The New Yorker Radio Hour: "Senator Chris Van Hollen on the Epstein Files, and the Leadership Crisis in Washington"
Original Air Date: November 21, 2025
Host: David Remnick
Guest: Senator Chris Van Hollen (D-Maryland)

Overview

In this episode, David Remnick sits down with Senator Chris Van Hollen to discuss two of the most pressing issues facing Washington: the fallout around the Epstein files and the deepening leadership crisis in both the Republican and Democratic parties. The conversation spans the transparency struggle over the Epstein documents, the dynamics of party discipline, Democratic infighting around Chuck Schumer’s leadership, immigration controversies, and broader questions about the future direction of the Democratic Party.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Epstein Files: Transparency and Political Gamesmanship

• House & Senate Action
  • Both chambers of Congress have nearly unanimously passed legislation to force release of the Epstein files, overcoming strong resistance from President Trump and his allies (02:01–03:58).
• Trustworthiness of the Trump Administration
  • Sen. Van Hollen is deeply skeptical about the Trump White House and DOJ fully complying:

    “I'm not sure we can trust them. In fact, I don't think we can, which is why we have to keep pressing to make sure that they turn over every document.” [03:58]

  • He notes that Trump had the authority to release the documents earlier and only acted under congressional compulsion.
• Scope & Completeness of Files
  • DOJ retains significant unreleased material; the House Judiciary and other committees have partial access, but financial records from the Treasury remain outside current legislation’s reach ([05:00]).
• Potential for Obstruction or Suppression
  • DOJ could suppress or destroy documents unless threatened by legal consequences or whistleblowers with a “principle to uphold the law” come forward ([06:04]).
  • Ongoing investigations could be used as a pretext to stall or avoid full disclosure:

    “All hell will break loose if they do that. And I think the American people, and especially the victims... are going to make sure that these documents ultimately are released.” [06:59–07:47]

2. The Leadership Crisis in Washington

• GOP Conflicts & Trump’s Waning Control
  • Trump’s inability to contain more radical figures like Marjorie Taylor Greene, and divisions over extremism (e.g., Nick Fuentes) signal a fractured movement ([02:01]).
• Democratic Disunity & Leadership Challenges
  • Democratic Party unity is strained—eight Democrats voted with Republicans to end the shutdown, triggering calls for Minority Leader Chuck Schumer’s resignation ([02:01], [10:47]).
  • Van Hollen’s frank assessment:

    “I see [Schumer] as having been effective during the Biden years... But our caucus of what I say is the no business as usual caucus has grown considerably.” [11:29–12:18]

• Debate Over Chuck Schumer’s Leadership
  • While not personally calling for Schumer’s ouster, Van Hollen sees a need for broader unity and accountability:

    “The Democratic Party should make room for lots of different opinions... but when we have a Democratic nominee, we need to back them.” [13:40]

3. Political Norms, the Senate, and the Filibuster

• Republican Silence & Fear
  • GOP Senators privately express concern over “the total nuttiness of this administration” but refuse public opposition due to “political fear of Trump’s retribution” ([15:14–15:26]).
  • Van Hollen’s rebuke:

    “This job's not worth it if you can't look yourself in the mirror... Surrendering your entire vote and soul to Donald Trump is... simply not worth the job.” [15:37–16:02]

• The Filibuster Debate
  • Trump wants to eliminate the filibuster, but Senate Republicans resist, knowing it serves their interests.

    “There are important policy changes we need to make... The super majority requirement has been an obstacle to getting some of those important things done.” [17:01–18:24]

4. The Kilmar Abrego Garcia Case & Broader Immigration Policy

• Van Hollen’s El Salvador Advocacy
  • Details his intervention to secure the release of Maryland man Kilmar Abrego Garcia, wrongfully detained in El Salvador ([22:02–24:34]).
  • Criticizes the Trump administration for constitutional violations and retaliatory prosecutions:

    “He had no idea...he was the subject of a 9 to 0 Supreme Court ruling ordering the Trump administration to facilitate his return. So I was able to call his wife... and say he was alive.” [23:22]

• Vindictive Prosecutions and Broader Patterns
  • Many Marylanders unfairly detained or deported, not just Garcia; sees this as symptomatic of a larger problem ([25:42–26:30]).
• Trump’s Immigration Policy
  • Van Hollen argues that “the cruelty is the point” and rejects the idea that due process violations are popular:

    “What is more American than having your constitutional right to due process protected?” [27:07]

  • Contrasts this with Biden administration’s shortcomings, advocating for both immigration reform and border security.

5. The Future of the Democratic Party

• Emerging Candidates & Party Direction
  • Too early to endorse any 2026 candidates, but stresses Democrats failed to present themselves as the party of change:

    “We better have a damn good answer for [economic pain] in the next one. I have some ideas that I'm going to be... part of the debate as to where the Democratic Party goes.” [28:54–30:00]

• Personal Ambitions
  • Asked if he’s considering a presidential run, Van Hollen deflects but doesn’t rule it out; expresses desire to “stiffen the spine of the Democratic Party” and oppose “powerful special interests” ([30:00–30:47]).
  • Remnick playfully comments: “I've heard firmer no's in my time.” [30:36]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On DOJ Transparency and the Epstein Files
  • “Donald Trump has had the power to release these documents on his own since he was sworn in, and he didn't do it. It required an act of Congress to make him do it.”
    —Sen. Van Hollen [03:58]
• On Bipartisan Cowardice
  • “Surrendering your entire vote and soul to Donald Trump is something that it seems to me is simply not worth the job.”
    —Sen. Van Hollen [15:37]
• On Party Discipline
  • “It cannot just be a big tent when it seems to be politically convenient or personally convenient.”
    —Sen. Van Hollen [14:26]
• On Due Process and Immigration
  • “People across the political spectrum, including Joe Rogan, did care about being deprived of your liberty without due process. I mean, what is more American than having your constitutional right to due process protected?”
    —Sen. Van Hollen [27:07]
• On Democratic Party’s Shortcomings
  • “It is extraordinary that a guy like Donald Trump, this billionaire from New York, became the guy who was going to take on the status quo.”
    —Sen. Van Hollen [28:54]
• On Candidacy
  • “My goal at this moment really is to stiffen the spine of the Democratic Party... not just resistance to Trump, it also means taking on very powerful special interests...”
    —Sen. Van Hollen [30:03]

Important Segment Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |-----------|---------| | 02:01 | Remnick introduces leadership crisis and Epstein files context | | 03:58 | Van Hollen on trust in White House/DOJ to release files | | 06:04 | Potential for DOJ suppression and whistleblower role | | 07:47 | Van Hollen on Democratic strategy versus Trumpian chaos | | 10:07 | On disappointment with Secretary Marco Rubio | | 11:14 | Discussion of Chuck Schumer’s leadership | | 13:40 | Van Hollen: “Big tent” but need to back nominees | | 15:14 | Republicans confide in private but don’t act publically | | 17:01 | Filibuster debate | | 22:02 | Garcia and El Salvador intervention story begins | | 27:07 | Van Hollen on the centrality of due process | | 28:54 | Conversation shifts to future of Democratic Party | | 30:03 | Van Hollen on his role within the party/possible candidacy |

Tone & Language

The tone is frank, measured, and often critical. Both Remnick and Van Hollen combine policy detail with occasional flashes of exasperation at the state of American politics. There is a sense of urgency and frustration throughout, especially regarding congressional dysfunction, Trump’s enduring influence, and the struggle for accountability and transparency.

This summary provides a comprehensive breakdown of the episode's rich political discussion and should serve as a guide for anyone wishing to understand the critical dynamics shaping Washington as explored by David Remnick and Senator Van Hollen.