Summary of "There’s a Reason Even ‘Smart’ People Surrender to Trump"

Podcast Title: The Opinions
Host/Author: The New York Times Opinion
Episode: There’s a Reason Even ‘Smart’ People Surrender to Trump
Release Date: February 13, 2025

1. Introduction to the Discussion

In this episode of The Opinions, Patrick Healy, Deputy Editor of New York Times Opinion, delves into the perplexing phenomenon of why even intelligent and informed individuals capitulate to Donald Trump's influence. Healy engages in a comprehensive conversation with Masha Gessen, a renowned journalist and author known for her incisive analysis of authoritarianism in Russia and Eastern Europe.

2. Anti-Trans Rhetoric in Trump's Inaugural Speech

Healy initiates the discussion by highlighting the shocking inclusion of anti-transgender remarks in Trump's inaugural address, a move that surprised even seasoned observers like Gessen.

Masha Gessen [02:19]: "I was unpleasantly surprised by the fact that even in his inaugural speech, he started going after trans people...the prominence of his anti-trans rhetoric...was more central than I expected."

This unexpected aggressiveness toward transgender individuals set the tone for Trump's administration, marking a stark departure from traditional inaugurational speeches that typically emphasize unity and forward-looking themes.

3. Institutional Obedience and Anticipatory Compliance

Gessen introduces the concept of "anticipatory obedience," a strategic preemptive compliance to authoritarian demands to preserve one's position or safety.

Masha Gessen [05:00]: "This provider said... 'I'm not going to talk to you on the record because I don't want to draw any attention to myself...'"

She explains that institutions and individuals, such as hospitals and educators, often comply with Trump's directives not out of agreement but as a means of survival within a rapidly changing political landscape.

4. The Normalization of Trumpian Policies

The conversation explores how Trump's early actions are laying the groundwork for a long-term transformation of American societal norms.

Masha Gessen [09:08]: "In this country, it's faster and it's worse... the big money lining up and genuflecting before the inauguration."

Gessen compares the speed and severity of Trump's maneuvers to historical authoritarian shifts, noting the unprecedented rapidity with which he is altering the political and social fabric of the nation.

5. Democrat’s Response to Trump’s Administration

Healy scrutinizes the Democratic Party's initial strategy of seeking common ground with Trump, questioning its effectiveness and potential consequences.

Masha Gessen [19:41]: "The Democrats are entirely allowing Trump to set the agenda... Trump has an ideology, and Trump's people have even more ideas."

Gessen criticizes the Democrats for not adequately opposing Trump's agenda, arguing that this approach inadvertently grants him greater influence over national policy and societal norms.

6. The Challenge of Collective Action in America

A significant portion of the discussion centers on America's lack of a tradition of collective action, which hampers efforts to resist authoritarian tendencies.

Masha Gessen [17:29]: "It's a pretty convenient country to pick for building an autocracy. We don't have a culture of collective action."

Gessen emphasizes that successful opposition to authoritarianism often requires unified, collective efforts, which are currently undermined by America's individualistic ethos and weakened local media landscape.

7. Examples of Resistance and Hope

Despite the bleak outlook, Gessen offers glimmers of hope by citing instances where institutions and individuals are beginning to resist Trump's authoritarian impulses.

Masha Gessen [24:25]: "The FBI is really resisting the broad effort to fire agents... we haven't lost the battle yet."

Additionally, the bravery of trans youth speaking out against governmental policies serves as an inspiration for broader societal pushback.

Trans Activist [27:42]: "I moved here from Florida because it's unsafe there. Now I am up safe again because Trump is president... please keep fighting for me."

8. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Healy and Gessen conclude by reflecting on the precarious state of American democracy under Trump's leadership. While acknowledging the deep challenges, they underscore the importance of collective resistance and the necessity for America to cultivate a culture of opposition to prevent the entrenchment of authoritarian rule.

Masha Gessen [25:09]: "We haven't lost the war yet. We haven't even lost the battle. It is still possible to stop him."

Gessen's optimism hinges on the potential for organized, collective action to counterbalance Trump's authoritarian strategies, suggesting that the fight to preserve democratic norms is far from over.

Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Masha Gessen [02:19]: "I was unpleasantly surprised by the fact that even in his inaugural speech, he started going after trans people...the prominence of his anti-trans rhetoric...was more central than I expected."

• Masha Gessen [05:00]: "This provider said... 'I'm not going to talk to you on the record because I don't want to draw any attention to myself...'"

• Masha Gessen [09:08]: "In this country, it's faster and it's worse... the big money lining up and genuflecting before the inauguration."

• Masha Gessen [17:29]: "It's a pretty convenient country to pick for building an autocracy. We don't have a culture of collective action."

• Masha Gessen [19:41]: "The Democrats are entirely allowing Trump to set the agenda... Trump has an ideology, and Trump's people have even more ideas."

• Masha Gessen [24:25]: "The FBI is really resisting the broad effort to fire agents... we haven't lost the battle yet."

• Trans Activist [27:42]: "I moved here from Florida because it's unsafe there. Now I am up safe again because Trump is president... please keep fighting for me."

• Masha Gessen [25:09]: "We haven't lost the war yet. We haven't even lost the battle. It is still possible to stop him."

This episode provides an in-depth analysis of the mechanisms through which Donald Trump secures compliance from various segments of society, even among those who are otherwise intelligent and informed. Through the expertise of Masha Gessen, listeners gain a nuanced understanding of the psychological and structural factors that facilitate the erosion of democratic norms, as well as the potential avenues for resistance and restoration of democratic integrity.