Podcast Summary: "How Channel One Keeps the News Safe for Putin"
Podcast: The New Yorker Radio Hour
Host: David Remnick
Guest: Joshua Yaffa, Moscow correspondent for The New Yorker
Release Date: December 9, 2019
Overview
This episode explores the role of Channel One, Russia’s preeminent state television network, in shaping public opinion and protecting the political interests of Vladimir Putin’s government. David Remnick interviews Joshua Yaffa about the influence of Channel One’s CEO, Konstantin Ernst, the evolution of Russian propaganda from Soviet times to the present, and the psychological tactics used to manage information and uncertainty in Russia. The conversation also draws parallels to American media and delves into the complex personal compromises made by those who navigate these political systems.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. The Power and Role of Channel One (00:09–01:21)
- Channel One's Centrality: Described as a combination of NBC, Fox News, MSNBC, and Walt Disney, Channel One is the dominant state broadcaster and cultural powerhouse in Russia.
- Quote [00:43 | Joshua Yaffa]: “Today, Channel One is a bit like NBC, Fox News, MSNBC and Walt Disney all rolled into one. ... It's the channel whose tone, visual tone, cultural and political tone, translates outward and broader into the culture.”
- Cultural Impact: The channel’s reach and influence extend beyond news to entertainment and national identity.
2. Evolution of Russian Propaganda (01:21–02:25)
- Difference from Soviet Era: Soviet propaganda promoted a single, often absurd, truth, but modern Russian propaganda is more sophisticated.
- Modern Tactics: Russian TV now appeals to the pre-existing beliefs of viewers, creating compelling narratives rather than forcing singular truths.
- Quote [01:35 | Joshua Yaffa]: “Soviet propaganda was essentially about convincing the viewer of a single truth at the expense of some other truth... I would say what Channel One does... is first and foremost they appeal to a kind of truth that, that viewers are already inclined to believe.”
3. Konstantin Ernst’s Approach and Influence (02:25–04:18)
- Background: Ernst has roots in show business, art, and counterculture, bringing high production values and artistic sensibility to state television.
- Entertainment and Engagement: He understands the necessity to compete for viewers’ attention, packaging propaganda in attractive, viewer-friendly formats.
- Quote [03:08 | Joshua Yaffa]: “He brought those tastes to state television along with a sense of high production values, quality, a real auteur's eye... to deliver a visual product that was compelling and attractive and that people really wanted to watch.”
4. Information Control in the Digital Age (04:18–07:30)
- Contrast with Other Media: Despite pockets of freer press (e.g., Dozhd TV, Echo of Moscow), television remains tightly controlled.
- Distraction and Confusion as Tactics: Instead of persuading audiences with a single narrative, Channel One deploys a barrage of conflicting stories to exhaust and confuse, ultimately leading viewers to distrust all information.
- Example: MH17 Coverage
- Multiple contradictory theories aired about the 2014 shootdown, muddying the water to the point viewers lose faith in any established narrative.
- Quote [05:11 | Joshua Yaffa]: “The way that Channel One counteracts this loud contradictory informational froth is by actually leaning into it, by throwing up so many contradictory versions of events... the point being not to convince the viewer... but rather to have the viewer become so exhausted, so overwhelmed, so confused that she simply throws her hands up and decides there is no such thing.”
- Example: MH17 Coverage
5. Parallels with American Media (07:30–08:43)
- Echoes in the U.S.: Remnick notes similar strategies in American partisan media (Fox News, Breitbart), where multiple theories and innuendo create confusion rather than clarity.
- Quote [07:30 | David Remnick]: “What you're describing sounds an awful lot like what I see on Fox or read in Breitbart...the way that conspiracy theories have entered the rhetoric not only of right wing media, but also...the President of the United States, who is always using the phrase people are saying, I don't know, but I've heard and all that kind of thing.”
- Unintentional Convergence: Yaffa suggests that American media may have independently gravitated to these confusion tactics, noting their efficacy.
- Quote [08:08 | Joshua Yaffa]: “I don't know exactly the causal relationship. ... We seem to have sadly stumbled upon this approach all on our own. But certainly...I see that exact strategy in play.”
6. Insider Experience on Russian TV (08:43–10:51)
- Yaffa's Own Appearance: Yaffa recalls a combative experience guesting on the Channel One show “Vremya. Time Will Tell,” where he was outnumbered and treated as a rhetorical “piñata.”
- He tried to provoke officials to admit disappointment in Trump’s failure to deliver friendlier U.S.–Russia relations, succeeding in eliciting some reluctant admissions.
- Quote [09:08 | Joshua Yaffa]: “I should say whenever I did go on the show, I was reliably outnumbered five to one, at least by pro Kremlin Russian guests versus me, the lone American who functioned as the kind of birthday party pinata that everyone got a chance to step up and have a whack at.”
7. Compromise and “Prispasoblenets” in Russian Society (10:51–13:13)
- Personal Compromise: Yaffa introduces the Russian concept "prispasobleniets," meaning someone who adapts to survive, shifting positions to fit the prevailing order without firm convictions.
- Quote [11:10 | Joshua Yaffa]: “...it's essentially the act of shifting oneself, one's actions, always managing to know which way the wind is blowing. To not really have deep or heartfelt personal convictions of one's own, but to know how to manipulate and position oneself in whatever system...to extract maximum benefit for oneself.”
- Illustrative Anecdote: Ernst’s negotiations over airing boring government meetings reveal the small, constant compromises that define professional life in Russia, gradually shaping one’s ambitions and ethics.
- Quote [12:10 | Joshua Yaffa]: “You can really come out the other end of those compromises a very different person than when you began.”
Memorable Quotes
- Joshua Yaffa [00:43]: “Channel One is a bit like NBC, Fox News, MSNBC and Walt Disney all rolled into one.”
- Joshua Yaffa [05:11]: “The way that Channel One counteracts...is by leaning into it, by throwing up so many contradictory versions of events...have the viewer become so exhausted, so overwhelmed, so confused that she…decides there is no such thing.”
- Joshua Yaffa [11:10]: “...always managing to know which way the wind is blowing. To not really have deep or heartfelt personal convictions... but to know how to manipulate and position oneself in whatever system or greater order rules the day.”
Segment Timestamps
- 00:09 – 01:21: The importance and reach of Channel One in Russia
- 01:21 – 02:25: Differences between Soviet and modern Russian propaganda
- 02:25 – 04:18: Konstantin Ernst’s unique approach and influence
- 04:18 – 07:30: Information control, digital age, and confusion tactics
- 07:30 – 08:43: Comparisons between Russian and American media strategies
- 08:43 – 10:51: Yaffa’s experience on Russian talk shows and official admissions
- 10:51 – 13:13: The concept of prispasobleniets and the corrosive effects of compromise
Tone & Takeaways
The discussion is nuanced, analytical, and blends reporting with a wry, knowing tone about both Russian and Western politics. It offers a vivid portrait of how sophisticated media manipulation operates, the role of compromise under authoritarianism, and unsettling similarities to emerging trends in Western media. The episode concludes with a reflection on the slow, corrosive effect of everyday compromises on personal and collective integrity, making the subject deeply relatable and urgent.