Podcast Summary: Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie on Discovering America

Podcast: The New Yorker Radio Hour
Host: David Remnick (with interviewer likely John Seabrook for main conversation)
Guest: Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie
Date: January 30, 2018

Overview: Main Theme & Purpose

This episode centers on acclaimed Nigerian novelist Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie’s journey from Lagos to America, her process of self-discovery, and her candid reflections on identity, race, feminism, and writing. Adichie discusses her personal experiences as an immigrant, a writer, and a vocal feminist, especially her bold approach to taboo subjects. The conversation, held at the New Yorker Festival, provides sharp insights into American and Nigerian cultures, identity politics, and the expectations and pitfalls of literary and political communities.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Leaving Nigeria and Arriving in America

• Fleeing Medicine for Creative Freedom

  • Adichie shares her motivation for coming to the U.S.—escaping preordained expectations in Nigeria to become a doctor, instead seeking freedom to explore art and humanities.
  • "I came to the US because I was fleeing the study of medicine." (01:26)

• American Reality vs. Expectation

  • Adichie’s first impressions of Philadelphia were dissonant—she found the reality of housing disappointing compared to her polished visions of America.
  • "I imagined that everything in America was clean and shiny and bright, you know, and it wasn't. And that disappointed me profoundly." (03:06)

2. The Purpose of Writing and Publishing

• Desire for Connection, Delight, and Humanity

  • She distinguishes between writing and publishing: the former for herself, the latter for connection.
  • "We publish because we seek a certain connection. We want to be read. I write the kind of fiction I like to read... that delights me, that instructs me, that feels rooted in sort of some kind of humanity." (05:29)

• On Writing 'Americanah' as a 'F--- You Book'

  • Adichie describes writing from a place of freedom, rebelling against the literary expectation to discuss race only subtly:
  • "Much of the writing about race I just found to be dishonest... And it seemed to me also quite ideological... I just felt that, yeah..." (06:34)

3. Critique of the Political Left & Liberal Orthodoxy

• On Ideological Frustration and Purity Tests

  • Adichie finds the American left cannibalistic and self-righteous, highlighting how quick the community can be to ostracize its own over perceived ideological impureness.
    • "The left is cannibalistic. It eats its own... It's so easy to fall afoul of the ridiculously high standards set there." (08:07)
  • She discusses the orthodoxy, rigidity, and need for performative purity within progressive circles.
    • "There's an orthodoxy. There's a kind of... you follow the rules and if you don't, you're cut down very quickly." (09:19)

• Personal Experience with the Transgender Debate Blowback

  • Adichie recounts criticism for stating, "I think trans women are trans women, and that I think there is a difference between trans women and women who are born female." (09:58)
  • She describes the outsized reaction, including being lectured at public events and feeling misunderstood:
    • "It was as though somebody had died. Seriously... it was simply that I didn’t use the language I was supposed to use." (10:56)

4. Freedom of Speech in America

• On Debating Offensive Ideas
  • Adichie advocates for more speech—not censorship—when responding to controversial public figures and ideas.
    • "I guess I'm just a person who thinks that the answer to bad speech is more speech in general." (12:15)
  • She challenges the notion that protecting students from offensive ideas in college shields them from real-world racism.
    • "America is a country that is steeped in racism. So how are you protecting this young woman in a college? By not having a speaker come? When she steps out into the world... she's stepping out into racism." (13:09)

5. Discovering 'Blackness' in America

• Encountering U.S. Racial Categorization
  • In Nigeria, Adichie never thought of herself as Black—America imposed the identity on her.
    • "In Nigeria, there was no reason for me to think of myself as Black. In Nigeria." (13:31)
  • She shares her first taste of American racial bias—a professor surprised at her essay quality:
    • "That's when I knew what being black meant. It meant that you're not supposed to write the best essay in class if you're black." (13:50)
  • She reflects on her own internalized discomfort at being racially grouped:
    • "It was me backing away from blackness because I knew that in America, blackness is a bad thing... Now I want to find him and hug him and say, I am so your sister." (14:57)

6. On Immigration, Opportunity, and Identity

• Immigration as Agency
  • Adichie sees coming to America as an act of assertion, not simply desperation.
    • "The act of immigration, when it's not an act of desperation... is an assertive action." (15:44)
  • She admires America's culture of possibility, real or imagined.
    • "Only here do I feel... Doesn't matter if it's true. I feel it." (16:14)

7. Feminism: In Nigeria and the U.S.

• Why Call Herself a Feminist?

  • Despite the word’s reputational baggage, Adichie insists on labeling herself a feminist to start necessary conversations, albeit at personal cost.
    • "Feminist is a bad word in Nigeria. A feminist is a person who is unhappy, as some people have told me. It's a person who hates men... But feminist is a bad word all over the world, actually." (16:47)

• Nigerian vs. Western Feminism

  • She notes Nigeria’s overlooked tradition of feminist autonomy—counter to the notion that Western feminism is singular.
    • "Western feminism, having been the most documented feminism, can often seem like the only feminism. Right. As though there haven't been movements of sort of insubordinate women in Asia and Latin America and Africa." (17:45)
  • She observes a shift: her mother’s generation, despite cultural limitations, pursued autonomy more freely than Adichie's, which is more preoccupied with marriage.
    • "I sometimes think that my generation, there's a kind of conservative strain that didn't exist 50 years ago, where marriage is what everybody aspires to." (18:19)

• Family Expectations

  • Adichie’s parents were relatively progressive, but marriage was still an expectation after academic achievements.
    • "You get your degree, you get your master's, you get your PhD, you get the husband after the PhD..." (18:48)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "We teach girls to shrink themselves, to make themselves smaller. We say to girls, you can have ambition, but not too much... Because I am female, I am expected to aspire to marriage." — Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie [00:31]
• "I wanted to write about my take on America, and much of it was about race... Writing about race I just found to be dishonest. I would read some fiction and be like, no, right." — Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie [06:34]
• "The left is cannibalistic. It eats its own." — Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie [08:07]
• "It was as though somebody had died. Seriously... it was simply that I didn't use the language I was supposed to use." — Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie on backlash to her comments about trans women [10:56]
• "In Nigeria, there was no reason for me to think of myself as Black... That's when I knew what being black meant. It meant that you're not supposed to write the best essay in class if you're black." — Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie [13:31, 13:50]
• "Feminist is a bad word in Nigeria. A feminist is a person who is unhappy, as some people have told me. It's a person who hates men." — Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie [16:47]
• "Western feminism, having been the most documented feminism, can often seem like the only feminism." — Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie [17:45]

Timestamps of Major Segments

• 00:06 – Introduction by David Remnick
• 01:26 – Adichie’s decision to come to America
• 03:06 – First impressions of Philadelphia and American reality
• 05:07 – Discussion of the purpose of Adichie’s novels and writing vs. publishing
• 06:26 – Meaning of 'fuck you book' and writing about race honestly
• 08:06 – Critique of ideological purity on the left
• 09:49 – Public blowback over transgender women comments
• 12:15 – Speech, censorship, and campus controversies
• 13:29 – Discovery of blackness in America
• 16:47 – Feminism and its perception in Nigeria and the world
• 17:45 – Nigerian feminism vs. Western feminism
• 18:48 – Expectations for women and autonomy in Adichie’s family

Tone and Language

The exchange is candid, insightful, sometimes humorous, and unflinchingly honest. Adichie’s responses are nuanced, often using humor to disarm, but never shying away from serious or controversial topics.

Conclusion

This episode offers a vivid, personal perspective on the immigrant experience, challenges of identity, honesty in art, and the perils and promise of advocacy. Adichie provides invaluable commentary on how cultures and ideologies shape—and sometimes constrain—individuals, especially women and writers.

For more Adichie: Visit newyorker.com and search her renowned TED talk “We Should All Be Feminists.”

Note:
This summary only covers the featured interview with Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie. The latter half of the episode shifts to a music segment with Laura Marling, which is not included in this summary, as per instructions.