The New Yorker Radio Hour: Jenin Younes on Threats to Free Speech from the Left and the Right

Episode Date: February 10, 2026
Host: David Remnick
Guest: Jenin Younes, National Legal Director of the American Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee (ADC)

Episode Overview

This episode explores the evolving threats to free speech in America, critically examining how both the political left and right have used (and abused) their power to suppress dissent. David Remnick interviews Jenin Younes—an attorney known for her First Amendment work, including high-profile litigation during the COVID-19 pandemic and current advocacy surrounding Palestine and anti-Semitism laws. They discuss government involvement in social media censorship, shifting attitudes towards free speech over recent decades, and the worrying loss of cultural commitment to open debate.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Government Censorship and Social Media during COVID-19

[03:16–08:07]

• Younes' work on the House Select Committee on the Weaponization of the Federal Government:

  • Focused on investigating "government involvement, especially federal government involvement in social media censorship" (03:19).
  • Examples included the suppression of dissenting views on COVID-19 policy and vaccines.
  • Cited Dr. Martin Kulldorff’s censored tweet saying "children and the naturally immune don’t necessarily need the COVID vaccine" as an example of protected speech potentially stifled due to government pressure (03:46).

• Nature of Government Pressure:

  • Younes referenced email evidence showing social media companies felt compelled to follow government directives, specifically mentioning ex-Facebook executive Nick Clegg questioning "why we were censoring the lab leak theory," to which a colleague replied, "because we were under pressure from the Biden White House. We shouldn’t have done it." (07:42).

2. The Biden Administration’s Justifications and Legal Arguments

[04:46–06:34]

• Government’s Side:

  • Administration claimed their contact was "government speech," not direct censorship.
  • Younes countered: "It can’t cross the line into demanding censorship of other people’s points of view. That’s when you get a First Amendment violation." (04:51).

• Courts’ Limitations on Standing:

  • Supreme Court dismissed the case for lack of standing—a technical legal issue regarding traceable harm.

3. Free Speech Principles and the Testimony of RFK Jr.

[08:07–09:30]

• RFK Jr.’s Passionate Defense:

  • Younes: "I did think it was the best defense of free speech I’d ever heard." (08:22).
  • Remnick quoted RFK Jr.: "You cannot end that polarization by censoring people… I’m telling you, you cannot." (08:44).

• Disappointment in RFK Jr. as HHS Secretary:

  • Younes criticized his subsequent actions threatening funding for universities over insufficient action against antisemitism—alleging "using their power to silence that kind of speech," especially criticism of Israel or in support of Palestinian rights (09:30).

4. Free Speech: Right, Left, and Younes’ Politics

[10:25–14:35]

• Working with Conservatives:

  • Younes: "I may have been a bit naive in that I actually believed some of them believed in free speech." (10:45).
  • She identifies as neither Democrat nor Republican, expressing disenchantment with both parties (11:14).

• Trump, Biden, and Chilling Effects:

  • Remnick observes Trump’s open hostility to press freedoms post-reelection, calling it "unprecedented in American history" (11:26).
  • Younes: "He’s obviously proven… that he’s not even remotely committed to free speech." (12:15).
  • She notes "consequences are so much more extreme… that really has a very strong chilling effect," including deportation policies and fears about participating in protests/social media for non-citizens (13:50–14:07).

5. Current Legal Battles: Anti-Discrimination and Palestine

[17:53–19:12]

• Younes' ADC Role:
  • Leading litigation against California’s AB 715, a new law allegedly "silencing speech that’s critical of Israel" under the guise of anti-antisemitism protections (18:05).
  • Argues it is "void for vagueness" (violates due process because it’s too broad/unclear) and "viewpoint discriminatory" (favors one side of a contentious issue).

6. The Meaning and Limits of Free Speech

[19:12–22:54]

• First Amendment Basics:

  • "The First Amendment prohibits the government from abridging the freedom of speech…generally… political speech is the most important." (19:30).
  • Only a narrow set of exceptions (incitement, threats, etc.).

• The Skokie Case and the Decline of Free Speech Tolerance:

  • Skokie Nazi march as the "high tide" for First Amendment protection (20:58).
  • Rise in societal division and aversion to offensive speech are eroding public support.

• On 'Hate Speech':

  • "I don’t know that there is one definition and it’s not an exception to the First Amendment, despite many misnomers." (21:59).
  • Younes favors the classic "answer to bad speech is better speech" approach.

7. Elon Musk, X (Twitter), and Social Media Moderation

[22:54–24:20]

• Mixed Views:
  • "I still haven’t figured out exactly what I think social media companies’ content moderation policies should be. I mean, it’s not the government, so it’s not subject to the First Amendment…" (23:53).

8. Technology and the First Amendment

[24:20–25:22]

• Recognizes that "the speed with which lies can spread on social media can be very scary and... has real world consequences." (25:04).
• Does not see government censorship as a solution.

9. Policy Recommendations and Rights of Non-Citizens

[25:22–26:31]

• Stresses non-citizens also enjoy First Amendment protections:
  • "It’s not about the citizenship status of the speaker… We should actually want to hear more from people from other countries." (25:32).
• Warns of the danger in targeting immigrants’ speech and the treatment of the press.

10. Both Parties’ Hypocrisy and the Loss of Cultural Commitment

[26:31–28:39]

• "Both parties have a problem with free speech… people in power tend to want to use that power… to suppress speech…" (26:36).
• Describes a "loss of a cultural commitment" and how public tolerance for dissent is weakening.
• Pinpoints decline beginning in the 2010s, with public defenders and progressives embracing the idea of hate speech laws.

Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• On Government Pressure and Social Media:

  • "The person responded, because we were under pressure from the Biden White House. We shouldn’t have done it."
    — Jenin Younes, paraphrasing a Facebook executive’s email (07:42)

• On Defining Free Speech:

  • "It’s something you have to work on and sort of continually remind yourself of the commitment and why we don’t want the government in charge of making decisions about who should be heard and who should be silenced."
    — Jenin Younes (21:36)

• On the Decline of Support for Free Speech:

  • "It sounds good to say you’re for free speech, but it doesn’t really come naturally… Nobody does. I don’t. Sometimes I have to resist my own impulse to want to shut people up."
    — Jenin Younes (21:29)

• On Both Parties’ Hypocrisy:

  • "Both parties have a problem with free speech. And the reason is one the framers identified... people in power tend to want to use that power."
    — Jenin Younes (26:36)

• On Technology’s Effects:

  • "The speed with which lies can spread on social media can be very scary and I think has real world consequences. So I agree with you. I wish I had had the solution. I do not believe that government being involved in censorship is the solution."
    — Jenin Younes (25:04)

Key Segment Timestamps

• [03:16] – Jenin Younes on investigating government pressure on social media moderation during COVID-19
• [07:42] – Email evidence of Biden administration pressure on Facebook
• [08:22] – RFK Jr.’s moving testimony on free speech
• [09:30] – Critique of RFK Jr's performance as HHS Secretary
• [12:15] – Younes on Trump’s assault on the press and chilling effects
• [18:05] – Younes describes anti-Palestinian speech suppression in California
• [19:30] – Explaining the First Amendment’s speech protections and limitations
• [20:58] – The Skokie case as a free speech landmark
• [23:29] – Younes on Elon Musk, X, and the complexity of content moderation
• [25:32] – Emphasis that non-citizens also have First Amendment rights
• [26:36] – On why both political parties succumb to censorship instincts
• [27:27] – Declining support for free speech traced to the 2010s and earlier

Tone and Language

The conversation is intellectually rigorous, candid, and often urgent. Younes and Remnick both speak plainly but with deep legal and historical context, expressing disappointment and concern at the erosion of free speech norms across the American political spectrum.

This episode provides a comprehensive, nuanced overview of First Amendment controversies in recent years, with a crucial look at how societal divisions and the temptations of power threaten the core American value of free speech—from both sides of the aisle.