Podcast Summary: The Opinions – "Make America 1897 Again"

Release Date: January 28, 2025
Host/Author: The New York Times Opinion
Participants: Aaron Retica (Host), Jamelle Bouie (NYT Opinion Columnist)

1. Introduction and Context

In the episode titled "Make America 1897 Again," host Aaron Retica engages in a profound discussion with Jamelle Bouie, an esteemed columnist from The New York Times Opinion section. The conversation delves into the intriguing resurgence of 19th-century political ideologies within contemporary American politics, particularly focusing on former President Donald Trump's references to historical figures and eras.

2. Donald Trump's References to William McKinley

The episode opens with Trump's unexpected admiration for William McKinley, the 25th President of the United States. Retica notes, “[Trump] name checked him in his inaugural address and we will restore the name of a great president, William McKinley, to [Mount McKinley],” referencing Trump's proposal to rename Denali mountain in Alaska (01:57).

Jamelle Bouie offers insights into Trump's motivations:
"I think what's mostly happening here is that he is, for a variety of reasons, familiar with the name. William McKinley sees McKinley as maybe sort of an important and prominent Republican president and wants to associate himself with McKinley" (01:57).

3. The Gilded Age Parallel

Bouie draws parallels between Trump's admiration for McKinley and the broader socio-economic landscape of the late 19th century, often referred to as the Gilded Age. This era was marked by rapid cultural, economic, and political transformations, including mass immigration, significant wealth concentration in burgeoning industries, and substantial political influence wielded by industrial magnates.

"It's a time of just rapid cultural and economic and political change in the United States... the owners of those industries... possessed large amounts of close to unchecked political influence" (02:17).

4. Tech Capitalists and Trump's Inauguration

Retica highlights the notable presence of tech moguls like Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, and Mark Zuckerberg at Trump's inauguration, symbolizing a strategic alliance between Trump and Silicon Valley elites. Bouie interprets this alignment as a move by tech leaders to secure favorable regulatory environments amidst their pursuit of emerging technologies like AI.

"Elon Musk has major government contracts. Jeff Bezos is looking for major government contracts... Mark Zuckerberg and other Silicon Valley types want the government to stay out of the way of AI development" (08:15).

5. Influence of Curtis Yarvin

A significant portion of the dialogue explores the influence of Curtis Yarvin, a blogger whose ideas advocate for a transition from democratic governance to a more autocratic, technocracy-led system. Bouie explains Yarvin's ideology as a critique of liberal democracies, proposing that only a tech elite can steer the nation towards progress.

"He basically was a blogger who built a following with this argument that the United States was sort of under an oppressive liberal totalitarianism... the only way to arrest this and to put America back on the path to greatness was to transition the United States away from democracy" (11:29).

6. Ideological and Material Motivations of the Tech Industry

The conversation delves into the motivations behind the tech industry's support for Trump's administration. Bouie posits that both material and ideological factors drive this alliance. Materially, tech companies seek lucrative government contracts and a regulatory landscape conducive to innovation. Ideologically, there's a pushback against increasing worker militancy and demands for greater equality within these firms.

"Trump is nothing if not virulently anti-labor. He loves to talk of the workers as a kind of cultural class, but when it comes to the actual interest of the working class, he is as anti-labor as they come" (09:30).

7. Implications for American Politics and Society

Bouie underscores the potential ramifications of this ideological shift towards elitism and oligarchic influence, reminiscent of the Gilded Age. He warns of increased stratification and diminished democratic processes, suggesting that without significant resistance movements, the nation could drift further from its egalitarian ideals.

"Politics doesn't end, history doesn't stop moving. The people in power now will overreach. People in power always do, and people out of power will respond to that overreach" (16:57).

8. Conclusion: Prospects for American Renewal

In concluding the discussion, Bouie remains cautiously optimistic about the resilience of American democratic culture. He acknowledges the long gestation periods required for social movements to effect meaningful change, citing historical examples like the NAACP's journey to influencing landmark decisions such as Brown v. Board of Education.

"As this agenda moves forward, I would expect it to seed perhaps movements that are responding directly to it, that are attempting to make good on an egalitarian promise" (16:57).

Retica wraps up the episode by appreciating Bouie's insightful analysis, emphasizing the importance of understanding historical contexts to navigate present challenges.

Notable Quotes with Attribution and Timestamps

• Aaron Retica:
  “It feels particularly relevant in this moment as we see Donald Trump, of all people, turning to the past in a new and really a little bit surprising way.” (00:52)

• Jamelle Bouie:
  “I think what's mostly happening here is that he is, for a variety of reasons, familiar with the name... wants to associate himself with McKinley.” (01:57)
  “Trump is nothing if not virulently anti-labor.” (09:30)
  “Politics doesn't end, history doesn't stop moving.” (16:57)

• Aaron Retica:
  “The idea that the Gilded Age is something we should be aiming at... is almost a positive.” (04:16)

Final Thoughts

"Make America 1897 Again" offers a compelling exploration of the intersections between historical political ideologies and contemporary American politics. Through the expertise of Jamelle Bouie, listeners gain a nuanced understanding of how past paradigms are being reimagined in the present, with significant implications for the nation's future trajectory.

Note: This summary excludes advertisements, intros, outros, and non-content sections to focus solely on the substantive discussions of the episode.