Podcast Summary: The New Yorker Radio Hour – "The Long-Distance Con, Part 2"

Host: David Remnick | Date: October 9, 2018
Produced by: WNYC Studios and The New Yorker

Overview

In Part 2 of "The Long-Distance Con," Maggie Robinson Katz continues her deeply personal investigation into the extraordinary scam that ensnared her late father, Terry Robinson. Despite being a savvy and successful businessman, Terry lost hundreds of thousands of dollars—and ultimately his family's financial future—in a long-running, fantastical scheme involving claims of hidden Filipino gold and U.S. bonds. Maggie travels to Manila to confront Jim Stuckey, her father's business partner and possible con man, while wrestling with the psychological complexities of trust, belief, and denial that underpin such deceptions. Along the way, the episode explores the blurred line between perpetrator and victim.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. A Scam of Fantastical Proportions

• [00:19] The episode opens with recorded calls between Terry Robinson and Jim Stuckey, setting up the bizarre nature of the con: a $70,000 "accumulated charge" to access supposed riches.
• [01:22] Jim makes outlandish claims: "20 to 25 trillion dollars, counting the value of gold and diamonds and cash and all these other things."
• [01:38] The scam fits a familiar pattern: tall tales of hidden WWII-era treasure in the Philippines, tribal guardians, official-looking but dubious documents, and urgent demands for ever more money.

David Remnick: "Stuckey said he was involved in a project to get US Bonds, currency and gold bullion out of the Philippines... It’s very much like a number of scams based in the Philippines, including ones investigated by the U.S. Secret Service." [01:38]

2. The Human Cost: Family and Inheritance Lost

• [02:27] Terry’s daughter, Maggie, and widow are left nearly destitute.
• [02:40] Maggie Robinson Katz: "After he died, I found out he sent him another 14,000, and we didn’t have 14,000."
• The episode highlights the emotional fallout—the bewilderment and anger of surviving family members.

3. Expert Caution and Psychological Manipulation

• Maggie consults Maria Konnikova, a con expert and author, who warns her of the dangers and manipulations inherent in meeting a career scammer.

Maria Konnikova: "Don’t underestimate old men... If you think they have end of life regrets, think again. And don’t let your guard down—the con works when objectivity breaks down." [03:22, 03:46]

4. Journey to Manila: Investigating the Reality

• [04:21] Maggie, her husband Ben, and producer Daniel fly to Manila, anxious but determined to track down Stuckey and find out the truth.
• They hire local driver Baboy, who is unwittingly connected to the Filipino treasure-hunting culture.

Baboy: "You cannot find the gold if you’re greedy. You have to have a clean heart to get this gold." [07:15]

• Maggie realizes how embedded these legends are—and how many locals have been caught up in similar schemes.

5. Encounter with the Treasure-Hunting Underworld

• The team meets Henry Rojas, son of a famous (and real) Filipino treasure hunter, who shares stories of endless fruitless searching and skepticism toward others who claim to have found riches.

Henry Rojas: "You should have been fucking rich right now. And you’ve been doing that ever since... 25 years and finding nothing but helmets and lamps." [11:59]

• The pattern: years of hope, stories, and artifacts of little value—never the promised gold.

6. The Vigilant and Nervous Search for Jim Stuckey

• Maggie and her team conduct security checks, mindful of expert advice to meet in a public, safe area, accompanied by security guards.

Daniel Guimet: "The most common threat in Manila traffic, so-called tandem motorcycle riding. ...one driver and one shooter coming up on the side of the car." [14:17]

• The tension builds as they spot and mistakenly approach suspicious older white men in opulent hotel lobbies—false leads that amplify the anxiety and surreal tone.

7. Confronting Jim Stuckey

• Ultimately, Maggie meets Jim Stuckey, who, at 92, is nearly blind but agrees to a frank interview.

Jim Stuckey: "Well, all of this really started back when God created the world." [19:29]

• Stuckey spins grandiose tales, invoking biblical myths (the Ark of the Covenant, millions of tons of gold), and claims his and Terry’s work transitioned from "profit-motivated to humanitarian."
• When directly asked, he repeatedly denies "conning" Terry but remains evasive about details and deflects responsibility.

Maggie Robinson Katz: "Did you con my dad?"
Jim Stuckey: "I guess that would depend on the definition of con... Did we get into things that did not work out? Yes." [24:13]
Maggie: "Did you con him?"
Jim: "No. Is that a straight enough answer?" [24:52]

• Despite everything, Jim claims Terry's money "will be multiple times repaid," echoing the false hope that kept the con alive.

8. The Aftermath and Emotional Reckoning

• Maggie reflects on the deep psychological pull of the scam, both on her father and on herself:

Maggie Robinson Katz: "I just wanted Jim to convince me, even for a moment, that the gold bullion and the treasury bonds and the caves filled with cash were real so I could get why my dad believed him for so long." [27:57]

• She revisits old recordings—heartbreakingly, her father felt alone, ashamed, and unable to admit failure to his family.

Terry Robinson (call): "Even though none of them are going to be talking to me... just alone." [28:35]

• Maggie’s brother, Patrick, voices the family’s regret:

Patrick (Maggie's brother): "I just wish you just would have been like, I’m doing bad... Money doesn’t define us as a family." [28:57]

9. Another Victim: Stuckey’s Stepdaughter

• Maggie speaks with Julia, Jim’s stepdaughter, who reveals her own family was bled for money by Jim’s schemes.
  • Julia’s mother was driven to financial ruin, clinging to hope and love for Jim.
  • Julia summed up the damage:

Julia: "He wasted his beautiful life, you know, chasing dreams for me. That’s what I think. Chasing something that does not exist." [33:19]

• Yet Julia struggles with the possibility that Jim is both a grifter and a true believer:

Julia: "Maybe I don’t want to believe that he took my mother and all of us for a ride... But don’t chase, don’t dig. It was, it went, it’s not coming back." [33:44]

• Maggie ends with defiant determination: she will keep digging for answers to find meaning in what happened to her father.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "Somewhere in the vicinity of 20 to 25 trillion dollars, counting the value of gold and diamonds and cash and all these other things."
  — Jim Stuckey ([01:25])

• "You cannot find the gold if you’re greedy. You have to have a clean heart to get this gold."
  — Baboy ([07:15])

• "I guess that would depend on the definition of con... Did we get into things that did not work out? Yes."
  — Jim Stuckey ([24:13])

• "My dad died with almost nothing, and he lied about his losses to the people who loved him most."
  — Maggie Robinson Katz ([28:07])

• "He wasted his beautiful life, you know, chasing dreams for me. That’s what I think. Chasing something that does not exist."
  — Julia, Jim’s stepdaughter ([33:19])

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:19 – Introduction to Terry’s phone calls with Jim Stuckey
• 01:38 – Explanation of the scam and background on Stuckey
• 02:27-03:30 – The financial and emotional toll on Terry’s family
• 04:21-07:22 – Arrival in Manila and immersion in treasure-hunter culture
• 11:14-12:13 – Probing the realities of Filipino treasure hunting with Henry Rojas
• 14:17-15:47 – Security preparations to meet Jim
• 17:54-21:05 – Maggie’s meeting with Jim Stuckey: his story, deflections, and denials
• 24:07-25:04 – Direct questions about the con and Stuckey’s responses
• 27:04-28:57 – Maggie’s aftermath, family reflections, and confronting loss
• 29:29-34:23 – Julia (Jim’s stepdaughter) recounts her family’s entanglement and disillusionment

Conclusion

"The Long-Distance Con, Part 2" is a powerful exploration of the human stories behind elaborate scams—the hope, shame, and confusion of victims; the ambiguous morality and reality distortion of perpetrators; and the devastation left in their wake. Maggie’s journey becomes not just a search for truth, but an act of reclaiming family memory and dignity. The episode skillfully blends investigative journalism, emotional honesty, and cultural observation, revealing how vulnerable anyone can be to the promise of riches and the manipulation of trust.