← The Nerve with Maureen Callahan
The Nerve with Maureen Callahan
Why "The Let Them Theory" is Terrible Advice For Women, Plus Celebs and the Dangers of Ozempic
01:10:41
Maureen Callahan unloads on the massively-successful "The Let Them Theory" and Mel Robbins, how the premise is terrible and ridiculous, the self-defeating philosophy at the center of it, Robbins' lack of self-awareness, and the overall self-help genre aimed at women. Plus, the irresponsible way celebrities like Oprah talk about Ozempic, and the dangerous side effects. And Maureen's brother "Bill From Brooklyn" joins to talk about Ben Affleck's hall of fame tabloid history and his grumpiest moments with J. Lo, bizarre Diddy media coverage, Rosie O'Donnell's Trump-related issues, and more.
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- [00:01]
Maureen Callahan
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- [00:29]
Bill from Brooklyn
It's from New York.
- [00:31]
Maureen Callahan
Some people get a wild haircut or book a spontaneous trip when life throws them a curveball. But Molly, well, she dove headfirst into a world of no strings attached sex, secret rendezvous, forbidden affairs and unforgettable adventures. And together we tell every juicy detail in Dying for Sex. Wondry's award winning podcast that's now streaming on a TV near you, starring Michelle Williams and Jenny Slate. And to top it off, we're dropping brand new bonus episodes where I sit down with the cast to spill all the spicy secrets, desire, friendship, self discovery and the ultimate bucket list of pleasure. This is a story that had everyone talking. Listen to the original Dying for Sex and brand new episodes. Wherever you get your podcasts, binge the original series before anyone else. Hello and welcome to the Nerve. I'm Maureen Callahan. This is our second show. You can probably still hear a little bit in my voice. The nerves are still a little bit there, but I promise you they are actually transitioning into genuine excitement. We have an incredible show lined up for you today and again I just want to thank everybody who has been kind enough to send me emails and DMs encouraging me and reacting to the first show and telling them how much they really enjoyed couldn't have gone better from our end either. And I'm so happy that we are back so quickly for you. We've got great topics today. One, we're gonna talk about Ozempic. We're gonna have a real conversation about Ozempic. Not the conversation that you're probably overhearing like in tabloid media or among anybody you know who's on it. We're gonna talk about what it really does to you and why it's so accessible and pervasive. And is it worth it? I'll bet you can guess. But we're going to do a deep dive on that. Also, my brother Bill, who I call Bill from Brooklyn for the purposes of this show, is going to make his debut, his media debut and I think you're Going to love him as much as I do. We're going to talk Ben Affleck and more celebrity gossip. But we begin today with actually the biggest podcast in the country according to Apple charts. If you are on Instagram at any point in any given day, this woman has clogged up your feed like no other. I am sure her name is Mel Robbins. She has a book out. It's called the Let Them Theory. We're going to take this thing apart. If you've already spent money on it, I would request a refund. And the hugely popular theory that she's been selling on multiple platforms lo these many months. So if you haven't had an introduction to her. Oh, by the way, before we even get into that, I have an update for you from the last show. And it is a Jon Hamm update because apparently he did not love what we had to say about him. Surprise, surprise. So in the wake of that segment, the Daily Mail, where I call him twice a week, reached out to Jon Hamm and they call. So a young reporter called Jon Hamm's cell phone directly. Now, who among you answers an unidentified number on your cell phone? Jon Hamm does, proving my point that I don't think he's very bright. He picks up the phone and the Daily Mail reporter asks if he cares to comment on our explosive blow by blow, no pun intended, of his savage, what I believe to be a near fatal beating of a fraternity pledge when he was in college. Jon Hamm tells the Daily Mail he was offended to have been contacted by a lowly reporter. Who are you calling the professionally handsome Jon Hamm in the middle of the day? So he says to the reporter, I think you should call my rep. Who are you? This is inappropriate. It's a very odd choice for you to call me. I'd say it's a very odd choice to like, beat someone so severely they nearly lose a kidney. But, you know, tomato, tomato. He continues, the they are claims that have been around for years. No, I don't want to respond. That's not a denial. Again, back to being offended that this no name. Nobody called Jon Hamm directly on his cell phone. Who? You are Tina Fey. I'm a little bit offended that you called my personal line. That's why we have representatives. Don't you know anything? Shades of Gayle King. I've been to space. You haven't. Talk to me about it when you come back. Okay, whatever. I'm loving this for Jon Hamm. I hope this sticks to him like Velcro and never goes away. I hope he continues to issue tone deaf, remorseless, non denials about this horrific act he perpetrated. And, you know, when I was reading all of these comments and my editor had emailed me about, it reminded me of an interview. This is a story Kathy Griffin told years ago. I felt like I heard it on the Howard Stern Show. I could be wrong, but we did find her recollection of being at a very intimate, very starry a list Hollywood dinner years ago. And who walks in but Jon Hamm, who she knows from, like, comedy circles. He's kind of adjacent to her crowd, so he's not an unknown person to her. And she sees him walk in and he's shooting Mad Men. He's at the height of Mad Men fame. He's directing an episode. So he's high on this now because he's not just a mere actor, he's a director. He's an auteur. And he enters the room and her heart sinks because she has a good idea of what's coming next. So take a listen to Kathy Griffin on Jon Hamm.
- [06:44]
Kathy Griffin
Case in point, a dinner at the legendary talent agent Sue Menger's house in which I was privileged to be invited. It was, I think, only eight people there, and one of them was the great Jack Nicholson. So when Hammy showed up, I swear to God inside, I was like, oh, great. He even says to me, he goes, what are you doing here? Anyway, he proceeded to get very drunk during the coffee table portion. And then it was time for dinner. Sue sat Hammy next to me, which was uncomfortable, but I wasn't gonna bother her. But at least Jack Nicholson was there and I could focus on hopefully getting to know one of the great actors of our time. Then Jack, who usually directs whatever he's saying to seemingly, like the world at large, he actually focused on me. And he went off on this tangent about Rupert Murdoch almost getting a pie in the face during a parliamentary hearing in England. You can look up the clip. Anyway, I was asking Jack about why he was so interested in this, and he started doing an imitation of Murdoch, the right wing media mogul, and I was in heaven. And then Hammy picks that moment when Jack Nicholson is talking to me to start whispering, like, boozy, stupid, yammering attempts at jokes in my ear. So the first one was, you know, your Emmy isn't a real Emmy. I was like, whatever. So I kind of just ignored him. Then the next one, he just goes, you're so old. I just swear to God, I said it out of the side of my mouth, I go, not now. And then he kept going. Stuff like, do you know how old you look? Finally I just fucking snap. I just turn, I go, look, you can't keep up. You're outclassed. Zip it. Jack's talking.
- [08:25]
Maureen Callahan
I love that anecdote because it ratifies everything we were just talking about on Monday or Tuesday, rather. Excuse me. And don't forget, I also talked about in the way in which he dumped, I believe. Dumped. They said it was mutual. I'm not buying it. His girlfriend of like 18 years who stood by him while he was struggling to make it, who sacrificed marriage and children because he didn't want them. And then he turns around and marries a woman half his age and starts talking publicly about how now he wants kids. Lovely. This is what Jon Hamm really thinks of women. Jon Hamm walked into that room and he couldn't believe that Jack Nicholson preferred to talk to Kathy Griffin than to talk to him. He couldn't believe it. Probably because Kathy Griffin can actually hold up her end of a conversation and has some natural wit. I think Jon Hamm's got none of those gifts. And so what does he do? He gets boozy. This is the other sort of line about Jon Hamm that's, you know, been rumored for quite a while that he's like a mean drunk. So he's drunk according to Kathy Griffin, and he's leaning into her ear and insulting her. And what does he think the biggest insult he can level against her? A, her Emmy's not real, Whatever that means. Whatever, Jon Hamm. And secondly, that she's old. That she's old. Are you freaking kidding me? You know, Jon Hamm, age comes for us all and it's going to come for you. And you typically wind up with the face you deserve. So enjoy being professionally handsome as long as you can, because I don't think you're long for this world in terms of that stuff. Great. Okay, moving on. We are going to get into our Let Them segment and this is one of those topics I think we're going to be revisiting quite a bit, which is the sort of health and wellness and self help stuff that is really primarily marketed to women, often by women. And the latest self help guru to captivate the nation is a woman who, before landing on this, a theory that she calls the Let Them theory, which I think is ridiculous. And we will discuss why she had like 19 failed ventures, she somehow wound up in $800,000 worth of debt. She never tells us how or why? I would love to know how one gets into $800,000 worth of debt. But now she thinks she's the one we should all be going to for advice. And guess who else has fallen for it? None other than your and my favorite person, Oprah Winfrey. Take a look. Let them. Is when you release control.
- [11:10]
Kathy Griffin
Oh, my goodness. It's so freeing.
- [11:13]
Maureen Callahan
Yes. Yes. You don't actually think about what other people think when you're proud of yourself because you know the truth that is so powerful. Other people never block your way. Only you can do that. Bing, bing, bing, bing, bing. Wow, that is so true. Is Oprah even present for this conversation? I feel like that's like the replicant Oprah, where you push a button and you get one of her patented responses, like, oh, wow. Or that's so true. Like, is it? Is it? Other people never stand in your way. Yes, they do. Of course they do. We've all had people stand in our way. You don't worry about what other people think when you're proud of yourself. Of course. Course you do. What is this garbage? So, okay, this book, like, I think this book sold, like, a slew of copies before it was even published. Like, it was, like, on the New York Times bestseller list for weeks and weeks. If it not still is. First, I want to show you guys this author photo, because this author photo is like to die. Okay? Look at this woman. Look at her freaking. She's looking up as if she's like a beatified saint, and all she's spreading is joy and knowledge, and she's blessing us all. So that's red flag number one. Number two, the let them theory. She's claiming initially that she had coined this. It's been around forever. Her origin story is that she thought this was a great idea. When her daughter Sawyer, who figures prominently in this story, told her to stop nagging one of the kids in the house about doing something, she just said, geez, mom, let them let him do it. And that was, oh, eureka, you know, a movement is born. Okay. Sawyer also co wrote the book with her mom, whose name is on the COVID It ain't Sawyer's. It's Mel's. Now, in Mel's theory, I'm supposing her daughter should have just let her get away with that. But apparently the newer editions of the book do have Sawyer's name on the book jacket. Sawyer, get a good lawyer. Start now. Start early, start young. Okay, so I'm going to read you sort of samples from the let them theory. Which is full of garbage. Chapter two is called Getting Let Them and Let Me. And in this chapter, Mel Robbins shares a story that many people can relate to. I think it's happened to everybody where she's harmlessly scrolling through social media one night, comes across photos of her friend group, realizes they're all on vacation without her, and they look amazing. They look like they're having the greatest time. And she is extremely wounded. Now if you're going to be any kind of self help guru, I think you need to first acknowledge to your audience that social media is a lie. That most people are putting a highly edited and curated version of themselves out on social media. And if you believe that, you're a moron. And I think that Mel Robbins is kind of a moron because she believes it. And then she goes on to say, I haven't really spent time with them as a group in a long, long time. I hadn't invested in those individual friendships and I hadn't planned anything fun or reached out to them recently either. So these people are probably so fed up with Mel Robbins, who can probably talk only about herself, her marketing team, the multiple platforms she's building out, how she's become this like incredible figure that everybody just wants to go to for advice. I mean, I'm sure like presidents and prime ministers call her regularly and they were probably like, you, let's just ditch her. She's not really great and she lacks kind of the self awareness to be like, maybe I'm the asshole. So anyway, moving on, she. Again, this entire book, the premise is let them. And the premise is that if a friend group leaves you out of something and you're very hurt, let them. If your boyfriend is kind of being a jerk to you, let him. If your boss refuses to give you that promotion or that raise that you know you deserve, let him. The idea that this is a blanket policy that is applicable to any and every conflict in your life is so moronic. I'm sorry to use that word again, but it's so truly, profoundly dumb. Like, for one thing, I think that anger abides for a reason in the human race. I think it's an evolutionary adaptation. I think in the right moments, in the right doses, it can actually be healthy. It can alert you to something or someone who is not quite right. This Buddhist idea that she's sort of like repackaging and shilling, that the only way to happiness is to somehow find a way within yourself to eradicate hurt feelings, betrayals, anything that basically upsets you and is motivating you to look for change. I don't subscribe to it. I don't actually subscribe to that Buddhist theory that like wants and desires are actually the root of all human misery. I think wants and desires, again, if you view them through the right lens, can be a very life affirming thing. I mean, could you imagine hitting a plateau in life where you're like done it all, seen it all? I have no goals, I have no ambitions. I've reached this plane of otherworldly existence where I don't desire anything. And by the way, this is going to loop into our future conversation about Ozempic because that's one of the side effects that the drug companies don't really tell you about. Chapter. What is this? Eight? Eight In a book that is just way too long. This is the title, which I love. So she goes, the right decision often feels wrong, to which I wrote in my notes. Does it? I don't think it does. I mean, we all have anxiety. There's good anxiety, there's bad anxiety. But I think this is a very strange idea to be putting forth to a bunch of people who follow you and believe that you do have some kind of access to wisdom that they do not. And by the way, Mel Robbins has no training in psychology, in sociology, in human behavior. She doesn't know anything more than you and I do. Okay, so listen to the banality, the platitudes. She's positing in this book that, by the way, she's charging 29.99 for hardcover and she's on tour right now, by the way, she's hitting New York City in a few weeks. I might go the lowest ticket, 500, biggest ticket, $1500. If I'm paying $1500 to see somebody speak, it better be Jesus Christ himself coming down from heaven. Okay, here we go. Mel Robbins, the wit and wisdom. The fact is, every human being is dealt a different hand in life. You don't say. Secondly, it's not about the hand you've been dealt, it's how you play it. Are you kidding me? Are you kidding me? Here she goes. It's true. A lot of people have been dealt a quote, luckier or quote, more successful hand of cards. Let them. You will never be able to move forward in life. She says. I'm paraphrasing here. Now I'm quoting. If you give all of your power to this stupid and toxic habit of comparing yourself to other people, stop it now. After we finish this part of the book by saying some People are just really lucky. Again, are you kidding me? Why am I spending money? Why am I spending my time reading this book? I have to say, when you see somebody who has something you want, it could be a material thing. It could be a quality they have. It could be sort of a ineffable thing they've got. The way I tend to look at stuff like that is that's alerting me that there is something I maybe would like to have or develop that I hadn't been in tune with before. And that's a nice little nudge to see what I can do to make my life a little bit happier. That is a much more healthy way, I think, to frame it now before we move on. I just have to say this woman who also had a very. She had a failed Talk show in 2019. And you don't really see this in her algorithm or her Instagram, which, by the way, she prefers to show us photos of. And I weep for humanity, truly. These are images of women who have tattooed let them on their bodies because I guess it's too difficult to remember. It's the equivalent of like somebody who has a tattoo that says breathe. It's an involuntary reaction. It keeps you going. You don't have to think about it. Why do you have to tattoo it on your body? So anyway, she had this failed talk show. We never really talk about the show. And in it, it was in 2019, and she again posited herself as somebody who was going to be America's shrink and help us with, you know, anyone who couldn't afford, let's say, a shrink. She was gonna be your therapist on television. Now, I'm just gonna read you some sample talk show titles. Men Being Catfished. The Mel Robbins Show. I Killed My Ex in Self Defense. The Mel Robbins Show. Confronting the Father I Never Knew I had the Mel. Okay, this is Jerry Springer. This is not high end self help. So I'm circling back now to Sawyer, the daughter who worked on this book. You know, Mel expresses a lot of anger towards Sawyer and she kind of. I think my interpretation is she knifes her a little bit in this book. And I don't quite understand why, but I am loving the lack of self awareness here on display. So she is talking about. She talks about being horrible, a horrible person. She literally writes the words, I was a complete bitch. You know, what happened? Um, she had three couples in a friend group with her and her husband, and the other three couples split off and formed their own friend group and expelled Mel and Chris. So I get again, I think we're getting an indication that Mel can be kind of difficult interpersonally. And she starts talking about, like, her kids in this book and in ways that I think, like, did her kids, like, sign off on this? Were they? Okay, so, Sawyer again. Sawyer, I see you, I acknowledge you, and I think we're all with you. This is Mel. I have watched our oldest daughter, Sawyer, engage in this type of comparison and torture herself for years. She is hyper fixated on her younger sister, Kendall, who has a completely different body type, bone structure, metabolism, and athletic abilities. To top it off, Kendall was born with an amazing singing voice and perfect pitch. Sawyer cannot change this. Holy crap. Okay, we go on. I've watched with so much sadness in my heart, in my. I, me, my. We're going to do a segment on difficult mothers. Trust me, I've watched with so much sadness in my heart at how miserable Sawyer makes herself. Dear Lord. And I can't save her. What? The great Mel Robbins can't save her own daughter? I thought you had all the answers. What's going on over there in casa Robbins going on? To quote, I can't stop her from engaging in this kind of comparison, and no amount of complimenting or reassurance is going to change her behavior. She must choose to change this for herself. Oh, my God. I feel like she is very, very antagonistic towards this daughter who must possess qualities that Mel just burns up with envy over here. She acknowledges Sawyer in the back of the book. Sawyer, my brilliant daughter, co conspirator, co researcher, co writer, and co pilot. Again, name is not on the book. You swore you would never, in all caps, work for your mother, and here we are. Well, here we all are. And I think we can conclude safely that Mel Robbins really deserves none of your time, none of your money. And let her implement this theory in her own house, with her own family, where I truly do believe some stuff needs attending to. Love you, Sawyer. We'll be back with the deep dive on Jose. You know that feeling when someone shows up for you just when you need it most? Yeah. I mean, we all need that. That's what Uber's all about. Not just a ride or dinner at your door. It's how Uber helps you show up for the moments that matter. Because showing up can turn a tough day around. Or make a good one even better. Whatever it is, big or small, Uber is on the way, so you can be on yours.
- [25:22]
Marlena
Uber on our way.
- [25:27]
Maureen Callahan
You know the secret to great days, better nights. I sound like Meghan Markle. Doing that, don't I? But let's just continue. It all starts by turning your bedroom into a sanctuary with Cozy Earth. Their bamboo sheet set is something incredible. It is the softest, coolest, most luxurious sheets you will ever own. Breathable, temperature regulating and crafted to help you sleep like it actually matters. Because it does, it directly impacts our health and mental well being. Imagine crawling into bed every night and feeling restored, refreshed and ready to take on tomorrow. And don't forget about their bamboo pajamas. Lightweight, yet cozy, they're designed to help you fall asleep faster and stay asleep longer. It's the sleepwear upgrade you didn't know you needed, but you definitely deserve. Cozy Earth makes it easy to try for yourself. You get 100 nights risk free to fall in love. Plus every bedding product is backed by a 10 year warranty. So take the time to prioritize your sleep and prioritize you. Visit cozyearth.com and start sleeping better with cozy earth today. That's cozyearth.com welcome back to the Nerve. Have you guys seen Lizzo recently? You know Lizzo, who had been sued by like a bunch of her dancers for terrible, what they say was abusive behavior and weight shaming. By the way, implied weight shaming. If you don't know about that, you might know Lizzo as the morbidly obese hip hop star who loved telling America how much she loved being morbidly obese and how that was an actual healthy, viable lifestyle and the rest of us could take our fat phobia and shove it. One of my favorite Instagram posts of recent memory is this post. Lizzo threw up on her Instagram saying how much again, she loved being fat. She loved. Look at those roles. Look at the amount of weight she is. And this is somebody who performs for a living. Like when you're performing for two hours a night on a live stage, you have to have a ton of energy and athleticism and discipline. Can you like work on the treadmill? Can you like work out on the treadmill while singing and dancing like it's you are an athlete? One would think. Anyway, we heard a lot from Lizzo about how much she loved being fat and now Lizzo has suddenly dropped half her body weight. It's gone. And guess how she's telling us she did it? Diet and exercise. And if you believe that, I know you don't believe that. I don't believe that. This reminded me of who I will call Patient Zero in this story and I believe it's Starr Jones, who audience members of a certain age will remember this. She was on the View. She was morbidly obese. She married a man of dubious heterosexuality. She used the View as a pump and dump to get sponsors for her wedding. It was, this was an incredible era in the View. It really, really, it was really fun to watch. Rosie O'Donnell, who We're going to be talking about later, was the lead host at the time. So Star Jones takes an exit. She takes a bit of a sabbatical. She comes back like a month or two. Half her body weight's gone, half of her body weight is gone. So all of these bitches on the View are going to her. Star, how'd you really lose that weight? And Star's going diet and exercise, diet and exercise. And the story was because I went back and looked this up at the time, Star was dying because she was convinced that Joy Behar and Rosie O'Donnell were leaking to Page Six that she had gastric bypass surgery. And I do believe at one point it was either Rosie or Joy. I think it was Rosie who said this lie that Star Jones is peddling. Their words, not mine. That she lost weight this way is a bunch of horseshit. And it's a very dangerous, hypocritical message to be giving the women of America. Now, again, this is coming from people who work on the View. So, you know, pot, kettle. But Starr did later admit that she had been lying and that she did lose the weight through gastric bypass. And this is all to say that I think we've all seen many celebrities who we all suspect are taking the jab. They won't admit it or they lie about it like Oprah did, and then they admit that they did it. I mean, my own theories about prominent people who are taking the jab, Michelle Obama, who has suddenly lost again, half her body weight, Kelly Clarkson, I think, has admitted it, but she had a stubborn problem for years and suddenly the pounds have fallen off. Meghan Markle, who looks like she has the metabolism of a 15 year old, suddenly after two kids and she's well into middle age, I suspect she might be on it. John Goodman, Kathy Bates, like people we've seen in the public eye for years and years and years and they're being very quiet about it. And the messaging that we're all getting is that Ozempic's really okay to take and we should be taking it. Oprah Winfrey did not one, but two primetime specials on Ozempic after she was forced to admit that, yes, indeed, this was despite having so much personal wealth that she has access to the best dieticians, nutritionists, chefs, trainers. She could hire a minder the way, like, people who are struggling with their own sobriety have somebody with them at all times to sort of keep them on the straight. Now, she could hire a minder if her food issues are that severe. Instead, she's taking the jab Now. I loved the Oprah advertorials for this, the GLP1s. And I particularly loved episode two, when she had Busy Phillips on. And the first clip I'm going to play of Busy Phillips, you're going to die. And Busy took it upon herself to apologize on behalf of America for making Oprah feel bad about her weight. Do not apologize for me, Busy Phillips. Okay? Because I'm not sorry. Because I have a theory about this entire thing. So, anyway, let's listen to Busy talk to Oprah and to us, the American people, about how she is an expert on weight and weight struggles.
- [32:15]
Marlena
I speak from a place of celebrity. I've been doing this since I was 19 years old.
- [32:20]
Kathy Griffin
Why do you think this has become.
- [32:22]
Maureen Callahan
A morality discussion instead of one about health and science?
- [32:27]
Marlena
Well, I mean, good Lord. I mean, because isn't. Isn't our weight always become always a morality thing? Haven't women, especially who are bigger in bigger bodies always been judged?
- [32:41]
Maureen Callahan
Yes.
- [32:41]
Marlena
I love you so much. And when you did that special and I watched with my mom and all of those magazine covers were behind you, and it broke my heart because they were in my house growing up, and you are the most brilliant. And it brought so many incredible, wonderful, transformative ideas into households that otherwise wouldn't have had the opportunity to know about meditation, to know about getting centered, to know about all of these things.
- [33:13]
Maureen Callahan
You were reduced. Yes.
- [33:14]
Marlena
You were reduced.
- [33:15]
Maureen Callahan
Yes. Yes, yes, yes. Thank you for saying that. Okay, let's take that apart. Busy Phillips opens up by saying, I come from a place of celebrity. To which I would say, I think, Busy Phillips, you're overestimating just how famous you are. Not many people know who you are. Not many people care. That's your problem. It's not your weight. And by the way, don't bitch about being judged by your weight when you're an actress. That's part of the job description. Sorry, that it. If you don't like it, leave. So you go on this Oprah special. I think Oprah invited her because she did some, like, video that went viral. You know, it was just sort of. She was just bitching about people judging women for their weight. She's not very bright. This will, I'm sure, shock you. She's not very bright because at one point Oprah's talking to her and asking her why she thinks that women judge women and men judge women for weight. And busy Phillips goes, you know, I just, I don't know. I mean, there's just like. I mean, there's so many other things to talk about. I mean, look at all the atrocities going on in the world. This is not a first rate mind, okay? Not a first rate mind. Then she tells, she tells Oprah, like so. She's clearly very nervous and she cannot believe she is in the presence of the great and good Oprah Winfrey because her voice is shaking and her pitch is extremely high. And she's giving Oprah credit for bringing such foreign concepts as meditation, which I guarantee is a practice as old as humanity itself. But no, Oprah brought meditation into America's living rooms. It's like that time when Gwyneth said that she went to like a fancy yoga studio and told the girl working the counter like, you wouldn't have a job if it weren't for me. I brought yoga to the masses. I think, I think many Indian yoga masters would beg to differ. But again, just my opinion. And then busy gets into. She works herself into like this high self righteous dungeon, right? She's telling Oprah how bad she felt for Oprah on Oprah's one woman special, a primetime special on Ozempic. So Oprah's running this show and it was she who decided to display those magazines about her weight, which by the way, are meant to make us the bad guys, okay? Oprah Winfrey wanted to be on the COVID of Vogue magazine so badly that when Anna Wintour told her if she wanted it, she had to drop like 80 pounds, Oprah did it. Oprah did it. Oprah did a whole special on her show when she first lost the weight. I'm going to say she was maybe in her 30s at the time. And she dragged out, I kid you not, a red wagon full of bags of fat to show us how much she had dropped. So if you don't think that Oprah Winfrey has commodified her weight, then she went and struck this huge deal with Weight Watchers. And this was the crux of the thing, right? I think that was really the origination of those two primetime specials because suddenly Oprah had dropped all this weight. But she clearly hadn't done it through Weight Watchers. She clearly hadn't done it through calorie counting. And Diet and exercise. So now we have to pivot and we have to convince American women to take this drug, which, by the way, we have zero long term longitudinal studies on the side effects of this drug. Okay? Trust me. I have a good friend whose partner is like a top doctor in a top New York City hospital. And trust me when I tell you, he will not let anyone in his life get on these things. These are just some of the side effects. And not for nothing, we're still relitigating the long term effects and the short term effects of the COVID vaccine. Okay? We are going to be litigating that for years. We are going to be seeing deleterious health outcomes as a result of that vaccine for years. But the messaging we're getting everywhere and from Oprah, who really should be ashamed of herself, as well as 60 minutes, which back in November ran an advertorial for Novo Nordisk, the company that invented this drug. It was an advertorial, I swear to you. There was not one remotely critical question. Today, Novo Nordisk success and the spike in demand for Ozempic is fattening the country's economy, creating thousands of jobs, bolstering national pension plans, keeping mortgage rates low. Like most Danes delighted that America's demand for Novo Nordisk drugs is Denmark's gain. The benefits of Novo's drugs to global.
- [37:57]
Marlena
Health will ultimately save trillions of dollars.
- [38:00]
Maureen Callahan
And if anything is to blame for.
- [38:02]
Marlena
The high prices, it's the fractured US health care system.
- [38:05]
Maureen Callahan
This is malpractice, I think journalistically, medically. Okay? Here are just some of the side effects that we know about. And listen to the wording that you'll find if you go look it up online like I did. Okay? Pancreatitis. That is an extremely dangerous inflammation of the pancreas. A higher risk of thyroid cancer. Just a little cancer. They call it this side effect. They call it vision problems. Let me tell you something. No, I'm sorry. They call it vision changes. Vision changes, okay? If your vision changes, it does not change for the better. Okay? It should be called vision problems. Blindness is one. Acute kidney injury, which they call kidney problems. Acute kidney injury sounds worse, right? Because it is. Gallbladder issues, tachycardia, low blood sugar, violent vomiting, projectile vomiting, diarrhea so bad people cannot leave their homes. Constipation, fatigue, weakness, sagging. Ozempic butt. Ozempic feet, facial sagging. These are just some of the things we know about. Listen to Sharon Osbourne talk about her experience on Ozempic for me.
- [39:27]
Marlena
Anyway, it's different for everybody. But for me, the first few weeks.
- [39:31]
Maureen Callahan
Was because you just throw up all the time and feel so nauseous. Really? Yeah. That's their big secret. We made something that makes you throw up and who knows, you lose weight. Oh, my God. What geniuses in the lab. My thoughts exactly. Bill Maher. What kind of geniuses in the lab came up with a wonder drug? You know, this reminds me of the fen phen phenomenon in the 90s. Like, everyone was taking this pill called fen phen. It was kind of a black market off label drug. I knew people who took it and it was later recalled because people were dying and. But it was just like people love the idea that there's this magic bullet for weight loss. And I'm telling you, everything costs something. Sharon Osbourne. In this next clip, you will see how gaunt she is. You're not going to believe it. She looks seriously unwell and she basically talks about her weight. She's having trouble. She stopped taking it. She can't put weight back on. Okay. This is yet another side effect. She was dropping so much weight, she just stopped taking it. Some people, when they stop, they put the weight right back on. Plus more other people like Sharon. And I believe she's probably in a small cohort. But what do we know because we have no studies says that she is the weight at which she. At her. At her roughest battle with cancer on chemotherapy. This is what she. Where she's at right now. Take a listen to her. I can't put on weight now, and.
- [41:06]
Marlena
I don't know what it's done to.
- [41:08]
Maureen Callahan
My metabolism, but I just can't seem to put any on because I think I went too far. And I was worried for you because you do have a health history of cancer and other things. So putting chemicals into your body has got to be a.
- [41:22]
Bill from Brooklyn
A little bit of a.
- [41:23]
Maureen Callahan
A worrisome moment, right? In fact, I haven't been this way since I had cancer. Right. So I'm back to my cancer weight. That's not a good thing. No, it's not.
- [41:35]
Bill from Brooklyn
No, it's not.
- [41:36]
Maureen Callahan
No. But you look great, and that's the important thing. You had cancer. You know what it's like to have to put poison in your body to get rid of the cancer. You survived the cancer, but you want to look great. You want to look great. That's the important thing. So you're putting this thing in your body that might cause cancer again. But we look great. So let's bring in the lovely Marlena, who is one of our wonderful producers because we were having a great conversation about this the other day and I was expressing surprise that I'm now hearing about people sort of adjacent to my social circles. Like people I'm acquainted with, I don't know well, who are now taking it and people who I thought would be like, above this. I heard about someone I know who is on it, who frankly, I don't think ever needed to be on it. And it really is shocking to me how this messaging is working and convincing people who I think are otherwise very smart and sophisticated to put this chemical in their bodies. Marlena, welcome to the Nerve on air. How are you?
- [42:49]
Marlena
Hi. I'm doing well. Great to be here.
- [42:53]
Maureen Callahan
So, Marlena, you were telling me something very interesting, that people who are taking Ozempic, we're talking about regular people in our social circles, not like a list stars. You've heard they are also mixing it with Adderall.
- [43:07]
Marlena
Well, some people are sort of doing this off and on like Ozempic and then they go off Ozempic and then they take Adderall to suppress their appetite. But also you were talking about fen phen earlier and phentermine, which is a component of fen phen, is now making the rounds again. And it's almost like a jacked up version of Adderall where it's like this absolute extreme suppression of your appetite and also gives you all of this energy. So I guess the people that are taking this haven't heard about the massive class action lawsuit that happened with fen phen after the fact, after it was taken off the market. But this is now trending within. And it's. And it's not even something that people I feel like are talking about online. It's just something that I'm hearing in my circles and have been offered in my circles, which I did not take up anyone on the way.
- [44:06]
Maureen Callahan
The. The idea that you would need to go on Ozempic is insane. You are a totally healthy, fit, normal sized woman. But this is, I think, the real danger too here. I mean, there are so many dangers and things we never hear about. Like the lobbying that Novo Nordisk is doing in D.C. like the way that ads for this stuff can run on American tv. Unfettered Europe. They don't allow this stuff. They don't allow pharmaceutical companies to market directly to who their consumer should be. By the way, ads that look like everybody's like singing in some sort of 2D musical and they're so happy because they're lowering their A1C. I've never heard the phrase A1C more in my life. But the idea that like this is the messaging we're getting now and I think it's really screwing with body standards and body image. And I worry really for young girls who are coming of age now and who are being told this is what you want to look like 100%.
- [45:08]
Marlena
Because originally they were putting this on the market for people who are obese, which is questionable in and of itself because it is a drug for diabetics. And now you have people who are of average weight who want to take this just so that they can be even skinnier, but the side effects are terrible. And the crazy thing, and I think you and I touched on this offline, was about people who, they were, they were showing this connection between people who were having, who were on Ozempic to lose weight and then were getting pregnant. And these were also people who had fertility issues. So now this, this new wave of sort of like this Ozempic baby boom sparked this conversation and new studies of whether or not now you know whether it could be marketed toward women who are having fertility issues. Again, not even knowing what the long term side effects are. And the sort of comedy piece, if you want to call it that is that if you're going on Ozempic to lose weight and then you get pregnant, then you're in a weird cycle because you're about to gain back all that weight with your pregnancy. So jokes on you, I guess, but it's, it's a, it's a strange culture. But the fact that it's so expensive and that there are backdoor ways of getting it, because people know, people who are doctors, who are dentists, who, whatever, who can just get it, you know, by writing a prescription and are taking it. It's not even being monitored by any sort of medical professional that could tell you whether you know whether or not this is even in something that's right for your valves, like your heart valve.
- [46:51]
Maureen Callahan
Right, Correct. There are also, they've been seeding this idea that Ozempic is a miracle drug, a panacea that is going to cure possibly everything from Parkinson's to Alzheimer's, which makes me highly, highly suspicious. And the other I hate about this drug and which makes me again, highly suspicious is they want customers for life. So if you want to keep all that weight off, you got a micro dose Ozempic for the rest of your life, risk of pancreatic or thyroid cancer be damned. Be very, very suspicious of any drug company that is telling you they have a miracle drug. I do not think this is going to end well. Thank you Marlena for joining the chat and we will be back with Bill from Brooklyn. Netcredit is here to say yes to a personal loan or line of credit. When other lenders say no, apply in minutes and get a decision as soon as the same day. If approved, applications are typically funded the next business day or sooner. Loans offered by Netcredit or lending partners, banks and serviced by Netcredit Application subject to review and approval. Learn more@netcredit.com partner netcredit credit to the People Let me tell you a story about a guy named Leo Grillo. While on a road trip, Leo came across a Doberman. This dog was severely underweight and clearly in trouble. Leo rescued that Doberman and named him Delta. Sadly, Delta was just one of many animals that needed help which inspired Leo to start Delta Rescue, the largest no kill care for life animal sanctuary in the world. They've rescued thousands of dogs, cats and horses from the wilderness and they provide their animals with shelter, love, safety and a home. This dedication and everlasting love to animals is Leo's mission and legacy. Delta Rescue relies solely on contributions from people like us and if you want caring for these animals to be part of your legacy, you could speak with your estate planner because there are tax saving estate planning benefits too. You can grow your estate while letting your love for animals live well into the future. Check out the estate planning tab on their website to learn more and to speak with an advisor. We call a dog Man's best friend and woman's best friend for a reason. You can help those who need it most. So please visit Deltarescue.org today to learn more. That's Deltarescue.org welcome back to the Nerve. I am so excited about this next guest who I know you're going to love as much as I do. He is actually my brother. His name is Bill. He's from Brooklyn. He does not work in media. He actually has a job, a career that contributes to the wellness and well being of society at large. And he, you're going to hear him talk. He has a very thick New York accent. He sounds like he could break your legs. He probably could. He wouldn't, but he could. And the way I sort of want to set Bill up is to say this and this is all true. When the LA wildfires broke out and then news broke, the really important stuff that Ben Affleck dropped everything, raced over to Jen Garner's house, scooped her and the kids up and Spirited them off to safety. I thought to myself, how is JLo reacting to this news? It cannot be. Well, my second thought is I need to call Bill and talk to him about this because he, like me, loves to dive in to the human psychology behind these people who otherwise present themselves as so perfect and rich and powerful. And Ben Affleck is one of our favorite talking points since he is out promoting his new movie the Accountant too. I thought, what better time to bring in Bill and talk some Ben Affleck and other celebrity news. So welcome, Bill, and thank you for doing the show.
- [51:09]
Bill from Brooklyn
Thank you for having me. Let me congratulate you on your show. I listened to the first show the other day. Absolutely amazing.
- [51:17]
Maureen Callahan
Thanks, Bill. Thank you. Oh, my God. So first, I want to start off by showing the audience like Ben Affleck's greatest hits. First we're gonna look at the. This is one of the greatest paparazzi photos ever taken. And were Andy Warhol still alive, this would be a silkscreen print that would go for millions of Christie's. The paparazzi photo of a fed up Jennifer Garner in Ray Bans. I think they're Ray Bans driving Ben Affleck to rehab. And he makes her stop for Jack in the Box or fast food. She can't even look at him. She is so disgusted. She's pushing the food, the bag of food in his face while looking down. This shot said everything about their relationship. As we know, Ben went on to marry the quote, unquote love of his life, Jennifer Lopez, who they were engaged 20 years ago. They like to say the media broke them up. What really broke them up was Ben went to a strip club while he was shooting a movie in Canada. And I will never forget the details of this story because I remember it was like my JFK assassination moment. I was on the beach reading the National Enquirer. It was this story about Ben at a strip club with his castmates, who included Christian Slater. They were partying. He performed a sex act on a stripper in the club in front of everybody. They all went back to the mansion where they were staying. Somebody walked by a bathroom at some point and saw one of the strippers shaving Christian Slater's back. And I was like, these are the details that really make a story sing, you know? So let's take a look at J. Lo and Ben. Maybe in the first flush of their newly rekindled romance. Their newlyweds, they're on the red carpet strutting their stuff, showing how happy they are. Let's Take a look at some of those moments in recent memory. So right now we're looking at. I believe this is one of Jen's premieres. So look at him get in her face. Look at, like, he's a big guy. This guy's like 6:3, I think. And it's her night, and he's getting in her face. It's like, yeah, you can see the name of the movie. It's the Mother. I think that was hers. Here we are at the Grammys. Oh, I love this one. Ben, his best grumpy face is on. They don't know the cameras are on them. And she basically elbows him and is like, hey, look alive, okay? This is her crowd, not his. This is her work event. He needs to show up and support her. And he is being such a pill, by the way. Whenever it's one of Ben's events, he's always on. Okay, now we're walking to the car. This is towards the end of the relationship. And you're gonna see why he opens the car door for Jen. Jennifer Garner. Sorry, JLo. I get confused. Okay, she steps inside. Very daintily steps inside. Watch the slam. The arm. The arm, like, flies up. It's the most epic fuck you. He knows the cameras are there. He sees them. He's talking to the paparazzi at the end of that clip. And that, ladies, is what it's like to date Ben Affleck. Bill, your thoughts?
- [54:36]
Bill from Brooklyn
First thing I have to say is I never heard that part about Christian Slater before. I mean, who gets. Who gets their back shaved by a strip? I. I just. I never heard that one before.
- [54:47]
Maureen Callahan
Well, I mean, it was like 4:00am you know, I mean, imagine what it was like there. But like, that's like, who exactly. Like, hey, want to shave my back? Like that stripper was earning her money that night. Okay, anyway, go on.
- [54:58]
Bill from Brooklyn
The. The door slam that's just in front of people. I've. I've just given up, you know, and it's funny coming from a guy who's, you know, he. He could be a pretty good actor depending upon the role he's taking. And he just can't do it. It's not there. He's just given up giving up on life at that moment, slamming the door in front everyone knows fully well it's going to be on the front page of every paper. Just, I'm done. I'm giving. I've given up. And here it is for everyone to see.
- [55:28]
Maureen Callahan
Showing so much contempt for a woman who made an entire documentary about how Much she loves him. Like, that's the thing. Like, don't date Ben Affleck. There was this great story. Well, okay, before we get into the latest quotes from some insiders who had some really juicy stuff to share with the New York Post, I want to go back to this clip of Ben Affleck on Howard Stern because now he's trying to win back Jennifer Garner. He has been leaking that he would take her back in a heartbeat if she would have him. This woman is in a seven year relationship with another man. But this was Ben on Stern about, like two years ago, talking about why he had such a problem with alcohol. We're probably at each other's throats. I'd probably still be drinking.
- [56:17]
Bill from Brooklyn
You know, like, was part of why I started drinking alcohol because I was trapped.
- [56:23]
Maureen Callahan
So, Bill, you've been married for a while now. You're coming up on your 12 year anniversary. So congratulations on that. Let's say, God forbid you split up with your wife. Would you tell anyone, let alone Howard Stern, that your lovely wife drove you to drink?
- [56:49]
Bill from Brooklyn
I mean, I don't, I don't understand how you even discuss it publicly. It's. It's so private. Right. That's one, you know, that would be, I would assume, what you consider your greatest personal failure. And you would want to. And I would.
- [57:05]
Maureen Callahan
In the marriage ending. Not alcoholism, right?
- [57:08]
Bill from Brooklyn
No, not the alcoholism. No, that's, that's a struggle that people face all the time. But to blame that on the mother of your children publicly put that out there for all to see, for eternity. They're going to see it over and over again. It just, you know, to me, it goes to show the level of selfishness and, and just self importance that he has clearly doesn't. I mean, he banged the nanny. He clearly doesn't think.
- [57:34]
Maureen Callahan
Allegedly. Allegedly. She did get a drop top Lexi out of it, Alexis, which she told us about, but he's always denied that, but go on.
- [57:45]
Bill from Brooklyn
Allegedly. My, my mistake. Yeah. I mean, you know, bring that back to the, to the pictures with Jennifer Lopez on a big night for her and he's, you know, where she's elbowing him to smile. I mean, you, a person that can't even put a smile out there. It. I, I don't know, I don't know what goes on inside someone like that with some, like, in his head. I can't place it. There are times where you see, he looks like a great guy. He's out there smiling. He can be very charismatic. He's a great looking guy. He's had some great movies, but then you see these awful moments.
- [58:24]
Maureen Callahan
That's why he's so fascinating, because I am also a fan of his. Like, I may sound like I'm not, but I am. For a long time. I had a huge shame crush on Ben Affleck, but he like one of my. So I love the town. I think that's an incredible movie. I thought he did an incredible job with Argo. I love that movie. Movie. He also did one of the greatest DVD commentaries of all time. For Armageddon.
- [58:49]
Bill from Brooklyn
I asked Michael why it was easier to train oil drillers to become astronauts than it was to train astronauts to become oil drillers. And he told me to shut, shut, shut the fuck up. So that was the end of that talk, you know, Ben, just shut up, okay? You know, this is a real plan, all right? I was like, you mean it's a real plan at NASA to train oil drillers?
- [59:10]
Maureen Callahan
He was like, just shut your mouth. And it was so funny. And you can see how this guy would be such a sparkling conversationalist. He displayed like self awareness and self deprecation. And he pointed something out that is painfully obvious about a movie that kind of put him on the map as a matinee idol. Shows he has intelligence. And then he does stuff like this.
- [59:34]
Bill from Brooklyn
Yeah, it's. You go back to just, you know, the self importance piece of it. It's just he has to put himself out there publicly. There's. I think there's a public image that he is so concerned with. And I think, you know, maybe to a degree, part of that door slamming with Jennifer Lopez was, you know, the masculinity part where he couldn't be viewed as the weaker person in the relationship, the one without the power. So that was a public display of. It may look like she's running things, but I'm tired of her crap. And here it is for everybody to see.
- [60:10]
Maureen Callahan
Yes, yes. I want to read this quote before we go into our theory as to why Ben cut and run so quickly with JLo. Because his usual MO is to force the woman in his life into leaving him by treating her like shit. So this is a quote from someone who knows Affleck in this. It was this incredible story in the New York Post. It was like a Sunday great, juicy read, read quote. The dirty secret is that he, Ben, he's the diva. He's the one who likes attention and calls the paps and manipulates women. He love bombs you. And once he's got you, he gets bored and leaves. It's cruel and anyone who remembers what he did. So this guy, again, we're promoting a movie and he loves, his favorite thing is to love to run around and say, I have no idea why everybody's so fascinated with my private life. Like, nothing, nothing to see here. Ana de Armas, this up and coming starlet at the time, she's building a nice career for herself, left him and he had one of his children, by the way, again, we all know what their children look like. I shouldn't really know what they look like. I think he had one of his children take a life size cardboard cutout of Ana de Armas and dump it in his trash containers in full view of the paparazzi. Nothing to see here. Okay, so the diddy of it all because we're going to get into diddy as well. Share your theory, Bill, as to why Ben Affleck chose a moment in which Jennifer Lopez was in Europe to flee the $65 million marital home in the metaphorical dead of night and move into a $20 million rental. Closer to who else, Jen Garner.
- [61:58]
Bill from Brooklyn
To go back to the comment you made earlier, allegedly thought, you know, I don't just a wild theory. You don't run off in the middle of the night for no reason. There is something that scares you into it, if I'm not mistaken. Right about that time there were reports, rumors surfacing of a female, a list superstar who may have been witness to partaking in some of the freak offs and might have, you know, where some of the bodies are buried, so to speak. It's a scary thing to be involved with. I'm sure there are a lot of people out there right now that would love to remain nameless and faceless through this whole trial.
- [62:43]
Maureen Callahan
I couldn't agree with you more. I think that it because it so goes against his normal ways we just spoke about, of exiting a relationship. Like he got the F out of there and he never does that. And then so in this new GQ interview, he's on the COVID this cover story and he's like super, like they've sort of made him look like kind of a Bob Evans super producer Hollywood type. The first question in this profile is speaking of tabloids, the FBI visited your house. And he gives this like lengthy run on explanation which has two different reasons as to why the FBI showed up at his personal residence. And none of it really makes any sense. And I think there's probably only one reason the feds would show up at Ben Affleck's house with everything that's Going on. Am I crazy?
- [63:38]
Bill from Brooklyn
My favorite part of that story was Ben Affleck had to call the FBI to find out why they were there.
- [63:43]
Maureen Callahan
I mean, oh, my God. That was amazing. That was amazing.
- [63:48]
Bill from Brooklyn
I don't know how one knows to call the FBI or how to get in contact with them. I mean, do you Google them? Do you have a direct line? I don't know.
- [63:56]
Maureen Callahan
That is amazing. Now, to transition to the Diddy part of this. First of all, do you remember when JLO and Diddy were arrested in that nightclub shooting?
- [64:08]
Bill from Brooklyn
I watched the Law and Order episode about it all the time.
- [64:11]
Maureen Callahan
Oh, my God. It's one of the best ever. It's one of the best ever. At the height of his arrest, they were playing that thing on a loop, like you could tune into whatever channel runs it. WETV or whatever, or tbs. But my favorite anecdote from that night was, so they have JLO in a separate interrogation room, and she says to the cops, by the way, people have been shot. A woman got shot in the face. This is why I've never liked J. London, she says. One of many reasons she goes to the cops. I need you to go out and get me some cuticle cream. My manicure's really taking a beating during this arrest.
- [64:49]
Bill from Brooklyn
Good Lord.
- [64:51]
Maureen Callahan
So the New York Times ran this huge front page story on Sunday. I don't know if it was this past Sunday. Sean Puffy Combs, Life behind bars. And no pun intended. This is a puff piece. This is a puff piece about how hard Sean Combs has it in mdc, the Metropolitan Detention center, which is one of the worst. And they have this power. First of all, there are two things worth noting. The jurors, prospective jurors are going to be asked if they will be willing to watch videos of these freak offs, lest we all need a reminder. We've all seen the video of Sean Combs beating the shit out of Cassie in a hotel hallway. This is what this guy does in public. Imagine what he does in private. We all know the story of Kid Cudi, his rival rapper, saying that Sean Combs telling the New York Times, Sean Combs threw a Molotov cocktail into his car to back him off of. Of a love interest that they both had. Now the Times has this really sympathetic graph. Two, actually. One, Diddy has lost his jailhouse best friend Sam Bankman Fried, the crypto fraudster who has been transferred to another prison. And secondly, the feds raided his or prosecutors raided his cell while he wasn't in it, which they're allowed to do, by the way, and how wrong that was. But the argument that they put forth in court was that they were getting word that Sean Combs was trying to intimidate witnesses, allegedly from inside. Bill, what do you make of that?
- [66:34]
Bill from Brooklyn
I first the whole, let's feel bad for Diddy. I just can't. I don't know how anyone, the guy's lawyer quit. The guy's lawyer resigned.
- [66:46]
Maureen Callahan
That's right. The lawyer said, there's no way I can go forward on this case. None.
- [66:50]
Bill from Brooklyn
Right. And I, I read, I read some other piece where there was, the lawyer made a comment about the, the speed at which he was resigning, and it wasn't in the normal range time frame required by the courts, but there were reasons protected by attorney client privilege that he could not disclose that did not allow him to continue representing him. So, you know, if your lawyer quits, a criminal defense lawyer in New York quits. I'm not really feeling too bad for you.
- [67:24]
Maureen Callahan
Oh, my God. That's the funny. You're so freaking right. That is so funny. Okay, I want to move on to our last topic, a favorite of yours and mine, Rosie O'Donnell, who is doing a series of interviews promoting this documentary that nobody's interested in. They want to talk to her about two things. One, she fled America for Ireland after Trump got elected. And she told the New York Times that she said to her shrink, if he wins, I gotta go. And my therapist said, quote, well, let's make a real plan. So she moves to Ireland with one of her children who is both autistic and non binary. And then she talks about befriending Lyle Menendez, who she says is the first straight man she's ever really fallen in love with. I guess the days of Tom Cruise crushing are over, well and truly. And that he makes her feel safe. Billy, what is the damage? Here I go.
- [68:33]
Bill from Brooklyn
I, I, I, I, I want to go back to the beginning where, how, how did they initially come in contact?
- [68:40]
Maureen Callahan
From what I read, he wrote her a letter, he wrote her a letter back in the 90s because she has a habit of befriending people who wind up in a lot of trouble.
- [68:48]
Bill from Brooklyn
Okay, but how does someone, I don't know how to find Rosie O'Donnell's address. How does somebody in jail get that?
- [68:55]
Maureen Callahan
That's a good question. But remember, like his father, the father that he, and he and his brother Eric savagely murdered along with the mother, never forget, at this crime scene, when the cops came, the investigators came, Jose's body, his, his brain fell out of his head. Kitty, the mother was unrecognizable. And one of the brothers said, I put the gun right to her cheek and I blew her fucking face off. I'm paraphrasing, but that's what happened. And this was premeditated. They planned it for a week. They stacked up their alibis. They made a hysterical phone call to 911. The whole thing was premeditated. And Lyle, by the way, has just been caught recently cheating on his wife while behind bars with a woman who was born the year they were married with an illicit cell phone that he's not supposed to have in prison. So Lyle remains a great guy. And this is who Rosie O'Donnell is throwing her support behind to get him out of prison.
- [69:59]
Bill from Brooklyn
There was nobody else she could befriend. No support group that. I mean, parents of autistic children, no one through the school.
- [70:10]
Maureen Callahan
It's so funny you say that, because how she and Lyle connected apparently was once she started taking Lyle's calls and they talk like, all the time now. Lyle told her what a great idea it would be for her. Sorry, her autistic non binary child to get a dog that had been trained as an emotional service animal by felons. And ly really wanted to. To hook her up with this. And then she went on to say it was a. It was a great idea he gave her. And that's exactly what she did. God damn it. And she made a documentary about it. So let Lyall Menendez out.
- [70:47]
Bill from Brooklyn
Yeah, I mean, listen, I just, I. It just all seems like clickbait. Right. She's not. She's no longer relevant. She's leaving the country because of President Trump. I'm. You're that broken up. I think I read where she said she was. Her drinking had become excessive.
- [71:06]
Maureen Callahan
Yes.
- [71:06]
Bill from Brooklyn
Over the election as well. I mean, therapy is probably a better option than moving. I don't know that, you know, moving continents is really going to solve the problem.
- [71:18]
Maureen Callahan
Yes. And by the way, I just want to say there was a press conference in the White House with Donald Trump and the. The Prime Minister of Ireland. It was in the Oval Office, and during this presser, a reporter named Brian Glenn with the news outlet Real America's Voice asked the Prime Minister of Ireland why he was allowing Ms. O'Donnell to move there when all she could do was, quote, bring unhappiness to the country.
- [71:48]
Bill from Brooklyn
And if I'm not mistaken, he didn't have to answer because President Trump answered for him, from what I read, cut him off. So he's probably pretty happy that he didn't have to follow through.
- [71:59]
Maureen Callahan
And I'm sure Trump's answer, I don't know what Trump said but I'm sure it was great. Just like when Trump said that he was not going to cause any problems for Prince Harry because he had enough on his plate with Meghan Markle who he said is terrible. And I thought I don't that was great. Right. Like whatever side of the aisle you're on, we can all agree that Trump spoke the truth that day.
- [72:16]
Bill from Brooklyn
Oh, he hit the nail on the head.
- [72:19]
Maureen Callahan
Well, Bill, this has been an amazing chat. I'm so glad you have agreed to come on the show. I know this is not normally your wheelhouse but you have agreed to become a recurring guest and so you will be hearing from Bill from Brooklyn more often. And I thank all of you for joining me today on the Nerve where you will never guess what we're about to say next.