← The Official Yellowstone Podcast
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- [00:06]
A
Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the official Yellowstone podcast. I'm Jen Landon and I am here with my great co host, Jefferson White. We have an amazing episode for you today. We are going to be talking about episode seven of season five of Yellowstone and the series premiere of 1923.
- [00:29]
B
Huge week, huge week for Yellowstone fans, ourselves included.
- [00:33]
A
So don't go away. We're going to take a quick break and we'll be right back.
- [00:47]
B
And we're back. Big week for Yellowstone, huh?
- [00:50]
A
Yeah, it was. It was an episode filled with tremendous change. And if I were to say there's a theme, I would say departure would be the theme.
- [01:06]
B
Yeah. And I can't help but notice, I'm excited to talk about, you know, episode seven of Yellowstone. I'm also really excited about to talk about 1923 later on, in part because there's some interesting echoes. You know, there's some themes that transcend both shows totally and really sort of demonstrate the ways in which these worlds are connected. You know, across decades, the struggles that have faced the Dutton family are connected and sort of cyclical in a lot of ways.
- [01:34]
A
Yeah. I found that incredibly satisfying as a viewer myself. There's something about ranching that inherently doesn't change. That's one of the important things that Taylor talks about and writes about into in his stories.
- [01:52]
B
So this episode of Yellowstone, episode seven opens in a third timeline, which is the timeline we've been exploring in. I think it's 1997. The events of Rip's childhood, you know, these events with young Rip, with Rowdy and with young, young John Dutton, played by Josh Lucas. And this episode sort of echoes. It's funny, it's interesting. Rip has been fighting for Beth his whole life. It's amazing to see, as in the events of modern day Yellowstone, we see Rip come to Beth's defense over and over again, fight on her behalf of her honor to protect her, fight to sort of preserve her legacy, fight to sort of support her ideology. We witnessed maybe the first time that Beth has gotten Rip into a fight in the beginning of episode seven here, because we see, you know, out on the trail out doing this big gather, Rowdy starts to perhaps besmirch Beth's honor. And Rip takes offense at it.
- [02:53]
A
Yeah. It sets this dynamic up in which we become aware that Rip will kill and be killed for Beth.
- [03:02]
B
Yeah. And we've observed, you know, throughout this season and throughout five seasons of Yellowstone this idea of, you know, how cowboys settle conflicts, how cowboys settle arguments.
- [03:11]
A
Right.
- [03:11]
B
You know, we've watched Rip settle arguments. We've watched him sort of mediate, you know, quote unquote, mediate other fist fights. This one gets out of control and escalates in a sort of frightening way that results in, I don't think, deliberately. I don't think that Rip is deliberately doing quite such a critical wound to Rowdy. But Rowdy. Rowdy gets messed up pretty bad. And it's interesting. It's this moment with this. This sort of cowboy code of honor. Rowdy says to Rip, hey, you know, go get help. Tell him, I just fell off my horse. You know, like, you and I both know that we were settling an argument the cowboy way here. You know, this isn't your fault. You go get them and tell them I fell off my horse. There's no reason that you should sort of have to accept responsibility for what's happened here.
- [03:57]
A
So I think it gives us this moment where we as an audience connect with Rowdy in a way that makes us really like him, to sort of set up the devastation of what comes later. And you hit on another thing, Jeff, that was so smart, which was, of course, that Rip didn't intentionally set out in any way to create this much harm. And the theme that it establishes for me is that what Rip doesn't know is his own strength. And what we see him become over the years is somebody who is so strong and is very aware of that strength, but at this juncture in time, he is somebody who's not aware of it.
- [04:34]
B
Yeah. And he's somebody who sort of, over time, gets himself under control. We've seen him kill before. You know, the first time we're introduced to Rip, it's when he's killing his. His father. His own father who has killed his mother. So the first time we see Rip, he's engaged in this emotional, brutal violence. This is another time that, you know, emotions ride high and. And this fight escalates wildly, and Rip sort of once again, is not fully in control of himself. And it is. It really shows that the Rip that we know in the present timeline, you know, Cole Hauser has, through years of hard work and through years of sort of discipline, he is now in control of the. The monster that he's capable of being.
- [05:23]
A
Right. So when he lets it out in his adult life, it is. It is a consciousness choice to do so. Cole Hauser does such an amazing job of embodying Rip, of course, but his body language, going into a moment where he's about to inflict harm, his walk becomes so deliberate. It is the. One of the more distinct and terrifying walks I have ever seen ever portrayed by anybody. It's. He really embodies that incredibly well.
- [05:54]
B
Yeah, my man's got some presence.
- [05:56]
A
Jeff, let's dive back into that moment where Rip doesn't tell the lie. Rip doesn't say Rowdy fell off his horse, but instead tells Jon the truth. What do you think Jon's feelings were about that?
- [06:09]
B
I think he respects it. It's obviously the more difficult decision to make. It also sets up a relationship that echoes for decades because, you know, this season of Yellowstone, just a few episodes ago, we saw Rip come clean with Jon and say, hey, sir, sorry we killed some of the park wolves on the ranch. You know, another one of these moments where Rip could have lied to John. He could have sort of made his life easier. He could have tried to duck accountability, but he, once again, you know, he can't lie to John. That's his sort of highest loyalty, it seems like.
- [06:41]
A
Totally. And it feels like, though John has respect for this honesty, it is a burden that John then has to carry. You know, he has to care.
- [06:50]
B
It also makes him complicit in these crimes.
- [06:52]
A
That's what I mean. Like, it's like he's got to. Now he's got to do something about it. Yeah, he's complicit.
- [06:58]
B
Yeah. It's a kind of. It's a kind of. It foists this responsibility then on John, But John has accepted the responsibility of young Rip. You know, it's a really beautiful. Like, in the same way that Rip accepts the responsibility of Carter and has to own up to it when John Dutton's horse is killed as a result of Carter's carelessness in season five.
- [07:18]
A
Right.
- [07:19]
B
Know, John Dutton took responsibility for a young Rip and took responsibility for the consequences of bringing this kid onto the ranch. So we really are seeing this kind of cycle of fathers and sons, you know, even if they're not biological fathers and sons, the responsibility that is shared between these kind of mentors and mentees. It's really neat to see this young Rip and young John Dutton then mirrored in Rip and Carter, mirrored in Casey's relationship with Tate. It's a fascinating sort of cycle to continue exploring.
- [07:55]
A
And Taylor also sets up here in a timeline sequence with the loyalty that is essential to the ranch when he says to Rip, if I do this, essentially, if I do this, if I help you, then you have to be loyal to this ranch until the day you die. It's a sort of precursor to what we, as the audience know, leads to branding.
- [08:18]
B
Yeah, it's since the beginning of Yellowstone, we've seen these kind of what have sometimes seemed like extreme commitments. You know, we've said, wow, geez, you sign up, show up your first day of work, and they say, hey, you're going to be here till you die. But in this case, we sort of understand that often those, those commitments, those loyalties are born in blood, you know, so. So John is accepting responsibility for the death of Rowdy, and in exchange for that, Rip is pledging his loyalty to the ranch for life.
- [08:48]
A
And then moving into the next scene, we've got Jaime and Sarah. This is one of my favorite scenes. This is a scene where Jaime opens up to Sarah about how he was never supposed to become this. And by this he means a lawyer. The suit guy that he was raised to be a cowboy. He was meant to be a cowboy that his. His father submitted his application for him.
- [09:13]
B
You're totally right, John. John needed a different kind of soldier. John had plenty of cowboys, and with Jamie, he said, okay, I need a different kind of soldier. And he sent his kid off to Harvard Law to become a lawyer. And it's wild because all season we've seen John Rip Casey, the rest of the family, expressing the spiritually satisfying, cathartic joy of participating in this way of life. They're out on the ranch early mornings, watching the sunrise on horseback, kind of savoring the best of what this life has to offer, celebrating the best of what this life has to offer. And Jamie has not had a minute of that. Every time they're out there gathering cows at dawn, you know, really in touch with the roots of this culture and this tradition and this way of life. Jamie is in a boardroom, he's in a shitty hotel, he's somewhere else sort of fighting a battle on a completely different front. He has been utterly denied the benefits of this way of life. And at the same time, he's been asked to give his entire being to protecting this way of life. He's been told, hey, spend your entire life protecting the ranch, protecting our Western tradition, protecting our family's heritage, but you don't ever get to enjoy it yourself. You don't get to spend time with us. You don't get to be on the ranch living the lifestyle that you are fighting to protect. And we're seeing the weight of that responsibility just absolutely rip him apart.
- [10:54]
A
Yeah, it's so smart what you said. And it's like everybody else gets to have some kind of job for John, but also gets to be their child or somebody that he cares about and is tender to. And in a way, Jamie just has the job part and doesn't really have the son part. It feels doubly screwed up because he's the one who's adopted. You'd think John would have gone out of his way to make him feel more included.
- [11:23]
B
Yeah. This season we watch John and Casey have all these beautiful moments of togetherness. We watch John be a father to Casey, be a grandfather to Tate, be a sort of father figure to Carter, be a father in law to Monica. We see John impart wisdom to all of these people around him. Wisdom and kindness and love. We don't get a single. I'm counting on one hand over here, the tender moments between John and Jamie. And I can count him on one finger. The finger doesn't even go up.
- [12:01]
A
You know, in a weird way, the best thing that Jamie could do is start to work for the ranch as a ranch hand, kill somebody to save the ranch, go to the train station with that body and then get branded and he'd be treated a lot better.
- [12:15]
B
You know, and he's tried a lot of this stuff. Season two, he worked on the ranch for a little bit, as after the murder of Sarah Nguyen, who he killed somebody to protect the ranch. You would think Jamie's done everything in his power to belong here, to sort of get a little bit of his dad's love. And he's been denied it at every turn, which is brutal. So we're gonna get right back into it. We're gonna jump back into more of this episode after this quick break. So crucial to the action of the last few episodes has been gathering cattle to brand them. Right? Gathering these cow calf pears and branding them. This time, as the cowboys ride out to go gather more, there is a startling and alarming discovery, which is these stillborn bison calves, which these cowboys, who are also effectively veterinary scientists, these guys are also just incredibly smart. They know how to interpret these signs. These cowboys know that stillborn bison calves means brucellosis. And it's very, very important that that disease not be transmitted from those bison to the Yellowstone's cows, because if it's transferred to the herd, it's going to run through the herd, it's going to do an incredible amount of damage. And the Department of Wildlife basically is going to dictate that the entire herd be put down to avoid that disease spreading further. So the only option they have effectively is to figure out another place to bring these cows where they're going to be safe from these bison, safe from the Possible transmission of brucellosis. So immediately John Dutton starts getting on the phone and figuring out where the f. Are we going to put one of the biggest herds in the state, where are we going to put all of these cows? Which is a big logistical nightmare and also implies you can't just send the cows. You're going to have to send a lot of cowboys with them. So this immediately sets up this kind of heartbreaking situation, which is that functionally, half of the bunkhouse is going to have to leave the state for God knows how long to move the cows and then babysit them wherever they wind up.
- [14:41]
A
And of course, we find out that the cows are going to be moving down to Texas. So really the cows are moving closer to you, Jeff. That's. I feel like we're like inching closer to Jimmy as these cows. The audience is like, with the cows on their way to Jimmy.
- [15:03]
B
Yeah, exactly. Find Texas. So it sets up this fascinating situation, and we've talked about this all season, that John's resources are being spread ever more thin. John himself has been torn away from the ranch and basically dropped into Helena with all of these political responsibilities. Beth is, is jet setting around trying to sort of help her father manage his political responsibilities and also do double duty and take care of the ranch, figure out how to keep the ranch from collapsing financially. And now Rip is going to have to go to Texas with the herd. Right? So all of a sudden John Dutton's soldiers are spread so thin, Casey is going to be, you know, left on the ranch, left responsible functionally for, for the day to day operations of the ranch, along with Lloyd, along with Ethan Lee Colby. And when Rip is given the sort of choice of who he's going to bring with him on this big drive down to Texas, he says, I want Teeter.
- [16:10]
A
Thank you.
- [16:10]
B
Great choice. We're doing a draft here. He says, I want Teeter, I want Walker, because Walker's from Texas, he knows where we're headed. And I want Ryan. And right there you're talking about three people who are suddenly in long distance relationships, not to mention Rip himself, who's having to leave behind Beth, who is obviously his sort of center of gravity. And Ryan says, Ryan says, I just love this line. He says, cowboying is how I sing. If the Grand Ole Opry is your Super bowl, moving 5,000 head to land, we don't know, and keeping that herd together, getting it through winter, new disease, new predators, that's ours. So Ryan says, this is our Super Bowl. This responsibility, this duty is some. It's not something we're afraid of. It's something we look forward to and embrace.
- [16:59]
A
I love when Ryan says that to Abby. And it pushes forward a mentality of cowboy that is mirrored in the 1923 episode when we get to that, which is that the cattle will always come first. Being a cowboy and ranching will always come first. And I will leave it at that because Helen Mirren in 23 expands on that idea with dialogue that is better than anything I could say. So we have. We now know a bunch of people are headed to Texas. And then we jump to Jamie, Ellis and Sarah. And Ellis and Sarah are enraged because John Dutton has put the ranch into a land trust. And Sarah basically is like, how could you let your father do that? And sort of shames him, berates him, but then gives him the key to the castle after and says, that sounds like an impeachable offense. It's an ominous but also exciting moment as a viewer to. To sort of get a taste of what is to come. And in the next scene, the scene opens with another one of those moments, which is BETH Calling the 6666 Ranch. And that was an incredibly exciting thing for me to read as an actor because all during that season I'm aware that you, Jefferson Wright, are at the 6666 ranch and that we don't see you and that I don't get to see you. And then I find out that I get to go to Texas and then I see BETH Call the 6666 Ranch. And my. Again, my. My dream is that those cows make it all the way to the 6666 ranch, which is, I think, exactly what it looks like.
- [18:57]
B
Yeah, it's one of these cool things where there's this, you know, this mythology of the Dutton ranch and then there's also this Mythology of the6666, this like real life mythology, you know, the6666 is a massive, historically sort of precious cattle ranch in west Texas. We were introduced to it in season four of Yellowstone. The myth of that ranch started to sort of build and cook. We've only seen it from Jimmy's kind of ants eye view. And then it's a really exciting moment when Beth calls, you know, Beth calls up the supply house at the four sixes and we start to sort of see it from the eagle's eye view, from Beth's view.
- [19:39]
A
In a weird way, the brucellosis ends up becoming a potential financial blessing that the Duttons wouldn't have stumbled upon any other way because Beth says in the scene with John, you know, and of course, throughout the entire show, that they never turn a profit, that they just scrape by to keep this ranch going.
- [20:00]
B
And there's different models for how it can work. Beth has proposed and tried to sort of enact different models to make the Yellowstone ranch solvent over the last five seasons. And this is the seed of this new idea for this different sort of financial model. And she learns, you know, functionally, how does the four sixes do it? Well, they sell their beef direct to consumer. Instead of selling their beef for A$50 a pound to a meat packer, they're selling, you know, sirloin for $30 a pound direct to a customer. And Beth hears that, and I feel like that that's a huge moment for her. She's a genius. She's an economic genius. That proposition all of a sudden really lights up, really lights her up with possibility, and she starts to sort of cook on this kind of whole new model.
- [20:49]
A
Of course, what this means is that Taylor is a genius as well in terms of being able to identify that meat packers are the. Are conglomerates that are holding the rancher and the consumer hostage. As the consumer pays more money for beef, the rancher gets less money for beef, and nobody wins except for massive industry.
- [21:16]
B
Yeah, this is a sort of a huge crisis facing all people who work in agriculture around the country, right? So I'm from Iowa. In Iowa, it's corn, soybeans, and pork. It gets harder and harder every year for family farmers to sell at the prices that these massive corporate sort of big agribusiness institution set, right? They can afford to sell at a much lower price. They can functionally set the price of corn, soybeans, and pork when they're working with these. These massive, massive quantities that allow them to make a sort of smaller margin of profit per sale, Whereas small farms, family farms, can't afford to do that. Right? So this is the same question facing the cattle industry, the beef industry, and Sarah Atwood, right? Sarah Atwood sort of makes a point earlier in the season. She says, oh, yeah, American beef is done. It's Brazil. Like. Like real beef manufacturing. Big beef in 10 years is going the way that, you know, the way that American manufacturing went to China over the last 10 years. Big beef is going to Brazil. American cattle ranchers are not going to be able to keep up with the prices being set by these massive corporate interests in Brazil and internationally. And so this is, you know, it's. It's the steady march of, you know, shifting economic headwinds that John Dutton is trying to resist in a million ways. And they're trying to sort of figure out how to defeat this incredibly strong headwind that is making it harder and.
- [22:53]
A
Harder for farmers to stay afloat, moving into lighter territory. Let's talk about the fair. This was a massive scene, Jeff. Sadly, again, you weren't there. It took a while to shoot, I can tell you for the audience. Here's a fun fact. We shot that fair sequence in Montana and in Texas, and this is just a testament to movie magic and the hard work of our crew. Somehow Texas looked like Montana. I didn't think they were going to get away with it, but they did. But this is an amazing scene where we sort of have all of the key relationships in the show in one place. We see all of the dynamics. The theme, of course, is romance, and there are goodbyes and then there are sort of steps forward, certainly with Jon and Summer at the end of the episode.
- [23:51]
B
Yeah, it's really sweet. You know, we've set up, as you mentioned, this kind of departure, this exodus. Everybody's going to have to leave. And that, I think, brings into stark relief what they're leaving behind. So all these characters are confronting these relationships. They're perhaps, you know, realizing how they feel because suddenly they're leaving, which I think is something we've all experienced. So all these characters are sort of having this opportunity to articulate their feelings and sort of express their feelings and plan for their future, or lack thereof.
- [24:24]
A
And we find out that the cowboys who are leaving will be gone for about a year. And of course, the scene between Ryan and Abby with that beautiful quote that you referenced. And when I was watching the episode, of course, part of me wondered, based on how I was clutching the pink bear, because I was really clutching the pink bear, because it was about 30 degrees outside and it was the only way I could stay warm. But watching it, I thought, is Teeter more sad to leave Colby, or is she more sad to leave behind the bear? And I frankly couldn't tell.
- [25:00]
B
It is, yeah. What an amazing sort of moment. None of these people are particularly verbally expressive. This is perhaps sort of the nature of cowboys. You know, me and Jen, our whole thing is talking. In real life, we love talking. That's why we're here doing a podcast. Talking comes very naturally to us, and you can decide for yourself whether we're any good at it. But these characters on the show aren't necessarily talkers, they're doers. You know, they're. They're people. They. They're working people. They speak. They speak the language of horses. They speak the language of these cows that they're responsible for. They are literate in this entire other language, but they're not necessarily the most eloquent when it comes to expressing their feelings, their rich inner lives. And it doesn't mean they don't have rich inner lives. It's just that their words aren't usually the way that they express them.
- [25:51]
A
I feel like we can't wrap up this episode totally without just hitting on the moment between John and Summer, which obviously ends in what we can only assume is a kiss behind John Dutton's hat, which, if I was a kid, I would have been like, they're making out. But Summer gives John sort of a gem in terms of reaching people and getting them to understand, because she talks about how she may never agree with him about certain things, but she understands why. And that the big mistake that people make in some places and the opportunity that John has is to get people who don't agree with him to at least understand why. And in the same way that Sarah has given Jamie some powerful gems, I feel like Summer imparts one to John here.
- [26:50]
B
Obviously an incredible episode. We could talk about it forever, and we may have just talked about it forever. I'm looking at my watch, and it says that we just talked about that episode literally forever. So we're going to take a quick break, and when we come back, we're going to talk about my new favorite TV show, 1923. Okay, this. This is a huge week for Yellowstone fans because not only is there a new episode of Yellowstone, but we also had the. The absolute honor of watching the premiere episode of a new entry in the extended Yellowstone universe, the. The prequel, 1923. This is my new favorite show. I am obsessed with this first episode. I just want to have a little disclaimer here. You know, Jen and I, we work on Yellowstone. We have a sort of insider knowledge of Yellowstone. We read those scripts. We spend a lot of time percolating on it. We're going to talk about 1923 because we're both huge fans of this show, but we are just like you, watching this show alongside you. We don't have any insider information. We're excited about it. But just forgive us because some of you are going to know a little bit more about this than some of us.
- [28:13]
A
Jeff, this is. Though I'm a fan of, obviously everything that exists in the Taylor verse, I have to agree that I Think this is my absolute favorite. This is the show that I'm going to be a super fan about, that I'm going to be sad on days that I miss episodes when they air. I've been looking forward to this ever since the casting announcement.
- [28:40]
B
This one is wild. Everybody wants to work on these projects because Taylor's a genius and it brings in these incredible collaborators. Not only actors like Harrison Ford, obviously some of the biggest movie stars in the world, but Taylor also has an incredible eye for young talent. Taylor is incredible at recognizing actors who haven't had opportunities like this and giving them their first opportunity. So this cast is chock full to some of my favorite actors. Not only Harrison Ford and Helen Mirren, you've also got Brian Garrity, you've got James Badge Dale, you got Robert Patrick, you got some of the best. You got Jerome Flynn, you got some of the best character actors in the world. And then also these young actors that it's so exciting to sort of discover alongside audiences the way that Taylor did with, with Isabel May in 1883. You know, it's such a gift to have young actors that we're learning about for the first time alongside some of the biggest and best movie stars in the world. So this is a jam packed first episode. I just want to take a second at the jump. Big fans of the Yellowstone universe like myself are going to be curious heading into this, what the relationship is between these characters and the characters of 1883. And this episode offers us a great roadmap for that. So we learn in this opening narration what happened in those intervening years. So basically, Tim McGraw. James Dutton dies in 1893 after the action of 1883. We saw it in a flashback in Yellowstone season four. His wife, Margaret Dutton, Faith Hill, sends for help. She writes to his brother, Jacob Dutton, asking for help. Jacob shows up in 1894, tragically, after just barely, after Margaret Dutton has frozen to death. Jacob and his wife Kara functionally adopt John Dutton and Spencer Dutton, the two kids of James and Margaret. John is the character, the young boy played by Audie Rick that we saw in the action of 1883. And he's the only character that overlaps between these two shows. That's John Dutton. He's played by James badge Dale in 1923. He has a son, Jack Dutton, who is getting married. So Harrison Ford and Helen Mirren, Jacob Dutton and Kara Dutton have functionally adopted John Dutton and Spencer Dutton, who's in Africa hunting lions. John Dutton has a son, Jack Dutton, who's getting married what do we think? Did we get it? You out there? Listen, to be honest, you folks listening to this are in basically the same position we're in. So please fact check me. Please send me a message on Instagram if I've gotten this wrong. I drew a diagram I used. I got a lot of help from Bria Brissy, who is the expert Yellowstone historian who runs the Yellowstone Instagram account. I called her panicking, asking her for guidance about this. And that's what I just said out loud for about eight and a half minutes. That's as clear as I could get it.
- [31:52]
A
Jeff. It was perfect. Jeff, do you remember what Elsa says in the video at the top? Like, while you were going through that, I flashed on this piece that Elsa says my parents had three children and only one of them will live to see theirs grow, which sets up people we care about are going to die.
- [32:15]
B
Yeah.
- [32:16]
A
It still feels a little confusing and maybe on purpose in terms of who's who. And maybe that function is to be like, who's safe, who's not.
- [32:24]
B
Yeah. So one of them have already died. Her parents had three children. One of them was her. She's dead. The two remaining children are Spencer Dutton and John Dutton.
- [32:32]
A
So we will spend the rest of our time wondering about them.
- [32:37]
B
I've learned by now by watching everything Taylor Sheridan has ever.
- [32:41]
A
Everybody does just worry about everybody.
- [32:43]
B
Just worry about everybody all the time.
- [32:46]
A
You know, everyone's dead. I love that. As Taylor's expanded the world in terms of shows that correspond to it, the world's gotten bigger. So Yellowstone is set on one ranch in Montana. We are in Montana. We do not leave Montana. And then we go to 1883. And then we start to cover a chunk of America. And then, as you said, by scene two of 1923, we're aware that we're going around the globe for this version. And then the parallels of the wildness between the two was incredibly exciting. So jumping into that first scene, right, we've got some guy running and limping and terrified running away from someone. And the reveal is Helen Mirren. And in that second, like, I get goosebumps just thinking about it. I know that this is going to be epic. And I feel like she blows me away by how she transforms in every role that she does. But she took on this sort of weight of a frontier woman in a way that blew my mind.
- [33:51]
B
Yeah. It's a woman who has lived a life. Like, one of the sort of exciting things about this is discovering these characters after an incredibly long and difficult and punishable life that has sort of traveled great distances. So even in that opening narration, we hear Elsa Dutton from 1883, sort of describing the family's journey that brought them here. And now one of the very first things she says is violence has always haunted this family. And. And what could be a more potent expression of that than this opening scene that makes. That brings Cara Dutton sort of directly into that violence, thrusts her right into it after a long and difficult life of violence.
- [34:32]
A
And then, I mean, I feel like in Westerns, we often see the duel, right? Who pulls their gun faster? But there's this great moment, Cara Dutton, Helen Mirren goes to shoot the guy after he sort of appeals to her gentleness, or he uses God, but it feels like he's trying to get the sympathy that he thinks a woman is going to bestow on him. And she fires. It doesn't go off. And then there's this great mad dash to reload their guns. And I felt like I hadn't seen that before. Not in that way. It was so exciting and it felt so fresh. Of course, she gets the shot in, and then again, because we don't have the scripts, I don't know if it was written in or if it was a choice, but she then screams, right? And she's somebody who can make the brutal choice without a thought. But it's not. Not painful for her that it does cost something. I felt like that entire scene was such brilliant storytelling and character reveal right off the bat. Yeah.
- [35:41]
B
And it's so exciting. I mean, like, it's also. We don't know where that falls in the timeline. So classic Taylor Sheridan plot device is showing us events that will occur later. 1883 opens with this kind of dreamy fugue showing us Elsa being shot with an arrow. We don't know when this sequence falls in the action of the show. We just know that the show will carry us to this violence. Violence will haunt this family, will sort of continue to pursue them.
- [36:09]
A
Elsa says that thing that violence will, has followed her family, but then says for those of us, you know, who don't, who it hasn't followed or something, that they will go seek it. And then we. Which is sort of. It feels a bit like Taylor making a statement about human nature, which I certainly agree with, is that we, in. In some way, we are hardwired for violence and aggression. It's in our DNA, and it's about what we do with that impulse and how we channel it into creative ways in which we're not. We're not harming.
- [36:41]
B
Yeah. And it's a fascinating, you know, speaking of the sort of second scene here as we cut to. To Africa, I believe, to Kenya. I'm not 100% certain about that. I don't know if it's clarified in the episode. I don't think it is. We find Spencer Dutton hunting. And Spencer is this fascinating character who I can't help but see as a sort of clear and distinct ancestor of Casey Dutton. A man who went to war, sort of experienced profound loss and violence and trauma in war, and then has spent the rest of his life trying to escape it, perhaps, but in doing so, falling back into it over and over again. A man who's so haunted by his. That what he was asked to do, you know, we see these scenes of him throughout the episode In World War I, entrench warfare, you know, just scrambling, fighting for his life, fighting to. To protect himself and his. His comrades. And now we find him later after that, sort of still, who knows what it is. You can't tell if he's running from something or if he's running towards violence. You can't tell if he's being haunted, you know, if he's chasing violence or violence is chasing him. It's a sort of fascinating relationship.
- [37:58]
A
Yeah. And we talked a little bit earlier about the sort of parallel moments over time that Taylor hits on, both in this episode and in the episode of Yellowstone that aired this week. And when we see Spencer Dutton shoot the lion, we know right away he's a hell of a shot. And I just gotta say Brandon Sklenar. I don't know if I'm saying his name correctly. He is one of those actors that. It just is like. I felt like he was a movie star that I had seen before. Movie star, massive presence. I will watch anything he does. He turns me into the woman in the safari at the safari dinner. Like, I'm just so blown away by him. But one of the. One of the parallels is, is that we. We know he's an amazing shot. And go back to the fair scene in Yellowstone, and we've got Tate just shooting at, like, one of the carnival games. And he's just naturally. An amazing shot.
- [38:57]
B
Yeah, it's a really fascinating. You know, John Dutton has talked about these sort of echoes, this kind of ongoing battle, and it really is an amazing thing to jump back into it and see literally those recurring images throughout time. Speaking of John Dutton, let's get into. Let's get into the main event. I hesitate to say the main event because there's so many incredible events in this first episode of 1923. But let's get into it. We got Harrison Ford playing Jacob Dutton. Incredible.
- [39:35]
A
He inhabits this world so beautifully. And the thing that both he and Helen bring to this, that I thought was really fresh for me, was, in a way, was comedy that I didn't expect because they're both so bloody talented. Their ability to find humor or to in these moments was so refreshing. And then we've got Jacob. I just look at Harrison. Harrison takes us into what I'm assuming is Bozeman. Right. Or is it Livingston? Maybe it's Livingston. Like, what town are we in? Right. Because the Dutton Ranch is set in Paradise Valley. We know that we're already in Paradise Valley at the Dutton Ranch because we. We see the baby birds, I think. Or maybe not. Maybe the ranch moved, but it feels like. Right. Right.
- [40:32]
B
I think so. Yeah. Beginnings of a white.
- [40:34]
A
So I'm wondering if that was Livingston, which is a beautiful town, by the way. When I lived in Montana years ago, that was my main town that I would go to. And then we get to see some of the colorful aspects of that time period. And I loved that they just went for it. They're like, we're throwing boxers in the street. We're throwing, you know, Prohibition. You know, they just threw it all in. And it was so satisfying. I knew. Exactly. It made me want to time travel, just for just briefly. I don't really want to be there for most of that decade.
- [41:18]
B
Well, yeah. I mean, and it's a decade, like, characterized by extremes. Right. Because it's both the Roaring Twenties, it's both this excess, this sort of bacchanalian excess, and this. The, you know. You know, Prohibition and this kind of response to it. Right. It's these. It's this changing world and then this effort to stop that change. You know, it's a world that is pulling in two directions at once. Especially sort of in response to the profound global trauma of World War I. Right. Like, there's these. This sort of generation of men who return from World War I having seen the world, the best and worst of it, the sort of most beautiful and ugliest aspects of the world and human nature kind of pulling in two directions at once. Yeah. So this boxing match, this sort of excess, and then right after that, these sort of warriors on behalf of Prohibition and the plenty and suffering. You know, like, Jacob's got this sort of. You know, he, in some ways, is succeeding. He's got a lot to be happy about, but also his Herd is suffering. From the very beginning of this, we learned that there is not enough grass. There is sort of famine spreading here. The herd is really suffering and every surrounding herd, including these sheep farmers, these sheep herders, they're all suffering immensely.
- [42:41]
A
Gosh. I think that takes us right to the beginnings of Yellowstone Ranch where we see Jack Dutton, who's played by Darren Mann, and he's breaking a cult, which we've also seen on Yellowstone. And that whole experience of seeing the ranch in its baby version of it.
- [43:03]
B
Seeing the round pen, didn't.
- [43:04]
A
Yeah, the round pen. Didn't you like, oh, that's home. That's our home.
- [43:07]
B
I know when you saw the cowboys leaning up against the round pen, I was like, oh, that's amazing. It has echoes to the second episode of Yellowstone where we see Jimmy getting his ass absolutely kicked by a bucking horse while everybody sort of leans and watches. I also just have to flag one of our. A little insider thing here. When you work on Yellowstone, you really get to know the stunt guys because they work very hard and they're always present. I had my first Jordan Warwick sighting. So some stunt performers wind up getting tagged in over and over and over again on Yellowstone because there's some stuff that only a few guys in the world can do. There's only a few guys who can fall off a horse over and over again the way that our stunt performers can. You know, we have a really incredibly talented stunt team. So the first Jordan war exciting of 1923 is that Jerome Flynn's character, whose name is Banner, punches him in the face as that sort of argument escalates in the. In the town hall or wherever it is. First guy to get punched in the face, boom. That's, that's Jordan Warren I saw at.
- [44:08]
A
The, at the ranch. I see Kay Stream. Yeah, standing, which for those of you who don't know, Kay Stream is Jake Ream's son. Jake plays Jake on Yellowstone, obviously. And I was like, oh, it's my buddy.
- [44:23]
B
Yeah, it's so nice to see those familiar faces. We're also introduced for the first time to Brian Garrity's character Zane. Brian, clearly sort of authority figure, a bit of a RIP style figure who sort of got a lot of responsibility on the ranch, who the rest of the cowboys are looking to. Perhaps the sort of leader of the bunkhouse, it would seem in 1923.
- [44:46]
A
Moving into what is potentially the most painful sort of segment storyline sequence of the show. But also my favorite is the world that is the American Indian boarding school. And when that first shot opened up and you see Sister Mary, who's played by Jennifer Ely and like played brilliantly and almost not fully of this earth. She looked almost ghoulish standing there. And she proceeds to then, you know, quiz who we come to know as Tiona or Tiana. And that is played by Amina Neves. Pardon me for any mispronunciations of any of this. And again, like, talk about, in this scene alone, we have two more all star performances. I feel like any one of these could be nominated for an award. And then what becomes just one of the more painful sequences that I've seen.
- [45:47]
B
Yeah, kind of, I would say, like a sort of fearless exploration of a brutally unjust chapter of American history. Taylor likes to show us the west as we romanticize it. He likes to show us these sweeping vistas, you know, the joy that these cowboys have in doing their work. And then he'll also show us the uncomfortable stuff that we don't necessarily know about, you know, the, the. The dark side of that myth. Speaking of, you know, these conflicts that echo back and forth in history, in this episode we're setting up this. This conflict that's brewing between Jacob Dutton and these neighboring sheep herders and sheep farmers, leading to a conflict that's not unlike the conflict that we first saw in the pilot of Yellowstone, where these cows have wandered off of John Dutton's land and onto this nearby reservation. So we're setting up a sort of conflict around the rights to graze at a time when grass is particularly scarce and is gold. You know, right now, at this moment in history, grass is gold. It's the only way that these cattle, these cattle ranchers can keep their cows alive. And it's the only way that these sheep herders, sheep ranchers, can keep their sheep alive. So he's set up a real powder keg of a situation here. And you know, also a pretty. A funny illustration. You know, we were talking in episode, season five, episode seven of Yellowstone, we were talking about the sort of lifestyle of being a rancher and how everything has to operate around what the herd needs. There's a conflict, a similar conflict set up in this episode of 1923. Jack Dutton is supposed to get married. His wedding has been set and all of a sudden he has to go on a cattle drive instead of getting married. Which is. I can't imagine that's a critical crisis in a personal life.
- [47:42]
A
Yeah, I loved that. The naivete of his response of why shouldn't the marriage be like the wedding? And then I forget who says it? But they're like, yeah, I'd like to see how that goes over. Of course, Kara knows this is going to be disastrous. Gets in her buggy, goes over there, knowing that. That it. Knowing that it's going to be bad. I believe Elizabeth tells Jack to go sleep with a cow, which is one of my favorite moments. And then Kara sits down with Elizabeth and turns that around in a way that she sort of says, the cows, you know, the cattle will always come first. You know, the ranch will always come first. You'll have your first born, and, you know, basically, you will come second. But then she says, and you'll be free in a way that most people could only imagine or could never imagine. And as somebody on a personal level, as somebody who relishes their freedom, I found that to be just such a really wonderful way of framing that.
- [48:47]
B
So back to Spencer Dutton in Africa. We see him sort of experiencing this dream, this kind of flashback within a flashback within a prequel. That is his sort of nightmares of what happened to him in World War I, the sort of tremendous difficulty that he experienced in World War I, the sort of profound violence of trench warfare. We see that that is haunting him still to this day, much like Casey is haunted by the violence he saw overseas as a soldier in Yellowstone.
- [49:23]
A
Yeah, I think it's a common theme that people who experience PTSD from warfare and a myriad of other things, even home becomes a very hard place to reestablish and a place to reenter. It's almost impossible to reenter it.
- [49:48]
B
Yeah, he says this beautiful thing. He's woken up by a steward on the train. And the guy says, hey, man, you've reached your destination. And he says, I have no destination. I've reached my next stop. That's all this is. So, yeah, exactly like you just said, he doesn't know where home is. He doesn't know how to stop moving. And he's. He's haunted by violence. You know, as Elsa says in that opening narration, this is a character who is haunted by violence everywhere he goes. Speaking of violence, he's not the only Dutton in danger. So this. This tense relationship between these sheep herders and the Duttons, their. Their cattle ranch, you know, has come to a head. There's a massive cattle drive happening. John Dutton, Jacob Dutton and Jack Dutton are pushing cows. Much like. Much like the sort of gathering that we did in Yellowstone Season five. They're pushing cows. They're driving them to a pasture where there ought to be grass yet. Jack Dutton crests a hill and finds that grassy pasture covered in sheep. So functionally, that grass, that gold, that green gold, is being stolen by these sheep herders. Jack sort of peers into the middle distance trying to see what's going on. He sees a man on horseback, and then he sees a muzzle flash and we cut away. So that that violence that haunts the Duttons is haunting them across continents, across generations.
- [51:23]
A
We. We really leave the episode with two did they live cliffhangers? Because Spencer in Africa, we don't know whether or not Spencer lives or dies.
- [51:34]
B
Yeah. Very exciting. It is classic Taylor Sheridan to kill a main character in the pilot. He's done that a couple of times. He killed Lee Dutton in the pilot of Yellowstone. It is a brutal move to get the audience invested in a character and then rip them away just like that. So I'll be really curious to see who makes it to episode two. I personally can't wait for episode two. I'm hooked.
- [52:01]
A
Make sure you subscribe to the official Yellowstone Podcast and tune in with us every Sunday at Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. See you soon.
- [52:12]
B
The official Yellowstone Podcast is a production of 101 Studios and Paramount. This episode was produced by Scott Stone. Brandon Gatches is the head of audio for 101 Studios. Steve Rezis is the executive vice president of the Paramount Global Podcast Group. Special thanks to Megan Marcus, Jeremy Westfall, Ainsley Rosito, Andrew Sarnow, Jason Reed, and Whitney Baxter from Paramount. And of course, David Glasser, David Hutkin, and Michelle Newman from 101 Studios.