The Official Gilded Age Podcast: “The Gilded Age as We Have Found It” – Episode Summary

Release Date: August 13, 2025
Guest Speakers: Kelli O’Hara, Dr. Stanley Burns, and John Carrafa
Hosts: Alicia Malone (Turner Classic Movies) and Tom Meyers (The Bowery Boys Podcast)

Introduction

In this special bonus episode of The Official Gilded Age Podcast, hosts Alicia Malone and Tom Meyers reflect on Season Three of HBO's The Gilded Age. This episode serves as a comprehensive wrap-up, delving into the overarching themes, memorable character journeys, hidden historical references, and behind-the-scenes insights. Additionally, the hosts engage in exclusive interviews with key contributors—Actress Kelli O’Hara, Medical Consultant Dr. Stanley Burns, and Choreographer John Carrafa—to provide listeners with a deeper understanding of the show's intricate production elements.

Season Three Overview and Major Themes

Tom Meyers begins by summarizing the expansive journeys of the show's characters:

• Gladys Russell becomes a duchess.
• Aurora Fane undergoes a forced divorce.
• Jack Trenor transforms into a wealthy inventor.
• Ada Russell steps up as the new head of the household.
• Additional arcs include Oscar finding his softer side, Maude Beaton's reappearance, Trent Ford's storyline, Bertha Russell taking over Mrs. Astor's ball, Mrs. Winterton becoming a widow, and Ward McAllister being pushed out of society. The inclusion of the Haymarket also adds political and social drama to the narrative.

Alicia Malone prompts a discussion on the season's central themes:

1. Love and Marriage: The exploration of marriages for love versus those arranged for strategic purposes. Multiple proposals and a grand wedding underscore this theme.

   • Tom Meyers: “Who gets to marry for love? Who gets pushed into marriage because of outside sort of strategic purposes.” [03:02]

2. Divorce: Introduced early with Aurora's husband Charles demanding a divorce, and further developed through Charlotte Drayton and the strained marriage between George and Bertha Russell.

   • Alicia Malone: “We saw the other side of marriage, which is divorce.” [03:23]

3. Ambition: Highlighted through characters like Mrs. Kirkland and Bertha Russell, whose high ambitions for their children lead to familial conflicts.

   • Tom Meyers: “Bertha's character, two very ambitious women who had big ambitions for their own children.” [04:12]

4. Progressive Causes: The season delves into temperance, suffrage, and black rights, featuring events like Peggy’s lecture in Newport advocating for African American rights.

   • Alicia Malone: “We went to temperance meetings and suffrage meetings, and we witnessed a talk given by PEGG in Newport about fighting for black rights.” [04:26]

5. Trust and Honesty: Explored through the relationship between Larry and Marian Larian.

   • Tom Meyers: "Trust was very important this season and honesty." [04:44]

6. Power Dynamics: A recurring question throughout the season is, “Who is in charge?”

   • Alicia Malone: “Who's in charge here? That was the name of episode one of season three. And honestly, I feel like that expression could be applied to this entire season.” [04:54]

Character Journeys

Most Intriguing Journeys:

• Aunt Ada Russell (Ada):
  Tom Meyers selects Ada's transformation into the head of the household as the most intriguing journey.

  • Tom Meyers: “Ada's journey, coming into that position of power. Assuming new responsibilities and taking charge.” [05:21]

• Jack Trenor:
  Alicia Malone highlights Jack's embodiment of the American Dream, depicting both the triumphs and challenges of newfound wealth.

  • Alicia Malone: “Jack doesn't have to work as a footman anymore, but wealth wasn't actually his goal… now he's at a loss of what to do with his time.” [05:45]

Notable Moments:

• Aurora Fane’s Divorce Scene:
  A poignant moment where the servant laments not having had a home, reflecting Aurora's turmoil.
  • Servant: “I've never had a home before this one.” [06:14]

Hidden Historical Tidbits

The hosts delve into subtle historical references woven into the show's narrative:

• Italian Opera Debate:
  An exchange about whether operas should be performed in their original language or translated, reflecting real historical debates in the Metropolitan Opera.

  • Tom Meyers: “They talked about last season's Italian season at the Metropolitan Opera, which really did happen.” [07:03]

• Consuelo Vanderbilt’s Memoir:
  A reenactment of Consuelo Vanderbilt standing up to Lady Sarah, mirroring real-life events described in her memoir.

  • Alicia Malone: “Gladys stood up for herself against Lady Sarah because that was a reconstruction of a real moment that happened with Consuelo Vanderbilt.” [08:39]

Additional Historical Insights:

• Alva Vanderbilt’s Divorce and Remarriage:
  Discussed in the podcast but not directly in the show, highlighting the scandalous remarriage of Alva Vanderbilt shortly after Consuelo’s wedding.

  • Tom Meyers: “Alva remarried Oliver Belmont, another heir to a fortune… they ended up getting the mayor of New York City to officiate.” [09:34]

• Mrs. Bruce and Borden:
  A storyline involving unrequited love and societal pressures regarding marriage and existing commitments.

  • Alicia Malone: “Mrs. Bruce had to say no to Borden because she's already married.” [11:09]

Favorite Quotes and Rewatchable Moments

Favorite Historical Tidbits:

• Agnes Zingers’ Witty Lines:
  Highlighting Agnes's memorable quotes, particularly her line before the temperance meeting.
  • Alicia Malone: “Let the sober circus begin.” [12:19]

Rewatchable Scenes:

• Aurora Fane’s "Bedecked Myself in These Gowns" Line:
  A standout moment showcasing Aurora's emotional depth and the actor’s prowess.

  • Alicia Malone: “Aurora Fane saying, ‘and I bedecked myself in these gowns’” [13:32]

• Larry Proposes to Marian:
  A tender scene shot on a spinning stage, adding a layer of complexity unnoticed in initial viewings.

  • Tom Meyers: “We shot that entire scene on a sort of lazy Susan, a spinning stage.” [13:35]

Notable Quote Exchanges:

• Gladys and Lady Sarah:
  • Lady Sarah: “Are you quite well?” [09:07]
  • Gladys: “Why shouldn't I be? …” [09:10]

Behind-the-Scenes Insights and Cut Interviews

Cut Interview Clip with Visual Effects Supervisor Douglas Perver:

Discusses crowd duplication techniques used in significant scenes like the Metropolitan Opera House and the baseball game.

• John Carafa: “Crowd duplication is such a huge part of our work… we had to create a ton of people.” [15:17]

Costume Designer Kasha Walika Mamone’s Insights:

Reveals the intentional choice for bridesmaids to wear white, a historically accurate detail that differs from contemporary norms.

• Bannister: “All the bridesmaids were identical and wore white, which was surprising to the first glance.” [16:56]

Further Reading and Watching Recommendations

Books Recommended by Tom Meyers:

1. "The Glitter and the Gold: The American Duchess in Her Own Words" by Consuelo Vanderbilt Balson
2. "Consuelo and Alva: The Story of a Daughter and a Mother in the Gilded Age" by Amanda MacKenzie Stewart
3. "Society as I Have Found It" by Ward McAllister
4. "King Lear and the Gilded Age" by Elizabeth Drexelaer
5. "A Season of the Court of Mrs. Astor in Gilded Age New York" by Greg King
6. "Black: A Family History of African Americans in 19th Century New York City" by Carla Peterson

Movies Recommended by Alicia Malone:

1. "The Age of Innocence" (1934 & 1993 versions) – Based on Edith Wharton’s novel.
2. "The House of Mirth" (2000) – Starring Julianne Moore.
3. "The Magnificent Ambersons" (1942) – Directed by Orson Welles.
4. "Hester Street" (1975) – Directed by Joan Micklin Silver.
5. "Washington Square" (1949 & 1997 versions) – Based on Henry James’s novel.

Alicia Malone emphasizes the importance of these works in understanding the societal norms and personal dramas of the Gilded Age.

Exclusive Interviews

1. Kelli O’Hara on Playing Aurora Fane

Kelli O’Hara discusses the depth and transformation of her character, Aurora Fane, particularly focusing on her forced divorce and progressive streak in an era restrictive to women's choices.

• Kelli O’Hara: “Aurora is the picture of someone trying to do everything right… her progressive streak… she's trying to know more and educate herself.” [25:31]

She highlights the emotional challenges of portraying Aurora’s turmoil and her interactions with Ward Horton, who plays her unempathetic husband.

• Kelli O’Hara: “I want to show the devastation of what it would have done to a woman at no fault of her own.” [27:21]

O’Hara also shares anecdotes about embodying Aurora’s character, including her struggle with accents and the naturalism in her performance.

Notable Quotes:

• Kelli O’Hara: “When I bedecked myself in these gowns, I was looking forward to your coming home.” [34:20]
• Kelli O’Hara: “I never tried to lose my Southern accent because… it's my voice.” [35:12]

2. Dr. Stanley Burns on Medical Authenticity

Dr. Stanley Burns, an ophthalmologist and medical consultant, provides insights into the portrayal of medical procedures, particularly the emergency surgery scene involving George Russell.

• Dr. Burns: “Photography supplemented the written word by supplying detailed information you would never get from a book.” [39:23]
• Dr. Burns: “In the Gilded Age, you could do your surgery at home, which was often preferred.” [44:46]

He elaborates on the historical accuracy of medical practices, such as the use of anesthesia and the role of African American doctors in the period.

• Dr. Burns: “African American physicians, surgeons in Europe could attain an important place in medical culture.” [46:16]

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. Burns: “Holding someone down was really a common aspect of surgical procedures at the time.” [48:27]
• Dr. Burns: “The waltz in this era is a bizarre form of dancing… but each dancer has their own style.” [55:43]

3. John Carrafa on Choreography and Dance Representation

Choreographer John Carrafa discusses the intricate dance sequences, emphasizing historical accuracy and storytelling through movement. He explains the challenges of portraying 19th-century dances like the quadrille and the waltz, particularly in differentiating between the white and black balls.

• John Carrafa: “I built something between a quadrille and a waltz… patterns like a quadrille.” [60:10]
• John Carrafa: “The black community had even more of a reason to be vigilant about really obeying the rules.” [58:22]

Carrafa highlights the dedication of the dancers, who create personas and backstories to embody their characters fully.

• John Carrafa: “We give them a history packet… they're just so excited about it from the beginning.” [62:16]

Notable Quotes:

• John Carrafa: “It's really about being as specific as possible, but even then, everyone has their own style.” [53:43]
• John Carrafa: “The black dancers just embrace this whole idea and we're so excited about it from the beginning.” [62:45]

Conclusion

Alicia Malone and Tom Meyers wrap up the episode by expressing their gratitude to the listeners, the podcast production teams, and the show's creators. They reflect on the profound impact of The Gilded Age, highlighting the dedication of the cast and crew in bringing historical authenticity and emotional depth to the series.

• Tom Meyers: “Making the show is really wonderful because we get to know a little bit more about what goes into the show and really appreciate the level of artistry.” [64:01]

The hosts sign off with anticipation for the next season, acknowledging the lasting connection they've built with the audience and the community surrounding The Gilded Age.

• Alicia Malone: “Thank you for joining us this season. We will be back next season. Woohoo.” [65:21]

This episode serves as both a celebration of Season Three's achievements and an insightful exploration into the historical and production elements that make The Gilded Age a compelling portrayal of America's opulent yet tumultuous era.