172. ACT for OCD: The "Observer Self" Hack to Stop Intrusive Thoughts

Summary

The OCD Whisperer Podcast with Kristina Orlova

Episode 172: ACT for OCD – The "Observer Self" Hack to Stop Intrusive Thoughts
Guest: Dr. Marisa Maza
Date: February 20, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this third installment of a four-part series, host Kristina Orlova and guest Dr. Marisa Maza explore key concepts from Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (ACT) for OCD, focusing on "present moment awareness" and "self as context," sometimes called the "observer self." They break down practical strategies for responding to intrusive thoughts, explain the purpose and application of the observer self, and respond to common listener questions about the overwhelming nature of OCD and mindfulness. The conversation is warm, practical, and packed with takeaways for those struggling to stay present while living with OCD.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. What Does "Being Present" Mean for Someone with OCD?

• Challenge of Being Present
  People with OCD often feel that being present is impossible due to the constant barrage of obsessions and compulsions. Kristina highlights the frequent listener confusion:

  “When they hear the word be present, they really can feel like this is a task that’s just too difficult to do because I’ve got too many obsessions or my compulsions are taking over.” (01:00)

• Dr. Maza on Present Moment Awareness
  You don’t need to be present 100% of the time. The point is gentle noticing:

  “It’s totally normal for the mind to wander during that act. ... The point is, is just to simply notice. Oh, wow, I’m future tripping right now ... and then ever so gently bringing yourself back to the here and now.” (02:11)

• Practical Mindfulness Exercise: 5-4-3-2-1 Technique
  Dr. Maza describes using sensory anchors to ground oneself:

  • 5 things you can see
  • 4 things you can feel (tactile, e.g. bracelet, hands, feet on ground)
  • 3 things you hear
  • 2 things you smell
  • 1 thing you taste (03:32)

2. Tailoring Mindfulness When Internal Focus Is Overwhelming

• If internal sensations are too intense (“I feel anxiety, like I’m going to crawl out of my skin”), redirect to tactile sensations:

  “What does my bracelet feel like as I rub it between my fingers? Or what do my feet feel like on the ground?” (03:47)

• For some, focusing on the breath or the feeling of feet on the ground works as an anchor (04:09).
• It’s normal for the mind to wander; practicing for even 1-2 minutes a day is beneficial (05:45).

3. Overcoming Overwhelm: Building Mindfulness Tolerance

• Start with brief practices—just 30 seconds to a minute (06:54).
• Try mindful movement, walking, yoga, or stretching, especially if you have excess energy or co-occurring ADHD (07:05).
• “There’s no right or wrong way to do this... This is hard. Having OCD is hard, but practicing present moment is hard.” (07:38)
• Use self-compassion:

  “Place your hand on your heart, say, this is a really, really hard moment. And it’s okay that I’m feeling anxious and it’s okay that I’m struggling.” (08:13)

4. Validating and Accepting Difficult Experiences

• Acknowledge what’s happening without trying to make it go away. This is not reassurance, but honest validation:

  “We’re not talking about reassurance. Like, you know, oh, it’s okay, I’m going to be okay. We’re talking about just owning and acknowledging what is here.” (08:36)

• Noticing what’s present allows for greater acceptance:

  “When we’re present, we’re able to say, oh, like there’s anger here or there’s frustration here, or there’s some kind of pain here. Right. What could it look like if I were willing to just experience this a little bit more than what I typically would?” (09:08)

5. The "Observer Self" / Self as Context

• Definition: The observer self is the part of you that notices your thoughts, feelings, urges, etc., without being defined by them (10:09).

  “Our observer self is the part of us that can kind of notice all of those experiences. So it’s bigger than any one experience." (10:09)

• Metaphor: The sky (observer self) vs. the weather (thoughts/feelings). The sky contains all weather, but is unchanged by it (10:45).

• For OCD: You are not your OCD. OCD is just one aspect of a much larger self. You have many identities, values, and life roles:

  “OCD is a part of you, but it’s not the whole you. ... Notice that there is a part of you that’s bigger than any one of these experiences.” (12:11)

• Zoom Out, Don’t Zoom In: OCD pulls you into the details. The observer self reminds you of your full self, including experiences beyond OCD (13:16).

6. How to Practice Self as Context / Observer Self

• It is not just about understanding, but practicing noticing from the observer perspective, even for a minute a day (14:01).
• Metaphor: Watch the tennis match (thoughts/urges) from the stands, rather than being trapped as a player on the court (14:47).

7. Applying These Skills During a Trigger

• Step 1: Notice and acknowledge—“This is a moment of suffering, the OCD is really loud” (16:58).

• Step 2: Diffusion Statement—"I’m noticing the OCD saying that..." or "I’m noticing the thought that..." (17:27).

• Step 3: Create space—observe your thoughts, but redirect some attention to sensory experiences (e.g., enjoying your meal, listening to friends) (17:37).

• Step 4: With this distance, you gain choice:

  “Can I also notice that besides this thought, here I am, I’m at a dinner table and really enjoying this steak or french fry, whatever it is.” (17:37)

• Over time, this noticing and naming interrupts the automatic spiral:

  “That gives you that kind of little leverage there, like a little buffer to say, yeah, wait a second. My brain is producing this thing called thoughts, which is what brains do, and I don’t have to then be so wrapped in it.” (18:21)

8. The Power and Freedom of Defusion

• Creating this distance lets you decide how to respond instead of compulsively reacting:

  “By creating distance... it then gives you that choice of like, okay, how do I want to proceed? ...That can be so freeing because oftentimes OCD doesn’t feel like a choice.” (19:58)

• Defusion is the process of unsticking yourself from your thoughts and moving into choice and self-compassion, or a values-based action (16:01).

9. Final Thoughts

• Practice, not Perfection:
  Kristina:

  “It’s not like some perfect science, but from what I hear, it’s. If we get better at that, it gives you more leverage.” (21:04)

• Capacity for Growth:
  Dr. Maza:

  “With practice and time, we get to know... that you are capable of having all of your experiences and still living a present full life.” (21:13)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Observer Self:

  “The observer self can be viewed as sort of like the sky, and our experiences can be viewed as the weather.”
  — Dr. Marisa Maza (10:09)

• On Facing Overwhelm:

  “Having OCD is hard, but practicing present moment is hard. ...Try a little bit of self compassion. Place your hand on your heart, say, this is a really, really hard moment.”
  — Dr. Marisa Maza (07:38)

• On Defusion:

  “‘I’m noticing the OCD saying that...’ Just simply by adding those words in front… allows us to create a little bit of space and choice.”
  — Dr. Marisa Maza (17:37)

• On OCD and Identity:

  “OCD is a part of you, but it’s not the whole you.”
  — Dr. Marisa Maza (12:11)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Present Moment Practice & 5-4-3-2-1 Exercise: 02:11–04:09
• Handling Overwhelm with Self-Compassion: 06:54–08:13
• Validating Experience (not Reassurance): 08:36–09:08
• Defining Observer Self/Self as Context: 10:09–10:54
• Applying Observer Self with OCD Intrusions: 11:26–12:11
• Practicing the Skills/Metaphor Use: 14:01–16:01
• Real-Time Use of Defusion and Noticing at Triggers: 16:58–18:21
• Summary of Gaining Leverage & Freedom: 19:58–21:13

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Conclusion

This episode demystifies ACT strategies for OCD, breaking down self as context and present moment awareness into small, achievable steps. Kristina and Dr. Maza balance clinical wisdom with lived experience, repeatedly emphasizing that even a moment of mindful noticing provides leverage against OCD’s patterns. Their metaphors—being the sky, not the weather; or standing in the stands, not stuck on the court—make ACT concepts accessible. Listeners walk away with practical skills and reassurance that change, while gradual, is absolutely possible.

For more from Dr. Maza: choicetherapy.net
For Kristina’s resources: corresults.com

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Transcript

[Christina Orlova]

Welcome to OCD Whispered podcast. So today, guys, we are in our third out of four episode series with Dr. Marisa Maza. And we're going to be talking about self as context and present moment awareness. And what does that mean? How do you even do something like that? So by the end of today's episode, you will have more clarity and understanding. So welcome to the show, Dr. Marisa Maza.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here.

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

Hi, I'm Christina Orlova, host of the OCD Whisperer podcast. As someone who lives with ocd, I understand the struggles firsthand. If you're here, you're not alone. Before we start, grab your free OCD survival kit at www.corresults.com to help you take control. That's K O R results dot com. Now let's dive into today's episode.

[Christina Orlova]

Awesome. So I, I think I'm, you know, I don't want to waste time. I want to kind of dive right into this because I know for sure. I hear, and even in DMs, often I get comments like, you know, how am I supposed to be present? What are you talking about? Right. With OCD can feel nearly impossible. So I have some questions that are kind of ready for you, and I'm going to read it as is one at a time. So the first question really is this. Someone with ocd, when they hear the word be present, they really can feel like this is a task that's just too difficult to do because I've got too many obsessions or my compulsions are taking over. My day is completely kind of overtaken by this. My heart is, you know, pounding out of my chest. I can't be present to that. So I kind of want to know, like, if it feels even scary or threatening to be present. How can somebody engage in that, you know, present awareness concept from act in a way that actually can. Can help them, I guess, be in the moment, right versus what I know I've certainly heard a lot of people do is I'm trying to do that, but they instead end up compulsing like they're hyper aware or they're overly checking or constantly ask, okay, am I present? Am I present? Or okay, I hope I'm present. And maybe by doing that, I'm gonna make all the stuff go away. So what's your take on that?

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

And present moment is all about sort of just being in the here and now, right? So noticing what's showing up for us internally, what's happening around us externally. And we don't have to be present 100% of the time. I don't think most people. People are. But really the goal with. With ACT is to just simply notice what's happening inside and around us. Even just a few times a day is great. And it will. It's totally normal for the mind to wander during that act. Right? It's going to wander. Different experiences are going to happen. But the point is, is just to simply notice. Oh, wow, I'm future tripping right now. Oh, wow. I'm like, rum right now. And I'm focused on, you know, criticizing myself or whatever it is. And then ever so gently bringing yourself back to the here and now. And there's a number of different ways one can do that. One of my favorite exercises is like, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Where you just simply notice. What are five things surrounding you right now? What are four things you felt feel right now? What are three things you hear right now? What are two things you smell? What's one thing you taste?

[Christina Orlova]

Right.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Okay, I gotta jump in and ask

[Christina Orlova]

you a question, because I know people with OCD are gonna be like, this is like a little alarm gonna go off. What do you mean, four things I feel? Right? Because I could say, well, I feel anxiety. I feel like I'm gonna crawl out of my skin. I feel scared.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Yeah, yeah. So if going inward to internal experiences feels, like, overwhelming, what I would suggest is doing more tactile feeling. So, for example, like, what does my bracelet feel like as I rub it between my fingers? Or what does my hand feel like as I rub it against my. My pant thigh?

[Christina Orlova]

Right.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

What do my feet feel like on the ground? What do my hands feel like as I touch them together? Right. Noticing the temperature, the texture, the colors of things, what you hear. Right. The earthiness and smells or the sweetness and smells. Right. And so these are just ways to. To throw yourself into the moment, into the here and now. If going inward isn't overwhelming for you, for some folks, it's not. You can also use your breath as your anchor. For example, noticing the rising and falling of the belly and chest with every inhalation, every exhalation. Right. A lot of my clients do also. Like noticing feet touching the ground or your bottom touching your chair. Right. Anchoring them into the ground, into the here and now. With ocd, the mind is just so good at pulling folks into the future and into the past that the person misses out on what's happening here and now in this very moment. And so the idea is to ever so Gently bring yourself back into the moment, either using your senses or the breath or just noticing your feet on the ground. And again, you're not going to stay there forever, but you just simply notice it for however long you choose to practice. Maybe it's one or two minutes a day, a couple times a day. And during that process, when your mind wanders, just gently bringing it back.

[Christina Orlova]

So can I ask? Because, I mean, I personally love it. I've definitely done some mindfulness practices, different meditation practices, and it depends, right. Like, sometimes I love guided things. Sometimes I love that the 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. I've definitely used it. I'm a big fan and I've loved at times being able to like, curl my toes and feel my, my feet on the floor and what that feels like. Because sometimes the internal kind of anxiety is a little, you know, in the past would be really high. And then other times being able to say, oh, today I can breathe a little more into my belly and kind of feel it. So I'm a fan of all these things I want to ask you, you know, because. And I'm sure you get this as well. You know, for those folks where they're, they're finding it hard because it's almost like being with it all can just feel so overwhelming and scary. Right. What would you recommend they do? Or how can they break something like this down? I guess. Right, that, that, you know, like, you're saying that they can kind of build that tolerance up.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Yeah, yeah. So I think one would be finding, you know, an amount of time that feels reasonable for you. If it's 30 seconds or a minute, um, that's one way to do it. Another way to do it is find a, A, like a present moment or mindful activity that, that works for you. So maybe you try 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Or you try a breath. You try someone guiding you through it. Um, for a lot of the folks I work with, some of them have ADHD and O, C, D. And so incorporating some kind of movement can work well if you're someone who has a little extra energy in you. So even a slow, mindful type of Y or stretching can be another way to sort of get into your body. A slow, mindful walking, for example, just noticing every time your right foot hits your right heel hits the ground as you're. You're going for a walk and recognizing that, like, there's no, there's no right or wrong way to do this. Right. So be kind to yourself in this process. Like, this is hard. Having OCD is hard, but practicing present moment is hard. And so I always say, like, when you're really stuck with something, try a little bit of self compassion. Place your hand on your heart, say, this is a really, really hard moment. And it's okay that I'm feeling anxious and it's okay that I'm struggling. Right. Offering yourself that kind of love and then maybe try it again, but maybe you can try it in a different way, in a way that feels a little bit softer, kinder, slower.

[Christina Orlova]

Yeah, I love that. And, and I love what you're saying. Right. Because I think, I think there is, there's something to be said for, you know, let's validate for ourselves and normalize. Like, look, this is where I'm at right now. And this, this sucks. It, you know, it's uncomfortable. I don't like it. Like, that's the reality. We're not talking about reassurance. Like, you know, oh, it's okay, I'm going to be okay. We're talking about just owning and acknowledging what is here. And, and so I think that's a really powerful strategy, frankly. Right. Because when we don't acknowledge it, then what are we doing? Well, we're trying to fight it. I think we're trying to push it away. We're trying to do something else with it.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Exactly. Yeah, exactly, exactly. And present moment really allows us to recognize, like, what, what is here to accept. Right. When we're present, we're able to say, oh, like there's anger here or there's frustration here, or there's some kind of pain here. Right. What could it look like if I were willing to just experience this a little bit more than what I typically would.

[Christina Orlova]

I love that. Well, I want to then with that kind of take it to the next question I have, which is part of today's topic, because I'd love to understand this more, and I know the audience would too. So we're talking about self as context. So I want to ask you if you can explain that. Like, so for someone with a city who feels really fearful, confused with their thoughts, right? Like the, like this thought says something true about me. How. How could you use that concept of self as context to essentially kind of separate or, or see something different? So what first, what is self like? What does that concept mean? And then how can somebody actually use it?

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

So I like to think of self as context, as sort of the observer self, if you will. As humans, we have lots of different experiences. We have thoughts, we have feelings, we have urges, we have values. We have roles and purposes in life, right? And our observer self is the part of us that can kind of notice all of those experiences. So it's bigger than any one experience. For example, like, the observer self can be viewed as sort of like the sky, and our experiences can be viewed as the weather, right?

[Christina Orlova]

So the.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

The. The wind, the storms, the rain, the sky is. Is stable and never really changes.

[Christina Orlova]

Right.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Whereas the weather is constantly coming and going and changing and doing its thing. Right? And so it's really that part of us that recognizes the different sorts of experiences that are showing up. So even right now, you can tap into your observer by noticing that there's a part of you that recognizes that you're here listening to this podcast. There's a part of me that can recognize I'm sitting here talking to you, Christina, here and now.

[Christina Orlova]

Yes. So then how does somebody with OCD apply that, I guess, right. When they're having a lot of thoughts? Because again, that's another common thing that happens is people have a ton of thoughts, or they start to really question their thoughts or, you know, or they see something, you know, visual in their head, and they're like, oh, my gosh, this all must mean something. Or, you know, this must mean something about me. Or, you know, they start to question, like, does this is. Maybe that's something I secretly want, even though I don't, but maybe I do, right? So we start to doubt things. And so how could you then apply what you just said to something like that to help people kind of create a little bit of that space?

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

OCD is a part of you, but it's not the whole you. Right? Take a moment to think about the other aspects of who you are. Think about all the things in your life that give you a sense of purpose. Right? Think about all the roles you play in your life. Daughter, son, husband, wife, partner, friend, co worker. Think about all of your values, the courage, the kindness, the love. Think about all of the life experiences you've had. And also think about some of the obsessions and urges and compulsions you've experienced. And notice that there is a part of you that's bigger than any one of these experiences is meaning that, like you, you are so much more than your ocd. This is just one part of you, and it doesn't have to dictate who you are.

[Christina Orlova]

Yeah, I love what you're saying. It's like zooming out a bit. Because ocd, I think, has us overly zoom in onto, like, you know, any. The tiniest detail. And then Start to treat that as the whole. And you're saying, like, hang on, let's step back for a second and let's remember all these other things of who you are and what. Like, how you've lived and the things that you care about and maybe the heartaches you've had, the blessings you've had, the. The laughs, the cries. Right. All of it. And the intrusive thoughts to reconnect and remember, like, yeah. All of that is actually the more full picture of you not. Right. Not that one tiny speck you just fixated on.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. It allows us to sort of step back and recognize that we're complex. Like, we're so much more than anyone. Any one experience.

[Christina Orlova]

Totally. I mean, yeah. I mean, I think too, like, you know, when you're talking, I think these concepts, like, the concept is one thing, but like you said, kind of the practice is where it's at. It's not like there can be a lack of understanding this. It's more, I gotta sit down and actually do it, like you said, even if it's a minute or two, but doing it and seeing what happens and then doing it over time, that's probably where you start to see stuff, I would assume.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Absolutely.

[Christina Orlova]

With.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Yes. With practice, with time. And sort of noticing the struggle. Right. So for some of my clients, noticing when the OCD is giving you an obsession or an urge, Right. And notice that pull to respond. Right. And then notice what the OCD says and notice that pull to respond. Right. And so it's almost like watching, like, a tennis match going sort of back and forth. Right. And you can kind of be the player in the match or you can be in the stands watching the game.

[Christina Orlova]

I love your metaphors. I mean, I know. I know Acceptance therapy is really kind of known, and it has a reputation for metaphor use. I think it's extremely helpful because as humans, we learn best through stories, of course. And I think metaphors are one way, and I just love that because I think it gives it a better access to saying, oh, yeah, let me be the sky, not the weather. Right. Let me be. Let me watch the game. Not suddenly act like I'm smack in the middle of the game. And. And now I can't see anything other than, oh, my God, this ball is being hurled at me, let's say.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Right. Right. Yeah. And I think being able to step back from our experiences in this way then gives a choice of, like, okay, well, how do I want to respond? Right. Do I want to play the game? Do I Want to continue to be the weather or do I want to choose something else? Maybe acceptance or self compassion or a values based behavior here.

[Christina Orlova]

Love it. I love that. Okay, so that leads me then to my last question for you, which is in the moment. Right. Like somebody's triggered, let's say at a restaurant or driving or I don't know, let's say they're laying in bed. So, okay, what does act ask them to do differently if we're going to apply this present moment and kind of selfish context? So there's in the middle of the, you know, dinner or again, they're. They're driving. Right. Or maybe it's nighttime, they're like getting ready for bed and then things are up. So how can these be applied in any one of those scenarios? What would Axe say? Here's what we want you to do.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Yeah. So one is just noticing like this is a moment of suffering here.

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

Right.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

The OCD is really loud. So one is just acknowledging that. Right. That fosters that diffusion that we were talking about earlier. Right. Recognizing this is an OCD moment. This is really hard. Right. And then noticing like, what is the OCD actually saying here? Like, what's the worst fear? What's the worst case scenario? And can we acknowledge that the OCD is saying this?

[Christina Orlova]

Right.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

And so some clients will put it into a bit of a script. For example, like I'm noticing the OCD saying that or I'm noticing the thought that.

[Christina Orlova]

Right.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Just simply by adding those words in front of allows us to create a little bit of space and choice of like, what to do next. Right. Can I also notice that besides this thought, here I am, I'm at a dinner table and really enjoying this steak or french fry, whatever it is. Right. And I'm also noticing like the person in front of me, what they look like I'm listening to what they're saying. Right. And so can I notice all of the experiences that are showing up while stepping back from the thought thoughts, recognizing that they're not necessarily the truth? It may feel like they are. Right. But we know that our minds are faulty.

[Christina Orlova]

Yeah. So I think when I'm listening to you, it kind of, if I'm going to recap what, what I'm really getting from this and for folks listening is that, you know, being, bringing awareness and noticing is really integral in this work. And that is, that is an intervention, that is a strategy is to, to, to bring your full kind of awareness into that moment. And then number two is literally being able to verbally give yourself Like a little reminder, almost like a prompt with some of the words you gave as an example, that that helps you remember. Right. My OCD brain is saying that, or I'm having a thought that. And over time. Because that does that. That gives you that kind of little leverage there, like a little buffer to say, yeah, wait a second. My brain is producing this thing called thoughts, which is what brains do, and I don't have to then be so wrapped in it. And then if I notice that and name it like that, then. Then it's like this little opening gets created where, okay, I can now take a moment to decide what do I want to do? Do I really want to, like, deep dive into more compulsion? Or like you said, is this where. Okay, can I be a little bit kinder to myself? Or is this where maybe I want to delay or interrupt the compulsion? Maybe you decide to do an exposure and response prevention or. I think you also mentioned, like, you know, some values and stuff, which we'll get into that in our next and final episode. But we're going to talk a bit more, too, about how to use values and kind of taking action in that way versus ocd.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Absolutely. By creating distance, distance between your thoughts and your experiences, it then gives you that choice of like, okay, how do I want to proceed? Right. Do I want to continue to spiral into this experience or choose something different? Right. And for folks with ocd, that can be so freeing because oftentimes OCD doesn't feel like a choice. Right. It feels like I have to do this and that. That is the case when we're fused.

[Christina Orlova]

Right.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

But when one is able to sort of defuse and step back and observe and say, well, I'm noticing this experience, experience, they then have the freedom to choose what to do next.

[Christina Orlova]

I mean, again, I. I personally love this because I think it's so. It's such a underused tool and something we don't historically all learn unless you're, you know, practicing meditation for eons. But this whole concept of, you know, observing your experience, observing your internal states without kind of getting swept up by them, and, you know, that's not always easy to do, and we're all human and, you know, we are getting out of.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Right.

[Christina Orlova]

Like you said, it's not like some perfect science, but from what I hear, it's. If we get better at that, it gives you more leverage.

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

Absolutely. I think with practice and time, we get to know, like, what we are truly capable of, that you can notice the mind, you can notice your experience. Experiences and whatever worst case scenario is brewing up there, right? May not happen. Or if it does, you will ultimately still learn that you're capable like you are capable of having all of your experiences and still living a present full life.

[Christina Orlova]

I love that. That's a beautiful place to finish for the day. And I just want to say thank you for coming on and talking about this and explaining these concepts a little bit more. And if folks would like to find you, how can they find you?

[Dr. Marisa Maza]

They can go to my [e-mail] thanks so much for having me.

[Christina Orlova]

Thank you.

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

Thanks for listening to the OCD Whisperer podcast. Remember, freedom from OCD is a journey

[Christina Orlova]

and you're not alone.

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

Visit www.coraresults.com to explore self help masterclasses like Sneaky Ritual with Jenna Overbaugh or ICBT Masterclass with Christina Inabe. Don't forget to grab your OCD CBT journal tracker and planner while you're there. If you found this episode helpful, please subscribe, share and leave a five star review to help others find the podcast. Together we can make a difference. Keep going and I'll see you in the next episode.