthcoming novel. It's stuck. Started with a Whisper, it's out in April, and it's already rising, rising, soaring up the Amazon pre order charts, which is what we like to see, which means we're going to get this book on the New York Times bestseller list. Welcome, Rob.
- [06:34]
Rob Shooter
Hey, my friend. Are you having a snow day today? I love the studio. I love. Are you at home?
- [06:40]
Maureen Callahan
We are in an undisclosed location because Oprah and Gail have reversed course and are hot on our trail. I call this our situation room. Forgive a bit of the echo. It should be our last day in here.
- [06:53]
Rob Shooter
It looks great. It looks great. You could do this show from anywhere, my friend. Thank you for being so kind to the book. I was out for dinner last night or the night before the storm, and there was a troublemaker in the restaurant who came over and said, I love you on the nerve. But I purchased your book. Thank you.
- [07:10]
Maureen Callahan
We love it. As we suspect there are troublemakers everywhere. So, Rob, let's begin. You have a breaking exclusive about Savannah Guthrie that has run counter to all of the other reporting about this tragic situation. But over at 30 Rock, over at Studio 1A, everybody's trying to climb up the greasy pole of Savannah's absence. You have a report that says her mother sacrificed everything so that Savannah could pursue this career. One longtime source says to walk away now would feel like letting the darkness win. She loves her family fiercely. Even though she is devastated. She also loves her job. These two things can coexist. They have to. Before we get to what else you've got to say about this on the back end, Savannah posted this new video to Instagram on Tuesday morning, upping the reward to $1 million. Here we go.
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Commercial Announcer
Hi there.
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Maureen Callahan
Coming on to say it is day 24 since our mom was taken in the dark of night from her bed. And every hour and minute and second and every long night has been agony since then. Of worrying about her and fearing for her, aching for her, and most of all, just missing her. Just missing her. We know that millions of you have been praying. So many people have been praying of every faith and no faith at all. Praying for her return. And we feel those prayers. Please keep praying without ceasing. We still believe. We still believe in a miracle. We still believe that she can come home.
- [09:21]
Rob Shooter
Wow.
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Maureen Callahan
What do you make of all of this?
- [09:25]
Rob Shooter
It's just so heartbreaking. Savannah now, I think, has put out three videos. This one really got to me. The others were really upsetting, too. But this one got to me because I think Savannah is now at the point where a lot of us have been for a few days, if not weeks. It doesn't look good. And I think Savannah now is acknowledging that this is a really smart person. She investigates. She's a reporter. If this wasn't her mom, if this was a case that she was following for the Today show or wherever else, she would have thoughts about this now. And I understand why you're pushing them away because it's your mom. However, she still is a reporter in her heart. And I think now it's been over 20 days. We have no tips. I'm told from my law enforcement sources that it's almost a cold case. They have nothing. They're not hiding anything back. I keep hoping and praying, maybe they're not telling us everything. Maybe there is a smoking gun. Maybe there's a detail that the police know, that the authorities know, that the FBI know and we don't. I'm told there isn't. I'm told that they are as baffled by this as we are. And they've had lots of updates with Savannah with her family, and they've not sugarcoated it. They've told her the reality, which she already knew. She's an awfully smart person, and she has covered a lot of really ugly cases in her days in local tv, now in national tv. And so this video broke my heart. And I think Savannah now is at the point where she. She's looking to a future without her mom. Just a little bit of breaking reporting that I got just 10 minutes before. Before we came on. On the show. I'm told that very soon, if not this weekend, Savannah's probably going to come back to New York. Her family is here. Her children are here in Arizona. Now. I'm not sure she feels like she's been very useful. I think she's going to be back in New York pretty soon.
- [11:35]
Maureen Callahan
And the most important question, Rob, is what does this mean for Hoda Kopi?
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Rob Shooter
Wow.
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Maureen Callahan
What does this mean for her? You know, she's been very excited about being in Savannah's chair. It's been obvious. You know, most of the Today show hosts have been wearing the yellow ribbon. The reporting that I always thought was coming straight from her competitors was that there was no way Savannah would ever return after this. Almost trying to, in my estimation, put the. Put the thought in her head that it would be unseemly to return to work after such a tragedy rather than perhaps actually healthy for Savannah.
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Rob Shooter
That's so smart. Maureen, we've been doing this a really long time. You're a great reporter. 80, 90% of my sources are people who are competitors, who feel competitive with someone that might be a sibling, it might be somebody in your family, it might be a competitor in the workplace. And so these stories never made sense to me that she wouldn't come back. And I know Savannah. I've been on that show 40, 50 times. I've hung out with her in a social environment. She's really ambitious. You don't get to be in that chair. You don't get to start in local TV and work your way up to the Today show chair without really wanting it. She wants this. And more importantly, her mom really wanted it, too. Her mom encouraged her to be a reporter. There's a beautiful story where Savannah wasn't going to leave home. She wanted to stay by home. And it was her mom who really was smart enough and kind enough to push her out of the nest to say, you go, there's a big world for you out there, Savannah. You're so smart. This could be your oyster. And she literally flew and flying high, the number one morning show. She's in that chair. She's not leaving it. And if she did, these monsters, these terrorists, I would say win. And she will not let that happen. They might have destroyed her family. They're not going to destroy her career. Her mum was her biggest cheerleader, I'm sure. I would guess, like you, it's competitors out there putting out this little rumor, muddying the water, that, oh, my goodness, it would be unseemly to see her back. No, it wouldn't be. You can be ambitious and you can be full of love, too. You can love your family and you can love your job. You don't have to pick either. All I love what I do for a living, but I love my family, too. And so you can do both. And Savannah, Savannah will be back on that show. And the big question, you know we're joking almost a little bit about it, but what does happen to Hoda? I have a very good indication, Maureen, and I want everybody to watch this. On the day that Savannah returns to the Today show, they're going to have monster ratings. It might be the highest.
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Maureen Callahan
Oh, yes, absolutely.
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Rob Shooter
In years, maybe decades. If Hoda is not in the studio that day, then we know Hoda's not going to be there. She's going to be thanked along with everybody else, but she's not going to be sitting at that desk. I know she's there next week so she's going to have a third week at the anchor desk that fits together very well with my reporting. If she comes back home this weekend, she'll have a week in New York, and then I think we're going to see Savannah on the Today show in the next two or three weeks. She's coming back.
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Maureen Callahan
I love this. I love this for Hoda, who is, like, visibly licking her lips at the thought that Savannah's tragedy would be her triumph. I love the idea that she could be shown the door at 30 Rock and Studio 1A permanently. And I hope that Savannah knows that despite what those vultures over there have been trying to seed in the mainstream media, that all America wants to see is an iota of happiness for her, an iota of comfort. And if that comfort is back in her chair at Studio 1A, that's where, exactly where she should be. And there's not a single decent person who would ever begrudge her that. Ever.
- [15:46]
Rob Shooter
Absolutely, Maureen. Absolutely. And I think not, not at the moment. But there are certainly people around Savannah who see this, and they're not talking about the Today show at the moment. They're not talking about people not being supportive of her. They're talking about her mom. They're talking about how they're going to survive potentially without their mother. But there will come a day when Savannah sees these videos and she sees what's going on and she hears about what is going on. She always had a difficult relationship with Hoda. They were never that close. She was not Savannah's first choice to replace Matt Lauer. That was Willie Geist. And it was only when the numbers were not there that they brought in Hoda. And so I think Hoda here should tread really carefully because her future is gonna be in Savannah's hands. And biting the hand that feeds you is a really dumb thing to do. So at the moment here, if I was Hoda, I would go to work this week, next week, and then I would off. Go away. Don't go back to that studio until you're invited back, which I predict will not be soon.
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Maureen Callahan
To be continued. Now, moving on to another kind of a true family crisis. You are reporting in the wake of the former Prince Andrew's arrest last Thursday that the royal family is actually hoping that Andrew is convicted in court and does prison time. Why would they want this? And what would be the desired outcome? Rob?
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Rob Shooter
Yeah. And one of the reasons we found each other, you found me. I'm so grateful for it, Maureen, is that not only am I an entertainment Reporter. I used to be a publicist, and so I've seen that the. The situation on both sides. One of my clients was Princess Michael of Clint. I got a check from Buckingham palace every month in my PR day. So I know this family intimately. I know this family, I would say, better than any other reporter out there because I worked for them. I've been in the meetings, I've been in the conference rooms. I've been on the conference calls. I was paid to give them advice, to give Princess Michael Kent advice. So enough patting myself on the back, but I think it gives you an indication that my sources within this institution go right to the top. So I was on the phone. I was planning to fly back to Britain and the snowstorm stopped that. So I've been hitting the phones like crazy. It's always better to do it in person. Telephones are great. Emails are great. When I came on your show for the Golden Globes, that's what I really fell in love with you in person is when you do it, when you see people say.
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Maureen Callahan
Exactly.
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Rob Shooter
Honestly, you don't have to be in show business. You don't have to be a reporter. If your friends invite you out for a drink, go for a drink. Don't just. Don't just talk to them on the phone. There's no substitute. There's no substitute. So I had to have the substitute because my flight was canceled. But I hit the phones. I spoke to three people, three senior people within the palace who told me that the best scenario is for Andrew to go to jail. I gasped. I said, what is going on? And they said, if Andrew is not convicted, he will be unleashed. He will feel vindicated. He feels like he's done nothing wrong now. So if he has a legal argument that he's innocent, he's going to be a real problem for the family. Also, too. They're still paying his rent, so that's a problem they've got to deal with. Do they keep paying his rent or do they kick him out of this house, too, and he has to go and find, God forbid, his own house. He's a troubled person. He is going to embarrass them again and again and again. The only place, if he moves to the Middle east, he'll embarrass them. We'll see him with dictators. We'll see him with strongman. We'll see him really being a hustler, really being a grifter, not unlike his nephew. That's exactly the point. They didn't get rid of the Harry Problem by sending exactly abroad. The only way that, that the Royal family can literally stop this and turn the page and stop the drip, drip, drip, drip, drip that's going to be there till the day he dies is if he's in jail. And so I'm told. I gasped and takes a lot to shock me, but I was told, Maureen, that there's a wish, there's a fantasy, there's a hope that Andrew goes to jail. And if he goes to jail, they can not exactly justly here, but they can close this book, they can put a little ribbon of it and they can blame everything on Andrew. That's what they want to do. They want to blame it all on him and they want to, they want to close this chapter. And if he went to jail, that would be a way to do it.
- [20:36]
Maureen Callahan
Rob, tell me what you think of this. But this to me seems like wishful thinking and this to me seems like intel that is probably coming out of the King's office. The idea that, as we talked about last week, there are no plea deals in British courts, so Andrew has to go to trial, he will be tried in the King's court, he will undoubtedly try to drag his brother into these proceedings as a witness and Charles cannot be a witness in his own court. That is a compromise. I don't know how one squares the idea that Charles knew nothing about this strains credulity. We saw William and CATHERINE at the BAFTAs this weekend, the British version of the Oscars, and they looked beautiful, well put together, dignified. But there did seem to be a little bit of a disconnect between the two of them. Even Catherine, in talking to people, was caught on camera saying, oh, you have to be in a very calm state of mind to watch a movie such as the much nominated Hamnet. And William said something like, well, I'm not calm at the moment.
- [21:44]
Rob Shooter
Yeah, it's real insight, really sad. It was a slip up that they don't normally make. I actually like them being a little bit human here and I think that they are definitely the future. I read your amazing, amazing piece about the King should resign. And you're not alone in that, Maureen. You're the only one that's brave enough to say it. But a lot of my conversations, including in the palace, these are people in the palace. They work for the Palace. They don't want to get rid of the monarchy, they don't want that. But what they want is a fresh start. And so I think getting rid of Andrew would be a great start to that. We've seen that he won't go away. So he's always going to be a problem to them. And then they have to really talk about the King. There's going to be some really ugly, ugly conversations over the next six months in Britain. I'm told he's not going to abdicate. He's not going to leave at the moment. But over the next six months or so, we might have a health crisis where he has to take a step back. And so they'll never, ever say he abdicated because of his complicated relationship, maybe even his complicit relationship with his brother. They'll say it's about health. So that's going to be the press release. We know it, give it six months. But William will be on the throne sooner than we think and I think we can start over then. But it's a story, Maureen. It ain't gonna go anywhere. He's going to go on trial. I'm told now that other witnesses are coming forward. I had a bombshell reporting on my sub stack that they've searched Buckingham Palace.
- [23:11]
Maureen Callahan
He had it. I missed that item because, you know, you post every eight seconds, Rob. It's very difficult to keep up.
- [23:20]
Rob Shooter
Yeah. So he had an office. He had an office and rooms.
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Maureen Callahan
Andrew did.
- [23:25]
Rob Shooter
Yeah, Andrew did. So the mistake. What is.
- [23:27]
Maureen Callahan
What is this? What is he doing? What's. What does he clock in to do? What is his.
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Rob Shooter
He had the offices in the rooms in the early 2000s when he was the trade envoy. That's where he was based out of. And so there's still a computer in that office. And I'm sure he did not clean it because he was so arrogant. He doesn't think he's done anything wrong. And so the mistake I've made people make is that Buchan and Polish palace is not a house, it's an office. They don't really live there. The Queen lived at Windsor or Balmoral, she didn't live there. Charles and Camilla don't live there. William and Kate don't live there. It is an office. It's a bureaucracy. They use it for state dinners, they use it for official events. But all those floors, it's a several story high building, they're offices. And so all these royals who have really nothing to do are given an office space there. It's like working for the un, you get an office space. And I'm not quite sure what you do in the office space, but he had an office space at the palace. He had multiple rooms. And the police. I don't want to use the word raid, because that isn't what they're saying. But if they've searched three, four of his. His homes, including his former homes, of course they're going to search his office. And so they have been to Buckingham palace and they have searched and taken computers and electronic devices.
- [24:46]
Maureen Callahan
Yes. And to your point, before we move on to Blake Lively, I do think also the idea of Charles citing health concerns about six months from now with a coronation of William and Catherine, the publicist in you surely understands this is a. This is a masterstroke, because what it does is it changes the conversation. Now the world's media is descending for the coronation of the young and beautiful king and queen who will be taking care of business and ushering, not only ushering the monarchy into a new century, but saving the monarchy.
- [25:26]
Rob Shooter
It's at that point now where there needs to be massive changes. I would argue, even if we didn't have the disgraced former Prince Andrew in the conversation, we've changed. When the monarchy was set up, the world was a very different place. Now, bowing down to a human being because of a birthright, it's just not the way we operate. And, you know, it always amazed me that America was born by getting rid of the Brits and still was quite sort of deferential or fascinated in the British royal family. That is changing too now, as we realize that this family is deeply flawed, the system's deeply flawed. I love reality shows, but I don't know a reality show that is as cruel as this, you can't get the job until the person dies. At least on Survivor, you just put out their torch and they go home. This is a really cruel game show. Someone has to die. It is the Hunger Games that they've been playing for centuries. And so I think a lot of things have to change. And we know they're not going to change under Charles. He's not going to do it. And so William, I think, is going to be the hope, the future of the monarchy. But even with William there, Maureen, they have a tough job ahead of them. It's a really tough. It's like having a company, like being the head of, I don't know, Kodak Films. We don't use them anymore. We don't. You know, it's that. It's you and me with the head of Blockbuster Video. How do we save it? That's where we are in the story of the royals.
- [26:55]
Maureen Callahan
It's so true. It's so true. You kind of have to repurpose yourself as kind Of a. The way I kind of think of it is the way that CDs and then the ipod and streaming just made vinyl obsolete. But now it's kind of a thing that's come back as like a collectible, you know, and you're sort of a rarefied person. Like, that's what I think they have to sort of do with the monarchy. Make it feel special. Make it feel like a special drop, you know, here and there. So Blake Lively, we noticed here in New York City during Fashion Week, for those who among us who still pay attention. And Rob, you and I are going to have to keep an eye together on the Anna Wintour slash Chloe Mal handoff. But Blake Lively was Persona non grata at New York Fashion Week. We've got images and video of her sitting front row, and she was like an island unto herself. Not a single celebrity wanted to be photographed with her seen gesturing. There's Gigi Hadid, Jesse Williams. They're all pointedly turned away from her. There's Blake grinning like an idiot. Everything's great. That's the Meghan Markle trademark move. Tell us what you make of it and what do you know?
- [28:11]
Rob Shooter
Absolutely. I knew I recognized that move, Maurice. Than Meghan Markle.
- [28:16]
Maureen Callahan
Meghan Markle trademark.
- [28:17]
Rob Shooter
I do that too. When I'm being caught with my pants down. I'm so nice. I'm so hyper, and I'm like, you
- [28:21]
Maureen Callahan
know what I love to do, Rob? I love to go places where I know I'm completely not wanted and then sit there and get my photo taken and wonder why no one will talk to me.
- [28:30]
Rob Shooter
That's exactly what she did here. A couple of things. She's never been warm and fuzzy. I've been at fashion shows and I've seen her, and she's not the kindest. She's not the most welcoming person in the world.
- [28:45]
Maureen Callahan
So I think in her dealings with entertainment journalists, job is nothing more than to make these people look great and help them sell their movies. And she's a queen bitch to everyone.
- [28:57]
Rob Shooter
She just is awful. Whenever there's an opportunity to interview a big celebrity, I have to, like, pick and choose the person very carefully on my staff because everybody wants to do it. If. If there's going to be a big interview, I can't play favorites. The only person in my office that nobody raises their hand for is Blake Lively.
- [29:17]
Maureen Callahan
I think you said this before on the nerve.
- [29:18]
Rob Shooter
Nobody wants to talk to her. And that's not just reporters that are that celebrities too. She's great for a picture. Go and Take your picture and then walk away pretty quickly. She's not very good at chit chat. She's not very good at being authentic. And so now add on top of that this massive stinker of a trial, which she has mishandled time and time again. And so I think celebrities just don't want any part of her. They also too, don't want to upset the powerful Taylor Swift who is watching everything.
- [29:50]
Maureen Callahan
And so I think that's easy right there, sitting there. She's still very close with Taylor. And Bradley Cooper will be going to that wedding.
- [29:58]
Rob Shooter
Yes. Yeah. Everyone's wedded. Invite you to write. They don't want to blow that up. And I think Ryan, too. Ryan's movie star reputation really helped her. And I think he's blowing up his career too. Or she. She's blowing up his career in the process. So I have not seen the fall of a celebrity couple this, this dramatic since Harry and Meghan. They're on Harry and Meghan territory.
- [30:25]
Maureen Callahan
I would predict that they don't make it through the year. Where's Ryan? Why isn't he sitting with his wife, who's a pariah at New York Fashion Week? And the people who did that seating chart in the front row are definitely effing with Blake, putting Gigi next to her.
- [30:39]
Rob Shooter
That's. But that's. That's a publicist genius that you. That's how you get us talking about you. I think they were hoping there was going to be fists flying like my fantasy at my book party. Is that one of the celebrities I worked for, maybe Naomi Campbell, maybe a Jennifer, I want them to walk in and slap me in the face and then I could be on the. The COVID of your newspaper tomorrow. Like that's what you want. You want that drama. And so Blake, it's. I thought, I thought she was too smart to do this. Evidently not. But I also think too, that Blake misses that life. She misses row life. And so she thinks too, that if she doesn't go to Fashion Week, she's so powerful, people will say she's hiding. We won't. We won't. But that's what she's thinking.
- [31:27]
Maureen Callahan
It just goes to show you how these people. It's like shame. The override for shame is the deep black hole within that nothing else will fill but a klieg light. You know, Family? No. Children, no. Friendships? No. A fractured marriage, allegedly, reportedly, no. We've got to get our photo taken. It's Meghan Markle syndrome. That's what it is.
- [31:50]
Rob Shooter
It's the Meghan Markle syndrome.
- [31:52]
Maureen Callahan
Yeah. I want to move on to Courtney Cox because I saw this in the Daily Mail and I bookmarked it for you.
- [31:57]
Rob Shooter
Thank you.
- [31:58]
Maureen Callahan
We had massive snowstorms, a blizzard here in the northeast, which has brought everything to a standstill. May or may not be the reason I'm in the Situation Room. So Courtney Cox has a place in New York City. Why wouldn't she? She's got so much money, you need to put it in real estate. And on Monday night, she was seen and photographed having a cozy dinner at a wine bar in Tribeca with her married co star, Greg Kinnear, who I believe is 62. He's married forever, shares three daughters with his wife. Courtney has been with Johnny McDade from Snow Patrol forever. But they then went from dinner to have a sleepover at her apartment. Rob, why on earth would these two be having a sleepover when this guy has tons of money and can check himself into the nicest hotel suite in New York City?
- [32:55]
Rob Shooter
They think that it's more private to be in a residential building. So celebrities. They do.
- [33:03]
Maureen Callahan
Unless you're gonna order up a bunch of, like, hookers and drugs. Why do you need so much privacy when you're married and you've got a co star of the opposite that you're sleeping over there? What does this look like?
- [33:15]
Rob Shooter
It looks awful. It looks awful. It is awful. I would argue the reason they had a sleepover is the same reason you and I might have a sleepover at our friend's house. I'm not going to say any more, but we sleep over to maybe not sleep. And so I think we can all be very suspicious about this. Courtney, too, is very cheap, even though she's got pots and pots of money. Celebrities don't like to spend their own money. They like to stay in hotels when the movie company is paying for it. And so it's so silly. It's so tacky. It's so celebrities. It's so troublemaker. I love it.
- [33:51]
Maureen Callahan
It's so troublemaker. I'm sorry, but Greg Kinnear has been married forever. I think his youngest daughter is 17.
- [33:59]
Rob Shooter
Yeah.
- [33:59]
Maureen Callahan
But shame on him, too.
- [34:00]
Rob Shooter
Shame. Like, like, shame.
- [34:01]
Maureen Callahan
What are you doing?
- [34:03]
Rob Shooter
Like, get out.
- [34:04]
Maureen Callahan
Does that say? I mean, I take that to mean one thing. There's only one reason you would be spending the night. There's one. That's it. I don't get it. I think this is. I, I like. But I would like this storyline to continue pulling at that thread. And you know, Courtney Cox has made it Clear that she's been wanting Johnny of Snow Patrol, a mediocre band of basketball, to marry her. They've been together, like, 20 years, and he won't do it. So maybe she's acting out a little bit.
- [34:35]
Rob Shooter
Maybe try to make him jealous. They do that sometimes. Is it called revenge? Body revenge behavior? Maybe that she knows that he's going to read this. But if that's. If that's the way you get somebody to propose, it probably ain't gonna last.
- [34:47]
Maureen Callahan
Rob, you're so wise. I think she's maybe watching Love Story, JFK Jr. And Carolyn Bessette and thinking, like, I should. I should do a Carolyn Bessette would do. Just get him jealous by, like, sleeping with somebody else.
- [35:00]
Rob Shooter
All right, I'm reading your book at the moment.
- [35:02]
Maureen Callahan
Sorry, what's that?
- [35:03]
Rob Shooter
I'm reading your book at the moment. Oh, yeah, I'm a little late to the party. Forgive me, but I know I got it literally for the snow weekend. I was like, I need a great book. And I went to Amazon. It's good.
- [35:17]
Maureen Callahan
Oh, thank you, Rob.
- [35:17]
Rob Shooter
You'll have to know who my neighbor is. My next door neighbor is in my building. I'm going to. I want to hold it in the elevator. Jack Schlossberg has moved in.
- [35:25]
Maureen Callahan
Okay. I have to tell you something. I was in midtown Manhattan last week, and I was. I wanted to go grab, like, a coffee and a quick bite, so I went up to the Time Warner center, and I got to the third floor. It was freezing. I'm, like, bundled up, and I have the big sunglasses on. I get off the elevator, I round the corner, Rob, and like, this image on the floor grabs my attention. You know how it is in there? It's very graphic.
- [35:55]
Rob Shooter
Yes, it is. Pop it up. Pops up.
- [35:57]
Maureen Callahan
There's a young guy sitting on the floor in a perfectly tailored suit on his iPhone with an earbud in, looks up at me, looks at me, smiles. It's Jack Schlossberg. And I'm like, how does he know I even made eye contact with him? Because I have these big black glasses on. And secondly, does he. Does he know it's me? And is he smiling at me? Because he's called me terrible things.
- [36:27]
Rob Shooter
Well, now he's gonna see his neighbor carrying your book.
- [36:31]
Maureen Callahan
Well, good. Leave it outside the door. You know, I'm sure he's already read it, but this guy needs attention, you know, there's no shortage of places to sit at the Time Warner Center. It's a very lovely center.
- [36:45]
Rob Shooter
There's bars, there's restaurants in there. When I was working with celebrities, it used to make me laugh. It was 20 years ago in Us Weekly and the tabloid. The weekly magazines were the biggest things in the world. And they used to come out on a Wednesday. And on a Wednesday, I think in LA, there was one store at like 6am that got them and the celebrities were lined up around the block from Paris Hilton to Jessica Simpson. It was like their college newsletter. And so they used to rush to get that. Now they're rushing to get your book. I love it.
- [37:16]
Maureen Callahan
Oh, that's so funny. That reminds me, by the way, Jackie O. She would send her maid out to buy the Inquirer all the tabs. She would sit at her kitchen table and read them and she would say, let's see what she's up to now of herself. So funny. Okay, our final unfortunately for this week, person to discuss, Jen Aniston. It has been reported this week that she and her celebrity hypnotist slash con man boyfriend, just my opinion, Jim Curtis, were spotted looking for apartments in New York City. Now, before we get to Jim's issues with Brad Pitt, who he is reportedly still intimidated by, my question to you is, Rob, why is she doing this again? When she was with Justin Theroux, she got, he's, he's a famously lifelong New Yorker.
- [38:10]
Rob Shooter
Yeah.
- [38:11]
Maureen Callahan
She was born and raised in New York, moved to la, has been a California girl ever since. Does not like it here.
- [38:16]
Rob Shooter
Doesn't like it here.
- [38:18]
Maureen Callahan
She bought a very fancy, expensive apartment in New York City. I think even before they split up, sold, it was like, I'm out of here. I don't like it. She's going through this whole rigmarole again. I mean, is this just a fig leaf or she's buying her loser boyfriend with no money an apartment? What's going on?
- [38:36]
Rob Shooter
It could be Jen really doesn't like New York. Remember for a minute when she dated, of all people, John Mayer, and he brought her to New York and he almost did a press conference in the meatpacking district. He wanted to prate her from the Soho house to another restaurant or vice versa. And instead of jumping in her car, which follows her everywhere, they walked, I couldn't believe it. Jen walking around. She doesn't like New York. She's tried it. It's not her town. So why is she doing it again? It has to be love. I don't think it's any coincidence that his apartment downtown is up for sale now for 1.5 million. So he has an apartment that had
- [39:15]
Maureen Callahan
at least Two liens on it, and at least I think one missed mortgage payment.
- [39:19]
Rob Shooter
Yeah, that's right. And I. I know the building where she was looking. It's on Park Avenue. It's on the Upper east side. It's a $25 million apartment. He ain't buying.
- [39:28]
Maureen Callahan
Get out.
- [39:29]
Rob Shooter
It's 25 million. He ain't buying that. It's Jen's money.
- [39:33]
Maureen Callahan
She's going to buy a $25 million apartment on the Upper east side for this guy to live in. And, well, at least there will be, like, enough room for his yellow butterflies that we're all supposed to look for. But I mean, seriously, Rob, what's the psychology here? Because it's the same thing with Justin Thoreau, where she got with him and he didn't like L. A. And it seems like Jim Curtis. There's no dragging him to LA either. Permanently. So what is the psychology of getting with these men who will never fully move in with her?
- [40:04]
Rob Shooter
It's looking for love in all the wrong places. She's still not over Brad Pitt and everybody. I think so. And everybody since Brad. None of them have been a good fit for her. And she seems to have tried, but she always puts herself into a position, a situation that she's not going to like. Like, she doesn't like New York. Dating a New Yorker that's not willing to move to LA is somebody who's looking for somebody who's unavailable. I think she's always looking for reasons to break up. She's always causing trouble. It's never easy with her, you know, reporting on her for 20, 30 years. She's not easy. She's a difficult person. I think she makes her relationships difficult. She's one of those people that puts obstacles constantly in. In their life. From the minute I wake up, I try to think, how can I make my day so simple? How can I simplify the next 24 hours? I've got so much to do. Jen's the opposite. She has nothing to do all day. She's not working, really. She has pots of money. So what does she do all day? She fills her day with nonsense. And that nonsense is always related to
- [41:03]
Maureen Callahan
a man, you know, it's so fascinating, too, because her image, her very carefully constructed image is like, Jen's just cool. She's easy, breezy, like, you know, like, she's just a California girl. All she wants to do is smoke pot on a beach in Mexico and have a margarita and then go work out and that's it. But it's a. It's actually really quite a complicated, dark psyche. I agree with you.
- [41:27]
Rob Shooter
So difficult. I am. I was hired to do the press for her first movie after she broke up with Brad Pitt. And I remember the breakup. It was. Yeah, it was the breakup. It was a Weinstein movie. Harvey, I think, was there. I think it was only still at Weinstein. And it was at the Lincoln Square Theater on the west side, the amc. And we had closed the place off, basically. And every credentialed press. The press were not outside. They were all inside, so you couldn't sneak in. So there was nobody inside that was going to ask her even a slightly saucy question. And the lead position was Regis Philburn. Regis was still on tv, and she was such a big star that Regis was a red carpet reporter to get a sound bite to take back to Kathy Lee the next day and talk about Jen. She saw Regis and she refused to speak to him until her hair, her makeup, and her publicist were present. I said, it's Regis. He's not gonna ask you anything. Shocking. He's here to. She wouldn't do it.
- [42:28]
Maureen Callahan
And this is the ridiculousness of these people, Rob, in terms of, like, give me all the attention I demand.
- [42:34]
Rob Shooter
Don't talk to me.
- [42:35]
Maureen Callahan
Getting a spectacular divorce. It's like, please respect my privacy. She breaks up with Brad Pitt, or Brad Pitt leaves her for Angie. And then her first choice of film after that is a film called the Breakup.
- [42:48]
Rob Shooter
That's right.
- [42:50]
Maureen Callahan
So these people know what they're doing. She was forever trying to become a bankable, critically lauded movie star. She could never get purchased in that. It didn't matter that she married Brad Pitt, which I think was one of the reasons why I think she was in love with him. But that was definitely part of it. That appealed. And so she thinks, well, I'll just, like, dive in the deep end of this scandal, and hopefully that will redound to my benefit. And it did not.
- [43:13]
Rob Shooter
It did not.
- [43:14]
Maureen Callahan
She won't talk to Regis Philbin at the movie premiere. What are we doing here?
- [43:19]
Rob Shooter
I know. Had it been you or me, I'd be like, maybe you got a point. But Regis, like, come on. She would talk to him. Already paranoid and insecure, and it made me sad. She's beautiful. She really is. In person, she's stunning to look at, and she has all this money and all this power, and she's just like a scared little, little sparrow. It was very odd to watch her.
- [43:41]
Maureen Callahan
Well, no wonder the likes of Jim Curtis successfully got his claws into her. And he's got A here's hoping gents that some member of her of her close knit group is able to knock some sense into her. And don't put his name on any paperwork. Rob, we love you. We love you. Thank you so much for joining us on tv.
- [44:03]
Rob Shooter
I love it. I want to read all those books behind you. That color coordinate in the in the secret location. Now I'm interested.
- [44:10]
Maureen Callahan
These are not my books. I would never have a book that has books wrapped in just white paper for decorative purposes. To me it's sacrilege. But I am, I'm at where I'm at. There's nothing I can do. At least I'm secure. You know what I'm saying?
- [44:21]
Rob Shooter
You look warm, you look beautiful and you're as funny and witty as ever. It's great to see you my friend.
- [44:26]
Maureen Callahan
Great to see you Rob. Talk to you soon.
- [44:28]
Rob Shooter
Bye bye.
- [44:29]
Maureen Callahan
Few things are better than a nerve at night. Gossip Obsession with Rob Shooter coming up, your feedback. We are back in a minute. Are you searching for makeup that gives your skin a healthier and more radiant look? Try Jones Road Beauty's Miracle balm. It enhances instead of masking giving you that effortless natural your skin but better glow in under 60 seconds seconds. You can use it as a blush, bronzer, highlighter, even lip tint. No brushes. Just use your fingers and go. It is perfect for busy mornings, post workout or travel. Plus it's clean and high performing. It is packed with skin loving ingredients. No phthalates, sulfates, petroleum pegs, cyclic cyclo, cyclic silicones, EDTAs or BPAs. Basically anything you don't know the meaning of. If you want makeup that brings out your natural glow instead of hiding it, Jones Road is the way to go. For a limited time our listeners are getting a free Shimmer face oil on their first purchase. Just use code NERVE at checkout. Head to JonesRoadBeauty.com use code NERVE at checkout. After you purchase, they're going to ask where you heard about them. Please support the Nerve and tell them our little show sent you. Kick off the new year and new tru.
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Rob Shooter
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Maureen Callahan
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- [47:17]
Maureen Callahan
We are back now as always, Troublemaker feedback is unparalleled in the world of podcasts or elsewhere. I would defy anyone in mass media to come up against this crew, but I have to tell you that what I've got here in my hot little hands is so good and juicy and the last. I saved the best of this batch for last. And by best I just mean just like really specific intel about Carolyn Bessette okay, troublemakers are on top of everything. We begin. Greetings Maureen, Marlena and Nerve crew. This goes to our premiere on Tuesday. So yesterday of the nerves 100th episode on YouTube and about 11 minutes in it crashed. And we saw in the live chat that everybody was like Oprah, God to her. Is she safe? Is it. Is it Stedman? Is it who? Is it Sarah Jessica Parker? There's any number. Is it Blake? There's any number of people who would try to interfere with a Nerve live stream. This troublemaker. These are troublemakers. Michelle and Teddy say I would. They no longer believe Oprah and Gail were behind the insidious attempted 100th episode blackout. Surely this is the work of one Meghan Markle, who fucks up everything she touches. It didn't work for very long. We were back on the air in no time. Okay, Dear Maureen, subject line, our inspirational 900 year old heroine who we took down in our hundredth again, the pizza hat that I was wearing. By the way, that is also going in the Smithsonian when the Nerve gets its wing. In what appears to be a calculated move to position herself as an intellectual extraordinaire, SJP will receive an honorary doctorate from Northwestern University, which has one of the best journalism schools in the country. Or had. Perhaps I should say she is going to deliver the commencement address to the class of 2026. Clearly we need Your ongoing cultural prosecution. Not to worry. This is a New Jersey. Sorry an NU troublemaker named Margaret, not Northwestern University troublemaker. We will, we will take care of it. Not to worry. We will be covering it and it will be the subject of our next Nerve Brainstorm meeting. Not to worry. Hi Maureen. Subject line, Hoda. Exclamation point, exclamation point, exclamation point. Wow. I thought I was the only one who rolled my eyes whenever Hoda showed up on the Today show after she quote unquote left last year. I've noticed that she has stepped up her makeup and hair game as she's sitting in for Savannah. She used to sport a more laid back, even no makeup look when she was a regular co host. Great observation, troublemaker Lori this morning. So this is dated Tuesday. So this is yesterday morning, which we did not get much of it in New York because it was wall to wall blizzard coverage this morning as they were talking about the Olympics and mentioned that LA is next. It is 2028. Laurie said to her husband, quote, hoda's not going to want to miss that. Seconds later, Hoda says we're ready, meaning she's ready to go. Laurie writes as a former local news anchor and reporter. That was a snake pit. I can only imagine what it's like at the network level. Indeed. Good morning, Maureen. Troublemaker Carrie here. I hope I'm pronouncing it right. It's an unusual spelling. Was watching the Today show and noticed that everyone on the set has a yellow ribbon for Savannah's missing mother. But Hoda. Hi Maureen. First time emailing. I am certainly. Oh, this is a therapist. This is a troublemaker therapist. Okay. Or a therapist troublemaker. And just an aside that the term analarapist is reserved going forward for one Meghan Markle. We talked to Kinsey about it last week. She reintroduced me to the word analarapist being the portmanteau coined by those genius writers at Arrested Development. It is the combination of the word analyst and therapist. Anal rapist. Anal rapist. Meghan Markle. What she's doing in the culture on the Daily. Anyway, back to our email from our troublemaker therapist. I am certainly no body language expert, but as a licensed marriage and family therapist for over 25 years, I have witnessed endless couple sessions similar to the one with Chloe Mao and Anna Wintour. Recall, we did that on Friday's Nerve. Anna sat with hands clenched, probably to keep them off of Chloe's neck, her left leg poised forward in a sitting getting ready to bolt position. Ready to sprint over to Chloe's office, probably to change the locks on the door. And Chloe's obliviousness to Anna turning away and laughing at her was cla. She was laughing at Chloe, visibly smirking and laughing anytime Chloe attempted to answer a question. In addition to Chloe glancing at Anna as she punched her with this is Chloe. Her disgruntled list of improvements that she clearly felt Anna had done wrong. For example pay everyone 30% more, bigger social team. Etc. Anna hardly took a full breath during this session and by the end was clutching her hands into knockout punch fists. This marriage will not end well. Hi Maureen, I had to laugh when I heard you say on MK's podcast this was last Friday that JFK Junior's bikes were frequently stolen because he never locked them up. In New York City, no less. This troublemaker says I have a dear friend who was a deputy District Attorney in Manhattan for decades. My friend worked with JFK Jr. I use the phrase savage troublemaker, savage parenthetical. I use the phrase worked with loosely because my friend tried high profile murders while JFK Jr only tried people's patience. I'm dying. My friend said that while Junior was nice enough, he wasn't all that bright. Well established here at the Nerve. In fact, my friend mentioned that Junior would lock him his bike chain around his waist when not in use, which became a problem because Junior would frequently lose the key to the chain such that he was once late for work because he had to call a locksmith to his apartment to unlock the chain from his waist. You know, not for nothing, but when you buy locks like that, those old school locks, they usually come in sets of two, so you could put one somewhere for safekeeping in such an event. But what am I talking about? It's JFK Jr. Okay, this is a troublemaker. I'm going to call you Troublemaker L. Longtime watcher, first time commenter trying to watch Love Story, but I cannot get through it, even as a hate watch. And two my complaint. I believe last week that one of the things I hate the most in film or television are music cues that are completely literal and are meant to hammer home the point of any given scene or tell us what to think. The scene where Daryl first comes into JFK Jr's apartment, the song that is playing is Damn, I Wish I was your lover by Sophie B. Hawkins. Do better music supervisors. Okay Dear Maureen, this is Troublemaker Julie in South Florida. I wanted to tell you about my two experiences with Jackie O. And Carolyn Bessette Kennedy in approximately 1987 I was in a coffee shop on the Upper east side eating my cheeseburger deluxe around 3pm singing my song. Okay. I was a working actress at the time, so I had odd hours. Unbelievably, Jackie O was sitting next to me at the counter by herself, eating a hamburger and chain smoking. It tracks. She was nevertheless quite striking and stunning, even though this troublemaker said she looked heavily drugged, extremely gaunt, and had a haunted look on her face. That also tracks now with Carolyn Bessette Kennedy. My very elegant and bejeweled mother ran into her at a drugstore on the Upper east side. I'm going to bet it. Zitomer's going to bet they were the only two in the drugstore. This was shortly after Carolyn married John. My mother, being very outgoing and warm, told her how beautiful she thought she was and how happy she was for her. This troublemakers report. Carolyn just simply glared at her. My mother was shocked and hurt at how rude a response that was. No surprise. Totally tracks. Hi Maureen. Don't you find it strange that Carol Radziwill claims to be best friends with the late Carolyn Bessette Kennedy but was later friends with Ghislaine Maxwell? It's interesting that she mentions her friendship with cbk, but wong with Ghislaine. And also interesting that Carol has never really produced a photograph of her with Carolyn Bessette. Yet there are images of. There's. I believe that Carol has been photographed with Ghislaine and Ghislaine took Carol's author photograph for her memoir about John F. Kennedy Jr. Carolyn Bessette and some guy Carol married who died of cancer. Okay, this is the money email info I have regarding Carolyn Bessette. I've been emailing with this troublemaker back and forth and I believe this is the real deal. And as someone who spent like four to five years doing deep research and reporting for Ask Not, I'm pretty sure I can sniff out the real thing. So take it though, with a grain of salt if you must. This is just this troublemaker's report. But again, to me attracts. Now, this troublemaker went to dinner through business connections with a guy. I'm gonna. I'm gonna leave him unnamed. I'll call him JL Now, JL was a big, big nightlife player in Boston. Big. Now during dinner. So this is 10 years ago. So this is long after Carolyn and Lauren Bessette were killed needlessly by JFK Jr. In that plane crash. I'm always going to use that phrase, phraseology. Never. They died In a plane crash. No, no, no. JFK Jr. Killed them. During dinner, this guy mentions that Carolyn Bessette had worked for him. I said, what was she like? And he says, do you want to heal? Hear the real story that nobody else knows? Needless to say, I said yes. He said that Carolyn was this word is in all caps, obsessed with John Jr. From the beginning, before she ever met John Jr. That she would talk back in Boston about one day that she was going to meet him and she was going to marry him. They all liked her enough, but they thought she was a little bit nuts. He said the obsession was pretty incessant. John Jr. Was friends with this guy JL and happened to be in Boston one day and paid a visit. Carolyn happened to be out to lunch that day when she found out that JFK Jr had been to lunch with her boss and she had not been tipped off that he was coming. Carolyn said. Carolyn, according to J.L. flipped out and quit her job on the spot. She admitted to JL that she was going to move and put herself into a position where she would meet John Jr. Back then she had mousy brownish blonde hair in Boston. You can go look at the photos. This is true. She moved to New York. She made a strategic decision to bleach it simply because she knew, according to this troublemaker, John Jr. Preferred blondes. Remember Daryl Hannah, longtime girlfriend, Madonna fixation. She started to wear red lipstick. She worked her way up with Calvin Klein, set herself up on purpose with a job she knew landed her more potential to meet Junior. Now this is something I've never heard anywhere else, but JL swears that Carolyn found out which bar John Jr frequented and went there. And that's how they met. Not through Calvin. And that would not be surprised me, because Carolyn Bassett was huge in the nightlife scene in New York City. She went to the bigger clubs like Tunnel, the Roxy Plate, and then the smaller ones in Soho that had like 12 seats. She dated at least one nightlife impresario in New York City. And trust me, I've got Michael Bergen's book here. The guy who she treated like shit. In order, like it all tracks okay. So much for this fantasy, this fairy tale that Ryan Murphy spinning. We're about to get into episode five this week. Okay? The miniseries this Troublemaker Goes on makes it look like Carolyn rejected John a lot because of her uncomfortability with his status. Not so. I write about this in Ask Not. It was a massive ploy and it paid off. John Jr. Noticed her, flirted, asked for her number, she rejected, knowing he wouldn't be able to stand it. Of course, she knew it would hook him because he was rarely, if ever, rejected. Also, when it took her a month to say, yes, I'm deciding to marriage, that was also a calculated strategy. Listen, there are still water bearers out there, especially those who remain enamored of John Jr. To this day, who will insist that Carolyn was really agonized. She really did. Trust me, it was all a game. She was playing chess, okay? She was playing chess with a guy who could only ever really play checkers. He wasn't bright enough for chess. She pretended to hate being in the public eye, but actually loved it. Of course she did. You don't marry a JFK junior if you don't like everything that comes with it. Because the guy loved being famous. JL Went to their wedding and had maintained a friendship with Carolyn. After she left his employer, she admitted all of this to him and confided in him. She did do drugs. She did have issues. But what stands out and is not really known is the calculated way in which she went after John Jr. None of it was an accident. It wasn't an accident. You don't break into circles like that without climbing your way in there. Same thing with Meghan Markle. She was not of that world. And that's why eyebrows get raised and people want to know, what's your story? Where did you come from? What's your deal? She moved her entire world. This troublemaker writes of Carolyn on taking a chance that she would land him. And she did it. The irony is it cost her her life. I haven't ever told anyone this before. I just held onto it. But the recent resurgence of interest in Carolyn and John Jr. Brought that evening's conversation back to the forefront of my mind. And this troublemaker, we are so thankful that you shared this. Not because it's just gossip, not because it's interesting, but because it runs in direct counter, in direct contradiction to the garbage that Ryan Murphy is shilling out here and trying to make younger generations think is the actual truth. As this troublemaker writes, for all of her machinations, for all of her desperation to land the most eligible bachelor in America, this troublemaker writes, it cost her her life. And I will tell you that when interviewing Carolyn's friends for Ask not, and they did not want to be named, understandably. So, this is what they said to me, that when they woke up that Saturday morning to news that that plane was missing and they all knew it had gone down, and they all knew John Jr did it, that they thought to themselves, holy shit, this is so up. Carolyn wanted this so badly. She wanted it so badly and this is how it ended up. And it's kind of just an object lesson in trying to force something that isn't natural and maybe shouldn't be yours. Coming up, we are gonna get into it. Episode three, Episode four. In the meantime, please keep your income incredible, riveting, funny, brilliant, original feedback coming. Email me at maureen devilmake hair media.com or DM me@maureen Callahan, writer on Instagram or at the Nerve show on Instagram. And remember, please subscribe to the Nerves substack and join us for more bonus content. Fun and troublemaker talk over there, just go over to our website thenerveshow.com you're going to see a prompt. Would you like to get our weekly email? Put your email address in and that's it. Every Friday around 3pm Eastern, after the last full nerve of the week, you get a little dessert and it's so fun. You're gonna love it. Coming up, our love story reality check is coming your way. We will see you in a minute. I'm going to tell you about a film that truly earns your attention. It is called I Was a Stranger. It is now streaming on Angel. This story begins with a moment of tragedy in Aleppo, Syria, and follows the shockwave of that moment across borders, families and lives. The film weaves together the stories of five families in four different countries, all caught in circumstances they never chose and forced into decisions that will change everything. The director, Brandt Anderson, drew from real events and real people, and you can feel that authenticity in every scene. Border crossings, hidden escapes, moments where survival depends on the kindness of someone you have never met. This emotionally gripping film proves angel is willing to tell difficult human stories with honesty and artistic excellence. There is a reason that this film has earned major awards at international festivals including Berlin and Raindance. And there is a reason so many viewers say it stays with them long after it ends. If you are looking for a film that is beautifully made, emotionally honest and deeply affecting, I Was a Stranger is worth your time. Go to angel guild@angel.com nerve become a member of the Angel Girl Guild and Stream I Was a Stranger Today. It is one of the most powerful films you will see this year and one you will not soon forget. Again, that's angel guild@angel.com nerve tires matter.
- [68:36]
Rob Shooter
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- [69:22]
Maureen Callahan
Maybe score a two for five dollar deal on a sausage McMuffin with egg and more. Limited time only. Price and participation may vary. Cannot be combined with any other offer single item at regular price. We are back troublemakers. Okay, we are going to episode three and episode four of Love Story by Ryan Murphy, JFK Jr. And Carolyn Bessette's reimagined fairy tale. Now we touched on episode three last week with Jackie Kennedy drunkenly dancing with JFK's portrait. Something that I can assure you never happened. But I want to also go through this death scene because there is a strain of incestuousness running through this miniseries and it is not an accident. Again, I think Ryan Murphy is a really dark up guy and I think that there is no mistaking what's going on in this scene. And all I could think of while watching it is not only how this scene highlights how completely Naomi Watts just does not resemble in the least Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis, but how the actor playing JFK Jr had to endure the creepy, creepy finger work of Naomi as Jackie O. Trying to comfort her son her like they had they were emotionally enmeshed in a not healthy way. Watch this scene and tell me if you are as creeped out as I am. Here we go. I'm sorry, what? What are you talking about? She's on her deathbed dressed all in white. All this bridal, not subtle. Just just for an idea. If you're listening, definitely go watch this show now. He gets into bed with her, puts his head on her. Here comes the creepy hand and it's very Dakota Johnson with that young actress. Junior is fairly trembling. It is definitely sexual. I'm sorry. A tear streams down his face
- [72:09]
Commercial Announcer
and
- [72:09]
Maureen Callahan
now we're really crying. He reaches over for her hands. And it's pretty clear she's died in bed with him. Marlena in my ear literally said oh my God. Now moving on to episode four. This opens at a Calvin Klein party at a very famous downtown restaurant that is still there and still looks exactly the Same. It's called Indochine. It was very popular with fashion people and media people. It does remain something of a fashion and media people restaurant. It's. But it's not like a scene the way it was in the 90s. And this is a very brief clip, but I want to show it because I think it's again, giving young girls and young women a poisonous idea of what is romantic. Carolyn is leaving this party hosted by her boss, John Kennedy has already left. They've had really only just a surreptitious amount of contact in that party. Let's watch what happens here. John grabs her ten pages ahead. Nighttime, he was like hiding in this little secreted area. It's not quite an alleyway. And Carolyn's walking down the street alone at night and she passes him, she doesn't see him. And he grabs her by the arm and pulls her in and she's like, hahaha. And I'm going to tell you, any woman that happened to would be screaming their head off or they would have just like completely. Your vocal cords can freeze with that amount of terror. That is not romantic. Okay? That is an assault or an attack. That is how your body would read that. This is so fucked up. Now here's another scene in which Carolyn, at work with her boss, Calvin Klein, are flipping through the New York Post and they see paparazzi photos of Kate Moss, who has been made a newly minted supermodel by her new Calvin Klein campaign. And they're debating the legitimacy of somebody who wanted to be famous, getting famous, then bitching about being famous. None too subtle. Right? Here we go.
- [74:38]
Rob Shooter
Kate's irate.
- [74:39]
Maureen Callahan
Irate about what?
- [74:40]
Rob Shooter
Being an overnight sensation with the world at her feet.
- [74:43]
Maureen Callahan
And I think it's more about the world in her face. I actually kind of feel for her.
- [74:47]
Rob Shooter
Oh, come on. She knew what she was signing up for.
- [74:51]
Maureen Callahan
Did she? She was just a girl from Croydon who booked a job.
- [74:56]
Rob Shooter
And then all this.
- [74:57]
Maureen Callahan
I don't think she expected to be a sensation any more than we did. Well, I stopped feeling sorry for famous
- [75:02]
Rob Shooter
people a long time ago. Yes. Boo hoo. Fame takes some things away from you, but it gives you more. And if young Kate doesn't like it,
- [75:10]
Maureen Callahan
she can always go back to Croydon. So again, none too subtle. It's Carol. It's foreshadowing of Carolyn being like, you know, just because your goal is to be a fashion model, nay a supermodel, and be on billboards and your face plastered everywhere doesn't mean you want to be famous. You Know the line on Carolyn was that she was pretty sharp and savvy and smart. But like, I don't understand how you can be taken that way when you constantly argue that completely nonsensical, contradictory point. Now then comes a scene where Carolyn goes to meet John Jr. And his friends at a veritable round table of wits. Shades of Dorothy Parker and of course just JFK Jr bring her into this dinner on his arm so that she has his support while meeting all of these like people who are strangers to her who are going to judge her. No, this is one detail that the series gets right. Whether or not it is factually true. John did this all the time. He was putting his women through the ringer. So she has to show up on her own and she does so. And then John's like, oh, just stay for dinner, stay for dinner. And she's like, no, no, no, I have to go meet my mother for a pre planned dinner. Which of course turns out to be like she's sitting on the floor of her shitty apartment. Which is very Sex and the the City Carrie Bradshaw coded. We will get into it on a later episode. But she's sitting on the floor of her apartment eating takeout Chinese. Her sister is there. I believe this is Lauren Bessette. They don't name the sister, but of the twin sisters Lauren and Lisa. It was Lauren who died. And so I think they are taking some, some artistic license with her. And then her mother, Ann Freeman. And Ann, this is true. Never liked John for her daughter. Had his number from day one. Thought he was treating her daughter like a plaything and she didn't like it and she wanted Carolyn to move on. Here we go. Carolyn's hanging out with John again. John, sorry, Kennedy Jr. Should have clarified. Well, what happened to the movie star that he left you for? Nobody left anybody. Both of us were just. It was bad timing, but it's good timing now. It's different this time. Next, John invites Carolyn to a party at his sister Caroline's. And again, this is another test. Now in real life, unlock. Unlike here, as depicted here, we see Junior walking Carolyn in to Caroline's apartment building. But in real life he didn't walk her in. I will never forget these paparazzi photos of her. She was always looking like hunched over and gaunt and like really kind of druggie sometimes. Like, you know, red eyes, like red rings around her nostrils. She was carrying a bunch of designer shopping bags. She, she was dressed very similarly to the actress Sarah Pigeon in Love Story. But there's a Crucial detail missing from this wardrobing. Carolyn was wearing a pearl necklace. This Carolyn Bessette in the film is not. And I. It was a pretty iconic tabloid photo because it. The Carolyn Bessette attending a party at Caroline Kennedy's apartment told the media something, which was that Carolyn was a very, very serious girlfriend now of John Junior's who was approaching an age at which he was going to have to marry. He was going to have to marry because he was going to run for elected office. Anyway, that whole night is terrible. And Caroline Kennedy in the. In this depiction is terrible to Carolyn as she was in real life. Caroline Kennedy is. Was a snob. I have heard from people who are in Caroline's circle who socialize with Caroline that she's a raging bitch. Now, in real life, there's a. There's the version depicted in Love Story, which is a little too polite in the actual version. And this goes, by the way, this circles back to our troublemakers email that late. The email about how Carolyn Bessette did indeed plot to land JFK Jr. It was years in the making and she was determined to make it happen. One of John's friends wrote John a letter, and it was a letter of warning. And that letter said, listen, this woman dates famous men. She did. She is looking to land a big fish. True. She is a denizen of nightclubs. True. I mean, but cast the first stone. Really? I mean, you're talking about a bunch of privileged guys who did what they wanted so that, you know, whatever. Drugs, hard drugs. True. Again, cast the first stone in real life. You know what? I'll tell you what happened in real life. But watch the version here. Then we'll talk about it. What is it? What's wrong?
- [80:45]
Commercial Announcer
Nothing.
- [80:46]
Rob Shooter
Just thinking about how we met. Just trying to remember it was Calvin's idea to introduce us. Yeah.
- [80:58]
Maureen Callahan
Why are you asking me this? John, what's wrong? You have to tell me right now.
- [81:05]
Rob Shooter
You know, it have been fine if
- [81:07]
Maureen Callahan
you asked him to introduce us. I didn't ask anyone to introduce us. Then Calvin did. Then you asked for my number. Then I didn't give it to you. Then you tracked me down in the showroom. Okay, I'm not gonna stand here and wait for you to tell me wherever the fuck this is. I'm gonna get my shit and leave. Somebody left a letter in my bag.
- [81:29]
Rob Shooter
There's a lot of stuff about you, like men you've dated, drugs, shady friends that you've got, things like. Like you were trying to meet me.
- [81:42]
Maureen Callahan
That you were fixated on me, that
- [81:44]
Rob Shooter
you were asking everybody about me, that you were trying to land me.
- [81:51]
Maureen Callahan
Where is it? Notice she's not denying any of now she's reading the letter.
- [82:01]
Rob Shooter
Hold on, Carolyn, shut up.
- [82:07]
Maureen Callahan
I'm going to read now a bit from the Other man by Michael Bergen, who was the male model that Carolyn was dating and using savagely so that she could land JFK Jr. This book, by the way, which helped inform Ask not and I had purchased years prior to that. I'm hearing from a lot of you troublemakers because I recommended it on our sub stack at least once. You guys are emailing me and telling me that the cheapest price on Amazon this book is apparently out of print. Doesn't surprise me, but it's the lowest price is $799, and in some cases it's going for over a thousand. If the Nerve had a publishing imprint, we would buy the rights and reprint this book in a heartbeat. But until that day comes, I'm going to read relevant passages that link up to what's going on in Ryan Murphy's miniseries. Because Ryan Murphy is depicting Carolyn as just pure of heart. And yeah, maybe she had some ambition. Maybe she did kind of want me to meet JFK Jr. We don't know. But she was overall a good person and she wasn't. She used this guy savagely. Now I'm going to start from the Other man on page 115. And at this point in the narrative, according to Michael Bergen, Carolyn is pregnant with his child. Monday morning I walked her to the subway. I'm beginning this extract. On the way home, Michael writes, I passed a newsstand and saw something that stopped me dead in my tracks. A picture of her and JFK junior On the COVID of the New York Post. Imagine. Imagine this woman is pregnant with his child and he's going to work in the morning and he sees her on the COVID of the New York Post, sitting side by side with JFK Jr. They were sitting on a curb together, close. I mean, their arms were practically touching, watching the New York City Marathon. I called her at work and asked her if she had seen the paper. Yes? She said, it's nothing. Nothing. I was steamed. This was the weekend she was supposed to have been with me and my family up in Naugatuck. And somehow she had managed to pull herself out of her depression. That was her stated reason for not going to go for a little stroll with her friend John Jr. And Michael Bergen is being very kind here, because if I were him, I would have included and reminded the Reader of the Inconvenient Detail that she's carrying his child. Michael Continues. I was about to rip into her and she knew it. She was a very calculating, manipulative person. So she stopped me and told me she couldn't talk right then but that she would explain everything to me later. We met at her place that evening. She reiterated that it was nothing. John Jr. Had called. She'd been home alone, moping. She decided that some fresh air might do her some good. Oh, really? I said. And then my usually reliable impulse, impulse control failed me. What about that copy of People magazine? I don't know why I said it. I just blurted it out. Michael. While Carolyn was out, his stated reason for rooting around under her kitchen sink was he was looking for coffee filters. He found a copy of 1988's People magazine's Sexiest Man Alive, as discussed on last week's Nerve, stashed under Carolyn's kitchen sink. Okay. I believe we are right now in 1993. So you know. No, I'm saying. What copy of People magazine? She asked. Don't act so innocent, I said. The one you've got stashed under the kitchen sink. So you're going through my things when I'm not here? Deflector, deflector. Beware people who deflect and answer a question with a question, attempting to reverse victim and offender. Okay? It is a very typical tactic, especially among the personality disordered. As discussed. I think Carolyn had at least three personality disorders histrionic, narcissistic, and borderline. Okay, Carolyn, this is ridiculous. She snapped. Why are we even talking about this? I told you already. He doesn't mean anything to me. He happened to call me. I was here. I went. That's it. Now Michael writes. I remembered that I'd been unable to get through to Carolyn on Saturday night. I wondered if perhaps she hadn't been home. I wondered if perhaps she had been with John. That seemed like the obvious answer. But when you're in love, there are certain things you don't want to see, and I certainly didn't want to see that. Why didn't you at least tell me that he called? I said, why didn't you tell me you'd gone out with him? Why do I have to see in the paper a picture of my girlfriend sitting on the curb with JFK Jr. Watching the goddamn marathon? Michael. God, how many times do I have to tell you? He's just a friend. We just chatted. I think he's seen Daryl Hanna, Michael writes. That worked. It gave me hope. So what Ryan Murphy is depicting Carolyn as, which would be the victim of John's two timing and lying and manipulating and obfuscating, is exactly what Carolyn Bessette did to Michael Bergen. And it gets worse. And we will have more from the Other man by Michael Bergen next week. That does it. That does it for this edition of the Nerve at Night. We will be back on Friday with a full Nerve from our regular studio. Thank you for dealing with the audio issues. If you haven't already troublemakers, check out our substack@thenerveshow.com be sure to subscribe. Plus nerve merch grab something for yourself or a fellow troublemaker slash fellow traveler@shophenurve.com you can also listen to the Nerve every Monday, Wednesday and Friday at 9am Eastern on Megan's Podcast Playlist, which you can find on Sirius XM channel 111, the Megan Kelly channel. We will see you back here on Friday for a full episode of the Nerve where you will never guess what we're about to say next.
- [88:56]
Rob Shooter
Dear McDonald's, your breakfast menu Fire tens across the board. I could be happy with anything even though I ordered the same thing every time. Thanks for not judging me. I'll try something new next time.
- [89:13]
Maureen Callahan
Maybe score a two for five dollar deal on a sausage McMuffin with egg and more. Limited time only. Price and participation may vary. Cannot be combined with any other offer single item at regular price.
- [89:26]
Rob Shooter
You're listening with Athletic Brewing company this
- [89:28]
Maureen Callahan
time of year everyone talks about going dry. Cool. We're skipping that because we prefer going Athletic, which isn't dry at all.
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Rob Shooter
From crisp goldens to hoppy IPAs and
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Maureen Callahan
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Rob Shooter
that fits your style.
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Maureen Callahan
Every single non alcoholic brew is packed with flavor and the same craft experience you love. So yeah, you could call it dry,
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Rob Shooter
but there's really nothing dry about it.
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Maureen Callahan
Find your new favorite near beer@athletic brewing.com Athletic Brewing Co. Fit for All Times.