Podcast Summary

The Ops Experts Club Podcast

Episode 92: Why Visionaries Undervalue Ops and How to Fix It
Hosts: The Collab Team (Aaron, Terryn, Savannah)
Date: December 11, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode dives into a recurring challenge in high-growth businesses: visionary leaders consistently undervaluing the complexity and importance of operations ("ops"). Aaron, Terryn, and Savannah draw on years of supporting seven- and eight-figure entrepreneurs to unpack why this happens, what the costly implications are, and—most importantly—how to fix it. Through candid examples, laughter, and tactical insights, they break down myths about automation, cost-saving, and “just hiring a VA,” offering actionable advice for visionary founders and their ops teams alike.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Visionaries Undervalue Ops

• Simplicity Bias
  Visionaries excel at strategy, sales, and big ideas, but often see ops as a "time suck" or "money suck" (02:06). Two successful visionaries were cited for saying, "Let’s just cut that down to half the time, half the money,"—a recurring misconception (02:36—03:00).

• Minimization & Oversimplification
  There’s a tendency to seek shortcuts: “Let’s just get AI to do that” or “Let’s hire a cheap VA overseas.” The hosts argue these often ignore underlying constraints, skill demands, or risks (03:45—04:45).

2. Automation: The Right and Wrong Way

• AI Isn’t Plug-and-Play
  While AI can help streamline certain steps, it's far from a wholesale replacement for people.
  Quote:
  “It's not like it's just something you go to a website, you know, aidothisforme.com, and it's done… I'm thinking through all the different things: creating constraints, workflows, SOPs, managing the AI, fixing the AI—it’s not a magic bullet.” — Taran (04:00—04:50)

• People Still Needed
  Even with AI, you need people to set it up, tweak, maintain, and fix it when it breaks.
  Quote:
  “You can’t just set the thing off on its course and not expect that it’s going to break or have pain points or need to be refined.” — Aaron (05:23—06:00)

3. Outsourcing and Team Structure: Risks and Realities

• Outsourcing Missteps
  Key roles (ex: finance controller) shouldn’t be handed to just anyone, especially overseas VAs, due to sensitivity and accountability.
  Quote:
  “There are places where you can make savings and then there are some places where savings actually would be pretty scary.” — Aaron (06:40—07:00)

• The Myth of the One Hire Fix
  Hiring a superstar doesn't mean you can eliminate other team members without consequence. High performers need a solid supporting cast.
  Quote:
  “Be really careful you don’t cut out a bunch of people, because you want the best ROI out of the good person that you hired.” — Aaron (07:16—08:40)

4. Financial Ops: Labor Costs and Team Bandwidth

• Understanding Labor Percentage
  Keep track of labor as a percentage of revenue (“travel at a good labor percentage”). For digital businesses, safe zones are 12–22%, depending on customer service needs (09:40—10:25).

  Quote:
  “Get really clear on your industry and how you should be spending your money when it comes to labor, because that’s actually what shows you your profitability rather than making a knee-jerk decision.” — Aaron (10:32—11:00)

• Avoiding the Slow-Season Trap
  Don’t downsize staff just because you’re in a slow season; fulfillment of previous commitments and upcoming surges require talent continuity.
  Quote:
  “Just because I’m slow right now means that I can cut back, but without realizing the 10 things we just did last month that we’re now fulfilling on.” — Taran (11:00—11:40)

5. Retention of Historical Team Members

• Value of Institutional Knowledge
  Retaining long-term team members is crucial—they smooth onboarding, maintain momentum, and prevent costly reinvention each launch cycle.

  Quote:
  “If the historical people weren’t there, it’d take me two or three times as long to get to where I can without them.” — Taran (13:27—13:43)

6. Memorable Moments and Personality

• Humorous Moment

  • Prairie, Taran’s cat, makes an unscheduled “appearance” (05:00)—“Prairie just wanted to make an appearance on the show. Just one claw up on the shirt.” — Aaron

• Thanksgiving Banter

  • Warm close with both hosts sharing their traditional favorite Thanksgiving dishes; Aaron sticks to a classic turkey, mashed potatoes, peas and gravy, and a cranberry dish from his mom. Taran goes for scalloped potatoes. Their banter emphasizes the importance of dependable operators vs. “spontaneous” visionaries (15:33—16:44).

Notable Quotes With Timestamps

• On AI and Automation:
  “It’s not something you go to a website, aidothisforme.com, and it’s done. There’s a lot that goes into switching to AI and the constraints involved.” — Taran (04:00)

• Cautions on Cost-Cutting via New Hires:
  “Be really careful that you don’t cut out a bunch of people doing steps that give you the best ROI out of the good person you hired… you want your expensive new hire to do what you paid them to do, not slog details.” — Aaron (07:16)

• Labor Percentages for Digital Businesses:
  “A pretty safe labor percentage is somewhere between, like, 12% up to, like, 22%... get really clear on your industry.” — Aaron (10:10)

• Retaining Institutional Knowledge:
  “If the historical people weren’t there, it’d take me two or three times as long to get to where I can without them.” — Taran (13:27)

• On Reacting to Slow Seasons:
  “Just because I’m slow right now means I can cut back, but without realizing the 10 things we just did last month that we’re now fulfilling on.” — Taran (11:00)

Important Segment Timestamps

| Segment | Start Time | Topic | |-----------------------------|------------|----------------------------------------------------------------------| | Visionaries minimizing ops | 02:36 | Real-world examples of ops being undervalued | | Automating ops with AI | 03:45 | Why “just get AI to do it” is naïve | | VAs and overseas hiring | 06:04 | Risks and realities of outsourcing key operational roles | | Superstar hires | 07:16 | Why cutting everyone else after hiring a top person is dangerous | | Labor percentages explained | 09:40 | Benchmarks and pitfalls for digital businesses | | Retaining key staff | 13:27 | Costs of losing experienced team members | | Thanksgiving banter | 15:33 | Personality, tradition, and “dependable operations” |

Final Takeaways

• Visionaries often focus on the front end (sales, marketing, new ideas), underestimating the operational lift required to succeed at scale.
• Automation and outsourcing have limits; human oversight and institutional knowledge are critical.
• Labor cost percentages are a more reliable lever than impulsive hiring/firing decisions.
• Seasonal and project-based fluctuations require maintaining a stable, knowledgeable team.
• Operators who “show up” through business cycles are valuable assets—retain and appreciate them.

Hosts conclude:
“Hope you think through the pivots that your team is making—where you can cut, where you can automate, where you can simplify… Carry your good people through the times when you don't think you need them, because you probably will.” — Aaron (16:48)

For more operational insights and stories from behind the scenes of top entrepreneurial brands, check out additional episodes or visit foundationsthatscale.com/level-up.